On 20 Aug 2004 17:05:41 -0700, (Matt Lang) wrote:

vze3j5ge wrote in message ...
My husband and I are considering purchase of a used boat - currently out
of the water at our marina. We've spoken to a marine surveyor we might
hire who says that the engine can be tested to some extent on land but
that we really should put the boat in the water and check it out. Seems
reasonable - but my question is one about procedure. Who usually pays
for the marina to put boat in and take it out again in such a case -
buyer or seller?

~~ snippity do da ~~

A good deal is one that both parties would do again under the same
circumstances knowing what they know after the deal.

Dewd!!!

What planet do yo live on? I want to move there. :)

Later,

Tom

In article FmxVc.56473$TI1.15297@attbi_s52,
Tony Thomas wrote:


Karl,
Noone has been saying the seller should pay for the survey. That is a
buyers cost if he chooses to have one.
And if a special haul is required for the survey (assuming the boat is not
on a trailer and there is a cost) then that would be payed by the buyer if
not negotiated.
However, for a test ride the seller should pay for the boat to be put in the
water (and if the buyer wants to have a survey done during the test ride
then that should be fine).

--
Tony
my boats at http://t.thomas.home.mchsi.com

Assuming we're talking about a trailer boat or similar, yes. There is no
significant cost involved here.

If its a larger boat and is up on blocks, that's a different matter. Give
me a contract subject to survey and sea trial, and we can talk about it.

I want to see the buyer's skin on the table (at least the cost of his
surveyor) before I'm going to call the travelift operator.

--
--
Karl Denninger ) Internet Consultant & Kids Rights Activist
http://www.denninger.net My home on the net
http://scubaforum.org Your UNCENSORED place to talk about DIVING!
http://boaterforum.com Talk about Boating online - any topic, any time!
http://www.spamcuda.net SPAM FREE mailboxes - FREE FOR A LIMITED TIME!

Agreed. The deal should be settled and the sea trial should be confirmation
of what has been said and negotiated.

--
Tony
my boats at http://t.thomas.home.mchsi.com

"Karl Denninger" wrote in message
nk.net...

In article FmxVc.56473$TI1.15297@attbi_s52,
Tony Thomas wrote:


Karl,
Noone has been saying the seller should pay for the survey. That is a
buyers cost if he chooses to have one.
And if a special haul is required for the survey (assuming the boat is
not
on a trailer and there is a cost) then that would be payed by the buyer
if
not negotiated.
However, for a test ride the seller should pay for the boat to be put in
the
water (and if the buyer wants to have a survey done during the test ride
then that should be fine).

--
Tony
my boats at http://t.thomas.home.mchsi.com

Assuming we're talking about a trailer boat or similar, yes. There is no
significant cost involved here.

If its a larger boat and is up on blocks, that's a different matter. Give
me a contract subject to survey and sea trial, and we can talk about it.

I want to see the buyer's skin on the table (at least the cost of his
surveyor) before I'm going to call the travelift operator.

--
--
Karl Denninger ) Internet Consultant & Kids Rights
Activist
http://www.denninger.net My home on the net
http://scubaforum.org Your UNCENSORED place to talk about DIVING!
http://boaterforum.com Talk about Boating online - any topic, any time!
http://www.spamcuda.net SPAM FREE mailboxes - FREE FOR A LIMITED TIME!

"jps" wrote in message
...
In article , says...

"vze3j5ge" wrote in message
...
My husband and I are considering purchase of a used boat - currently
out
of the water at our marina. We've spoken to a marine surveyor we
might
hire who says that the engine can be tested to some extent on land but
that we really should put the boat in the water and check it out.
Seems
reasonable - but my question is one about procedure. Who usually pays
for the marina to put boat in and take it out again in such a case -
buyer or seller?


I never paid a fee for any boat that I sea trialed. I bought 3 of
them...and walked away from a fourth 'cause the seller and I couldn't
reach
an agreement on a lower price after the sea trial. But I still didn't
pay
for the sea trial.

Three of the four boats that I sea trialed were sold on consignment by a
dealer. The reason the dealer gets a commission on the sale of a
consignment boat is because he has to take on the responsibility and
cost of
launching the boat for sea trials.

There is no way I'd pay a dealer to launch and sea trial a boat that
he's
already getting a commission on. That's the reason he's getting a
commission...to put up with the tire kickers.

We're probably not talkin' about trailer boats Nobby.

There's no difference. It takes just as much time and effort to launch a
25' center console from a dry rack as it does a 40' Convertible. Two of the
four boats that I looked at were in dry storage and needed a forkie to put
'em in the water. Another one was at a boat dealer that was
landlocked...and the owner of the dealership trailered it 20 minutes to the
launch ramp and sea-trialed it with me.

Only one of the four was already moored at a wet slip and didn't need to be
launched.

Gould tried to make the point that there's a difference between launching
for a sea-trial, and launching for a survey. What if your surveyor travels
along for the sea-trial? Is that a sea-trial (seller pays according to
Gould)...or a survey (buyer pays according to Gould)?

nope, only bought 4 for myself. quite a few for most folks...


"Gould 0738" wrote in message
...
nope..i can't agree. when i buy cars or boats, the seller pays, IF I
BUY.
if not, then I BUY.

Well then, don't agree.

Bought many boats? (I've sold a couple of hundred).

Sea Trial is the seller's expense. Survey is the buyers. If the boat is
being
launced for sea trial, it's on the seller. Survey is on the buyer.

You can ask for anything you want. It's all negotiable. My comment merely
reflects the industry norm.

In article , says...

"jps" wrote in message
...
In article , says...

"vze3j5ge" wrote in message
...
My husband and I are considering purchase of a used boat - currently
out
of the water at our marina. We've spoken to a marine surveyor we
might
hire who says that the engine can be tested to some extent on land but
that we really should put the boat in the water and check it out.
Seems
reasonable - but my question is one about procedure. Who usually pays
for the marina to put boat in and take it out again in such a case -
buyer or seller?


I never paid a fee for any boat that I sea trialed. I bought 3 of
them...and walked away from a fourth 'cause the seller and I couldn't
reach
an agreement on a lower price after the sea trial. But I still didn't
pay
for the sea trial.

Three of the four boats that I sea trialed were sold on consignment by a
dealer. The reason the dealer gets a commission on the sale of a
consignment boat is because he has to take on the responsibility and
cost of
launching the boat for sea trials.

There is no way I'd pay a dealer to launch and sea trial a boat that
he's
already getting a commission on. That's the reason he's getting a
commission...to put up with the tire kickers.

We're probably not talkin' about trailer boats Nobby.

There's no difference. It takes just as much time and effort to launch a
25' center console from a dry rack as it does a 40' Convertible. Two of the
four boats that I looked at were in dry storage and needed a forkie to put
'em in the water. Another one was at a boat dealer that was
landlocked...and the owner of the dealership trailered it 20 minutes to the
launch ramp and sea-trialed it with me.

Only one of the four was already moored at a wet slip and didn't need to be
launched.

Gould tried to make the point that there's a difference between launching
for a sea-trial, and launching for a survey. What if your surveyor travels
along for the sea-trial? Is that a sea-trial (seller pays according to
Gould)...or a survey (buyer pays according to Gould)?

We're talking about a: boat that's sitting in the water needing to be
dry docked so the surveyor can do his under the waterline inspection of
hull, running gear, thru hulls, etc.

or b: sitting on the hard needing to get to the water to be sea-trialed.

For a 28' and under that can fit on a trailer or get a forklift ride,
the expense and time isn't that bad but it's still usually incumbent on
the person looking for confirmation, not on the current owner.

When you've got a boat that requires a traveling lift or dry dock to
raise or lower, it's a different story. It can run hundreds of $ to
lift and splash. I'm certainly not going to do that for a perspective
buyer on my dime.

jps

"vze3j5ge" wrote in message
...
My husband and I are considering purchase of a used boat - currently out
of the water at our marina. We've spoken to a marine surveyor we might
hire who says that the engine can be tested to some extent on land but
that we really should put the boat in the water and check it out. Seems
reasonable - but my question is one about procedure. Who usually pays
for the marina to put boat in and take it out again in such a case -
buyer or seller?

Thanks for any help.

Elaine


I probably wouldn't deal with anyone that wouldn't reimburse me if I bought
the boat. I guess that means BUYER pays, SELLER reduces sale price by
survey fee if, AND ONLY IF, the buyer buys. Like I said, I wouldn't DEAL
with anyone who wouldn't accept such reasonable terms. Now if this is a
$2500 boat, it's a different story.

My opinion ... either party ... or even a third party (broker) ... with the
seller's might I suggest written and signed permission and proof of
insurance (suppose the boat turns turtle, goes up in flames, takes out 1/2
the pier etc while out on that test run). And the seller of course can just
say it's for sale as is ... take it or leave it.


"vze3j5ge" wrote in message
...
My husband and I are considering purchase of a used boat - currently out
of the water at our marina. We've spoken to a marine surveyor we might
hire who says that the engine can be tested to some extent on land but
that we really should put the boat in the water and check it out. Seems
reasonable - but my question is one about procedure. Who usually pays
for the marina to put boat in and take it out again in such a case -
buyer or seller?

Thanks for any help.

Elaine

On Sat, 21 Aug 2004 13:00:03 GMT, "Bowgus" wrote:
My opinion ... either party ... or even a third party (broker) ... with the
seller's might I suggest written and signed permission and proof of
insurance (suppose the boat turns turtle, goes up in flames, takes out 1/2
the pier etc while out on that test run). And the seller of course can just
say it's for sale as is ... take it or leave it.

=================================================

A normal yacht brokerage purchase contract spells out the risks and
obligations related to the sea trial and survey. In all contracts
I've seen the seller is responsible for the cost of the sea trial, and
for providing an experienced operator (normally the owner,
professional captain or broker). The buyer is generally responsible
for all survey costs including haulout. During the sea trial the
buyer and surveyors are essentially along for the ride and share no
risk. A typical contract gives the buyer a certain number of days
after the survey and sea trial to either accept or reject the boat
(subject to price re-negotiation). If rejected for any reason, the
deposit money gets returned less any survey/haulout expenses. All of
this is oriented more towards "big boat" purchases of course, and
things are frequently a lot more casual with trailer boats where the
launch and haulout expenses are minimal. It's still a good idea to
have a formal written contract however, especially if there is deposit
money involved.

Thanks to all for your prompt, thoughtful and informative answers. We
really appreciate the help.

Elaine