We are shopping for a fishing boat and have narrowed it down to a Grady
White 28 foot walkaround with twin 225 outboards or an Albemarle 28 foot
walkaround with twin 200 diesels with jackshafts and stern drives. The clean
transom of the inboard is sure appealing, and the Albemarle people claim
that having the engine weight in the middle of the boat gives a much better
ride. But really, how much better? Is it a big difference or one of those
things that is real but subtle?

Also what about noise? It seems that having 2 turbocharged diesels right
under you would be a lot noisier than having a couple of 4 strokes hanging
off the transom.

Any other comments about this choice will be welcome. Thanks.

--
Peter Aitken

Remove the crap from my email address before using.

On Mon, 28 Mar 2005 20:49:37 GMT, "Peter Aitken"
wrote:

We are shopping for a fishing boat and have narrowed it down to a Grady
White 28 foot walkaround with twin 225 outboards or an Albemarle 28 foot
walkaround with twin 200 diesels with jackshafts and stern drives. The clean
transom of the inboard is sure appealing, and the Albemarle people claim
that having the engine weight in the middle of the boat gives a much better
ride. But really, how much better? Is it a big difference or one of those
things that is real but subtle?

Also what about noise? It seems that having 2 turbocharged diesels right
under you would be a lot noisier than having a couple of 4 strokes hanging
off the transom.

Any other comments about this choice will be welcome. Thanks.

I had twin FICHTS (225) on my old Contender (31') and new E-TECs (twin
225) on the new Contender Fisharound (31'). For my money, the new two
stroke outboard technology beats four strokes hands down both in
terms of efficiency, weight and reliability. The "clean" transom
isn't really as clean as you think - there still stern drives hanging
off the stern.

I had looked at a Topaz in the same category which had twin diesels,
but I can't sell myself on diesel power for this size boat. My boat
will be just as quick and while I've been informed otherwise by people
on this group that I respect, I still think that outboards are more
efficient - in particular these new E-TECs.

There are those who will disagree, but for what it's worth outboards
are better.

Later,

Tom

"Peter Aitken" wrote in message
. com...
We are shopping for a fishing boat and have narrowed it down to a Grady
White 28 foot walkaround with twin 225 outboards or an Albemarle 28 foot
walkaround with twin 200 diesels with jackshafts and stern drives. The
clean
transom of the inboard is sure appealing, and the Albemarle people claim
that having the engine weight in the middle of the boat gives a much
better
ride. But really, how much better? Is it a big difference or one of those
things that is real but subtle?

Also what about noise? It seems that having 2 turbocharged diesels right
under you would be a lot noisier than having a couple of 4 strokes hanging
off the transom.

Any other comments about this choice will be welcome. Thanks.

--
Peter Aitken


Other factors to consider:
Trailering or not?
Fuel Economy- diesels should be much better for comparable speeds and marina
diesel tend sto be 10 to 15 cents/gallon cheaper then gasoline.
Cruising Speed desired and top speed-Twin OB GW should push 35 to 40 Knots
top end while the Albemarle will be hard pressed to get to 30 Knots.
Maintenance Costs: If you od you rown then the OBs adn the diesels will
probably cost the same for routine procedures but anything out of the
ordinary and diesel techs bill at $96 per hour here in Wisconsin and parts
are not cheap.
Finally, diesel exhaust fumes are often unpleasant to numerous people.

Fred

On Mon, 28 Mar 2005 21:10:58 GMT, "Fred Miller"
wrote:

~~ snippage ~~

marina
diesel tend sto be 10 to 15 cents/gallon cheaper then gasoline.

What country do you live in? :)

Later,

Tom

Peter Aitken wrote:
We are shopping for a fishing boat and have narrowed it down to a Grady
White 28 foot walkaround with twin 225 outboards or an Albemarle 28 foot
walkaround with twin 200 diesels with jackshafts and stern drives. The clean
transom of the inboard is sure appealing, and the Albemarle people claim
that having the engine weight in the middle of the boat gives a much better
ride. But really, how much better? Is it a big difference or one of those
things that is real but subtle?

Also what about noise? It seems that having 2 turbocharged diesels right
under you would be a lot noisier than having a couple of 4 strokes hanging
off the transom.

Any other comments about this choice will be welcome. Thanks.



I'd vote for outboards in a 28 ftr unless you propose to do lots of
coastal passage making where fuel consumption cost and range might be an
issue.

If you go outboard my suggestion is don't under any circumstance go for
a 2 stroke & worse anything 2 stroke DFI, this is a dead technology with
the French about the only ones left now still trying to spruik it.
Yamaha is just plugging the market till the 4 stokes thing is settled
which will then only leave the French offering & renamed or not, they
will fail as Ficht did for the same reasons.

The new bigger 4 stroke OBs are still not as fuel efficient as the
diesels (the difference is about 15-20% HP for HP but the OBs are
lighter so you'll need less HP speed for speed narrowing the difference)



K

& the Krause lie of the day is a newie but a goody:-) This idiot has
never been able to even begin to enter any coastal nav thread much less
the many celest ones over the years, yet he recently produced this lie,
well it's another classic Krause lie:-)

Have a read of this I mean it!!! He's a nut case a complete nutter:-)


I took my *first* course, in piloting, with my then best friend,
Steve, when
we were about 11-12 years old, by special dispensation of the US Power
Squadron in New Haven, Connecticut. The class was held in the
evenings in the
basement of one of the Sheffield scientific buildings, on Prospect
Street, if
I recall, on the campus of Yale University, across from Woolsey Hall. Our
parents dropped us off and picked us up; the classes were in the
evenings.

We were at that time the two youngest enrollees in such a course in the
history of the USPS. We completed the course successfully. It was
about 45
years ago, when piloting and navigation were done with hand instruments.

How did we get in at such an early age? Both of us had started yacht club
sailboat racing in dinghies at the age of 8, and by the time we were
11, were
working individually and as a team, competing successfully in southern
Connecticut junior racing circuits. It also didn't hurt that my
father was a
boat dealer and marina operator and also a by-then retired boat racer
of some
fame, and that Steve's dad was a well-known sailboater out of the
Branford,
Connecticut, area.

Steve now sails out of the Maritime Provinces.

Also Sprach K. Smith :

If you go outboard my suggestion is don't under any circumstance go for
a 2 stroke & worse anything 2 stroke DFI, this is a dead technology with
the French about the only ones left now still trying to spruik it.
Yamaha is just plugging the market till the 4 stokes thing is settled
which will then only leave the French offering & renamed or not, they
will fail as Ficht did for the same reasons.

Pardon me, could you please post in English instead of Insane?

Thanks.

Dan

--
A burro is an ass. A burrow is a hole in the ground.

Now can you tell the difference?

On 29 Mar 2005 18:17:35 GMT, Marshall Banana wrote:

Also Sprach K. Smith :

If you go outboard my suggestion is don't under any circumstance go for
a 2 stroke & worse anything 2 stroke DFI, this is a dead technology with
the French about the only ones left now still trying to spruik it.
Yamaha is just plugging the market till the 4 stokes thing is settled
which will then only leave the French offering & renamed or not, they
will fail as Ficht did for the same reasons.

Pardon me, could you please post in English instead of Insane?

Allow me.

FICHTs suck.

Later,

Tom

Peter Aitken wrote:
We are shopping for a fishing boat and have narrowed it down to a
Grady
White 28 foot walkaround with twin 225 outboards or an Albemarle 28
foot
walkaround with twin 200 diesels with jackshafts and stern drives.
The clean
transom of the inboard is sure appealing, and the Albemarle people
claim
that having the engine weight in the middle of the boat gives a much
better
ride. But really, how much better? Is it a big difference or one of
those
things that is real but subtle?

Also what about noise? It seems that having 2 turbocharged diesels
right
under you would be a lot noisier than having a couple of 4 strokes
hanging
off the transom.

Any other comments about this choice will be welcome. Thanks.

--
Peter Aitken

Remove the crap from my email address before using.

Pete, first off, forget about what the outboard people say about speed,
their fast, on nice days. On bad days, their not so fast, or you can
run them fast and beat the hell out of yourself (if your in your 20's
or early 30's, no big deal, 40 and over the pain last a lot longer).
Yes, most of the waves they take just fine, it's just those big ones
now and then that after several hours start to add up. Their's nothing
worse than having to hang on for dear life

My old 27 Phoenix with inboards was slower than the Grady White crowd
in shore, but outside, when the sea's kick up, like they do late in the
day, I just ran away from them. They would go out at 30 knots, if at
all, and come home at 16. I'd go out at 24 knots, and come home at 23
(straight inboards have a definite advantage in poor sea conditions).

That being said, get away from the idea of really high speed, and start
looking realistic crusing speeds and operating cost, the diesels have
the clear advantage. Yes, they cost more, but back off the throttle and
they burn very little fuel and they are reliable.

Don't get me wrong, I like outboards, on small boats used near shore.
But if you intend to run this boat a good distance offshore frequently
you will run into bad weather, their's just no way to avoid it, the
weather man is wrong all the time. The Albemarle should run much better
and faster in normal conditions because of the weight distribution and
the extra weight from the engines which should help keep the boat in
the water rather than leaping from wave to wave. The diesel engines
will out last the outboards, and the boat will hold it's value much
better. The GW with outboards is a nice boat, but it's a "me too" boat,
lots of them around, nothing special about it.

Just my two cents.

John

On 29 Mar 2005 09:33:10 -0800, "Capt John"
wrote:

~~ snippage ~~

Pete, first off, forget about what the outboard people say about speed,
their fast, on nice days. On bad days, their not so fast, or you can
run them fast and beat the hell out of yourself (if your in your 20's
or early 30's, no big deal, 40 and over the pain last a lot longer).
Yes, most of the waves they take just fine, it's just those big ones
now and then that after several hours start to add up. Their's nothing
worse than having to hang on for dear life

My Contender (31') rode most comfortably in heavy weather and at
moderate speeds - say 25/30 mph. Now if you want to be an idiot about
it and run WOT, then you are right. I'm expecting the same from the
new Fisharound.

I can also trim bow attitude with the engines which you can't do on an
inboard. The ride is dry and safe - and reasonably fast.

The key word there is reasonably. I can put the boat airborne on a
nice day in Narragansett Bay if I really work at it.

~~ snippage ~~

The Albemarle should run much better and faster in normal conditions
because of the weight distribution and the extra weight from the engines
which should help keep the boat in the water rather than leaping from
wave to wave.

I agree with you on this - diesel boats are much heavier which makes
them plow much more readily than an outboard powered boat. With the
boat "in the waves" is exactly the point - movement is much more
marked on an inboard boat than an outboard - it's a difference in
weight balance.

The idea is not to make the boat sit down and ride up and down, but to
carefully balance the boats movement "through" the wave rather than
ride up and down the wave movement cycle.

The diesel engines will out last the outboards, and the boat will hold
it's value much better.

I can agree with this, but then again, what boat truly holds value
over it's purchase price?

Not many.

The GW with outboards is a nice boat, but it's a "me too" boat,
lots of them around, nothing special about it.

Now there is something we can agree on. :)

Although you do know that we're both going to get pounded on by the GW
owners on this group?

Just my two cents.

Ditto. :)

And as always, I'm more than open to being proved wrong.

Occasionally, I am wrong you know.

Later,

Tom

On Mon, 28 Mar 2005 20:49:37 GMT, "Peter Aitken"
wrote:

Also what about noise? It seems that having 2 turbocharged diesels right
under you would be a lot noisier than having a couple of 4 strokes hanging
off the transom.

That is true with regard to noise. The only really compelling reason
to go diesel is fuel range as far as I'm concerned. For the same
tankage you will be able to go about twice as far. I'd also tend to
agree that the ride would be somewhat better with the weight in the
middle but the advantage of that is hard to quantify.

As others have mentioned, the outboards will be faster and probably
easier/cheaper to maintain. Diesels probably have the edge on
longevity and resale value. The argument between 2 stroke and 4
stroke outboards usually takes on a religious tone but there is no
question that the 2 strokes are lighter.