Speaking of boats for the middle class.
 

On Thu, 29 Nov 2007 08:58:57 -0500, " JimH" ask wrote:


"Reginald P. Smithers III" wrote in message
...
HK wrote:
JimH wrote:
"Reginald P. Smithers III" wrote in message
. ..
JimH wrote:
"Reginald P. Smithers III" wrote in
message . ..
JimH wrote:
"HK" wrote in message
. ..
JimH wrote:
"Tim" wrote in message
...
I was wondering if there are any stats on how long people
actually
keep their boat. Like if they buy a new runabout or cuddie etc.
how
long do they actually keep it, before selling it or trading it in
for
a new model.

some people keep cars a year then trade for new, others buy new
and
run the wheels off it.

I've never bought a brand new boat in my life and really don't
plan on
it. My two boats are 1983 and 1977. Both in very good shape and
will
be keeping them for quite a while.

Does anyone know what is the average trade off or average length
of
ownership is for boats?
I would guess I change boats every 5-7 years. I have only
purchased 1 new boat and that was only because the dealership was
going out of business and I got a great deal on it.

My 20 foot runabout is being gifted to my son when he is actually
able to take ownership and advantage of using it. I received a
call from the marina today that the outdrive maintenance has been
completed and the boat is ready to be picked up. They found some
additional problems with the OD.....which they repaired. We are
picking it up over the weekend to be shrink wrapped and winter
stored at another site (cheaper).
Having never owned a boat with an I/O, my info is obtained
vicariously. From what I have read here and elsewhere over the
years, it seems to be that these drives are nothing but continuing
maintenance and trouble. Yet the technology in them, really, is
many decades old. Do you think they'd be less problematical if
their manufacturers concentrated on improving the quality of the
parts they contain and worried less about new and sometimes dubious
features?

Regarding mechanical problems, I have not had any significant
problems with the outdrives on my boats.

Having said that...........I will never purchase another boat with
an outdrive as the upkeep is more demanding than an outboard.



Except for the boot on the OD, what additional upkeep do you have?

I thought you may know this but here goes anyway: The I/O stays
submerged during the entire season. An outboard is in the water only
when it is being used as it can be raised out of the water when
docked. As a result the anodes need replacing more often and most
significantly the lower unit on the I/O takes a beating. It also
takes on a significant amount of marine growth with can result in
reduced performance.

Personally I clean the I/O whenever the water is warm enough to jump
in. It is amazing the amount of marine growth that reoccurs within
only a few weeks if not attended to.

I have never had a problem with algea growth because I use Outdrive
Anti-Fouling paint. It really makes a hell of a difference and is
cheap and easy to do yourself. I look at the zincs every month or so,
but I am lucky because my marina does not seem to have a stray current
leak, because they barely look used when I replace them every 3 years.
The first year, I thought this meant my zincs were not working, but I
was assured they are working correctly. I was told if they weren't i
would see pitting on the drive itself, which I don't. Since they are
so cheap, I replace the zincs when i have the marina pulls the outdrive
to do a complete service on the outdrive.



You seem to have the perfect boat that never has any sort of problems
Reg. ;-)

Even with an anti-fouling paint you will get algae growth.

BTW: One additional maintenance item with I/O's........alignments.

Inboards or outboards are the only way to go.


When all you have is an imaginary boat, like Reggie has, you never have
mechanical problems.

Serious question. I have no ownership experience with these modern, car
or truck gas engines in boats. What RPMS do you typically run them at? My
SUV V8 loafs along at 2000 rpm or so at highway speeds, but you have to
be running at what, twice that, in an I/O planing boat. What steps are
taken to build up these engines to take that sort of constant high rpm
stress?

It depends upon the boat, but 3200-3500 has always kept my boats on plane.
You are correct, I really have been lucky, and have never had a major
problem, but I do keep up with the mfg'er recommended schedule.

Who was talking abut *major* problems Reg? Even if you keep up with PM you
can still encounter problems.

It is great to know that you never have any.


Jim, I can't understand your 'snark attacks' at Reggie. This is the third
in only two threads. I've just started reading the posts and have not seen
any nasty comments made to you or Harry.
--
John H

Speaking of boats for the middle class.
 

On Thu, 29 Nov 2007 07:36:42 -0500, " JimH" ask wrote:


"John H." wrote in message
.. .
On Wed, 28 Nov 2007 18:25:12 -0500, " JimH" ask wrote:


"Tim" wrote in message
...
I was wondering if there are any stats on how long people actually
keep their boat. Like if they buy a new runabout or cuddie etc. how
long do they actually keep it, before selling it or trading it in for
a new model.

some people keep cars a year then trade for new, others buy new and
run the wheels off it.

I've never bought a brand new boat in my life and really don't plan on
it. My two boats are 1983 and 1977. Both in very good shape and will
be keeping them for quite a while.

Does anyone know what is the average trade off or average length of
ownership is for boats?

I would guess I change boats every 5-7 years. I have only purchased 1 new
boat and that was only because the dealership was going out of business
and
I got a great deal on it.

My 20 foot runabout is being gifted to my son when he is actually able to
take ownership and advantage of using it. I received a call from the
marina
today that the outdrive maintenance has been completed and the boat is
ready
to be picked up. They found some additional problems with the
OD.....which
they repaired. We are picking it up over the weekend to be shrink
wrapped
and winter stored at another site (cheaper).


That's really great that you're going to give it to your son. Are you
going
to pay the storage fees for him also. That would be a super gift!
--
John H

Reading comprehension problems John?


What did I misunderstand? Does 'being gifted' not mean the same as 'give
it'?
--
John H

Speaking of boats for the middle class.
 

John H. wrote:
On Thu, 29 Nov 2007 08:58:57 -0500, " JimH" ask wrote:

"Reginald P. Smithers III" wrote in message
. ..
HK wrote:
JimH wrote:
"Reginald P. Smithers III" wrote in message
. ..
JimH wrote:
"Reginald P. Smithers III" wrote in
message . ..
JimH wrote:
"HK" wrote in message
. ..
JimH wrote:
"Tim" wrote in message
...
I was wondering if there are any stats on how long people
actually
keep their boat. Like if they buy a new runabout or cuddie etc.
how
long do they actually keep it, before selling it or trading it in
for
a new model.

some people keep cars a year then trade for new, others buy new
and
run the wheels off it.

I've never bought a brand new boat in my life and really don't
plan on
it. My two boats are 1983 and 1977. Both in very good shape and
will
be keeping them for quite a while.

Does anyone know what is the average trade off or average length
of
ownership is for boats?
I would guess I change boats every 5-7 years. I have only
purchased 1 new boat and that was only because the dealership was
going out of business and I got a great deal on it.

My 20 foot runabout is being gifted to my son when he is actually
able to take ownership and advantage of using it. I received a
call from the marina today that the outdrive maintenance has been
completed and the boat is ready to be picked up. They found some
additional problems with the OD.....which they repaired. We are
picking it up over the weekend to be shrink wrapped and winter
stored at another site (cheaper).
Having never owned a boat with an I/O, my info is obtained
vicariously. From what I have read here and elsewhere over the
years, it seems to be that these drives are nothing but continuing
maintenance and trouble. Yet the technology in them, really, is
many decades old. Do you think they'd be less problematical if
their manufacturers concentrated on improving the quality of the
parts they contain and worried less about new and sometimes dubious
features?

Regarding mechanical problems, I have not had any significant
problems with the outdrives on my boats.

Having said that...........I will never purchase another boat with
an outdrive as the upkeep is more demanding than an outboard.



Except for the boot on the OD, what additional upkeep do you have?

I thought you may know this but here goes anyway: The I/O stays
submerged during the entire season. An outboard is in the water only
when it is being used as it can be raised out of the water when
docked. As a result the anodes need replacing more often and most
significantly the lower unit on the I/O takes a beating. It also
takes on a significant amount of marine growth with can result in
reduced performance.

Personally I clean the I/O whenever the water is warm enough to jump
in. It is amazing the amount of marine growth that reoccurs within
only a few weeks if not attended to.
I have never had a problem with algea growth because I use Outdrive
Anti-Fouling paint. It really makes a hell of a difference and is
cheap and easy to do yourself. I look at the zincs every month or so,
but I am lucky because my marina does not seem to have a stray current
leak, because they barely look used when I replace them every 3 years.
The first year, I thought this meant my zincs were not working, but I
was assured they are working correctly. I was told if they weren't i
would see pitting on the drive itself, which I don't. Since they are
so cheap, I replace the zincs when i have the marina pulls the outdrive
to do a complete service on the outdrive.


You seem to have the perfect boat that never has any sort of problems
Reg. ;-)

Even with an anti-fouling paint you will get algae growth.

BTW: One additional maintenance item with I/O's........alignments.

Inboards or outboards are the only way to go.

When all you have is an imaginary boat, like Reggie has, you never have
mechanical problems.

Serious question. I have no ownership experience with these modern, car
or truck gas engines in boats. What RPMS do you typically run them at? My
SUV V8 loafs along at 2000 rpm or so at highway speeds, but you have to
be running at what, twice that, in an I/O planing boat. What steps are
taken to build up these engines to take that sort of constant high rpm
stress?
It depends upon the boat, but 3200-3500 has always kept my boats on plane.
You are correct, I really have been lucky, and have never had a major
problem, but I do keep up with the mfg'er recommended schedule.
Who was talking abut *major* problems Reg? Even if you keep up with PM you
can still encounter problems.

It is great to know that you never have any.


Jim, I can't understand your 'snark attacks' at Reggie. This is the third
in only two threads. I've just started reading the posts and have not seen
any nasty comments made to you or Harry.


You're not too observant.

Speaking of boats for the middle class.
 

On Sat, 01 Dec 2007 17:31:01 -0500, HK wrote:

John H. wrote:
On Thu, 29 Nov 2007 08:58:57 -0500, " JimH" ask wrote:

"Reginald P. Smithers III" wrote in message
. ..
HK wrote:
JimH wrote:
"Reginald P. Smithers III" wrote in message
. ..
JimH wrote:
"Reginald P. Smithers III" wrote in
message . ..
JimH wrote:
"HK" wrote in message
. ..
JimH wrote:
"Tim" wrote in message
...
I was wondering if there are any stats on how long people
actually
keep their boat. Like if they buy a new runabout or cuddie etc.
how
long do they actually keep it, before selling it or trading it in
for
a new model.

some people keep cars a year then trade for new, others buy new
and
run the wheels off it.

I've never bought a brand new boat in my life and really don't
plan on
it. My two boats are 1983 and 1977. Both in very good shape and
will
be keeping them for quite a while.

Does anyone know what is the average trade off or average length
of
ownership is for boats?
I would guess I change boats every 5-7 years. I have only
purchased 1 new boat and that was only because the dealership was
going out of business and I got a great deal on it.

My 20 foot runabout is being gifted to my son when he is actually
able to take ownership and advantage of using it. I received a
call from the marina today that the outdrive maintenance has been
completed and the boat is ready to be picked up. They found some
additional problems with the OD.....which they repaired. We are
picking it up over the weekend to be shrink wrapped and winter
stored at another site (cheaper).
Having never owned a boat with an I/O, my info is obtained
vicariously. From what I have read here and elsewhere over the
years, it seems to be that these drives are nothing but continuing
maintenance and trouble. Yet the technology in them, really, is
many decades old. Do you think they'd be less problematical if
their manufacturers concentrated on improving the quality of the
parts they contain and worried less about new and sometimes dubious
features?

Regarding mechanical problems, I have not had any significant
problems with the outdrives on my boats.

Having said that...........I will never purchase another boat with
an outdrive as the upkeep is more demanding than an outboard.



Except for the boot on the OD, what additional upkeep do you have?

I thought you may know this but here goes anyway: The I/O stays
submerged during the entire season. An outboard is in the water only
when it is being used as it can be raised out of the water when
docked. As a result the anodes need replacing more often and most
significantly the lower unit on the I/O takes a beating. It also
takes on a significant amount of marine growth with can result in
reduced performance.

Personally I clean the I/O whenever the water is warm enough to jump
in. It is amazing the amount of marine growth that reoccurs within
only a few weeks if not attended to.
I have never had a problem with algea growth because I use Outdrive
Anti-Fouling paint. It really makes a hell of a difference and is
cheap and easy to do yourself. I look at the zincs every month or so,
but I am lucky because my marina does not seem to have a stray current
leak, because they barely look used when I replace them every 3 years.
The first year, I thought this meant my zincs were not working, but I
was assured they are working correctly. I was told if they weren't i
would see pitting on the drive itself, which I don't. Since they are
so cheap, I replace the zincs when i have the marina pulls the outdrive
to do a complete service on the outdrive.


You seem to have the perfect boat that never has any sort of problems
Reg. ;-)

Even with an anti-fouling paint you will get algae growth.

BTW: One additional maintenance item with I/O's........alignments.

Inboards or outboards are the only way to go.

When all you have is an imaginary boat, like Reggie has, you never have
mechanical problems.

Serious question. I have no ownership experience with these modern, car
or truck gas engines in boats. What RPMS do you typically run them at? My
SUV V8 loafs along at 2000 rpm or so at highway speeds, but you have to
be running at what, twice that, in an I/O planing boat. What steps are
taken to build up these engines to take that sort of constant high rpm
stress?
It depends upon the boat, but 3200-3500 has always kept my boats on plane.
You are correct, I really have been lucky, and have never had a major
problem, but I do keep up with the mfg'er recommended schedule.
Who was talking abut *major* problems Reg? Even if you keep up with PM you
can still encounter problems.

It is great to know that you never have any.


Jim, I can't understand your 'snark attacks' at Reggie. This is the third
in only two threads. I've just started reading the posts and have not seen
any nasty comments made to you or Harry.


You're not too observant.

Well, I'm just working my way through about 580 posts. Maybe Reggie got
vicious in later threads.
--
John H

Speaking of boats for the middle class.
 

John H. wrote:
On Sat, 01 Dec 2007 17:31:01 -0500, HK wrote:

John H. wrote:
On Thu, 29 Nov 2007 08:58:57 -0500, " JimH" ask wrote:

"Reginald P. Smithers III" wrote in message
. ..
HK wrote:
JimH wrote:
"Reginald P. Smithers III" wrote in message
. ..
JimH wrote:
"Reginald P. Smithers III" wrote in
message . ..
JimH wrote:
"HK" wrote in message
. ..
JimH wrote:
"Tim" wrote in message
...
I was wondering if there are any stats on how long people
actually
keep their boat. Like if they buy a new runabout or cuddie etc.
how
long do they actually keep it, before selling it or trading it in
for
a new model.

some people keep cars a year then trade for new, others buy new
and
run the wheels off it.

I've never bought a brand new boat in my life and really don't
plan on
it. My two boats are 1983 and 1977. Both in very good shape and
will
be keeping them for quite a while.

Does anyone know what is the average trade off or average length
of
ownership is for boats?
I would guess I change boats every 5-7 years. I have only
purchased 1 new boat and that was only because the dealership was
going out of business and I got a great deal on it.

My 20 foot runabout is being gifted to my son when he is actually
able to take ownership and advantage of using it. I received a
call from the marina today that the outdrive maintenance has been
completed and the boat is ready to be picked up. They found some
additional problems with the OD.....which they repaired. We are
picking it up over the weekend to be shrink wrapped and winter
stored at another site (cheaper).
Having never owned a boat with an I/O, my info is obtained
vicariously. From what I have read here and elsewhere over the
years, it seems to be that these drives are nothing but continuing
maintenance and trouble. Yet the technology in them, really, is
many decades old. Do you think they'd be less problematical if
their manufacturers concentrated on improving the quality of the
parts they contain and worried less about new and sometimes dubious
features?

Regarding mechanical problems, I have not had any significant
problems with the outdrives on my boats.

Having said that...........I will never purchase another boat with
an outdrive as the upkeep is more demanding than an outboard.



Except for the boot on the OD, what additional upkeep do you have?

I thought you may know this but here goes anyway: The I/O stays
submerged during the entire season. An outboard is in the water only
when it is being used as it can be raised out of the water when
docked. As a result the anodes need replacing more often and most
significantly the lower unit on the I/O takes a beating. It also
takes on a significant amount of marine growth with can result in
reduced performance.

Personally I clean the I/O whenever the water is warm enough to jump
in. It is amazing the amount of marine growth that reoccurs within
only a few weeks if not attended to.
I have never had a problem with algea growth because I use Outdrive
Anti-Fouling paint. It really makes a hell of a difference and is
cheap and easy to do yourself. I look at the zincs every month or so,
but I am lucky because my marina does not seem to have a stray current
leak, because they barely look used when I replace them every 3 years.
The first year, I thought this meant my zincs were not working, but I
was assured they are working correctly. I was told if they weren't i
would see pitting on the drive itself, which I don't. Since they are
so cheap, I replace the zincs when i have the marina pulls the outdrive
to do a complete service on the outdrive.


You seem to have the perfect boat that never has any sort of problems
Reg. ;-)

Even with an anti-fouling paint you will get algae growth.

BTW: One additional maintenance item with I/O's........alignments.

Inboards or outboards are the only way to go.

When all you have is an imaginary boat, like Reggie has, you never have
mechanical problems.

Serious question. I have no ownership experience with these modern, car
or truck gas engines in boats. What RPMS do you typically run them at? My
SUV V8 loafs along at 2000 rpm or so at highway speeds, but you have to
be running at what, twice that, in an I/O planing boat. What steps are
taken to build up these engines to take that sort of constant high rpm
stress?
It depends upon the boat, but 3200-3500 has always kept my boats on plane.
You are correct, I really have been lucky, and have never had a major
problem, but I do keep up with the mfg'er recommended schedule.
Who was talking abut *major* problems Reg? Even if you keep up with PM you
can still encounter problems.

It is great to know that you never have any.

Jim, I can't understand your 'snark attacks' at Reggie. This is the third
in only two threads. I've just started reading the posts and have not seen
any nasty comments made to you or Harry.

You're not too observant.

Well, I'm just working my way through about 580 posts. Maybe Reggie got
vicious in later threads.


About 75% of "Reggie Posts" are snark attacks. If you don't see that,
the problem is with you.

Speaking of boats for the middle class.
 

On Sat, 01 Dec 2007 17:48:59 -0500, HK wrote:

About 75% of "Reggie Posts" are snark attacks.

Are snark attacks like snivitz attacks.

(Please don't ask me how I know this)

Speaking of boats for the middle class.
 

Short Wave Sportfishing wrote:
On Sat, 01 Dec 2007 17:48:59 -0500, HK wrote:

About 75% of "Reggie Posts" are snark attacks.

Are snark attacks like snivitz attacks.

(Please don't ask me how I know this)


Cause the kids at school called you Salt Water Snivitz? :}

Speaking of boats for the middle class.
 

On Nov 30, 9:50 pm, HK wrote:
Wayne.B wrote:
On Wed, 28 Nov 2007 09:50:08 -0800 (PST), Tim
wrote:

20% hit? I would think that the spread would be greater than that, but
then again, I really don't know. I haven't priced brand new, and
compared with a year or two older models

Depends on the boat and how old it is. 20% after the first year or
two is probably in the ballpark. After 5 to 7 years it's closer to
50% for all but the highest quality.

Depends on the boat, the demand for the boat, and its condition.

I sold my 2003 Parker 25' rig in 2007 for only 10% less than I paid for
it. No broker, either. I wasn't hurt by the fact that between 2003 and
2007, Parker raised its price for the same model boat by nearly $20,000.

Sounds to me like somebody got a bargian! buying the boat at "sale
price" with an extra 10% off.

Speaking of boats for the middle class.
 

On Dec 1, 6:01 pm, Short Wave Sportfishing

Are snark attacks like snivitz attacks.

(Please don't ask me how I know this)


Snivets... wasnt he an admiral in WWII?

Speaking of boats for the middle class.
 

Tim wrote:
On Nov 30, 9:50 pm, HK wrote:
Wayne.B wrote:
On Wed, 28 Nov 2007 09:50:08 -0800 (PST), Tim
wrote:
20% hit? I would think that the spread would be greater than that, but
then again, I really don't know. I haven't priced brand new, and
compared with a year or two older models
Depends on the boat and how old it is. 20% after the first year or
two is probably in the ballpark. After 5 to 7 years it's closer to
50% for all but the highest quality.
Depends on the boat, the demand for the boat, and its condition.

I sold my 2003 Parker 25' rig in 2007 for only 10% less than I paid for
it. No broker, either. I wasn't hurt by the fact that between 2003 and
2007, Parker raised its price for the same model boat by nearly $20,000.

Sounds to me like somebody got a bargian! buying the boat at "sale
price" with an extra 10% off.


Both parties were pleased. At the time I sold mine, there were not that
many similar "low mileage" models on the market, and of those that were,
several were "Florida" boats, which are the least desirable.

Speaking of boats for the middle class.
 

" JimH" ask wrote in message
...
John H, I can't understand your *snark attacks* on many members of this
NG. This is about your 5th *snark attack* on my posts today John, and you
are just getting started. This week you probably posted well over 100
*snark* attacks on Harry and Don.

What gives?


He was heading in for his 'new personality' operation and wanted to get as
many licks in as possible before being civilized.

Speaking of boats for the middle class.
 

On Sat, 1 Dec 2007 18:46:33 -0500, " JimH" ask wrote:


"John H." wrote in message
.. .


John H, I can't understand your *snark attacks* on many members of this NG.
This is about your 5th *snark attack* on my posts today John, and you are
just getting started. This week you probably posted well over 100 *snark*
attacks on Harry and Don.

What gives?



Jim, you lie, but most folks here know that by now.

Was this an example of what bothers you?

*********************************************
That's really great that you're going to give it to your son. Are you
going to pay the storage fees for him also. That would be a super gift!

John H

Reading comprehension problems John?


What did I misunderstand? Does 'being gifted' not mean the same as 'give
it'?


--
John H

Speaking of boats for the middle class.
 

John H. wrote:
On Sat, 1 Dec 2007 18:46:33 -0500, " JimH" ask wrote:

"John H." wrote in message
...


John H, I can't understand your *snark attacks* on many members of this NG.
This is about your 5th *snark attack* on my posts today John, and you are
just getting started. This week you probably posted well over 100 *snark*
attacks on Harry and Don.

What gives?



Jim, you lie, but most folks here know that by now.

Was this an example of what bothers you?

*********************************************
That's really great that you're going to give it to your son. Are you
going to pay the storage fees for him also. That would be a super gift!

John H

Reading comprehension problems John?


What did I misunderstand? Does 'being gifted' not mean the same as 'give
it'?




Nicely nasty, Herring. Going to play "Who, me?" with this one, too?

Speaking of boats for the middle class.
 

JimH wrote:
"HK" wrote in message
...
John H. wrote:
On Sat, 1 Dec 2007 18:46:33 -0500, " JimH" ask wrote:

"John H." wrote in message
...


John H, I can't understand your *snark attacks* on many members of this
NG. This is about your 5th *snark attack* on my posts today John, and
you are just getting started. This week you probably posted well over
100 *snark* attacks on Harry and Don.

What gives?


Jim, you lie, but most folks here know that by now.

Was this an example of what bothers you?

*********************************************
That's really great that you're going to give it to your son. Are you
going to pay the storage fees for him also. That would be a super gift!
John H

Reading comprehension problems John? What did I misunderstand? Does
'being gifted' not mean the same as 'give
it'?



Nicely nasty, Herring. Going to play "Who, me?" with this one, too?

Yikes! All I have been reading from John this morning are snipes like that
on you and me.

What is funny is that he conveniently snipped this from my previous post in
this thread:

++++++++++++++++++++
My 20 foot runabout is being gifted to my son when he is actually able to
take ownership and advantage of using it.
++++++++++++++++++++

He still does not get it..

Let him continue to play his little game here if it makes him somehow feel
better. His purpose for being here should become obvious to everyone if
they have not already figured it out.




He and Reggie play the "Who, me?" game continually here.