Michael Moore would be proud...
 

wrote in message
...
On Jan 4, 8:49 am, "D.Duck" wrote:
wrote in message

...
On Jan 3, 2:07 pm, "D.Duck" wrote:





wrote in message

...
On Jan 3, 10:50 am, wrote:

On Jan 3, 10:42 am, wrote:

On Jan 3, 10:27 am, BAR wrote:

John H. wrote:
On Thu, 3 Jan 2008 06:11:48 -0800 (PST),
wrote:

On Jan 2, 7:01 pm, Short Wave Sportfishing
wrote:
Woman waits in California hospital for a bed to open up here
Wednesday, January 02 - 11:30:00 AM

Lyle Fisher
VANCOUVER (NEWS1130) - A Surrey woman's holiday in California
has
turned into a healthcare nightmare. The 68-year old needed
emergency
surgery after her appendix burst, but now she can't come home
due
to a
lack of hospital beds.

Arlene Meeks has been in a California hospital since December
17th.
Her family has been trying to get her transferred back to the
Lower
Mainland for 2 weeks now but they haven't had any luck.

Stephen Harris with the South Fraser Health Region says the
issue
is a
shortage of ventilated intensive care unit beds, which are
highly
specialized. He says over the holidays, it's not surprising to
see
those beds filled up.

Harris says as soon as a bed becomes available, Meeks will be
transferred to a local hospital. Arlene's daughter Kim says
her
mom is
'frustrated as hell', and she just wants to come home.

NDP Health Critic Adrian Dix says the issue is one that's
continued to
plague the Lower Mainland and he's blaming Liberal government
cuts
to
acute care beds. "The number of acute care beds in British
Columbia
was reduced by 1,300 in the first mandate of the government,
and
some
of the new facilities being opened won't be adding to that
number."

Dix says the Vancouver Coastal and Fraser Health authorities
issued
reports last fall indicating they are 650 acute care beds
short
right
now.
The trouble is, you right wingers only look for the bad things
about
any system you don't like. Why don't you find the good things,
and
post them as well, if you want to come off as balanced. Same
with
global warming!

The only good thing about the overtaxed, crappy health system is
that it's
'free'. So what?

There is nothing good about socialized medicine.

And, it is not free. It costs you money, that you conveniently
don't
see, and it costs lives and livelihoods which end up costing the
rest
of
us more.

Pay for what you want and need in all things.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Tell all veterans that who use the V.A. system.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

They already paid with their service....- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Bull****. I wholeheartedly agree that they deserve good care. But
there is no tangible amount they "paid".

Why does there have to be a "tangible" amount, as you so adeptly put
it?-
Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Because he's saying he paid.

How much?

You do realize it's possible to "pay" with other than "tangible" assets,
don't you?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Cool, whatcha got for sale? I have some imaginary, um.....stuff I'll
pay you with.


You could pay with your brain, but that is lacking any worth.

Michael Moore would be proud...
 

Calif Bill wrote:
wrote in message
...
On Jan 3, 7:23 pm, "Calif Bill" wrote:
"Reginald P. Smithers III" "Reggie is Here wrote in
...





D.Duck wrote:
wrote in message
...
On Jan 3, 10:50 am, wrote:
On Jan 3, 10:42 am, wrote:
On Jan 3, 10:27 am, BAR wrote:
John H. wrote:
On Thu, 3 Jan 2008 06:11:48 -0800 (PST),
wrote:
On Jan 2, 7:01 pm, Short Wave Sportfishing
wrote:
Woman waits in California hospital for a bed to open up here
Wednesday, January 02 - 11:30:00 AM
Lyle Fisher
VANCOUVER (NEWS1130) - A Surrey woman's holiday in California has
turned into a healthcare nightmare. The 68-year old needed
emergency
surgery after her appendix burst, but now she can't come home due
to a
lack of hospital beds.
Arlene Meeks has been in a California hospital since December
17th.
Her family has been trying to get her transferred back to the
Lower
Mainland for 2 weeks now but they haven't had any luck.
Stephen Harris with the South Fraser Health Region says the issue
is a
shortage of ventilated intensive care unit beds, which are highly
specialized. He says over the holidays, it's not surprising to
see
those beds filled up.
Harris says as soon as a bed becomes available, Meeks will be
transferred to a local hospital. Arlene's daughter Kim says her
mom
is
'frustrated as hell', and she just wants to come home.
NDP Health Critic Adrian Dix says the issue is one that's
continued
to
plague the Lower Mainland and he's blaming Liberal government
cuts
to
acute care beds. "The number of acute care beds in British
Columbia
was reduced by 1,300 in the first mandate of the government, and
some
of the new facilities being opened won't be adding to that
number."
Dix says the Vancouver Coastal and Fraser Health authorities
issued
reports last fall indicating they are 650 acute care beds short
right
now.
The trouble is, you right wingers only look for the bad things
about
any system you don't like. Why don't you find the good things, and
post them as well, if you want to come off as balanced. Same with
global warming!
The only good thing about the overtaxed, crappy health system is
that
it's
'free'. So what?
There is nothing good about socialized medicine.
And, it is not free. It costs you money, that you conveniently don't
see, and it costs lives and livelihoods which end up costing the
rest
of
us more.
Pay for what you want and need in all things.- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
Tell all veterans that who use the V.A. system.- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
They already paid with their service....- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
Bull****. I wholeheartedly agree that they deserve good care. But
there is no tangible amount they "paid".
Why does there have to be a "tangible" amount, as you so adeptly put
it?
If I am not mistaken, the VA healthcare plan in some manner, is included
in their compensation package. The same way most large companies include
a healthcare plan as part of their compensation package. I really don't
know the details of the military plan, but if you retired from the
military, you really do expect them to honor the compensation package
everyone agreed to. The tangible part is the salary you deferred to
cover
the cost of your healthcare.
My brother did not retire, but did spend 11 years active duty. He gets VA
medical care because of Agent Orange exposure. He paid a lot for that
"free" care.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Well, then, quantify it. How much did he pay?

A lot of his health. How much do you pay for your health care? Some
greenbacks? How about Prostrate problems, shaky hands, major possibility of
cancer. Memories of rocket attacks killing and maiming your coworkers. A
hell of a lot more than you loogie. You and HK seem to fit together. No
real care for the rest of the people.




I'm in favor of universal health insurance coverage and that in your
mind makes you believe I am opposed to "real care" for the "rest of the
people? I've also stated several times my belief that vets are being
shortchanged on their medical care.

I'd call you retarded, but there is no need to insult those among us who
are mentally disabled or disadvantaged. So I guess you are just plain
stupid.





--
George W. Bush - the 43rd Best President Ever!

Michael Moore would be proud...
 

wrote in message
...
On Jan 4, 8:54 am, wrote:
On Fri, 4 Jan 2008 08:46:13 -0500, "JimH" wrote:

wrote in message
...
On Jan 4, 8:16 am, wrote:
On Jan 3, 5:39 pm, Jim wrote:

Short Wave Sportfishing wrote:
Woman waits in California hospital for a bed to open up here
Wednesday, January 02 - 11:30:00 AM

A friend of mine, here in the good 'ol USA, dislocated his knee a
week
and a half ago. Had to wait a week for the MRI and has a meeting with
the surgeon next Monday. He's in intense pain and can't walk at all.

He's a veteran and has a good HMO (Pacific Care).

Is our system really that good?

Awhile back, I came very close to dying. I have very good insurance. I
waited in the emergency room for six hours, then two hours in triage,
then another day and a half before a surgical suite would be available
for the surgeon to get me in. It was so close at the end that he came
and personally checked on me every half hour.

So, please tell me where you would have rather been, Cuba, Britian,
Iran.??? Please, we will pitch in for a ticket if you want to be
treated somewhere else...
================

Booger has exaggerated his story just a wee bit. Anyone close to death
does not wait 6 hours in any emergency room for care but is rushed right
in
and attended to, including immediate surgery if needed to save the life.

**** you, you pussy little twit. Show me where I exaggerated anything.
You a ****ing doctor now, asshole? Let me tell you, I had periotonitis
when I went in. I sat there for six hours before seeing ANYONE besides
that intake person. Prove me wrong you little ****head. My surgeon
even stated that had I got the CT scan earlier that I wouldn't have
had emergency surgery because they could have simply inserted a needle
and took the node out that way, then when my blood count was back to
normal, have elected surgery. But again, you just like being an
asshole so **** you. What a big man, you can say that **** hiding
behind salt's message but don't have the balls to say a damned thing
to me directly.

Unless, of course they don't have insurance, in which case they may be
transferred to another hospital that is willing to take them, or
simply put in a cab and dumped off on a street corner.- Hide quoted text -

Sorry Salt, had to reply to that low life scum JimH. He'll probably
now start saying nasty untrue things about my wife and kids. That's
how he works. Almost makes me wish what I had on him, so he can see
what to hell really happened. Hell, we were so frustrated that we've
worked on, and got the hospital logs!


Was the required union supplied clerk that screwed you.

Michael Moore would be proud...
 

On Fri, 4 Jan 2008 09:21:27 -0800 (PST), wrote:

On Jan 4, 9:25*am, John H. wrote:
On Fri, 4 Jan 2008 05:10:52 -0800 (PST), wrote:
On Jan 3, 7:23*pm, "Calif Bill" wrote:
"Reginald P. Smithers III" "Reggie is Here wrote in ...
My brother did not retire, but did spend 11 years active duty. *He gets VA
medical care because of Agent Orange exposure. *He paid a lot for that
"free" care.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Well, then, quantify it. How much did he pay?

Here are some of the diseases associated with Agent Orange, Loogy.

Chloracne
Non-Hodgkin's Lymphoma
Soft tissue sarcoma
Hodgkin's Disease
Porphyria Cutanea Tarda (PCT)
Multiple Myeloma
Respiratory cancers
(including cancers of the lung, larynx, trachea and bronchus)
Prostate cancer
Peripheral neuorapthy
(acute or subacute)
Type 2 Diabetes (Diabetes mellitus)

Me, I'm right on the borderline for several of these, although I'm
receiving nothing from VA for any of them...yet.

I really think the best thing you could do for your attitude is visit a VA
hospital and just walk around for an hour. Have a cup of coffee in the
cafeteria. I'll buy.

You're starting to sound like Harry with this stuff. You sure as hell don't
want to sink to that low.
--
John H

I've been to several VA hospitals over the years. I've known several
people using their services. I totally understand that the people who
served our country should be taken care of. The facts remain. If you
consider it as "pay" to what end?

To what end? Better health.

Yes, I consider it as 'pay'. When I was drafted I got 'free' health care,
food, lodging, and uniforms. Of course, my pay was a grandiose $72 per
month. Later I became an officer. My pay went to a tremendous $223 per
month.
--
John H

Michael Moore would be proud...
 

On Fri, 4 Jan 2008 09:48:07 -0800 (PST), wrote:

On Jan 4, 9:35*am, John H. wrote:
On Fri, 4 Jan 2008 05:16:12 -0800 (PST), wrote:
On Jan 3, 5:39*pm, Jim wrote:
Short Wave Sportfishing wrote:
Woman waits in California hospital for a bed to open up here
Wednesday, January 02 - 11:30:00 AM

A friend of mine, here in the good 'ol USA, dislocated his knee a week
and a half ago. *Had to wait a week for the MRI and has a meeting with
the surgeon next Monday. *He's in intense pain and can't walk at all.

He's a veteran and has a good HMO (Pacific Care).

Is our system really that good?

Awhile back, I came very close to dying. I have very good insurance. I
waited in the emergency room for six hours, then two hours in triage,
then another day and a half before a surgical suite would be available
for the surgeon to get me in. It was so close at the end that he came
and personally checked on me every half hour.

I find it hard to believe that Jim's friend didn't receive any pain killers
when he went to the emergency room.

A week for an MRI and another couple days for an orthopedic surgeon is
nothing. A couple months for each would be the story in many places, *if*
he was lucky.

You were either not close to dying, or you were quickly stabilized in the
emergency room. *Or*, which may be possible, you had a potful of illegal
immigrants clogging up the whole show.

For your information, Dr., I was only a few more hours from dead. My
surgeon also told me had I not had to wait that long, I would have
avoided emergency surgery and been able to have one elected surgery
instead of an emergency surgery then an elected one four months later.
I love how you and JimH think you know more about my misfortune than
I, or my surgeon does. Now about that quickly stabilized crap. You go
into the emergency room, you talk to an intake person, not a doctor,
not a nurse, a paper pusher. Then you wait. That intake person can do
nothing to you. I was there for better than two hours when someone
came to me. It was the financial lady wanting to know about my
insurance. I told her I couldn't get up, so she got me a wheelchair.
After talking with her, I asked the intake lady to PLEASE hurry, "I
think something is seriously wrong". A guy with a swollen foot went
before me!

Here, AVERAGE wait, almost 4 hours:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15487676/

You guys complain of waits of hours or days. Imagine waits of months and
more months, and then flying to another country to get yourself fixed.
--
You only use, and show the bad things.

The bad things are what makes it suck!
--
John H

Michael Moore would be proud...
 

JimH wrote:
...
================

Booger has exaggerated his story just a wee bit. Anyone close to death
does not wait 6 hours in any emergency room for care but is rushed right in
and attended to, including immediate surgery if needed to save the life.

You must be living in a dream world. I have no idea what happened when
Loogie went to the ER, but it is not unusual for triage to make some
major misdiagnoses resulting in death or near death experience. His
claim that a triage mistake almost resulted in a death is completely
possible.

Michael Moore would be proud...
 

Michael Moore would be proud...
 

Michael Moore would be proud...
 

On Jan 4, 8:28*pm, Dan wrote:
wrote:
On Jan 4, 8:49 am, "D.Duck" wrote:
wrote in message

....
On Jan 3, 2:07 pm, "D.Duck" wrote:

wrote in message
....
On Jan 3, 10:50 am, wrote:
On Jan 3, 10:42 am, wrote:
On Jan 3, 10:27 am, BAR wrote:
John H. wrote:
On Thu, 3 Jan 2008 06:11:48 -0800 (PST),
wrote:
On Jan 2, 7:01 pm, Short Wave Sportfishing
wrote:
Woman waits in California hospital for a bed to open up here
Wednesday, January 02 - 11:30:00 AM
Lyle Fisher
VANCOUVER (NEWS1130) - A Surrey woman's holiday in California
has
turned into a healthcare nightmare. The 68-year old needed
emergency
surgery after her appendix burst, but now she can't come home
due
to a
lack of hospital beds.
Arlene Meeks has been in a California hospital since December
17th.
Her family has been trying to get her transferred back to the
Lower
Mainland for 2 weeks now but they haven't had any luck.
Stephen Harris with the South Fraser Health Region says the
issue
is a
shortage of ventilated intensive care unit beds, which are
highly
specialized. He says over the holidays, it's not surprising to
see
those beds filled up.
Harris says as soon as a bed becomes available, Meeks will be
transferred to a local hospital. Arlene's daughter Kim says her
mom is
'frustrated as hell', and she just wants to come home.
NDP Health Critic Adrian Dix says the issue is one that's
continued to
plague the Lower Mainland and he's blaming Liberal government
cuts
to
acute care beds. "The number of acute care beds in British
Columbia
was reduced by 1,300 in the first mandate of the government, and
some
of the new facilities being opened won't be adding to that
number."
Dix says the Vancouver Coastal and Fraser Health authorities
issued
reports last fall indicating they are 650 acute care beds short
right
now.
The trouble is, you right wingers only look for the bad things
about
any system you don't like. Why don't you find the good things,
and
post them as well, if you want to come off as balanced. Same with
global warming!
The only good thing about the overtaxed, crappy health system is
that it's
'free'. So what?
There is nothing good about socialized medicine.
And, it is not free. It costs you money, that you conveniently don't
see, and it costs lives and livelihoods which end up costing the
rest
of
us more.
Pay for what you want and need in all things.- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
Tell all veterans that who use the V.A. system.- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
They already paid with their service....- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
Bull****. I wholeheartedly agree that they deserve good care. But
there is no tangible amount they "paid".
Why does there have to be a "tangible" amount, as you so adeptly put it?-
Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
Because he's saying he paid.

How much?
You do realize it's possible to "pay" with other than "tangible" assets,
don't you?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Cool, whatcha got for sale? I have some imaginary, um.....stuff I'll
pay you with.

Is that what your calling it now, Sally? *I thought it was for a friend
- for medicinal purposes.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Took me a second.. ;O

Michael Moore would be proud...
 

On Jan 4, 8:28*pm, Dan wrote:
wrote:
On Jan 4, 8:49 am, "D.Duck" wrote:
wrote in message

....
On Jan 3, 2:07 pm, "D.Duck" wrote:

wrote in message
....
On Jan 3, 10:50 am, wrote:
On Jan 3, 10:42 am, wrote:
On Jan 3, 10:27 am, BAR wrote:
John H. wrote:
On Thu, 3 Jan 2008 06:11:48 -0800 (PST),
wrote:
On Jan 2, 7:01 pm, Short Wave Sportfishing
wrote:
Woman waits in California hospital for a bed to open up here
Wednesday, January 02 - 11:30:00 AM
Lyle Fisher
VANCOUVER (NEWS1130) - A Surrey woman's holiday in California
has
turned into a healthcare nightmare. The 68-year old needed
emergency
surgery after her appendix burst, but now she can't come home
due
to a
lack of hospital beds.
Arlene Meeks has been in a California hospital since December
17th.
Her family has been trying to get her transferred back to the
Lower
Mainland for 2 weeks now but they haven't had any luck.
Stephen Harris with the South Fraser Health Region says the
issue
is a
shortage of ventilated intensive care unit beds, which are
highly
specialized. He says over the holidays, it's not surprising to
see
those beds filled up.
Harris says as soon as a bed becomes available, Meeks will be
transferred to a local hospital. Arlene's daughter Kim says her
mom is
'frustrated as hell', and she just wants to come home.
NDP Health Critic Adrian Dix says the issue is one that's
continued to
plague the Lower Mainland and he's blaming Liberal government
cuts
to
acute care beds. "The number of acute care beds in British
Columbia
was reduced by 1,300 in the first mandate of the government, and
some
of the new facilities being opened won't be adding to that
number."
Dix says the Vancouver Coastal and Fraser Health authorities
issued
reports last fall indicating they are 650 acute care beds short
right
now.
The trouble is, you right wingers only look for the bad things
about
any system you don't like. Why don't you find the good things,
and
post them as well, if you want to come off as balanced. Same with
global warming!
The only good thing about the overtaxed, crappy health system is
that it's
'free'. So what?
There is nothing good about socialized medicine.
And, it is not free. It costs you money, that you conveniently don't
see, and it costs lives and livelihoods which end up costing the
rest
of
us more.
Pay for what you want and need in all things.- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
Tell all veterans that who use the V.A. system.- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
They already paid with their service....- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
Bull****. I wholeheartedly agree that they deserve good care. But
there is no tangible amount they "paid".
Why does there have to be a "tangible" amount, as you so adeptly put it?-
Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
Because he's saying he paid.

How much?
You do realize it's possible to "pay" with other than "tangible" assets,
don't you?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Cool, whatcha got for sale? I have some imaginary, um.....stuff I'll
pay you with.

Is that what your calling it now, Sally? *I thought it was for a friend
- for medicinal purposes.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Hello Rec.Boats **** Boy!