http://www.eskimo.com/~mighetto/p11.htm

Myth#11 Mac26 is not for ocean sailing. Go ahead, click the link and see
just how good and seaworthy a professional captain thinks the Mac really
is. Dare you. Jeff expecially.

If you're too much of a coward to admit how good the Mac26X is don't
click the link and don't read a little of what it has in it that I
pasted right here.-- Owing to "focally ruptured gangreous acute
appendicitis", I spent the better part of January 2001 arguing about
this (the Mac26x is fit for all waters), rather than sailing or working,
and have 80 pages of emails as well as several magazines and books on
boat design involving the subject. According to Sea magazine (April
2005) "California's coastline is not particularly trailerboat-friendly -
the areas where you can take small or trailerboats are limited, so it
also would stand to reason that boaters would be heading to inland lakes
and rivers in droves." But MacGregor Yachts has always oriented its
products for world-wide coastal ocean and not just Califorina sales. The
manufacturer believes that a 26 footer is too small to hold enough gear
and supplies for passage. However, at least one Mac26x dealer considers
ocean passage to be within the boat's design parameters and in 1999 more
that a few Mac26x vessels made the trip from Crandon Park marina on
Miami's Key Biscayn or nearby to the Bahamas. At least one Mac26x yacht
made the trip from the city marina at Garison Bight in Key West to the
Marquesas and on to the Tortugas. The 1000 mile coast of Florida has
been sailed by a Mac26x. And two Mac26x cruisers (from Bellingham and
Everett) were outfitted for an Alaskan inside passage (over 2000 miles)
following the Cassiopeia in that regard. Those who find the ride of a
light displacement under 30 foot sailboat preferable in ocean swells see
its potential as a long-distance passage maker. This is demonstrated by
reports that MacGregor Yachts receives many unsolicited requests for
sponsorship of expeditions involving Mac26x ocean passages and by the
consideration given to adding a platform (as discussed above) which
would be used for storage during an extended cruise. It is also a
favorite for chartering at blue water destinations such as the BVI,
Bahamas Malaysia, Spain and Belize.


Told you so. I enjoy being your mentor...


Oh, be sure to visit my new anti-drug abuse site linked under my name.
Also please click on a link or two for the sponsors to keep this site
free of charges. Much appreciated.


--
Cheerio,
Ed Gordon
http://www.freewebs.com/egordon873/index.htm

In article , egordon873
@aol.com says...
http://www.eskimo.com/~mighetto/p11.htm

Myth#11 Mac26 is not for ocean sailing. Go ahead, click the link and see
just how good and seaworthy a professional captain thinks the Mac really
is. Dare you. Jeff expecially.

Wow gee whiz.

I didn't read all the guff - what a god awful website.

I did find this though...

http://www.ne-ts.com/ar/ar-407capsize.html


My own comments on a Mac 26X - which I tried out (a new one) two years
ago.

Is it a sailing boat or a speedboat? My biggest gripe, for a brand new
boat, is that it is beaten on the water (sailing) by boats that are 25
years old (eg Farr 7.5, Noelex 25). (I bought a Farr 7.5 in the end,
BTW). I was pleasantly surprised by it's pointing ability, but again
much older boats out point it (as probably expected given it's 'cross
nature' design).

And is it a speedboat? No, no way. It's good to have the motor to get
out of trouble (before the weather hits) quickly. But *in* the heavier
stuff, presumably you have the ballast in place, so a reduced speed, and
would be going much slower than that anyway given it's hull design in
rough sea.

The price is good, and the cabin is spacious in feel. I like that.

The rigging looks and feels *way* too light for my liking - however I
note of few reports of breakages - so I supose that's good. The whole
rudder assembly likewise seems too light in construction.

Overall I think the Mac retains it's - it's neither this, and it's
neither that - label, sorry.

--
Duncan

On Sun, 10 Jun 2007 14:31:54 +1200, Duncan McC (NZ)
wrote:

My own comments on a Mac 26X - which I tried out (a new one) two years
ago.

Is it a sailing boat or a speedboat? My biggest gripe, for a brand new
boat, is that it is beaten on the water (sailing) by boats that are 25
years old (eg Farr 7.5, Noelex 25). (I bought a Farr 7.5 in the end,
BTW). I was pleasantly surprised by it's pointing ability, but again
much older boats out point it (as probably expected given it's 'cross
nature' design).

I couldn't find any Farr 7.5's for sale in the U.S., but maybe they
come on market sometimes. Do they still make them? Looks like
a nice boat. Probably not many made the trip to the U.S.
There was a long thread in the Mac forum where an Aussie
went through contortions having a Mac 26X shipped there.
Shipping container prices, fumigation, trailer rules/modifications,
etc. Ended costing him quite a bit. I couldn't quite figure why he
would do it.
Then another Aussie mentioned the outrageous price asked for the Mac
there (60k AUS for the X, 70k AUS for the M) and said that despite his
costs he will come out ahead should he decide to sell it off. He is
himself arranging an import.
The X and M are almost identical, with the M being the newer version.
A new M in the U.S. will cost maybe 30-34K U.S. tricked out with a
4-stroke 50HP and other common add-ons. I think the bare boat itself
with trailer and just a mainsail is 20-24K U.S.
Apparently trade between the U.S. and Oz/NZ is well restricted between
distance and regs. One of my sons recently sold his Chicago based
Bayliner powerboat for an attractive price (he wanted a quick sale) to
an Aussie working in Indiana. The fellow told my son he would be
sending the boat off for sale in Australia and pocket 10k U.S. on the
deal.
All very strange. Another of my sons now resides in Sydney and tells
me there are similar price anomalies with some U.S. cars, where older
models not given a second look here (Ford Taurus, eg) sell for
seemingly large sums in Australia. If I had more energy I might look
into U.S./Oz import/export business.

The price is good, and the cabin is spacious in feel. I like that.

Pretty scary you would say the price is good for a Mac 26 in Oz/NZ,
given what I've heard. Were you looking there or in the U.S.?
Agree on the Mac 26 cabin. The spartan nature gives it a less
claustrophobic feel than similar sized boats. But some will see that
lack of cabinetry as inadequate stowage.

--Vic

It was that web site that made me lose all respect for certain Mac
owners. It is, like some Mac proponents, a stream of nautical
gibberish. There's enough nautical nonsense to fill a pineapple under
the sea.

A typical example:

"the Mac26x dances like a butterfly when on the anchor supports the
notion that the vessel is a form of trimaran. ... The point is that
the behavior at anchor probably means X owners can expect multihull
behavior when underway as well."

That makes sense - the boat dances at anchor and therefore must be
just like a multihull.

In another place he asserts a tacking angle of 64 degrees, even though
most Mac owners report the expected 95 degrees.

I don't believe I "bash" Macs (well maybe just once), but I do react
against outlandish claims.

As for being an "offshore" boat, the fact that out of the thousands of
Macs out there, a few of them have made short ocean trips doesn't mean
a lot. All of the "passages" you mention are only a few hours, in
good weather they can be done by almost any boat. In fact, there are
numerous examples windsurfers, jetskis, racing dinghies, etc. making
exactly these hops. Given that the Mac can do 12-15 mph under power,
these trips are no big deal. I've been going from Boston to
Provincetown (about 50 miles, dock to dock) for 40 years in boats as
small as an Rhodes 18, and almost every time I see a number of small
boats out there.

A telling thing about some of the ventures you mention is that they
are in groups, not alone. For whatever reason, they didn't want to be
alone out there.

And, for all the claims, I've never actually seen a Mac outside of
protected waters, nor have I ever seen one at a "cruisers' anchorage."






* Ed Gordon wrote, On 6/9/2007 5:45 PM:
http://www.eskimo.com/~mighetto/p11.htm

Myth#11 Mac26 is not for ocean sailing. Go ahead, click the link and see
just how good and seaworthy a professional captain thinks the Mac really
is. Dare you. Jeff expecially.

If you're too much of a coward to admit how good the Mac26X is don't
click the link and don't read a little of what it has in it that I
pasted right here.-- Owing to "focally ruptured gangreous acute
appendicitis", I spent the better part of January 2001 arguing about
this (the Mac26x is fit for all waters), rather than sailing or working,
and have 80 pages of emails as well as several magazines and books on
boat design involving the subject. According to Sea magazine (April
2005) "California's coastline is not particularly trailerboat-friendly -
the areas where you can take small or trailerboats are limited, so it
also would stand to reason that boaters would be heading to inland lakes
and rivers in droves." But MacGregor Yachts has always oriented its
products for world-wide coastal ocean and not just Califorina sales. The
manufacturer believes that a 26 footer is too small to hold enough gear
and supplies for passage. However, at least one Mac26x dealer considers
ocean passage to be within the boat's design parameters and in 1999 more
that a few Mac26x vessels made the trip from Crandon Park marina on
Miami's Key Biscayn or nearby to the Bahamas. At least one Mac26x yacht
made the trip from the city marina at Garison Bight in Key West to the
Marquesas and on to the Tortugas. The 1000 mile coast of Florida has
been sailed by a Mac26x. And two Mac26x cruisers (from Bellingham and
Everett) were outfitted for an Alaskan inside passage (over 2000 miles)
following the Cassiopeia in that regard. Those who find the ride of a
light displacement under 30 foot sailboat preferable in ocean swells see
its potential as a long-distance passage maker. This is demonstrated by
reports that MacGregor Yachts receives many unsolicited requests for
sponsorship of expeditions involving Mac26x ocean passages and by the
consideration given to adding a platform (as discussed above) which
would be used for storage during an extended cruise. It is also a
favorite for chartering at blue water destinations such as the BVI,
Bahamas Malaysia, Spain and Belize.


Told you so. I enjoy being your mentor...


Oh, be sure to visit my new anti-drug abuse site linked under my name.
Also please click on a link or two for the sponsors to keep this site
free of charges. Much appreciated.

Duncan McC (NZ) wrote in
. nz:

In article ,
egordon873 @aol.com says...
http://www.eskimo.com/~mighetto/p11.htm

Myth#11 Mac26 is not for ocean sailing. Go ahead, click the link and
see just how good and seaworthy a professional captain thinks the Mac
really is. Dare you. Jeff expecially.

Wow gee whiz.

I didn't read all the guff - what a god awful website.

I did find this though...

http://www.ne-ts.com/ar/ar-407capsize.html


You can't blame the boat for that terrible tragedy. It said the guy was
drunk and it said this too: "The boat that capsized on the Fourth of
July and killed two children was overloaded and was being used
incorrectly, according to the boat's manufacturer."

"The 26-foot MacGregor, which is a cross between a sailboat and a power
boat, is designed to hold up to six people, according to Roger
MacGregor, the boat company's owner. The boat carried 11 people the
night of July 4."

"The boat's hybrid design uses a water tank on the bottom to provide
stability. The tank should be filled when there are more than four
people on board, MacGregor said. The tank on the boat driven July 4 by
George Dean Martin was empty, according to the prosecutor in the case."

The guy was dumb and drunk. Don't blame the Mac!!!


My own comments on a Mac 26X - which I tried out (a new one) two years
ago.

Is it a sailing boat or a speedboat? My biggest gripe, for a brand
new boat, is that it is beaten on the water (sailing) by boats that
are 25 years old (eg Farr 7.5, Noelex 25). (I bought a Farr 7.5 in
the end, BTW). I was pleasantly surprised by it's pointing ability,
but again much older boats out point it (as probably expected given
it's 'cross nature' design).

And is it a speedboat? No, no way. It's good to have the motor to get
out of trouble (before the weather hits) quickly. But *in* the
heavier stuff, presumably you have the ballast in place, so a reduced
speed, and would be going much slower than that anyway given it's hull
design in rough sea.

The price is good, and the cabin is spacious in feel. I like that.

The rigging looks and feels *way* too light for my liking - however I
note of few reports of breakages - so I supose that's good. The whole
rudder assembly likewise seems too light in construction.

Overall I think the Mac retains it's - it's neither this, and it's
neither that - label, sorry.

It's what you make of it. If you want it to be a saiboat it's a pretty
fast and safe sailboat. If you want a motorboat it's a pretty fast and
safe motor boat. It's the best of both worlds. Everybody who doesn't
know anything complains about the rudders. They say they are too lightly
built. They are too dumb to remember they are slender because they also
are a power boat rudders that have to be able to go throught the water
way faster than a heavy keelboat rudder has to. They are tuffer than you
think since they hold up going twenty or more mph. The rigging is light
so it's easier to put the mast up and down. It's a trailerable boat
remember. You can't make the mast and wiring too big or it'll be too
heavy to put it up. It's designed to be light and strong and is plenty
strong for the sails you get with it.



--
Cheerio,
Ed Gordon
http://www.freewebs.com/egordon873/index.htm

Vic Smith wrote in
:

I couldn't find any Farr 7.5's for sale in the U.S., but maybe they
come on market sometimes. Do they still make them? Looks like
a nice boat. Probably not many made the trip to the U.S.
There was a long thread in the Mac forum where an Aussie
went through contortions having a Mac 26X shipped there.
Shipping container prices, fumigation, trailer rules/modifications,
etc. Ended costing him quite a bit. I couldn't quite figure why he
would do it.
Then another Aussie mentioned the outrageous price asked for the Mac
there (60k AUS for the X, 70k AUS for the M) and said that despite his
costs he will come out ahead should he decide to sell it off. He is
himself arranging an import.
The X and M are almost identical, with the M being the newer version.
A new M in the U.S. will cost maybe 30-34K U.S. tricked out with a
4-stroke 50HP and other common add-ons. I think the bare boat itself
with trailer and just a mainsail is 20-24K U.S.
Apparently trade between the U.S. and Oz/NZ is well restricted between
distance and regs. One of my sons recently sold his Chicago based
Bayliner powerboat for an attractive price (he wanted a quick sale) to
an Aussie working in Indiana. The fellow told my son he would be
sending the boat off for sale in Australia and pocket 10k U.S. on the
deal.
All very strange. Another of my sons now resides in Sydney and tells
me there are similar price anomalies with some U.S. cars, where older
models not given a second look here (Ford Taurus, eg) sell for
seemingly large sums in Australia. If I had more energy I might look
into U.S./Oz import/export business.

The price is good, and the cabin is spacious in feel. I like that.

Pretty scary you would say the price is good for a Mac 26 in Oz/NZ,
given what I've heard. Were you looking there or in the U.S.?
Agree on the Mac 26 cabin. The spartan nature gives it a less
claustrophobic feel than similar sized boats. But some will see that
lack of cabinetry as inadequate stowage.

--Vic



Think of the opportunity for some young Australian adventurer who wants
to make some good money. Hitch a ride on a yacht as crew en route to
California. Buy a Mac26M in California and sail it to Australia. Then
sell it there. Good sailing for the adventurer and good bargain for the
buyer and everybody's happy. I bet some young man or woman could do
three or four trips a year and make a decent enough living.Might even
write a book about it and make even more money.



--
Cheerio,
Ed Gordon
http://www.freewebs.com/egordon873/index.htm

Jeff wrote in
:

It was that web site that made me lose all respect for certain Mac
owners. It is, like some Mac proponents, a stream of nautical
gibberish. There's enough nautical nonsense to fill a pineapple under
the sea.

That's because you admitted you hate Macs, man!!!


A typical example:

"the Mac26x dances like a butterfly when on the anchor supports the
notion that the vessel is a form of trimaran. ... The point is that
the behavior at anchor probably means X owners can expect multihull
behavior when underway as well."

That makes sense - the boat dances at anchor and therefore must be
just like a multihull.

He's talking about the speed not the kind of hull. I think he's thinking
about shallow draft like most catamarans are shallow draft so they dance
around at anchor because they don't have a big heavy deep keel to keep
them in one place. It makes sense to me.

In another place he asserts a tacking angle of 64 degrees, even though
most Mac owners report the expected 95 degrees.

You gotta know how to sail them, man. 64 degrees is too low and 95
degrees is dreaming. Even the Americas cup boats can't do 95% unless the
wind is maybe blowing six or seven mph. I used to tack about 75 or 80
degrees with mind in moderate breezes. In heaver winds it might be low
around 60 because of the slippage because of the short keel that doesn't
bite that great.


I don't believe I "bash" Macs (well maybe just once), but I do react
against outlandish claims.

As for being an "offshore" boat, the fact that out of the thousands of
Macs out there, a few of them have made short ocean trips doesn't mean
a lot. All of the "passages" you mention are only a few hours, in
good weather they can be done by almost any boat. In fact, there are
numerous examples windsurfers, jetskis, racing dinghies, etc. making
exactly these hops. Given that the Mac can do 12-15 mph under power,
these trips are no big deal. I've been going from Boston to
Provincetown (about 50 miles, dock to dock) for 40 years in boats as
small as an Rhodes 18, and almost every time I see a number of small
boats out there.


Macs can do 20. 12-15 is about half throttle, man. And the article said
there are lots of Macs in England and some of them were probily saiked
there.

A telling thing about some of the ventures you mention is that they
are in groups, not alone. For whatever reason, they didn't want to be
alone out there.

Even you adimitted Mac owners are a friendly group of people who enjoy
some company of fellow enthusiasts. Having the same boat makes it easier
to stay together.


And, for all the claims, I've never actually seen a Mac outside of
protected waters, nor have I ever seen one at a "cruisers' anchorage."


Well, I guess that means it NEVER happens. You sail everwhere all the
time and know about what all the boats in the world are doing. You da
man! I bet it burns you up when a Mac comes sailing by your slow heavy
keel boat. But, you shouldn't cop an attitude because maybe your boat is
slower and not as versatil but it might have at least one good point. Ha
ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha!!! What kinda boat do you have anyway?
Probably a cheap Hunter or something like that.



--
Cheerio,
Ed Gordon
http://www.freewebs.com/egordon873/index.htm

"Ed Gordon" wrote in message
8...


Think of the opportunity for some young Australian adventurer who wants
to make some good money. Hitch a ride on a yacht as crew en route to
California. Buy a Mac26M in California and sail it to Australia. Then
sell it there. Good sailing for the adventurer and good bargain for the
buyer and everybody's happy. I bet some young man or woman could do
three or four trips a year and make a decent enough living.Might even
write a book about it and make even more money.



--
Cheerio,
Ed Gordon
http://www.freewebs.com/egordon873/index.htm

You don't really think that's a feasible plan, do you Ed?

"KLC Lewis" wrote in
et:

You don't really think that's a feasible plan, do you Ed?




Why not? Some kid just crossed from England to the BVI islands in a
sailboat that's a Mac copy. A real Mac should be capable of an easy
downwind Pacific run. You'd have to stock up on groceries carefully and
maybe use the water ballast tank for your fresh water but you could make
it. The engine would do you little good for such a long trip so maybe be
a purist and go engineless?? They probably have cheap engines in
Australia anyway, think?


--
Cheerio,
Ed Gordon
http://www.freewebs.com/egordon873/index.htm

"Ed Gordon" wrote in message
. ..
"KLC Lewis" wrote in
et:

You don't really think that's a feasible plan, do you Ed?




Why not? Some kid just crossed from England to the BVI islands in a
sailboat that's a Mac copy. A real Mac should be capable of an easy
downwind Pacific run. You'd have to stock up on groceries carefully and
maybe use the water ballast tank for your fresh water but you could make
it. The engine would do you little good for such a long trip so maybe be
a purist and go engineless?? They probably have cheap engines in
Australia anyway, think?


--
Cheerio,
Ed Gordon
http://www.freewebs.com/egordon873/index.htm

Well, let's look at it rationally. Three to four trips in one year? That
means sailing year-round, in all weather conditions, including winter storms
and summer cyclone season, not to mention three or four trips across the
doldrums. Let's say three round trips, to make it easier on our lucky
sailor. Six crossings of the Pacific round trip in one year. And not a
simple rhumb-line passage from, say San Diego to Sydney, because that is
simply impossible. No, our sailor will need to follow the prevailing winds
and currents, meaning a southerly course down and a northerly course up.
Essentially, the return trip will mean sailing at least as far north as
Washington, then coming back down the west coast.

Of course, they could always just fly back, but that would eat into their
profits. They'd be lucky to do two trips in a year, and would be beaten up
pretty well by the time it's over.