Obviously you've never seen fog... just a low cloud bank. In real fog you
might not see the bow of your boat. 60 foot visibility is a 'normal' fog
bank up my way.... they get way thicker than that.

CM

"Simple Simon" wrote in message
...
| Jeff,
|
| Back in the old days some of the schooners could indeed
| proceed at a good clip (clipper ship, get it?). I'm surprised
| you think the recent ruling that ALL vessels slowing down
| was because of anything other than a proliferation of motor
| vessels becoming such a hazard that the very safety of
| even large, fast sailing ships was in danger. The bottom
| line is only those vessels who are going fast must slow
| down. Those already going slow need not slow down
| and these include small cruising yacht restricted by
| their hull speed.
|
| The fact remains there are two different sound signals
| one for motor vessels and another for all vessels above
| them in the pecking order. These signals alone shout
| out loudly and clearly "PECKING ORDER" and
| pecking order means stand-on and give-way vessels.
|
| You always seem to fall back on your lame argument
| about a fog so thick that you can't see your own bow
| let alone another ship. Well, tough! One instance does
| not make a Rule. My instance of a normal fog in which
| ships become visible to one another and hence must
| follow the in-sight rules even though they are in or near
| an area of restricted visibility is all that's needed to prove
| there IS a pecking order and hence a give-way and
| stand-on vessel in restricted visibility.
|
| The logic here is unassailable making the statement true
| till proven false and thus far you and the other tugboat
| captain's lame (by the nature of their specificity) arguments
| have come up short.
|
| S.Simon - irrefuteable
|
|
|
| "Jeff Morris" wrote in message
m...
| Its an interesting comment, one that we've discussed before. It may
| actually have some validity in very light fog, which might be all Neal
has
| any experiance in. However, it is the opinion of all of the
commentators,
| the IMO, and the courts, that if there is any doubt as to the
conditions,
| one must assume you are NOT in sight of one another.
|
| In thick fog (which has always been stipulated in these discussions)
there
| will not be sufficient time for a powerboat to avoid collision if a
sailboat
| assumes it is "standon"and continues at hull speed. This is why the
rules
| stipulate that ALL VESSELS must slow when hearing a fog signal.
|
| An interesting point is that until 1972 this rule only applied to
| powerboats. Previous versions of the ColRegs (from about 1890 and 1948)
had
| similar wording but only applied it to power, not sail. Obviously, the
IMO
| decided that it was important that ALL VESSELS slow down in the fog when
| hearing a fog signal. They also eliminated the concept of "moderate
speed"
| and replaced it with "safe speed."
|
| -jeff
|
|
|
| "Simple Simon" wrote in message
| ...
| In a fog, as soon as vessels concerned come within sight of one
| another the sailboat is the stand-on vessel with respect to the
| motor vessel
|
| This means in a fog (when in sight) the pecking order applies.
|
| This loophole in the Rules is something that seems to go right
| over the heads of the group's tugboat captains. They cannot
| fathom the fact that 'in sight' also exists in restricted visibility
| as in a fog. Since 'in sight' exists in a fog then the pecking order
| exists in a fog. This is so logical that it cannot be argued.
|
| Yet the fools continue to argue it . . .
|
| S.Simon
|
|
| "The_navigator©" wrote in message
| ...
| Who is the stand on vessel in fog?
|
| Cheers MC
|
| Simple Simon wrote:
| Joe,
|
| I'm surprised at you making an ignorant statement like you could
| care less about the COLREGS. Everybody who cares about safe
| and sane operation of boats of all kinds would do well to learn
the
| COLREGS. Even if you aren't concerned about safety you should
| be concerned about liability. Knowing and following the COLREGS
| will eventually save you far more trouble than the little time
spent
| avoiding acquiring this valuable knowledge.
|
| I recommend you visit my website and read the Novice Lessons
| where I give a very good and thorough explaination in layman's
| terms of the COLREGS.
|
| http://www.homestead.com/captneal/lesson.html
|
|
| S.Simon - knows the COLREGS better than any other individual
| here and better than all the tugboat captains
combined
| which includes Rick, Otnmbrd, Morris, and Shen44.
|
|
| "Joe" wrote in message
| om...
|
| "katysails" wrote in message
| ...
|
| So the gamers should respect the people and the vessel with a
goal
| and
| or a purpose.
|
| Racers are entoute and do have a goal and purpose. It is just
not
| YOUR
| goal or purpose. They do have to follow COLREGS, though, in the
| process
| even though some forget that.
|
| Katy,
|
| If a man is mowing a lawn, would you expect him to stop so you can
| play baseball? He's trying to feed his kids. Yet you are just
playing
| a game.
|
| If a man is sweeping a sidewalk, would you have him stop so you
can
| Scotty can play jacks?
|
| You may have the right to demand him to stop, But the whole
| neighborhood will suffer a dirty sidewalk because you are selfish.
|
| I could care less about the COLREGS.
|
| It's not about the law, it's about the respect.
|
| Joe
| MSV RedCloud
|
|
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