"Larry W4CSC" wrote in message
...
Kelton wrote in
:

Unless you're all using submarine 6250AH cells, I doubt you'll ever see
100A coming out of a 100A charger,


I suppose that the amp meter on the remote panel of my Heart inverter might
be lying, but it at least claims that it pumps out 100 amps into my 450
amp-hour battery bank.

especially these new computerized-charge models.

It would be only the "smart" chargers that would drive that kind of current
into a battery bank that a recreational boat is likely to have for more than
a minute or so.

If the battery is THAT dead, there's no sense charging it.

Why?

Run
the batteries down to what you normally do, then watch the charging
current
curve on that 100A charger.

If it is a "smart" charger and rated at 100 amps it should drive the full
100 amps until the end of the "Bulk" phase, which is when the battery
voltage reaches 14.4 volts. If you have a simple "taper" charger then the
current will start to drop off as the battery voltage increases.


1200 watts will simply boil the electrolyte in
a lead acid battery that cannot dissapate that much heat (the batteries in
these boats).

If you charge at high rates you certainly need to monitor the electrolyte
level in the battery closely. To maximize the service life of the batteries
it is advisable to limit the charge current to no more than 20% of the
capacity; if you have a 100 amp-hour battery don't charge it at a rate
greater than 20 amps.

Rod

"Larry W4CSC" wrote in message
...

Unless you're all using submarine 6250AH cells, I doubt you'll ever see
100A coming out of a 100A charger, especially these new computerized-charge
models.

Nonsense. I have 425 Amp-hours (4 6-Volt golf cart batteries). My Heart 2000
always puts out 100 Amps even if the batteries are only moderately discahrged.

If the battery is THAT dead, there's no sense charging it.

Wow, I've been running 5 years now on dead batteries! Amazing!

Run
the batteries down to what you normally do, then watch the charging current
curve on that 100A charger.

100 Amps, bang on.

1200 watts will simply boil the electrolyte in
a lead acid battery that cannot dissapate that much heat (the batteries in
these boats).

When I charge with the alternator thats at about 80 Amps. I do have to check
the water every month, but in 5 years it hasn't "boiled off."

Sounds great in the sales brochure and if you turn every
light in the boat on you might get it up to 50A, but that isn't reality.

You have to get out more, Larry.



If you boys want to see a hard charger, there's an original equipment Amel
40A manual charger in my stepvan service truck out of my buddy's Amel
Sharki ketch. IT will boil any battery you have in a couple of hours,
right out the top caps on every cell. That thing is DANGEROUS.

Glad to be back on r.b.c, by the way. Had a great time in Florida cruising
and in the Gulfstreamer Race from Daytona to Charleston out in the gulf
stream. We had the Amel Sharki heavy old cruising ketch up over 12 knots
with the help of the Gulf Stream....(c;

I did 14 knots once ... in the Cape Cod Canal.

100A x 14.4V = 1440 watts. Simply amazing it hasn't boiled them over or
melted the plastic cases or melted the internal structures causing an
explosive short in the process.

All this going on in a "battery box" that seals in all this heat even
worse.....

How long does it charge at 100A? minutes? hours? I've never seen a good
battery that, if you jacked 100A into it, wouldn't rise up to 14V in no
time at all, which should make the charger stop hitting them so hard.

You simply CANNOT charge a lead-acid battery in an hour. That's as crazy
as those idiots at the service station "quick charging" someone's car
battery while-they-wait....

Larry

I'll ignore the crack about getting out more, having just come in from the
Gulf Stream last Sunday.


"Jeff Morris" wrote in
:

"Larry W4CSC" wrote in message
...

Unless you're all using submarine 6250AH cells, I doubt you'll ever
see 100A coming out of a 100A charger, especially these new
computerized-charge models.

Nonsense. I have 425 Amp-hours (4 6-Volt golf cart batteries). My
Heart 2000 always puts out 100 Amps even if the batteries are only
moderately discahrged.

If the battery is THAT dead, there's no sense charging it.

Wow, I've been running 5 years now on dead batteries! Amazing!

Run
the batteries down to what you normally do, then watch the charging
current curve on that 100A charger.

100 Amps, bang on.

1200 watts will simply boil the electrolyte in
a lead acid battery that cannot dissapate that much heat (the
batteries in these boats).

When I charge with the alternator thats at about 80 Amps. I do have
to check the water every month, but in 5 years it hasn't "boiled off."

Sounds great in the sales brochure and if you turn every
light in the boat on you might get it up to 50A, but that isn't
reality.

You have to get out more, Larry.



If you boys want to see a hard charger, there's an original equipment
Amel 40A manual charger in my stepvan service truck out of my buddy's
Amel Sharki ketch. IT will boil any battery you have in a couple of
hours, right out the top caps on every cell. That thing is
DANGEROUS.

Glad to be back on r.b.c, by the way. Had a great time in Florida
cruising and in the Gulfstreamer Race from Daytona to Charleston out
in the gulf stream. We had the Amel Sharki heavy old cruising ketch
up over 12 knots with the help of the Gulf Stream....(c;

I did 14 knots once ... in the Cape Cod Canal.

On Wed, 02 Jun 2004 13:43:14 -0000, Larry W4CSC
wrote:
Unless you're all using submarine 6250AH cells, I doubt you'll ever see
100A coming out of a 100A charger, especially these new computerized-charge
models. If the battery is THAT dead, there's no sense charging it.

================================================== ====

Larry, with all due respect, that's total BS and you of all people
should know better.

It is safe in the bulk charge phase (below 80% of full charge) to
recharge at 25% of the battery banks Amp-hour capacity. That means
that any run of the mill battery combination that yields 400AH of
capacity can safely accept a 100 amp charge rate. My old boat had 4
golf cart batts in series-parallel equaling 440AH of capacity. My 3
phase Heart Interface charger routinely recharged at 100+ amps during
the bulk charge phase with no heating or excessive electrolyte
consumption (the generator was straining however). The batteries were
routinely recharged this way 50 or 60 times a year over a 4 year
period. The battery bank was still in excellent condition when I sold
the boat.

"Doug Dotson" wrote in message
...


I'm confused about why there is some question about
running a battery charger off of a genset. I have run
mine for several years with no problem. The battery charger
runs off the genset the same as off of shore power.

Several reasons:

1) As others have said, the battery charger can represent a significant
load to the generator. The point that several people are making is that
many battery chargers have a very poor power factor, which could create
significant issues to the generator, especially a generator that uses
inverter technology to get more horsepower out of a smaller engine.

2) The voltage output of a generator can often vary considerably. A cheap
battery charger can have its charging rate drastically reduced if the
voltage is low.

3) The frequency of a generator can vary quite a bit. Many marine battery
chargers are the "Ferro resonant" type which rely on the AC input being
exactly 60 Hz. Any deviation from this and the output can be drastically
reduced.

Rod

The Honda EB3000c puts out 12amps at 12vdc, max, continuously. It has a
special circuit w/plug&cable just for this purpose.

The generator itself has a rated power of 2.6kVA, weighs 68 lbs. and
have sold on Ebay for $1K.

Might be worth your consideration.





engsol wrote:

I spnt a bit of web time googling marine battery chargers that
might work with the Honda EU1000 or EU2000 generators.

Here are some URLs...not an exhaustive list by any means...
http://www.charlesindustries.com/main/ma_chargers.html
http://www.newmarpower.com/
http://www.mastervolt.com/chargers/index.asp
http://www.progressivedyn.com/
http://www.majorpower.com/newmar/p3bc.html (interesting)
http://www.batterystuff.com/battery/...o/dual-pro.htm

I like the specs shown by majorpower.com. They give a
figure for power factor, which sems to be missing from
other manufs.

As a trial...assume a 100 AH gel battery. A PT14 charger will
charge 28 to 140 AH batteries at 14 amps maximum. 14 amps times
1.1 (efficeincy of 90%) times PF of .95 (spec at 115VAC) equals
about 16.2 amps. Adjust to 115VAC input and you get about 2 amps,
or 230 VA. A 25 amp charger might work even better without over
stressing the generator.
I called a couple of the charger manufs, and they concur
with the numbers. The trick is to get a charger with a rated output
compatible with the available input power. A 150 amp charger ain't
going to work with a EU1000. But of course the trade-off is longer
charge times.

Hope this helps.
Norm B




--
s/v Mutiny
Rhodes Bounty II
lying Oriental, NC
WDB5619