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On Tue, 08 Nov 2005 20:26:54 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote: "Dan J.S." wrote in message ... "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "Dan J.S." wrote in message ... wrote in message ps.com... Sammy wrote: Wow, I thought social unrest was impossible under democratic socialism? Nah. It's just not moved to a designated "protest zone" where the high rollin' elite and right wing political candidates don't have to see it. Don't forget what that old communist, Thomas Jefferson, preached. Every so often it is healthy for the people to rise up, take control of, and reform the government. We may be seeing the beginnings of that process in France, and that should make all the "We-hate-France-because-the French-didn't-fall-for-the-WMD-propaganda-and-join-the-invasion-of-Iraq" crowd extremely happy. It worked really well when the Arabs burned down half of Europe in the 1600s... ****ing idiot! You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. I'm ready for a history lesson. Half of Europe? Which half? read about Grand Vizier Merzifonlu Kara Mustafa Pasha Done. Now what? Write a 100 word synopsis, please. -- John H "It's *not* a baby kicking, bride of mine, it's just a fetus!" Hypocrital Liberal |
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On Tue, 8 Nov 2005 14:04:37 -0600, "Dan J.S." wrote:
Are you blaming the Great Fire of London (1666) on "Arabs"? How amusing- if you are. I hope you don't kiss your mother with that mouth. I apologize for swearing at you... I just get all up in arms when Islam comes up. Sure wish more folks would follow this example! -- John H "It's *not* a baby kicking, bride of mine, it's just a fetus!" Hypocrital Liberal |
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"NOYB" wrote in message nk.net... "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "Dan J.S." wrote in message ... "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... Dan J.S. wrote: "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "Dan J.S." wrote in message ... wrote in message ps.com... Sammy wrote: Wow, I thought social unrest was impossible under democratic socialism? Nah. It's just not moved to a designated "protest zone" where the high rollin' elite and right wing political candidates don't have to see it. Don't forget what that old communist, Thomas Jefferson, preached. Every so often it is healthy for the people to rise up, take control of, and reform the government. We may be seeing the beginnings of that process in France, and that should make all the "We-hate-France-because-the French-didn't-fall-for-the-WMD-propaganda-and-join-the-invasion-of-Iraq" crowd extremely happy. It worked really well when the Arabs burned down half of Europe in the 1600s... ****ing idiot! You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. I'm ready for a history lesson. Half of Europe? Which half? read about Grand Vizier Merzifonlu Kara Mustafa Pasha Read about "Arabs." The Ottomans were not Arabs. Muslims, Arabs. Todays Muslims associate themselves with Islam. These are the people burning down France. I will call them Islamists now. Better? Black people here burned down ghettos back in the 60s. Probably the majority were Baptists or Catholics. But, they weren't rioting for religious reasons. What makes you think religion is the issue in France at the moment? Could it be skin color? It could be because they're running around yelling "this is war" and "jihad". Bull****. |
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"John H." wrote in message ... On Tue, 08 Nov 2005 21:13:56 GMT, "Doug Kanter" wrote: "Dan J.S." wrote in message ... "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... Dan J.S. wrote: "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "Dan J.S." wrote in message ... wrote in message ps.com... Sammy wrote: Wow, I thought social unrest was impossible under democratic socialism? Nah. It's just not moved to a designated "protest zone" where the high rollin' elite and right wing political candidates don't have to see it. Don't forget what that old communist, Thomas Jefferson, preached. Every so often it is healthy for the people to rise up, take control of, and reform the government. We may be seeing the beginnings of that process in France, and that should make all the "We-hate-France-because-the French-didn't-fall-for-the-WMD-propaganda-and-join-the-invasion-of-Iraq" crowd extremely happy. It worked really well when the Arabs burned down half of Europe in the 1600s... ****ing idiot! You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. I'm ready for a history lesson. Half of Europe? Which half? read about Grand Vizier Merzifonlu Kara Mustafa Pasha Read about "Arabs." The Ottomans were not Arabs. Muslims, Arabs. Todays Muslims associate themselves with Islam. These are the people burning down France. I will call them Islamists now. Better? Black people here burned down ghettos back in the 60s. Probably the majority were Baptists or Catholics. But, they weren't rioting for religious reasons. What makes you think religion is the issue in France at the moment? Could it be skin color? According to Len, the kids are being motivated in their religious schools. Or, did I read that wrongly? Bull****. |
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On Wed, 09 Nov 2005 00:26:29 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote: "John H." wrote in message .. . On Tue, 08 Nov 2005 21:13:56 GMT, "Doug Kanter" wrote: "Dan J.S." wrote in message ... "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... Dan J.S. wrote: "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "Dan J.S." wrote in message ... wrote in message ps.com... Sammy wrote: Wow, I thought social unrest was impossible under democratic socialism? Nah. It's just not moved to a designated "protest zone" where the high rollin' elite and right wing political candidates don't have to see it. Don't forget what that old communist, Thomas Jefferson, preached. Every so often it is healthy for the people to rise up, take control of, and reform the government. We may be seeing the beginnings of that process in France, and that should make all the "We-hate-France-because-the French-didn't-fall-for-the-WMD-propaganda-and-join-the-invasion-of-Iraq" crowd extremely happy. It worked really well when the Arabs burned down half of Europe in the 1600s... ****ing idiot! You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. I'm ready for a history lesson. Half of Europe? Which half? read about Grand Vizier Merzifonlu Kara Mustafa Pasha Read about "Arabs." The Ottomans were not Arabs. Muslims, Arabs. Todays Muslims associate themselves with Islam. These are the people burning down France. I will call them Islamists now. Better? Black people here burned down ghettos back in the 60s. Probably the majority were Baptists or Catholics. But, they weren't rioting for religious reasons. What makes you think religion is the issue in France at the moment? Could it be skin color? According to Len, the kids are being motivated in their religious schools. Or, did I read that wrongly? Bull****. Len, did you read that? -- John H "It's *not* a baby kicking, bride of mine, it's just a fetus!" Hypocrital Liberal |
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"Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "NOYB" wrote in message nk.net... "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "Dan J.S." wrote in message ... "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... Dan J.S. wrote: "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "Dan J.S." wrote in message ... wrote in message ps.com... Sammy wrote: Wow, I thought social unrest was impossible under democratic socialism? Nah. It's just not moved to a designated "protest zone" where the high rollin' elite and right wing political candidates don't have to see it. Don't forget what that old communist, Thomas Jefferson, preached. Every so often it is healthy for the people to rise up, take control of, and reform the government. We may be seeing the beginnings of that process in France, and that should make all the "We-hate-France-because-the French-didn't-fall-for-the-WMD-propaganda-and-join-the-invasion-of-Iraq" crowd extremely happy. It worked really well when the Arabs burned down half of Europe in the 1600s... ****ing idiot! You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. I'm ready for a history lesson. Half of Europe? Which half? read about Grand Vizier Merzifonlu Kara Mustafa Pasha Read about "Arabs." The Ottomans were not Arabs. Muslims, Arabs. Todays Muslims associate themselves with Islam. These are the people burning down France. I will call them Islamists now. Better? Black people here burned down ghettos back in the 60s. Probably the majority were Baptists or Catholics. But, they weren't rioting for religious reasons. What makes you think religion is the issue in France at the moment? Could it be skin color? It could be because they're running around yelling "this is war" and "jihad". Bull****. "It's Baghdad here," the rioters shouted. Night after night last week, rage spread through the ghettos that ring Paris, then beyond to every corner of France. When a tear-gas canister exploded near a mosque in Clichy-sous-Bois on the fourth violent evening, a new cry went up. "Now this is war," said one of the vandals. Others cried "jihad." http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9938333/site/newsweek/ |
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On Wed, 09 Nov 2005 02:02:22 GMT, "NOYB" wrote:
"Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "NOYB" wrote in message nk.net... "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "Dan J.S." wrote in message ... "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... Dan J.S. wrote: "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "Dan J.S." wrote in message ... wrote in message ps.com... Sammy wrote: Wow, I thought social unrest was impossible under democratic socialism? Nah. It's just not moved to a designated "protest zone" where the high rollin' elite and right wing political candidates don't have to see it. Don't forget what that old communist, Thomas Jefferson, preached. Every so often it is healthy for the people to rise up, take control of, and reform the government. We may be seeing the beginnings of that process in France, and that should make all the "We-hate-France-because-the French-didn't-fall-for-the-WMD-propaganda-and-join-the-invasion-of-Iraq" crowd extremely happy. It worked really well when the Arabs burned down half of Europe in the 1600s... ****ing idiot! You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. I'm ready for a history lesson. Half of Europe? Which half? read about Grand Vizier Merzifonlu Kara Mustafa Pasha Read about "Arabs." The Ottomans were not Arabs. Muslims, Arabs. Todays Muslims associate themselves with Islam. These are the people burning down France. I will call them Islamists now. Better? Black people here burned down ghettos back in the 60s. Probably the majority were Baptists or Catholics. But, they weren't rioting for religious reasons. What makes you think religion is the issue in France at the moment? Could it be skin color? It could be because they're running around yelling "this is war" and "jihad". Bull****. "It's Baghdad here," the rioters shouted. Night after night last week, rage spread through the ghettos that ring Paris, then beyond to every corner of France. When a tear-gas canister exploded near a mosque in Clichy-sous-Bois on the fourth violent evening, a new cry went up. "Now this is war," said one of the vandals. Others cried "jihad." http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9938333/site/newsweek/ Thanks, maybe Doug will stop thinking I'm the one that made it up! -- John H. "Divide each difficulty into as many parts as is feasible and necessary to resolve it." Rene Descartes |
France
"NOYB" wrote in message ink.net... "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "NOYB" wrote in message nk.net... "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "Dan J.S." wrote in message ... "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... Dan J.S. wrote: "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "Dan J.S." wrote in message ... wrote in message ps.com... Sammy wrote: Wow, I thought social unrest was impossible under democratic socialism? Nah. It's just not moved to a designated "protest zone" where the high rollin' elite and right wing political candidates don't have to see it. Don't forget what that old communist, Thomas Jefferson, preached. Every so often it is healthy for the people to rise up, take control of, and reform the government. We may be seeing the beginnings of that process in France, and that should make all the "We-hate-France-because-the French-didn't-fall-for-the-WMD-propaganda-and-join-the-invasion-of-Iraq" crowd extremely happy. It worked really well when the Arabs burned down half of Europe in the 1600s... ****ing idiot! You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. I'm ready for a history lesson. Half of Europe? Which half? read about Grand Vizier Merzifonlu Kara Mustafa Pasha Read about "Arabs." The Ottomans were not Arabs. Muslims, Arabs. Todays Muslims associate themselves with Islam. These are the people burning down France. I will call them Islamists now. Better? Black people here burned down ghettos back in the 60s. Probably the majority were Baptists or Catholics. But, they weren't rioting for religious reasons. What makes you think religion is the issue in France at the moment? Could it be skin color? It could be because they're running around yelling "this is war" and "jihad". Bull****. "It's Baghdad here," the rioters shouted. Night after night last week, rage spread through the ghettos that ring Paris, then beyond to every corner of France. When a tear-gas canister exploded near a mosque in Clichy-sous-Bois on the fourth violent evening, a new cry went up. "Now this is war," said one of the vandals. Others cried "jihad." http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9938333/site/newsweek/ Bingo! Exactly what I have been saying all along. Young extremist Muslim men. |
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" *JimH*" wrote in message ... "NOYB" wrote in message ink.net... "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "NOYB" wrote in message nk.net... "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "Dan J.S." wrote in message ... "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... Dan J.S. wrote: "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "Dan J.S." wrote in message ... wrote in message ps.com... Sammy wrote: Wow, I thought social unrest was impossible under democratic socialism? Nah. It's just not moved to a designated "protest zone" where the high rollin' elite and right wing political candidates don't have to see it. Don't forget what that old communist, Thomas Jefferson, preached. Every so often it is healthy for the people to rise up, take control of, and reform the government. We may be seeing the beginnings of that process in France, and that should make all the "We-hate-France-because-the French-didn't-fall-for-the-WMD-propaganda-and-join-the-invasion-of-Iraq" crowd extremely happy. It worked really well when the Arabs burned down half of Europe in the 1600s... ****ing idiot! You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. I'm ready for a history lesson. Half of Europe? Which half? read about Grand Vizier Merzifonlu Kara Mustafa Pasha Read about "Arabs." The Ottomans were not Arabs. Muslims, Arabs. Todays Muslims associate themselves with Islam. These are the people burning down France. I will call them Islamists now. Better? Black people here burned down ghettos back in the 60s. Probably the majority were Baptists or Catholics. But, they weren't rioting for religious reasons. What makes you think religion is the issue in France at the moment? Could it be skin color? It could be because they're running around yelling "this is war" and "jihad". Bull****. "It's Baghdad here," the rioters shouted. Night after night last week, rage spread through the ghettos that ring Paris, then beyond to every corner of France. When a tear-gas canister exploded near a mosque in Clichy-sous-Bois on the fourth violent evening, a new cry went up. "Now this is war," said one of the vandals. Others cried "jihad." http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9938333/site/newsweek/ Bingo! Exactly what I have been saying all along. Young extremist Muslim men. Bull****. You have no idea what you're talking about. |
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"Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "Dan J.S." wrote in message ... "DSK" wrote in message .. . Just to make sure I'm not accused of misquoting you, you are saying that the Turks (whose troops were not all Muslim, BTW... look up "Janissaries") beseiging Vienna... and failing... equals "burning down half of Europe"? You may want to check a map. I don't need to check a map of a place that I lived at for a long time. They did practice Islam. And most of Europe was involved. Your American education (or lack of) is showing. Most of Europe? France, Germany, Poland, Italy, etc etc.... ??? The Mohammedan's were knocking on the door to Paris when the Crusades started. And Paris is probably as far North as Don White's home. |
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" *JimH*" wrote in message ... "Bill McKee" wrote in message ink.net... "Dan J.S." wrote in message ... wrote in message ps.com... Sammy wrote: Wow, I thought social unrest was impossible under democratic socialism? Nah. It's just not moved to a designated "protest zone" where the high rollin' elite and right wing political candidates don't have to see it. Don't forget what that old communist, Thomas Jefferson, preached. Every so often it is healthy for the people to rise up, take control of, and reform the government. We may be seeing the beginnings of that process in France, and that should make all the "We-hate-France-because-the French-didn't-fall-for-the-WMD-propaganda-and-join-the-invasion-of-Iraq" crowd extremely happy. It worked really well when the Arabs burned down half of Europe in the 1600s... ****ing idiot! You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. Actually Chuck may be right. France is an economic disaster. Almost all the public union strikes are over the government trying to add a couple of years more working time before the people retire. In something like 10-15 years, there will be only 2 workers for every retired worker. Think that will be sustainable? France just happens to be the worst, but lots of European countries are in the same boat. Naples has a 37% unemployment. Most likely the reason it is one of the most dangerous cities in Italy (besides the taxi drivers). Yep, France's economy is in the crapper and social spending is out of control. But those facts are not factors of the riots. Otherwise the rioters would not be made up only of young muslim men. They are a part of the riots. The 40% unemployment in their society goes a long way towards dissatisfaction with life. This also makes a verdant garden for Mullahs to recruit in. Plus the families never assimilated into French life. The parents thought they would return to the home countries. Part of this is France reaping the rewards of being an asshole colonial ruler. England at least trained and educated the ruled, but France did not educate females and educated the makes to the 6th grade level. So they could read the instructions for work for their masters. Had a coworker who grew up under the French in Algeria. His description of life for the Algerians was not nice. But after the Algerian's finally tossed the French, their was a power vacuum and the different sect's of Islam are maiming/killing the other sects, so the underdogs flee to France, as that is OK under the old colonial rules. But, no jobs for the immigrants or only menial jobs makes for a nasty neighborhood. France's socialized society has not created enough new jobs to satisfy the needs of these people, so they are reaping the fruits of their garden. Not enough dole money to give them a decent life, and no way to make enough money. And Imam's that want a Islamic Europe, find good recruiting ground. |
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"Harry Krause" wrote in message ... thunder wrote: On Tue, 08 Nov 2005 16:45:44 -0500, P Fritz wrote: Actually it is to some degree.....economics plays a major role in it.......and the fact that muslims tend to not assimilate into the culture where they live means they end up religated to the lower end of the economic scale. Huh? Islam is a religion. If a Muslim remains true to his faith, are you saying he doesn't assimilate? How about a Baptist? Keep in mind this is Fritz. As in one half of the Dumb and Dumberer team, Fritz and Robbins. And neither sounds as dumb as you with that statement. Assimilating into the French culture, does not mean giving up your religion. Lots of Korean's here in California go to their churches and also do very well as capitalist shopkeepers. They speak the language, and understand the mores. |
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"Bill McKee" wrote in message ink.net... They are a part of the riots. The 40% unemployment in their society goes a long way towards dissatisfaction with life. This also makes a verdant garden for Mullahs to recruit in. It's no secret that Islamic fanaticism feeds on the poor and destitute. Why do you think places like Louis Farrakhan/Nation of Islam's Mosque Maryam is on Stoney Island Avenue in Chicago...which is one of Chicago's worst areas? It's not poverty that is causing the riots. It's scum-sucking opportunistic Clerics, or Mullahs, or Ministers( or whatever they call themselves) who use Western culture in general (and the white man specifically) as the scapegoat for all that ails the downtrodden. The levees failed? Well, it's because the white man blew 'em up to drown the blacks! It's easy to say that if you get rid of poverty, you get rid of the breeding grounds for the fanatacism. That may be true to some extent, but why isn't a stronger effort made to round up the POS self-declared holy men who prey on the poor? And then shoot those *******s in the f-in head. Anybody who uses class warfare to bring about violent uprisings is unfit to live among the civil world. It's the lowest form of "dirty pool"...and shows more contempt for the people they are exploiting, than the people or government that they are turning them against. |
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"NOYB" wrote in message k.net... It's no secret that Islamic fanaticism feeds on the poor and destitute. Sounds like another group of people I know. |
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"Sammy" wrote in message news:g4gcf.14339$dU6.8464@trnddc03... "NOYB" wrote in message k.net... It's no secret that Islamic fanaticism feeds on the poor and destitute. Sounds like another group of people I know. Democrats? |
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"Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... Bull****. You have no idea what you're talking about. " there have been examples...of attackers acting under their direction, so that Muslim-owned businesses, a halal butcher's shop and a kebab joint, for example, are spared, while a bank branch and symbols of another France are targeted." " The gravest fear for French ministers is that the trouble of the past 10 days has been orchestrated by Islamists bent on exploiting the grievances of impressionable youths." http://www.opinion.telegraph.co.uk/o...ixopinion.html |
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"NOYB" wrote in message k.net... "Bill McKee" wrote in message ink.net... They are a part of the riots. The 40% unemployment in their society goes a long way towards dissatisfaction with life. This also makes a verdant garden for Mullahs to recruit in. It's no secret that Islamic fanaticism feeds on the poor and destitute. Why do you think places like Louis Farrakhan/Nation of Islam's Mosque Maryam is on Stoney Island Avenue in Chicago...which is one of Chicago's worst areas? It's not poverty that is causing the riots. It's scum-sucking opportunistic Clerics, or Mullahs, or Ministers( or whatever they call themselves) who use Western culture in general (and the white man specifically) as the scapegoat for all that ails the downtrodden. The levees failed? Well, it's because the white man blew 'em up to drown the blacks! It's easy to say that if you get rid of poverty, you get rid of the breeding grounds for the fanatacism. That may be true to some extent, but why isn't a stronger effort made to round up the POS self-declared holy men who prey on the poor? And then shoot those *******s in the f-in head. Anybody who uses class warfare to bring about violent uprisings is unfit to live among the civil world. It's the lowest form of "dirty pool"...and shows more contempt for the people they are exploiting, than the people or government that they are turning them against. It is the perception that life looks like it is not going to get better, you are going to be stuck in Poverty for ever, and your children also will be stuck. There are no jobs and no training for jobs and the locals are discriminating against you. It is the perception. Instead of going to school and starting their own businesses, Even small groceries, etc. |
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On Wed, 09 Nov 2005 04:54:48 +0000, NOYB wrote:
It's easy to say that if you get rid of poverty, you get rid of the breeding grounds for the fanatacism. That may be true to some extent, but why isn't a stronger effort made to round up the POS self-declared holy men who prey on the poor? And then shoot those *******s in the f-in head. Geez, you are really getting out there. If you really believe this, you need a reality check. |
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"NOYB" wrote in message ink.net... "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... Bull****. You have no idea what you're talking about. " there have been examples...of attackers acting under their direction, so that Muslim-owned businesses, a halal butcher's shop and a kebab joint, for example, are spared, while a bank branch and symbols of another France are targeted." " The gravest fear for French ministers is that the trouble of the past 10 days has been orchestrated by Islamists bent on exploiting the grievances of impressionable youths." http://www.opinion.telegraph.co.uk/o...ixopinion.html In the 1960s, the FBI was watching who was "orchestrating" race riots in our cities, calling them communists blah blah blah. It was about jobs, not religion, although clergymen were sometimes motivating people. For people who are tight with their churches, who else would they look to for leadership? Oprah? |
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"NOYB" wrote in message
k.net... "Bill McKee" wrote in message ink.net... They are a part of the riots. The 40% unemployment in their society goes a long way towards dissatisfaction with life. This also makes a verdant garden for Mullahs to recruit in. It's no secret that Islamic fanaticism feeds on the poor and destitute. Why do you think places like Louis Farrakhan/Nation of Islam's Mosque Maryam is on Stoney Island Avenue in Chicago...which is one of Chicago's worst areas? All political movements that you don't like feed on the poor and the destitute. The birth of labor unions thrived on poverty. The Black Panthers thrived on poverty. The rise of communism was the same. |
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Bill McKee wrote:
The Mohammedan's were knocking on the door to Paris when the Crusades started. Which "Mohammedan's"? Which Crusades? I didn't realize there were any Crusades in the 1600s. DSK |
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"Bill McKee" wrote in message ink.net... "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... thunder wrote: On Tue, 08 Nov 2005 16:45:44 -0500, P Fritz wrote: Actually it is to some degree.....economics plays a major role in it.......and the fact that muslims tend to not assimilate into the culture where they live means they end up religated to the lower end of the economic scale. Huh? Islam is a religion. If a Muslim remains true to his faith, are you saying he doesn't assimilate? How about a Baptist? Keep in mind this is Fritz. As in one half of the Dumb and Dumberer team, Fritz and Robbins. And neither sounds as dumb as you with that statement. Assimilating into the French culture, does not mean giving up your religion. Lots of Korean's here in California go to their churches and also do very well as capitalist shopkeepers. They speak the language, and understand the mores. Exactly.........but the brain dead liebrals like harry and "thunder" will never get it. Their heads are permantly stuck up the asses. |
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"DSK" wrote in message ... Doug Kanter wrote: Either that, or Spain is equal to half of Europe. Can't wait to learn Moor. :-) Good point, 1/2 is the wrong fraction, but I was thinking of veinna it happened, too. Still, the wrong century by a couple. Surely the right-wingnut history bund of rec.boats can tell time better than that?? DSK Thinking of the Battle of Tours (~mid-700's) Ending the Moorish thrust into France by way of Spain? Also significant was the Battle of Lopinto(?)--Sea battle won by an Italian lead Fleet vs. the Turks (mid-1600's?) And of course, The Defeat of the Turks at the Gates of Vienna. Departure points for further reseach on the current thread-All three Battles considered turning points in a long, long war between Christian West and Moslem East. |
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Bill McKee wrote:
"Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "Dan J.S." wrote in message ... "DSK" wrote in message t... Just to make sure I'm not accused of misquoting you, you are saying that the Turks (whose troops were not all Muslim, BTW... look up "Janissaries") beseiging Vienna... and failing... equals "burning down half of Europe"? You may want to check a map. I don't need to check a map of a place that I lived at for a long time. They did practice Islam. And most of Europe was involved. Your American education (or lack of) is showing. Most of Europe? France, Germany, Poland, Italy, etc etc.... ??? The Mohammedan's were knocking on the door to Paris when the Crusades started. And Paris is probably as far North as Don White's home. I'm probably equivalent to the north coast of Spain....or maybe Yaquina Head in Oregon if I went left. |
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tak wrote:
Thinking of the Battle of Tours (~mid-700's) Ending the Moorish thrust into France by way of Spain? Possibly. That was well before the Crusades, by more years than there are between Presidents George Washington & George Bush! But I guess, what's a couple hundred years or so, it's ancient history anyway ;) Also significant was the Battle of Lopinto(?)--Sea battle won by an Italian lead Fleet vs. the Turks (mid-1600's?) Yes, and that was probably more significant than the siege of Vienna IMHO (not to take away from Sobieski's victory), because it showed that the Turks were not the equal of European states in industry & technology, plus this battle determined who would control the wealthiest trade routes of the time. And of course, The Defeat of the Turks at the Gates of Vienna. Departure points for further reseach on the current thread-All three Battles considered turning points in a long, long war between Christian West and Moslem East. A war that some people on both sides would like to reignite, for no better reason than their imaginary friend's urging. Some even pretend this war has been going on all the time. Scary... but those who are ignorant can be more easily persuaded. Which IMHO is one reason why the Bush Administration and it's followers are determined to dismantle the U.S. education system. DSK |
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Sammy wrote: Wow, I thought social unrest was impossible under democratic socialism? Please, do tell, exactly WHAT made you think that "social unrest was impossible under democratic socialism"? |
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Dan J.S. wrote: "DSK" wrote in message ... Dan J.S. wrote: Where are the liberals defending the Muslims now? yeah, we should just exterminate the pesky little *******s! if it wasn't for those libby-rull traitors, we'd have Muslims in concentraion camps by now! DSK Where they belong! Unless they want to assimilate into our culture... Who to hell are we to force "our culture" on anyone else? Doesn't that sound like other dictator/tyrant leaders in history? Hitler, perhaps? |
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"Dan J.S." wrote in message ... "DSK" wrote in message ... Dan J.S. wrote: Where are the liberals defending the Muslims now? yeah, we should just exterminate the pesky little *******s! if it wasn't for those libby-rull traitors, we'd have Muslims in concentraion camps by now! DSK Where they belong! Unless they want to assimilate into our culture... Assimilate? When foreigners come here, they bring much of their old lives with them: Music, cooking, mode of dress, dance, etc. If you really believe what you're saying, then it should be retroactive, don't you think? - Italians will no longer be permitted to wear huge gold jewelry. - No more pizza may be sold, except for the raped versions from Domino's, etc., which are not Italian. - No more Jewish dishes like knishes may be sold in delis in NY. - Someone will be stopping by your house to go through your family recipes, to be sure none of them are in any way similar to those your ancestors brought from the old country. The recipes will be destroyed, and anyone who complains will be arrested. - No more Carlos Santana, or anyone like him. His work is too much like "world music", representing Latin & African. - No more St. Patrick's Day. It's now illegal. - No more Nutcracker shows for the kiddies. Matter of fact, the vast majority of classical music will be banned. You might want to think about this big idea of yours. |
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"DSK" wrote in message ... tak wrote: Thinking of the Battle of Tours (~mid-700's) Ending the Moorish thrust into France by way of Spain? Possibly. That was well before the Crusades, by more years than there are between Presidents George Washington & George Bush! But I guess, what's a couple hundred years or so, it's ancient history anyway ;) Also significant was the Battle of Lopinto(?)--Sea battle won by an Italian lead Fleet vs. the Turks (mid-1600's?) Yes, and that was probably more significant than the siege of Vienna IMHO (not to take away from Sobieski's victory), because it showed that the Turks were not the equal of European states in industry & technology, plus this battle determined who would control the wealthiest trade routes of the time. And of course, The Defeat of the Turks at the Gates of Vienna. Departure points for further reseach on the current thread-All three Battles considered turning points in a long, long war between Christian West and Moslem East. A war that some people on both sides would like to reignite, for no better reason than their imaginary friend's urging. Some even pretend this war has been going on all the time. Scary... but those who are ignorant can be more easily persuaded. Which IMHO is one reason why the Bush Administration and it's followers are determined to dismantle the U.S. education system. DSK Somewhat the same line of reasoning on the subject of manipulation or spinning, albeit an even darker world view held by the speaker: "Of course the people don't want war. But after all, it's the leaders of the country who determine the policy, and it's always a simple matter to drag the people along whether it's a democracy, a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism, and exposing the country to greater danger." -- Herman Goering at the Nuremberg trials |
France
"Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "Dan J.S." wrote in message ... "DSK" wrote in message ... Dan J.S. wrote: Where are the liberals defending the Muslims now? yeah, we should just exterminate the pesky little *******s! if it wasn't for those libby-rull traitors, we'd have Muslims in concentraion camps by now! DSK Where they belong! Unless they want to assimilate into our culture... Assimilate? When foreigners come here, they bring much of their old lives with them: Music, cooking, mode of dress, dance, etc. If you really believe what you're saying, then it should be retroactive, don't you think? - Italians will no longer be permitted to wear huge gold jewelry. - No more pizza may be sold, except for the raped versions from Domino's, etc., which are not Italian. - No more Jewish dishes like knishes may be sold in delis in NY. - Someone will be stopping by your house to go through your family recipes, to be sure none of them are in any way similar to those your ancestors brought from the old country. The recipes will be destroyed, and anyone who complains will be arrested. - No more Carlos Santana, or anyone like him. His work is too much like "world music", representing Latin & African. - No more St. Patrick's Day. It's now illegal. - No more Nutcracker shows for the kiddies. Matter of fact, the vast majority of classical music will be banned. You might want to think about this big idea of yours. None of the classes you listed 'exclude' themselves. Similar to the Amish, except the Amish do not cause trouble. Amish want nothing to do with our culture. Muslims are similar. However they still want to make money, but dont want to accept any of the western ideas, like freedom for women, or other barbaric ideas. |
France
"Dan J.S." wrote in message ... "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "Dan J.S." wrote in message ... "DSK" wrote in message ... Dan J.S. wrote: Where are the liberals defending the Muslims now? yeah, we should just exterminate the pesky little *******s! if it wasn't for those libby-rull traitors, we'd have Muslims in concentraion camps by now! DSK Where they belong! Unless they want to assimilate into our culture... Assimilate? When foreigners come here, they bring much of their old lives with them: Music, cooking, mode of dress, dance, etc. If you really believe what you're saying, then it should be retroactive, don't you think? - Italians will no longer be permitted to wear huge gold jewelry. - No more pizza may be sold, except for the raped versions from Domino's, etc., which are not Italian. - No more Jewish dishes like knishes may be sold in delis in NY. - Someone will be stopping by your house to go through your family recipes, to be sure none of them are in any way similar to those your ancestors brought from the old country. The recipes will be destroyed, and anyone who complains will be arrested. - No more Carlos Santana, or anyone like him. His work is too much like "world music", representing Latin & African. - No more St. Patrick's Day. It's now illegal. - No more Nutcracker shows for the kiddies. Matter of fact, the vast majority of classical music will be banned. You might want to think about this big idea of yours. None of the classes you listed 'exclude' themselves. Similar to the Amish, except the Amish do not cause trouble. Amish want nothing to do with our culture. Muslims are similar. However they still want to make money, but dont want to accept any of the western ideas, like freedom for women, or other barbaric ideas. In general the Amish do not expect the rest of the country to change to fit their needs, Muslims tend to be the opposite |
France
"P Fritz" wrote in message ... "Dan J.S." wrote in message ... "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "Dan J.S." wrote in message ... "DSK" wrote in message ... Dan J.S. wrote: Where are the liberals defending the Muslims now? yeah, we should just exterminate the pesky little *******s! if it wasn't for those libby-rull traitors, we'd have Muslims in concentraion camps by now! DSK Where they belong! Unless they want to assimilate into our culture... Assimilate? When foreigners come here, they bring much of their old lives with them: Music, cooking, mode of dress, dance, etc. If you really believe what you're saying, then it should be retroactive, don't you think? - Italians will no longer be permitted to wear huge gold jewelry. - No more pizza may be sold, except for the raped versions from Domino's, etc., which are not Italian. - No more Jewish dishes like knishes may be sold in delis in NY. - Someone will be stopping by your house to go through your family recipes, to be sure none of them are in any way similar to those your ancestors brought from the old country. The recipes will be destroyed, and anyone who complains will be arrested. - No more Carlos Santana, or anyone like him. His work is too much like "world music", representing Latin & African. - No more St. Patrick's Day. It's now illegal. - No more Nutcracker shows for the kiddies. Matter of fact, the vast majority of classical music will be banned. You might want to think about this big idea of yours. None of the classes you listed 'exclude' themselves. Similar to the Amish, except the Amish do not cause trouble. Amish want nothing to do with our culture. Muslims are similar. However they still want to make money, but dont want to accept any of the western ideas, like freedom for women, or other barbaric ideas. In general the Amish do not expect the rest of the country to change to fit their needs, Muslims tend to be the opposite Very good analogy. |
France
"Dan J.S." wrote in message ... "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "Dan J.S." wrote in message ... "DSK" wrote in message ... Dan J.S. wrote: Where are the liberals defending the Muslims now? yeah, we should just exterminate the pesky little *******s! if it wasn't for those libby-rull traitors, we'd have Muslims in concentraion camps by now! DSK Where they belong! Unless they want to assimilate into our culture... Assimilate? When foreigners come here, they bring much of their old lives with them: Music, cooking, mode of dress, dance, etc. If you really believe what you're saying, then it should be retroactive, don't you think? - Italians will no longer be permitted to wear huge gold jewelry. - No more pizza may be sold, except for the raped versions from Domino's, etc., which are not Italian. - No more Jewish dishes like knishes may be sold in delis in NY. - Someone will be stopping by your house to go through your family recipes, to be sure none of them are in any way similar to those your ancestors brought from the old country. The recipes will be destroyed, and anyone who complains will be arrested. - No more Carlos Santana, or anyone like him. His work is too much like "world music", representing Latin & African. - No more St. Patrick's Day. It's now illegal. - No more Nutcracker shows for the kiddies. Matter of fact, the vast majority of classical music will be banned. You might want to think about this big idea of yours. None of the classes you listed 'exclude' themselves. Similar to the Amish, except the Amish do not cause trouble. Amish want nothing to do with our culture. Muslims are similar. However they still want to make money, but dont want to accept any of the western ideas, like freedom for women, or other barbaric ideas. I had a white BTC (big time christian) neighbor who would yell across the house (or yard) for his obedient wife to bring him a glass of water. He'd quote scripture which he and his pastor interpreted to mean women were crap. I'm gonna go check my dictionary now. Is christian synonymous with muslim? |
France
"NOYB" wrote in message nk.net... "P Fritz" wrote in message ... "Dan J.S." wrote in message ... "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "Dan J.S." wrote in message ... "DSK" wrote in message ... Dan J.S. wrote: Where are the liberals defending the Muslims now? yeah, we should just exterminate the pesky little *******s! if it wasn't for those libby-rull traitors, we'd have Muslims in concentraion camps by now! DSK Where they belong! Unless they want to assimilate into our culture... Assimilate? When foreigners come here, they bring much of their old lives with them: Music, cooking, mode of dress, dance, etc. If you really believe what you're saying, then it should be retroactive, don't you think? - Italians will no longer be permitted to wear huge gold jewelry. - No more pizza may be sold, except for the raped versions from Domino's, etc., which are not Italian. - No more Jewish dishes like knishes may be sold in delis in NY. - Someone will be stopping by your house to go through your family recipes, to be sure none of them are in any way similar to those your ancestors brought from the old country. The recipes will be destroyed, and anyone who complains will be arrested. - No more Carlos Santana, or anyone like him. His work is too much like "world music", representing Latin & African. - No more St. Patrick's Day. It's now illegal. - No more Nutcracker shows for the kiddies. Matter of fact, the vast majority of classical music will be banned. You might want to think about this big idea of yours. None of the classes you listed 'exclude' themselves. Similar to the Amish, except the Amish do not cause trouble. Amish want nothing to do with our culture. Muslims are similar. However they still want to make money, but dont want to accept any of the western ideas, like freedom for women, or other barbaric ideas. In general the Amish do not expect the rest of the country to change to fit their needs, Muslims tend to be the opposite Very good analogy. Muslims are more similar to the ACLU......if they find something "offensive" it must be banned!!! |
France
"DSK" wrote in message ... Bill McKee wrote: The Mohammedan's were knocking on the door to Paris when the Crusades started. Which "Mohammedan's"? Which Crusades? I didn't realize there were any Crusades in the 1600s. DSK Muslim's were also known as "Mohammedan's" until about 1950. And when did the crusades start? the first "Crusade" was in the 1050's. battles related to Crusades, went all the way to the 1500's (Northern Crusades). |
France
Dan J.S. wrote:
None of the classes you listed 'exclude' themselves. Similar to the Amish, except the Amish do not cause trouble. Amish want nothing to do with our culture. Other than that some of them want to deal drugs. ... Muslims are similar. However they still want to make money, but dont want to accept any of the western ideas, like freedom for women, or other barbaric ideas. You should get out more. I have a number of Muslim friends, and the way they complain about their kids music makes me think that they are assimilating just fine. Plus, their wives or daughters have assimilated the idea of equal rights very well, thank you. One of the biggest issues facing mainstream Muslims is whether or not they want their kids to be recruited as suicide bombers. How our society treats them is a big part of how they are likely to answer that question. DSK |
France
Bill McKee wrote:
Muslim's were also known as "Mohammedan's" until about 1950. Actually, they're still known as "Mohammedans." How do you think I knew who you were talking about? However, calling Muslim (or Moslem) a 'Mohammedan' is like calling a Christian a "Jesusian." But hey, people have killed each other over the proper way to spell YHWH. I shouldn't have quibbled. ... And when did the crusades start? the first "Crusade" was in the 1050's. Yep. More than 300 years later. So, your saying that Mohammedans were knocking on the door of Paris at the start of the Crusades is like saying that Queen Anne's failure to produce an heir to the throne http://www.royal.gov.uk/output/Page102.asp was one everybody's mind when the U.S. decided to invade Iraq. ... battles related to Crusades, went all the way to the 1500's (Northern Crusades). hmm... You could push it further than that if you really like stretching the truth (and I want to encourage you in this, it's a step up from bald-faced lying). Sure there were a lot of thugs with armor & swords who liked to pretend they were Crusaders, including the Knights of Malta (who to be sure, did fight Muslims when they had to, and did it valiantly) up into the 1700s. Pretending to be a Crusader was a good excuse for whacking people you didn't like, whether they were Muslim or not, or if you had any intention of liberating Jerusalem or not. I guess some things never change. DSK |
France
Harry,
I can remember a few years ago when you were preaching a anti Islam message. I am glad to see you have become more enlightened, and hopefully you will not flip flop on this issue. "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... NOYB wrote: "P Fritz" wrote in message ... "Dan J.S." wrote in message ... "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "Dan J.S." wrote in message ... "DSK" wrote in message ... Dan J.S. wrote: Where are the liberals defending the Muslims now? yeah, we should just exterminate the pesky little *******s! if it wasn't for those libby-rull traitors, we'd have Muslims in concentraion camps by now! DSK Where they belong! Unless they want to assimilate into our culture... Assimilate? When foreigners come here, they bring much of their old lives with them: Music, cooking, mode of dress, dance, etc. If you really believe what you're saying, then it should be retroactive, don't you think? - Italians will no longer be permitted to wear huge gold jewelry. - No more pizza may be sold, except for the raped versions from Domino's, etc., which are not Italian. - No more Jewish dishes like knishes may be sold in delis in NY. - Someone will be stopping by your house to go through your family recipes, to be sure none of them are in any way similar to those your ancestors brought from the old country. The recipes will be destroyed, and anyone who complains will be arrested. - No more Carlos Santana, or anyone like him. His work is too much like "world music", representing Latin & African. - No more St. Patrick's Day. It's now illegal. - No more Nutcracker shows for the kiddies. Matter of fact, the vast majority of classical music will be banned. You might want to think about this big idea of yours. None of the classes you listed 'exclude' themselves. Similar to the Amish, except the Amish do not cause trouble. Amish want nothing to do with our culture. Muslims are similar. However they still want to make money, but dont want to accept any of the western ideas, like freedom for women, or other barbaric ideas. In general the Amish do not expect the rest of the country to change to fit their needs, Muslims tend to be the opposite Very good analogy. No it isn't. The majority of Muslims in this country participate fully in our culture, and enjoy the opportunities offered by the United States. One of my near neighbors is a Muslim family. The patriarch is a reknowned physician, the son is a builder-developer, the son's daughters participate in all sorts of activities in the local public schools, et cetera. My Iraqi friend of 20 years standing, a Muslim, owns a chain of tire stores, and his family is Americanized. I have a few other Muslim friends who also live the American life. I'm not saying there are no Muslims who want to avoid integration into our society, obviously there are. But to categorize "Muslims" here the way Fritz tries is just plain stupid. Well, of course. It's too bad you live in such an isolated part of the country, eh? |
France
In the conservative Muslim countries you are correct, and I would hope we
never follow their example. In the US the majority of the Muslims are tolerant of other beliefs. "P Fritz" wrote in message ... "NOYB" wrote in message nk.net... "P Fritz" wrote in message ... "Dan J.S." wrote in message ... "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "Dan J.S." wrote in message ... "DSK" wrote in message ... Dan J.S. wrote: Where are the liberals defending the Muslims now? yeah, we should just exterminate the pesky little *******s! if it wasn't for those libby-rull traitors, we'd have Muslims in concentraion camps by now! DSK Where they belong! Unless they want to assimilate into our culture... Assimilate? When foreigners come here, they bring much of their old lives with them: Music, cooking, mode of dress, dance, etc. If you really believe what you're saying, then it should be retroactive, don't you think? - Italians will no longer be permitted to wear huge gold jewelry. - No more pizza may be sold, except for the raped versions from Domino's, etc., which are not Italian. - No more Jewish dishes like knishes may be sold in delis in NY. - Someone will be stopping by your house to go through your family recipes, to be sure none of them are in any way similar to those your ancestors brought from the old country. The recipes will be destroyed, and anyone who complains will be arrested. - No more Carlos Santana, or anyone like him. His work is too much like "world music", representing Latin & African. - No more St. Patrick's Day. It's now illegal. - No more Nutcracker shows for the kiddies. Matter of fact, the vast majority of classical music will be banned. You might want to think about this big idea of yours. None of the classes you listed 'exclude' themselves. Similar to the Amish, except the Amish do not cause trouble. Amish want nothing to do with our culture. Muslims are similar. However they still want to make money, but dont want to accept any of the western ideas, like freedom for women, or other barbaric ideas. In general the Amish do not expect the rest of the country to change to fit their needs, Muslims tend to be the opposite Very good analogy. Muslims are more similar to the ACLU......if they find something "offensive" it must be banned!!! |
France
"Harry Krause" wrote in message ... NOYB wrote: "P Fritz" wrote in message ... "Dan J.S." wrote in message ... "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "Dan J.S." wrote in message ... "DSK" wrote in message ... Dan J.S. wrote: Where are the liberals defending the Muslims now? yeah, we should just exterminate the pesky little *******s! if it wasn't for those libby-rull traitors, we'd have Muslims in concentraion camps by now! DSK Where they belong! Unless they want to assimilate into our culture... Assimilate? When foreigners come here, they bring much of their old lives with them: Music, cooking, mode of dress, dance, etc. If you really believe what you're saying, then it should be retroactive, don't you think? - Italians will no longer be permitted to wear huge gold jewelry. - No more pizza may be sold, except for the raped versions from Domino's, etc., which are not Italian. - No more Jewish dishes like knishes may be sold in delis in NY. - Someone will be stopping by your house to go through your family recipes, to be sure none of them are in any way similar to those your ancestors brought from the old country. The recipes will be destroyed, and anyone who complains will be arrested. - No more Carlos Santana, or anyone like him. His work is too much like "world music", representing Latin & African. - No more St. Patrick's Day. It's now illegal. - No more Nutcracker shows for the kiddies. Matter of fact, the vast majority of classical music will be banned. You might want to think about this big idea of yours. None of the classes you listed 'exclude' themselves. Similar to the Amish, except the Amish do not cause trouble. Amish want nothing to do with our culture. Muslims are similar. However they still want to make money, but dont want to accept any of the western ideas, like freedom for women, or other barbaric ideas. In general the Amish do not expect the rest of the country to change to fit their needs, Muslims tend to be the opposite Very good analogy. No it isn't. The majority of Muslims in this country participate fully in our culture, and enjoy the opportunities offered by the United States. One of my near neighbors is a Muslim family. The patriarch is a reknowned physician, the son is a builder-developer, the son's daughters participate in all sorts of activities in the local public schools, et cetera. My Iraqi friend of 20 years standing, a Muslim, owns a chain of tire stores, and his family is Americanized. I have a few other Muslim friends who also live the American life. I'm not saying there are no Muslims who want to avoid integration into our society, obviously there are. But to categorize "Muslims" here the way Fritz tries is just plain stupid. Well, of course. It's too bad you live in such an isolated part of the country, eh? Bad? Some might consider "isolation" a good thing. Remember that I grew up in NJ. I've seen the "non-isolated" way to live...and much prefer the way things are down here...as do many of the folks who move here from the "non-isolated" areas. But as far as I can tell, there's no sign on the way into Naples telling any particular race, ethnicity, sexual pursuasion or religion to stay out. There *is* one telling Democrats to stay out...so the few who are here must are holdovers from the pre-Civil War era. |
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