Um, does the rubbish below somehow exonerate American torturers?

It's the "lookie there!" defense/logic of a good many people on the right.

"You think you caught a Republican pulling some dirty crap? We won't even
discuss that, but instead we will switch the subject to Clinton's blow job.
Lookie there! Lookie there!"

"You think some aspect of conservatism doesn't stand up to logical scrutiny? We
won't even discuss that, but instead we will
throw some wacky iberal idea up for discussion and redirect the conversation.
Lookie there! Lookie there!"

"There's a chance or an allegation that a tiny percentage of our miltary
personnel are not behaving like professional soldiers in Iraq? We certainly
won't adress that either, just point out that the behavior of the regime we
feel consisted of despicable intolerable, inhuman *******s did even worse!
Lookie there! Lookie there!"

There is no doubt that we have been regaled with all the gruesome details of
hideous abuses committed by many of Saddam's interrogators. Personally, I
believe those stories have some foundation in fact.

There is also no doubt that the actions of our own *worst* actors will be cast
as typical American tactics and indicative of
American philosophies and values. The pendulum swings both ways. If we are as
truly civilized as we aspire to be, we should try to see that our own *worst*
actions aren't all that bad, and that stories of atrocities and torture by
Americans do not have a foundation in fact.

When the military justice system is arresting and charging US interrogators who
step over the line into torture and sadism, the system is working about as well
as we can hope.

"Gould 0738" wrote in message
...
Um, does the rubbish below somehow exonerate American torturers?

It's the "lookie there!" defense/logic of a good many people on the right.

"You think you caught a Republican pulling some dirty crap? We won't even
discuss that, but instead we will switch the subject to Clinton's blow
job.
Lookie there! Lookie there!"

"You think some aspect of conservatism doesn't stand up to logical
scrutiny? We
won't even discuss that, but instead we will
throw some wacky iberal idea up for discussion and redirect the
conversation.
Lookie there! Lookie there!"

"There's a chance or an allegation that a tiny percentage of our miltary
personnel are not behaving like professional soldiers in Iraq? We
certainly
won't adress that either, just point out that the behavior of the regime
we
feel consisted of despicable intolerable, inhuman *******s did even worse!
Lookie there! Lookie there!"

There is no doubt that we have been regaled with all the gruesome details
of
hideous abuses committed by many of Saddam's interrogators. Personally, I
believe those stories have some foundation in fact.

There is also no doubt that the actions of our own *worst* actors will be
cast
as typical American tactics and indicative of
American philosophies and values. The pendulum swings both ways. If we are
as
truly civilized as we aspire to be, we should try to see that our own
*worst*
actions aren't all that bad, and that stories of atrocities and torture by
Americans do not have a foundation in fact.

When the military justice system is arresting and charging US
interrogators who
step over the line into torture and sadism, the system is working about as
well
as we can hope.



Oh, BULL****! Chuck. They have been arrested, the allegations are being
addressed. They are innocent until proven guilty. Your illustrious Clinton
Regime used the same tactic, except for the bright light, on a whole bunch
of people before burning them up in Waco. You liberals all defended the
same tactics and also the lies that were used to bring in US Military tanks
(against the law, except for drug enforcement). The allegations are being
addressed. This is not a Mai Lai type situation. They are not accused to
beating, electrifying parts of the body, raping his daughter / wife in front
of him. The fact that they have been arrested, shows the military is
addressing the boundries of conduct.
Bill

Oh, BULL****! Chuck. They have been arrested, the allegations are being
addressed. They are innocent until proven guilty. Your illustrious Clinton
Regime used the same tactic, except for the bright light, on a whole bunch
of people before burning them up in Waco. You liberals all defended the
same tactics and also the lies that were used to bring in US Military tanks
(against the law, except for drug enforcement). The allegations are being
addressed. This is not a Mai Lai type situation. They are not accused to
beating, electrifying parts of the body, raping his daughter / wife in front
of him. The fact that they have been arrested, shows the military is
addressing the boundries of conduct.
Bill

Inhale slowly and deeply, Bill. I was addressing the response from some guy who
seemed to imply it didn't matter what we did to prisoners in Iraq becuase the
Saddam Hussein team had done far worse.

If we are screwing up, or some of our guys and gals are, we should address it
as we seem to be doing........

I'm the guy who said....
When the military justice system is arresting and charging US
interrogators who
step over the line into torture and sadism, the system is working about as
well
as we can hope.

You get right up to the edge of the "Lookie There!" defense yourself.......

Your illustrious Clinton
Regime used the same tactic, except for the bright light, on a whole bunch
of people before burning them up in Waco.

And then you get out of some very thin ice, indeed, with this goofy line:

You liberals all defended the
same tactics and also the lies that were used to bring in US Military tanks
(against the law, except for drug enforcement).

Let's see here. According to you, we liberals *all* defended the tactics and
the lies used to bring military tanks against the Koresh compound in Waco. Hey,
I'm a liberal. I have been for 35 or 40 years. Refresh my memory, just exactly
how did I defend the lies and tactics used to bring tanks in to Waco?

See how you build a trap for yourself when you stereotype and overstate?

I apologize if you are not the one berating the military for abuse. I read
the piece and thought you were the one. As to the Liberals supporting the
Waco disaster, there were a myriad of liberals all saying they had it
coming, and should not have resisted and the government was correct. Not
being a Google sort, I will not go back and see if you were the 1% of the
liberals who did not rise up in support of Janet Reno. I do remember any
Lib on this board saying it was wrong, so you may be condemned by omission
instead of commission.
Bill

"Gould 0738" wrote in message
...
Oh, BULL****! Chuck. They have been arrested, the allegations are being
addressed. They are innocent until proven guilty. Your illustrious
Clinton
Regime used the same tactic, except for the bright light, on a whole
bunch
of people before burning them up in Waco. You liberals all defended the
same tactics and also the lies that were used to bring in US Military
tanks
(against the law, except for drug enforcement). The allegations are
being
addressed. This is not a Mai Lai type situation. They are not accused
to
beating, electrifying parts of the body, raping his daughter / wife in
front
of him. The fact that they have been arrested, shows the military is
addressing the boundries of conduct.
Bill

Inhale slowly and deeply, Bill. I was addressing the response from some
guy who
seemed to imply it didn't matter what we did to prisoners in Iraq becuase
the
Saddam Hussein team had done far worse.

If we are screwing up, or some of our guys and gals are, we should address
it
as we seem to be doing........

I'm the guy who said....
When the military justice system is arresting and charging US
interrogators who
step over the line into torture and sadism, the system is working about
as
well
as we can hope.

You get right up to the edge of the "Lookie There!" defense
yourself.......

Your illustrious Clinton
Regime used the same tactic, except for the bright light, on a whole
bunch
of people before burning them up in Waco.

And then you get out of some very thin ice, indeed, with this goofy line:

You liberals all defended the
same tactics and also the lies that were used to bring in US Military
tanks
(against the law, except for drug enforcement).

Let's see here. According to you, we liberals *all* defended the tactics
and
the lies used to bring military tanks against the Koresh compound in Waco.
Hey,
I'm a liberal. I have been for 35 or 40 years. Refresh my memory, just
exactly
how did I defend the lies and tactics used to bring tanks in to Waco?

See how you build a trap for yourself when you stereotype and overstate?