I've played with Carlson Hulls somewhat and it appears that you can
only input 4 or 5 sections, which isn't nearly enough for my needs. If
it can in fact accept the 20 sections that I need to input, perhaps
someone can clue me in on how it's done.

I was thinnking if you had the sections you could enter them into
Greg Carlson's program one or two at a time just to draw the panels. Never
tried it myself.




Do a google on Blue Peter Marine, software from a chap downunder, has a
functional free version and a more capable Pro demo that can unfold and
develop - he calls it plates - but can't save the output in demo I think,
but maybe its worth a try and if it does what you want and maybe it's not
too expensive...

I had the 8S version and I've downloaded the 9S and "plate enhanced"
demo version. It appears that it can do what I want, but it's going to
take some time to figure out how.


I have the old DOS version. I've not figured out the curvature numbers
that will give flat panels (hard chines). I'm sure it's possible. You also
have to go and set the parameters (eg units of measure) before starting to
key in offsets on that version. You have to put in some things like bow
and transom rake before you can put in offsets too. I had offsets from the
Carlson program I wanted to key into the Blue Peter(BP) program. BP starts
with a simple hull and you add lines and sections. It worked best if I
kept inserting sections between exsisting sections until the hull was
filled out, instead of trying to start at bow or stern and key in sections
sequentially. I used BP because it calculated more hydrostatics numbers
than the Carlson program. It was just an exercise in designing a hull. I
didn't build the boat.

Hi

"I used BP because it calculated more hydrostatics numbers
than the Carlson program. It was just an exercise in designing a hull.
I
didn't build the boat. "

Oh yea --- but did blue Peter or Carson ???? Build it ????
Well Cyber-Boat was a bunch of acturly _build boats_ and a lot of
hands-on experience happily shared, where this seem to be a fantasy
piece of software with _no_ build experience documentation "did you
build it" suddenly make sense right ????

wrote:
Hi

"Now I'm really confused. I joined the group and did some searching
around and I haven't found links to any Cyber-Boat software. Searching
the web for "Cyber-Boat" produces links to the Yahoo group and a few
other designs, but that's it. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I get the
impression that what's on the group are designs that must be
viewed/modified using AutoCad. Can anyone clear this up for me? "

No you shuldn't expect Cyber-Boat to offer the free download software,

Who said anything about "free"? What I asked was for a program that
would allow me to enter sections, fair the shape and create panels.

-- now this been an issue in this group before ,as when you check the
free-download designs and full-scale drawings in the Cyber-Boat groups,
then any amature builder with a small CAD proram ofcaurse would love to
have the simple applications that make this possible.

But due to the group bullying and promoting of specific flatbottom
designs ,vaste material boatsbuilding replacing real boats building and
desktop designers promoting grandfathers designs , Cyber-Boat stopped
at just that point where you all could have profited by it's software
--- software that can do exactly what you asked and _much_ more such as
3D morphing between two 3D designs that then can produce both unfolded
panels and framework ; but no, --- you just check back and see the
bullying and harasment that came as soon as Cyber-Boat treadened the
flatbottom vaste materials "designs" .

Frankly, I really don't care about all of that nonsense. I wasn't part
of it (I don't even know when it happened) and I'm not going to get into
it now. I also have no interest in your ranting, as it's not solving my
problem. If there is software available that will do what I need, please
tell me where and how to get it. If not, please don't waste my time
telling me about a product that isn't available.

William R. Watt wrote:
I've played with Carlson Hulls somewhat and it appears that you can
only input 4 or 5 sections, which isn't nearly enough for my needs. If
it can in fact accept the 20 sections that I need to input, perhaps
someone can clue me in on how it's done.


I was thinnking if you had the sections you could enter them into
Greg Carlson's program one or two at a time just to draw the panels. Never
tried it myself.

As far as I can tell, it will only accept a limited number of sections.

Do a google on Blue Peter Marine, software from a chap downunder, has a
functional free version and a more capable Pro demo that can unfold and
develop - he calls it plates - but can't save the output in demo I think,
but maybe its worth a try and if it does what you want and maybe it's not
too expensive...

I had the 8S version and I've downloaded the 9S and "plate enhanced"
demo version. It appears that it can do what I want, but it's going to
take some time to figure out how.

I have the old DOS version. I've not figured out the curvature numbers
that will give flat panels (hard chines). I'm sure it's possible. You also
have to go and set the parameters (eg units of measure) before starting to
key in offsets on that version. You have to put in some things like bow
and transom rake before you can put in offsets too. I had offsets from the
Carlson program I wanted to key into the Blue Peter(BP) program. BP starts
with a simple hull and you add lines and sections. It worked best if I
kept inserting sections between exsisting sections until the hull was
filled out, instead of trying to start at bow or stern and key in sections
sequentially.

The current version allows you to input basic shape parameters (curved
or hard chine, freeboard, etc.) and the number of sections at the
beginning. I'll need to move and modify the sections, but at least it'a
a place to start. I've taken the sections off a skin-on-frame boat I
built, so the design is tested, and I want to duplicate it in
stitch-and-glue.

I used BP because it calculated more hydrostatics numbers
than the Carlson program. It was just an exercise in designing a hull. I
didn't build the boat.

Thanks Bill. I guess I'll just play with the demo version for a while
and if I can generate the panels I need, I'll buy the full-function version.

--It was this ****ing contest mentality that made me stop
reading rec.boats.building. Seems to me the bottom line is this
cyber-boat crap is inadequate to the task of designing anything other
than a limited variety of hull types. For those who are heading down
other roads there *must* be some other software packages available.
Assuming you don't want free/limited but don't want to pay a couple of
grand either, what *is* available?
--As for me I've decided to do it the "old fashioned" way; i.e.
make a model, do some tank tests and make sure it "feels" right B4
scaling up.

--
"Steamboat Ed" Haas : Nihil curo de ista tua
Hacking the Trailing Edge! : stulta superstitione...
http://www.nmpproducts.com/intro.htm
---Decks a-wash in a sea of words---

Hi

"--It was this ****ing contest mentality that made me stop
reading rec.boats.building. Seems to me the bottom line is this
cyber-boat crap is inadequate to the task of designing anything other
than a limited variety of hull types"

No you are wrong --- it was those crap flatbottom fanatics that would
not allow things like Cyber-Boat ; if they hadn't won all the
Cyber-Boat software would have been avaible and the most beautifull
amature boats could have been build but no.

Beside The cyber-Boat concept let you design just any shape you want,
the ones quite a lot btw. at download can even just be scaled up or
down if you know just a tiny bit about CAD, --- No What Cyber-Boat
could have brought you, was exactly what you expect computers to bring,
and the new framework system acturly could have build any Elegant
Bolger Elefant way easier --- and belive it 4 times strionger.

No the Cyber-Boat thing was just another "we **** on him and then we
say he stink, ---then we steal the bread from his mouth !!!"

The Cyber-Boat guy was just a happy idealist who wanted to share nome
nice designs and the plans to build them --- such like this Cyber-Boat;

http://home20.inet.tele.dk/h-3d/Lofot-1.jpg

But na no one shall think he is anyone right ; first we **** on him
then we say he stink then we steal the bread from his mouth , how great
"we" are"???

Sadass usenet fanatics poison belly.

How do you expect it to be possible to show the build boats and the
accurate plans , even for lapstrake hulls that is not the useal smooth
surface CAD models of boats, no Cyber-Boat did bring it a step further
these jokers just didn't wanted that, and made usenet their evil
playground.
Still you proberly shuld look closer into the thing I promote instead
of this simple unfolding thing, acturly there are something much more
important than the shivering unfolded panels ,what they acturly are
placed on ,the framework you place any paneling ontop and that is much
more important than the unfolded surfaces ; that is the real challance
,realy unfolding are way overexposed it is nothing and the programming
are trivial , ---- think about it whatever you think you need it for
,it never brought what it promised and why -- becaurse it is as
important to have a structure undreneath the panels othervise they are
impossible to assemble into that shape being unfolded.

Anyway I gave up the proud boatsbuilding crafts ,the inviroment was
simply to poison and there was no bread in bringing beautifull boats
made with at those day's technology ,the homey's rather wanted Elegant
Elefants than nice boats and splendid design ,but true I still have the
software I didn't use for years but as I said, maby you shuld consider
if the computer unfolding realy are the important issue. Whatever you
need it for.
The Cyber-Boat guy don't exist like that anymore I had it with the
plesant gentlemen here and realy it is years since any nice
craftmanship been on display in this group ,if it was it would first
meet the slick guy's then the pretitors --- it proberly be the same guy
with just a fake usenet identity..

wrote:
How do you expect it to be possible to show the build boats and the
accurate plans , even for lapstrake hulls that is not the useal smooth
surface CAD models of boats, no Cyber-Boat did bring it a step further
these jokers just didn't wanted that, and made usenet their evil
playground.
Still you proberly shuld look closer into the thing I promote instead
of this simple unfolding thing, acturly there are something much more
important than the shivering unfolded panels ,what they acturly are
placed on ,the framework you place any paneling ontop and that is much
more important than the unfolded surfaces ; that is the real challance
,realy unfolding are way overexposed it is nothing and the programming
are trivial , ---- think about it whatever you think you need it for
,it never brought what it promised and why -- becaurse it is as
important to have a structure undreneath the panels othervise they are
impossible to assemble into that shape being unfolded.

snip

Fine, I'm perfectly willing to accept that it's a nice design package,
but where is it available? I'm beginning to feel like I'm chasing
unicorns. It is real or just a memory? Is it a stand-alone package or
does one need AutoCad or another Cad package to use it? Please answer
these questions, rather than just complaining about the past. I can't do
anything about that and reading about it isn't addressing my needs.

Hi

Brian you are welcome to email me . I will ansver your call as I see
you mean this serious.
P.C.