katy wrote:
Chi Chi wrote:

The wife should buy hubby an auto pilot for christmas so she can stay
home and face all those challenges of raising children that You speak
so highly of. I noticed dear kate You ignored the part where the hubby
stated he has told her and shown her time and time again how to do
things and she can't seem to get it.


He obviously has no teaching skills, Neal.

Of course you blame the man for not having patience with the

female but did You ever stop to think maybe she's just not smart
enough to get it.


Or he's not communicative enough to express the correct thing to do?


Oh wait that takes thinking. sorry

Something he obviously didn't do.

"katy" wrote in message
...

Gilligan wrote:

Leave the wife home.


She wants to sail.

Obviously she can not contribute to the solution of the

problem, she can only make matters worse.


Because he doesn't have the patience or whatever to communicate the
workings properly.
Just think of what might have

happened if someone was injured or quick action was needed to
prevent catastrophe.


He would have fallen apart.

The icing on the cake is to mention to her how lonely her retirement
will be when you are out sailing the world - without her.


No...for Christmas he should buy her sailing lessons with a female
instrictor or a male instructor with a ;ot of experience teaching
women and children..and the daughter should go, too/ I did not learn
to sail by being taught by my husband. He assumed too much. And when
I got it wrong he ye;;ed. So I sought out others with a lot of
sailing experience and began sailing on their boats. Funny how other
people are loathe to yell at you on their boats. The constraints of
pioliteness with someone elses wife helps a lot. (And their wife will
crawl all over them if they yell at you.)

I do not understand why men are expected to cater to women's
emotionally driven whims and are expected to "apologize" for not
understanding.


He acted like an asshole. If he doesn't apologize just what do you
think the consequences at home will be? I suppose there are some men
who prefer the vouch for life.
Why

aren't women expected to understand men?


They do. That's the problem.

Why is it assumed that women are so

handicapped?


Men make this assumption. It makes them feel manly and strong. Goes
back to the cave days. The genetics haven't been wiped out yet.

Why must men yield to this emotional terrorism?

Because they like warm bodies...

Women are wired for dealing with children, other women and some
family matters.


Dealing with children means a woman deals with every aspect of life:
danger, illness, transportation, education, feeding, clothing,
caring, emergencies, disasters, household management. ALl the things
you need to deal with when sailing.

Men are wired for dealing with the external world - things such as

attacking beasts, danger, dinosaurs, thugs, science, sailing and the
like.


You've never seen my mother go after a snake with a hoe. Or my
grandmother after a fox that got into her chickens. You are making
incorrect suppositions here. Women face beasts all day. They face
the external world everyday when they have to deal with teachers, the
pharmacist, the doctor, and the repairmen who come to the hoise to
fix ehatever her husband can't.


In your situation there was a conflict between the manly world and
the woman's world. It looks like the costliest solution won.


Bunk.....

It is unfortunate that the great and powerful mind of that Master
Mariner Capt Neal is not here to contribute further on this subject.
I am certain that he would add brilliant insight.


And thank God for that...



OK...after reading his explanation of the history of sailing in his
family, I addend this. WHen you take her sailing, don't ask her to do
anything. Make her as comfortable as possible. Have a bottle of wine
on board. A boc of chocolates, a good book. Ig things get dicey, don't
get mad. Just clear the decks and do what has to be done. And get your
engine fixed so it never happens again. DON'T not take her sailing when
she asks. Take fer, grit your teeth, and think of the benefits that
might come from being pleasant for the day.

katy wrote:
katy wrote:
Chi Chi wrote:

The wife should buy hubby an auto pilot for christmas so she can stay
home and face all those challenges of raising children that You speak
so highly of. I noticed dear kate You ignored the part where the hubby
stated he has told her and shown her time and time again how to do
things and she can't seem to get it.


He obviously has no teaching skills, Neal.

Of course you blame the man for not having patience with the

female but did You ever stop to think maybe she's just not smart
enough to get it.


Or he's not communicative enough to express the correct thing to do?


Oh wait that takes thinking. sorry

Something he obviously didn't do.

"katy" wrote in message
...

Gilligan wrote:

Leave the wife home.


She wants to sail.

Obviously she can not contribute to the solution of the

problem, she can only make matters worse.


Because he doesn't have the patience or whatever to communicate the
workings properly.
Just think of what might have

happened if someone was injured or quick action was needed to
prevent catastrophe.


He would have fallen apart.

The icing on the cake is to mention to her how lonely her retirement
will be when you are out sailing the world - without her.


No...for Christmas he should buy her sailing lessons with a female
instrictor or a male instructor with a ;ot of experience teaching
women and children..and the daughter should go, too/ I did not learn
to sail by being taught by my husband. He assumed too much. And when
I got it wrong he ye;;ed. So I sought out others with a lot of
sailing experience and began sailing on their boats. Funny how other
people are loathe to yell at you on their boats. The constraints of
pioliteness with someone elses wife helps a lot. (And their wife will
crawl all over them if they yell at you.)

I do not understand why men are expected to cater to women's
emotionally driven whims and are expected to "apologize" for not
understanding.


He acted like an asshole. If he doesn't apologize just what do you
think the consequences at home will be? I suppose there are some men
who prefer the vouch for life.
Why

aren't women expected to understand men?


They do. That's the problem.

Why is it assumed that women are so

handicapped?


Men make this assumption. It makes them feel manly and strong. Goes
back to the cave days. The genetics haven't been wiped out yet.

Why must men yield to this emotional terrorism?

Because they like warm bodies...

Women are wired for dealing with children, other women and some
family matters.


Dealing with children means a woman deals with every aspect of life:
danger, illness, transportation, education, feeding, clothing,
caring, emergencies, disasters, household management. ALl the things
you need to deal with when sailing.

Men are wired for dealing with the external world - things such as

attacking beasts, danger, dinosaurs, thugs, science, sailing and the
like.


You've never seen my mother go after a snake with a hoe. Or my
grandmother after a fox that got into her chickens. You are making
incorrect suppositions here. Women face beasts all day. They face
the external world everyday when they have to deal with teachers, the
pharmacist, the doctor, and the repairmen who come to the hoise to
fix ehatever her husband can't.


In your situation there was a conflict between the manly world and
the woman's world. It looks like the costliest solution won.


Bunk.....

It is unfortunate that the great and powerful mind of that Master
Mariner Capt Neal is not here to contribute further on this subject.
I am certain that he would add brilliant insight.


And thank God for that...



OK...after reading his explanation of the history of sailing in his
family, I addend this. WHen you take her sailing, don't ask her to do
anything. Make her as comfortable as possible. Have a bottle of wine
on board. A boc of chocolates, a good book. Ig things get dicey, don't
get mad. Just clear the decks and do what has to be done. And get your
engine fixed so it never happens again. DON'T not take her sailing when
she asks. Take fer, grit your teeth, and think of the benefits that
might come from being pleasant for the day.

katy:

In a long term relationship, you never stop hoping the other partner
will someday get interested in what interests you. She seems to think
that someday i will miraculously be interested in going to plays. I
foolishly think that maybe she will somehow get interested in sailing..
There is also the teaching aspect. SHE IS a teacher by profession and
I am not. I just expect copmpetence from people and I admit to having
little patience.
Generally, you cannot choose the conditions when you go sailing, you
look out to sea and either go or not. I've backed down from family
sailing trips due to weather but this time it looked OK in spite of no
other boats being out and generally I think I can fix anything on my
boat. Given time, I could have fixed the engine and had a great story
to tell. OK, I still have a story but I just dont look good in it.

In a long term relationship, you never stop hoping the other partner
will someday get interested in what interests you. She seems to think
that someday i will miraculously be interested in going to plays. I
foolishly think that maybe she will somehow get interested in sailing..
There is also the teaching aspect. SHE IS a teacher by profession and
I am not. I just expect copmpetence from people and I admit to having
little patience.
Generally, you cannot choose the conditions when you go sailing, you
look out to sea and either go or not. I've backed down from family
sailing trips due to weather but this time it looked OK in spite of no
other boats being out and generally I think I can fix anything on my
boat. Given time, I could have fixed the engine and had a great story
to tell. OK, I still have a story but I just dont look good in it.


At least you're a big enough person to admit it and go on....

OK...after reading his explanation of the history of sailing in his
family, I addend this. WHen you take her sailing, don't ask her to do
anything. Make her as comfortable as possible. Have a bottle of wine
on board. A boc of chocolates, a good book. Ig things get dicey, don't
get mad. Just clear the decks and do what has to be done. And get your
engine fixed so it never happens again. DON'T not take her sailing when
she asks. Take fer, grit your teeth, and think of the benefits that
might come from being pleasant for the day.

Oh sure I'd bet You'd like that, being treated like royalty I suppose is
what You expect from men just because You're a female. With that type of
attitude the captain ought to throw your ass overboard. You ever hear the
word teamwork? Just like a marriage sailing is a team thing but I doubt You
comprehend that.

"Chi Chi" wrote in message
m...
OK...after reading his explanation of the history of sailing in his
family, I addend this. WHen you take her sailing, don't ask her to do
anything. Make her as comfortable as possible. Have a bottle of wine
on board. A boc of chocolates, a good book. Ig things get dicey, don't
get mad. Just clear the decks and do what has to be done. And get your
engine fixed so it never happens again. DON'T not take her sailing when
she asks. Take fer, grit your teeth, and think of the benefits that
might come from being pleasant for the day.

Oh sure I'd bet You'd like that, being treated like royalty I suppose is
what You expect from men just because You're a female. With that type of
attitude the captain ought to throw your ass overboard. You ever hear the
word teamwork? Just like a marriage sailing is a team thing but I doubt
You comprehend that.


For what it's worth, I have this exact relationship with my husband -- he
doesn't care to learn a thing about sailing, doesn't particularly like it,
and wouldn't mind at all if I sold Escapade. Then again, he does, from time
to time, enjoy a day out on the water. So when we go sailing I treat it as
if I'm single-handing. I try to lure him into the cockpit if it's nice out
and there's something "interesting to see" (what -- just the water isn't
enough!?) but otherwise leave him to nap below or whatever he wants to do.

Granted, it's more fun when I have my sister and family aboard, because they
absolutely LOVE sailing, and want to learn about it. But you know what they
say: "You can lead a horse to water, but you can't teach him to gybe."

KCL Leave Alesford Lake and head to the bay. Moron is their.

KLC Lewis wrote:

"Chi Chi" wrote in message
m...
OK...after reading his explanation of the history of sailing in his
family, I addend this. WHen you take her sailing, don't ask her to do
anything. Make her as comfortable as possible. Have a bottle of wine
on board. A boc of chocolates, a good book. Ig things get dicey, don't
get mad. Just clear the decks and do what has to be done. And get your
engine fixed so it never happens again. DON'T not take her sailing when
she asks. Take fer, grit your teeth, and think of the benefits that
might come from being pleasant for the day.

Oh sure I'd bet You'd like that, being treated like royalty I suppose is
what You expect from men just because You're a female. With that type of
attitude the captain ought to throw your ass overboard. You ever hear the
word teamwork? Just like a marriage sailing is a team thing but I doubt
You comprehend that.


For what it's worth, I have this exact relationship with my husband -- he
doesn't care to learn a thing about sailing, doesn't particularly like it,
and wouldn't mind at all if I sold Escapade. Then again, he does, from time
to time, enjoy a day out on the water. So when we go sailing I treat it as
if I'm single-handing. I try to lure him into the cockpit if it's nice out
and there's something "interesting to see" (what -- just the water isn't
enough!?) but otherwise leave him to nap below or whatever he wants to do.

Granted, it's more fun when I have my sister and family aboard, because they
absolutely LOVE sailing, and want to learn about it. But you know what they
say: "You can lead a horse to water, but you can't teach him to gybe."

Chi Chi wrote:
OK...after reading his explanation of the history of sailing in his
family, I addend this. WHen you take her sailing, don't ask her to do
anything. Make her as comfortable as possible. Have a bottle of wine
on board. A boc of chocolates, a good book. Ig things get dicey, don't
get mad. Just clear the decks and do what has to be done. And get your
engine fixed so it never happens again. DON'T not take her sailing when
she asks. Take fer, grit your teeth, and think of the benefits that
might come from being pleasant for the day.

Oh sure I'd bet You'd like that, being treated like royalty I suppose is
what You expect from men just because You're a female. With that type of
attitude the captain ought to throw your ass overboard. You ever hear the
word teamwork? Just like a marriage sailing is a team thing but I doubt You
comprehend that.


HAHAHAHAHA...you don't know me....I can't stand to have other people do
things for me, serve me, etc. I have noticed, thoughm that most men
have NO problem at all being catered to.

katy wrote:
Chi Chi wrote:
OK...after reading his explanation of the history of sailing in his
family, I addend this. WHen you take her sailing, don't ask her to do
anything. Make her as comfortable as possible. Have a bottle of wine
on board. A boc of chocolates, a good book. Ig things get dicey, don't
get mad. Just clear the decks and do what has to be done. And get your
engine fixed so it never happens again. DON'T not take her sailing when
she asks. Take fer, grit your teeth, and think of the benefits that
might come from being pleasant for the day.

Oh sure I'd bet You'd like that, being treated like royalty I suppose is
what You expect from men just because You're a female. With that type of
attitude the captain ought to throw your ass overboard. You ever hear the
word teamwork? Just like a marriage sailing is a team thing but I doubt You
comprehend that.


HAHAHAHAHA...you don't know me....I can't stand to have other people do
things for me, serve me, etc. I have noticed, thoughm that most men
have NO problem at all being catered to.

My 10 yr old daughter who likes every slimy thing there is would make
friends with the giant octopus.

wrote:
katy wrote:

Chi Chi wrote:

OK...after reading his explanation of the history of sailing in his
family, I addend this. WHen you take her sailing, don't ask her to do
anything. Make her as comfortable as possible. Have a bottle of wine
on board. A boc of chocolates, a good book. Ig things get dicey, don't
get mad. Just clear the decks and do what has to be done. And get your
engine fixed so it never happens again. DON'T not take her sailing when
she asks. Take fer, grit your teeth, and think of the benefits that
might come from being pleasant for the day.

Oh sure I'd bet You'd like that, being treated like royalty I suppose is
what You expect from men just because You're a female. With that type of
attitude the captain ought to throw your ass overboard. You ever hear the
word teamwork? Just like a marriage sailing is a team thing but I doubt You
comprehend that.



HAHAHAHAHA...you don't know me....I can't stand to have other people do
things for me, serve me, etc. I have noticed, thoughm that most men
have NO problem at all being catered to.


My 10 yr old daughter who likes every slimy thing there is would make
friends with the giant octopus.


A girl after my own heart...

katy wrote:
WHen you take her sailing, don't ask her to do
anything. Make her as comfortable as possible. Have a bottle of wine
on board. A boc of chocolates, a good book. Ig things get dicey, don't
get mad. Just clear the decks and do what has to be done. And get your
engine fixed so it never happens again. DON'T not take her sailing when
she asks. Take fer, grit your teeth, and think of the benefits that
might come from being pleasant for the day.

Okay I just cant let this one go. There is a lot of going back and forth
about which one os in the wrong and the fact is that it is both of their
faults. He should not have invited her to go out. If you want to spend time
with her on the boat sit and have lunch tied tot he dock. If she is not
comfortable on the water don't try to change her and make her like it. When
a problem arises you should know after 27 years with her that arguing back
when she drives you nuts is not going to work. I bet if you just suggested
that she go sit and relax while you deal with it and to please leave you
alone so that you can save what little patience you have for the job at hand
she would understand. Then you can be the problem solver all by yourself and
she can not have to worry about spending a bunch of time out there when she
is not comfortable on the water. Lesson 1: Don't bring someone sailing that
doesn't like the water.

Secondly she should have let him do what was needed. I am not going to make
a male/female remark here because she doesn't sound like someone that can not
handle adversity in nature but she is not a sailor and should have left the
decision making to someone that has experience in sailing instead of
constantly second guessing him and nagging him. That sort of behavior shows
a huge lack of consideration and respect for your partner. If anybody,
girlfriend wife friend or otherwise, ever treated me the way she treated him
I would seriously reconsider my relationship with them. She went out with
him knowing that he wanted to spend time with her and share something he
loves to do and when a little adversity strikes that he feels confident he
can resolve she spends the entire time nagging him instead of offering to
help or just stay out of the way.

This being said I am sure I will get a lot of people saying that I know
nothing of this sort of thing and I am stupid but the fact is that how we
treat each other, especially in rough times, is more important the small
experience at hand. if he was wrong in wanteing to stay there until the
morning, and he may have been, she still had no right to treat him that way.
She should have shown a little trust in his judgement as a sailor, a husband,
and a father, to make this call without second guessing him. He should have
known not to bring her. All in all I think that he may have learned
something by this esxperience but i doubt him appoligizing and taking full
blame for it will help her to learn from this and mae things better for them
both in the future.

--
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