Sailing and Cars
 

But my BMW 323Ci

Gawd, talk about a silly car.


RB
35s5
NY

Sailing and Cars
 

And one more thing, Bubbles--that Prius is futt bucking ugly.


Yep, it aint that perty. But I own a MG-TF for fun.


RB
35s5
NY

Sailing and Cars
 

The problem, Bubbles, is that you are a typical gullible consumer,
grasping
at the first thing that comes along, fully believing you are being 1)
ecologically responsible, and 2) cost efficient.


BWahahahahah! Prius is on 3rd gen. How is that the "first thing to come
along?" Hmmm? No one has said that a Prius is cost effective. I only
said I'd rather give money to Toyota than oil. As for being
ecologically responsible your view is typically shortsighted. As I
stated earlier, these cars are the beginning of such efforts on a
higher scale, just like recycling technology that is still struggling.
You pay for the "process" of that improvement. People who bought Honda
CRX's also paid for a process of technology they liked. People like you
just keep waiting for sun powered cars while others commit to becoming
part of the solution. Of course it doesn't "pay" to understand that now
does it, Maxi? Hmmm?

RB
35s5
NY

Sailing and Cars
 

"Capt. Rob" wrote in message
oups.com...
And one more thing, Bubbles--that Prius is futt bucking ugly.


Yep, it aint that perty. But I own a MG-TF for fun.

But it will be the Prius you have to see--and be seen in--on a daily basis.
That Morris Garage antique won't stand up to daily use in NYC.

Max

Sailing and Cars
 

"Capt. Rob" wrote in message
oups.com...
The problem, Bubbles, is that you are a typical gullible consumer,
grasping
at the first thing that comes along, fully believing you are being 1)
ecologically responsible, and 2) cost efficient.


BWahahahahah! Prius is on 3rd gen. How is that the "first thing to come
along?" Hmmm?

Untrue. The current model is the second in the Prius series. But I wasn't
referring to the Prius as the "first thing that comes along." I was
referring to hybrids in general. Yes, they are green, but they are not cost
effective.

No one has said that a Prius is cost effective.

I think I just said that. :-)

I only
said I'd rather give money to Toyota than oil. As for being
ecologically responsible your view is typically shortsighted. As I
stated earlier, these cars are the beginning of such efforts on a
higher scale, just like recycling technology that is still struggling.
You pay for the "process" of that improvement. People who bought Honda
CRX's also paid for a process of technology they liked. People like you
just keep waiting for sun powered cars while others commit to becoming
part of the solution.

Part of what solution? Fuel usage or minimization of greenhouse gasses? I
can equal the fuel consumption of that Prius (driven normally) with a Mini
Cooper S by simply staying off the accelerator pedal (which, admittedly,
would be damned difficult in a Mini). Better yet, I can buy a Smart Car in
Cana-duh and beat your fuel consumption figures all to hell. And I can be
far greener than thou by riding a small-displacement motorcycle or riding a
bicycle. Or by living near my work and walking. So your chest-thumping
self-righteousness is really misplaced, Bubbles. You are not really part of
the solution, but if it makes you feel good, well then by all means go for
it. That's what hybrids are all about, after all. Nothing is quite as
important as satisfying one's own need for believing you're doing the "right
thing." Just don't expect to feel all warm and fuzzy when that mega-battery
is shot and someone has to decide how to dispose of 250lbs. of sulfated
lead.

Max

Sailing and Cars
 

"Capt. Rob" wrote in message
oups.com...
How tall are you? I'm 6' and can sit in a Yaris with at least two or
three
inches to spare overhead.

I'm 6'3 and I'm too tall for most compacts. But if you knew something
about driving, you'd also know that even shorter people can have
trouble if their legs are long.

I raced D and E production in SCCA track events for over 20 years. Does
that qualify me to know "something about driving?" But to respond to your
comment, the Yaris has more leg room than you'd probably need. With the
seat all the way back, I'm quite comfortable with my 32" inseam. But I'll
grant that you are probably too, um, sizeable for a Yaris.


Was that 30mpg an all-around average, or just highway. Actually, IIRC,
hybrids get slightly better mileage in city driving, mostly because
their
engines

Actually, you have no clue. I drove the Prius for several days and we
got MUCH better MPG locally off highway. Owners know it's more than
slightly better.

You have far more stops in NYC than most folks do. But on the average, the
Prius and the Honda Civic hybrid do only a little better in city vs. highway
driving. That is according to Toyota and Honda literature, as well as
findings by the automotive press.

My
contention is that Toyota wanted to make a car with the power of a big
V6


Your contention is hardly a factor. The FACTS are that the Camry does
great MPG, have lower emmisions and is part of a improving curve of
higher MPG cars that don't sacrifice drivability and comfort.


To the contrary, I think the US
vehicle fleet should be comprised of at least 50% E85-compatible
vehicles by
2012.

And I think warp drive should also be installed. But here on planet
Earth we won't have any such thing. Meanwhile, at least some of us can
opt to spend less on fuel today.

Brazil is almost completely E-85 now, and has ceased importing foreign oil.
You should read the paper or watch TV a little more before opening mouth and
inserting foot. Oh wait, that wasn't your foot, was it. g

Say, Bubbles--are you going to run that Bendy Toy on biodiesel? If not, you
should be ashamed.

Max

Sailing and Cars
 

"Capt. Rob" wrote in message
oups.com...
But my BMW 323Ci

Gawd, talk about a silly car.

Do I detect just a note of jealousy, Bubbles? Huh? g

Max

Sailing and Cars
 

"Capt. Rob" wrote in message
oups.com...
Have you even looked at the Ford Explore Hybred? It sure looks like it

could make a 6'5" body comfortable. Milage is good and it sure as hell
has more power; Enough for a real SUV, not a make believe.


My Subaru clobbers the Ford in every way

Not every way. Have you ever looked at that Tripuka from the front? Talk
about homely.

and will last twice as long.

Maybe not twice as long, but probably longer than the Ford.

I
won't buy a poor product on that scale simply because it's American.
The tribeca is also a CROSSOVER, not a pure SUV, Thom. That means it
outhandles the Ford by a wide margin, and yet still has a better crash
rating...the highest in fact. The Tribeca's AWD system is also far
superior to the Ford's.

Why, then, are Tribeca sales a major disappointment for Subaru? And why do
the automotive magazines all, without exception, rate it worse than its
competition? Subaru will most likely drop the ugly, incompetent thing from
their line next year. Better trade that hog now, Bubbles, if you ever hope
to get half what you paid for it.

You might try Vermont--I hear they love Subarus up there, especially those
horrid things with the flat-four engines.

Max

Sailing and Cars
 

In article et,
Maxprop wrote:

"Capt. Rob" wrote in message
oups.com...
The problem, Bubbles, is that you are a typical gullible consumer,
grasping
at the first thing that comes along, fully believing you are being 1)
ecologically responsible, and 2) cost efficient.


BWahahahahah! Prius is on 3rd gen. How is that the "first thing to come
along?" Hmmm?

Untrue. The current model is the second in the Prius series. But I wasn't
referring to the Prius as the "first thing that comes along." I was
referring to hybrids in general. Yes, they are green, but they are not cost
effective.

No one has said that a Prius is cost effective.

I think I just said that. :-)

I only
said I'd rather give money to Toyota than oil. As for being
ecologically responsible your view is typically shortsighted. As I
stated earlier, these cars are the beginning of such efforts on a
higher scale, just like recycling technology that is still struggling.
You pay for the "process" of that improvement. People who bought Honda
CRX's also paid for a process of technology they liked. People like you
just keep waiting for sun powered cars while others commit to becoming
part of the solution.

Part of what solution? Fuel usage or minimization of greenhouse gasses? I
can equal the fuel consumption of that Prius (driven normally) with a Mini
Cooper S by simply staying off the accelerator pedal (which, admittedly,
would be damned difficult in a Mini). Better yet, I can buy a Smart Car in
Cana-duh and beat your fuel consumption figures all to hell. And I can be
far greener than thou by riding a small-displacement motorcycle or riding a
bicycle. Or by living near my work and walking. So your chest-thumping
self-righteousness is really misplaced, Bubbles. You are not really part of
the solution, but if it makes you feel good, well then by all means go for
it. That's what hybrids are all about, after all. Nothing is quite as
important as satisfying one's own need for believing you're doing the "right
thing." Just don't expect to feel all warm and fuzzy when that mega-battery
is shot and someone has to decide how to dispose of 250lbs. of sulfated
lead.

Mooring block or lead for bullet casting. Yes!

PDW

Sailing and Cars
 

In article et,
Maxprop wrote:


You might try Vermont--I hear they love Subarus up there, especially those
horrid things with the flat-four engines.

Umm, Max - every Subaru I've ever seen has had either a flat 4 or a
flat 6. Do they sell something else in the USA?

Vested interest - I have a Liberty AWD sedan (Legacy to you guys) and I
like it. It starts, runs, is comfortable and reasonably quiet. Mileage
is OK and at 230K, I expect to get at least another 100K out of it yet.
Never seen a Tribeca here but from the pix, looks a bit better than a
WRX. That's damning with faint praise :-)

PDW

Sailing and Cars
 

You have far more stops in NYC than most folks do. But on the average,
the
Prius and the Honda Civic hybrid do only a little better in city vs.
highway
driving.


Wrong again. We drove the car in PA. Locally, away from Route 80 we had
nearly 10 MPG more, which is consistant with other reports on Edmunds.

Say, Bubbles--are you going to run that Bendy Toy on biodiesel? If
not, you
should be ashamed.


Judging by her light air ability demonstrated Sunday, that engine will
barely be used at all.


I raced D and E production in SCCA track events for over 20 years.
Does
that qualify me to know "something about driving?"

Wow, and yet you still get so much wrong. Just goes to prove: Old
knowledge is often bad knowledge.



RB
35s5
NY

Sailing and Cars
 

Do I detect just a note of jealousy, Bubbles? Huh?


Maxi....Puhlease! It's a 3 series. I'm driving a Suburu STI and
Forester XT wagon...both of which would leave that 3 series in the dust
in any conditons. I like the 5 series though. The puny 3 series is
little more than an econobox. Even my Tribeca is cooler with its 250HP,
traction control and 18" wheels and it even has manual mode. Off the
line she's a tank (0-60 in 8.5), but at speed she's faster than the
Lexus 330 and I've had her up to 130 MPH.
I suppose you wanted a car as slow as your boat. Job well done!

RB
35s5
NY

Sailing and Cars
 

Why, then, are Tribeca sales a major disappointment for Subaru? And
why do
the automotive magazines all, without exception, rate it worse than its

competition? Subaru will most likely drop the ugly, incompetent thing
from
their line next year.

Uh, Maxi....this kind of ends the idea that you know cars. The Tribeca
outsold ALL other SUV crossovers per factory orders, barely edging out
the Lexus 330. Meanwhile, Suburu could not predict the current gas
surge which has hurt all SUV makers. Since they still sold over 2000
Tribeca's per month, it gave Suburu their best year in HISTORY. The
only model recently offered to truly fail was the Baja Outback.
Oh...and just to show that you haven't gotten ANYTHING right...the 2007
Tribeca is already on the web with a few new features. Rumors says
she'll get a Turbo for 2008 and possibly help from Toyota for the
Hybrid version. You do know that Toyota took GM's stake in Suburu,
Don't you????
Here's more...

CHERRY HILL, N.J., May 2 -- Subaru of America, Inc. today reported
April sales totaling 16,073 units. Strong sales of the Subaru Impreza
led the month, climbing eight percent from the same period last year.
The Subaru B9 Tribeca recorded a strong 1,803 units for the month of
April. The Subaru Legacy model line posted a total of 6,259 units, with
Subaru Outback posting 4,283 units for the month. Subaru Impreza posted
3,066 unit sales, while Subaru Forester totaled 4,512 units for the
month. Subaru Baja recorded 433 units in April.


Gulp! Bwahahahhahahahahahaha!!!

RB
35s5
NY

Sailing and Cars
 

Not every way. Have you ever looked at that Tripuka from the front?
Talk
about homely.


I wonder why my Tribeca gets so much positive attention then? Of course
people who don't dig the looks certainly don't come up and say they
hate it, but it's the only new car I've ever owned to get compliments
wherever I go. Subaru is so pleased they have taken the odd Tribeca
nose and put it on the entire line for 2007-2008. If you want a car to
blend in with everything else, buy a Lexus 300 or 330 type SUV.
Oh, and the interior of the Tribeca is amazing...the best in it's
class.


RB
35s5
NY

Sailing and Cars
 

You might try Vermont--I hear they love Subarus up there, especially
those
horrid things with the flat-four engines.


Yeah, those flat fours that last 300K miles! My friend's old Forester
was sold with 220K and wasn't burning a drop of oil and still on the
original tranny. That's a common story for Subaru.
All of the Subaru's are popular here in NY. Tons of them in PA, plenty
in CT, but we only saw Impreza's in SC.
Subaru continues to post gains in all markets while Ford, GM and
Chrysler can't get panel switches to work!

RB
35s5
NY

Sailing and Cars
 

On Tue, 09 May 2006 04:17:36 +0100, Peter Wiley
wrote:

In article et,
Maxprop wrote:


You might try Vermont--I hear they love Subarus up there, especially those
horrid things with the flat-four engines.

Umm, Max - every Subaru I've ever seen has had either a flat 4 or a
flat 6. Do they sell something else in the USA?

Vested interest - I have a Liberty AWD sedan (Legacy to you guys) and I
like it. It starts, runs, is comfortable and reasonably quiet. Mileage
is OK and at 230K, I expect to get at least another 100K out of it yet.
Never seen a Tribeca here but from the pix, looks a bit better than a
WRX. That's damning with faint praise :-)

PDW


Kilometers?

Sailing and Cars
 

On 9 May 2006 04:53:49 -0700, "Capt. Rob" wrote:

You might try Vermont--I hear they love Subarus up there, especially
those
horrid things with the flat-four engines.


Yeah, those flat fours that last 300K miles! My friend's old Forester
was sold with 220K and wasn't burning a drop of oil and still on the
original tranny. That's a common story for Subaru.
All of the Subaru's are popular here in NY. Tons of them in PA, plenty
in CT, but we only saw Impreza's in SC.

Rarely seen in Mississippi. Don't know why. Maybe it's a snow thing.

Subaru continues to post gains in all markets while Ford, GM and
Chrysler can't get panel switches to work!

My wifes Town and Country LXi much to my surprise turns out to be one
of the best vehicles we have ever owned. Pushing 140K and eight years
with only wear part maintenance. Certainly not typical for that
vehicle, however, you can't beat a completely tricked out T & C for
travel comfort.

However, it is at the end of its usefulness to us (kids are gone, no
need for the room). I'm waiting to see the 07 CR-V as a replacement.

Frank

RB
35s5
NY

Sailing and Cars
 

On 9 May 2006 10:34:35 -0700, "Capt. Rob" wrote:

Rarely seen in Mississippi. Don't know why. Maybe it's a snow
thing.


Price is also becoming a factor. Cars like the Forester XT, 6 Cycle
Outback are 28-34K. The Tribeca tops out at 40K. That's a lot of cash
for folks in Mississipi.

Not necessarily. Other components of COL fairly low. 180K house in
Tupelo is 450K in most places in New York, 750K in many places on the
west coast.Taxes and energy costs also lower. Difference in income,
professional and entreprenuer at least, is not that great. So there
is a lot of discretionary income. Lots of Mercedes and Lexus suvs.
Lots of fully loaded navigators, expeditions, and surburbans. Plenty
of Nissans (manufactured in the State).

Dealer network may be lagging behind others. I actually don't think
I've seen a Tribeca in real life down here.

And this isn't an AWD area, most don't want to pay the extra for it.
That's my beef with the CR-V. Hoping the 07 will give you the option
of top trim line without having to take AWD. I'd rather have one more
MPG.

Frank

RB
35s5
NY

Sailing and Cars
 

In article , Frank
Boettcher wrote:

On Tue, 09 May 2006 04:17:36 +0100, Peter Wiley
wrote:

In article et,
Maxprop wrote:


You might try Vermont--I hear they love Subarus up there, especially those
horrid things with the flat-four engines.

Umm, Max - every Subaru I've ever seen has had either a flat 4 or a
flat 6. Do they sell something else in the USA?

Vested interest - I have a Liberty AWD sedan (Legacy to you guys) and I
like it. It starts, runs, is comfortable and reasonably quiet. Mileage
is OK and at 230K, I expect to get at least another 100K out of it yet.
Never seen a Tribeca here but from the pix, looks a bit better than a
WRX. That's damning with faint praise :-)

PDW


Kilometers?

Well, of course. Doesn't everyone use the metric system?

PDW

Sailing and Cars
 

"Peter Wiley" wrote in message
. ..

Mooring block or lead for bullet casting. Yes!

You might have something there. Okay, not the mooring block, but the
bullets. I used to cast .45 SWCs for myself and several friends. We used
lead ingots plus some old wheel weights for the antimony and tin. We had
two 4-cavity molds and could keep things moving along well. We did the
smelting and casting in the hoods (constant negative pressure with outdraft)
at the biology lab of a local college.

Max

Sailing and Cars
 

"Capt. Rob" wrote in message
ups.com...
You have far more stops in NYC than most folks do. But on the average,
the
Prius and the Honda Civic hybrid do only a little better in city vs.
highway
driving.


Wrong again. We drove the car in PA. Locally, away from Route 80 we had
nearly 10 MPG more, which is consistant with other reports on Edmunds.

I'll trust the other automotive magazines I've read over your experience.
And since I haven't read Edmund's reports on hybrids . . .


Say, Bubbles--are you going to run that Bendy Toy on biodiesel? If
not, you
should be ashamed.


Judging by her light air ability demonstrated Sunday, that engine will
barely be used at all.

Since she'll seldom leave the dock, I concur.



I raced D and E production in SCCA track events for over 20 years.
Does
that qualify me to know "something about driving?"

Wow, and yet you still get so much wrong. Just goes to prove: Old
knowledge is often bad knowledge.

Wrong by your standards is probably right by everyone else's.


Max

Sailing and Cars
 

"Capt. Rob" wrote in message
ups.com...
Do I detect just a note of jealousy, Bubbles? Huh?


Maxi....Puhlease! It's a 3 series. I'm driving a Suburu STI and
Forester XT wagon...both of which would leave that 3 series in the dust
in any conditons.

BWAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. Japanese toys vs. fine Teutonic engineering.
Right. A cheap Japanese 600cc motorcycle will outperform that STI in all
respects, so your point is ludicrous.

I like the 5 series though. The puny 3 series is
little more than an econobox.

First--the new Chris Bangle-designed 5 is as ugly as your Tribeca. Well,
okay, perhaps not quite that ugly. Second, you see almost no 5, 6, or 7
series cars on the race track, but you see 3s by the dozens. By the way, an
M3 left a WRX STI so far in its dust at Laguna Seca a few weeks ago as to
make the officials wonder if the STI was in the wrong class.

Even my Tribeca is cooler with its 250HP,
traction control and 18" wheels and it even has manual mode.

LOL. Put my Bimmer next to that Tribeca (as unthinkable as that would be
for a BMW owner) and see how many folks compliment each car respectively.
Of course the derisive comments about the ugly truck won't count as
"compliments."

Off the
line she's a tank (0-60 in 8.5), but at speed she's faster than the
Lexus 330 and I've had her up to 130 MPH.
I suppose you wanted a car as slow as your boat. Job well done!

A Lexus ES330 is just a Camry in disguise, and that's no performance
machine. Even your Tribeca would outhandle that softly-sprung, rolly
luxo-box.

As for speed, it's rather pointless to buy a car that can double most posted
speed limits, despite your need to compensate for the manliness nature
failed to provide. I'm content to have a quick auto with superb handling,
outstanding quality, cutting-edge engineering, and resale value that your
Subarus could only dream about.

Max

Sailing and Cars
 

"Capt. Rob" wrote in message
oups.com...
You might try Vermont--I hear they love Subarus up there, especially
those
horrid things with the flat-four engines.


Yeah, those flat fours that last 300K miles! My friend's old Forester
was sold with 220K and wasn't burning a drop of oil and still on the
original tranny. That's a common story for Subaru.
All of the Subaru's are popular here in NY. Tons of them in PA, plenty
in CT, but we only saw Impreza's in SC.
Subaru continues to post gains in all markets while Ford, GM and
Chrysler can't get panel switches to work!

Right. If Subarus are so great, why does J.D.Powers always place Toyota and
Honda at the top of the reliability heap, with Subaru buried somewhere down
the list? Same with Consumer Reports.

Max

Sailing and Cars
 

"Capt. Rob" wrote in message
oups.com...
Rarely seen in Mississippi. Don't know why. Maybe it's a snow
thing.


6 Cycle
Outback

That thing must be a technological marvel.

And you claim to know something about cars.

Max

Sailing and Cars
 

I'll trust the other automotive magazines I've read over your
experience.
And since I haven't read Edmund's reports on hybrids . . .


More evidence that you can't even research properly. Edmunds has owner
forums and you can read what people are truly getting from a car in a
variety of locations. Magazine tests are too limited on their own to
judge something like MPG.

Wrong by your standards is probably right by everyone else's

According to Edmunds and the many Hybrid owners posting there, you're
wrong...about all of it.



RB
35s5
NY

Sailing and Cars
 

Max;

My Myopic friend, just how wrong can you be. I'm for Ethanol. I've
defended Ethanol as safer in transport, emissions and Auto engines for
Flex-fuels. E85 is the quickest way to energy independency. As I've
said; if we can reduce Gasoline usage by 85% the 15% necessary for
Gasoline can easily be supplied by our own reserves.

We have the ability to start using E85 right NOW, if we can get it into
Service Station's Pumps. If we start selling it, the profit boys sure as
hell will start making it.

Max, do you understand what I'm saying? I want Ethanol,if it will make
us fuel independent!! Is that clear enough for your BIAS (?) MIND?

http://community.webtv.net/tassail/ThomPage

Sailing and Cars
 

BWAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. Japanese toys vs. fine Teutonic engineering.

Right. A cheap Japanese 600cc motorcycle will outperform that STI in
all
respects, so your point is ludicrous.


BMW makes some fine cars, but the cheap 3 series is little more than a
teenager's toy, except for the M3. The STI is simply better than
everything, far faster, far better handling in ALL conditions. It's
essentially an off the rack rally car. Oh, and the STI is very much
able to hold it's own with an M3 in every respect but build. The M3 is
awesome. You don't own one.

LOL. Put my Bimmer next to that Tribeca (as unthinkable as that
would be
for a BMW owner) and see how many folks compliment each car
respectively.

This is NY. BMW is about as common as the Ford Focus. No one looks them
and they've become little more than ghetto mobiles. Then again only
really poor folks drive low end 3 series anyway...about as pathetic as
the Audi A4 in fact.


I'm content to have a quick auto with superb handling,
outstanding quality, cutting-edge engineering,


Do let us know when you get such a car.

and resale value that your

Better check Edmunds. Both the Outback and STI have better resale than
your 3 series. Only the M3 has a good resale value. BMW doesn't even
make the top 10. You also need need to run TCO (Total cost of
ownership) where Subaru FAR outstrips the BMW and is only bested by
Toyota and Honda.
Yep, you sure know your cars!

A Lexus ES330 is just a Camry

Dude, are you on some kind of medication? Anyone who knows anything
would understand that it's not the ES330 I was talking about. You do
know that Lexus also makes a crossover, right? You do know that it has
a totally different suspension, right? And that it's one of the best
rated in it's class, right? Hmmmm? Guess not. Read some more car &
drivers and MT and get back to us!

Good lord, Maxi....my shovel has your face imprinted on it!.


RB
35s5
NY

Sailing and Cars
 

"Thom Stewart" wrote in message
...
We have the ability to start using E85 right NOW, if we can get it into
Service Station's Pumps. If we start selling it, the profit boys sure as
hell will start making it.

Max, do you understand what I'm saying? I want Ethanol,if it will make
us fuel independent!! Is that clear enough for your BIAS (?) MIND?

http://community.webtv.net/tassail/ThomPage

Problem is, and you can look this up, is that it takes MORE than 1 gallon of
fossil fuels to produce 1 gallon of ethanol. The "profit boys" are currently
being subsidized heavily by the federal government to produce ethanol. There
is no "magic bullet", regardless of what the folks at BP say.

http://www.news.cornell.edu/releases...idies.hrs.html

John Cairns

Sailing and Cars
 

In article , Maxprop
wrote:

"Capt. Rob" wrote in message
oups.com...
You might try Vermont--I hear they love Subarus up there, especially
those
horrid things with the flat-four engines.


Yeah, those flat fours that last 300K miles! My friend's old Forester
was sold with 220K and wasn't burning a drop of oil and still on the
original tranny. That's a common story for Subaru.
All of the Subaru's are popular here in NY. Tons of them in PA, plenty
in CT, but we only saw Impreza's in SC.
Subaru continues to post gains in all markets while Ford, GM and
Chrysler can't get panel switches to work!

Right. If Subarus are so great, why does J.D.Powers always place Toyota and
Honda at the top of the reliability heap, with Subaru buried somewhere down
the list? Same with Consumer Reports.

Dunno. My personal experience with Subarus has been excellent, tho.
Never had any probs with any of the 4 I've owned, and they do hold
resale value well here in Oz. I have nothing bad to say about Toyotas &
Hondas either but can't speak from personal experience.

Note that I have no interest in the rev-head toys Bob likes. I like the
conservative, slightly overweight, very solid and well engineered
sedans. It's nice to have a car whose image is the opposite of the
driver's :-)

PDW

Sailing and Cars
 

In article , OzOne wrote:

On Wed, 10 May 2006 04:05:02 +0100, Peter Wiley
scribbled thusly:

Dunno. My personal experience with Subarus has been excellent, tho.
Never had any probs with any of the 4 I've owned, and they do hold
resale value well here in Oz. I have nothing bad to say about Toyotas &
Hondas either but can't speak from personal experience.

Note that I have no interest in the rev-head toys Bob likes. I like the
conservative, slightly overweight, very solid and well engineered
sedans. It's nice to have a car whose image is the opposite of the
driver's :-)

PDW

Subarus are known to have a small but expensive problem with cylinder
head gaskets leaking coolant, rapid wear in the valvetrain, and
gearboxes/clutches that may not be as hardy as they might be.

The turbo ones, I can well believe it. I'd never buy a used turbo
Subie. The clutch on my Liberty was replaced at 160K, the CV joints at
180K. That's it, and while I bought it used, it has the full logbook
dealer service records.

Still, they are a great car and worth the risk afa I'm concerned.

As I said, my personal experience with them is good. In fact I was
considering buying another one for my daughter.

PDW

Sailing and Cars
 

John,

Your Expert from the IVY LEAGUE should get out and buy some; "White
Lightning!"

The Bootleggers have been making ALKY for years on hidden Still, without
Fossil Fuel. They have been transporting & fermenting the Grain in
secret, they have been transporting the "booze" in gallon Jugs in Hop-up
Cars and selling it at around $5.00 a gallon and making a fortune if
they don't get caught.

Now you post an article by a Ivy League that say this isn't possible?
BS!!!!

Let the Profit Boys get a chance to produce it legally. Let the Chemist
start reforming that Ethanol Mol., like they did with the Straight Run
Gasoline and our Street Cars will have the Energy off the Drag Cars on
Fuel

http://community.webtv.net/tassail/ThomPage

Sailing and Cars
 

"Maxprop" wrote in message
.net...
0
As for speed, it's rather pointless to buy a car that can
double most posted
speed limits, despite your need to compensate for the
manliness nature
failed to provide.

Have you seen the V W commercials where people in their cars
are shouting stuff through bull horns? Saw it last night,
thought of Bob.

SBV

Sailing and Cars
 

Have you seen the V W commercials where people in their cars
are shouting stuff through bull horns? Saw it last night,
thought of Bob.


Saw a Jeep ad with a shot of the Grand Canyon and I though of Scotty's
wife with her legs open. Of course the Grand Canyon has fewer
"wrinkles."


RB
35s5
NY

Sailing and Cars
 

"Peter Wiley" wrote in message
. ..
In article , Frank
Boettcher wrote:

On Tue, 09 May 2006 04:17:36 +0100, Peter Wiley
wrote:

In article et,
Maxprop wrote:


You might try Vermont--I hear they love Subarus up there, especially
those
horrid things with the flat-four engines.

Umm, Max - every Subaru I've ever seen has had either a flat 4 or a
flat 6. Do they sell something else in the USA?

Vested interest - I have a Liberty AWD sedan (Legacy to you guys) and I
like it. It starts, runs, is comfortable and reasonably quiet. Mileage
is OK and at 230K, I expect to get at least another 100K out of it yet.
Never seen a Tribeca here but from the pix, looks a bit better than a
WRX. That's damning with faint praise :-)

PDW


Kilometers?

Well, of course. Doesn't everyone use the metric system?

The USA began the switch to the metric system some decades back, but gave up
the idea due to cost. Too bad. Now we have both systems--British and
metric, and I have to have two sets of wrenches and sockets, not to mention
speedometers that read in both systems.

Max

Sailing and Cars
 

"Capt. Rob" wrote in message
oups.com...
I'll trust the other automotive magazines I've read over your
experience.
And since I haven't read Edmund's reports on hybrids . . .


More evidence that you can't even research properly. Edmunds has owner
forums and you can read what people are truly getting from a car in a
variety of locations. Magazine tests are too limited on their own to
judge something like MPG.

Are you saying that Consumer Reports is too limited to include owner
surveys? AAMOF, CS has consumer feedback on every car sold in America,
unless it's too new to be valid. Not to mention that magazine tests are
performed by highly experienced individuals whose only job is to perform
such tests and write them up. That would be in contrast to a single
self-proclaimed expert of everything whose unknowledgable opinions are
completely worthless in the overall scheme of things.


Wrong by your standards is probably right by everyone else's

According to Edmunds and the many Hybrid owners posting there, you're
wrong...about all of it.

I'm sure the "many hybrid owners" are more orgasmic about their cars than
about the second coming of Christ. After all they already bought them and
are stuck with an cost-inefficient technology that will be superceded
shortly.

Max

Sailing and Cars
 

"Capt. Rob" wrote in message
oups.com...
BWAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. Japanese toys vs. fine Teutonic engineering.

Right. A cheap Japanese 600cc motorcycle will outperform that STI in
all
respects, so your point is ludicrous.


BMW makes some fine cars, but the cheap 3 series is little more than a
teenager's toy, except for the M3. The STI is simply better than
everything, far faster, far better handling in ALL conditions. It's
essentially an off the rack rally car. Oh, and the STI is very much
able to hold it's own with an M3 in every respect but build. The M3 is
awesome. You don't own one.

And it's damned unlikely I ever will. Why would I want the quintessential
poor-man's pocket rocket when I can own a real car, like a BMW?


LOL. Put my Bimmer next to that Tribeca (as unthinkable as that
would be
for a BMW owner) and see how many folks compliment each car
respectively.


This is NY. BMW is about as common as the Ford Focus. No one looks them
and they've become little more than ghetto mobiles. Then again only
really poor folks drive low end 3 series anyway...about as pathetic as
the Audi A4 in fact.

Gee, that must put the STI in the economic basement of ownership. Sorry to
hear that.



I'm content to have a quick auto with superb handling,
outstanding quality, cutting-edge engineering,


Do let us know when you get such a car.

I already have it. You, OTOH, have a hot little sedan that won't hold its
value after the next, more attractive and quicker Japanese pocket rocket
surfaces.


and resale value that your

Better check Edmunds. Both the Outback and STI have better resale than
your 3 series. Only the M3 has a good resale value. BMW doesn't even
make the top 10. You also need need to run TCO (Total cost of
ownership) where Subaru FAR outstrips the BMW and is only bested by
Toyota and Honda.
Yep, you sure know your cars!

Yep, I do. And I don't believe a word of your previous paragraph.
J.D.Powers, the acknowledged authority on owner surveys, puts the BMW way
above any Subaru in value retention.

A Lexus ES330 is just a Camry

Dude, are you on some kind of medication? Anyone who knows anything
would understand that it's not the ES330 I was talking about.

You might have been more specific. You simply said "a 330." An RX or an ES
would have been helpful.

You do
know that Lexus also makes a crossover, right?

"Crossover" is a media hype term. The RX330 is a car-based SUV, just like
my Highlander. In fact it's the same vehicle with different sheet metal and
some expensive interior goodies.

You do know that it has
a totally different suspension, right? And that it's one of the best
rated in it's class, right? Hmmmm? Guess not. Read some more car &
drivers and MT and get back to us!

I know that the RX330 and my Toyota Highlander, along with the Honda Pilot
leave your Tribeca in the dust in every survey and test so far published.

Sorry, Bubbles, but putting perfume on a pig doesn't make it something else.
G

Max

Sailing and Cars
 

"Scotty" wrote in message
...

"Maxprop" wrote in message
.net...
0
As for speed, it's rather pointless to buy a car that can
double most posted
speed limits, despite your need to compensate for the
manliness nature
failed to provide.

Have you seen the V W commercials where people in their cars
are shouting stuff through bull horns? Saw it last night,
thought of Bob.

Of course he'd have the best, most advanced bull horn made.

Max

Sailing and Cars
 

"Peter Wiley" wrote in message
. ..

The clutch on my Liberty was replaced at 160K, the CV joints at
180K. That's it, and while I bought it used, it has the full logbook
dealer service records.

That's pretty good for a Jeep Liberty, which overall has had a rather dismal
reliability rating. But each car is an individual, and some folks get
lucky. I'd say you were fortunate. A neighbor finally sold his after only
15K miles and 2 years, during much of which the vehicle was in the shop
awaiting parts.

As I said, my personal experience with them is good. In fact I was
considering buying another one for my daughter.

Road & Track's long-term tests of Subarus has pointed to a number of service
issues on most of the models. And Consumer Reports also noted some issues
as well. But overall they are stout, relatively reliable vehicles. That
the company has doggedly retained it boxer engines is a bit surprising,
considering the problems that are inherent with boxers, but I suspect their
loyal clientele might revolt if they began putting inline 4s and V6s in
them.

Max

Sailing and Cars
 

"John Cairns" wrote in message
. com...

"Thom Stewart" wrote in message
...
We have the ability to start using E85 right NOW, if we can get it into
Service Station's Pumps. If we start selling it, the profit boys sure as
hell will start making it.

Max, do you understand what I'm saying? I want Ethanol,if it will make
us fuel independent!! Is that clear enough for your BIAS (?) MIND?

http://community.webtv.net/tassail/ThomPage

Problem is, and you can look this up, is that it takes MORE than 1 gallon
of fossil fuels to produce 1 gallon of ethanol. The "profit boys" are
currently being subsidized heavily by the federal government to produce
ethanol. There is no "magic bullet", regardless of what the folks at BP
say.

Really old info, John (2003). The ethanol for automotive fuel use will be
produced from a variety of prairie grass, not corn. The cost of producing
one gallon of ethanol is substantially less than if corn were used. In
fact, it is widely regarded that if gasoline at the pumps exceeds $2.70,
then E85 can become a reality with no cost penalty. Since we've already
passed that figure, it's a slam dunk.

Max

Sailing and Cars
 

Well; thank you Max,

The process in called Cellular Ethanol; An it is the process of using
the waste (What is now called Waste) biomass. The same size field can
out produce Corn 10 to 1 and the emission is reduced by 85% compared to
Ethanol from Corn is only about 25%. The Fermentation uses Gas rather
than Yeast and is getting cheaper every day but is still higher cost yet
than Crude but, as you say, it is competitive right now.

Max; Ethanol is the Chem of the week right now but there are 4 Alcohol
of high interest Methanol, Ethanol, Propanol and butanol. All capable of
replacing Fossil Fuels. Butanol is closer to gasoline than Ethanol

http://community.webtv.net/tassail/ThomPage