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#1
posted to rec.boats,rec.boats.cruising
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Marine Diesel Prices are Outrageous
Paul Cassel wrote:
Now, instead of railing against we who see things differently from you, if you choose to lobby for pollution controls on all diesels, then we can form common cause. Else, sail away. Nice try, and well stated, Paul. But that's all this Wilbur guy does. Richard |
#2
posted to rec.boats,rec.boats.cruising
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Marine Diesel Prices are Outrageous
"Paul Cassel" wrote in message . .. snip.... Now, instead of railing against we who see things differently from you, if you choose to lobby for pollution controls on all diesels, then we can form common cause. Else, sail away. You're replying to a roll who prides himself on spending his retirement years in a mustard yellow sailboat c/w mauve interior. This decaying hulk is usually found in some mosquito infested swamp one step ahead of the authorities. |
#3
posted to rec.boats,rec.boats.cruising
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Marine Diesel Prices are Outrageous
Paul Cassel wrote in
: I'm in agreement that diesel engines are disgusting polluters, but they are all we have in marine life. We can either use them or use nothing, IMO. I won't sail with petrol engines due to the safety issue. I have twice been personal witness to yachts exploding due to petrol fumes - both times with deaths. That's odd.....No NOx output, nearly unmeasurable CO, spews out carbon black but only if you romp it too hard, only spews fuel if your injection is setup way wrong.... What's so disgusting about diesel? Mine are all BURNING POLLUTANTS....waste frying oil! Frying oil doesn't even make SULPHUR Dioxide! www.frybrid.com Larry -- Shhhh...Don't tell Algore... The Earth is COOLING! |
#4
posted to rec.boats,rec.boats.cruising
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Marine Diesel Prices are Outrageous
On Sat, 21 Jul 2007 10:56:39 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote: "Bruce" wrote in message .. . On Fri, 20 Jul 2007 18:18:48 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard" wrote: "Verizon News" wrote in message news:%NOni.4475$SM6.2392@trnddc01... The cost of marine diesel for your boat is outrageous these days. I am all for businesses making an honest buck and I am all for http://www.billharder.com/boating/39...are-outrageous Anybody who buys a trawler deserves to pay out the ass for his fuel. Those trawlers are ugly, smelly, noisy and make about as much sense on the water as driving a semi tractor on the road for your road trip vacations. I have no sympathy for anybody who runs a diesel engine for recreational purposes. Don't you realize how much pollution a marine diesel engine produces? It's totally selfish and irresponsible. Anybody running a marine diesel for recreational purposes is sick in my opinion. No regard whatsoever for clean air and a clean marine environment. When somebody's 'fun' takes precedence over my rights (to a clean environment) then I cannot excuse such hedonism. I wish they'd jack the price of recreational marine diesel up to about fifty bucks a gallon. Maybe people would be forced to buy environmentally friendly sailboats that use small, clean-air, 4-stroke, gasoline outboards when needed but use sails most of the time. When your 'cruising' is a blatant act of pollution and you don't even realize it then you're just clueless and nobody I want to associate with.... Wilbur Hubbard Wilber old buddy, your ideas have some validity when applied to a skiff but don't work so well when you are talking about a 40 ft. 7 ton sailboat. In addition, if you ever start really cruising you will discover that sometimes the wind just doesn't blow and after you have been becalmed for a few days in the S. China Sea, as a buddy of mine just did, you'll probably want to start motoring toward somewhere you think you might be able to buy some grub and your little outboard just isn't going to cut it. By the way, if your theory about motor boats was really correct the world's ocean freight would still be carried on sailing ships..... I made the distinction quite clear with regards to 'recreational' use of marine diesel engines. Just like truck freight over the road depends of big diesel rigs so does freight over the oceans. In my opinion, it is an acceptable compromise to use diesel engines for commerce although I would like to see emission standards tightened up. But, when it comes to recreational use of diesel engines in boats I find this to be totally unacceptable. The typical marine recreational diesel meets NO emission standards that I know of. They are often old, decrepit, in ill-repair and in need of an overhaul. Visible smoke is more the rule than the exception. The stench of them is enough to sicken even the crew. And people continue to use them for recreational purposes. In other words, strictly for selfish reasons - their 'fun.' I find this appalling. That people would knowingly pollute the air and water during any 'optional' activity tells me these people have no regard for anybody but their own selfish selves. If they were responsible human beings they would use an engine that meets or exceeds current emission standards. That means a late-model gasoline engine. And don't tell me no such engines exist for marine use. The choice of a diesel engine is the wrong choice when looked at from the environmental standpoint. One other thing, if one can't abide being becalmed from time to time then don't take up sailing. Wilbur Hubbard First of all you do not compare apples to apples. Your rant appears to concern a new, computer controlled gasoline engine as compared to an older model direct injection diesel engine. And, yes, you are probably right that the modern engine produces less pollutants then the old style diesel. Of course this is a ridicules comparison -- as ridicules as condemning the amount of horse manure my grandfather's horse and buggy produced by comparing it to my father's Model 'A' Ford. I suggest that if you compare the pollutants produced by a modern computer controlled diesel engine to that produced by a modern gasoline engine you might find a different picture. As for the odors produced by engines I am assuming you are referring to the exhaust. A properly designed diesel system produces little, if any odor. As far as your statement that "I find this appalling. That people would knowingly pollute the air and water during any 'optional' activity tells me these people have no regard for anybody but their own selfish selves." is quite simply self serving bull****. If you really find the use of polluting devices appalling then you would be rowing your dinghy out to the mooring and sailing away -- no engine at all. But that isn't what you are doing. You have a gasoline engine that you use and then you try to justify your actions by saying, in effect, that your engine produces less pollutants than mine -- My daddy can lick your daddy, in other words. Very reminiscent of the 4th grade. Your final comment that "One other thing, if one can't abide being becalmed from time to time then don't take up sailing" simply indicates that you have never actually "cruised". Oh, maybe a little day sailing but how many trips have you made where you didn't expect to see land for three weeks to a month? When you are sitting 250 miles off shore and the wind hasn't made a ripple on the water for three days, as happened to a friend of mine, you too might find the thought of trying to motor that 250 miles to get to a place you can buy some food and water as somewhat appealing. I had another friend that was depending on one of your recommended outboards, because his sail drive ate it's gears, and the wind stopped. It took him 10 days to make just a bit over 100 miles to shore, drifting most of the way. Those little outboard tanks sure don't carry much fuel. No Wildur, you go out and make a couple of real voyages and then come back and talk to me. You might even find that we'd agree on a lot more things that you think we would. Bruce in Bangkok (brucepaigeatgmaildotcom) -- Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com |
#5
posted to rec.boats,rec.boats.cruising
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Marine Diesel Prices are Outrageous
This whole thread is pretty goofy considering all the two stroke
British Seagulls out there using 10:1 oil mix. Course the newer ones use 25:1 ! |
#6
posted to rec.boats,rec.boats.cruising
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Marine Diesel Prices are Outrageous
Bruce wrote in
: self serving bull****. Wilbur is a professional. Don't try this at home! Larry -- |
#7
posted to rec.boats,rec.boats.cruising
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Marine Diesel Prices are Outrageous
On Thu, 19 Jul 2007 19:18:19 GMT, "Verizon News"
wrote: The cost of marine diesel for your boat is outrageous these days. I am all for businesses making an honest buck and I am all for http://www.billharder.com/boating/39...are-outrageous My old man can hardly support our drinking habits! - - http://magazine.doughstreet.com/page...an_asshole.htm |
#8
posted to rec.boats,rec.boats.cruising
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Marine Diesel Prices are Outrageous
Doug Kanter Jr wrote:
On Thu, 19 Jul 2007 19:18:19 GMT, "Verizon News" wrote: The cost of marine diesel for your boat is outrageous these days. I am all for businesses making an honest buck and I am all for http://www.billharder.com/boating/39...are-outrageous My old man can hardly support our drinking habits! - - http://magazine.doughstreet.com/page...an_asshole.htm Check the overhead of a marine fuel business and their volume against a gas station and their volume. Then figure out how much you have to make on each gallon to pay the overhead at each. |
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