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#1
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Opinions on Radars
I had a JRC 1000 on my first boat and now I am restoring a 43 Endeavour
ketch and it is time to think about radars. The JRC was a nice unit but woefully underpowered. I would like to see out 8 to 10 miles with the radome mounted 20-30' up the mizzen. I know that the 4kw will give more power out and thus burn thru in foggy conditions but most of the 4kw units have the big displays. Everyone on this group knows the drill...what will give me the biggest bang for the buck with the best reliability amd a thin small display. Thanks Bruce -- Shield Finishes and Nauticoat Marine Finish Systems www.shieldfinishes.com |
#2
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Bruce on horizon wrote:
I had a JRC 1000 on my first boat and now I am restoring a 43 Endeavour ketch and it is time to think about radars. The JRC was a nice unit but woefully underpowered. I would like to see out 8 to 10 miles with the radome mounted 20-30' up the mizzen. I know that the 4kw will give more power out and thus burn thru in foggy conditions but most of the 4kw units have the big displays. Everyone on this group knows the drill...what will give me the biggest bang for the buck with the best reliability amd a thin small display. The RayMarine equipment lets you mix and match the displays and the domes so you get what you need now, and upgrade later. BTW, the radar horizon is about 7 miles from a transmitter 30 feet up. Large targets will of course be seen at a larger distance, but I can't say that I've had any problem with my low power Raytheon, and I cruise in Maine and Cape Cod. |
#3
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I would like to see out 8 to 10 miles with the
radome mounted 20-30' up the mizzen. Hi Bruce, As Jeff says, your radar will not be able to pick up small targets past your visible horizon (about 6.3 nm according to Bowditch). You will be able to pick up big, tall contacts further out, but that's about it. I'd stick to a 1.5 to 2 kw radar if I were you. Higher power doesn't "burn" through anything, including fog, and I think 4 kw is over kill for what you'll be doing. In fact at the short ranges you'll be operating at, the higher power will probably be a disadvantage. The RayMarine stuff looks pretty nice and has alot of nice features (like color and MARPA (their adaptation of ARPA)). But I'd go with a small Furuno if you can afford it or another JRC if you're on the cheap. Just my biased opinion though. Walk around the docks and see what the smaller commercial fisherman in your area use. They tend to only get stuff that works, why not do the same? Just remember, if you get too fancy a radar, chances are your attention will be fixated on that fancy screen and not your main navigation tool: your "Mark I Mod II Eyeballs" ;-) Hope this helps, Paul =----------------------= Renewontime A FREE email reminder service for licensed mariners http://www.renewontime.com =----------------------= |
#4
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On Sun, 13 Feb 2005 17:20:53 -0500, "Bruce on horizon"
wrote: I would like to see out 8 to 10 miles with the radome mounted 20-30' up the mizzen. I Sidebar question: Am I woefully ignorant on radar implementation or am I correct in assuming that a target heading directly for one's bow would be invisible to a mizzen mounted radar due to the three-to-four degree "screen" of the main mast directly ahead? Or am I missing something? Why the mizzen (aside from its convenience and the fact few people use a mizzen stays'l, so nothing to hook the radome or mount). R. |
#5
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rhys wrote:
On Sun, 13 Feb 2005 17:20:53 -0500, "Bruce on horizon" wrote: I would like to see out 8 to 10 miles with the radome mounted 20-30' up the mizzen. I Sidebar question: Am I woefully ignorant on radar implementation or am I correct in assuming that a target heading directly for one's bow would be invisible to a mizzen mounted radar due to the three-to-four degree "screen" of the main mast directly ahead? Or am I missing something? Why the mizzen (aside from its convenience and the fact few people use a mizzen stays'l, so nothing to hook the radome or mount). R. Quite possibly, IF you where an expert helmsman at all times. otn BTW I hate small displays. I'd get the biggest one possible. Also, don't get hung up on the "height of eye" distance capabilities of your radar ..... your "HE" may only say 6ish miles, but you'll be able to see a whole bunch of stuff beyond that. otn |
#6
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rhys wrote:
Sidebar question: Am I woefully ignorant on radar implementation or am I correct in assuming that a target heading directly for one's bow would be invisible to a mizzen mounted radar due to the three-to-four degree "screen" of the main mast directly ahead? A common misconception. If you think about it, you will realize that the radio energy of flowing off of and being received along the entire width of the antenna which is much wider than your mast. A healthy percentage of it is reflected back and to the sides, but most of the energy just flows right on past the mast. It works the same in reverse for the reflected energy coming back from a target. Thus, the strength of the reteurn is reduced, but you are still able to see it. Othereise, all those boats with mast mounted radars would have a fairly wide cone to their rear where they pick up nothing. In answer to Bruce's original question, overall, I like the Raymarine units. The one I put on my last boat worked so well for me, I put one on this boat too and like it just as well. I find the JVC screens harder to see and focus on than the others, but this may just be a personal thing. Whatever you do, mount the display so that it can be seen at the helm, not just at the nav station. A friend of mine's radar is just visible at the nav station and having played radar operator calling instructions up to him at the helm while dodging freighters in dense fog on SF Bay, I'm here to say that this arrangement sucks. Fair winds - Dan |
#7
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I am not a schill for Practical Sailor (subscription newsletter), nor
do I play one on TV, but I do find their articles generally useful, educational and informative. They did a piece on 'Entry Level LCD Radar' in September '04, the preamble to which you can see he http://www.practical-sailor.com/pub/...es/5003-1.html MW |
#8
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I ditto your comment about the radar in the cockpit. That is the reason I
want a smaller LCD at the helm. I will be right on top of the display, not trying to look at it from 10' away. Bruce -- Shield Finishes and Nauticoat Marine Finish Systems www.shieldfinishes.com "Dan Best" wrote in message ... rhys wrote: Sidebar question: Am I woefully ignorant on radar implementation or am I correct in assuming that a target heading directly for one's bow would be invisible to a mizzen mounted radar due to the three-to-four degree "screen" of the main mast directly ahead? A common misconception. If you think about it, you will realize that the radio energy of flowing off of and being received along the entire width of the antenna which is much wider than your mast. A healthy percentage of it is reflected back and to the sides, but most of the energy just flows right on past the mast. It works the same in reverse for the reflected energy coming back from a target. Thus, the strength of the reteurn is reduced, but you are still able to see it. Othereise, all those boats with mast mounted radars would have a fairly wide cone to their rear where they pick up nothing. In answer to Bruce's original question, overall, I like the Raymarine units. The one I put on my last boat worked so well for me, I put one on this boat too and like it just as well. I find the JVC screens harder to see and focus on than the others, but this may just be a personal thing. Whatever you do, mount the display so that it can be seen at the helm, not just at the nav station. A friend of mine's radar is just visible at the nav station and having played radar operator calling instructions up to him at the helm while dodging freighters in dense fog on SF Bay, I'm here to say that this arrangement sucks. Fair winds - Dan |
#9
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Jeff Morris wrote:
Bruce on horizon wrote: I had a JRC 1000 on my first boat and now I am restoring a 43 Endeavour ketch and it is time to think about radars. The JRC was a nice unit but woefully underpowered. I would like to see out 8 to 10 miles with the radome mounted 20-30' up the mizzen. I know that the 4kw will give more power out and thus burn thru in foggy conditions but most of the 4kw units have the big displays. Everyone on this group knows the drill...what will give me the biggest bang for the buck with the best reliability amd a thin small display. The RayMarine equipment lets you mix and match the displays and the domes so you get what you need now, and upgrade later. BTW, the radar horizon is about 7 miles from a transmitter 30 feet up. Large targets will of course be seen at a larger distance, but I can't say that I've had any problem with my low power Raytheon, and I cruise in Maine and Cape Cod. I've had minor second thoughts on this after checking the specs. In the "old days" more powerful domes were heavier and used more power - that is not the case now - the 4kW Raymarine dome only weighs a few pounds more and uses 1 or 2 Watts more juice. I'm still not sure of the value for long distance viewing, but the high power dome will have finer resolution, so that a pair of channel buoys will be resolved as two targets further away with the more powerful unit. Navigation is easier, since coastlines will more closely resemble the chart. However, this takes a lot of practice and you're better off relying on a good gps. The downsides of the large unit is almost double the cost (a $1000 premium on the RayMarine list) and a much larger dome (an issue for those trying to hide the dome from the jib). |
#10
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Stay away from Raymarine! Since they separated from Raytheon, they're
turning into cheap junk. Stick with Furuno. -- Keith __ "Usually, terrible things that are done with the excuse that progress requires them are not really progress at all, but just terrible things." - Russell Baker "Bruce on horizon" wrote in message ... I had a JRC 1000 on my first boat and now I am restoring a 43 Endeavour ketch and it is time to think about radars. The JRC was a nice unit but woefully underpowered. I would like to see out 8 to 10 miles with the radome mounted 20-30' up the mizzen. I know that the 4kw will give more power out and thus burn thru in foggy conditions but most of the 4kw units have the big displays. Everyone on this group knows the drill...what will give me the biggest bang for the buck with the best reliability amd a thin small display. Thanks Bruce -- Shield Finishes and Nauticoat Marine Finish Systems www.shieldfinishes.com |
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