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#1
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Deceptive hydro drivers :-), New museum.
We recently had a discussion regarding whether or not it was "deceptive" to
refer to the speed of a boat in MPH rather than knots. I spent time this afternoon at a gathering that included a bunch of ex hydro drivers. As somebody said, "The old drivers are easy to pick out of the crowd, they're the guys who are walking with limps." Best line of the afternoon, "All you need to know to drive one of these boats is to go fast, and turn left." Um hmm, sure. Learned two things. 1) In about two weeks, there will be a brand new hydroplane and race boat museum opening in Kent, WA. There are a lot of vintage boats here in the NW, and an active group of guys who rebuild and restore them. The boats will rotate through the museum so that the display keeps changing. One of the ways the museum hopes to support itself will be hosting class reunions for graduates from the glory days of thunderboat racing here in the NW. Wayne Hill, VP of the museum, told me "We can provide a boat from just about any year in the 50's, 60's, and 70's. The classmates can have pictures taken with boats that were making local headlines when they graduated." 2) Those deceptive hydroplane drivers discuss speeds in MPH. :-) At the get together today, Craig McCaw's restored 1959 Miss Bardahl was looking sharp! A dark green hull so flawlessly maintained it could be used for a mirror. One of the Budweiser boats was also on hand, and is available for sale. I hate to think what it would cost to pump fuel into that 12-cylinder aircraft engine, but a guy would certainly be king of the lake almost anywhere he went. I did misunderstand the invitation, however. I was looking forward to an "armadillo barbecue" (never having eaten an armadillo), but it turned out that the name of the company that catered Billy Schumacher's event was "Armadillo Barbecue." Oh well, the chicken and ribs were both delicious. :-) |
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#2
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Deceptive hydro drivers :-), New museum.
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#3
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Deceptive hydro drivers :-), New museum.
The only people who like mph are
inland boaters, and those who'd like to inflate their numbers. This poor horse is going to get beat to death. If you walked into a donut shop and asked, "How much for a half dozen maple bars?" and the donut kid answered, "Sir, I'll sell you six maple bars for $4," is he trying to make you think you're getting more fatty poison than you're paying for? After all, the word "six" represents a higher number than the term "one-half". No. You're using two different standards to express the same thing, and both are accurate. If you give the kid $4 and he gives you six maple bars instead of "half a dozen" you would have no basis at all for complaint about the quantity received. Now, if the kid tells you he's going to sell you half a dozen for $4, and sacks up only half a single maple bar instead.......that's deceptive. :-) Maybe I'm wrong Chuck but I've never thought of you as an inland boater. Like the vast majority of boaters in the Pacific NW, I do spend the bulk of my time in "Inland Waters". Inland COLREGS apply everywhere south of a point at the head of Admiralty Inlet, east of Deception Pass, and all the way up the lee side of Vancouver Island. The most time I ever spend in a typical year in any area not considered "inland" is on the occassion or two that I might cross the Strait of Juan de Fuca rather than do an end run up the lee side of Whidbey Island. We can and do experience some lumpy conditions at times, with steep waves at short intervals. Am I, or most boaters in the Pacific NW, routinely braving 6-7 foot breaking waves and flying spray? No. Been there, proved my boat is capable of handling it, and would prefer to avoid frequent repetitions of same. If I'm heading north and the Strait is a snarly mess, I'm not too proud to run up the inside. As I have often told the Mrs. when we're pounding through head seas and collecting eel grass in the windshield wipers.. "All that screaming isn't helping a damn thing." My little tug travels in knots. Heck, you could multiply some of my cruise speeds by 1.15 and still wind up with single digits. A whizzy express cruiser zipping along on plane can be accurately logged in either MPH or knots, and as long as the standard being used is disclosed there is no element of deception involved. |
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#4
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Deceptive hydro drivers :-), New museum.
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#5
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Deceptive hydro drivers :-), New museum.
Wayne.B wrote: the key thing is the distance scale on your charts. ?????????? If the distance scale is in statute miles, i.e., 5280 feet - then you are an inland boater. I suspect your charts are otherwise and so also should your boat reports except for the dinkiest lake craft. Even dead horses can kick ... Charts for Puget Sound depict inland waters - and - are printed with a scale in nautical miles. Just as Chuck stated, "Inland COLREGS apply everywhere south of a point at the head of Admiralty Inlet, east of Deception Pass, and all the way up the lee side of Vancouver Island." The chart for Lake Washington Ship Canal and Lake Washington (18447) provides a scale for nautical, statute, and yards ... the "key thing" that determines "inland" is the COLREGS, not the chart scale. Rick |
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#6
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Deceptive hydro drivers :-), New museum.
On Mon, 17 May 2004 00:32:37 GMT, Rick
wrote: The chart for Lake Washington Ship Canal and Lake Washington (18447) provides a scale for nautical, statute, and yards ... the "key thing" that determines "inland" is the COLREGS, not the chart scale. ============================================== For COLREGS purposes you are correct of course and the issue was never in dispute. For the purpose of disuading Chuck from reporting boat performance numbers in mph when he most surely knows better, then I am correct. :-) As an FYI, Mrs B and I have gone to contract on a GB 49. The survey and sea trial are scheduled for tomorrow, full newsgroup reports to follow soon thereafter. Performance will be reported in kts of course. The numbers will be low anyway you slice them but it will travel at those speeds for a LOOOONG time without a fuel stop. |
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#7
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Deceptive hydro drivers :-), New museum.
In the spirit of ensuring a totally lifeless horse, the key thing is
the distance scale on your charts. If the distance scale is in statute miles, i.e., 5280 feet - then you are an inland boater. I suspect your charts are otherwise and so also should your boat reports except for the dinkiest lake craft. So you're saying it's OK, in your book, to use MPH on an inland lake? Does Lake Washington count? |
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#8
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Deceptive hydro drivers :-), New museum.
"Gould 0738" wrote in message ... In the spirit of ensuring a totally lifeless horse, the key thing is the distance scale on your charts. If the distance scale is in statute miles, i.e., 5280 feet - then you are an inland boater. I suspect your charts are otherwise and so also should your boat reports except for the dinkiest lake craft. So you're saying it's OK, in your book, to use MPH on an inland lake? Does Lake Washington count? People that are not necessarily boaters are the hydro spectators. Whether they are unlimiteds or crackerbox boats. They run in circles. All people understand MPH, but most do not understand Knots is reference to speed. |
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#9
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Deceptive hydro drivers :-), New museum.
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#10
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Deceptive hydro drivers :-), New museum.
Gould 0738 wrote:
The only people who like mph are inland boaters, and those who'd like to inflate their numbers. This poor horse is going to get beat to death. If you walked into a donut shop and asked, "How much for a half dozen maple bars?" and the donut kid answered, "Sir, I'll sell you six maple bars for $4," is he trying to make you think you're getting more fatty poison than you're paying for? After all, the word "six" represents a higher number than the term "one-half". No. You're using two different standards to express the same thing, and both are accurate. If you give the kid $4 and he gives you six maple bars instead of "half a dozen" you would have no basis at all for complaint about the quantity received. Now, if the kid tells you he's going to sell you half a dozen for $4, and sacks up only half a single maple bar instead.......that's deceptive. :-) Maybe I'm wrong Chuck but I've never thought of you as an inland boater. Like the vast majority of boaters in the Pacific NW, I do spend the bulk of my time in "Inland Waters". Inland COLREGS apply everywhere south of a point at the head of Admiralty Inlet, east of Deception Pass, and all the way up the lee side of Vancouver Island. The most time I ever spend in a typical year in any area not considered "inland" is on the occassion or two that I might cross the Strait of Juan de Fuca rather than do an end run up the lee side of Whidbey Island. We can and do experience some lumpy conditions at times, with steep waves at short intervals. Am I, or most boaters in the Pacific NW, routinely braving 6-7 foot breaking waves and flying spray? No. Been there, proved my boat is capable of handling it, and would prefer to avoid frequent repetitions of same. If I'm heading north and the Strait is a snarly mess, I'm not too proud to run up the inside. As I have often told the Mrs. when we're pounding through head seas and collecting eel grass in the windshield wipers.. "All that screaming isn't helping a damn thing." My little tug travels in knots. Heck, you could multiply some of my cruise speeds by 1.15 and still wind up with single digits. A whizzy express cruiser zipping along on plane can be accurately logged in either MPH or knots, and as long as the standard being used is disclosed there is no element of deception involved. You've missed the point Chuck. (i) "Charts" are in nautical miles (1 min of latitude) so if you are traveling true nth/sth then you can translate you speed in knots X the time at that speed directly onto the chart as your distance traveled (save currents etc etc ). (ii) Traveling east west, then a minute of longitude is only 1 nautical mile when you are on the equator. That's why "charts" have a different scale for the longitude at each particular latitude, so you can determine distances with dividers if you so wish. (iii) To determine distance off or traveled or much else any distance/speed etc relative to a "chart" in a marine environment, you need to calculate it with any of the myriad spherical triangle formulas (say diff lat X secant course), because you rarely travel far directly true nth/sth or est/wst, most tracks are an amalgam of latitude (@ 1 min = 1 n/mile) & longitude (@ various & constantly varying as your latitude changes) (iv) Most charts (not all) are mercator projection, which somewhat distort (particularly in higher latitudes where you are), however so long as everyone uses n/miles then the diam of the earth ensures we all get the same answers. (v) Miles kilometers etc are used on "maps" & for runabouts etc where it's not really important. If a boat is used as a real boat the speed should be expressed in knots, it's just so embarrassing when people use MPH because in true navigation it's as meaningless as m/s, or chains per hour, both are a true measure of the boat's progress through the water, but not much use when assessing the progress of a boat on a chart. Deceptive boat broker types usually have no clue as to the subtle but most important difference between knots & MPH so instinctively spruik the higher number & lower fuel consumption number. Some don't do it deliberately it's just how they make their way through life. K |
Hybrid Mode
