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More gas on gas
On Sun, 23 Apr 2006 19:01:23 -0400, Harry Krause
wrote more political bull**** which was deleted: You're trying, Harry. Hopefully enough folks will realize just what you're trying to do. -- 'Til next time, John H ****************************************** ***** Have a Spectacular Day! ***** ****************************************** |
More gas on gas
JohnH wrote: On Sun, 23 Apr 2006 19:01:23 -0400, Harry Krause wrote more political bull**** which was deleted: You're trying, Harry. Hopefully enough folks will realize just what you're trying to do. -- 'Til next time, John H ****************************************** ***** Have a Spectacular Day! ***** ****************************************** Don't worry. Enough folks already know what Harry and the rest of you socialist Demoncraps are trying to do. Till |
More gas on gas
"tillius" wrote in message
oups.com... JohnH wrote: On Sun, 23 Apr 2006 19:01:23 -0400, Harry Krause wrote more political bull**** which was deleted: You're trying, Harry. Hopefully enough folks will realize just what you're trying to do. -- 'Til next time, John H ****************************************** ***** Have a Spectacular Day! ***** ****************************************** Don't worry. Enough folks already know what Harry and the rest of you socialist Demoncraps are trying to do. Till Your timing is excellent. Just today, I was wondering "What's a socialist?" Maybe you can tell me, since you just used the word. |
More gas on gas
"tillius" wrote in message oups.com... JohnH wrote: On Sun, 23 Apr 2006 19:01:23 -0400, Harry Krause wrote more political bull**** which was deleted: You're trying, Harry. Hopefully enough folks will realize just what you're trying to do. -- 'Til next time, John H ****************************************** ***** Have a Spectacular Day! ***** ****************************************** Don't worry. Enough folks already know what Harry and the rest of you socialist Demoncraps are trying to do. Till Till, I've been a republican, a democrat, a libertarian, and an independent. I vote the issue and the man, not the party. Please leave the name calling for another group. |
More gas on gas
"Bryan" wrote in message . net... "tillius" wrote in message oups.com... JohnH wrote: On Sun, 23 Apr 2006 19:01:23 -0400, Harry Krause wrote more political bull**** which was deleted: You're trying, Harry. Hopefully enough folks will realize just what you're trying to do. -- 'Til next time, John H ****************************************** ***** Have a Spectacular Day! ***** ****************************************** Don't worry. Enough folks already know what Harry and the rest of you socialist Demoncraps are trying to do. Till Till, I've been a republican, a democrat, a libertarian, and an independent. I vote the issue and the man, not the party. Please leave the name calling for another group. "I'm a WAR president!" |
More gas on gas
"Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "Bryan" wrote in message . net... "tillius" wrote in message oups.com... JohnH wrote: On Sun, 23 Apr 2006 19:01:23 -0400, Harry Krause wrote more political bull**** which was deleted: You're trying, Harry. Hopefully enough folks will realize just what you're trying to do. -- 'Til next time, John H ****************************************** ***** Have a Spectacular Day! ***** ****************************************** Don't worry. Enough folks already know what Harry and the rest of you socialist Demoncraps are trying to do. Till Till, I've been a republican, a democrat, a libertarian, and an independent. I vote the issue and the man, not the party. Please leave the name calling for another group. "I'm a WAR president!" LOL! Thanks, you're sending me to the airport with a smile on my face. |
More gas on gas
Bryan wrote: "tillius" wrote in message oups.com... JohnH wrote: On Sun, 23 Apr 2006 19:01:23 -0400, Harry Krause wrote more political bull**** which was deleted: You're trying, Harry. Hopefully enough folks will realize just what you're trying to do. -- 'Til next time, John H ****************************************** ***** Have a Spectacular Day! ***** ****************************************** Don't worry. Enough folks already know what Harry and the rest of you socialist Demoncraps are trying to do. Till Till, I've been a republican, a democrat, a libertarian, and an independent. I vote the issue and the man, not the party. Please leave the name calling for another group. Sorry Bryan, but as much as you may be interested in the man and the issue, Harry is only interested in Bush bashing and conservative bashing (not that Bush is behaving all that conservative these days). Harry's the reason I be inactive in this group in the first place, and I come back TODAY and the first thing I see is his OT political post, thinly disquised as conserns over gas. Till |
More gas on gas
Doug Kanter wrote: "tillius" wrote in message oups.com... JohnH wrote: On Sun, 23 Apr 2006 19:01:23 -0400, Harry Krause wrote more political bull**** which was deleted: You're trying, Harry. Hopefully enough folks will realize just what you're trying to do. -- 'Til next time, John H ****************************************** ***** Have a Spectacular Day! ***** ****************************************** Don't worry. Enough folks already know what Harry and the rest of you socialist Demoncraps are trying to do. Till Your timing is excellent. Just today, I was wondering "What's a socialist?" Maybe you can tell me, since you just used the word. It's what the leftist don't like being called but what they really are. |
More gas on gas
"tillius" wrote in message oups.com... Doug Kanter wrote: "tillius" wrote in message oups.com... JohnH wrote: On Sun, 23 Apr 2006 19:01:23 -0400, Harry Krause wrote more political bull**** which was deleted: You're trying, Harry. Hopefully enough folks will realize just what you're trying to do. -- 'Til next time, John H ****************************************** ***** Have a Spectacular Day! ***** ****************************************** Don't worry. Enough folks already know what Harry and the rest of you socialist Demoncraps are trying to do. Till Your timing is excellent. Just today, I was wondering "What's a socialist?" Maybe you can tell me, since you just used the word. It's what the leftist don't like being called but what they really are. Just as I thought. You didn't know what it meant, either. |
More gas on gas
"Bryan" wrote in message . net... "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "Bryan" wrote in message . net... "tillius" wrote in message oups.com... JohnH wrote: On Sun, 23 Apr 2006 19:01:23 -0400, Harry Krause wrote more political bull**** which was deleted: You're trying, Harry. Hopefully enough folks will realize just what you're trying to do. -- 'Til next time, John H ****************************************** ***** Have a Spectacular Day! ***** ****************************************** Don't worry. Enough folks already know what Harry and the rest of you socialist Demoncraps are trying to do. Till Till, I've been a republican, a democrat, a libertarian, and an independent. I vote the issue and the man, not the party. Please leave the name calling for another group. "I'm a WAR president!" LOL! Thanks, you're sending me to the airport with a smile on my face. I didn't want to call him any more names tonight. So, I thought I'd just remind you in an indirect way that your president was a omplete ------- -----. |
More gas on gas
tillius wrote:
Don't worry. Enough folks already know what Harry and the rest of you socialist Demoncraps are trying to do. Till Like maybe.. save your country and your sorry *ss for you? |
More gas on gas
"Harry Krause" wrote in message . .. tillius wrote: Doug Kanter wrote: "tillius" wrote in message oups.com... JohnH wrote: On Sun, 23 Apr 2006 19:01:23 -0400, Harry Krause wrote more political bull**** which was deleted: You're trying, Harry. Hopefully enough folks will realize just what you're trying to do. -- 'Til next time, John H ****************************************** ***** Have a Spectacular Day! ***** ****************************************** Don't worry. Enough folks already know what Harry and the rest of you socialist Demoncraps are trying to do. Till Your timing is excellent. Just today, I was wondering "What's a socialist?" Maybe you can tell me, since you just used the word. It's what the leftist don't like being called but what they really are. Ahhh. The intellectually based response. If there really is a heaven, I hope Karl Marx is laughing his ass off because the number of incorrect uses of the word "socialist". |
More gas on gas
Hey, even the Faux News poll has their boy down at 33%. That's just fascinating. Yale / M.D. / lobster boat. Yes, very fascinating. |
More gas on gas
"Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "Harry Krause" wrote in message . .. tillius wrote: Doug Kanter wrote: "tillius" wrote in message oups.com... JohnH wrote: On Sun, 23 Apr 2006 19:01:23 -0400, Harry Krause wrote more political bull**** which was deleted: You're trying, Harry. Hopefully enough folks will realize just what you're trying to do. -- 'Til next time, John H ****************************************** ***** Have a Spectacular Day! ***** ****************************************** Don't worry. Enough folks already know what Harry and the rest of you socialist Demoncraps are trying to do. Till Your timing is excellent. Just today, I was wondering "What's a socialist?" Maybe you can tell me, since you just used the word. It's what the leftist don't like being called but what they really are. Ahhh. The intellectually based response. If there really is a heaven, I hope Karl Marx is laughing his ass off because the number of incorrect uses of the word "socialist". You think Karl Marx went to heaven? ..... oh ... wait ... maybe I am thinking of Stalin. RCE |
More gas on gas
"RCE" wrote in message ... Don't worry. Enough folks already know what Harry and the rest of you socialist Demoncraps are trying to do. Till Your timing is excellent. Just today, I was wondering "What's a socialist?" Maybe you can tell me, since you just used the word. It's what the leftist don't like being called but what they really are. Ahhh. The intellectually based response. If there really is a heaven, I hope Karl Marx is laughing his ass off because the number of incorrect uses of the word "socialist". You think Karl Marx went to heaven? ..... oh ... wait ... maybe I am thinking of Stalin. RCE That's a common mistake. Yu whented to collage, rite? U no about Marks. |
Peak Oil - counterargument
Again, stolen from another NG, the following is a portion of an article
published in the "Economist". It seems to refute some of the Peak Oil doom and gloom arguments. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- There was an article in the latest Economist about this. Here's a little of it: "The notion of a sharp global peak in production does not withstand scrutiny, either. CERA's Peter Jackson points out that the price signals that would surely foreshadow any "peak" would encourage efficiency, promote new oil discoveries and speed investments in alternatives to oil. That, he reckons, means the metaphor of a peak is misleading: "The right picture is of an undulating plateau." What of the notion that oil scarcity will lead to economic disaster? Jerry Taylor and Peter Van Doren of the Cato Institute, an American think-tank, insist the key is to avoid the price controls and monetary-policy blunders of the sort that turned the 1970s oil shocks into economic disasters. Kenneth Rogoff, a Harvard professor and the former chief economist of the IMF, thinks concerns about peak oil are greatly overblown: "The oil market is highly developed, with worldwide trading and long-dated futures going out five to seven years. As oil production slows, prices will rise up and down the futures curve, stimulating new technology and conservation. We might be running low on $20 oil, but for $60 we have adequate oil supplies for decades to come." The other worry of pessimists is that alternatives to oil simply cannot be brought online fast enough to compensate for oil's imminent decline. If the peak were a cliff or if it arrived soon, this would certainly be true, since alternative fuels have only a tiny global market share today (though they are quite big in markets, such as ethanol-mad Brazil, that have favourable policies). But if the peak were to come after 2020 or 2030, as the International Energy Agency and other mainstream forecasters predict, then the rising tide of alternative fuels will help transform it into a plateau and ease the transition to life after oil. The best reason to think so comes from the radical transformation now taking place among big oil firms. The global oil industry, argues Chevron, is changing from "an exploration business to a manufacturing business". To see what that means, consider the surprising outcome of another great motorcar race. In March, at the Sebring test track in Florida, a sleek Audi prototype R-10 became the first diesel-powered car to win an endurance race, pipping a field of petrol-powered rivals to the post. What makes this tale extraordinary is that the diesel used by the Audi was not made in the normal way, exclusively from petroleum. Instead, Shell blended conventional diesel with a super-clean and super-powerful new form of diesel made from natural gas (with the clunky name of gas-to-liquids, or GTL). Several big GTL projects are under way in Qatar, where the North gas field is perhaps twice the size of even Ghawar when measured in terms of the energy it contains. Nigeria and others are also pursuing GTL. Since the world has far more natural gas left than oil-much of it outside the Middle East-making fuel in this way would greatly increase the world's remaining supplies of oil. So, too, would blending petrol or diesel with ethanol and biodiesel made from agricultural crops, or with fuel made from Canada's "tar sands" or America's shale oil. Using technology invented in Nazi Germany and perfected by South Africa's Sasol when those countries were under oil embargoes, companies are now also investing furiously to convert not only natural gas but also coal into a liquid fuel. Daniel Yergin of CERA says "the very definition of oil is changing, since non-conventional oil becomes conventional over time." Alternative fuels will not become common overnight, as one veteran oilman acknowledges: "Given the capital-intensity of manufacturing alternatives, it's now a race between hydrocarbon depletion and making fuel." But the recent rise in oil prices has given investors confidence. As Peter Robertson, vice-chairman of Chevron, puts it, "Price is our friend here, because it has encouraged investment in new hydrocarbons and also the alternatives." Unless the world sees another OPEC-engineered price collapse as it did in 1985 and 1998, GTL, tar sands, ethanol and other alternatives will become more economic by the day (see chart 2). This is not to suggest that the big firms are retreating from their core business. They are pushing ahead with these investments mainly because they cannot get access to new oil in the Middle East: "We need all the molecules we can get our hands on," says one oilman. It cannot have escaped the attention of oilmen that blending alternative fuels into petrol and diesel will conveniently reinforce oil's grip on transport. But their work contains the risk that one of the upstart fuels could yet provide a radical breakthrough that sidelines oil altogether. If you doubt the power of technology or the potential of unconventional fuels, visit the Kern River oil field near Bakersfield, California. This super-giant field is part of a cluster that has been pumping out oil for more than 100 years. It has already produced 2 billion barrels of oil, but has perhaps as much again left. The trouble is that it contains extremely heavy oil, which is very difficult and costly to extract. After other companies despaired of the field, Chevron brought Kern back from the brink. Applying a sophisticated steam-injection process, the firm has increased its output beyond the anticipated peak. Using a great deal of automation (each engineer looks after 1,000 small wells drilled into the reservoir), the firm has transformed a process of "flying blind" into one where wells "practically monitor themselves and call when they need help". The good news is that this is not unique. China also has deposits of heavy oil that would benefit from such an advanced approach. America, Canada and Venezuela have deposits of heavy hydrocarbons that surpass even the Saudi oil reserves in size. The Saudis have invited Chevron to apply its steam-injection techniques to recover heavy oil in the neutral zone that the country shares with Kuwait. Mr Naimi, the oil minister, recently estimated that this new technology would lift the share of the reserve that could be recovered as useful oil from a pitiful 6% to above 40%. All this explains why, in the words of Exxon Mobil, the oil production peak is unlikely "for decades to come". Governments may decide to shift away from petroleum because of its nasty geopolitics or its contribution to global warming. But it is wrong to imagine the world's addiction to oil will end soon, as a result of genuine scarcity. As Western oil companies seek to cope with being locked out of the Middle East, the new era of manufactured fuel will further delay the onset of peak production. The irony would be if manufactured fuel also did something far more dramatic-if it served as a bridge to whatever comes beyond the nexus of petrol and the internal combustion engine that for a century has held the world in its grip." '''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' ''''''''''''''' These words of encouragement brought to you by RCE |
More gas on gas
"William Bruce" wrote in message ... Hey, even the Faux News poll has their boy down at 33%. That's just fascinating. Yale / M.D. / lobster boat. Yes, very fascinating. What's that got to do with the fact that the Faux News poll says exactly what Harry pointed out? |
Peak Oil - counterargument
"RCE" wrote in message
... Again, stolen from another NG, the following is a portion of an article published in the "Economist". It seems to refute some of the Peak Oil doom and gloom arguments. The hell with "the peak". How about just doing our part to lower prices? Or, are Americans too friggin' busy, lazy or stupid to make the effort? |
Peak Oil - counterargument
"Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "RCE" wrote in message ... Again, stolen from another NG, the following is a portion of an article published in the "Economist". It seems to refute some of the Peak Oil doom and gloom arguments. The hell with "the peak". How about just doing our part to lower prices? Or, are Americans too friggin' busy, lazy or stupid to make the effort? Like the Meatloaf song from the '70's says, "2 out of 3 ain't bad." --- humor |
More gas on gas
"Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "Bryan" wrote in message . net... "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "Bryan" wrote in message . net... "tillius" wrote in message oups.com... JohnH wrote: On Sun, 23 Apr 2006 19:01:23 -0400, Harry Krause wrote more political bull**** which was deleted: You're trying, Harry. Hopefully enough folks will realize just what you're trying to do. -- 'Til next time, John H ****************************************** ***** Have a Spectacular Day! ***** ****************************************** Don't worry. Enough folks already know what Harry and the rest of you socialist Demoncraps are trying to do. Till Till, I've been a republican, a democrat, a libertarian, and an independent. I vote the issue and the man, not the party. Please leave the name calling for another group. "I'm a WAR president!" LOL! Thanks, you're sending me to the airport with a smile on my face. I didn't want to call him any more names tonight. So, I thought I'd just remind you in an indirect way that your president was a mplete ------- -----. Doug, I'm back from the airport, the kids are tucked in and sleeping like logs, and I'm confused. When did he become MY president? Is what we have here, a failure to communicate? |
More gas on gas
"tillius" wrote in message oups.com... Bryan wrote: "tillius" wrote in message oups.com... JohnH wrote: On Sun, 23 Apr 2006 19:01:23 -0400, Harry Krause wrote more political bull**** which was deleted: You're trying, Harry. Hopefully enough folks will realize just what you're trying to do. -- 'Til next time, John H ****************************************** ***** Have a Spectacular Day! ***** ****************************************** Don't worry. Enough folks already know what Harry and the rest of you socialist Demoncraps are trying to do. Till Till, I've been a republican, a democrat, a libertarian, and an independent. I vote the issue and the man, not the party. Please leave the name calling for another group. Sorry Bryan, but as much as you may be interested in the man and the issue, Harry is only interested in Bush bashing and conservative bashing (not that Bush is behaving all that conservative these days). Harry's the reason I be inactive in this group in the first place, and I come back TODAY and the first thing I see is his OT political post, thinly disquised as conserns over gas. Till Thanks Till. I understand. It's just that I enjoy these discussions. They're actually interesting until they ... |
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On Mon, 24 Apr 2006 01:26:52 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote: "tillius" wrote in message roups.com... JohnH wrote: On Sun, 23 Apr 2006 19:01:23 -0400, Harry Krause wrote more political bull**** which was deleted: You're trying, Harry. Hopefully enough folks will realize just what you're trying to do. -- 'Til next time, John H ****************************************** ***** Have a Spectacular Day! ***** ****************************************** Don't worry. Enough folks already know what Harry and the rest of you socialist Demoncraps are trying to do. Till Your timing is excellent. Just today, I was wondering "What's a socialist?" Maybe you can tell me, since you just used the word. He obviously knows, 'cause he called *me* one! -- 'Til next time, John H ****************************************** ***** Have a Spectacular Day! ***** ****************************************** |
More gas on gas
On Mon, 24 Apr 2006 06:25:44 GMT, "Bryan" wrote:
"Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "Bryan" wrote in message . net... "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "Bryan" wrote in message . net... "tillius" wrote in message oups.com... JohnH wrote: On Sun, 23 Apr 2006 19:01:23 -0400, Harry Krause wrote more political bull**** which was deleted: You're trying, Harry. Hopefully enough folks will realize just what you're trying to do. -- 'Til next time, John H ****************************************** ***** Have a Spectacular Day! ***** ****************************************** Don't worry. Enough folks already know what Harry and the rest of you socialist Demoncraps are trying to do. Till Till, I've been a republican, a democrat, a libertarian, and an independent. I vote the issue and the man, not the party. Please leave the name calling for another group. "I'm a WAR president!" LOL! Thanks, you're sending me to the airport with a smile on my face. I didn't want to call him any more names tonight. So, I thought I'd just remind you in an indirect way that your president was a mplete ------- -----. Doug, I'm back from the airport, the kids are tucked in and sleeping like logs, and I'm confused. When did he become MY president? Is what we have here, a failure to communicate? That's been Doug's banner for years. He uses it to sucker folks into political flaming wars along with Harry. Most of us are learning better. -- 'Til next time, John H ****************************************** ***** Have a Spectacular Day! ***** ****************************************** |
More gas on gas
On Mon, 24 Apr 2006 02:13:10 GMT, Don White wrote:
tillius wrote: Don't worry. Enough folks already know what Harry and the rest of you socialist Demoncraps are trying to do. Till Like maybe.. save your country and your sorry *ss for you? Don, if the US had a severe shortage of gas, would Canada not be affected? -- 'Til next time, John H ****************************************** ***** Have a Spectacular Day! ***** ****************************************** |
Peak Oil - counterargument
"Bryan" wrote in message . com... "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "RCE" wrote in message ... Again, stolen from another NG, the following is a portion of an article published in the "Economist". It seems to refute some of the Peak Oil doom and gloom arguments. The hell with "the peak". How about just doing our part to lower prices? Or, are Americans too friggin' busy, lazy or stupid to make the effort? Like the Meatloaf song from the '70's says, "2 out of 3 ain't bad." --- humor The real problem is one of religion, Bryan. In this great country, cars occupy almost mythical status in the mind of the consumer. Point out a bad purchase decision and it generates a level of animosity that makes the Catholic/Protestant dispute in N. Ireland look like a friendly game of "go fish". I'm not aware of any other product like this. |
More gas on gas
"JohnH" wrote in message
... On Mon, 24 Apr 2006 01:26:52 GMT, "Doug Kanter" wrote: "tillius" wrote in message groups.com... JohnH wrote: On Sun, 23 Apr 2006 19:01:23 -0400, Harry Krause wrote more political bull**** which was deleted: You're trying, Harry. Hopefully enough folks will realize just what you're trying to do. -- 'Til next time, John H ****************************************** ***** Have a Spectacular Day! ***** ****************************************** Don't worry. Enough folks already know what Harry and the rest of you socialist Demoncraps are trying to do. Till Your timing is excellent. Just today, I was wondering "What's a socialist?" Maybe you can tell me, since you just used the word. He obviously knows, 'cause he called *me* one! John H You're in the club now, too?!? :-) I may as well call you an ophthalmologist. |
More gas on gas
"Bryan" wrote in message . com... "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "Bryan" wrote in message . net... "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "Bryan" wrote in message . net... "tillius" wrote in message oups.com... JohnH wrote: On Sun, 23 Apr 2006 19:01:23 -0400, Harry Krause wrote more political bull**** which was deleted: You're trying, Harry. Hopefully enough folks will realize just what you're trying to do. -- 'Til next time, John H ****************************************** ***** Have a Spectacular Day! ***** ****************************************** Don't worry. Enough folks already know what Harry and the rest of you socialist Demoncraps are trying to do. Till Till, I've been a republican, a democrat, a libertarian, and an independent. I vote the issue and the man, not the party. Please leave the name calling for another group. "I'm a WAR president!" LOL! Thanks, you're sending me to the airport with a smile on my face. I didn't want to call him any more names tonight. So, I thought I'd just remind you in an indirect way that your president was a plete ------- -----. Doug, I'm back from the airport, the kids are tucked in and sleeping like logs, and I'm confused. When did he become MY president? Is what we have here, a failure to communicate? Did you vote for him? |
More gas on gas
"JohnH" wrote in message
... Doug, I'm back from the airport, the kids are tucked in and sleeping like logs, and I'm confused. When did he become MY president? Is what we have here, a failure to communicate? That's been Doug's banner for years. He uses it to sucker folks into political flaming wars along with Harry. Most of us are learning better. John H John, do you have a refrigerator in your kitchen? Is it yours, or mine? |
Peak Oil - counterargument
"Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... The real problem is one of religion, Bryan. In this great country, cars occupy almost mythical status in the mind of the consumer. And I see absolutely nothing wrong with that. It's part of the American culture. This is the alternative: http://www.thatvideosite.com/view/2052.html RCE |
Peak Oil - counterargument
"Harry Krause" wrote in message ... RCE wrote: "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... The real problem is one of religion, Bryan. In this great country, cars occupy almost mythical status in the mind of the consumer. And I see absolutely nothing wrong with that. It's part of the American culture. This is the alternative: http://www.thatvideosite.com/view/2052.html RCE What's wrong with the alternative? Because they are not a solution. They are a symbolic statement, which is fine if that's what floats your boat. I don't care where fuel prices are, the NEXT car we buy will be a high MPG vehicle. And mine will probably be a low MPG vehicle that I drive less often. What's the difference? RCE |
Peak Oil - counterargument
"RCE" wrote in message
... "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... The real problem is one of religion, Bryan. In this great country, cars occupy almost mythical status in the mind of the consumer. And I see absolutely nothing wrong with that. It's part of the American culture. You've just proven my point. "Someone else can deal with the problem. I'm too busy or stupid". |
Peak Oil - counterargument
"RCE" wrote in message
... "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... RCE wrote: "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... The real problem is one of religion, Bryan. In this great country, cars occupy almost mythical status in the mind of the consumer. And I see absolutely nothing wrong with that. It's part of the American culture. This is the alternative: http://www.thatvideosite.com/view/2052.html RCE What's wrong with the alternative? Because they are not a solution. They are a symbolic statement, which is fine if that's what floats your boat. So, in between an Escalade and a hybird, there are no in-between solutions? |
Peak Oil - counterargument
"Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "RCE" wrote in message ... "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... RCE wrote: "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... The real problem is one of religion, Bryan. In this great country, cars occupy almost mythical status in the mind of the consumer. And I see absolutely nothing wrong with that. It's part of the American culture. This is the alternative: http://www.thatvideosite.com/view/2052.html RCE What's wrong with the alternative? Because they are not a solution. They are a symbolic statement, which is fine if that's what floats your boat. So, in between an Escalade and a hybird, there are no in-between solutions? Yes, common sense. If hybrids and being politically correct floats your boat, do so without preaching. If an Escalade floats your boat, do so, responsibly. The same applies for everything in between. RCE |
Peak Oil - counterargument
"RCE" wrote in message ... "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "RCE" wrote in message ... "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... RCE wrote: "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... The real problem is one of religion, Bryan. In this great country, cars occupy almost mythical status in the mind of the consumer. And I see absolutely nothing wrong with that. It's part of the American culture. This is the alternative: http://www.thatvideosite.com/view/2052.html RCE What's wrong with the alternative? Because they are not a solution. They are a symbolic statement, which is fine if that's what floats your boat. So, in between an Escalade and a hybird, there are no in-between solutions? Yes, common sense. If hybrids and being politically correct floats your boat, do so without preaching. You are very defensive about all this. It's not absolutely NOTHING to do with being politically correct. Nada. Zip. If an Escalade floats your boat, do so, responsibly. The same applies for everything in between. Correct. It applies to everything in between. But, if your daily routine (work, shopping) can't be altered, and sometimes it can't, there is a floor - a minimum below which you cannot go, in terms of using a vehicle. I have a question for you. Do you believe that to an extent, the prices of commodities are determined by demand? |
Peak Oil - counterargument
"Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "RCE" wrote in message ... "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... The real problem is one of religion, Bryan. In this great country, cars occupy almost mythical status in the mind of the consumer. And I see absolutely nothing wrong with that. It's part of the American culture. You've just proven my point. "Someone else can deal with the problem. I'm too busy or stupid". If I truly believed that a 40 mpg hybrid in every garage would solve the problem, I'd listen. But, I am of the belief that they won't. They are a nothing but an admirable but symbolic gesture in the bigger scheme of things, IMOH. I respect those that feel good about themselves owning and driving one, but to think they are making a significant difference is being blind-sighted. You know, everytime something that our culture traditionally enjoys is found to be bad for the environment or is wasteful or is deemed not appropriate by some, the answer is to ban them. Why not investigate ways that they can continue to be enjoyed by those that do while addressing the offending problems? RCE |
Peak Oil - counterargument
Here's another thought exercise for you. Don't debate each point which
begins with an asterisk. They're true. Wait for the question at the end. * It requires energy to build everything, including cars. * By nature of their design & manufacturing details, some cars are more expendable than others. Therefore, their early demise and replacement represents an earlier requirement for more energy use. * Careful with this one: Regardless of the type of vehicle, some are made more expendable due to the actions of the people who buy them. This is the question: What could consumers do to reduce the tendency of vehicles to be more quickly expendable? |
Peak Oil - counterargument
"RCE" wrote in message ... "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "RCE" wrote in message ... "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... The real problem is one of religion, Bryan. In this great country, cars occupy almost mythical status in the mind of the consumer. And I see absolutely nothing wrong with that. It's part of the American culture. You've just proven my point. "Someone else can deal with the problem. I'm too busy or stupid". If I truly believed that a 40 mpg hybrid in every garage would solve the problem, I'd listen. But, I am of the belief that they won't. They are a nothing but an admirable but symbolic gesture in the bigger scheme of things, IMOH. I respect those that feel good about themselves owning and driving one, but to think they are making a significant difference is being blind-sighted. You know, everytime something that our culture traditionally enjoys is found to be bad for the environment or is wasteful or is deemed not appropriate by some, the answer is to ban them. Why not investigate ways that they can continue to be enjoyed by those that do while addressing the offending problems? RCE Here's a radical idea: How about a president who makes it his hobby to tell people he trusts them to make changes? Our grandparents made sacrifices during WWII. There were no Victory Garden police walking around checking back yards. As far as the 40 mpg hybrids you keep mentioning, you need to stop that. According to two people I know who own them, Escalades get 12-14 mpg on a good day. A Camry or an Impala get numbers in the high 20s - low 30s. I wasn't a math whiz in high school, so please correct me if I'm wrong, but I *think* that's about twice the gas mileage of an Escalade. |
Peak Oil - counterargument
"Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... So, in between an Escalade and a hybird, there are no in-between solutions? Yes, common sense. If hybrids and being politically correct floats your boat, do so without preaching. You are very defensive about all this. It's not absolutely NOTHING to do with being politically correct. Nada. Zip. Not defensive at all. I have nothing to be defensive about. I don't have to burn up fuel in low MPG autos to still enjoy them. If an Escalade floats your boat, do so, responsibly. The same applies for everything in between. Correct. It applies to everything in between. But, if your daily routine (work, shopping) can't be altered, and sometimes it can't, there is a floor - a minimum below which you cannot go, in terms of using a vehicle. I have a question for you. Do you believe that to an extent, the prices of commodities are determined by demand? Of course they are, as you say, "to an extent". But prices are also determined by other factors as well, such as inflation, rising costs of production, quality, etc. RCE |
Peak Oil - counterargument
"Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... Here's another thought exercise for you. Don't debate each point which begins with an asterisk. They're true. Wait for the question at the end. * It requires energy to build everything, including cars. * By nature of their design & manufacturing details, some cars are more expendable than others. Therefore, their early demise and replacement represents an earlier requirement for more energy use. * Careful with this one: Regardless of the type of vehicle, some are made more expendable due to the actions of the people who buy them. This is the question: What could consumers do to reduce the tendency of vehicles to be more quickly expendable? I'll answer your question in the form of another truth asterisk: * Not all, but some consumers purchase items, including cars, to use and enjoy, not as investments in longevity. I've forgotten ... do you currently own a boat? If so, do you enjoy it? Is it really a necessity? RCE |
Peak Oil - counterargument
"RCE" wrote in message ... "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... So, in between an Escalade and a hybird, there are no in-between solutions? Yes, common sense. If hybrids and being politically correct floats your boat, do so without preaching. You are very defensive about all this. It's not absolutely NOTHING to do with being politically correct. Nada. Zip. Not defensive at all. I have nothing to be defensive about. I don't have to burn up fuel in low MPG autos to still enjoy them. If an Escalade floats your boat, do so, responsibly. The same applies for everything in between. Correct. It applies to everything in between. But, if your daily routine (work, shopping) can't be altered, and sometimes it can't, there is a floor - a minimum below which you cannot go, in terms of using a vehicle. I have a question for you. Do you believe that to an extent, the prices of commodities are determined by demand? Of course they are, as you say, "to an extent". But prices are also determined by other factors as well, such as inflation, rising costs of production, quality, etc. RCE If you personally have the ability to influence one of those factors, and you are bothered by rising prices, do you think it makes no sense at all to do your part to effect a change? I'm curious, because I'll bet you call yourself patriotic. |
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