Keenan & Julie wrote:

in article , Frederick Burroughs at
wrote on 6/19/05 10:47 AM:


Keenan & Julie wrote:


in article , Frederick Burroughs at
wrote on 6/19/05 9:47 AM:



Brian wrote:



Waxing the boat will make it go slower as the wax will repel the thin
layer of water called "Laminar layer". Laminar flow must be maintained
for the layer to make proper contact along the hull to form a so called
slip stream. Only way to do this is to compound or wet sand the hull to
make the laminar layer stick to the hull surface.



But, if you sand too coursely don't you create turbulances that
increase drag? Why are surfboards waxed?


Aaaaaa! Stop! Stop! ROFL


You could have a sharkskin textured slipover designed for your kayak,
similar to the swim wear worn by some athletes. In designer colors
and patterns, it is worn by your kayak to increase speed and get
envious stares.


You owe me a dry pair of undies. Only I wasn't wearing any, so you owe me a
mattress.

K

PS: What if you use the slipover with a shorter boat and a wood paddle that
is reinforced with resin vs a longer boat that is waxed but is powered by a
figerglass paddle?


Does the fiberglass paddle incorporate corrugated surface design,
effectively doubling surface area and efficiency? Then, the answer is
obvious.




--
"This president has destroyed the country, the economy,
the relationship with the rest of the world.
He's a monster in the White House. He should resign."

- Hunter S. Thompson, speaking to an antiwar audience in 2003.

Frederick Burroughs wrote:
You could have a sharkskin textured slipover designed for your kayak,
similar to the swim wear worn by some athletes. In designer colors
and patterns, it is worn by your kayak to increase speed and get
envious stares.





--
"This president has destroyed the country, the economy,
the relationship with the rest of the world.
He's a monster in the White House. He should resign."

- Hunter S. Thompson, speaking to an antiwar audience in 2003.

I wouldn't do that. I mean if you are in favor of a democratic world
for sardines...

"The Forum for Losers.....for those who have no life."

I think we kayakers got more in common with sardines. Think about it:
WE ALWAYS ARE AT THE BOTTOM OF THE FOOD CHAIN. Yet you see too many
sharks around here. They must be trying to stop the little fish from
organizing.

Well, next time you see one of those fake kayakers out there with the
big teeth sticking out, say, "Hey PREDATOR, you are too big for a
kayak!"

in article , Frederick Burroughs at
wrote on 6/19/05 11:48 AM:

Keenan & Julie wrote:

in article , Frederick Burroughs at
wrote on 6/19/05 10:47 AM:


Keenan & Julie wrote:


in article , Frederick Burroughs at
wrote on 6/19/05 9:47 AM:



Brian wrote:



Waxing the boat will make it go slower as the wax will repel the thin
layer of water called "Laminar layer". Laminar flow must be maintained
for the layer to make proper contact along the hull to form a so called
slip stream. Only way to do this is to compound or wet sand the hull to
make the laminar layer stick to the hull surface.



But, if you sand too coursely don't you create turbulances that
increase drag? Why are surfboards waxed?


Aaaaaa! Stop! Stop! ROFL


You could have a sharkskin textured slipover designed for your kayak,
similar to the swim wear worn by some athletes. In designer colors
and patterns, it is worn by your kayak to increase speed and get
envious stares.


You owe me a dry pair of undies. Only I wasn't wearing any, so you owe me a
mattress.

K

PS: What if you use the slipover with a shorter boat and a wood paddle that
is reinforced with resin vs a longer boat that is waxed but is powered by a
figerglass paddle?


Does the fiberglass paddle incorporate corrugated surface design,
effectively doubling surface area and efficiency? Then, the answer is
obvious.

Perhaps, but I forgot to mention the bent shaft with muskrat grip.

K

...stuff deleted

Lookee, Lookee what I found on the web site that someone posted
with Sea Kayaker magazine data:

Prijon Calabria Current Design Andromeda
LOA 4.42m (14.5ft) 5.26m (17.25ft)
LWL 3.96m (13 ft) 4.19m (13.75ft)
Drag 16.7 lb 18.0 lb

So here we have two _real_ sea kayaks, one that is more than 17 foot
long and another that is over 14 feet long (one 19% longer) yet
their waterline lengths are 13 and 13.75 feet respectively (one
only 6% longer).

Note in particular that the _shorter_ kayak has less resistance
at 4.5 knots.

Mike,

This is a pretty good comparison. I assume that the two boats were
unladen. Geared up for a long tour, however, the shorter boat should
ride deeper in the water (the LWL of the Andromeda should increase
significantly as the hull rides deeper), while the Calabria already has
most of its hull in the water. One would expect the drag to increase (as
well as the beam of the boat) as weight is added. I think this is where
we'd begin to see a performance hit on the shorter boat.

That is a heck of a lot of hull out of the water on the Andromeda,
however. Must be a real joy in wind (though probably pretty fun in surf
and waves).

Rick

donquijote1954 wrote:


Frederick Burroughs wrote:

You could have a sharkskin textured slipover designed for your kayak,
similar to the swim wear worn by some athletes. In designer colors
and patterns, it is worn by your kayak to increase speed and get
envious stares.

I wouldn't do that. I mean if you are in favor of a democratic world
for sardines...

"The Forum for Losers.....for those who have no life."

I think we kayakers got more in common with sardines. Think about it:
WE ALWAYS ARE AT THE BOTTOM OF THE FOOD CHAIN. Yet you see too many
sharks around here. They must be trying to stop the little fish from
organizing.

Well, next time you see one of those fake kayakers out there with the
big teeth sticking out, say, "Hey PREDATOR, you are too big for a
kayak!"


The slipover is sharkskin "textured" which results in improved laminar
flow, and theoretically less drag. It is essentially hosiery to be
worn by the kayak. The fabric can display any design and color you
choose, great white, barracuda, guppy, gleeful pink or camouflage...
You can even choose a pattern of foam and broken styrofoam, to blend
in perfectly with many of today's rivers and beaches.





--
"This president has destroyed the country, the economy,
the relationship with the rest of the world.
He's a monster in the White House. He should resign."

- Hunter S. Thompson, speaking to an antiwar audience in 2003.

On 19-Jun-2005, Frederick Burroughs wrote:

Why are surfboards waxed?

Before answering that question - look up _how_ surfboards
are waxed. And with what kind of wax.

Mike

On 19-Jun-2005, Frederick Burroughs wrote:

You could have a sharkskin textured slipover designed for your kayak,
similar to the swim wear worn by some athletes. In designer colors
and patterns, it is worn by your kayak to increase speed and get
envious stares.

The Thorpedo no longer wears a full sharkskin swimsuit but hasn't
slowed down. There is a significant number of folks who believe
these sharkskin suits had more to do with psychology than speed.

Research on texturing the hulls of sailboats has found that there
is no advantage unless the vessel is sailed on a single tack
with specific conditions. What makes the hull fast in one
configuration doesn't work in another.

Mike

"Michael Daly" wrote in message
...
On 19-Jun-2005, Frederick Burroughs wrote:

You could have a sharkskin textured slipover designed for your kayak,
similar to the swim wear worn by some athletes. In designer colors
and patterns, it is worn by your kayak to increase speed and get
envious stares.

The Thorpedo no longer wears a full sharkskin swimsuit but hasn't
slowed down. There is a significant number of folks who believe
these sharkskin suits had more to do with psychology than speed.

Research on texturing the hulls of sailboats has found that there
is no advantage unless the vessel is sailed on a single tack
with specific conditions. What makes the hull fast in one
configuration doesn't work in another.

Mike

I can't tell if Mike is playing along or being serious. I think it's the
latter, but that's even scarier than the original discussion.

On 20-Jun-2005, Rick wrote:

Geared up for a long tour, however, the shorter boat should
ride deeper in the water (the LWL of the Andromeda should increase
significantly as the hull rides deeper), while the Calabria already has
most of its hull in the water.

Adding 50lb to each kayak only makes the difference in waterline lengths
change from 5.8% to 6.2% - not very much.

One would expect the drag to increase (as
well as the beam of the boat) as weight is added.

The Andromeda actual increases its wetted surface more.

That is a heck of a lot of hull out of the water on the Andromeda,
however. Must be a real joy in wind (though probably pretty fun in surf
and waves).

I have only paddled the Andromeda for an hour or so in moderate
conditions. It sucks. I can't say anything good about that
kayak... well, the colour was nice.

It's a Derek Hutchinson design. Folks familiar with my opinions on
his boat design "skills" will know that I'd expect the results the
kayak yeilded. When I talked to Mike Henderson of Current Designs
the year before the kayak was sold, he said the kayak in development
would be "long and fast" compared to the GulfStream. It is long
and slow - much slower than the Gulfstream. How slow? - there are
a whole whack of plastic and folding kayaks that are faster.

Mike

Michael Daly wrote:

Frederick Burroughs wrote:

Why are surfboards waxed?

Before answering that question - look up _how_ surfboards
are waxed. And with what kind of wax.


Roger. The deck of a surfboard is waxed to provide traction for the
rider's feet. Which begs the question; Given two kayaks of identical
size and shape, will the one constructed of hydrophilic material have
a speed advantage (however slight) over than one constructed of
hydrophobic material, all else being the same?





--
"This president has destroyed the country, the economy,
the relationship with the rest of the world.
He's a monster in the White House. He should resign."

- Hunter S. Thompson, speaking to an antiwar audience in 2003.