What does peel ply look like? Does it look just like 6oz fiberglass cloth?
I laminated two layers of 6oz cloth to my cockpit sole using epoxy. I
laid the fiberglass down dry and lined it up nicely. Then I folded it
back over itself half way. Then I rolled unthickened epoxy over the sole
surface and the laid the fiberglass back over the epoxy and rolled that
down with more epoxy until it was clear. Then I did the other half the
exact same way. I used just enough epoxy to turn the cloth clear but no
extra. Then I laid a second layer of cloth on top of the first layer and
rolled epoxy onto it until it was clear. This is two feet wide by 6 feet
long.
I waited until it was sticky like masking tape. I rolled unthickened
epoxy over the whole surface. I waited until that was sticky and rolled
another coat on it.
after the second coat was sticky, I rolled a 3rd coat on. It was smooth
and shiny. That was two weeks ago. The temperature in the shop was
around 65 or so. I was sweating doing it so it wasn't very cold out. It
was raining outside, but this is in a building.
Today, I was picking at the corner of the glass with my pocket knife. I
was able to lift the corner of the fiberglass. I pushed my knife in
further and was able to lift a big piece of fiberglass. In just 15
minutes, I was able to rip all of the fiberglass off in big pieces. So I
wonder if this guy sold me peel ply instead of fiberglass. I can't
believe that it was a contaminated substrate because, the epoxy should
have stuck somewhere. This was too easy to get up. I pulled it up with
my gloves on and just yanked it up. I can also rip the two courses apart
with ease. What is going on here? What does peel ply look like? Could I
have possibly mistaken peel ply for fiberglass?

On Sun, 15 Oct 2006 19:25:51 -0400, Dan wrote:

What does peel ply look like? Does it look just like 6oz fiberglass cloth?

It looks like 3 oz polyester interlining material.

Brian Whatcott Altus OK

Dan wrote:
What does peel ply look like?

Depends on what kind. I've gotten two different kinds, one
rather coppery colored & stiff, looked like a performated
film more than like a woven cloth. Then I've also gotten
some stuff that looked like lightweight cloth with an almost
greasy-feeling finish on it, much more supple and good for
molding curves. This second type might be mistaken for
fiberglass cloth, I guess.

I laminated two layers of 6oz cloth to my cockpit sole using epoxy.

...(snip for brevity)... In just 15
minutes, I was able to rip all of the fiberglass off in big pieces. So I
wonder if this guy sold me peel ply instead of fiberglass. I can't
believe that it was a contaminated substrate because, the epoxy should
have stuck somewhere.

Not if it was a type of cloth with a binder or finish that
is incompatible with epoxy. Usually this is a problem with
matte, but it could be a problem with woven cloth too.

And it's possible that it's really peel ply. Personally, I'd
call up the supplier and tell him what you've told us. I'd
also ask for a refund, but then I'm not shy about such things.

Fresh Breezes- Doug King

aka white nylon taffeta. (cheap after prom season is over)

It does NOT look like fiberglass.

I'd suggest that maybe you had cold wood and warm epoxy so the epoxy didn't
penetrate the pores of the wood. I like to warm the wood, coat with
unthickened epoxy, kill any pinholes/bubbles, then lay on the glass. But
even when I don't, it's always, eventually, bonded to the wood; it just had
pinholes/bubbles.

Roger

http://home.insightbb.com/~derbyrm

"Brian Whatcott" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 15 Oct 2006 19:25:51 -0400, Dan wrote:

What does peel ply look like? Does it look just like 6oz fiberglass cloth?

It looks like 3 oz polyester interlining material.

Brian Whatcott Altus OK

Sounds like a problem with the epoxy, not the glass. What you're using is
definitely not peel ply. What brand of epoxy were you using? Was it
formulated as a laminating epoxy rather than a "glueing" epoxy? Seems like
you did everything right. I can sort of understand if it didn't stick to
the substrate but it MUST have at least stuck to itself. Hmmmm....

Arnold


"Dan" wrote in message ...
What does peel ply look like? Does it look just like 6oz fiberglass cloth?
I laminated two layers of 6oz cloth to my cockpit sole using epoxy. I laid
the fiberglass down dry and lined it up nicely. Then I folded it back over
itself half way. Then I rolled unthickened epoxy over the sole surface and
the laid the fiberglass back over the epoxy and rolled that down with more
epoxy until it was clear. Then I did the other half the exact same way.
I used just enough epoxy to turn the cloth clear but no extra. Then I laid
a second layer of cloth on top of the first layer and rolled epoxy onto it
until it was clear. This is two feet wide by 6 feet long.
I waited until it was sticky like masking tape. I rolled unthickened epoxy
over the whole surface. I waited until that was sticky and rolled another
coat on it.
after the second coat was sticky, I rolled a 3rd coat on. It was smooth
and shiny. That was two weeks ago. The temperature in the shop was around
65 or so. I was sweating doing it so it wasn't very cold out. It was
raining outside, but this is in a building.
Today, I was picking at the corner of the glass with my pocket knife. I
was able to lift the corner of the fiberglass. I pushed my knife in
further and was able to lift a big piece of fiberglass. In just 15
minutes, I was able to rip all of the fiberglass off in big pieces. So I
wonder if this guy sold me peel ply instead of fiberglass. I can't believe
that it was a contaminated substrate because, the epoxy should have stuck
somewhere. This was too easy to get up. I pulled it up with my gloves on
and just yanked it up. I can also rip the two courses apart with ease.
What is going on here? What does peel ply look like? Could I have possibly
mistaken peel ply for fiberglass?

I am using West system epoxy. The material is about 6 mos. old. I am
bonding over fairing putty that was used to level the surface prior to
putting the fiberglass down. It was a clean and course surface. The part
I don't get is that it didn't even stick to itself. I did some repair
work using this epoxy and DB1808 and it is solid as a rock. I need to
figure out what this fiberglass material is. I'm going to do a test
laminate on wood today to see how it adheres. I ruled out contamination
because I can peel both layers apart. That's what's confusing.

It didn't bond well to the fairing putty, but it didn't bond well to the
original fiberglass either. Hmmmm...
Thanks for the reply's,
Dan

Ystay wrote:
Sounds like a problem with the epoxy, not the glass. What you're using is
definitely not peel ply. What brand of epoxy were you using? Was it
formulated as a laminating epoxy rather than a "glueing" epoxy? Seems like
you did everything right. I can sort of understand if it didn't stick to
the substrate but it MUST have at least stuck to itself. Hmmmm....

Arnold

He said.........

I am using West system epoxy. The material is about 6 mos. old. I am
bonding over fairing putty that was used to level the surface prior to
putting the fiberglass down. It was a clean and course surface. The part
I don't get is that it didn't even stick to itself. I did some repair
work using this epoxy and DB1808 and it is solid as a rock.



You have discovered that the 6 oz finely woven fiber glass that is commonly
sold by "fiberglass supply houses" is terrible when it comes to adhesion
properties. I have found this to be true regardless of the resin type
Epoxy, Vinylester or Polyester.

I think it is attributable to the tightly packed and twisted tows used to
make the material. It does not allow for good saturation.

Next time use a DB1208 and you will get the same results as the DB1808 and
save a bit of weight. The glass mat sewn to the double bias strands offer
good saturation and great adhesion and a superior water proofing layer.

I know of very few "pros" who use this stuff in fiberglass work but for
some reason it seems very popular with do it yourselfers.

In 28 years of fiberglass boat building with five different companies I have
never used this product in a commercially built boat.

My advice is to stay away from it unless your are building model boats.

frp

Thanks FR. I have thrown the 6oz material in the trash.
Here is a stupid question, which way do you put down the DB1208, mat
side up, or mat side down against the substrait?

FR wrote:
He said.........

I am using West system epoxy. The material is about 6 mos. old. I am
bonding over fairing putty that was used to level the surface prior to
putting the fiberglass down. It was a clean and course surface. The part
I don't get is that it didn't even stick to itself. I did some repair
work using this epoxy and DB1808 and it is solid as a rock.



You have discovered that the 6 oz finely woven fiber glass that is commonly
sold by "fiberglass supply houses" is terrible when it comes to adhesion
properties. I have found this to be true regardless of the resin type
Epoxy, Vinylester or Polyester.

I think it is attributable to the tightly packed and twisted tows used to
make the material. It does not allow for good saturation.

Next time use a DB1208 and you will get the same results as the DB1808 and
save a bit of weight. The glass mat sewn to the double bias strands offer
good saturation and great adhesion and a superior water proofing layer.

I know of very few "pros" who use this stuff in fiberglass work but for
some reason it seems very popular with do it yourselfers.

In 28 years of fiberglass boat building with five different companies I have
never used this product in a commercially built boat.

My advice is to stay away from it unless your are building model boats.

frp

Next time use a DB1208 and you will get the same results as the
DB1808 and
save a bit of weight. The glass mat sewn to the double bias strands
offer
good saturation and great adhesion and a superior water proofing layer.

I know of very few "pros" who use this stuff in fiberglass work
but for
some reason it seems very popular with do it yourselfers.

snip

DB1208 is great for polyester but the mat does nothing but add
unnecessary weight when using epoxy.

Personally, I like DB170 for epoxy.

Lew

I agree. The DB170 is great but it sure does stretch out of shape easy.
If nothing else, the mat helps to keep the shape of the material.

Lew Hodgett wrote:

Next time use a DB1208 and you will get the same results as the
DB1808 and
save a bit of weight. The glass mat sewn to the double bias strands
offer
good saturation and great adhesion and a superior water proofing layer.

I know of very few "pros" who use this stuff in fiberglass work but for
some reason it seems very popular with do it yourselfers.

snip

DB1208 is great for polyester but the mat does nothing but add
unnecessary weight when using epoxy.

Personally, I like DB170 for epoxy.

Lew