KMAN wrote:
in article ,
Tinkerntom
at wrote on 3/13/05 8:34 PM:


KMAN wrote:
...snip...

BTW, I do not believe in reincarnation, and DK was ushered into
the
afterlife to stay. So we will just have to continue what we do so
well;
SW telling you about annoying the whole world, and me trying to
figure
out how to tell the whole world that "God so Loved the whole
world,
that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes on Him
shall
not perish, but have everlasting life!"

Now that could be just a foretaste of better things to come, so
be
nice
to me or I will pray for you! Which I am sure will totally creep
you
out knowing that I am praying for you, and looking for additional
opportunities to aim my unlimited supply of God's Love, at your
heart!
Of course I will probably be praying for you anyway, so its a
win/win
at least from my side of the path! TnT

I really and truly find it hard to believe that you are not a
chronic
user
of hard drugs.

Oh but I do, get high that is, and strongly recommend a various
assortment of the highest high inducing drugs the world has ever
known.
The Love of God! TnT

Try embracing reality. It's harder work, but can be quite rewarding.

Praying for you is real, and God's Love for you is extremely real,
Jesus died! He did all the hard work, that is what is so very
rewarding! TnT

"KMAN" wrote in message
...
in article ,
Tinkerntom
at wrote on 3/13/05 7:33 PM:


KMAN wrote:
in article ,
Tinkerntom
at wrote on 3/12/05 3:33 AM:


KMAN wrote:
"Scott Weiser" wrote in message
...
A Usenet persona calling itself Tinkerntom wrote:



Scott, I must not have made myself clear, and riverman missed my
point.
I would like to meet the real Scott Weiser. Will the real Scott
Weiser
please stand up?

That would be me.

I have trouble believing all the bad things they say
about you as being true.

They aren't.

I have not had opportunity to go back and read
all the archives, and would really appreciate the opportunity to
form
my own opinion. So is it possible to meet? TnT

I imagine that is possible, though I'm a bit busy with business
right now.
We could meet for lunch one of these days if you like.

Give me a call and leave your number, I'm in the book.

I think it's the birth of a new political party. Scotty will seize
control
of the armed forces and Tinkerntom will wow the masses as god's
representative on earth ;-)

KMAN, It seems that we already have your attention! Our plan is
working! TnT

I'm sure in your minds it is...you and Scotty together could make
Waco look
like a minor event...the problem is, which of the two of you is to be
David
Koresh?

KMAN, I wondered what happened to you today, It has been pretty quiet
here on the RBP today, though things are beginning to pick up. I
thought you maybe even went to church this AM, being Sunday and
everything. But I knew the bliss could not last, some of us actually
talking about boats, what a novel idea!

As far as SW and I getting together for lunch, I hope you are not
missing to much sleep over this, or that nasty headache you get is
coming back. Remember the cure, two Motrin, and that God Loves you.

BTW, I do not believe in reincarnation, and DK was ushered into the
afterlife to stay. So we will just have to continue what we do so well;
SW telling you about annoying the whole world, and me trying to figure
out how to tell the whole world that "God so Loved the whole world,
that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes on Him shall
not perish, but have everlasting life!"

Now that could be just a foretaste of better things to come, so be nice
to me or I will pray for you! Which I am sure will totally creep you
out knowing that I am praying for you, and looking for additional
opportunities to aim my unlimited supply of God's Love, at your heart!
Of course I will probably be praying for you anyway, so its a win/win
at least from my side of the path! TnT

I really and truly find it hard to believe that you are not a chronic user
of hard drugs.

For some reason, I get the feeling that this site:
http://tinyurl.com/2wf69 is more in line with tinkeredamns thought
processes.

Mark

bearsbuddy wrote:
"KMAN" wrote in message
...
in article ,
Tinkerntom
at wrote on 3/13/05 7:33 PM:


KMAN wrote:
in article ,
Tinkerntom
at wrote on 3/12/05 3:33 AM:


KMAN wrote:
"Scott Weiser" wrote in message
...
A Usenet persona calling itself Tinkerntom wrote:



Scott, I must not have made myself clear, and riverman missed
my
point.
I would like to meet the real Scott Weiser. Will the real
Scott
Weiser
please stand up?

That would be me.

I have trouble believing all the bad things they say
about you as being true.

They aren't.

I have not had opportunity to go back and read
all the archives, and would really appreciate the opportunity
to
form
my own opinion. So is it possible to meet? TnT

I imagine that is possible, though I'm a bit busy with
business
right now.
We could meet for lunch one of these days if you like.

Give me a call and leave your number, I'm in the book.

I think it's the birth of a new political party. Scotty will
seize
control
of the armed forces and Tinkerntom will wow the masses as god's
representative on earth ;-)

KMAN, It seems that we already have your attention! Our plan is
working! TnT

I'm sure in your minds it is...you and Scotty together could make
Waco look
like a minor event...the problem is, which of the two of you is
to be
David
Koresh?

KMAN, I wondered what happened to you today, It has been pretty
quiet
here on the RBP today, though things are beginning to pick up. I
thought you maybe even went to church this AM, being Sunday and
everything. But I knew the bliss could not last, some of us
actually
talking about boats, what a novel idea!

As far as SW and I getting together for lunch, I hope you are not
missing to much sleep over this, or that nasty headache you get is
coming back. Remember the cure, two Motrin, and that God Loves
you.

BTW, I do not believe in reincarnation, and DK was ushered into
the
afterlife to stay. So we will just have to continue what we do so
well;
SW telling you about annoying the whole world, and me trying to
figure
out how to tell the whole world that "God so Loved the whole
world,
that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes on Him
shall
not perish, but have everlasting life!"

Now that could be just a foretaste of better things to come, so be
nice
to me or I will pray for you! Which I am sure will totally creep
you
out knowing that I am praying for you, and looking for additional
opportunities to aim my unlimited supply of God's Love, at your
heart!
Of course I will probably be praying for you anyway, so its a
win/win
at least from my side of the path! TnT

I really and truly find it hard to believe that you are not a
chronic user
of hard drugs.

For some reason, I get the feeling that this site:
http://tinyurl.com/2wf69 is more in line with tinkeredamns thought
processes.

Mark

And you demonstrate, all the more the need for "God's Love", "Come let
us reason together, though your sins be scarlet, they shall be as white
as snow."

"The blood of Jesus cleanses us from all our sins."

Obviously I need to be praying for you also, Mark, your power of reason
is totally messed up and lost in sin! TnT

in article , Tinkerntom
at wrote on 3/13/05 9:31 PM:


bearsbuddy wrote:
"KMAN" wrote in message
...
in article ,
Tinkerntom
at wrote on 3/13/05 7:33 PM:


KMAN wrote:
in article ,
Tinkerntom
at wrote on 3/12/05 3:33 AM:


KMAN wrote:
"Scott Weiser" wrote in message
...
A Usenet persona calling itself Tinkerntom wrote:



Scott, I must not have made myself clear, and riverman missed
my
point.
I would like to meet the real Scott Weiser. Will the real
Scott
Weiser
please stand up?

That would be me.

I have trouble believing all the bad things they say
about you as being true.

They aren't.

I have not had opportunity to go back and read
all the archives, and would really appreciate the opportunity
to
form
my own opinion. So is it possible to meet? TnT

I imagine that is possible, though I'm a bit busy with
business
right now.
We could meet for lunch one of these days if you like.

Give me a call and leave your number, I'm in the book.

I think it's the birth of a new political party. Scotty will
seize
control
of the armed forces and Tinkerntom will wow the masses as god's
representative on earth ;-)

KMAN, It seems that we already have your attention! Our plan is
working! TnT

I'm sure in your minds it is...you and Scotty together could make
Waco look
like a minor event...the problem is, which of the two of you is
to be
David
Koresh?

KMAN, I wondered what happened to you today, It has been pretty
quiet
here on the RBP today, though things are beginning to pick up. I
thought you maybe even went to church this AM, being Sunday and
everything. But I knew the bliss could not last, some of us
actually
talking about boats, what a novel idea!

As far as SW and I getting together for lunch, I hope you are not
missing to much sleep over this, or that nasty headache you get is
coming back. Remember the cure, two Motrin, and that God Loves
you.

BTW, I do not believe in reincarnation, and DK was ushered into
the
afterlife to stay. So we will just have to continue what we do so
well;
SW telling you about annoying the whole world, and me trying to
figure
out how to tell the whole world that "God so Loved the whole
world,
that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes on Him
shall
not perish, but have everlasting life!"

Now that could be just a foretaste of better things to come, so be
nice
to me or I will pray for you! Which I am sure will totally creep
you
out knowing that I am praying for you, and looking for additional
opportunities to aim my unlimited supply of God's Love, at your
heart!
Of course I will probably be praying for you anyway, so its a
win/win
at least from my side of the path! TnT

I really and truly find it hard to believe that you are not a
chronic user
of hard drugs.

For some reason, I get the feeling that this site:
http://tinyurl.com/2wf69 is more in line with tinkeredamns thought
processes.

Mark

And you demonstrate, all the more the need for "God's Love", "Come let
us reason together, though your sins be scarlet, they shall be as white
as snow."

"The blood of Jesus cleanses us from all our sins."

Obviously I need to be praying for you also, Mark, your power of reason
is totally messed up and lost in sin! TnT

That site is quite a lot more coherent than your religified rantings
Tinkerntom, and while I won't be signing up myself, at least they have a
female High Priestess. They may be satanists but they are more progressive
than, say, the Catholic Church!

KMAN wrote:
in article ,
Tinkerntom
at wrote on 3/13/05 9:31 PM:


bearsbuddy wrote:
"KMAN" wrote in message
...
in article ,
Tinkerntom
at wrote on 3/13/05 7:33 PM:


KMAN wrote:
in article
,
Tinkerntom
at wrote on 3/12/05 3:33 AM:


KMAN wrote:
"Scott Weiser" wrote in message
...
A Usenet persona calling itself Tinkerntom wrote:



Scott, I must not have made myself clear, and riverman
missed
my
point.
I would like to meet the real Scott Weiser. Will the real
Scott
Weiser
please stand up?

That would be me.

I have trouble believing all the bad things they say
about you as being true.

They aren't.

I have not had opportunity to go back and read
all the archives, and would really appreciate the
opportunity
to
form
my own opinion. So is it possible to meet? TnT

I imagine that is possible, though I'm a bit busy with
business
right now.
We could meet for lunch one of these days if you like.

Give me a call and leave your number, I'm in the book.

I think it's the birth of a new political party. Scotty will
seize
control
of the armed forces and Tinkerntom will wow the masses as
god's
representative on earth ;-)

KMAN, It seems that we already have your attention! Our plan
is
working! TnT

I'm sure in your minds it is...you and Scotty together could
make
Waco look
like a minor event...the problem is, which of the two of you is
to be
David
Koresh?

KMAN, I wondered what happened to you today, It has been pretty
quiet
here on the RBP today, though things are beginning to pick up. I
thought you maybe even went to church this AM, being Sunday and
everything. But I knew the bliss could not last, some of us
actually
talking about boats, what a novel idea!

As far as SW and I getting together for lunch, I hope you are
not
missing to much sleep over this, or that nasty headache you get
is
coming back. Remember the cure, two Motrin, and that God Loves
you.

BTW, I do not believe in reincarnation, and DK was ushered into
the
afterlife to stay. So we will just have to continue what we do
so
well;
SW telling you about annoying the whole world, and me trying to
figure
out how to tell the whole world that "God so Loved the whole
world,
that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes on Him
shall
not perish, but have everlasting life!"

Now that could be just a foretaste of better things to come, so
be
nice
to me or I will pray for you! Which I am sure will totally
creep
you
out knowing that I am praying for you, and looking for
additional
opportunities to aim my unlimited supply of God's Love, at your
heart!
Of course I will probably be praying for you anyway, so its a
win/win
at least from my side of the path! TnT

I really and truly find it hard to believe that you are not a
chronic user
of hard drugs.

For some reason, I get the feeling that this site:
http://tinyurl.com/2wf69 is more in line with tinkeredamns
thought
processes.

Mark

And you demonstrate, all the more the need for "God's Love", "Come
let
us reason together, though your sins be scarlet, they shall be as
white
as snow."

"The blood of Jesus cleanses us from all our sins."

Obviously I need to be praying for you also, Mark, your power of
reason
is totally messed up and lost in sin! TnT

That site is quite a lot more coherent than your religified rantings
Tinkerntom, and while I won't be signing up myself, at least they
have a
female High Priestess. They may be satanists but they are more
progressive
than, say, the Catholic Church!

Progressive implies that there is something new here, and that new is
good. There is neither, nothing new or good with any of this stuff!

They have had female high priestess, since the fall of Lucifer, and if
it is new to you, it would only show your high degree of being at best
uninformed. And certainly I can recommend that you ask for a refund on
that History of Religion degree that you boast of.

That there is nothing good is also not worth disputing, and that Satan
was there in the Garden, tempting man to stray from Gods Love, which
brought untold heartache and destruction on man since that time. That
you can not discern the fruit of the lie, shows that you have an
abysmal sense of discernment, and that you have deceived youself with
your own sinfulness. That you are not free, but a slave to sin and
wickedness, and a servant or Satan, even now as you dabble and boast,
and claim that you will not be signing up yourself, as if you have not
already done so. "Pride goes before the fall", as it was with Lucifer
in the beginning, nothing has changed today!

Your professed concern for others, is a cover for your own unbelief in
a Loving God, and your claim that you do not believe in God, nor that
you will serve Him and honor Him as God, is not a mark of higher
enlightenment, but instead that you are a fool! The scriptures say that
"The fool has said in his heart there is no God."

The scriptures also say that " even the devil believes in God, and
trembles!". The devil, Satan, Lucifer, is a fallen angel, and was the
highest Archangel, that desired to be God, and turned his back on
loving and serving God. But He still acknowledges that there is God,
and his only desire now is to destroy all that is good and sacred. That
you claim to see that there is no God, only displays your total
blindness. That you are trapped in his web of deceit and destruction,
and your need for the Savior, Jesus Christ who defeated the devil, when
He went into Hell, and paid the price for all of our Sins with His own
Blood.

I would strongly urge you to reconsider your foolishness, and
acknowledge that there is God, that He Loves you, and that He sent
Jesus to die for you. Otherwise you must face the wrath of Satan, and
Hells fire that was prepared for Satan, alone and on your own. Satan is
the one in the alley, and you are the fool if you think you can play
with him and not be destroyed!

Today may be a new day for you, if you find something that tintillates
your warped mind, but it is not new, for Lucifer and sin has definitely
warped your mind for a long time. You are not enlightened, but blind!
You are not free, but a slave! You are broken and headed for
destruction! God Loves you nonetheless KMAN, and if for no other
reason, this may be why I was brought here to tell you about "God's
Love that He showed us in His Son, in that while we were sinners,
Christ died for us!"

I do not say these thing to be mean, or proud myself. Except for the
grace of God, I would be exactly where you are at. I was there,
dabbling and proud, messing with Lucifer, and on a wide path that led
to destruction! And one day I saw a gate, that the banner over it said,
"Whomsoever will, may come in". My life, was a mess, I had come to the
end of thinking I could do it on my own, and knew I needed a Savior.
This was before I had been to church, or read the Bible, or knew the
religified language, and I had noone to tell me about God's Love. I
just knew that I was lost and alone, and did not know the true God.
That He loved me, was not even a concept in my thinking. That I could
know Him and Love Him was gone from my mind. But in His time He made
all these things known to me, and has given me the opportunity to share
His Love with others.

This has nothing to do with going to church, or religion, so get over
your old trite excuses of why you don't want anything to do with God.
Get over thinking that you can intimidate a person who comes here and
tells you about the love of God by stomping your foot, or insulting me.
Forget your whining about it being weird and creeping you out! I have
heard it all, and gone into Hell myself in the arms of Jesus, and was
rescued from Hells fire, so your problems with believeing in God, seem
pretty trite and meaningless to me. They may seem important to you, but
explain that to the rapist/murderer in the ally!

You may have a degree in religious history, or 15, but as far as I am
concerned, I have a serious degree in God's Love. This is not some sort
of meally mouth, mushy wussy, type Love, sorry, those days are over.
There's a new kind of Love in town, and He is not the sheriff, He is
God with whom you have to do! His Love is real, and I expect that I am
not going anywhere either. So get use to us, I have just began to Love
you! He Loved you from before the foundations of the world! TnT

Tinkerntom
at wrote on 3/13/05 9:31 PM:


bearsbuddy wrote:
For some reason, I get the feeling that this site:
http://tinyurl.com/2wf69 is more in line with tinkeredamns thought
processes.

Mark

And you demonstrate, all the more the need for "God's Love", "Come let
us reason together, though your sins be scarlet, they shall be as white
as snow."

"The blood of Jesus cleanses us from all our sins."

Obviously I need to be praying for you also, Mark, your power of reason
is totally messed up and lost in sin! TnT

Never sinned in my life, but thanks for the thought Thumper.

I will however repeat this little prayer for you, each time you come here
spoutin' on about god.


Hail Satan, full of Power,
Hell is with Thee.
Blessed art thou, and blessed are
thy spawn, the Children of Hell.
Holy Satan, Lord of Darkness,
give us strength,
that we may be led to greatness
in Word and in Deed.
Amen.

Remember, Satan love you too!

Mark

bearsbuddy wrote:
Tinkerntom
at wrote on 3/13/05 9:31 PM:


bearsbuddy wrote:
For some reason, I get the feeling that this site:
http://tinyurl.com/2wf69 is more in line with tinkeredamns
thought
processes.

Mark

And you demonstrate, all the more the need for "God's Love", "Come
let
us reason together, though your sins be scarlet, they shall be as
white
as snow."

"The blood of Jesus cleanses us from all our sins."

Obviously I need to be praying for you also, Mark, your power of
reason
is totally messed up and lost in sin! TnT

Never sinned in my life, but thanks for the thought Thumper.

I will however repeat this little prayer for you, each time you come
here
spoutin' on about god.


Hail Satan, full of Power,
Hell is with Thee.
Blessed art thou, and blessed are
thy spawn, the Children of Hell.
Holy Satan, Lord of Darkness,
give us strength,
that we may be led to greatness
in Word and in Deed.
Amen.

Remember, Satan love you too!

Mark

Sounds like you need some more thumping, and prayer! TnT

"Tinkerntom" wrote in message
oups.com...

KMAN wrote:
in article ,
Tinkerntom
at wrote on 3/13/05 9:31 PM:


bearsbuddy wrote:
"KMAN" wrote in message
...
in article ,
Tinkerntom
at wrote on 3/13/05 7:33 PM:


KMAN wrote:
in article
,
Tinkerntom
at wrote on 3/12/05 3:33 AM:


KMAN wrote:
"Scott Weiser" wrote in message
...
A Usenet persona calling itself Tinkerntom wrote:



Scott, I must not have made myself clear, and riverman
missed
my
point.
I would like to meet the real Scott Weiser. Will the real
Scott
Weiser
please stand up?

That would be me.

I have trouble believing all the bad things they say
about you as being true.

They aren't.

I have not had opportunity to go back and read
all the archives, and would really appreciate the
opportunity
to
form
my own opinion. So is it possible to meet? TnT

I imagine that is possible, though I'm a bit busy with
business
right now.
We could meet for lunch one of these days if you like.

Give me a call and leave your number, I'm in the book.

I think it's the birth of a new political party. Scotty will
seize
control
of the armed forces and Tinkerntom will wow the masses as
god's
representative on earth ;-)

KMAN, It seems that we already have your attention! Our plan
is
working! TnT

I'm sure in your minds it is...you and Scotty together could
make
Waco look
like a minor event...the problem is, which of the two of you is
to be
David
Koresh?

KMAN, I wondered what happened to you today, It has been pretty
quiet
here on the RBP today, though things are beginning to pick up. I
thought you maybe even went to church this AM, being Sunday and
everything. But I knew the bliss could not last, some of us
actually
talking about boats, what a novel idea!

As far as SW and I getting together for lunch, I hope you are
not
missing to much sleep over this, or that nasty headache you get
is
coming back. Remember the cure, two Motrin, and that God Loves
you.

BTW, I do not believe in reincarnation, and DK was ushered into
the
afterlife to stay. So we will just have to continue what we do
so
well;
SW telling you about annoying the whole world, and me trying to
figure
out how to tell the whole world that "God so Loved the whole
world,
that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes on Him
shall
not perish, but have everlasting life!"

Now that could be just a foretaste of better things to come, so
be
nice
to me or I will pray for you! Which I am sure will totally
creep
you
out knowing that I am praying for you, and looking for
additional
opportunities to aim my unlimited supply of God's Love, at your
heart!
Of course I will probably be praying for you anyway, so its a
win/win
at least from my side of the path! TnT

I really and truly find it hard to believe that you are not a
chronic user
of hard drugs.

For some reason, I get the feeling that this site:
http://tinyurl.com/2wf69 is more in line with tinkeredamns
thought
processes.

Mark

And you demonstrate, all the more the need for "God's Love", "Come
let
us reason together, though your sins be scarlet, they shall be as
white
as snow."

"The blood of Jesus cleanses us from all our sins."

Obviously I need to be praying for you also, Mark, your power of
reason
is totally messed up and lost in sin! TnT

That site is quite a lot more coherent than your religified rantings
Tinkerntom, and while I won't be signing up myself, at least they
have a
female High Priestess. They may be satanists but they are more
progressive
than, say, the Catholic Church!

Progressive implies that there is something new here, and that new is
good. There is neither, nothing new or good with any of this stuff!

And that's exactly how many of us feel about your "god" crap, Tinkerntom. I
guess you are finally starting to understand.

If I went at you constantly with salutations from Satan - even after you had
made it clear that you did not want to hear about Satan's love for you -
that would be the same type of hostility you perpetrate everyday with your
own preaching.

Clearly you aren't a big fan of Satanism, so even though I think your
reaction to it was hilarious, I won't start preaching about Satan to you
just to make your feel creepy.

I wonder if you will return the favour with your god crap?

KMAN wrote:
"Tinkerntom" wrote in message
oups.com...

KMAN wrote:
in article ,
Tinkerntom
at wrote on 3/13/05 9:31 PM:


bearsbuddy wrote:
"KMAN" wrote in message
...
in article
,
Tinkerntom
at wrote on 3/13/05 7:33 PM:


KMAN wrote:
in article
,
Tinkerntom
at wrote on 3/12/05 3:33 AM:


KMAN wrote:
"Scott Weiser" wrote in message
...
A Usenet persona calling itself Tinkerntom wrote:



Scott, I must not have made myself clear, and riverman
missed
my
point.
I would like to meet the real Scott Weiser. Will the
real
Scott
Weiser
please stand up?

That would be me.

I have trouble believing all the bad things they say
about you as being true.

They aren't.

I have not had opportunity to go back and read
all the archives, and would really appreciate the
opportunity
to
form
my own opinion. So is it possible to meet? TnT

I imagine that is possible, though I'm a bit busy with
business
right now.
We could meet for lunch one of these days if you like.

Give me a call and leave your number, I'm in the book.

I think it's the birth of a new political party. Scotty
will
seize
control
of the armed forces and Tinkerntom will wow the masses as
god's
representative on earth ;-)

KMAN, It seems that we already have your attention! Our
plan
is
working! TnT

I'm sure in your minds it is...you and Scotty together could
make
Waco look
like a minor event...the problem is, which of the two of you
is
to be
David
Koresh?

KMAN, I wondered what happened to you today, It has been
pretty
quiet
here on the RBP today, though things are beginning to pick
up. I
thought you maybe even went to church this AM, being Sunday
and
everything. But I knew the bliss could not last, some of us
actually
talking about boats, what a novel idea!

As far as SW and I getting together for lunch, I hope you are
not
missing to much sleep over this, or that nasty headache you
get
is
coming back. Remember the cure, two Motrin, and that God
Loves
you.

BTW, I do not believe in reincarnation, and DK was ushered
into
the
afterlife to stay. So we will just have to continue what we
do
so
well;
SW telling you about annoying the whole world, and me trying
to
figure
out how to tell the whole world that "God so Loved the whole
world,
that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes on
Him
shall
not perish, but have everlasting life!"

Now that could be just a foretaste of better things to come,
so
be
nice
to me or I will pray for you! Which I am sure will totally
creep
you
out knowing that I am praying for you, and looking for
additional
opportunities to aim my unlimited supply of God's Love, at
your
heart!
Of course I will probably be praying for you anyway, so its a
win/win
at least from my side of the path! TnT

I really and truly find it hard to believe that you are not a
chronic user
of hard drugs.

For some reason, I get the feeling that this site:
http://tinyurl.com/2wf69 is more in line with tinkeredamns
thought
processes.

Mark

And you demonstrate, all the more the need for "God's Love",
"Come
let
us reason together, though your sins be scarlet, they shall be
as
white
as snow."

"The blood of Jesus cleanses us from all our sins."

Obviously I need to be praying for you also, Mark, your power of
reason
is totally messed up and lost in sin! TnT

That site is quite a lot more coherent than your religified
rantings
Tinkerntom, and while I won't be signing up myself, at least they
have a
female High Priestess. They may be satanists but they are more
progressive
than, say, the Catholic Church!

Progressive implies that there is something new here, and that new
is
good. There is neither, nothing new or good with any of this stuff!

And that's exactly how many of us feel about your "god" crap,
Tinkerntom. I
guess you are finally starting to understand.

If I went at you constantly with salutations from Satan - even after
you had
made it clear that you did not want to hear about Satan's love for
you -
that would be the same type of hostility you perpetrate everyday with
your
own preaching.

Clearly you aren't a big fan of Satanism, so even though I think your

reaction to it was hilarious, I won't start preaching about Satan to
you
just to make your feel creepy.

I wonder if you will return the favour with your god crap?

Please understand, I do not share God's Love with "you just to make
your feel creepy." Your joking about Satan to me does not creep me out,
or intimidate me, or put me off in the least, or even surprise me. I am
seldom surprised at the wickedness that can be found in the heart of
man. And yet for all its wickedness, I still marvel at God's Love that
covers all of our wickedness with His Blood.

I do not share God's Love with you as something that is new, and hence
progressive. I share God's Love with you because, despite your protest,
I hear a cry from deep within your soul to know that you are loved by
God. This cry is reflected in the various and sundry comments that you
are compeled to make. There are many out there who are not so compeled,
I hear no cry, and I make no direct and specific statement to them
about God's Love!

Yesterday, I was having a good time talking boats, even with frtwz, and
even there, restricted the conversation to his shakedown cruise. If you
don't want to hear about God, then restrict your conversation to boats.
If you make an OT comment in particular to me and about me, ex: David
Koresh, then know that as far as I am concerned you are subject to
everything and anything that I choose to dish out and share about God's
Love. If someone makes an indirect derogatory comments about God, ex:
the satanism website, you will be subject to my full attention. If you
continue to make despairing and derogatory OT comments about me, and my
relationship with God, or about God in general, you will continue
getting more and more of my attention. I will be more attentive to
share freely and openly about God's love to you and everyone who
chooses to participate in the conversation, and I will definitely put
you on my prayer list if you indicate your need to be there.

I have gotten to know you in our conversation a little, and I do not
believe that you are specifically a troll, that is only interested in
stirring up trouble, though the Lord knows that you bring plenty down
upon yourself. You seem to have sincere interest in many subjects,
which I am willing to discuss with you from various perspectives.
However, you also seem to be unable to keep from making the
forementioned type of comments, that will continue to result in the
forementioned result. If you do not desire the results, then modify the
comments.

As to those who troll out of spite, and have no other vested interest
in the group or any of the ongoing converstions, I usually will ignore,
as that is the only response they understand and appreciate. Though
their name will go on my prayer list as well. If they have nothing
better to do than to trash and crap on everything and everywhere they
go, that is a sad commentary on them and their ability to make positive
and constructive contributions in society at large, and the usenet and
RBP in specific. They need all the help they can get!

Your concern about me and SW getting together may be cute in its
inception, but we are adults in a free society. If we choose to get
together for lunch to meet each other, that is our business. Until we
make it your business by allowing our relatinship to affect what is
discussed by you on RBP. Just as if your getting together for lunch
with anyone is any of my business. I would suggest that you mind your
own business, unless we were to make it yours. And as always know that
God Loves you, and I am praying for you! TnT

"Tinkerntom" wrote in message
oups.com...

KMAN wrote:
"Tinkerntom" wrote in message
oups.com...

KMAN wrote:
in article ,
Tinkerntom
at wrote on 3/13/05 9:31 PM:


bearsbuddy wrote:
"KMAN" wrote in message
...
in article
,
Tinkerntom
at wrote on 3/13/05 7:33 PM:


KMAN wrote:
in article
,
Tinkerntom
at wrote on 3/12/05 3:33 AM:


KMAN wrote:
"Scott Weiser" wrote in message
...
A Usenet persona calling itself Tinkerntom wrote:



Scott, I must not have made myself clear, and riverman
missed
my
point.
I would like to meet the real Scott Weiser. Will the
real
Scott
Weiser
please stand up?

That would be me.

I have trouble believing all the bad things they say
about you as being true.

They aren't.

I have not had opportunity to go back and read
all the archives, and would really appreciate the
opportunity
to
form
my own opinion. So is it possible to meet? TnT

I imagine that is possible, though I'm a bit busy with
business
right now.
We could meet for lunch one of these days if you like.

Give me a call and leave your number, I'm in the book.

I think it's the birth of a new political party. Scotty
will
seize
control
of the armed forces and Tinkerntom will wow the masses as
god's
representative on earth ;-)

KMAN, It seems that we already have your attention! Our
plan
is
working! TnT

I'm sure in your minds it is...you and Scotty together could
make
Waco look
like a minor event...the problem is, which of the two of you
is
to be
David
Koresh?

KMAN, I wondered what happened to you today, It has been
pretty
quiet
here on the RBP today, though things are beginning to pick
up. I
thought you maybe even went to church this AM, being Sunday
and
everything. But I knew the bliss could not last, some of us
actually
talking about boats, what a novel idea!

As far as SW and I getting together for lunch, I hope you are
not
missing to much sleep over this, or that nasty headache you
get
is
coming back. Remember the cure, two Motrin, and that God
Loves
you.

BTW, I do not believe in reincarnation, and DK was ushered
into
the
afterlife to stay. So we will just have to continue what we
do
so
well;
SW telling you about annoying the whole world, and me trying
to
figure
out how to tell the whole world that "God so Loved the whole
world,
that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes on
Him
shall
not perish, but have everlasting life!"

Now that could be just a foretaste of better things to come,
so
be
nice
to me or I will pray for you! Which I am sure will totally
creep
you
out knowing that I am praying for you, and looking for
additional
opportunities to aim my unlimited supply of God's Love, at
your
heart!
Of course I will probably be praying for you anyway, so its a
win/win
at least from my side of the path! TnT

I really and truly find it hard to believe that you are not a
chronic user
of hard drugs.

For some reason, I get the feeling that this site:
http://tinyurl.com/2wf69 is more in line with tinkeredamns
thought
processes.

Mark

And you demonstrate, all the more the need for "God's Love",
"Come
let
us reason together, though your sins be scarlet, they shall be
as
white
as snow."

"The blood of Jesus cleanses us from all our sins."

Obviously I need to be praying for you also, Mark, your power of
reason
is totally messed up and lost in sin! TnT

That site is quite a lot more coherent than your religified
rantings
Tinkerntom, and while I won't be signing up myself, at least they
have a
female High Priestess. They may be satanists but they are more
progressive
than, say, the Catholic Church!

Progressive implies that there is something new here, and that new
is
good. There is neither, nothing new or good with any of this stuff!

And that's exactly how many of us feel about your "god" crap,
Tinkerntom. I
guess you are finally starting to understand.

If I went at you constantly with salutations from Satan - even after
you had
made it clear that you did not want to hear about Satan's love for
you -
that would be the same type of hostility you perpetrate everyday with
your
own preaching.

Clearly you aren't a big fan of Satanism, so even though I think your

reaction to it was hilarious, I won't start preaching about Satan to
you
just to make your feel creepy.

I wonder if you will return the favour with your god crap?

Please understand, I do not share God's Love with "you just to make
your feel creepy." Your joking about Satan to me does not creep me out,
or intimidate me, or put me off in the least, or even surprise me. I am
seldom surprised at the wickedness that can be found in the heart of
man.

Well, as you say, I am only joking.

And yet for all its wickedness, I still marvel at God's Love that
covers all of our wickedness with His Blood.

Since I am joking and you are serious, it's clear who is the wicked one,
Tinkerntom.

I do not share God's Love with you as something that is new, and hence
progressive. I share God's Love with you because, despite your protest,
I hear a cry from deep within your soul to know that you are loved by
God.

No, that would be your mental illness. And while I sympathize with the fact
that you are ill and urge you to seek help, at the same time I think it is
reasonable to point out your hostile behaviour.

This cry is reflected in the various and sundry comments that you
are compeled to make. There are many out there who are not so compeled,
I hear no cry, and I make no direct and specific statement to them
about God's Love!

Yesterday, I was having a good time talking boats, even with frtwz, and
even there, restricted the conversation to his shakedown cruise. If you
don't want to hear about God, then restrict your conversation to boats.
If you make an OT comment in particular to me and about me, ex: David
Koresh, then know that as far as I am concerned you are subject to
everything and anything that I choose to dish out and share about God's
Love. If someone makes an indirect derogatory comments about God, ex:
the satanism website, you will be subject to my full attention. If you
continue to make despairing and derogatory OT comments about me, and my
relationship with God, or about God in general, you will continue
getting more and more of my attention. I will be more attentive to
share freely and openly about God's love to you and everyone who
chooses to participate in the conversation, and I will definitely put
you on my prayer list if you indicate your need to be there.

I have gotten to know you in our conversation a little, and I do not
believe that you are specifically a troll, that is only interested in
stirring up trouble, though the Lord knows that you bring plenty down
upon yourself. You seem to have sincere interest in many subjects,
which I am willing to discuss with you from various perspectives.
However, you also seem to be unable to keep from making the
forementioned type of comments, that will continue to result in the
forementioned result. If you do not desire the results, then modify the
comments.

As to those who troll out of spite, and have no other vested interest
in the group or any of the ongoing converstions, I usually will ignore,
as that is the only response they understand and appreciate. Though
their name will go on my prayer list as well. If they have nothing
better to do than to trash and crap on everything and everywhere they
go, that is a sad commentary on them and their ability to make positive
and constructive contributions in society at large, and the usenet and
RBP in specific. They need all the help they can get!

Your concern about me and SW getting together may be cute in its
inception, but we are adults in a free society. If we choose to get
together for lunch to meet each other, that is our business. Until we
make it your business by allowing our relatinship to affect what is
discussed by you on RBP. Just as if your getting together for lunch
with anyone is any of my business. I would suggest that you mind your
own business, unless we were to make it yours. And as always know that
God Loves you, and I am praying for you! TnT

Tinkerntom, as I am sure you are well aware, you and Scotty can do whatever
you want with each other, and I am not interested in (nor seeking) to stand
in your way.

As for your command to mind my own business, this is a public newsgroup, and
as Scotty would surely be the first to tell you, you don't have the right to
control what I choose to comment on here.

God hates you for your piety, Tinkerntom.

" "Tinkerntom" wrote in message
oups.com...
Your concern about me and SW getting together may be cute in its
inception, but we are adults in a free society. If we choose to get
together for lunch to meet each other, that is our business. Until we
make it your business by allowing our relatinship to affect what is
discussed by you on RBP. Just as if your getting together for lunch
with anyone is any of my business. I would suggest that you mind your
own business, unless we were to make it yours. And as always know that
God Loves you, and I am praying for you! TnT


You really are a nut case, and you should seriously seek out professional
help!

I'll have Satan look in on ya from time to time, lord knows y'all have a
great deal in common.

Mark

KMAN wrote:
"Tinkerntom" wrote in message
oups.com...

KMAN wrote:
"Tinkerntom" wrote in message
oups.com...

KMAN wrote:
in article
,
Tinkerntom
at wrote on 3/13/05 9:31 PM:


bearsbuddy wrote:
"KMAN" wrote in message
...
in article
,
Tinkerntom
at wrote on 3/13/05 7:33 PM:


KMAN wrote:
in article
,
Tinkerntom
at wrote on 3/12/05 3:33 AM:


KMAN wrote:
"Scott Weiser" wrote in message
...
A Usenet persona calling itself Tinkerntom wrote:



Scott, I must not have made myself clear, and
riverman
missed
my
point.
I would like to meet the real Scott Weiser. Will the
real
Scott
Weiser
please stand up?

That would be me.

I have trouble believing all the bad things they say
about you as being true.

They aren't.

I have not had opportunity to go back and read
all the archives, and would really appreciate the
opportunity
to
form
my own opinion. So is it possible to meet? TnT

I imagine that is possible, though I'm a bit busy with
business
right now.
We could meet for lunch one of these days if you like.

Give me a call and leave your number, I'm in the book.

I think it's the birth of a new political party. Scotty
will
seize
control
of the armed forces and Tinkerntom will wow the masses
as
god's
representative on earth ;-)

KMAN, It seems that we already have your attention! Our
plan
is
working! TnT

I'm sure in your minds it is...you and Scotty together
could
make
Waco look
like a minor event...the problem is, which of the two of
you
is
to be
David
Koresh?

KMAN, I wondered what happened to you today, It has been
pretty
quiet
here on the RBP today, though things are beginning to pick
up. I
thought you maybe even went to church this AM, being
Sunday
and
everything. But I knew the bliss could not last, some of
us
actually
talking about boats, what a novel idea!

As far as SW and I getting together for lunch, I hope you
are
not
missing to much sleep over this, or that nasty headache
you
get
is
coming back. Remember the cure, two Motrin, and that God
Loves
you.

BTW, I do not believe in reincarnation, and DK was ushered
into
the
afterlife to stay. So we will just have to continue what
we
do
so
well;
SW telling you about annoying the whole world, and me
trying
to
figure
out how to tell the whole world that "God so Loved the
whole
world,
that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes
on
Him
shall
not perish, but have everlasting life!"

Now that could be just a foretaste of better things to
come,
so
be
nice
to me or I will pray for you! Which I am sure will
totally
creep
you
out knowing that I am praying for you, and looking for
additional
opportunities to aim my unlimited supply of God's Love, at
your
heart!
Of course I will probably be praying for you anyway, so
its a
win/win
at least from my side of the path! TnT

I really and truly find it hard to believe that you are not
a
chronic user
of hard drugs.

For some reason, I get the feeling that this site:
http://tinyurl.com/2wf69 is more in line with tinkeredamns
thought
processes.

Mark

And you demonstrate, all the more the need for "God's Love",
"Come
let
us reason together, though your sins be scarlet, they shall
be
as
white
as snow."

"The blood of Jesus cleanses us from all our sins."

Obviously I need to be praying for you also, Mark, your power
of
reason
is totally messed up and lost in sin! TnT

That site is quite a lot more coherent than your religified
rantings
Tinkerntom, and while I won't be signing up myself, at least
they
have a
female High Priestess. They may be satanists but they are more
progressive
than, say, the Catholic Church!

Progressive implies that there is something new here, and that
new
is
good. There is neither, nothing new or good with any of this
stuff!

And that's exactly how many of us feel about your "god" crap,
Tinkerntom. I
guess you are finally starting to understand.

If I went at you constantly with salutations from Satan - even
after
you had
made it clear that you did not want to hear about Satan's love for
you -
that would be the same type of hostility you perpetrate everyday
with
your
own preaching.

Clearly you aren't a big fan of Satanism, so even though I think
your

reaction to it was hilarious, I won't start preaching about Satan
to
you
just to make your feel creepy.

I wonder if you will return the favour with your god crap?

Please understand, I do not share God's Love with "you just to make
your feel creepy." Your joking about Satan to me does not creep me
out,
or intimidate me, or put me off in the least, or even surprise me.
I am
seldom surprised at the wickedness that can be found in the heart
of
man.

Well, as you say, I am only joking.

And yet for all its wickedness, I still marvel at God's Love that
covers all of our wickedness with His Blood.

Since I am joking and you are serious, it's clear who is the wicked
one,
Tinkerntom.

I do not share God's Love with you as something that is new, and
hence
progressive. I share God's Love with you because, despite your
protest,
I hear a cry from deep within your soul to know that you are loved
by
God.

No, that would be your mental illness. And while I sympathize with
the fact
that you are ill and urge you to seek help, at the same time I think
it is
reasonable to point out your hostile behaviour.

This cry is reflected in the various and sundry comments that you
are compeled to make. There are many out there who are not so
compeled,
I hear no cry, and I make no direct and specific statement to them
about God's Love!

Yesterday, I was having a good time talking boats, even with frtwz,
and
even there, restricted the conversation to his shakedown cruise. If
you
don't want to hear about God, then restrict your conversation to
boats.
If you make an OT comment in particular to me and about me, ex:
David
Koresh, then know that as far as I am concerned you are subject to
everything and anything that I choose to dish out and share about
God's
Love. If someone makes an indirect derogatory comments about God,
ex:
the satanism website, you will be subject to my full attention. If
you
continue to make despairing and derogatory OT comments about me,
and my
relationship with God, or about God in general, you will continue
getting more and more of my attention. I will be more attentive to
share freely and openly about God's love to you and everyone who
chooses to participate in the conversation, and I will definitely
put
you on my prayer list if you indicate your need to be there.

I have gotten to know you in our conversation a little, and I do
not
believe that you are specifically a troll, that is only interested
in
stirring up trouble, though the Lord knows that you bring plenty
down
upon yourself. You seem to have sincere interest in many subjects,
which I am willing to discuss with you from various perspectives.
However, you also seem to be unable to keep from making the
forementioned type of comments, that will continue to result in the
forementioned result. If you do not desire the results, then modify
the
comments.

As to those who troll out of spite, and have no other vested
interest
in the group or any of the ongoing converstions, I usually will
ignore,
as that is the only response they understand and appreciate. Though
their name will go on my prayer list as well. If they have nothing
better to do than to trash and crap on everything and everywhere
they
go, that is a sad commentary on them and their ability to make
positive
and constructive contributions in society at large, and the usenet
and
RBP in specific. They need all the help they can get!

Your concern about me and SW getting together may be cute in its
inception, but we are adults in a free society. If we choose to get
together for lunch to meet each other, that is our business. Until
we
make it your business by allowing our relatinship to affect what is
discussed by you on RBP. Just as if your getting together for lunch
with anyone is any of my business. I would suggest that you mind
your
own business, unless we were to make it yours. And as always know
that
God Loves you, and I am praying for you! TnT

Tinkerntom, as I am sure you are well aware, you and Scotty can do
whatever
you want with each other, and I am not interested in (nor seeking) to
stand
in your way.

As for your command to mind my own business, this is a public
newsgroup, and
as Scotty would surely be the first to tell you, you don't have the
right to
control what I choose to comment on here.

God hates you for your piety, Tinkerntom.

And I have never tried to control what you "choose to comment on here."
In fact, if you chose to talk about God in a civil fashion, I can and
would respond in kind in a semi-detached fashion. If you choose to make
it personal, then I can make it very personal, that is my choice.

I have tried to lay out my thought process regarding different
scenarios, so that you can regulate yourself, to determine the results
that you desire, and find most comfortable to live with here in our
little corner of cyberspace. Remember, the fool is someone who does
something over and over, expecting different results!

If you choose to be a busy-body, and into everone elses personal
business, that says alot more about you, than anything else you may
have to say on that subject in particular, and probably in general as
well. Small minds make small comments and contributions to any society,
including the RBP. If this is not the case with you, you are free to
comment and show all of us otherwise, that is definitely a choice that
is up to you. Reminds me of another saying;

Let men think you a fool, just don't speak,
by opening your mouth, you leave no doubt!

You are correct on one point though, you said God hates "piety". Two
points.

One, I always find it interesting when someone who does not believe in
God seems to have a pretty good idea about what God likes and dislikes;
pretty good imagination there about the invisible that does not exist.
Which by logic, could not have likes and dislikes, and so would nullify
your point in the first place.

Secondly to your point about piety. Piety is an act of devotion and
reverence to God. If the act is performed for the purpose of
establishing ones own righteousness, then God definitely hates it,
because it sparates us from the righteousness that come from God, by
believing in the finished work of Jesus on the Cross. The scripture
says, "All our righteousness is like filthy rags!" So if we are
depending on our own acts of piety and benevolence to get in God's
favor and get close to Him, we would do better to grab a bunch of dirty
old filthy rags and rap them up as a present for the King of Kings, and
then should not be surprised when we are not allowed in His presence.

For myself, I acknowledge that all I had to offer Him was a bundle of
filthy rags, and I accepted Jesus as my Savior, He is now the source of
my Righteousness. And now the greatest act of piety on my behalf is to
crawl up in His lap, as a Son of God, a Child of the King, and say, I
Love You Father. He delights in these acts of piety by His Children.

God Loves you KMAN, and you are oh so close to the Kingdom! There is
not hostility here towards you KMAN, but a deep sense of compassion for
a wounded heart and soul. God Loved you before I came along to the RBP,
and He heard that cry, and assigned me to be here for awhile to share
His Love with you and others who come along. He heard your cry, and I
am learning to hear it, and to know the Love of God that suppasses
understanding, flowing through me like a River of Love flowing out to
you with Springs of Living Water. I cannot imagine the terrible wounds
that have been afflicted upon your heart and soul, to result in the
cries that I hear, but God Knows, and Loves you, and can heal all those
wounds and the broken heart! TnT

Mark H. Bowen wrote:
" "Tinkerntom" wrote in message
oups.com...
Your concern about me and SW getting together may be cute in its
inception, but we are adults in a free society. If we choose to
get
together for lunch to meet each other, that is our business. Until
we
make it your business by allowing our relatinship to affect what
is
discussed by you on RBP. Just as if your getting together for
lunch
with anyone is any of my business. I would suggest that you mind
your
own business, unless we were to make it yours. And as always know
that
God Loves you, and I am praying for you! TnT


You really are a nut case, and you should seriously seek out
professional
help!

I'll have Satan look in on ya from time to time, lord knows y'all
have a
great deal in common.

Mark

God Loves nut cases, that is why He assigned me to your case! Being a
nut case myself, He figured I could handle you! No one ever said that
God does not have a sense of humor! TnT

KMAN wrote:
....snip...

Tinkerntom, as I am sure you are well aware, you and Scotty can do
whatever
you want with each other, and I am not interested in (nor seeking) to
stand
in your way.

As for your command to mind my own business, this is a public
newsgroup, and
as Scotty would surely be the first to tell you, you don't have the
right to
control what I choose to comment on here.

God hates you for your piety, Tinkerntom.

And I have never tried to control what you "choose to comment on here."
In fact, if you chose to talk about God in a civil fashion, I can and
would respond in kind in a semi-detached fashion. If you choose to make
it personal, then I can make it very personal, that is my choice.

I have tried to lay out my thought process regarding different
scenarios, so that you can regulate yourself, to determine the results
that you desire, and find most comfortable to live with here in our
little corner of cyberspace. Remember, the fool is someone who does
something over and over, expecting different results!

If you choose to be a busy-body, and into everone elses personal
business, that says alot more about you, than anything else you may
have to say on that subject in particular, and probably in general as
well. Small minds make small comments and contributions to any society,
including the RBP. If this is not the case with you, you are free to
comment and show all of us otherwise, that is definitely a choice that
is up to you. Reminds me of another saying;

Let men think you a fool, just don't speak,
by opening your mouth, you leave no doubt!

You are correct on one point though, you said God hates "piety". Two
points.

One, I always find it interesting when someone who does not believe in
God seems to have a pretty good idea about what God likes and dislikes;
pretty good imagination there about the invisible that does not exist.
Which by logic, could not have likes and dislikes, and so would nullify
your point in the first place.

Secondly to your point about piety. Piety is an act of devotion and
reverence to God. If the act is performed for the purpose of
establishing ones own righteousness, then God definitely hates it,
because it sparates us from the righteousness that come from God, by
believing in the finished work of Jesus on the Cross. The scripture
says, "All our righteousness is like filthy rags!" So if we are
depending on our own acts of piety and benevolence to get in God's
favor and get close to Him, we would do better to grab a bunch of dirty
old filthy rags and rap them up as a present for the King of Kings, and
then should not be surprised when we are not allowed in His presence.

For myself, I acknowledge that all I had to offer Him was a bundle of
filthy rags, and I accepted Jesus as my Savior, He is now the source of
my Righteousness. And now the greatest act of piety on my behalf is to
crawl up in His lap, as a Son of God, a Child of the King, and say, I
Love You Father. He delights in these acts of piety by His Children.

God Loves you KMAN, and you are oh so close to the Kingdom! There is
not hostility here towards you KMAN, but a deep sense of compassion for
a wounded heart and soul. God Loved you before I came along to the RBP,
and He heard that cry, and assigned me to be here for awhile to share
His Love with you and others who come along. He heard your cry, and I
am learning to hear it, and to know the Love of God that suppasses
understanding, flowing through me like a River of Love flowing out to
you with Springs of Living Water. I cannot imagine the terrible wounds
that have been afflicted upon your heart and soul, to result in the
cries that I hear, but God Knows, and Loves you, and can heal all those
wounds and the broken heart! TnT

Melissa wrote:
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: RIPEMD160

Hi Tinkerntom,

On 14 Mar 2005 15:22:09 -0800, you wrote:

God Loves nut cases, that is why He assigned me to your case! Being
a nut case myself, He figured I could handle you! No one ever said
that God does not have a sense of humor!

It's been years since I've read it, but in Erasmus' "Praise of
Folly",
I seem to remember him mentioning the idea that "God loves the fools
the best". So perhaps you're pretty safe in this regard! :-)

- --
Melissa
....SNIP...

It makes me think of the song, "Here come the Clowns", my
qualifications for being safe in the arms of a loving God, are
undoubtedly without doubt! TnT

"Tinkerntom" wrote in message
oups.com...

...No one ever said that
God does not have a sense of humor! TnT

Not true. Many of us have.

Wolfgang

"Tinkerntom" wrote in message
ups.com...

It makes me think of the song, "Here come the Clowns"...


Yeah, theology will do that.

Wolfgang

Wolfgang wrote:
"Tinkerntom" wrote in message
oups.com...

...No one ever said that
God does not have a sense of humor! TnT

Not true. Many of us have.

Wolfgang

Well correction then, noone who has heard Him laugh, would say that He
does not have a sense of humor! TnT

"Tinkerntom" wrote in message
ups.com...

Wolfgang wrote:
"Tinkerntom" wrote in message
oups.com...

...No one ever said that
God does not have a sense of humor! TnT

Not true. Many of us have.

Wolfgang

Well correction then, noone who has heard Him laugh, would say that He
does not have a sense of humor! TnT

"Noone"? Hm......was he one of The Monkees?

Wolfgang

Wolfgang wrote:
"Tinkerntom" wrote in message
ups.com...

Wolfgang wrote:
"Tinkerntom" wrote in message
oups.com...

...No one ever said that
God does not have a sense of humor! TnT

Not true. Many of us have.

Wolfgang

Well correction then, noone who has heard Him laugh, would say that
He
does not have a sense of humor! TnT

"Noone"? Hm......was he one of The Monkees?

Wolfgang

I would not be able to help you on this one, I don't know noone who was
one of The Monkees. If it is someone you know then you will need to
check with them! In fact I am not familiar with The Monkees at all,
though it seems that I may have heard of The Monkeys! Are they one of
the clown acts? TnT

Wolfgang, it's clear that when spelling is an issue [as in "In fact I
am not familiar with The Monkees at all, though it seems that I may
have heard of The Monkeys!"], what was intended as mld or subtle humor
becomes hilarious.

frtzw906

in article , Tinkerntom
at wrote on 3/14/05 6:15 PM:


KMAN wrote:
"Tinkerntom" wrote in message
oups.com...

KMAN wrote:
"Tinkerntom" wrote in message
oups.com...

KMAN wrote:
in article
,
Tinkerntom
at wrote on 3/13/05 9:31 PM:


bearsbuddy wrote:
"KMAN" wrote in message
...
in article
,
Tinkerntom
at wrote on 3/13/05 7:33 PM:


KMAN wrote:
in article
,
Tinkerntom
at wrote on 3/12/05 3:33 AM:


KMAN wrote:
"Scott Weiser" wrote in message
...
A Usenet persona calling itself Tinkerntom wrote:



Scott, I must not have made myself clear, and
riverman
missed
my
point.
I would like to meet the real Scott Weiser. Will the
real
Scott
Weiser
please stand up?

That would be me.

I have trouble believing all the bad things they say
about you as being true.

They aren't.

I have not had opportunity to go back and read
all the archives, and would really appreciate the
opportunity
to
form
my own opinion. So is it possible to meet? TnT

I imagine that is possible, though I'm a bit busy with
business
right now.
We could meet for lunch one of these days if you like.

Give me a call and leave your number, I'm in the book.

I think it's the birth of a new political party. Scotty
will
seize
control
of the armed forces and Tinkerntom will wow the masses
as
god's
representative on earth ;-)

KMAN, It seems that we already have your attention! Our
plan
is
working! TnT

I'm sure in your minds it is...you and Scotty together
could
make
Waco look
like a minor event...the problem is, which of the two of
you
is
to be
David
Koresh?

KMAN, I wondered what happened to you today, It has been
pretty
quiet
here on the RBP today, though things are beginning to pick
up. I
thought you maybe even went to church this AM, being
Sunday
and
everything. But I knew the bliss could not last, some of
us
actually
talking about boats, what a novel idea!

As far as SW and I getting together for lunch, I hope you
are
not
missing to much sleep over this, or that nasty headache
you
get
is
coming back. Remember the cure, two Motrin, and that God
Loves
you.

BTW, I do not believe in reincarnation, and DK was ushered
into
the
afterlife to stay. So we will just have to continue what
we
do
so
well;
SW telling you about annoying the whole world, and me
trying
to
figure
out how to tell the whole world that "God so Loved the
whole
world,
that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes
on
Him
shall
not perish, but have everlasting life!"

Now that could be just a foretaste of better things to
come,
so
be
nice
to me or I will pray for you! Which I am sure will
totally
creep
you
out knowing that I am praying for you, and looking for
additional
opportunities to aim my unlimited supply of God's Love, at
your
heart!
Of course I will probably be praying for you anyway, so
its a
win/win
at least from my side of the path! TnT

I really and truly find it hard to believe that you are not
a
chronic user
of hard drugs.

For some reason, I get the feeling that this site:
http://tinyurl.com/2wf69 is more in line with tinkeredamns
thought
processes.

Mark

And you demonstrate, all the more the need for "God's Love",
"Come
let
us reason together, though your sins be scarlet, they shall
be
as
white
as snow."

"The blood of Jesus cleanses us from all our sins."

Obviously I need to be praying for you also, Mark, your power
of
reason
is totally messed up and lost in sin! TnT

That site is quite a lot more coherent than your religified
rantings
Tinkerntom, and while I won't be signing up myself, at least
they
have a
female High Priestess. They may be satanists but they are more
progressive
than, say, the Catholic Church!

Progressive implies that there is something new here, and that
new
is
good. There is neither, nothing new or good with any of this
stuff!

And that's exactly how many of us feel about your "god" crap,
Tinkerntom. I
guess you are finally starting to understand.

If I went at you constantly with salutations from Satan - even
after
you had
made it clear that you did not want to hear about Satan's love for
you -
that would be the same type of hostility you perpetrate everyday
with
your
own preaching.

Clearly you aren't a big fan of Satanism, so even though I think
your

reaction to it was hilarious, I won't start preaching about Satan
to
you
just to make your feel creepy.

I wonder if you will return the favour with your god crap?

Please understand, I do not share God's Love with "you just to make
your feel creepy." Your joking about Satan to me does not creep me
out,
or intimidate me, or put me off in the least, or even surprise me.
I am
seldom surprised at the wickedness that can be found in the heart
of
man.

Well, as you say, I am only joking.

And yet for all its wickedness, I still marvel at God's Love that
covers all of our wickedness with His Blood.

Since I am joking and you are serious, it's clear who is the wicked
one,
Tinkerntom.

I do not share God's Love with you as something that is new, and
hence
progressive. I share God's Love with you because, despite your
protest,
I hear a cry from deep within your soul to know that you are loved
by
God.

No, that would be your mental illness. And while I sympathize with
the fact
that you are ill and urge you to seek help, at the same time I think
it is
reasonable to point out your hostile behaviour.

This cry is reflected in the various and sundry comments that you
are compeled to make. There are many out there who are not so
compeled,
I hear no cry, and I make no direct and specific statement to them
about God's Love!

Yesterday, I was having a good time talking boats, even with frtwz,
and
even there, restricted the conversation to his shakedown cruise. If
you
don't want to hear about God, then restrict your conversation to
boats.
If you make an OT comment in particular to me and about me, ex:
David
Koresh, then know that as far as I am concerned you are subject to
everything and anything that I choose to dish out and share about
God's
Love. If someone makes an indirect derogatory comments about God,
ex:
the satanism website, you will be subject to my full attention. If
you
continue to make despairing and derogatory OT comments about me,
and my
relationship with God, or about God in general, you will continue
getting more and more of my attention. I will be more attentive to
share freely and openly about God's love to you and everyone who
chooses to participate in the conversation, and I will definitely
put
you on my prayer list if you indicate your need to be there.

I have gotten to know you in our conversation a little, and I do
not
believe that you are specifically a troll, that is only interested
in
stirring up trouble, though the Lord knows that you bring plenty
down
upon yourself. You seem to have sincere interest in many subjects,
which I am willing to discuss with you from various perspectives.
However, you also seem to be unable to keep from making the
forementioned type of comments, that will continue to result in the
forementioned result. If you do not desire the results, then modify
the
comments.

As to those who troll out of spite, and have no other vested
interest
in the group or any of the ongoing converstions, I usually will
ignore,
as that is the only response they understand and appreciate. Though
their name will go on my prayer list as well. If they have nothing
better to do than to trash and crap on everything and everywhere
they
go, that is a sad commentary on them and their ability to make
positive
and constructive contributions in society at large, and the usenet
and
RBP in specific. They need all the help they can get!

Your concern about me and SW getting together may be cute in its
inception, but we are adults in a free society. If we choose to get
together for lunch to meet each other, that is our business. Until
we
make it your business by allowing our relatinship to affect what is
discussed by you on RBP. Just as if your getting together for lunch
with anyone is any of my business. I would suggest that you mind
your
own business, unless we were to make it yours. And as always know
that
God Loves you, and I am praying for you! TnT

Tinkerntom, as I am sure you are well aware, you and Scotty can do
whatever
you want with each other, and I am not interested in (nor seeking) to
stand
in your way.

As for your command to mind my own business, this is a public
newsgroup, and
as Scotty would surely be the first to tell you, you don't have the
right to
control what I choose to comment on here.

God hates you for your piety, Tinkerntom.

And I have never tried to control what you "choose to comment on here."

Ah, I must have interpreted your "mind your own business" speech
inaccurately.

In fact, if you chose to talk about God in a civil fashion, I can and
would respond in kind in a semi-detached fashion. If you choose to make
it personal, then I can make it very personal, that is my choice.

Wow. I guess I am starting to understand that spreading god's love is all
about threatening and trying to control people. Which is pretty much what
religion is all about, and whether your are a victim or perpetrator, you're
definitely part of the game Tinkerntom.

I have tried to lay out my thought process regarding different
scenarios, so that you can regulate yourself, to determine the results
that you desire, and find most comfortable to live with here in our
little corner of cyberspace. Remember, the fool is someone who does
something over and over, expecting different results!

Sort of like someone who preaches about god even when the message is clear
that the preaching is offensive to them?

If you choose to be a busy-body, and into everone elses personal
business

How am I into your personal business, Tinkerntom? Did I cyberstalk you (like
you once did to me) and try to use information from outside this group to
silence you? I haven't been in your personal business one bit.

that says alot more about you, than anything else you may
have to say on that subject in particular, and probably in general as
well. Small minds make small comments and contributions to any society,
including the RBP. If this is not the case with you, you are free to
comment and show all of us otherwise

Your god complex is showing again. Speak for yourself, not for "us all."
Unless you've been elected Grand Priest of RBP and I never got my ballot.

that is definitely a choice that
is up to you. Reminds me of another saying;

Let men think you a fool, just don't speak,
by opening your mouth, you leave no doubt!

You've left no doubt.

You are correct on one point though, you said God hates "piety". Two
points.

No, I said god hates YOU for your piety.

Big difference.

In that context, I am talking about the definition of piety that refers to
hypocrisy. And your religious blather is the worst kind of hypocrisy. You
throw in a "god loves you" and you think that will cover up your blatant
hostility. It doesn't. It makes you pious hypocrite much like the priest
preaching chastity while diddling the altar boy in the back room.

One, I always find it interesting when someone who does not believe in
God seems to have a pretty good idea about what God likes and dislikes;
pretty good imagination there about the invisible that does not exist.
Which by logic, could not have likes and dislikes, and so would nullify
your point in the first place.

The fact that god exists only in your imagination does not mean that there
is not satirical material to be had in reflecting your own delusions back
onto you.

Secondly to your point about piety. Piety is an act of devotion and
reverence to God. If the act is performed for the purpose of
establishing ones own righteousness, then God definitely hates it,
because it sparates us from the righteousness that come from God, by
believing in the finished work of Jesus on the Cross. The scripture
says, "All our righteousness is like filthy rags!" So if we are
depending on our own acts of piety and benevolence to get in God's
favor and get close to Him, we would do better to grab a bunch of dirty
old filthy rags and rap them up as a present for the King of Kings, and
then should not be surprised when we are not allowed in His presence.

For myself, I acknowledge that all I had to offer Him was a bundle of
filthy rags, and I accepted Jesus as my Savior, He is now the source of
my Righteousness. And now the greatest act of piety on my behalf is to
crawl up in His lap, as a Son of God, a Child of the King, and say, I
Love You Father. He delights in these acts of piety by His Children.

God Loves you KMAN, and you are oh so close to the Kingdom!

Are you in that Kingdom, Tinkerntom?

If so, then without need for creating a deity of my own, I know that I want
to be elsewhere.

There is
not hostility here towards you KMAN

You are oozing hostility. You can't putty over it with your "god loves you"
blather. It's incredibly obvious.

You know that your religified blather isn't going to move me closer to
whatever beliefs you share, so you also know that all your god talk is for
no greater purpose than to satifsy your own personal issues, which I am
guessing have mainly to do with serious questioning of your own self-worth.
By investing in your delusions about your connection with a deity, you can
disassociate from whatever nasty demons are ailing you.

but a deep sense of compassion for a wounded heart and soul.

It's all about your wounded heart and soul, Tinkerntom. You use your
religified blather to shield your already damaged psyche from the harsh
light of reality.

God Loved you before I came along to the RBP,
and He heard that cry, and assigned me to be here for awhile to share
His Love with you and others who come along.

Ah! You are on a mission from god. You are "the chosen one."

Why didn't you say so earlier?


He heard your cry, and I
am learning to hear it, and to know the Love of God that suppasses
understanding, flowing through me like a River of Love flowing out to
you with Springs of Living Water. I cannot imagine the terrible wounds
that have been afflicted upon your heart and soul, to result in the
cries that I hear, but God Knows, and Loves you, and can heal all those
wounds and the broken heart! TnT

The pain you are feeling is never going to be healed through this insanity,
Tinkerntom. You need to confront your demons and do the work of healing
within the harsh context of reality. Escaping your problems through this
deity delusion is obviously forcing you to live increasingly in the confines
of your imagination, divorcing you further and further from reality.
Ultimately you will end up unable to return.

BCITORGB wrote:
Wolfgang, it's clear that when spelling is an issue [as in "In fact I
am not familiar with The Monkees at all, though it seems that I may
have heard of The Monkeys!"], what was intended as mld or subtle
humor
becomes hilarious.

frtzw906

Hello frtwz906, I'm glad to afford you the opportunity for hilarity! I
find many things to laugh about. Life is a kaleidoscope of humor, and
we are inside the house of mirrors!

Did you get a chance to check out those two links I left for you on one
of our last post prior to the week end? I found them interesting in
that they come from Alan Keyes who is as representative of the
conservative religious right as you can get. I am wondering if anyone
else on that side of the aisle has read his observations, and is
takeing heed? I suspect that there is a ground swell already building.
TnT

in article , Melissa at
wrote on 3/14/05 11:36 PM:

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: RIPEMD160

Hi Tinkerntom,

On 14 Mar 2005 20:16:06 -0800, you wrote:

Did you get a chance to check out those two links I left for you on
one of our last post prior to the week end? I found them
interesting in that they come from Alan Keyes who is as
representative of the conservative religious right as you can get.
I am wondering if anyone else on that side of the aisle has read
his observations, and is takeing heed? I suspect that there is a
ground swell already building.

When I get a chance I may find those links to have a look, but are you
aware of the situation between Keyes and his lesbian daughter?

Here's a Washington Post article about them:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...2005Feb12.html

Here's what Maya herself had to say about it:

http://tinyurl.com/6g44n

Sure, she's 19, and responsible for herself, but it wasn't until after
she "came out" publicly about her sexual orientation that her parents
decided to "cut her loose". Interesting "family values" at the very
least.

- --
Melissa

Hey now Melissa, just because he has turned his back on his own
daughter...if only Dick Cheney could feel the love of god as strongly as
Alan Keyes, he'd kick his daughter to the curb too! But no, the best Dick
can muster is to be quietly disapproving. Satan has made him weak, whereas
the blood of Christ flows thorugh Alan's veins and gives him the strength to
hate his own daughter. Religion is so beautiful!

KMAN wrote:
....snip...

Tinkerntom, as I am sure you are well aware, you and Scotty can do
whatever
you want with each other, and I am not interested in (nor seeking)
to
stand
in your way.

As for your command to mind my own business, this is a public
newsgroup, and
as Scotty would surely be the first to tell you, you don't have
the
right to
control what I choose to comment on here.

God hates you for your piety, Tinkerntom.

And I have never tried to control what you "choose to comment on
here."

Ah, I must have interpreted your "mind your own business" speech
inaccurately.

That's right, you did, I can't control what you do, but I can choose to
tell you what I think you should do. A big difference, but the
subtleties are apparently too deep for your confused mind!


In fact, if you chose to talk about God in a civil fashion, I can
and
would respond in kind in a semi-detached fashion. If you choose to
make
it personal, then I can make it very personal, that is my choice.

Wow. I guess I am starting to understand that spreading god's love is
all
about threatening and trying to control people. Which is pretty much
what
religion is all about, and whether your are a victim or perpetrator,
you're
definitely part of the game Tinkerntom.

I hope that you are beginning to understand, for I believe that you
have been operating under a false understanding about God's Love. So
many have the idea that God's Love is this nice warm fuzzy feeling that
you get at certain holiday times with family and friends. However God's
Love is far more than any of this. It is what compelled Jesus into this
world to die, and to rise again in Victory over Sin and Death and Satan
and his minions. The Love of God is the most powerful force, that
created the Universe, and will someday recreate a New Heaven and a New
Earth. The Love of God is what binds the Godhead together, and what
reaches out to all of us to include us in the presence of the very
Godhead someday! The Love of God compells men to reach out in Love to
others whose hearts are so hard as to even find contempt for that very
Love, but we reach out anyway. But this is a hard thing to understand I
am sure. We are speaking of the greatest miracle of God, for we are
told, "God is Love!" When we talk about the Love of God, we are talking
about the very essence of God! Not something light and fluffy, that
makes us feel warm and fuzzy! But something that becomes a consuming
fire that burns from within. A fire that cannot be quenched!

I can always choose to play or not, as can you as well, neither is in
control, unless you desire someone to be in control, however even that
is up to your choice. You say religion is all about control, and seem
to be fixated on proving that you have no choice. Your very choice
belies the claim that religion is all about control. You prove the
antithesis of your theory, by your choice.

Which all is a strawman arguement anyway, because I am not talking
about religion at all. If you choose to talk about religion, that is
your choice as well, and hence a free moral agent, personally
responsible for the choices you make, and you can't even then offload
your responsibility on religion.

I have tried to lay out my thought process regarding different
scenarios, so that you can regulate yourself, to determine the
results
that you desire, and find most comfortable to live with here in our
little corner of cyberspace. Remember, the fool is someone who does
something over and over, expecting different results!

Sort of like someone who preaches about god even when the message is
clear
that the preaching is offensive to them?

A preacher, as a soldier is under orders, does what he is told to do,
even though it may seem that he is preaching to no avail, because he
believes that God can intervene in the above equation. God + zero is a
number that no super computer can calculate. God + 1 obediant servant
can bring down any wall of wicked resistance, no matter what the odds,
or how hardened the wall!


If you choose to be a busy-body, and into everone elses personal
business

How am I into your personal business, Tinkerntom? Did I cyberstalk
you (like
you once did to me) and try to use information from outside this
group to
silence you? I haven't been in your personal business one bit.

I would say that you have tried to silence me with your whining,
lackluster logic, and some general nastiness. Even this comment is not
offered to clarify any previous perceived wrong, but to silence me in
the current conversation. And all of this current attempted
intimidation is aimed at the proposed meeting between SW and myself,
and trying to influence whether we get together or not. That is RL
intimidation and has nothing to do with any proposed sanctity of
cyberspace! If you open the door to the previous situation, we could go
back and re-examine the disaster of your previous communications in
other groups if you would like, otherwise I would recommend that we
stay in the current conversation! And staying in the current
converstion, I see no need to be silent!


that says alot more about you, than anything else you may
have to say on that subject in particular, and probably in general
as
well. Small minds make small comments and contributions to any
society,
including the RBP. If this is not the case with you, you are free
to
comment and show all of us otherwise

Your god complex is showing again. Speak for yourself, not for "us
all."
Unless you've been elected Grand Priest of RBP and I never got my
ballot.

I can choose to speak for us all, that continue to hear your whining.
The conclusions we draw will depend on our own position, though the
whining itself without doubt speaks loudly! Others may choose to speak
for themselves, and that is their choice as well, if they disagree with
me! Hello, I don't hear anyone else! and you definitely don't "show all
of us otherwise" either!

that is definitely a choice that
is up to you. Reminds me of another saying;

Let men think you a fool, just don't speak,
by opening your mouth, you leave no doubt!

You've left no doubt.

Nor have you!


You are correct on one point though, you said God hates "piety".
Two
points.

No, I said god hates YOU for your piety.

Big difference.

And I said you don't know what you are talking about! No matter what
the difference!


In that context, I am talking about the definition of piety that
refers to
hypocrisy. And your religious blather is the worst kind of hypocrisy.
You
throw in a "god loves you" and you think that will cover up your
blatant
hostility. It doesn't. It makes you pious hypocrite much like the
priest
preaching chastity while diddling the altar boy in the back room.

Is that what happened to you? That would explain alot of the hostility,
and I would have to agree with you, that is definitely hypocritical of
the priest! But it does not change the fact that God does Love you. If
you allow a hypocrite to stand between you and God, that only means
that the hypocrite is closer to God than you are! There are many actors
on the stage of Life, the problem is the play is for REAL! Are you
playing for real, or are you a hypocrite?


One, I always find it interesting when someone who does not believe
in
God seems to have a pretty good idea about what God likes and
dislikes;
pretty good imagination there about the invisible that does not
exist.
Which by logic, could not have likes and dislikes, and so would
nullify
your point in the first place.

The fact that god exists only in your imagination does not mean that
there
is not satirical material to be had in reflecting your own delusions
back
onto you.

An argument may be satirical, and provide a snicker, but it does not
present a basis for a logical conclusion. If you desire to arrive at a
logical conclusion, stick with a logical argument! Your point is still
Null if you do not believe in God, independent of my imagination!


Secondly to your point about piety. Piety is an act of devotion and
reverence to God. If the act is performed for the purpose of
establishing ones own righteousness, then God definitely hates it,
because it sparates us from the righteousness that come from God,
by
believing in the finished work of Jesus on the Cross. The scripture
says, "All our righteousness is like filthy rags!" So if we are
depending on our own acts of piety and benevolence to get in God's
favor and get close to Him, we would do better to grab a bunch of
dirty
old filthy rags and rap them up as a present for the King of Kings,
and
then should not be surprised when we are not allowed in His
presence.

For myself, I acknowledge that all I had to offer Him was a bundle
of
filthy rags, and I accepted Jesus as my Savior, He is now the
source of
my Righteousness. And now the greatest act of piety on my behalf is
to
crawl up in His lap, as a Son of God, a Child of the King, and say,
I
Love You Father. He delights in these acts of piety by His
Children.

God Loves you KMAN, and you are oh so close to the Kingdom!

Are you in that Kingdom, Tinkerntom?

If so, then without need for creating a deity of my own, I know that
I want
to be elsewhere.

And you shall be elsewhere, if you continue on "the broad path that is
easy, and leads to destruction!" However, I would point out that it is
all His Kingdom, for He descended into Hades and took back the Keys of
Hades and of Hell. Now He is enthroned at the right hand of the Father,
where He reigns as King of Kings, and Lord of Lords! You are already in
His Kingdom, albeit an unwilling servant whether you know it or not!
However the day will come when every knee shall bow, and every tongue
confess that He is Lord of Lords, and King of Kings. I just figure its
easier to do it now and be on the winning side, than to wait until it
is to late and be on the whining side.

There is
not hostility here towards you KMAN

You are oozing hostility. You can't putty over it with your "god
loves you"
blather. It's incredibly obvious.

The Scriptures teach us that God hates sin, but Loves the Sinner. Yes I
am very hostile to all that is hateful and wicked, and sinful. But I
can still tell you that God Loves you KMAN, the sinner! And I am
learning to Love you with His Love. No hostility to you, just your sin!


You know that your religified blather isn't going to move me closer
to
whatever beliefs you share, so you also know that all your god talk
is for
no greater purpose than to satifsy your own personal issues, which I
am
guessing have mainly to do with serious questioning of your own
self-worth.
By investing in your delusions about your connection with a deity,
you can
disassociate from whatever nasty demons are ailing you.

Talk about blather, say again, what was that! That sounds like
pseudo-professional, doubtful, deceitful, double talk. A regular smoke
screen! My conversation is not designed to move you or anyone. It is
designed, if you so choose, to find yourself moved nearer to God. The
choice is yours, not mine, and not based on my own self-worth, but the
ascribed value that God placed upon me when He sent His Son to die for
all of us, each one of us who believe! A value that cannot be conceived
by the mind of any man! And certainly not imagined in the grandest
delusions of any mind!


but a deep sense of compassion for a wounded heart and soul.

It's all about your wounded heart and soul, Tinkerntom. You use your
religified blather to shield your already damaged psyche from the
harsh
light of reality.

God Loved you before I came along to the RBP,
and He heard that cry, and assigned me to be here for awhile to
share
His Love with you and others who come along.

Ah! You are on a mission from god. You are "the chosen one."

Why didn't you say so earlier?

Because you didn't ask! and because you are incorrect!

No, He is the Chosen One! I am glad to see that you are able to know
the need for a Chosen One! I am just a sent one, He says, that He sends
us out into the world, to sow seed, plant and water, and some to bring
in the harvest. There are many of us. He also refers to us as fishers
of men. My only claim to fame is that I am a Servant of the Most High
God, and it is a privilege to work in His service as a farmer and a
fisher of men.


He heard your cry, and I
am learning to hear it, and to know the Love of God that suppasses
understanding, flowing through me like a River of Love flowing out
to
you with Springs of Living Water. I cannot imagine the terrible
wounds
that have been afflicted upon your heart and soul, to result in the
cries that I hear, but God Knows, and Loves you, and can heal all
those
wounds and the broken heart! TnT

The pain you are feeling is never going to be healed through this
insanity,
Tinkerntom. You need to confront your demons and do the work of
healing
within the harsh context of reality. Escaping your problems through
this
deity delusion is obviously forcing you to live increasingly in the
confines
of your imagination, divorcing you further and further from reality.
Ultimately you will end up unable to return.

Jesus already confronted my demons, and they hightailed it back to Hell
where they belong. And Jesus healed me with the reality of His gentle
touch, many times! And Jesus has set the captive free from all that
binds and destroys the shattered dreams and broken soul. The spirit of
the believer is set free to worship God as he was intended before the
Fall, before the Foundation of the World, in the Beauty of Holiness.
For the Word says, "Be ye Holy, for I am Holy", and God's word ascribes
to us Holiness! "For you are now the righteousness of God in Christ
Jesus!"

Ultimately I will end up in His Glorious Presence, from which I shall
never leave, nor want to return. My hope is to hear Him say, "Well done
thou good and faithful servant!" I would also be glad to see you there
on that glorious day, but the choice is yours! KMAN, God Loves you! TnT

Melissa wrote:
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: RIPEMD160

Hi Tinkerntom,

On 14 Mar 2005 20:16:06 -0800, you wrote:

Did you get a chance to check out those two links I left for you on
one of our last post prior to the week end? I found them
interesting in that they come from Alan Keyes who is as
representative of the conservative religious right as you can get.
I am wondering if anyone else on that side of the aisle has read
his observations, and is takeing heed? I suspect that there is a
ground swell already building.

When I get a chance I may find those links to have a look, but are
you
aware of the situation between Keyes and his lesbian daughter?

Here's a Washington Post article about them:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...2005Feb12.html

Here's what Maya herself had to say about it:

http://tinyurl.com/6g44n

Sure, she's 19, and responsible for herself, but it wasn't until
after
she "came out" publicly about her sexual orientation that her parents
decided to "cut her loose". Interesting "family values" at the very
least.

- --
Melissa

PGP Public Keys: http://www.willkayakforfood.tk

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Melissa, that is a very good article, and shows how much hurt there is
in the world even within a family. That it is a family that makes
claims of high ideals, only highlights the difficult issues involved.
This particular issue is very difficult because it strikes at the very
heart of how people identify themselves. I have had to learn that when
we base our identity in our own preconceived ideas, that someone always
is hurt. It is only when we find our identity in Someone greater than
ourselves that the healing can begin. There is no sin that the blood of
Christ does not cover, and the sin of unforgiveness and
self-righteousness required Christ to die just as dead, as for any
other sin. When Maya's folks, find their identity in Christ, they will
not be intimidated by the identity their daughter chooses for herself.
So we need to pray for them all.




I have included the links to Keyes web site, which were posted
originally in regards to a discussion that frtzw906 and I were having
about the involvement of the religious right in conservative politics.
It is post # 1796 in the long thread that has been going on for awhile.



http://tinyurl.com/5s3h6

http://tinyurl.com/62d7v


I find that the religious right, is at best a fickle political
bedfellow, and that there appears to be a rising ground swell of change
in the attitude toward the "right". We will see what happens with it
all. TnT

KMAN wrote:
in article , Melissa at
wrote on 3/14/05 11:36 PM:

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: RIPEMD160

Hi Tinkerntom,

On 14 Mar 2005 20:16:06 -0800, you wrote:

Did you get a chance to check out those two links I left for you
on
one of our last post prior to the week end? I found them
interesting in that they come from Alan Keyes who is as
representative of the conservative religious right as you can get.
I am wondering if anyone else on that side of the aisle has read
his observations, and is takeing heed? I suspect that there is a
ground swell already building.

When I get a chance I may find those links to have a look, but are
you
aware of the situation between Keyes and his lesbian daughter?

Here's a Washington Post article about them:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...2005Feb12.html

Here's what Maya herself had to say about it:

http://tinyurl.com/6g44n

Sure, she's 19, and responsible for herself, but it wasn't until
after
she "came out" publicly about her sexual orientation that her
parents
decided to "cut her loose". Interesting "family values" at the
very
least.

- --
Melissa

Hey now Melissa, just because he has turned his back on his own
daughter...if only Dick Cheney could feel the love of god as strongly
as
Alan Keyes, he'd kick his daughter to the curb too! But no, the best
Dick
can muster is to be quietly disapproving. Satan has made him weak,
whereas
the blood of Christ flows thorugh Alan's veins and gives him the
strength to
hate his own daughter. Religion is so beautiful!

Religion is ugly and a deadly poison. Jesus said I came to give you
life, and to give it to you abundantly. So obviously they are two
diffierent things, though some still can't seem to keep them separate!
TnT

"BCITORGB" wrote in message
ups.com...
Wolfgang, it's clear that when spelling is an issue [as in "In fact I
am not familiar with The Monkees at all, though it seems that I may
have heard of The Monkeys!"], what was intended as mld or subtle humor
becomes hilarious.

"Don't bother......they're here" :)

Wolfgang

"Tinkerntom" wrote in message
oups.com...

KMAN wrote:
...snip...

Tinkerntom, as I am sure you are well aware, you and Scotty can do
whatever
you want with each other, and I am not interested in (nor seeking)
to
stand
in your way.

As for your command to mind my own business, this is a public
newsgroup, and
as Scotty would surely be the first to tell you, you don't have
the
right to
control what I choose to comment on here.

God hates you for your piety, Tinkerntom.

And I have never tried to control what you "choose to comment on
here."

Ah, I must have interpreted your "mind your own business" speech
inaccurately.

That's right, you did, I can't control what you do, but I can choose to
tell you what I think you should do. A big difference, but the
subtleties are apparently too deep for your confused mind!

Mm, well Tinkerntom, I think it's obvious that you can't literally cage me
up and lock the door, so "telling me what to do" is about all the control
you can attempt. And that's what you've tried.

In fact, if you chose to talk about God in a civil fashion, I can
and
would respond in kind in a semi-detached fashion. If you choose to
make
it personal, then I can make it very personal, that is my choice.

Wow. I guess I am starting to understand that spreading god's love is
all
about threatening and trying to control people. Which is pretty much
what
religion is all about, and whether your are a victim or perpetrator,
you're
definitely part of the game Tinkerntom.

I hope that you are beginning to understand, for I believe that you
have been operating under a false understanding about God's Love.

No, I understand it perfectly, and you represent it perfectly.

many have the idea that God's Love is this nice warm fuzzy feeling that
you get at certain holiday times with family and friends. However God's
Love is far more than any of this. It is what compelled Jesus into this
world to die, and to rise again in Victory over Sin and Death and Satan
and his minions. The Love of God is the most powerful force, that
created the Universe, and will someday recreate a New Heaven and a New
Earth.

Can you give us the date?

The Love of God is what binds the Godhead together, and what
reaches out to all of us to include us in the presence of the very
Godhead someday! The Love of God compells men to reach out in Love to
others whose hearts are so hard as to even find contempt for that very
Love, but we reach out anyway. But this is a hard thing to understand I
am sure. We are speaking of the greatest miracle of God, for we are
told, "God is Love!" When we talk about the Love of God, we are talking
about the very essence of God! Not something light and fluffy, that
makes us feel warm and fuzzy! But something that becomes a consuming
fire that burns from within. A fire that cannot be quenched!

yawn

I can always choose to play or not, as can you as well, neither is in
control, unless you desire someone to be in control, however even that
is up to your choice. You say religion is all about control, and seem
to be fixated on proving that you have no choice.

Er, no, Tinkerntom, I've never said any such thing.

I've explained that most deity belief systems utilize a threat/reward system
to control their followers.

As I am not a follower, this problem does not apply to me in the least.

Your very choice
belies the claim that religion is all about control. You prove the
antithesis of your theory, by your choice.

Mm, no, clearly religious systems are not successful in controlling
everyone. However, many have been successful enough to accumulate
significant wealth and wield significant power.

Which all is a strawman arguement anyway, because I am not talking
about religion at all. If you choose to talk about religion, that is
your choice as well, and hence a free moral agent, personally
responsible for the choices you make, and you can't even then offload
your responsibility on religion.

"Religion" as I discuss it simply refers to a system of power based in deity
belief.

I have tried to lay out my thought process regarding different
scenarios, so that you can regulate yourself, to determine the
results
that you desire, and find most comfortable to live with here in our
little corner of cyberspace. Remember, the fool is someone who does
something over and over, expecting different results!

Sort of like someone who preaches about god even when the message is
clear
that the preaching is offensive to them?

A preacher, as a soldier is under orders, does what he is told to do,
even though it may seem that he is preaching to no avail, because he
believes that God can intervene in the above equation. God + zero is a
number that no super computer can calculate. God + 1 obediant servant
can bring down any wall of wicked resistance, no matter what the odds,
or how hardened the wall!

I'll take that as a "yes."

If you choose to be a busy-body, and into everone elses personal
business

How am I into your personal business, Tinkerntom? Did I cyberstalk
you (like
you once did to me) and try to use information from outside this
group to
silence you? I haven't been in your personal business one bit.

I would say that you have tried to silence me with your whining,
lackluster logic, and some general nastiness.

That's all very debatable, but you will recall that your claim was that I
was into your "personal business."

Try to stick with something for once.

How am I into your personal business?

Even this comment is not
offered to clarify any previous perceived wrong, but to silence me in
the current conversation.

Tinkerntom, you've got to be joking. I daresay it is painfully clear that
your piehole remains open regardless of the events around you.

And all of this current attempted
intimidation is aimed at the proposed meeting between SW and myself,
and trying to influence whether we get together or not.

Again, you must be joking. You are a match made in heaven. Nobody cares. Get
together. Make love in the afternoon sun next to the creek. Be happy!

That is RL
intimidation and has nothing to do with any proposed sanctity of
cyberspace!

What are you yapping about? What RL intimidation?!?!?

If you open the door to the previous situation, we could go
back and re-examine the disaster of your previous communications in
other groups if you would like

Go ahead Tinkerntom, you remember what happened last time. You have no clue
as to the context of any of the materials you posted, and one of the people
you assumed to be some sort of enemy of mine advised you to "suck his hairy
balls." So, if you want more of that, go ahead.

But again, it is interesting to see that you have just resorted to a threat,
yet again. I've made no such threats towards you.

otherwise I would recommend that we
stay in the current conversation! And staying in the current
converstion, I see no need to be silent!

What a shock.

that says alot more about you, than anything else you may
have to say on that subject in particular, and probably in general
as
well. Small minds make small comments and contributions to any
society,
including the RBP. If this is not the case with you, you are free
to
comment and show all of us otherwise

Your god complex is showing again. Speak for yourself, not for "us
all."
Unless you've been elected Grand Priest of RBP and I never got my
ballot.

I can choose to speak for us all

As someone who is delusional and afflicted with a god complex, yes.

that continue to hear your whining.

What am I whining about Tinkerntom?

The conclusions we draw will depend on our own position, though the
whining itself without doubt speaks loudly! Others may choose to speak
for themselves, and that is their choice as well, if they disagree with
me! Hello, I don't hear anyone else! and you definitely don't "show all
of us otherwise" either!

Well Tinkerntom, you haven't been elected to represent the group through any
process I've seen, but of course you can continue whatever fanciful
activities you wish.

that is definitely a choice that
is up to you. Reminds me of another saying;

Let men think you a fool, just don't speak,
by opening your mouth, you leave no doubt!

You've left no doubt.

Nor have you!

Geezus, with all that imagination you'd think you'd have a better retort.

You are correct on one point though, you said God hates "piety".
Two
points.

No, I said god hates YOU for your piety.

Big difference.

And I said you don't know what you are talking about! No matter what
the difference!

Wow! Another amazing retort! And you used exclamation marks!

In that context, I am talking about the definition of piety that
refers to
hypocrisy. And your religious blather is the worst kind of hypocrisy.
You
throw in a "god loves you" and you think that will cover up your
blatant
hostility. It doesn't. It makes you pious hypocrite much like the
priest
preaching chastity while diddling the altar boy in the back room.

Is that what happened to you?

No, but trust you to try to exploit such an idea.

The love of god eh?

Try the hostility of a petty hateful man.

That would explain alot of the hostility,
and I would have to agree with you, that is definitely hypocritical of
the priest! But it does not change the fact that God does Love you. If
you allow a hypocrite to stand between you and God, that only means
that the hypocrite is closer to God than you are! There are many actors
on the stage of Life, the problem is the play is for REAL! Are you
playing for real, or are you a hypocrite?

For real, Tinkerntom. God is only a figment of your twisted imagination.
Reality is much more work, try it and see. It can also be much more
rewarding than fantasy.

One, I always find it interesting when someone who does not believe
in
God seems to have a pretty good idea about what God likes and
dislikes;
pretty good imagination there about the invisible that does not
exist.
Which by logic, could not have likes and dislikes, and so would
nullify
your point in the first place.

The fact that god exists only in your imagination does not mean that
there
is not satirical material to be had in reflecting your own delusions
back
onto you.

An argument may be satirical, and provide a snicker, but it does not
present a basis for a logical conclusion. If you desire to arrive at a
logical conclusion, stick with a logical argument! Your point is still
Null if you do not believe in God, independent of my imagination!

There is no logical starting point for your fantastical rantings.

Secondly to your point about piety. Piety is an act of devotion and
reverence to God. If the act is performed for the purpose of
establishing ones own righteousness, then God definitely hates it,
because it sparates us from the righteousness that come from God,
by
believing in the finished work of Jesus on the Cross. The scripture
says, "All our righteousness is like filthy rags!" So if we are
depending on our own acts of piety and benevolence to get in God's
favor and get close to Him, we would do better to grab a bunch of
dirty
old filthy rags and rap them up as a present for the King of Kings,
and
then should not be surprised when we are not allowed in His
presence.

For myself, I acknowledge that all I had to offer Him was a bundle
of
filthy rags, and I accepted Jesus as my Savior, He is now the
source of
my Righteousness. And now the greatest act of piety on my behalf is
to
crawl up in His lap, as a Son of God, a Child of the King, and say,
I
Love You Father. He delights in these acts of piety by His
Children.

God Loves you KMAN, and you are oh so close to the Kingdom!

Are you in that Kingdom, Tinkerntom?

If so, then without need for creating a deity of my own, I know that
I want
to be elsewhere.

And you shall be elsewhere

Hurray!

if you continue on "the broad path that is
easy, and leads to destruction!" However, I would point out that it is
all His Kingdom, for He descended into Hades and took back the Keys of
Hades and of Hell. Now He is enthroned at the right hand of the Father,
where He reigns as King of Kings, and Lord of Lords! You are already in
His Kingdom, albeit an unwilling servant whether you know it or not!
However the day will come when every knee shall bow, and every tongue
confess that He is Lord of Lords, and King of Kings. I just figure its
easier to do it now and be on the winning side, than to wait until it
is to late and be on the whining side.

yawn

There is
not hostility here towards you KMAN

You are oozing hostility. You can't putty over it with your "god
loves you"
blather. It's incredibly obvious.

The Scriptures teach us that God hates sin, but Loves the Sinner. Yes I
am very hostile to all that is hateful and wicked, and sinful. But I
can still tell you that God Loves you KMAN, the sinner! And I am
learning to Love you with His Love. No hostility to you, just your sin!

ROFL.

Again, you are behaving exactly as expected. You are full of hate, but you
feel that your hate can be justified through your belief in an invisible
entity. Amazing, disturbing, and yet typical of religious belief systems.

You know that your religified blather isn't going to move me closer
to
whatever beliefs you share, so you also know that all your god talk
is for
no greater purpose than to satifsy your own personal issues, which I
am
guessing have mainly to do with serious questioning of your own
self-worth.
By investing in your delusions about your connection with a deity,
you can
disassociate from whatever nasty demons are ailing you.

Talk about blather, say again, what was that! That sounds like
pseudo-professional, doubtful, deceitful, double talk. A regular smoke
screen! My conversation is not designed to move you or anyone. It is
designed, if you so choose, to find yourself moved nearer to God. The
choice is yours, not mine, and not based on my own self-worth, but the
ascribed value that God placed upon me when He sent His Son to die for
all of us, each one of us who believe! A value that cannot be conceived
by the mind of any man! And certainly not imagined in the grandest
delusions of any mind!

yawn

but a deep sense of compassion for a wounded heart and soul.

It's all about your wounded heart and soul, Tinkerntom. You use your
religified blather to shield your already damaged psyche from the
harsh
light of reality.

God Loved you before I came along to the RBP,
and He heard that cry, and assigned me to be here for awhile to
share
His Love with you and others who come along.

Ah! You are on a mission from god. You are "the chosen one."

Why didn't you say so earlier?

Because you didn't ask! and because you are incorrect!

No, He is the Chosen One! I am glad to see that you are able to know
the need for a Chosen One!

I think it was Eddie Murphy in The Golden Child.

I am just a sent one, He says, that He sends
us out into the world, to sow seed, plant and water, and some to bring
in the harvest. There are many of us. He also refers to us as fishers
of men. My only claim to fame is that I am a Servant of the Most High
God, and it is a privilege to work in His service as a farmer and a
fisher of men.

yawn

He heard your cry, and I
am learning to hear it, and to know the Love of God that suppasses
understanding, flowing through me like a River of Love flowing out
to
you with Springs of Living Water. I cannot imagine the terrible
wounds
that have been afflicted upon your heart and soul, to result in the
cries that I hear, but God Knows, and Loves you, and can heal all
those
wounds and the broken heart! TnT

The pain you are feeling is never going to be healed through this
insanity,
Tinkerntom. You need to confront your demons and do the work of
healing
within the harsh context of reality. Escaping your problems through
this
deity delusion is obviously forcing you to live increasingly in the
confines
of your imagination, divorcing you further and further from reality.
Ultimately you will end up unable to return.

Jesus already confronted my demons, and they hightailed it back to Hell
where they belong. And Jesus healed me with the reality of His gentle
touch, many times! And Jesus has set the captive free from all that
binds and destroys the shattered dreams and broken soul. The spirit of
the believer is set free to worship God as he was intended before the
Fall, before the Foundation of the World, in the Beauty of Holiness.
For the Word says, "Be ye Holy, for I am Holy", and God's word ascribes
to us Holiness! "For you are now the righteousness of God in Christ
Jesus!"

Ultimately I will end up in His Glorious Presence, from which I shall
never leave, nor want to return. My hope is to hear Him say, "Well done
thou good and faithful servant!" I would also be glad to see you there
on that glorious day, but the choice is yours! KMAN, God Loves you! TnT

yawn

Get well soon, Tinkerntom.

"Tinkerntom" wrote in message
oups.com...

KMAN wrote:
in article , Melissa at
wrote on 3/14/05 11:36 PM:

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: RIPEMD160

Hi Tinkerntom,

On 14 Mar 2005 20:16:06 -0800, you wrote:

Did you get a chance to check out those two links I left for you
on
one of our last post prior to the week end? I found them
interesting in that they come from Alan Keyes who is as
representative of the conservative religious right as you can get.
I am wondering if anyone else on that side of the aisle has read
his observations, and is takeing heed? I suspect that there is a
ground swell already building.

When I get a chance I may find those links to have a look, but are
you
aware of the situation between Keyes and his lesbian daughter?

Here's a Washington Post article about them:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...2005Feb12.html

Here's what Maya herself had to say about it:

http://tinyurl.com/6g44n

Sure, she's 19, and responsible for herself, but it wasn't until
after
she "came out" publicly about her sexual orientation that her
parents
decided to "cut her loose". Interesting "family values" at the
very
least.

- --
Melissa

Hey now Melissa, just because he has turned his back on his own
daughter...if only Dick Cheney could feel the love of god as strongly
as
Alan Keyes, he'd kick his daughter to the curb too! But no, the best
Dick
can muster is to be quietly disapproving. Satan has made him weak,
whereas
the blood of Christ flows thorugh Alan's veins and gives him the
strength to
hate his own daughter. Religion is so beautiful!

Religion is ugly and a deadly poison. Jesus said I came to give you
life, and to give it to you abundantly. So obviously they are two
diffierent things, though some still can't seem to keep them separate!
TnT

Religion is the term that describes how human beings apply deity belief to
real world practices. It's all about power and control. And it is ugly.

KMAN wrote:
"Tinkerntom" wrote in message
oups.com...

KMAN wrote:
...snip...

Tinkerntom, as I am sure you are well aware, you and Scotty can
do
whatever
you want with each other, and I am not interested in (nor
seeking)
to
stand
in your way.

As for your command to mind my own business, this is a public
newsgroup, and
as Scotty would surely be the first to tell you, you don't have
the
right to
control what I choose to comment on here.

God hates you for your piety, Tinkerntom.

And I have never tried to control what you "choose to comment on
here."

Ah, I must have interpreted your "mind your own business" speech
inaccurately.

That's right, you did, I can't control what you do, but I can
choose to
tell you what I think you should do. A big difference, but the
subtleties are apparently too deep for your confused mind!

Mm, well Tinkerntom, I think it's obvious that you can't literally
cage me
up and lock the door, so "telling me what to do" is about all the
control
you can attempt. And that's what you've tried.

In fact, if you chose to talk about God in a civil fashion, I
can
and
would respond in kind in a semi-detached fashion. If you choose
to
make
it personal, then I can make it very personal, that is my
choice.

Wow. I guess I am starting to understand that spreading god's love
is
all
about threatening and trying to control people. Which is pretty
much
what
religion is all about, and whether your are a victim or
perpetrator,
you're
definitely part of the game Tinkerntom.

I hope that you are beginning to understand, for I believe that you
have been operating under a false understanding about God's Love.

No, I understand it perfectly, and you represent it perfectly.

many have the idea that God's Love is this nice warm fuzzy feeling
that
you get at certain holiday times with family and friends. However
God's
Love is far more than any of this. It is what compelled Jesus into
this
world to die, and to rise again in Victory over Sin and Death and
Satan
and his minions. The Love of God is the most powerful force, that
created the Universe, and will someday recreate a New Heaven and a
New
Earth.

Can you give us the date?

The Love of God is what binds the Godhead together, and what
reaches out to all of us to include us in the presence of the very
Godhead someday! The Love of God compells men to reach out in Love
to
others whose hearts are so hard as to even find contempt for that
very
Love, but we reach out anyway. But this is a hard thing to
understand I
am sure. We are speaking of the greatest miracle of God, for we are
told, "God is Love!" When we talk about the Love of God, we are
talking
about the very essence of God! Not something light and fluffy, that
makes us feel warm and fuzzy! But something that becomes a
consuming
fire that burns from within. A fire that cannot be quenched!

yawn

I can always choose to play or not, as can you as well, neither is
in
control, unless you desire someone to be in control, however even
that
is up to your choice. You say religion is all about control, and
seem
to be fixated on proving that you have no choice.

Er, no, Tinkerntom, I've never said any such thing.

I've explained that most deity belief systems utilize a threat/reward
system
to control their followers.

As I am not a follower, this problem does not apply to me in the
least.

Your very choice
belies the claim that religion is all about control. You prove the
antithesis of your theory, by your choice.

Mm, no, clearly religious systems are not successful in controlling
everyone. However, many have been successful enough to accumulate
significant wealth and wield significant power.

Which all is a strawman arguement anyway, because I am not talking
about religion at all. If you choose to talk about religion, that
is
your choice as well, and hence a free moral agent, personally
responsible for the choices you make, and you can't even then
offload
your responsibility on religion.

"Religion" as I discuss it simply refers to a system of power based
in deity
belief.

I have tried to lay out my thought process regarding different
scenarios, so that you can regulate yourself, to determine the
results
that you desire, and find most comfortable to live with here in
our
little corner of cyberspace. Remember, the fool is someone who
does
something over and over, expecting different results!

Sort of like someone who preaches about god even when the message
is
clear
that the preaching is offensive to them?

A preacher, as a soldier is under orders, does what he is told to
do,
even though it may seem that he is preaching to no avail, because
he
believes that God can intervene in the above equation. God + zero
is a
number that no super computer can calculate. God + 1 obediant
servant
can bring down any wall of wicked resistance, no matter what the
odds,
or how hardened the wall!

I'll take that as a "yes."

If you choose to be a busy-body, and into everone elses personal
business

How am I into your personal business, Tinkerntom? Did I cyberstalk
you (like
you once did to me) and try to use information from outside this
group to
silence you? I haven't been in your personal business one bit.

I would say that you have tried to silence me with your whining,
lackluster logic, and some general nastiness.

That's all very debatable, but you will recall that your claim was
that I
was into your "personal business."

Try to stick with something for once.

How am I into your personal business?

Even this comment is not
offered to clarify any previous perceived wrong, but to silence me
in
the current conversation.

Tinkerntom, you've got to be joking. I daresay it is painfully clear
that
your piehole remains open regardless of the events around you.

And all of this current attempted
intimidation is aimed at the proposed meeting between SW and
myself,
and trying to influence whether we get together or not.

Again, you must be joking. You are a match made in heaven. Nobody
cares. Get
together. Make love in the afternoon sun next to the creek. Be happy!

That is RL
intimidation and has nothing to do with any proposed sanctity of
cyberspace!

What are you yapping about? What RL intimidation?!?!?

If you open the door to the previous situation, we could go
back and re-examine the disaster of your previous communications in
other groups if you would like

Go ahead Tinkerntom, you remember what happened last time. You have
no clue
as to the context of any of the materials you posted, and one of the
people
you assumed to be some sort of enemy of mine advised you to "suck his
hairy
balls." So, if you want more of that, go ahead.

But again, it is interesting to see that you have just resorted to a
threat,
yet again. I've made no such threats towards you.

otherwise I would recommend that we
stay in the current conversation! And staying in the current
converstion, I see no need to be silent!

What a shock.

that says alot more about you, than anything else you may
have to say on that subject in particular, and probably in
general
as
well. Small minds make small comments and contributions to any
society,
including the RBP. If this is not the case with you, you are
free
to
comment and show all of us otherwise

Your god complex is showing again. Speak for yourself, not for "us
all."
Unless you've been elected Grand Priest of RBP and I never got my
ballot.

I can choose to speak for us all

As someone who is delusional and afflicted with a god complex, yes.

that continue to hear your whining.

What am I whining about Tinkerntom?

The conclusions we draw will depend on our own position, though the
whining itself without doubt speaks loudly! Others may choose to
speak
for themselves, and that is their choice as well, if they disagree
with
me! Hello, I don't hear anyone else! and you definitely don't "show
all
of us otherwise" either!

Well Tinkerntom, you haven't been elected to represent the group
through any
process I've seen, but of course you can continue whatever fanciful
activities you wish.

that is definitely a choice that
is up to you. Reminds me of another saying;

Let men think you a fool, just don't speak,
by opening your mouth, you leave no doubt!

You've left no doubt.

Nor have you!

Geezus, with all that imagination you'd think you'd have a better
retort.

You are correct on one point though, you said God hates "piety".
Two
points.

No, I said god hates YOU for your piety.

Big difference.

And I said you don't know what you are talking about! No matter
what
the difference!

Wow! Another amazing retort! And you used exclamation marks!

In that context, I am talking about the definition of piety that
refers to
hypocrisy. And your religious blather is the worst kind of
hypocrisy.
You
throw in a "god loves you" and you think that will cover up your
blatant
hostility. It doesn't. It makes you pious hypocrite much like the
priest
preaching chastity while diddling the altar boy in the back room.

Is that what happened to you?

No, but trust you to try to exploit such an idea.

The love of god eh?

Try the hostility of a petty hateful man.

That would explain alot of the hostility,
and I would have to agree with you, that is definitely hypocritical
of
the priest! But it does not change the fact that God does Love you.
If
you allow a hypocrite to stand between you and God, that only means
that the hypocrite is closer to God than you are! There are many
actors
on the stage of Life, the problem is the play is for REAL! Are you
playing for real, or are you a hypocrite?

For real, Tinkerntom. God is only a figment of your twisted
imagination.
Reality is much more work, try it and see. It can also be much more
rewarding than fantasy.

One, I always find it interesting when someone who does not
believe
in
God seems to have a pretty good idea about what God likes and
dislikes;
pretty good imagination there about the invisible that does not
exist.
Which by logic, could not have likes and dislikes, and so would
nullify
your point in the first place.

The fact that god exists only in your imagination does not mean
that
there
is not satirical material to be had in reflecting your own
delusions
back
onto you.

An argument may be satirical, and provide a snicker, but it does
not
present a basis for a logical conclusion. If you desire to arrive
at a
logical conclusion, stick with a logical argument! Your point is
still
Null if you do not believe in God, independent of my imagination!

There is no logical starting point for your fantastical rantings.

Secondly to your point about piety. Piety is an act of devotion
and
reverence to God. If the act is performed for the purpose of
establishing ones own righteousness, then God definitely hates
it,
because it sparates us from the righteousness that come from
God,
by
believing in the finished work of Jesus on the Cross. The
scripture
says, "All our righteousness is like filthy rags!" So if we are
depending on our own acts of piety and benevolence to get in
God's
favor and get close to Him, we would do better to grab a bunch
of
dirty
old filthy rags and rap them up as a present for the King of
Kings,
and
then should not be surprised when we are not allowed in His
presence.

For myself, I acknowledge that all I had to offer Him was a
bundle
of
filthy rags, and I accepted Jesus as my Savior, He is now the
source of
my Righteousness. And now the greatest act of piety on my behalf
is
to
crawl up in His lap, as a Son of God, a Child of the King, and
say,
I
Love You Father. He delights in these acts of piety by His
Children.

God Loves you KMAN, and you are oh so close to the Kingdom!

Are you in that Kingdom, Tinkerntom?

If so, then without need for creating a deity of my own, I know
that
I want
to be elsewhere.

And you shall be elsewhere

Hurray!

if you continue on "the broad path that is
easy, and leads to destruction!" However, I would point out that it
is
all His Kingdom, for He descended into Hades and took back the Keys
of
Hades and of Hell. Now He is enthroned at the right hand of the
Father,
where He reigns as King of Kings, and Lord of Lords! You are
already in
His Kingdom, albeit an unwilling servant whether you know it or
not!
However the day will come when every knee shall bow, and every
tongue
confess that He is Lord of Lords, and King of Kings. I just figure
its
easier to do it now and be on the winning side, than to wait until
it
is to late and be on the whining side.

yawn

There is
not hostility here towards you KMAN

You are oozing hostility. You can't putty over it with your "god
loves you"
blather. It's incredibly obvious.

The Scriptures teach us that God hates sin, but Loves the Sinner.
Yes I
am very hostile to all that is hateful and wicked, and sinful. But
I
can still tell you that God Loves you KMAN, the sinner! And I am
learning to Love you with His Love. No hostility to you, just your
sin!

ROFL.

Again, you are behaving exactly as expected. You are full of hate,
but you
feel that your hate can be justified through your belief in an
invisible
entity. Amazing, disturbing, and yet typical of religious belief
systems.

You know that your religified blather isn't going to move me
closer
to
whatever beliefs you share, so you also know that all your god
talk
is for
no greater purpose than to satifsy your own personal issues, which
I
am
guessing have mainly to do with serious questioning of your own
self-worth.
By investing in your delusions about your connection with a deity,
you can
disassociate from whatever nasty demons are ailing you.

Talk about blather, say again, what was that! That sounds like
pseudo-professional, doubtful, deceitful, double talk. A regular
smoke
screen! My conversation is not designed to move you or anyone. It
is
designed, if you so choose, to find yourself moved nearer to God.
The
choice is yours, not mine, and not based on my own self-worth, but
the
ascribed value that God placed upon me when He sent His Son to die
for
all of us, each one of us who believe! A value that cannot be
conceived
by the mind of any man! And certainly not imagined in the grandest
delusions of any mind!

yawn

but a deep sense of compassion for a wounded heart and soul.

It's all about your wounded heart and soul, Tinkerntom. You use
your
religified blather to shield your already damaged psyche from the
harsh
light of reality.

God Loved you before I came along to the RBP,
and He heard that cry, and assigned me to be here for awhile to
share
His Love with you and others who come along.

Ah! You are on a mission from god. You are "the chosen one."

Why didn't you say so earlier?

Because you didn't ask! and because you are incorrect!

No, He is the Chosen One! I am glad to see that you are able to
know
the need for a Chosen One!

I think it was Eddie Murphy in The Golden Child.

I am just a sent one, He says, that He sends
us out into the world, to sow seed, plant and water, and some to
bring
in the harvest. There are many of us. He also refers to us as
fishers
of men. My only claim to fame is that I am a Servant of the Most
High
God, and it is a privilege to work in His service as a farmer and a
fisher of men.

yawn

He heard your cry, and I
am learning to hear it, and to know the Love of God that
suppasses
understanding, flowing through me like a River of Love flowing
out
to
you with Springs of Living Water. I cannot imagine the terrible
wounds
that have been afflicted upon your heart and soul, to result in
the
cries that I hear, but God Knows, and Loves you, and can heal
all
those
wounds and the broken heart! TnT

The pain you are feeling is never going to be healed through this
insanity,
Tinkerntom. You need to confront your demons and do the work of
healing
within the harsh context of reality. Escaping your problems
through
this
deity delusion is obviously forcing you to live increasingly in
the
confines
of your imagination, divorcing you further and further from
reality.
Ultimately you will end up unable to return.

Jesus already confronted my demons, and they hightailed it back to
Hell
where they belong. And Jesus healed me with the reality of His
gentle
touch, many times! And Jesus has set the captive free from all that
binds and destroys the shattered dreams and broken soul. The spirit
of
the believer is set free to worship God as he was intended before
the
Fall, before the Foundation of the World, in the Beauty of
Holiness.
For the Word says, "Be ye Holy, for I am Holy", and God's word
ascribes
to us Holiness! "For you are now the righteousness of God in Christ
Jesus!"

Ultimately I will end up in His Glorious Presence, from which I
shall
never leave, nor want to return. My hope is to hear Him say, "Well
done
thou good and faithful servant!" I would also be glad to see you
there
on that glorious day, but the choice is yours! KMAN, God Loves you!
TnT

yawn

Get well soon, Tinkerntom.

And despite your profound parsing and retort, God Loves you KMAN, He
showed us His Love when He sent Jesus into the world to die for you.
You can scream and shout and whine, but it won't change God's Love for
you. There is no religion here, no threat, no control, just God loving
you with infinite, wonderful, boundless love. God's love is free for
the taking, no charge, no membership dues, no life of religious duty,
or conscript service. We rejoice to be called the Children of God and
to know His Love that passes understanding. And this is God that Loves
KMAN as well! TnT

Tinkerntom wrote:
KMAN wrote:
....snip...

yawn

Get well soon, Tinkerntom.


And despite your profound parsing and retort, God Loves you KMAN, He
showed us His Love when He sent Jesus into the world to die for you.
You can scream and shout and whine, but it won't change God's Love for
you. There is no religion here, no threat, no control, just God loving
you with infinite, wonderful, boundless love. God's love is free for
the taking, no charge, no membership dues, no life of religious duty,
or conscript service. We rejoice to be called the Children of God and
to know His Love that passes understanding. And this is God that Loves
KMAN as well! TnT

"Tinkerntom" wrote in message
oups.com...

Tinkerntom wrote:
KMAN wrote:
...snip...

yawn

Get well soon, Tinkerntom.


And despite your profound parsing and retort, God Loves you KMAN, He
showed us His Love when He sent Jesus into the world to die for you.
You can scream and shout and whine

Uh, it's not an issue for me, Tinkerntom. I'm not screaming, shouting, or
whining about it.

You, however, appear to be going on an all-out, wild-eyed, super-frenzied,
deep-fried and over-sermonized religified blowout.

but it won't change God's Love for
you. There is no religion here

Well, your expression of your deity belief system is your religion. It's
there, and it's whacko!

no threat

Read your own crap. It's full of threats. The fact that you are powerless to
carry them out is another story.

no control

It's all about control. The fact that you are out of control is another
story.

just God loving you with infinite, wonderful, boundless love

Whatever "god" is doing, being an omnipotent and invisible being and all,
she'd choose a much more effect vehicle than a nutcase like you to deliver
her message.

God's love is free for the taking, no charge, no membership dues, no life
of religious duty,
or conscript service

Wonderful. No need for proselytizing either then.

We rejoice to be called the Children of God

We who?

to know His Love that passes understanding. And this is God that Loves
KMAN as well! TnT

Er, great, you believe that your invisible ominipotent being loves me. I
understand that you believe this.

Now, aside from your ongoing hostility and craziness, is there anything
further you are looking to accomplish?

KMAN wrote:
....snip...

Er, great, you believe that your invisible ominipotent being loves
me. I
understand that you believe this.

Now, aside from your ongoing hostility and craziness, is there
anything
further you are looking to accomplish?

Ditto your action, Ditto the results! You are becoming quite the
expert! Rush could probably use you if you are volunteering for
"anything." I am currently on schedule, any further or future
accomplishments look equally exciting, challenging, and rewarding. I
will let you know when it is time to volunteer. In the meantime, you
can take a number and wait in line, but then you don't like being told
what to do, some control fixation, so you just carry on however you
carry on! Which I am sure you will carry on!

And despite your profound parsing and retort, God Loves you KMAN, He
showed us His Love when He sent Jesus into the world to die for you.
You can scream and shout and whine, but it won't change God's Love for
you. There is no religion here, no threat, no control, just God loving
you with infinite, wonderful, boundless love. God's love is free for
the taking, no charge, no membership dues, no life of religious duty,
or conscript service. We rejoice to be called the Children of God and
to know His Love that passes understanding. And this is God that Loves
KMAN as well! TnT

"Tinkerntom" wrote in message
oups.com...

KMAN wrote:
...snip...

Er, great, you believe that your invisible ominipotent being loves
me. I
understand that you believe this.

Now, aside from your ongoing hostility and craziness, is there
anything
further you are looking to accomplish?

Ditto your action, Ditto the results! You are becoming quite the
expert! Rush could probably use you if you are volunteering for
"anything." I am currently on schedule, any further or future
accomplishments look equally exciting, challenging, and rewarding. I
will let you know when it is time to volunteer. In the meantime, you
can take a number and wait in line, but then you don't like being told
what to do, some control fixation, so you just carry on however you
carry on! Which I am sure you will carry on!

And despite your profound parsing and retort, God Loves you KMAN, He
showed us His Love when He sent Jesus into the world to die for you.
You can scream and shout and whine, but it won't change God's Love for
you. There is no religion here, no threat, no control, just God loving
you with infinite, wonderful, boundless love. God's love is free for
the taking, no charge, no membership dues, no life of religious duty,
or conscript service. We rejoice to be called the Children of God and
to know His Love that passes understanding. And this is God that Loves
KMAN as well! TnT

I think I will try again, since you didn't come close to answering the
question.

Aside from your ongoing hostility and craziness (which I understand you may
wish to describe otherwise) is there anything further you are looking to
accomplish with respect to your proselytizing behaviours?

In other words, you have told me that your god loves me, I understand that
you believe this.

What more would you hope to achieve in this regard?

I can guess what it says. As you seem a reasonable person, it probably says
"I don't want to be in the middle of this discussion between you two idiots,
leave me out of it" :-)

If that's not what it is, let me know, I'll gladly send you my email
address.

"Melissa" wrote in message
...
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: RIPEMD160

Hi KMAN,

On Tue, 15 Mar 2005 13:35:28 -0500, you wrote:

"Tinkerntom" wrote ...

I already have a valid email address for Tinkerntom, but not for you.
I've written a reply to your message that I feel would be better
dealt with via private email; to be sent to both of you at the same
time. If you'd like me to send it along, please write to me via
email (just remove the "REMOVE_THIS" from my posting/reply address).

I'll wait until I have both of your addresses to send the message.

Thanks!

- --
Melissa

PGP Public Keys: http://www.willkayakforfood.tk

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z55OfdTGhdJzAeLlRc6MvMazS5SIVRJDv5XXXnw0lmu424eh8Q uiXYBC0AztzHP/
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"KMAN" wrote in message
. ..
Get well soon, Tinkerntom.

I can't for the life of me believe that you *actually* read all that the
SinisterMinister posted?

Mark --and responded too?--

Mark H. Bowen wrote:
"KMAN" wrote in message
. ..
Get well soon, Tinkerntom.

I can't for the life of me believe that you *actually* read all that
the
SinisterMinister posted?

Mark --and responded too?--

He's a glutton for being Loved by God. He protest, but he really has a
heart cry, apparently like you as well. Know that God Loves you, and
that Jesus died for you to demonstrate God's Love, and His Blood, is
the sacrifice for your sin. God Loves you the same as He Loves Kman,
and the whole world. His wonderful, soul cleansing Blood, can wash away
all your sins, and set you free to Love God with your whole heart, and
soul, and mind and body, in the Beauty of Holiness for though He died,
He is Risen, Victorious over sin and death and Satan, and even now
reigns from the Right Hand of the Father, King of Kings and Lord of
Lords! And to think that He loves us is somthing that is beyond
comprehension. All we can say is "Thankyou Father for loving me, and
showing your love to me in your Son, Jesus Christ!" I will continue
praying for you Mark, TnT

in article , Mark H. Bowen at
wrote on 3/15/05 5:29 PM:


"KMAN" wrote in message
. ..
Get well soon, Tinkerntom.

I can't for the life of me believe that you *actually* read all that the
SinisterMinister posted?

Mark --and responded too?--

It took about 12 seconds.