Comments interspersed:

Simple Simon wrote:

In my case, I have plenty enough time on the water in my
sailboat alone.

You may have, though I'd possibly argue it's validity.
If I decided to brag I could include the
time spend on the Boston Whaler.

Not worth the powder to blow it to hell.
It would give more
than double the time needed for the past five years in
only the last three of the five.

Any USCG accepting this time, would need an exam for basic intelligence.
Try cruising for six
months once in a while and be on the go day in and
day out and the time piles up quickly.

ROFL You forget, wannabe, I used to do this for a living. For me, 6
months was no big deal.
Time under sail
and time under motor - it's all time.

Nope

otn





S.Simon


"otnmbrd" wrote in message ink.net...

Sorry, but I disagree. Once you get that license, there is no way they
can take it from you, unless you can't pass the physical or you have an
incident that causes you to lose that license through revocation.
Now, having said this, they can make you jump through some extra hoops
at renewal time (Rules exam, etc.) but, that license is yours, as long
as you go through one of the hoops when renewing.
Pay close attention to (I believe) option 3 .... marine related experience.
The only thing current time does for you is make life easier during
renewal (no exams - and all exams are open book or at home, when you
don't have current time).
Make sure you include all your "discharges" next time you renew .....
but, and most importantly, if someone is telling you, you can lose your
license by not having actual time on the particular license, tell them
BS!!!!

otn

PS ... G I'm sorry to say, that applies to Neal, also.


Schoonertrash wrote:

That's pretty much it. But it's not a case of so much each year but rather
so much times the number of years of the life of the license. Mine started
June 1st of 2001 and I've got just shy of 60 days time on it. Suppose due
to work considerations I only get 30 a year average on it through June 2004
or 120 days. 45 times five if I have it right is 225 and the last two years
I'd have to do 105 or 55.5 per year. However once I finish the rebuild I'm
only working four on four off give or take to no more than age 62. Then,
hopefully, social security kicks in and I'm done working for good except for
using the license. The license is up in 2006, I turn 62 a year later.
Should be no problem. And if I get the 200 ton upgrade even less of a
problem. That with the STCW added on should make it a very useful document.
Leastways that's the plan. Now it's just a matter of making up for lost
time . . .and (tongue in cheek) hoping my retirement doesn't disappear.

MST

This was what I was asking, and I said the same thing....ALL his time
counts, where his license is concerned and he should not have a problem
with renewal, if he has "deepsea" time.
Thought maybe he thought he would lose it.

otn

Rick wrote:

otnmbrd wrote:

Sorry, but I disagree. Once you get that license, there is no way they
can take it from you, unless you can't pass the physical or you have
an incident that causes you to lose that license through revocation.


I don't recall anyone saying anything about the license being taken
away. If you just never show up to renew then it expires quietly and you
can do whatever you like with it.

You can lose the authority to use that license if you don't sail or jump
through all the hoops but to lose the license is an administrative thing
and that was never even mentioned to the best of my recollection.

I am not sure if Michael even needs to do anything other than turn in
his discharges to cover his 100 ton ticket anyway. All the CG asks for
is sea time, they don't care what the time is on unless it is for an
upgrade. Mine is tricky since my unlimited ticket is engine and my toy
ticket is deck ... though like I said they will count some unlimited
time spent "observing" on the bridge.

Rick

That's not true if he's kept a proper log.

Cheers MC

otnmbrd wrote:


You may have, though I'd possibly argue it's validity.
If I decided to brag I could include the

time spend on the Boston Whaler.


Not worth the powder to blow it to hell.
It would give more

than double the time needed for the past five years in
only the last three of the five.

The_navigator© wrote:

That's not true if he's kept a proper log.

Cheers MC


Very true, if we are talking about his 25 ton license .... not sure, but
doubtful for his oupv.

otn

Subject: What a USCG Master's license is good for?
From: "Simple Simon"


You're just jealous because I use as a part-time hobby
that which you use for a living. Your vaunted and valued
Master's license is that easy for anyone to get and this
makes you mad because it makes you realize you have
no real special skills.

ROFL .... If it's so easy, why don't you have one?

Why the proof is any old cruising
sailor is as qualified as you are to be licensed to legally
operate a motor vessel. Furthermore said qualification
time can be gained mostly under sail. It's time on the
water that counts - not time on the water under motor
power.

Now you tell me .... all that time sailing, as a kid ..... I shoulda skipped
school and gone directly to the examiner

Shen

Nothing unless you actually use it for commerce.
"Simple Simon" wrote in message
...
There is a loser here by the name of Rick who maintains
a Master's license is not worthwhile to have for one
who lives aboard and sails an aux/sailboat. Next thing
he will be attempting to claim a Six- Pak license is no
good for bonefish back country charters. Bwaahahahahah!

I say he's simple-minded and incorrect. Any aux/sailboat
is a motorboat unless the motor (machinery) is not on. The
transmission does not even have to be engaged. The motor
can just be sitting there running at idle charging the batteries,
for example, while the boats goes on her merry way under
sail and she is still classified as a motorboat. This means
having a sailing endorsement is really only legally required
for a pure sailboat (one with no machinery). For example,
I could be sailing along with paying passengers while my
Honda was idling in neutral and there isn't a thing in the
world I was doing illegally with respect to charging
passengers for the sail. Even if I stopped the motor
I could easily start it up again if I saw a law enforcement
vessel and if they boarded I could simply claim the motor
was running all along. This would be even simpler for
an aux/sail boat with an inboard motor as turning the
key to start a motor is even less conspicuous.

So, for all practical purposes any sailor whether he uses
his motor or knot really does not need a sailing endorsement.
The USCG realizes this and that is why they place primary
emphasis on their licenses stating Master of Steam or Motor
Vessels while they toss in a sailing endorsement mostly to
fill a loophole that of pure sailing vessels.

Now, I ask you all, how many pure sailboats have you seen
that are large enough to be for hire with captain are there
that require a sailing endorsement on one's Master of Steam
or Motor Vessels ticket? Also, ask yourself how many Master of
Sailing with motor endorsement licenses are there? The
answer to that is zero, zilch, nada, none! Yet that fool of
a boy Rick lives his life and argues his lame points on the
basis of acting like they predominate. What a misinformed
clown Rick is.

Even otn and Shen44 are smart enough to realize one cannot
make a living with a sailing endorsement. There just aren't
enough jobs of the sort available. Being a Master of Steam
and Motor Vessels is the way the majority of professionals
such as myself make a living - not via sailing endorsements.

So, Rick, please go away with your foolish statements and
goofy arguments because if you keep it up you're gonna need
to join the professional clown actor's guild.

S.Simon

"The Carrolls" wrote in message ...
Nothing unless you actually use it for commerce.


Do you have one?

Just wondering.

Joe



"Simple Simon" wrote in message
...
There is a loser here by the name of Rick who maintains
a Master's license is not worthwhile to have for one
who lives aboard and sails an aux/sailboat. Next thing
he will be attempting to claim a Six- Pak license is no
good for bonefish back country charters. Bwaahahahahah!

I say he's simple-minded and incorrect. Any aux/sailboat
is a motorboat unless the motor (machinery) is not on. The
transmission does not even have to be engaged. The motor
can just be sitting there running at idle charging the batteries,
for example, while the boats goes on her merry way under
sail and she is still classified as a motorboat. This means
having a sailing endorsement is really only legally required
for a pure sailboat (one with no machinery). For example,
I could be sailing along with paying passengers while my
Honda was idling in neutral and there isn't a thing in the
world I was doing illegally with respect to charging
passengers for the sail. Even if I stopped the motor
I could easily start it up again if I saw a law enforcement
vessel and if they boarded I could simply claim the motor
was running all along. This would be even simpler for
an aux/sail boat with an inboard motor as turning the
key to start a motor is even less conspicuous.

So, for all practical purposes any sailor whether he uses
his motor or knot really does not need a sailing endorsement.
The USCG realizes this and that is why they place primary
emphasis on their licenses stating Master of Steam or Motor
Vessels while they toss in a sailing endorsement mostly to
fill a loophole that of pure sailing vessels.

Now, I ask you all, how many pure sailboats have you seen
that are large enough to be for hire with captain are there
that require a sailing endorsement on one's Master of Steam
or Motor Vessels ticket? Also, ask yourself how many Master of
Sailing with motor endorsement licenses are there? The
answer to that is zero, zilch, nada, none! Yet that fool of
a boy Rick lives his life and argues his lame points on the
basis of acting like they predominate. What a misinformed
clown Rick is.

Even otn and Shen44 are smart enough to realize one cannot
make a living with a sailing endorsement. There just aren't
enough jobs of the sort available. Being a Master of Steam
and Motor Vessels is the way the majority of professionals
such as myself make a living - not via sailing endorsements.

So, Rick, please go away with your foolish statements and
goofy arguments because if you keep it up you're gonna need
to join the professional clown actor's guild.

S.Simon

Who needs it, me and my pals can dock the Exxon Valdex at City Island,
except my best friend Hazelwood ruined the boat.

Your Leader
RB



Do you have one?

Just wondering.

Joe



"Simple Simon" wrote in message
...
There is a loser here by the name of Rick who maintains
a Master's license is not worthwhile to have for one
who lives aboard and sails an aux/sailboat. Next thing
he will be attempting to claim a Six- Pak license is no
good for bonefish back country charters. Bwaahahahahah!

I say he's simple-minded and incorrect. Any aux/sailboat
is a motorboat unless the motor (machinery) is not on. The
transmission does not even have to be engaged. The motor
can just be sitting there running at idle charging the batteries,
for example, while the boats goes on her merry way under
sail and she is still classified as a motorboat. This means
having a sailing endorsement is really only legally required
for a pure sailboat (one with no machinery). For example,
I could be sailing along with paying passengers while my
Honda was idling in neutral and there isn't a thing in the
world I was doing illegally with respect to charging
passengers for the sail. Even if I stopped the motor
I could easily start it up again if I saw a law enforcement
vessel and if they boarded I could simply claim the motor
was running all along. This would be even simpler for
an aux/sail boat with an inboard motor as turning the
key to start a motor is even less conspicuous.

So, for all practical purposes any sailor whether he uses
his motor or knot really does not need a sailing endorsement.
The USCG realizes this and that is why they place primary
emphasis on their licenses stating Master of Steam or Motor
Vessels while they toss in a sailing endorsement mostly to
fill a loophole that of pure sailing vessels.

Now, I ask you all, how many pure sailboats have you seen
that are large enough to be for hire with captain are there
that require a sailing endorsement on one's Master of Steam
or Motor Vessels ticket? Also, ask yourself how many Master of
Sailing with motor endorsement licenses are there? The
answer to that is zero, zilch, nada, none! Yet that fool of
a boy Rick lives his life and argues his lame points on the
basis of acting like they predominate. What a misinformed
clown Rick is.

Even otn and Shen44 are smart enough to realize one cannot
make a living with a sailing endorsement. There just aren't
enough jobs of the sort available. Being a Master of Steam
and Motor Vessels is the way the majority of professionals
such as myself make a living - not via sailing endorsements.

So, Rick, please go away with your foolish statements and
goofy arguments because if you keep it up you're gonna need
to join the professional clown actor's guild.

S.Simon

Following the website lead Rick provided I found I can tie up reasonably
close to a school, upgrade to 200 ton and Oceans with a minimum of fuss.
One choice of course is in Seattle with a prep course and an on site USCG
test. The other I found is in Florida where everything is done at the
school. Full boat deal including radar, towing and advanced firefighting,
perhaps also GMDSS requires no more than a month. I'm sure there are more.
You were right that my current time counts. The weekend work I'm doing now
and did up in Virginia works in there. The only question is if the new
license will be 200 Ton Master or 100 Ton Master and 200 Ton Mate. Either
way with the full 'Oceans' designation I will move from the many to the few
who are legally able to deliver boats over 150 miles offshore. With the
more expensive yachts that's a major plus and solves a big insurance problem
for them. Above that level, especially 1600 tons and above the STCW
requirements hit you full force. That's more like 8 plus weeks but for 1600
and above it's not just worth it, it's mandatory. Two more things. It
appears the coasties MAY be phasing out 200 and keeping 500 ton licenses.
Second, a lot of what you get on a license depends on which REC you use.
Appy at Long Beach and its pretty much a screw job. The best I've found so
far are Boston and Portland, OR especially the latter. They all recommend
applying in this manner: Review and award all endorsements and levels for
my documentation and license for which I have qualified. If you want
something very specific, for example, AB Sail listed along with AB Limited
you can still ask for it. What are licenses good for? Well, in the
Chesapeake doing pick up work here and there I made double my tuition and
school costs back. Here's two funjobs. Catalina Island company driving the
glass bottom boat for the tourist trade or Laughlin NV driving the taxi boat
across the river from AZ. Jobs are where you find them and what you make of
them. I suspect bringing boats back from places like Mexico, Hawaii, or
even the Bahamas for those that didn't make it past a one way attempt is
another source. The major reason I found for going through the training was
it smoothed out the dips and bumps in my abilities. But having gained the
knowledge . . .the next step is to use the knowledge. Since the US doesn't
have anything approaching the Competency Certifications as do, say the
British, getting a 100 ton license is the best thing available.

Cheers and fair winds

MST

What's ''REC?



Sweet Jesus.

RB