I'd suggest that if you dropped him in the far North with no weapon Mr
Testosterone here would be ****ing himself with fear in a day. In his
closeted safe enviroment (with no real predators) he has no idea what
the worst of Oz is like. He probably wouldn't recognise half the predators.

Cheers

OzOne wrote:

On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 23:05:09 GMT, "Capt. Mooron"
scribbled thusly:


Oz... it seems to me like the general trend is to blame the animal for the
attack ... when in reality it is usually the people with no comprehension of
the world they inhabit that are to blame.


Yep that's true in many cases.

I don't hold much respect for 4x4 campers and even less for people that can
be so easily undone by a predator with the brain of a chook.

Hmmm, interesting that you'd think that.

It's time people learned that ability to access does in no way guarantee
safety. They should have been fined for killing the Salty and fined again
for gross stupidity.

Why, because they followed all the procedures for camping in an area
where crocs are present.
ie a long way from the water, no food, no fishing gear eyc etc.
This is the first recorded instance of a croc travelling as far as it
did to attack anyone let alone a sleeping camper.

No bravery was displayed here.... Idiocy was displayed!
That Croc could have been subdued in seconds by someone with an iota of
comprehension of their habitat, trigger systems and physical abilities....
without a gun. There was no reason for the attack if the "victim" had even
the base understanding of what makes a Crocodile act/react.


Ummm the victim was asleep.

We have idiots up here who lament bear attacks... bears don't attack without
reason. Yet every year idiots fall prey to them. Good Riddance! I'm all for
the bears! I'm also all for the Crocs...and the Sharks!

I would have preferred to see the lot eaten by the Croc...


Not something I'd like to see, especially after the croc followed his
usual method of stuffing his prey under an underwater log for a few
weeks to tenderise it before comsumption.

I will nonetheless concede.... that the actions of the Lady was
courageous... even though the initiation of the attack rests squarely on
their own shoulders.

The camper was asleep and followed all guidelines.

What a totally ridiculous situation and an unnecessary lost of life.... for
the Croc.

Ban the human Idiots.... why did they have a gun to begin with?? don't you
folks have laws against such things?

You probably should come out to Australia. There are many places where
guns are almost essential as a survival tool.
We see no need for guns in the cities.

Only Cowards and Idiots need guns to defend themselves.... especially in the
Bush!


Oh, OK, maybe next time you're out here and a 200kg ferral pig decides
to charge you without warninng, and without you even knowing he was
there, you might change your mind. Those tusks will tear open a human
like a letter opener does a letter.

CM





OzOne wrote in message ...

On Wed, 13 Oct 2004 10:20:42 +1300, Nav
scribbled thusly:


Great story. I would never camp close to a beach or a river in the North
-those salties scare the hell out of me!

Cheers

This was apparently the first instance where a croc had wandered so
far without anything to draw it in.
Apparently the people did all the right things, food etc up the other
end of the beach an all the rest.

Rangers are at a loss to explain just why the thing went as far as it
did up where they were camped.


Oz1...of the 3 twins.

I welcome you to crackerbox palace,We've been expecting you.




Oz1...of the 3 twins.

I welcome you to crackerbox palace,We've been expecting you.

Why would it leave, it knew where "lunch" was?
Cheers

thunder wrote:

On Wed, 13 Oct 2004 10:20:42 +1300, Nav wrote:


Great story. I would never camp close to a beach or a river in the North
-those salties scare the hell out of me!


There was another recent attack where a saltie treed a couple of young
men. It kept them in the tree for most of the night. I was rather
surprised to read that, and this story, as I always thought crocs were
ambush predators, not active predators. Something about being eaten, just
isn't a nice way to go.

Ya know, sometimes Mooron, you sound just like my 8 year old grandson...but
8 year olds are often forgiven their braggadocio and their delusions.....

"Capt. Mooron" wrote in message
...

"Nav" wrote in message
...
Mooron the man was asleep in his tent when the croc grabbed him and was
dragging him back to the water. The death roll is not carried out in
these circumastances. You really should not underestimate the pulling
power of a 300kg croc. I can just see it now, you with your legs in it
jaws trying to hold onto sand to stop being pulled into the water all the
while arguing with it that it's not playing by your rules.

Nav... leave your emotional fears of dangerous animals behind and attempt
to logically deduce what might have occured.... the man was in a friggin'
tent Nav.... how much nylon can a croc ingest??? You expect me to believe
this croc undid the zipper and picked out the plumpest legs???

Think Nav... 10 square meters of non rip nylon that would have carried the
entire weight of everyone in the tent plus entanglement factors. No way
Bubba.
The campers panicked out of fear of the same stories you want to subject
us to.... it won't wash with me. I've seen entirely way too many big
predators up close to understand that a reason is required to intiate an
attack. Hunger don't cut it all the time. Opportunity always will.

Crocs aren't some sort of super predator ... if they were the US forces
would be utilizing them. There are lots of animals on this planet much
more dangerous than a Salty. You are sounding like an American...
believing your own propoganda!

I've been 10 feet from a Polar Bear, meters from a Grizzly.... dove with
sharks.... big deal. I wasn't prey nor presented myself as such. I was
with my Dad in the Congo when he killed a 20 foot Croc that had eaten
several villagers.[ Ciraca 1959] I was only 4 years old but remember his
words.... loosely transalted from Lingala .." no hard feelings my friend"
prior to a .500 Nitro Express shot to the head. That son of a bitch cut a
swath across the river in a death run so violent it sent wakes to both
shores. I remember that clearly! I know the power Nav.... I also know they
are opportunistic hunters and ambush predators.... my Dad made certain I
understood and respected all animals.... especially those I intended to
hunt. He has 21 elephants, 12 Lions, 8 Leopards and 6 Crocs plus numerous
other kills to his credit. I was always taught that I was the Apex
Predator... as such I should show respect and understand the behaviour of
the animals I encountered.

You seem to live your life in unreasoned fear of somthing you do not
understand... that makes you weak in my eyes.

So be it..... be afraid. It will certainly overshadow any abilty to
respect such a fine animal as a Salty.

Idiot Humans... we have a plethora of.... let the Crocs eat away I say!

CM

Capt. Mooron wrote:

my Dad made certain I understood and
respected all animals.... especially those I intended to hunt. He has 21
elephants, 12 Lions, 8 Leopards and 6 Crocs plus numerous other kills to his
credit. I was always taught that I was the Apex Predator... as such I should
show respect and understand the behaviour of the animals I encountered.

Your mode of respect for animals is quite bizarre. I'd guess it would be
be a sort of Neanderthal logic.

Cheers

OzOne wrote:

On Wed, 13 Oct 2004 22:39:48 GMT, "katysails"
scribbled thusly:


Ya know, sometimes Mooron, you sound just like my 8 year old grandson...but
8 year olds are often forgiven their braggadocio and their delusions.....


He reverts under the influence of copious amounts of alcohol.


Or big girls!

Cheers

Nah...he writes that stuff when he's sober...he's a much better drunk...

OzOne wrote in message news
On Wed, 13 Oct 2004 22:39:48 GMT, "katysails"
scribbled thusly:

Ya know, sometimes Mooron, you sound just like my 8 year old
grandson...but
8 year olds are often forgiven their braggadocio and their delusions.....

He reverts under the influence of copious amounts of alcohol.


Oz1...of the 3 twins.

I welcome you to crackerbox palace,We've been expecting you.

"Nav" wrote in message
...
I'd suggest that if you dropped him in the far North with no weapon Mr
Testosterone here would be ****ing himself with fear in a day. In his
closeted safe enviroment (with no real predators) he has no idea what the
worst of Oz is like. He probably wouldn't recognise half the predators.

Crap... your "dingos" are 40lbs of scrawny mutt compared to our 125lb wolves
Your Feral Pigs... heck you have a TV celebrity that wrestles them to the
ground bare handed.
Nav... they are PIGS!! I eat pigs.
Oh Yeah the dangerous Wombat.... and the killer Roos!!
Compare those to a 1500 lb Polar Bear, a Wolverine or even a Walrus!
The Salty is your only claim to fame if you ignore your plentiful snakes.
I don't carry a firearm when I survey.... I've surveyed in Resolute, Holman
and Sachs Harbour to name 3 of over 20+ locations. Matter of fact... pick
any spot north of the 60th and I've most likely been there.

You have no idea of the predators up north... but I'd dare say that from my
many conversations with a multitude of Aussies that work for BHP Bilton
Diamond Mines in the NWT ... I have a very good idea of the wildlife in
Australia. My favourite Aussie trick is the Australian Bagpipes! I'm
certain you know that one.

So Nav.... BITE ME!

CM

"Capt. Mooron" wrote in message ...
"Nav" wrote in message
...
Have you ever seen a salty up close? Let me guess you'd discuss it with
him as he's dragging "lunch" back to the water??

You NIT.

Dragging??? What no "Death Roll"??? It let go when a 60 year old granny
jumps it??

Pardon my french but.... **** OFF!

Face it Nav... they have a set of jaws... are in their element in the
water. This Croc was on dry land! Burst speed is maybe 20kph for about 20
meters. Get a grip and remove the base fear from your reaction. The croc is
severely limited in it's ability to attack a land based mammal that can
sprint to 18 kph over a hundred meters in seconds.... never mind comprehend
it's surroundings beyond base instinct!! It's hunting food... man is not the
natural prey.

Got some bad news for you, CM. Man *is* natural prey for sal****er
crocs. Back in the 'old' days, the aboriginals apparently used to do
river crossings at a sprint. The logic was that the croc, if about,
would nail one of the older, slower members.

I agree with you about people in croc habitat needing to have a clue,
but crocs will kill people for food. It's not like a bear raiding a
tent for food & the occupant merely being in the way.

PDW

"katysails" wrote in message
...
Ya know, sometimes Mooron, you sound just like my 8 year old
grandson...but 8 year olds are often forgiven their braggadocio and their
delusions.....

Ya know Kitty... sometimes you just have no idea of what you are commenting
on ... and in such instances you should just refrain from allowing your
emotional reactions interfere with a subject matter you obviously don't have
a clue about.

I would trust your comments on sailing, pets and gardening and most other
urban matters..... wilderness survival?... not a chance!

CM

"Capt. Mooron" wrote
..... The croc is
severely limited in it's ability to attack a land based mammal that can
sprint to 18 kph over a hundred meters in seconds.... never mind comprehend
it's surroundings beyond base instinct!! It's hunting food... man is not the
natural prey.


Peter Wiley wrote:
Got some bad news for you, CM. Man *is* natural prey for sal****er
crocs. Back in the 'old' days, the aboriginals apparently used to do
river crossings at a sprint. The logic was that the croc, if about,
would nail one of the older, slower members.

That's taking recycling a bit too far IMHO.


I agree with you about people in croc habitat needing to have a clue,
but crocs will kill people for food. It's not like a bear raiding a
tent for food & the occupant merely being in the way.

I've never seen one but never want to. Florida alligators can't compare.
I've read accounts of the Australian sal****er croc grabbing people out
of boats... heard of one case of one grabbing a person out of a stalled
jeep... not fun.

DSK