HELP! what kind of boat and how to buy it...(kinda long, but worth it)
 

after seeing one local for sale that turned out to have a messed up
hull, my father and I decided to buy a boat. we haven't come up to an
agreement on what kind, because honestly we don't know enough. we're
going half on the purchase price so it's all about compomise here.
(we're looking at 17-21' and from the mid80's to early 90's)

My intention is tubing and general pleasure craft-type activities. a
buddy of mine has a 22 or 23' Cobalt bowrider and having the 2 boats
riding around the lake tubing and cruising is what i'm after. I would
also like to fish with this boat. so for me, a 17-20' bowrider with a
Inboard/Outboard is a compromise.


My father on the other hand wants to fish with it. he says that he
wants to cruise with it too, but we can't seem to agree, as he shows
me ads for these boats I call fishing boats. they're mostly outboards
(in the 80ish HP range) and don't appear to be worth anything as
pleasure boats. they look something like this

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1994-...QQcmdZViewItem


they look to him like they would make pleasure boats, but to me they
look like dhingys.

when i explain to him that the dinky outboard motors won't cut it as
pleasure boats and boats like that lack a proper place to hook a line
for tubing and also lack a teak-wood deck for getting in and out the
boat easily, i get an answer such as:

1. you can hook a skiier up to the hooks for tying the boat up, or
even more funny, you can drill into the fiberglass on the back and
mount one. i don't even think i need to explain what's wrong with
that.

2. as for no deck, you can also mount one. one that hangs over the
stern and mounts inside. and not really a deck either, more or less a
ladder.

since we're going half in on it, I honestly think that the design of
the type of boat my father is looking for isn't what both of us are
looking for. i don't see it being a compromise.


what I keep showing my father is something along this line...

http://newhaven.craigslist.org/boa/325479229.html

he says the 305ci in there is too big, and will eat gas. (he also
thinks that the I/O motor setup adds undue maintence and problems)
that's why he likes those dinky little outbards. i agree with him that
they're a pretty large motor, but the leap from fishing boat to
bowrider adds considerable heft to the weight of the boat


so the basic things a

1. please tell my father that a little fishing boat won't cut it for
all-around pleasure boating. (i constantly try to batter it into his
head that you can fish a bowrider, but you can't ride a fishing boat)


2. please tell him that they don't make bowriders with outboard motors
so he's stuck with an I/O.

3. Please inform both of us about the different types of motors
available for these things... so far i've found the 3.0L chrylser
based mercruiser in newer ones, and the 5.0L Chevy 305 in some of the
older ones.

i know that those old boats are probably made mostly out of steel, and
that they weigh a LOT compared to newer models. add to that the added
weight of the outdrive setup, and barring any sort of huge weight
difference(as the boats get newer), my guess is gonna be that the 3.0L
is gonna come up short on power.

but i guess the most important question that needs answering is...
what kinda power does it actually take to watertube?

to be able to hold its own against bigger boats?

can the square stroke and good low-end torque of a 305 allow you to
be conservative on gas for fishing? i think of it as a lot of
trolling, anchoring and killing the motor, and relatively minimal full
throttle time, making the difference in gas for a 5.0 Vs. a 3.0 pretty
negligible.. i don't want to buy an outrageously oversized motor
either, but i like to say it's better to have it and not need it then
to need it and not have it...


now for the "how to buy it" part...

i've read a lot about spotting problems with the hull, and the motor's
not a real issue, i can easily tell the good from the bad there...,
but the outdrive and steering mechanisms i haven't found good
information on....

i already run like hell away from the ones with lots of salt water
corrosion, but how about basic indicators on the condition of the
outdrive?

excess in/out play on the prop?

turning the prop? maybe that will allow me to hear worn bearings or
gear teeth?

things like that would be awesome...

HELP! what kind of boat and how to buy it...(kinda long, but worth it)
 

A smallish bowrider is really the ticket for what you want to do. The fact
that you aren't spending a lot of $$ on it makes it a good fishing boat as
well. Ask your dad, "what makes a good fishing boat?" Many will tell you
nothing less than a flat bottomed boat with a 250HP motor hanging off the
back, will do. That's a far cry from what your dad is looking at. :)

If fuel usage is a problem, it all depends on what you do. If he wants to
fish, then he motors out to where he wants to go, kills the engine, and
fishes. He won't be using much more fuel with a 190hp i/o or an 80hp
outboard. If you want to pull a tube or skier, then the fuel usage is yours
to contend with. Bottom line... without a ski pole or tower, any behind the
boat watersports will be problematic with an outboard.

All I can say is for you not to compromise. If the boat that you're 1/2
owner of can't do what you want it to do, you're just throwing money away,
and you'll be soured by the whole new boating experience. You'd be better
off to not get a boat at all. To put it another way, what your father wants
will not satisfy what you're looking for in a boat. What *you* are looking
for in a boat will be sufficient for both of your needs/wants. Seems like
a no brainer to me.

Good luck!

--Mike

"Chris Larocque" wrote in message
...
after seeing one local for sale that turned out to have a messed up
hull, my father and I decided to buy a boat. we haven't come up to an
agreement on what kind, because honestly we don't know enough. we're
going half on the purchase price so it's all about compomise here.
(we're looking at 17-21' and from the mid80's to early 90's)

My intention is tubing and general pleasure craft-type activities. a
buddy of mine has a 22 or 23' Cobalt bowrider and having the 2 boats
riding around the lake tubing and cruising is what i'm after. I would
also like to fish with this boat. so for me, a 17-20' bowrider with a
Inboard/Outboard is a compromise.


My father on the other hand wants to fish with it. he says that he
wants to cruise with it too, but we can't seem to agree, as he shows
me ads for these boats I call fishing boats. they're mostly outboards
(in the 80ish HP range) and don't appear to be worth anything as
pleasure boats. they look something like this

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1994-...QQcmdZViewItem


they look to him like they would make pleasure boats, but to me they
look like dhingys.

when i explain to him that the dinky outboard motors won't cut it as
pleasure boats and boats like that lack a proper place to hook a line
for tubing and also lack a teak-wood deck for getting in and out the
boat easily, i get an answer such as:

1. you can hook a skiier up to the hooks for tying the boat up, or
even more funny, you can drill into the fiberglass on the back and
mount one. i don't even think i need to explain what's wrong with
that.

2. as for no deck, you can also mount one. one that hangs over the
stern and mounts inside. and not really a deck either, more or less a
ladder.

since we're going half in on it, I honestly think that the design of
the type of boat my father is looking for isn't what both of us are
looking for. i don't see it being a compromise.


what I keep showing my father is something along this line...

http://newhaven.craigslist.org/boa/325479229.html

he says the 305ci in there is too big, and will eat gas. (he also
thinks that the I/O motor setup adds undue maintence and problems)
that's why he likes those dinky little outbards. i agree with him that
they're a pretty large motor, but the leap from fishing boat to
bowrider adds considerable heft to the weight of the boat


so the basic things a

1. please tell my father that a little fishing boat won't cut it for
all-around pleasure boating. (i constantly try to batter it into his
head that you can fish a bowrider, but you can't ride a fishing boat)


2. please tell him that they don't make bowriders with outboard motors
so he's stuck with an I/O.

3. Please inform both of us about the different types of motors
available for these things... so far i've found the 3.0L chrylser
based mercruiser in newer ones, and the 5.0L Chevy 305 in some of the
older ones.

i know that those old boats are probably made mostly out of steel, and
that they weigh a LOT compared to newer models. add to that the added
weight of the outdrive setup, and barring any sort of huge weight
difference(as the boats get newer), my guess is gonna be that the 3.0L
is gonna come up short on power.

but i guess the most important question that needs answering is...
what kinda power does it actually take to watertube?

to be able to hold its own against bigger boats?

can the square stroke and good low-end torque of a 305 allow you to
be conservative on gas for fishing? i think of it as a lot of
trolling, anchoring and killing the motor, and relatively minimal full
throttle time, making the difference in gas for a 5.0 Vs. a 3.0 pretty
negligible.. i don't want to buy an outrageously oversized motor
either, but i like to say it's better to have it and not need it then
to need it and not have it...


now for the "how to buy it" part...

i've read a lot about spotting problems with the hull, and the motor's
not a real issue, i can easily tell the good from the bad there...,
but the outdrive and steering mechanisms i haven't found good
information on....

i already run like hell away from the ones with lots of salt water
corrosion, but how about basic indicators on the condition of the
outdrive?

excess in/out play on the prop?

turning the prop? maybe that will allow me to hear worn bearings or
gear teeth?

things like that would be awesome...

HELP! what kind of boat and how to buy it...(kinda long, but worth it)
 

On Wed, 09 May 2007 00:57:02 -0400, Chris Larocque
wrote:

3. Please inform both of us about the different types of motors
available for these things... so far i've found the 3.0L chrylser
based mercruiser in newer ones, and the 5.0L Chevy 305 in some of the
older ones.

I'm going to tell both of you right off the bat that this arrangement
isn't going to work.

You both have completely different ideas and will never be happy with
a compromise boat.

He's insisting on one thing, you are insisting on another. One has
un-realistic expectations, the other not so much, but is still unaware
or unwilling to compromise.

Therefore - forget about a partnership - it will only cause the two of
you problems.

HELP! what kind of boat and how to buy it...(kinda long, but worth it)
 

You should get your own boat. What you want and what your father wants are
two different things. Fish-n-Ski boats are just boats that are not really
good at either.

"Chris Larocque" wrote in message
...
after seeing one local for sale that turned out to have a messed up
hull, my father and I decided to buy a boat. we haven't come up to an
agreement on what kind, because honestly we don't know enough. we're
going half on the purchase price so it's all about compomise here.
(we're looking at 17-21' and from the mid80's to early 90's)

My intention is tubing and general pleasure craft-type activities. a
buddy of mine has a 22 or 23' Cobalt bowrider and having the 2 boats
riding around the lake tubing and cruising is what i'm after. I would
also like to fish with this boat. so for me, a 17-20' bowrider with a
Inboard/Outboard is a compromise.


My father on the other hand wants to fish with it. he says that he
wants to cruise with it too, but we can't seem to agree, as he shows
me ads for these boats I call fishing boats. they're mostly outboards
(in the 80ish HP range) and don't appear to be worth anything as
pleasure boats. they look something like this

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1994-...QQcmdZViewItem


they look to him like they would make pleasure boats, but to me they
look like dhingys.

when i explain to him that the dinky outboard motors won't cut it as
pleasure boats and boats like that lack a proper place to hook a line
for tubing and also lack a teak-wood deck for getting in and out the
boat easily, i get an answer such as:

1. you can hook a skiier up to the hooks for tying the boat up, or
even more funny, you can drill into the fiberglass on the back and
mount one. i don't even think i need to explain what's wrong with
that.

2. as for no deck, you can also mount one. one that hangs over the
stern and mounts inside. and not really a deck either, more or less a
ladder.

since we're going half in on it, I honestly think that the design of
the type of boat my father is looking for isn't what both of us are
looking for. i don't see it being a compromise.


what I keep showing my father is something along this line...

http://newhaven.craigslist.org/boa/325479229.html

he says the 305ci in there is too big, and will eat gas. (he also
thinks that the I/O motor setup adds undue maintence and problems)
that's why he likes those dinky little outbards. i agree with him that
they're a pretty large motor, but the leap from fishing boat to
bowrider adds considerable heft to the weight of the boat


so the basic things a

1. please tell my father that a little fishing boat won't cut it for
all-around pleasure boating. (i constantly try to batter it into his
head that you can fish a bowrider, but you can't ride a fishing boat)


2. please tell him that they don't make bowriders with outboard motors
so he's stuck with an I/O.

3. Please inform both of us about the different types of motors
available for these things... so far i've found the 3.0L chrylser
based mercruiser in newer ones, and the 5.0L Chevy 305 in some of the
older ones.

i know that those old boats are probably made mostly out of steel, and
that they weigh a LOT compared to newer models. add to that the added
weight of the outdrive setup, and barring any sort of huge weight
difference(as the boats get newer), my guess is gonna be that the 3.0L
is gonna come up short on power.

but i guess the most important question that needs answering is...
what kinda power does it actually take to watertube?

to be able to hold its own against bigger boats?

can the square stroke and good low-end torque of a 305 allow you to
be conservative on gas for fishing? i think of it as a lot of
trolling, anchoring and killing the motor, and relatively minimal full
throttle time, making the difference in gas for a 5.0 Vs. a 3.0 pretty
negligible.. i don't want to buy an outrageously oversized motor
either, but i like to say it's better to have it and not need it then
to need it and not have it...


now for the "how to buy it" part...

i've read a lot about spotting problems with the hull, and the motor's
not a real issue, i can easily tell the good from the bad there...,
but the outdrive and steering mechanisms i haven't found good
information on....

i already run like hell away from the ones with lots of salt water
corrosion, but how about basic indicators on the condition of the
outdrive?

excess in/out play on the prop?

turning the prop? maybe that will allow me to hear worn bearings or
gear teeth?

things like that would be awesome...

HELP! what kind of boat and how to buy it...(kinda long, but worth it)
 

You should know that there are plenty of 16" to 18" bowriders out
there with outboards. Outboards also come in sizes far larger than
80HP. I personally do not think that an I/O is more maintenance than
an outboard, although they each have their pluses and minuses. The
boat that I currently own is a 19" cuddy cabin with a 3.0 L I/O. The
guy I bought it from had it set up for fishing on Lake Erie, with 8
pole holders mounted and the back seats removed, so apparently you can
sish from anything. I got the cuddy due to small grandchildren, but
doing it over a bowrider would be a better family boat. Once dad
sticks hooks all over all those plastic seats and gets fish guts all
over all that carpet though you will begin to understand the reason
for the design of bass boats ;-) (BTW where are you putting that live
well on that bowrider?)

Dave Hall

On Wed, 09 May 2007 00:57:02 -0400, Chris Larocque
wrote:

after seeing one local for sale that turned out to have a messed up
hull, my father and I decided to buy a boat. we haven't come up to an
agreement on what kind, because honestly we don't know enough. we're
going half on the purchase price so it's all about compomise here.
(we're looking at 17-21' and from the mid80's to early 90's)

My intention is tubing and general pleasure craft-type activities. a
buddy of mine has a 22 or 23' Cobalt bowrider and having the 2 boats
riding around the lake tubing and cruising is what i'm after. I would
also like to fish with this boat. so for me, a 17-20' bowrider with a
Inboard/Outboard is a compromise.


My father on the other hand wants to fish with it. he says that he
wants to cruise with it too, but we can't seem to agree, as he shows
me ads for these boats I call fishing boats. they're mostly outboards
(in the 80ish HP range) and don't appear to be worth anything as
pleasure boats. they look something like this

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1994-...QQcmdZViewItem


they look to him like they would make pleasure boats, but to me they
look like dhingys.

when i explain to him that the dinky outboard motors won't cut it as
pleasure boats and boats like that lack a proper place to hook a line
for tubing and also lack a teak-wood deck for getting in and out the
boat easily, i get an answer such as:

1. you can hook a skiier up to the hooks for tying the boat up, or
even more funny, you can drill into the fiberglass on the back and
mount one. i don't even think i need to explain what's wrong with
that.

2. as for no deck, you can also mount one. one that hangs over the
stern and mounts inside. and not really a deck either, more or less a
ladder.

since we're going half in on it, I honestly think that the design of
the type of boat my father is looking for isn't what both of us are
looking for. i don't see it being a compromise.


what I keep showing my father is something along this line...

http://newhaven.craigslist.org/boa/325479229.html

he says the 305ci in there is too big, and will eat gas. (he also
thinks that the I/O motor setup adds undue maintence and problems)
that's why he likes those dinky little outbards. i agree with him that
they're a pretty large motor, but the leap from fishing boat to
bowrider adds considerable heft to the weight of the boat


so the basic things a

1. please tell my father that a little fishing boat won't cut it for
all-around pleasure boating. (i constantly try to batter it into his
head that you can fish a bowrider, but you can't ride a fishing boat)


2. please tell him that they don't make bowriders with outboard motors
so he's stuck with an I/O.

3. Please inform both of us about the different types of motors
available for these things... so far i've found the 3.0L chrylser
based mercruiser in newer ones, and the 5.0L Chevy 305 in some of the
older ones.

i know that those old boats are probably made mostly out of steel, and
that they weigh a LOT compared to newer models. add to that the added
weight of the outdrive setup, and barring any sort of huge weight
difference(as the boats get newer), my guess is gonna be that the 3.0L
is gonna come up short on power.

but i guess the most important question that needs answering is...
what kinda power does it actually take to watertube?

to be able to hold its own against bigger boats?

can the square stroke and good low-end torque of a 305 allow you to
be conservative on gas for fishing? i think of it as a lot of
trolling, anchoring and killing the motor, and relatively minimal full
throttle time, making the difference in gas for a 5.0 Vs. a 3.0 pretty
negligible.. i don't want to buy an outrageously oversized motor
either, but i like to say it's better to have it and not need it then
to need it and not have it...


now for the "how to buy it" part...

i've read a lot about spotting problems with the hull, and the motor's
not a real issue, i can easily tell the good from the bad there...,
but the outdrive and steering mechanisms i haven't found good
information on....

i already run like hell away from the ones with lots of salt water
corrosion, but how about basic indicators on the condition of the
outdrive?

excess in/out play on the prop?

turning the prop? maybe that will allow me to hear worn bearings or
gear teeth?

things like that would be awesome...

HELP! what kind of boat and how to buy it...(kinda long, butworth it)
 

Chris Larocque wrote:
after seeing one local for sale that turned out to have a messed up
hull, my father and I decided to buy a boat. we haven't come up to an
agreement on what kind, because honestly we don't know enough.

Stop right there. People may be getting sick of me pushing this all the
time, but you and your father need to take a boating course - now! Find
and contact Power Squadron nearby by looking he
http://www.usps.org/cgi-bin/sfind.cgi

Among all the safety and piloting stuff - stuff that you absolutely
positively need to know - the course covers types of boats and their
uses, engine types and their advantages/disadvantages, as well as
watersports like tubing. Plus, if the two of you take the classes
together, it may help you reach a consensus. You'll also meet other
local boaters who may be able to help you through this.


I would
also like to fish with this boat. so for me, a 17-20' bowrider with a
Inboard/Outboard is a compromise.

My father on the other hand wants to fish with it. he says that he
wants to cruise with it too, but we can't seem to agree,

Your should also seriously consider the waters in which you will be
boating. On a small lake or calm inland waters a 17-20' boat may be
fine. Out on Long Island Sound or the Great Lakes or the ocean you may
find that a boat that small may not cut it except on the calmest of
days. As far as a bowrider vs a center console (which, from what you
describe, seems to be what your father would like, I have seen many a
bowrider used for fishing, and many a center console being used for
family fun and watersports.

when i explain to him that the dinky outboard motors won't cut it as
pleasure boats and boats like that lack a proper place to hook a line
for tubing

Not true - when an outboard is used for watersports the tow line
straddles the outboard. Many, many, many outboard boats are used for
watersports - it is not a problem.

and also lack a teak-wood deck for getting in and out the boat easily

Its called a swim platform if it spans the entire transom, and a swim
step if mounts on just a portion of the platform. They are also made of
fiberglass and sometimes plastic. Many outboard boats have swim steps
that can facilitate your watersports needs.

you can hook a skiier up to the hooks for tying the boat up

They are called "cleats".

even more funny, you can drill into the fiberglass on the back and
mount one. i don't even think i need to explain what's wrong with
that.

It is done all the time. Just make sure you are well above the
waterline and through-bolt to sturdy backplates.

since we're going half in on it, I honestly think that the design of
the type of boat my father is looking for isn't what both of us are
looking for. i don't see it being a compromise.

Keep looking (and take the course).


he says the 305ci in there is too big, and will eat gas. (he also
thinks that the I/O motor setup adds undue maintence and problems)
that's why he likes those dinky little outbards. i agree with him that
they're a pretty large motor, but the leap from fishing boat to
bowrider adds considerable heft to the weight of the boat

There are numerous advantages to outboards. He is also right that I/O's
have additional maintenance requirements. There are also advantages to
I/O's. Its not so simple. Also, gas usage will depend as much on usage
as it does on engine size/type. A motor that is too small and
constantly laboring could easily burn more fuel than a larger engine
that's purring easily along.


1. please tell my father that a little fishing boat won't cut it for
all-around pleasure boating. (i constantly try to batter it into his
head that you can fish a bowrider, but you can't ride a fishing boat)

That would be a lie.

2. please tell him that they don't make bowriders with outboard motors
so he's stuck with an I/O.

That would also be a lie.


i know that those old boats are probably made mostly out of steel

Most recreational boats have been made of fiberglass for decades. Prior
to that, wood.

my guess is gonna be that the 3.0L
is gonna come up short on power.

You'll do fine with a 3.0L on most 17-19 foot boats.

but i guess the most important question that needs answering is...
what kinda power does it actually take to watertube?

This depends on what boat you buy. I had a 16 foot with a 65 horse
outboard that was great for watersports. An 85 horse would probably
have been even better. Recently had a 19 foot bowrider with a 3.0L that
also did fine with a tube.

to be able to hold its own against bigger boats?

Please don't go boating with this attitude. You are not going to be
"against" anyone. Handling your boat in crowded waters is more a matter
of good seamanship. Take the course.


can the square stroke and good low-end torque of a 305 allow you to
be conservative on gas for fishing? i think of it as a lot of
trolling, anchoring and killing the motor, and relatively minimal full
throttle time

Many add small secondary trolling motors for use once they get to their
fishing spot.

i don't want to buy an outrageously oversized motor
either, but i like to say it's better to have it and not need it then
to need it and not have it...

Get the right sized motor for the boat you buy. Oversizing is overkill
and possibly dangerous. Check the boat's "Capacity Plate" - it will
tell you maximum power the boat can handle. Exceeding it is unlawful
and not very bright.


now for the "how to buy it" part...

Do yourself a favor and have the boat surveyed before you buy. You
can't check everything a surveyor checks. Worth the money.

And take a good boating course - NOW.

Larry Weiss
"...Ever After!"

HELP! what kind of boat and how to buy it...(kinda long, but worth it)
 

"Dave Hall" wrote in message
...
You should know that there are plenty of 16" to 18" bowriders out



Are we talking "model" boats here? 8) Sorry couldn't resist.





there with outboards. Outboards also come in sizes far larger than
80HP. I personally do not think that an I/O is more maintenance than
an outboard, although they each have their pluses and minuses. The
boat that I currently own is a 19" cuddy cabin with a 3.0 L I/O. The
guy I bought it from had it set up for fishing on Lake Erie, with 8
pole holders mounted and the back seats removed, so apparently you can
sish from anything. I got the cuddy due to small grandchildren, but
doing it over a bowrider would be a better family boat. Once dad
sticks hooks all over all those plastic seats and gets fish guts all
over all that carpet though you will begin to understand the reason
for the design of bass boats ;-) (BTW where are you putting that live
well on that bowrider?)

Dave Hall

On Wed, 09 May 2007 00:57:02 -0400, Chris Larocque
wrote:

after seeing one local for sale that turned out to have a messed up
hull, my father and I decided to buy a boat. we haven't come up to an
agreement on what kind, because honestly we don't know enough. we're
going half on the purchase price so it's all about compomise here.
(we're looking at 17-21' and from the mid80's to early 90's)

My intention is tubing and general pleasure craft-type activities. a
buddy of mine has a 22 or 23' Cobalt bowrider and having the 2 boats
riding around the lake tubing and cruising is what i'm after. I would
also like to fish with this boat. so for me, a 17-20' bowrider with a
Inboard/Outboard is a compromise.


My father on the other hand wants to fish with it. he says that he
wants to cruise with it too, but we can't seem to agree, as he shows
me ads for these boats I call fishing boats. they're mostly outboards
(in the 80ish HP range) and don't appear to be worth anything as
pleasure boats. they look something like this

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1994-...QQcmdZViewItem


they look to him like they would make pleasure boats, but to me they
look like dhingys.

when i explain to him that the dinky outboard motors won't cut it as
pleasure boats and boats like that lack a proper place to hook a line
for tubing and also lack a teak-wood deck for getting in and out the
boat easily, i get an answer such as:

1. you can hook a skiier up to the hooks for tying the boat up, or
even more funny, you can drill into the fiberglass on the back and
mount one. i don't even think i need to explain what's wrong with
that.

2. as for no deck, you can also mount one. one that hangs over the
stern and mounts inside. and not really a deck either, more or less a
ladder.

since we're going half in on it, I honestly think that the design of
the type of boat my father is looking for isn't what both of us are
looking for. i don't see it being a compromise.


what I keep showing my father is something along this line...

http://newhaven.craigslist.org/boa/325479229.html

he says the 305ci in there is too big, and will eat gas. (he also
thinks that the I/O motor setup adds undue maintence and problems)
that's why he likes those dinky little outbards. i agree with him that
they're a pretty large motor, but the leap from fishing boat to
bowrider adds considerable heft to the weight of the boat


so the basic things a

1. please tell my father that a little fishing boat won't cut it for
all-around pleasure boating. (i constantly try to batter it into his
head that you can fish a bowrider, but you can't ride a fishing boat)


2. please tell him that they don't make bowriders with outboard motors
so he's stuck with an I/O.

3. Please inform both of us about the different types of motors
available for these things... so far i've found the 3.0L chrylser
based mercruiser in newer ones, and the 5.0L Chevy 305 in some of the
older ones.

i know that those old boats are probably made mostly out of steel, and
that they weigh a LOT compared to newer models. add to that the added
weight of the outdrive setup, and barring any sort of huge weight
difference(as the boats get newer), my guess is gonna be that the 3.0L
is gonna come up short on power.

but i guess the most important question that needs answering is...
what kinda power does it actually take to watertube?

to be able to hold its own against bigger boats?

can the square stroke and good low-end torque of a 305 allow you to
be conservative on gas for fishing? i think of it as a lot of
trolling, anchoring and killing the motor, and relatively minimal full
throttle time, making the difference in gas for a 5.0 Vs. a 3.0 pretty
negligible.. i don't want to buy an outrageously oversized motor
either, but i like to say it's better to have it and not need it then
to need it and not have it...


now for the "how to buy it" part...

i've read a lot about spotting problems with the hull, and the motor's
not a real issue, i can easily tell the good from the bad there...,
but the outdrive and steering mechanisms i haven't found good
information on....

i already run like hell away from the ones with lots of salt water
corrosion, but how about basic indicators on the condition of the
outdrive?

excess in/out play on the prop?

turning the prop? maybe that will allow me to hear worn bearings or
gear teeth?

things like that would be awesome...

HELP! what kind of boat and how to buy it...(kinda long, but worth it)
 

On May 9, 12:57 am, Chris Larocque
wrote:

I hope you and your dad agree that you probably need two boats, or he
needs to fish off your pleasure boat. Anyway, it might help to know
more about where you are going to boat and fish. Your dad might be
able to get away with a big slow work skiff with a small outboard
while you get the pull boat.

HELP! what kind of boat and how to buy it...(kinda long, but worth it)
 

On Wed, 9 May 2007 10:36:08 -0400, "D.Duck" wrote:


"Dave Hall" wrote in message
.. .
You should know that there are plenty of 16" to 18" bowriders out



Are we talking "model" boats here? 8) Sorry couldn't resist.


I don't know why I hit the shift key on those...I did mean ' not "



there with outboards. Outboards also come in sizes far larger than
80HP. I personally do not think that an I/O is more maintenance than
an outboard, although they each have their pluses and minuses. The
boat that I currently own is a 19" cuddy cabin with a 3.0 L I/O. The
guy I bought it from had it set up for fishing on Lake Erie, with 8
pole holders mounted and the back seats removed, so apparently you can
sish from anything. I got the cuddy due to small grandchildren, but
doing it over a bowrider would be a better family boat. Once dad
sticks hooks all over all those plastic seats and gets fish guts all
over all that carpet though you will begin to understand the reason
for the design of bass boats ;-) (BTW where are you putting that live
well on that bowrider?)

Dave Hall

On Wed, 09 May 2007 00:57:02 -0400, Chris Larocque
wrote:

after seeing one local for sale that turned out to have a messed up
hull, my father and I decided to buy a boat. we haven't come up to an
agreement on what kind, because honestly we don't know enough. we're
going half on the purchase price so it's all about compomise here.
(we're looking at 17-21' and from the mid80's to early 90's)

My intention is tubing and general pleasure craft-type activities. a
buddy of mine has a 22 or 23' Cobalt bowrider and having the 2 boats
riding around the lake tubing and cruising is what i'm after. I would
also like to fish with this boat. so for me, a 17-20' bowrider with a
Inboard/Outboard is a compromise.


My father on the other hand wants to fish with it. he says that he
wants to cruise with it too, but we can't seem to agree, as he shows
me ads for these boats I call fishing boats. they're mostly outboards
(in the 80ish HP range) and don't appear to be worth anything as
pleasure boats. they look something like this

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1994-...QQcmdZViewItem


they look to him like they would make pleasure boats, but to me they
look like dhingys.

when i explain to him that the dinky outboard motors won't cut it as
pleasure boats and boats like that lack a proper place to hook a line
for tubing and also lack a teak-wood deck for getting in and out the
boat easily, i get an answer such as:

1. you can hook a skiier up to the hooks for tying the boat up, or
even more funny, you can drill into the fiberglass on the back and
mount one. i don't even think i need to explain what's wrong with
that.

2. as for no deck, you can also mount one. one that hangs over the
stern and mounts inside. and not really a deck either, more or less a
ladder.

since we're going half in on it, I honestly think that the design of
the type of boat my father is looking for isn't what both of us are
looking for. i don't see it being a compromise.


what I keep showing my father is something along this line...

http://newhaven.craigslist.org/boa/325479229.html

he says the 305ci in there is too big, and will eat gas. (he also
thinks that the I/O motor setup adds undue maintence and problems)
that's why he likes those dinky little outbards. i agree with him that
they're a pretty large motor, but the leap from fishing boat to
bowrider adds considerable heft to the weight of the boat


so the basic things a

1. please tell my father that a little fishing boat won't cut it for
all-around pleasure boating. (i constantly try to batter it into his
head that you can fish a bowrider, but you can't ride a fishing boat)


2. please tell him that they don't make bowriders with outboard motors
so he's stuck with an I/O.

3. Please inform both of us about the different types of motors
available for these things... so far i've found the 3.0L chrylser
based mercruiser in newer ones, and the 5.0L Chevy 305 in some of the
older ones.

i know that those old boats are probably made mostly out of steel, and
that they weigh a LOT compared to newer models. add to that the added
weight of the outdrive setup, and barring any sort of huge weight
difference(as the boats get newer), my guess is gonna be that the 3.0L
is gonna come up short on power.

but i guess the most important question that needs answering is...
what kinda power does it actually take to watertube?

to be able to hold its own against bigger boats?

can the square stroke and good low-end torque of a 305 allow you to
be conservative on gas for fishing? i think of it as a lot of
trolling, anchoring and killing the motor, and relatively minimal full
throttle time, making the difference in gas for a 5.0 Vs. a 3.0 pretty
negligible.. i don't want to buy an outrageously oversized motor
either, but i like to say it's better to have it and not need it then
to need it and not have it...


now for the "how to buy it" part...

i've read a lot about spotting problems with the hull, and the motor's
not a real issue, i can easily tell the good from the bad there...,
but the outdrive and steering mechanisms i haven't found good
information on....

i already run like hell away from the ones with lots of salt water
corrosion, but how about basic indicators on the condition of the
outdrive?

excess in/out play on the prop?

turning the prop? maybe that will allow me to hear worn bearings or
gear teeth?

things like that would be awesome...

HELP! what kind of boat and how to buy it...(kinda long, but worth it)
 

"Chris Larocque" wrote in message
...
after seeing one local for sale that turned out to have a messed up
hull, my father and I decided to buy a boat. we haven't come up to an
agreement on what kind, because honestly we don't know enough. we're
going half on the purchase price so it's all about compomise here.
(we're looking at 17-21' and from the mid80's to early 90's)

My intention is tubing and general pleasure craft-type activities. a
buddy of mine has a 22 or 23' Cobalt bowrider and having the 2 boats
riding around the lake tubing and cruising is what i'm after. I would
also like to fish with this boat. so for me, a 17-20' bowrider with a
Inboard/Outboard is a compromise.


My father on the other hand wants to fish with it. he says that he
wants to cruise with it too, but we can't seem to agree, as he shows
me ads for these boats I call fishing boats. they're mostly outboards
(in the 80ish HP range) and don't appear to be worth anything as
pleasure boats. they look something like this

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1994-...QQcmdZViewItem



FYI 115hp on 19 foot aluminum boat, this boat will FLY! You would not
only be able to tube but water-ski as well, warning a good water skier will
pull the backend of this boat all over the water. But you are correct for
taking a family or your friends out for a Sunday on the lake - this is not
what you have in mind.

If you and your fathers ideas are that far apart - do not try to do a
partnership with him. A bow rider would probably be to big for him to
launch so he wouldn't use it. An open aluminum boat would not be big enough
for you to relax in, so you wouldn't use it.

My suggestion, a fish and ski, first search:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/W-VID...spagenameZWDVW

You want over 100 hp, your dad is correct an outboard is usually cheaper to
have repaired and less maintenance if you trailer it. An I/o uses less gas,
but the new outboards are a lot more efficient. When you pull it out the
water drains out so you don't have to mess with draining the block.