On Tue, 28 Nov 2006 14:51:31 -0500, DSK wrote:

It's also the result of the profit motive: large
corporations are making lots of money convincing Americans
to eat more, thus becoming larger corporally.


Frank Boettcher wrote:
With all due respect, please elaborate on this. They advertise their
offerings, healthy or not, but, how do they convince Americans to eat
more?

???

This is like saying "Yes boats are bouyant and they float,
but how do they stay on top of the water?"

Not a good analogy. Advertising your wares as a choice among others
does not cause an individual to buy and use"too" much of that
particular commodity just because it is advertised.

Statistically speaking, advertising works. Spend a bazillion
advertising on the Super Bowl, increase sales two bazillion.
Galbraith spoke quite a bit about this.

Plus, as you observe, it's not totally a question of eating
more, but what you eat and what activites you pursue.


... I believe the current thinking is that overeating is an
emotional response to something wrong or lacking in an individua'ls
life. And we all at one time or another probably qualify.

Sure. I would be better for losing a few pounds myself.

Hunger is basic drive, I don't think people must have a
screw loose to over eat. OTOH to stuff oneself with all
sorts of unhealthy things can best be explained by social
norms... it's what everybody else is doing...


... Corporate
America responsible for that? Possibly, if they've convinced us that
our lives are empty without their product(s). It requires some
individual responsibility and discipline to avoid succumbing to that
folly.


Agreed. And it used to be a common value, everybody "just
knew" that advertising was mostly lies, or at best
exaggerations. Nowadays people get offended if you question
advertised claims of products they like.

Not me. I don't believe any of them.



Be back later, have to run, weather's right. Planning 6.3 today. Run
30-36 miles per week. A much better solution than more regulation.

If your feet & knees can take it, yes it is.

I'm back. Went 7 because I felt good. That's how I do it. set a
target mileage and then increase or decrease it based on how I feel.

Lot's of recent studies that dispel the old myth that runners end up
with deteriorating joints. Many more recent studies indicate that
running strengthens the tendons and muscles around a joint offering it
protection from deterioration and the onset of arthritic conditions.
At worst the scale tips to nuetral on joints and with the other health
benefits......



... I
can, as you might expect, eat anything and don't gain any weight.
But, I naturally choose to avoid those things that are not good, or
more aptly, provide no room for them by choosing those that are good.
(Scotty, Spam doesn't qualify)

You just haven't had it when it's cooked right.



... I don't need the Government to tell me
what they are.

Well, nobody should, but the American parent has abdicated
to the TV and nobody can make a profit by telling you what's
healthy. Kind of the same way nobody ever lobbies Congress
to spend *less* money on any given issue.


... After all, they gave you fifty years of fake butter
with trans fats as a better choice than the real thing. And had eggs
on the taboo list for many years.


And you know what? They didn't fool me with that, not for
one minute.

DSK

Frank Boettcher wrote:
... Advertising your wares as a choice among others
does not cause an individual to buy and use"too" much of that
particular commodity just because it is advertised.


Sure. Who the heck does that? Advertises their product "as a
choice among others" that is. And a given advertisement may
or may not work on any given individual.

However, if you truly believe that the millions of dollars
Anheuser-Busch Corp spends on advertising has nothing to do
with the hundreds of millions of dollars that large numbers
of people spend on Budweiser, then you need to take a good
look at the world around you.




Lot's of recent studies that dispel the old myth that runners end up
with deteriorating joints. Many more recent studies indicate that
running strengthens the tendons and muscles around a joint offering it
protection from deterioration and the onset of arthritic conditions.
At worst the scale tips to nuetral on joints and with the other health
benefits......


Maybe yes, maybe no. Personally, I know a lot of runners...
some my age, and some younger... who are suffering badly
from deteriorating feet & knees. Maybe it's a coincidence.
Are you taking glucosamine?

DSK

On Tue, 28 Nov 2006 15:50:52 -0500, DSK wrote:

Frank Boettcher wrote:
... Advertising your wares as a choice among others
does not cause an individual to buy and use"too" much of that
particular commodity just because it is advertised.


Sure. Who the heck does that? Advertises their product "as a
choice among others" that is. And a given advertisement may
or may not work on any given individual.

However, if you truly believe that the millions of dollars
Anheuser-Busch Corp spends on advertising has nothing to do
with the hundreds of millions of dollars that large numbers
of people spend on Budweiser, then you need to take a good
look at the world around you.

Sure it does, they are making a choice between Budweiser, Miller,
Coors, Sam Adams, etc... The advertising doesn't necessarily make them
buy or consume more beer.




Lot's of recent studies that dispel the old myth that runners end up
with deteriorating joints. Many more recent studies indicate that
running strengthens the tendons and muscles around a joint offering it
protection from deterioration and the onset of arthritic conditions.
At worst the scale tips to nuetral on joints and with the other health
benefits......


Maybe yes, maybe no. Personally, I know a lot of runners...
some my age, and some younger... who are suffering badly
from deteriorating feet & knees. Maybe it's a coincidence.
Are you taking glucosamine?

No, I'm not (taking glucosamine), although I think it may be
beneficial.

And I only have the studies, my personal history, and individuals in
the local running community who mirror the studies positive findings
to go by. Could be the chicken and the egg. Those who don't have
problems keep running, those that do, stop, and the studies only look
at current runners.

I never thought about it much, however my mother kept calling worrying
about the same thing, so I started to look for studies to send her.
It worked, she no longer worries about it.

Frank


DSK

Frank Boettcher wrote:
Sure it does, they are making a choice between Budweiser, Miller,
Coors, Sam Adams, etc... The advertising doesn't necessarily make them
buy or consume more beer.


I don't think we're speaking the same language here. Are you
saying that that, for example, mouthwash advertising oesn't
make people paranoid about bad breath? Car ads don't glorify
fast driving (and roads with no traffic)? Perhaps I should
ask you to explain what effect you think advertising *does*
have.

DSK

DSK wrote:
Frank Boettcher wrote:

Sure it does, they are making a choice between Budweiser, Miller,
Coors, Sam Adams, etc... The advertising doesn't necessarily make them
buy or consume more beer.


I don't think we're speaking the same language here. Are you saying that
that, for example, mouthwash advertising oesn't make people paranoid
about bad breath? Car ads don't glorify fast driving (and roads with no
traffic)? Perhaps I should ask you to explain what effect you think
advertising *does* have.

DSK

Wellm I can tell you one thing..I am NOT diving off a balciny just so I
don't get white stuff from antiperspirant on my dress!

On Tue, 28 Nov 2006 16:43:46 -0500, DSK wrote:

Frank Boettcher wrote:
Sure it does, they are making a choice between Budweiser, Miller,
Coors, Sam Adams, etc... The advertising doesn't necessarily make them
buy or consume more beer.


I don't think we're speaking the same language here. Are you
saying that that, for example, mouthwash advertising oesn't
make people paranoid about bad breath? Car ads don't glorify
fast driving (and roads with no traffic)? Perhaps I should
ask you to explain what effect you think advertising *does*
have.

Nope I'm saying that you won't necessarily eat more food because of
advertising, but you certainly might be swayed into eating the wrong
food, disallowing room for the right food.

If you have made a choice of what car to buy as a result of
advertising or your own method for making that decision you don't go
out and buy three more because they are advertised. And no, if you
stopped all advertising cold I believe those people who drive fast
would continue to do so.

Despite the fact that I don't think they work in most cases, If you
think you have halitosis and need a mouthwash, you don't buy every
brand available because they are advertised. And I don't believe the
advertising causes you to think you have bad breath (paranoia). I
believe bad breath preceded mouthwash.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not a fan of Madison Avenue, just don't
believe they are a primary cause for or more appropriately an excuse
for an individuals lack of personal responsibility or discipline.

You say it works and maybe it does, however, It doesn't work on me so
I don't have that perspective. I generally purchase to fill a need,
and am affected by advertising to the extent that it provides a source
to be evaluated. I never, ever, believe the ad. without the
additional evaluation.

Frank


DSK

"DSK" wrote in message
...
Frank Boettcher wrote:
Sure it does, they are making a choice between Budweiser, Miller,
Coors, Sam Adams, etc... The advertising doesn't necessarily make them
buy or consume more beer.


I don't think we're speaking the same language here. Are you saying that
that, for example, mouthwash advertising oesn't make people paranoid about
bad breath? Car ads don't glorify fast driving (and roads with no
traffic)? Perhaps I should ask you to explain what effect you think
advertising *does* have.

DSK


Well then, let's advertise crime and poverty away!


As I pass through my incarnations in every age and race, I make my proper
prostrations to the Gods of the Market-Place.
Peering through reverent fingers I watch them flourish and fall,
And the Gods of the Copybook Headings, I notice, outlast them all.

We were living in trees when they met us. They showed us each in turn.
That Water would certainly wet us, as Fire would certainly burn:
But we found them lacking in Uplift, Vision and Breath of Mind,
So we left them to teach the Gorillas while we followed the March of
Mankind.

We moved as the Spirit listed. They never altered their pace,
Being neither cloud nor wind-borne like the Gods of the Market-Place;
But they always caught up with our progress, and presently word would come
That a tribe had been wiped off its icefield, or the lights had gone out in
Rome.

With the Hopes that our World is built on they were utterly out of touch.
They denied that the Moon was Stilton; they denied she was even Dutch.
They denied that Wishes were Horses; they denied that a Pig had Wings.
So we worshipped the Gods of the Market Who promised these beautiful things.

When the Cambrian measures were forming, They promised perpetual peace.
They swore, if we gave them our weapons, that the wars of the tribes would
cease.
But when we disarmed They sold us and delivered us bound to our foe,
And the Gods of the Copybook Headings said: "Stick to the Devil you know."

On the first Feminian Sandstones we were promised the Fuller Life
(Which started by loving our neighbour and ended by loving his wife)
Till our women had no more children and the men lost reason and faith,
And the Gods of the Copybook Heading said: "The Wages of Sin is Death."

In the Carboniferous Epoch we were promised abundance for all,
By robbing selected Peter to pay for collective Paul; But, though we had
plenty of money, there was nothing our money could buy,
And the Gods of the Copybook Heading said: "If you don't work you die."

Then the Gods of the Market tumbled, and their smooth-tongued wizards
withdrew,
And the hearts of the meanest were humbled and began to believe it was true
That All is not God that Glitters, and Two and Two make Four-
And the Gods of the Copybook Headings limped up to explain it once more.

As it will be in the future, it was at the birth of Man- There are only
four things certain since Social Progress began:-
That the Dog returns to his Vomit and the Sow returns to her Mire,

And the burnt Fool's bandaged finger goes wobbling back to the Fire;
And that after this is accomplished, and the brave new world begins

When all men are paid for existing and no man must pay for his sins,
As surely as Water will wet us, as surely as Fire will burn,
The Gods of the Copybook Headings with terror and slaughter return!