A couple of newbie questions
 

Welcome back Jax.

Are you sure he didn't just call you an asshole because you are one?

I mean how do we know how much linkage to sine functions is really involved?

-W

"JAXAshby" wrote in message
...
btw, Bob Perry publicaly called me "an asshole" (his words, several times)
for
pointing out that a sine function does not EXPLODE at zero degrees (in
fact it
does nothing at all at zero degrees), which of course means that tens of
millions of people across the country are -- by Bob's definition --
"assholes"
for knowing from sine functions.

A couple of newbie questions
 

Welcome back Jax.

We are looking forward your enlightening explanation of how to calculate
hull power requirements.

Mark Browne

top posting corrected

"JAXAshby" wrote in message
...
try Dave Gerr, for power required. He makes some dumb comments regarding
theory
but his formulae are "close enough" to be more than useful for specific
power
needed for specific speeds for "displacement" type boats. Double check
with
your propeller vendor, and LISTEN to them, for they have some views that
don't
necessarily map one to one with DG's thoughts.

btw, Bob Perry publicalycalled me "an asshole" (his words, several times)
for
pointing out that a sine function does not EXPLODE at zero degrees (in
fact it
does nothing at all at zero degrees), which of course means that tens of
millions of people across the country are -- by Bob's definition --
"assholes"
for knowing from sine functions.


I did a little digging on the US navy training sites, as related to ship
design and propulsion.
I saw a fair amount on traverse wave systems, with analysis on wave-making
resistance as affected by beam to length ratio,
displacement, shape of hull, Froude number (ship length & speed), skin
resistance, laminar flow, and interaction between the drive system and the
hull. Most of it was fairly simple and easy to follow.

It would seem that the traverse wave system is the key to understanding
"hull speed".

The traverse waves travel at approximately the same speed as the ship
- At slow speeds, several crests exist along the ship length because the
wave lengths are smaller than the ship length
- As the ship increases speed, the length of the transverse wave increases
- As the wave length approaches the ship length, the wave making resistance
increases very rapidly
- When the transverse wave length equals the ship's length the vessel has
reached its HULL SPEED
It takes energy to produce waves, and as speed increases, the energy
required is a square function of velocity!
(Wave making resistance drastically increases above hull speed)


Here are my source links.
http://www.usna.edu/NAOE/courses/en2...efficients.ppt
http://www.usna.edu/NAOE/courses/en2...es/chap7_a.ppt
http://web.usna.navy.mil/~phmiller/en200/Chapter7.ppt
http://www.gidb.itu.edu.tr/staff/emi...cteristics.pdf
Some of these are long links - you may have to cut-n-paste to follow them.
The files are in PowerPoint or PDF format.
Most Military training material comes this way - sorry if you have trouble
reading it.
If you are on a Microsoft platform you can download free viewers (Search for
viewer) from Microsoft at:
http://office.microsoft.com/

Jax,
Help me out here; I seem to have missed the sine function thing.
Would you please elaborate?
Perhaps just a link to it and I will read up on it myself?

Mark Browne

A couple of newbie questions
 

"JAXAshby" wrote in message
...
btw, Bob Perry publicaly called me "an asshole" (his words, several times)

===============================================

Bob is a very perceptive guy.

A couple of newbie questions
 

snickers softly

-W

"Wayne.B" wrote in message
...

"JAXAshby" wrote in message
...
btw, Bob Perry publicaly called me "an asshole" (his words, several
times)

===============================================

Bob is a very perceptive guy.

A couple of newbie questions
 

"Mark Browne" wrote in message
news:xcEOb.80651$sv6.188571@attbi_s52...
snip
The concepts being wrestled with here are "precision" and "accuracy".

Precision implies repeatable results to some number of decimal places
plus or minus an uncertainty factor.

That is true.

Accuracy implies the correct answer in absolute terms.

Accuracy is related to how good (accurate) the data set is. For
example, "accurate within 3 meters" is not an absolute - it could
be dead on, or three meters off. Now if the phrase stated "accurate
to within 2.987654321 =/- .0000000001 meters" - that is precise - you
will always know that you will be within 2.987654321 +/- .0000000001
meters of any mark rather than somewhere within the accuracy range of
0 to 3 meters.

snip
I work with precision measuring devices and find that these are slippery
concepts for most people. The shoddy day-to-day usage and close
relationship
between the two words does not make things any easier.
See:
http://www.ieee-uffc.org/freqcontrol...g/vigaccur.htm
for a nice intuitive explanation of the difference between accuracy and
precision.

Mark Browne



Really bad when I make the mistake on an explanation posting. Used to teach
Digital Signal Processing and programming for Texas Instrument fixpoint
DSP's.
Bill

A couple of newbie questions
 

"Joe Parsons" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 17 Jan 2004 22:20:54 GMT, "Calif Bill"

wrote:


"Joe Parsons" wrote in message
.. .
[HAIRSPLITTING=ON]

On Sat, 17 Jan 2004 19:57:18 GMT, Short Wave Sportfishing
wrote:

A nautical mile is also, precisely, 6,076.12 feet.

That's not precise--that's rounded to two decimals.

A nautical mile is, by definition, precisely 1,852 meters, as mentioned
above.

That converts to 6,076.11549 feet (which still is not precise!).

[HAIRSPLITTING=OFF]

I look at it this way - if I can get within four feet of something, I
can holler at it. :)

Now THAT is practical navigation!


Joe Parsons


Difference between an engineer and a mathematician.

Voluptuous Dallas Cheer leader is standing nekid on the goal line.
The engineer and math nerd are on the other line. Told that the first
one
to her gets her. Only restriction is can move only 1/2 the distance to
the
goal in any one move. Math nerd says 'won't even start, is an infinite
series and will never get there.'. Engineer is moving and states, 7
moves
and I am close enough for any thing I want to do.

Joe, you a math minor in a business major?
Bill

Neither. I'm a writer. :)

Another Harry ;)

actually the moves thrown into Xcel for calculation
1 -150
2 -75
3 -37.5
4 -18.75
5 -9.375
6 -4.6875
7 -2.34375 John Holmes maybe, or Long Dong silver for the Clarence
Thomas group
8 -1.171875
9 -0.5859375
10 -0.29296875

A couple of newbie questions
 

On Sun, 18 Jan 2004 22:58:41 GMT, "Mark Browne"
wrote:

snip
The concepts being wrestled with here are "precision" and "accuracy".

Precision implies repeatable results to some number of decimal places
plus or minus an uncertainty factor.

That is true.

Accuracy implies the correct answer in absolute terms.

Accuracy is related to how good (accurate) the data set is. For
example, "accurate within 3 meters" is not an absolute - it could
be dead on, or three meters off. Now if the phrase stated "accurate
to within 2.987654321 =/- .0000000001 meters" - that is precise - you
will always know that you will be within 2.987654321 +/- .0000000001
meters of any mark rather than somewhere within the accuracy range of
0 to 3 meters.

snip
I work with precision measuring devices and find that these are slippery
concepts for most people. The shoddy day-to-day usage and close relationship
between the two words does not make things any easier.
See:
http://www.ieee-uffc.org/freqcontrol...g/vigaccur.htm
for a nice intuitive explanation of the difference between accuracy and
precision.

That was interesting - I was going to use rifle accuracy as an
example.

Actually, I was bored stiff yesterday and wanted to play with the
concept a little.

Oh well - back to the grind. :)

It's tough being retired.

Later,

Tom
S. Woodstock, CT
----------
"My rod and my reel - they comfort me."

St. Pete, 12 Lb. Test

A couple of newbie questions
 

On Mon, 19 Jan 2004 06:07:05 GMT, "Calif Bill"
wrote:

[snip]

Joe, you a math minor in a business major?
Bill

Neither. I'm a writer. :)

Another Harry ;)

I didn't miss your smiley (however ironic it might be), but I do have to make a
couple of observations about your comment:

First, that it is an example of a logical fallacy called "hasty generalization."
It goes like this:

Harry is an often flagrantly rude participant who espouses a
predominately "liberal" political position;

Harry describes himself as a writer;

Joe describes himself as a writer;

THEREFORE

Joe and Harry are the same.

The reason I mention this, apart from my fondness for identifying sloppy
thinking, is that Mr. Krause is (IMO) one of the more unpleasant and disruptive
participants in rec.boats. I find any attempt to tie me to anyone behaving as
he does to be, frankly, insulting.

Besides: you have no idea what (if any) political persuasions I might hold.

Joe Parsons

A couple of newbie questions
 

On Mon, 19 Jan 2004 11:18:56 -0500, Harry Krause wrote:

Joe Parsons wrote:
On Mon, 19 Jan 2004 06:07:05 GMT, "Calif Bill"
wrote:

[snip]

Joe, you a math minor in a business major?
Bill

Neither. I'm a writer. :)

Another Harry ;)

I didn't miss your smiley (however ironic it might be), but I do have to make a
couple of observations about your comment:

First, that it is an example of a logical fallacy called "hasty generalization."
It goes like this:

Harry is an often flagrantly rude participant who espouses a
predominately "liberal" political position;

Harry describes himself as a writer;

Joe describes himself as a writer;

THEREFORE

Joe and Harry are the same.

The reason I mention this, apart from my fondness for identifying sloppy
thinking, is that Mr. Krause is (IMO) one of the more unpleasant and disruptive
participants in rec.boats. I find any attempt to tie me to anyone behaving as
he does to be, frankly, insulting.

Besides: you have no idea what (if any) political persuasions I might hold.

Joe Parsons



What a nice welcome back after my roadtrip (well, planetrip and
roadtrip) to an even more frigid part of the country!

So, Joe, are you "this" Joe Parsons:


Subject: 11) Who is Joe Parsons, anyway??
From: Chris LIEthiser nospam@[EMAIL PROTECTED]

Let me see if I have this straight: you search the Usenet archives on Google and
find something an individual who cowers behind myriad sockpuppets and 'nyms
wrote about me.

Evidently, you are content to accept that screed of personal attacks from that
anonymous person as being somehow factual.

(continued, below)

Date: 7/31/03 4:38 PM Pacific Daylight Time
Message-id: p2ajivgaef9kng3kqrq7agn76mign099p8@[EMAIL PROTECTED]


11) Who is Joe Parsons, anyway??

Joe Parsons is a writer living in the San Francisco Bay area. As of this
writing, he is producing
erotic audio dramas for release near the end of the year (1994). Since
as a
writer he is just one
step away from being unemployed, he spends a lot of time sailing "Good
Faith"
out of Berkeley,
California.


There's a sleezebag goes by the name of Joe Parsons trolling ASAD, a
mental
health support group for those with neurological differences causing them
deficits of attention, who writes and posts a ton of propaganda to ASAD
depicting persons with deficits of attention as pathetic, disturbed,
disabled
losers, needing heavy duty drugging, research shows doesn't help them
perform any better, only makes them more complaint and pliable for the
psychopathic owners of businesses in the flourishing sex industry
recruiting
those all drugged up owing to damage done them by people believe horse
manure
people like Parsons manufactures.

Is the Joe Parsons producing the porn, one and the same Joe Parsons
writing
and posting the ton of propaganda to the attention deficit NG,
depicting those
with deficits of attention as pathetic, disturbed, worthless losers
in need
of drugging up, harmful to them, but making them more compliant and
pliable
for exploitation by psychopaths and porn producers?

------------------------

Or would you be some other unctuous rectal fissure who goes by the name
of Joe Parsons? You know, the kind of fellow Ian Maclaren wrote about in
Kate Carnegie: "A certain class of smug, self-contented, unctuous men."

You know, In the years I have been involved in rec.boats I have taken pains to
be courteous and respectful to others. It's true that, being human, I can be
provoked, but those instances--even in the increasingly nasty environment of
rec.boats--are rare. It's also true that I tend to point out logical flaws in
arguments--call it a hobby--but I generally try to do so in a way that is
constructive and polite.

You, on the other hand, politics aside, are, as I described you, typically a
"flagrantly rude participant" in rec.boats. Anyone who has read this newsgroup
beyond a couple of days and has seen your posts would have to concur. Even many
of who espouse views similar to yours will agree with that assessment.

I find it ironic that you have no idea what (if any) political views I might
have; for all you know, I could be to the left of Fidel Castro. Personally, I
think your conduct here is an embarrassment to anyone who holds views similar to
yours. I think your relentlessly hostile and belligerent behavior here may well
drive people *away* from your way of thinking.

It's a cowardly argument as well, Mr. Krause: where I characterize you
(accurately, I think) as being "flagrantly rude" here, you search the archives
for accusations and personal smears against me, then post that screed from an
arguably disturbed person as though it had some scintilla of truth.

But you know what?

Anyone reading your mean-spirited response is likely to see it for what it is:
the impotent mumbling of a deeply unhappy and angry man who, lacking an
argument, lashes out at anyone within reach--but bloodies and soils himself in
the process.

I hope a time comes when you can find some measure of peace for yourself.

Joe Parsons

A couple of newbie questions
 

On Mon, 19 Jan 2004 16:06:18 GMT, Joe Parsons
wrote:

On Mon, 19 Jan 2004 06:07:05 GMT, "Calif Bill"
wrote:

[snip]

Joe, you a math minor in a business major?
Bill

Neither. I'm a writer. :)

Another Harry ;)

I didn't miss your smiley (however ironic it might be), but I do have to make a
couple of observations about your comment:

First, that it is an example of a logical fallacy called "hasty generalization."
It goes like this:

Harry is an often flagrantly rude participant who espouses a
predominately "liberal" political position;

Harry describes himself as a writer;

Joe describes himself as a writer;

THEREFORE

Joe and Harry are the same.

The reason I mention this, apart from my fondness for identifying sloppy
thinking, is that Mr. Krause is (IMO) one of the more unpleasant and disruptive
participants in rec.boats. I find any attempt to tie me to anyone behaving as
he does to be, frankly, insulting.

Besides: you have no idea what (if any) political persuasions I might hold.

Joe Parsons

Besides, Joe's presence, just as Harry's absence, is most enjoyable!

John H

On the 'Poco Loco' out of Deale, MD
on the beautiful Chesapeake Bay!