I recently watched a cable program on heavy weather sailing techniques.
During a reefing discussion the distinction was made between headsail roller
furling and roller reefing systems. How does one tell the difference?

Thanks in advance -

- Scott

Hi Dave -

The thing is, they were referring specifically to headsail systems; this is
why I was confused!

Thanks -

- Scott



"Dave" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 17:54:47 GMT, "Scott" said:

During a reefing discussion the distinction was made between headsail
roller
furling and roller reefing systems. How does one tell the difference?

I suspect that when they referred to roller reefing systems they were
referring to the system my old Islander 24 had, where one reefed the main
by
pulling out the boom from the mast, and rolling the sail around it like a
window shade. Never used the system myself as I installed slab reefing as
an
early modification.

On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 18:34:30 GMT, "Scott" wrote:

Hi Dave -

The thing is, they were referring specifically to headsail systems; this is
why I was confused!

Isn't roller furling vertical, i.e. in the mast, and roller reefing
horizontal, i.e. around the boom?

Cheers!


Remco



"Dave" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 17:54:47 GMT, "Scott" said:

During a reefing discussion the distinction was made between headsail
roller
furling and roller reefing systems. How does one tell the difference?

I suspect that when they referred to roller reefing systems they were
referring to the system my old Islander 24 had, where one reefed the main
by
pulling out the boom from the mast, and rolling the sail around it like a
window shade. Never used the system myself as I installed slab reefing as
an
early modification.

I'm pretty sure that they were trying to say that headsail (e.g., jib,genoa)
roller furling systems (i.e., systems that aid in putting away the headsail
after sailing) were different in some way from headsail reefing systems
(i.e., systems that allow one to use part of the headsail, rather than the
whole, during sailing in heavier air). They kept talking about one having
two independant swivels, though it seems to me that both types of systems
would need two independant swivels in order to work at all!

- Scott




"Remco Moedt" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 18:34:30 GMT, "Scott" wrote:

Hi Dave -

The thing is, they were referring specifically to headsail systems; this
is
why I was confused!

Isn't roller furling vertical, i.e. in the mast, and roller reefing
horizontal, i.e. around the boom?

Cheers!


Remco



"Dave" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 17:54:47 GMT, "Scott" said:

During a reefing discussion the distinction was made between headsail
roller
furling and roller reefing systems. How does one tell the difference?

I suspect that when they referred to roller reefing systems they were
referring to the system my old Islander 24 had, where one reefed the
main
by
pulling out the boom from the mast, and rolling the sail around it like
a
window shade. Never used the system myself as I installed slab reefing
as
an
early modification.

Scott wrote:
I recently watched a cable program on heavy weather sailing techniques.
During a reefing discussion the distinction was made between headsail roller
furling and roller reefing systems. How does one tell the difference?

Thanks in advance -

- Scott

Roller furling the jib works kinda like roller reefing on the main
(by winding the main around the boom, having a swivel bearing on the
boom gooseneck and if a topping lift is desired, or a secure
mainsheet attachment, at the boom end also) but the jib is wound
around the forestay or a foil fitted over it, which also needs two
swivel bearings, one at top, one at bottom. Some installations need
to cut the forestay to install swivels, some swivel around an intact
forestay. The more conventional term used is jib furling, to my
experience.

Trust a tv announcer to get details foggy.

Roller furling of the jib works ok until the wind pipes up or
something breaks or jams, usually the top swivel or drum rope. Then
you are up posiedon's ass. Using the jib furler to reef the jib may
not work as well as you expect, despite ads for luff padding.
Reducing jib sail area and maintaining good jib shape means changing
jibs, which is difficult to do with the luff tape reqired in jib
furlers, what with loose luffs all over the deck and side in a blow.
The longer it takes to decide you have an unsatisfactory situation
the worse it gets, according to Murphy. One option is double
grooved headfoils with furlers. You might find it easier to hoist a
small sail "in the lee of a larger one", as I have seen advertised,
I doubt it. Folly, all folly. Double headstays, jib downhauls and
ready hanked on storm sails may be best, depending on your
situation, tastes and budget. They snag each other some. Nothing is
perfect, except logic as a process, itself, by definition.

Slab reefing the main (by adjusting three lines always at the ready)
is far better than roller reefing. When it gets loud enough, strike
the jib and your rig had better balance well with a main triple
reefed try sail alone. Beyond that, its drogue time, sea anchor,
survival suit, tootsie rolls, barfing and epirb, buddy.

Cruising, racing and surviving are all closely linked.

Simplicity, endurance and fatigue also figure together.

Satisfaction comes from changing what you can and respecting what
you can't.

I kinda like the ideas of a catamaran / swath hull, hinged A frame
masts, loose footed sails, perhaps fishermen on wandering tacks for
going about, possibly on club booms, grossly adjustable fore and
back stays, and another adjustable foot stay or wandering halyard /
stay ready for a hanked on try sail for high winds. A stay from
'midships to part way up the split backstay might mount a shelter
for rain or sun. Sounds interesting, anyway.

Terry K

On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 18:55:29 GMT, "Scott" wrote:

I'm pretty sure that they were trying to say that headsail (e.g., jib,genoa)
roller furling systems (i.e., systems that aid in putting away the headsail
after sailing) were different in some way from headsail reefing systems
(i.e., systems that allow one to use part of the headsail, rather than the
whole, during sailing in heavier air). They kept talking about one having
two independant swivels, though it seems to me that both types of systems
would need two independant swivels in order to work at all!

Ah, sorry, I was mistaking the headsail for a mainsail....English
isn't my native language.

Cheers!


Remco



"Remco Moedt" wrote in message
.. .
On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 18:34:30 GMT, "Scott" wrote:

Hi Dave -

The thing is, they were referring specifically to headsail systems; this
is
why I was confused!

Isn't roller furling vertical, i.e. in the mast, and roller reefing
horizontal, i.e. around the boom?

Cheers!


Remco



"Dave" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 17:54:47 GMT, "Scott" said:

During a reefing discussion the distinction was made between headsail
roller
furling and roller reefing systems. How does one tell the difference?

I suspect that when they referred to roller reefing systems they were
referring to the system my old Islander 24 had, where one reefed the
main
by
pulling out the boom from the mast, and rolling the sail around it like
a
window shade. Never used the system myself as I installed slab reefing
as
an
early modification.

Scott,

Your confusion is as easily understood as the presenters.

There are some headsail rollers that specifically do not advise running
with the sail other than fully unrolled. These are typicaly the less
expensive (one had a three leter name I do not recall) versions and
often have no halyard sivel.

The better units will allow a partially unrolled headsail, but will
caution you that the sail has limited use as a reef (ie. 130 of a 155).
Most sailmakers will build you a padded luff sail to flatten the draft
at reefed setting. These can come close to working.

Your choice if you want to do this is to talk to your loft and discuss
the situation at some length.

Matt Colie A.Sloop "Bonne Ide'e"
Lifelong Waterman, Licensed Mariner and Perpetual Sailor


Scott wrote:

I recently watched a cable program on heavy weather sailing techniques.
During a reefing discussion the distinction was made between headsail roller
furling and roller reefing systems. How does one tell the difference?

Thanks in advance -

- Scott

There is no difference, some yachts can use the furling system to reduce the
sail area. So, you are using the furler to reef the jib.


"Scott" wrote in message
...
I recently watched a cable program on heavy weather sailing techniques.
During a reefing discussion the distinction was made between headsail
roller
furling and roller reefing systems. How does one tell the difference?

Thanks in advance -

- Scott

Scotty,

As long as everyone else is guessing I'll join in

Head Sail Furling and head sail reefing; The difference being the
ability to reduce Sail Area without a full Furl. That is head sail
reefing. Usually requirers a special cut Jib. This is head Sail reefing

Head Sail Furling would be the head sail fully out or fully furled and
stored. They can take any Standard Cut Sail but if you wanted to fly a
smaller jib you'd need to remove the large sail and set the new sail.
The advantage being a proper sail in both cases.
Disadvantage being many. Storing extra sails, Replacement cost of
multi number of sails but the main disadvantage would be the sail
handling of more than one sail at a time on the pointy end of the boat.
If you can do without a head sail (Furl on the stay) it is fine. I use
my 170 this way quite often.

Hope this helps

Ole thom




http://community.webtv.net/tassail/ThomsPage

http://community.webtv.net/tassail/Pneuma

Matt has the answer right on the money. Very simply, there are Furlers and Reefers. Reefing Systems are built to withstand the added torque put on the extrusions from the sail being reefed while the Furler is not.

Cheers, Rob