Brian Whatcott ) writes:
On 15 Oct 2004 06:24:48 -0700, (Backyard
Renegade) wrote:

Morgan Ohlson wrote in message ...

I get a little tired of those who call themselves designers and only want
people to buy books or []...
Morgan O.


Holy crap! You come here with basically nothing asking for free help.
You get two professional working designers helping you on your threads
and you respond with this? If I were Evan and Steve, I would tell you
to []...
....
Yeah, the Backyard Renegade...

What he (BR) said....

I disagree. The guy's an engineer and bound to be picky. You have to make
allowances for engineers.

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An engineer who doesn't know that the centroid of a triangle is always at 1/3 of the triangle's altitude (that's
math-speak for the 'How high is the center of effort?' question.) needs a refresher course.

"William R. Watt" wrote:

Brian Whatcott ) writes:
On 15 Oct 2004 06:24:48 -0700, (Backyard
Renegade) wrote:

Morgan Ohlson wrote in message ...

I get a little tired of those who call themselves designers and only want
people to buy books or []...
Morgan O.


Holy crap! You come here with basically nothing asking for free help.
You get two professional working designers helping you on your threads
and you respond with this? If I were Evan and Steve, I would tell you
to []...
....
Yeah, the Backyard Renegade...

What he (BR) said....

I disagree. The guy's an engineer and bound to be picky. You have to make
allowances for engineers.

--
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William R Watt National Capital FreeNet Ottawa's free community network
homepage: www.ncf.ca/~ag384/top.htm
warning: non-FreeNet email must have "notspam" in subject or it's returned

Morgan says:

Ahaa, so we started flaming now!?

I see no flames - just my opinion.

So utterly low.

STANDARD USENET BONEHEAD REPLY FORM (Version 9.5) ---- Written by: John Henry
(check all boxes that apply)

Dear:

[ ] Clueless Newbie
[ ] Troller
[ ] "Me too"-er
[ ] Spammer
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[X] Expert on everything (EOE)
[ ] Flamethrower
[ ] News Groupie


You Are Being Flamed Because:
[X] You obviously don't know anything about the topic at hand
[ ] You are trying to make money on a non-commercial newsgroup
[ ] You posted a picture (binary) of something YOU think is really cool in
an unmoderated TEXT ONLY news group
[ ] You started a long, stupid thread
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last year and a half
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follow-up to crossposted robot-generated spam
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[X] You posted low-IQ flamebait
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[X] You said "X rules, Y sucks" and gave no support for your lame statement
[ ] You said "me too" to something and added NOTHING to the discussion
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[ ] Your margin settings (or lack of) make your post unreadable
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REASON
[ ] You posted a 1 line reply with PAGES of unnecessary quoted text
[ ] You didn't do anything specific, but appear to be so generally
worthless that you are being flamed anyway


To Repent, You Must:
[X] Refrain from posting until you have a vague idea what you're doing
[X] READ every post in this group for two weeks so you can get an idea about
what is discussed here
[ ] Read every newsgroup you posted to for a week
[ ] Give up your AOL account
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[ ] Jump into a bathtub while holding your monitor (monitor must be plugged
in)
[ ] Actually post something relevant
[ ] Post to alt.test
[ ] Print your home phone number and address in your ads
[ ] Be the guest of honor in alt.flame for a month
[ ] Nothing, we'll let you go this time


In Closing, I'd Like to Say:

[ ] Get a clue
[ ] Get a life
[ ] Go away
[ ] Grow up
[ ] Never post again
[ ] You need to seek psychiatric help
[ ] Like a neutered dog, you just don't get it
[ ] Take your gibberish somewhere else
[ ] Go back to school and actually learn something
[ ] Learn how to post or get off the Usenet
[X] Don't take offense at this, I just like to use this form
[ ] All of the above


Or something like that ;-)

On Fri, 15 Oct 2004 21:21:21 GMT, Jim Conlin wrote:

An engineer who doesn't know that the centroid of a triangle is always at 1/3 of the triangle's altitude (that's
math-speak for the 'How high is the center of effort?' question.) needs a refresher course.

"William R. Watt" wrote:

Brian Whatcott ) writes:
On 15 Oct 2004 06:24:48 -0700, (Backyard
Renegade) wrote:

Morgan Ohlson wrote in message ...

I get a little tired of those who call themselves designers and only want
people to buy books or []...
Morgan O.


Holy crap! You come here with basically nothing asking for free help.
You get two professional working designers helping you on your threads
and you respond with this? If I were Evan and Steve, I would tell you
to []...
....
Yeah, the Backyard Renegade...

What he (BR) said....

I disagree. The guy's an engineer and bound to be picky. You have to make
allowances for engineers.

--
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
William R Watt National Capital FreeNet Ottawa's free community network
homepage: www.ncf.ca/~ag384/top.htm
warning: non-FreeNet email must have "notspam" in subject or it's returned


Are you actually saying that you step out in the debate whith that kind of
fascistoid oppinions, aggressiv style and beliving anyone are taking you for
serious?

To the tech Q.... Two differnently sized (hight) triangles will have the CE
at different hight. But, if, say if I had expressed my self ambigous
couldn't you accept taht, in that case... or is that beyond your abilities?

So please, if you have to put really stupid words into other persons mouths
to improve your own position... do that somewhere else.


Morgan O.

On Fri, 15 Oct 2004 11:04:10 -0300, Terry Spragg wrote:

Morgan Ohlson wrote:
*** Jib size or Main/Foretriangle Ratio ***

If very theoretically 1 (equally large) must be the best. It lowers
(vertically) the CE to minimum and the shortest possible mast is needed.

1. What says that the main should be bigger?

2.Some boats have M/F-ratios of 4. That seems really stupid.

3. Is a self tacking jib a matter of importance when regarding the
M/F-ratio?

Ratio itself is just a number which in itself is not important.

True... numbers itself is for numbrologists ;o)



Self tacking or not doesn't matter, really, except that self tacking
jibs must be smaller than the space in which they are flown, as the
jib club foot must pass between the headstay gooseneck and the mast.
It may also be required to pass in front of the foreward shrouds,
if other considerations permit using the club somewhat off the wind.

Good, I'm going for unstayed so shrouds isn't much of a problem )


Interference with the pulpit bases while winged out is a
consideration. I prefer the longest possible club, so as to enable
flattening the jib in a constant way wrt the actual sheeting angle,
critical to good windward speed.

Club... is that the boom? sorry, it's the eng. vocabulary...

But I understand that you focus on the possibility to haul in the jib
properly going towards weather.

That will make the sheet angle towards the forstay crucial, wouldn't it?


All that depends on the geometery
and the system employed. The main advantage I find with a self
tending jib is really sheeting angle.

ahhaa.


Inboard sheeting angles permit
much better pointing, superior performance over a big baggy outboard
genny when there is enough apparrent wind. Off the wind I lower the
club and use regular outboard sheets, which are always attached even
when both are lazy, when using the "automatic" rig.

The actual ratio between sails isn't the key, here. It is a question
of balance overall and the relationship between sails in total verus
keel and rudder. A small jib may well improve weather helm over
going without.

If I go for a Cat rig I will get a very high mast, right! ..but if I have
I big jib (same total area) I can shorten the mast. Why wouldn't that be an
issue?

Morgan O.