On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 08:45:30 -0500, Harry Krause wrote:

Shortwave Sportfishing wrote:
On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 07:55:45 -0500, JohnH wrote:

On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 04:46:47 GMT, "Doug Kanter" wrote:

"JohnH" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 17 Dec 2005 21:54:48 -0800, Tamaroak wrote:

And he admits violating the law
He did not.
He didn't deny doing what's been claimed. His best answer so far has been "I
can't discuss it", or "I'll do whatever's necessary to protect blah blah
blah". You wouldn't let your kids get away with crap like that.

The statement was, "And he admits violating the law." That was a false statement.

"In the weeks following the terrorist attacks on our nation, I authorized the National Security
Agency, consistent with U.S. law and the Constitution, to intercept the international communications
of people with known links to al Qaeda and related terrorist organizations. Before we intercept
these communications, the government must have information that establishes a clear link to these
terrorist networks." (From the President's Radio Address, 17 Dec.)

You guys are arguing around the issue. The NSA's charter includes
this type of intelligence and is prohibited from gathering
intelligence on any LAWFULL CITIZEN of the US. Meaning that if you
are here on a green card or a visa, you are subject to surveillance in
international calls.

By the way, France, Germany and Italy have similar laws and
surveillance in people in their countries.

Tom:

It is illegal for the government to eavesdrop on a citizen without a
court order.
You know there is a special court set up to obtain permission for these
"national security" eavesdropping cases.
You also know that you can get permission from the special court weeks
after the eavesdropping took place.
You also know that in several decades of the special court being in
place, it has turned down the government only once.
You also should know that a number of NSA lawyers turned down the
administration's request for secret eavesdropping because of the illegal
procedures Bush wanted to follow.

This is a serious issue. It shows that the Bush Administration has
nothing but comtempt for the Constitution and the rule of law.

Read the NYTimes article closely:

""Under the agency's longstanding rules, the N.S.A. can target for interception phone calls or
e-mail messages on foreign soil, even if the recipients of those communications are in the United
States. Usually, though, the government can only target phones and e-mail messages in the United
States by first obtaining a court order from the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court, which
holds its closed sessions at the Justice Department."
--
John H

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