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Loud boats
Hey crackhead! What are you doing over here? LOL
Yeah it's me, the one and only. Just doing my time here making sure are part of the boating world is represented fairly if ya know what I mean? ;) You know me, I'm an equal opportunity offender. See ya on the other side of the tracks. Buck "bomar" wrote in message ... Hey Buck! Is that you from the Putz's site ??? (I won't mention it since I don't want some of these aholes there....leave them here w/ their Bayliners w/ Force L drives, Sunfish sailboats, and imaginary Lobster boats ) Can't be that many Buck's around ;) ~~~~ Bomar "buck183" wrote in message ... "Larry Hill" wrote in message ... If they were decent people they would use Silent Choice. Larry Hill I actually haven't figured out what is more amusing, the fact that you guys are actually talking about boats on this forum, or the fact that you don't have a clue about how these boats ACTUALLY operate. Yes, most performace boats do have switchable exhaust of some sort installed on them. Not all, but most. What you have failed to mention is the fact that these systems cannot be used above a certain RPM level. I realize this doesn't justify not using them while idling. These boats are manufactured to perform at high speed. They have big block engines in them. They are going to be loud. We all have to pay taxes and someday we will all die. Facts that we have to live w/ and move on. Get over it. Buck |
Loud boats
I knew it was you!
Too bad you didn't make it to our first ever big meeting this past weekend! The anti noise numbnuts here would have absolutely **** their pants Sunday morning @ the marina when that blown Cig Top Gun pulled in, not to mention Bird Dogs Cig and the scores of other insane water rockets. Christ, just the sound of it scared me, and as you know, I am fearless! This newsgroup, out of all the groups I frequent, has, by far the largest amount of idiots in my killfile.... See ya back there on planet Allan4 ;) Bomar "buck183" wrote in message ... Hey crackhead! What are you doing over here? LOL Yeah it's me, the one and only. Just doing my time here making sure are part of the boating world is represented fairly if ya know what I mean? ;) You know me, I'm an equal opportunity offender. See ya on the other side of the tracks. Buck "bomar" wrote in message ... Hey Buck! Is that you from the Putz's site ??? (I won't mention it since I don't want some of these aholes there....leave them here w/ their Bayliners w/ Force L drives, Sunfish sailboats, and imaginary Lobster boats ) Can't be that many Buck's around ;) ~~~~ Bomar "buck183" wrote in message ... "Larry Hill" wrote in message ... If they were decent people they would use Silent Choice. Larry Hill I actually haven't figured out what is more amusing, the fact that you guys are actually talking about boats on this forum, or the fact that you don't have a clue about how these boats ACTUALLY operate. Yes, most performace boats do have switchable exhaust of some sort installed on them. Not all, but most. What you have failed to mention is the fact that these systems cannot be used above a certain RPM level. I realize this doesn't justify not using them while idling. These boats are manufactured to perform at high speed. They have big block engines in them. They are going to be loud. We all have to pay taxes and someday we will all die. Facts that we have to live w/ and move on. Get over it. Buck |
Loud boats
Good points bajaman.
Something tells me the majority of the complainers were 4.0 students in school. I bet their rooms were spotless with everything in it's place. They probably wear suits to work and drive mini vans too. LOL One good thing has come from this thread though.....................AT LEAST WE ARE TALKING ABOUT BOATS!!!!! Buck "bajaman" wrote in message ink.net... Well Buck, as you can see we are in the minority in our opinions but WE know what we like and have bought what we want. You and I both know that most of the namby-pambys whining here secretly wish they had what we have. I suspect most of them are the types that let their wives run their lives, make their decisions for them....lol! And yes, they are the kind of guys that have always not got what they want, likely are totally politically correct, drive 55 on the highway to save gas....in other words.....BORING! But the world needs those guys too, and to each his own I guess. Bajaman "buck183" wrote in message ... LOL bajaman.....I was thinking pretty much what you said but didn't have the heart to put it quite like you did. Can't say I agree more. I've never owned a boat w/ anything smaller than a 502. Don't see that changing in my lifetime either. But then again, I intend to live my life to the fullest too and not watch it go buy. Buck "bajaman" wrote in message nk.net... Jesus....some of you so called "boaters".... A boat needs to have a nice big ass fire breathing big block in it to even be CALLED a boat! If you all don't like the sound, I suggest you crawl aboard a sail-bote and leave the water to the rest of us...lol! I've owned many different boats and with the exception of one (my first) all with big blocks, all with open exhaust....the way God intended. The sound is good, and manly men appreciate this. Girly men don't...it is as simple as that. What....you'd put a muffler on a race car? You guys want to hear loud? Go to some F1 races and hear those beautiful V10s screaming at 18,000 rpm. Or go to some Top Fuel/Funny Car races. Loud exhaust = good fun. But yes, it is up to the owner to have consideration for other more "sensitive" types, of course. No need to blow the gel-coat off someone else whilst idling thru the marinas. "Jim Brinson" wrote in message ... Those "dumb boats" most likely are illegal. Section 44 of the NYS Navigation Law appears to restrict the type of operation you are complaining about. Of course having a law and enforcing that law are two different animals. Worse, I never found a significant difference in performance between the through transom setups and those that exhausted through the outdrive. If you are talking about a thoroughly tuned racing setup then, sure you will have a performance advantage with reduced exhaust pressure. But the average consumer boat? Naw - its just the "look at me" syndrome that ****es people off rather than impressing them. Good luck and good boating, Jim Doug Kanter wrote: "Greg" wrote in message ... I do agree these folks may be calling undue attention to boats. It may be just a matter of time before we are all running air pumps and catalytic converters. I brought up the subject because after being a chauffeur for my 15 yr old son and his friends for most of the day, I ran out of time to get the boat in the water. So, I meandered down to the inlet where Irondequoit Bay meets Lake Ontario. Every 30 seconds, one of these needle-dick boats came blarping through the inlet. Even at idle speed, it completely drowned out ALL other sound. I couldn't hear the guy standing 10 feet away from me, who was yelling about why these dumb boats aren't illegal. |
Loud boats
It is clear that the noise generated by these boats wouldn't make it a half
mile down the normal highway. But, for some unknown reason, it is tolerated on the waterways. It is only a matter of time until these nuts get us all junked up with noise laws and enforcement. Then, those of us with "normal" boats... can only idle all of the way across the lake! They make the noise, and we, the general (reasonable) boating population, gets the laws and enforcement because of them... RichG -- RichG manager, Carolina Skiff Owners Group on MSN http://groups.msn.com/CarolinaSkiffOwners "SaladinoJA" wrote in message ... I meandered down to the inlet where Irondequoit Bay meets Lake Ontario. Every 30 seconds, one of these needle-dick boats came blarping through the inlet. Even at idle speed, it completely drowned out ALL other sound. I couldn't hear the guy standing 10 feet away from me, who was yelling about why these dumb boats aren't illegal. Out here we call those boats "Convertors" they convert money into noise. |
Loud boats
"Steve Alexanderson" Idon'tlikegreeneggsandspamIdon'tlikethemsamIamsal wrote in message ... KEYWORD = any pleasure vessel Slap a number on its side and its not a pleasure vessel anymore but rather a race boat.... thus the law does not apply. |
Loud boats
On Wed, 04 Aug 2004 03:25:03 GMT, "RichG"
wrote: It is clear that the noise generated by these boats wouldn't make it a half mile down the normal highway. But, for some unknown reason, it is tolerated on the waterways. It is only a matter of time until these nuts get us all junked up with noise laws and enforcement. Then, those of us with "normal" boats... can only idle all of the way across the lake! They make the noise, and we, the general (reasonable) boating population, gets the laws and enforcement because of them... ========================================== Exactly right. Unfortunately it's up to the rest of us to ensure that the existing laws get enforced before things get worse. Start by taking down the registration numbers of the prime offenders in your area. If one of them steps over the line and looks "BUI", arrange to have them met at the dock by your local law enforcement folks. They go quiet real quickly. |
Loud boats
For Christ sakes you are making it sound like every boat that goes by is a
37' Cigarette Top Gun with twin 502,s running at 7500 RPM. In south Fla we have our fair share of them but give me a break, its not like the bay is thundering with the sound of Ocean Racers 24/7! I don't have one of these boats, wish I could afford one but I still enjoy seeing them run and yes even hearing them run. I guess many of you are not race fans, or gear heads that enjoyed working on your cars. The rough idle is caused by a hot cam, and when at idle the motors are not that loud, granted they are louder than most, but they are not ear splitting and can even sound good to some people. Some of these boats can cruise at over 100 mph which is a pretty impressive feat, basically that's like breakfast in Bimini and lunch in the Grove. In the bay there are speed limits which pretty much limit the sound because they are running just above idle, in manatee zones they are running at idle. When they go into the inlet to the ocean they throttle up and are out if earshot in a minute or two. Unless you are in another boat that can stay with them you wont hear them again. Seems that all you people are too quick to try to start finding laws to ban them are they really that much of a problem? A little noise and its time to call in the feds. Some of the people in these boats can be jerks, no doubt about that too, Someone mentioned mufflers on race cars, don't laugh some classes require mufflers. When racing Mazda Rotaries you definitely need a muffler. Again some of these boats have them. Which makes me wonder why the big gripe about the noise? If you figure the total number of boat, then take the number of go-fasts minus the number of go-fasts with mufflers the percentage of boats you are complaining about is very small. Which makes me wonder if envy comes into play here. As a side note, twin high performance 502's at idle still smell a whole lot better than any diesel ever would. "Doug Kanter" wrote in message I'm using the term "speedboats" to describe boats which sound like they have (and probably do have) a pair of 400+ cubic inch motors in the back? In order to achieve their purpose (speed), is it absolutely necessary for them to be as noisy as they are, or are they just designed that way, in the same way some morons alter their motorcycles because "loud pipes save lives"? And, when they're idling, why do they sound (and smell) as if the engines are only firing on half their cylinders? |
Loud boats
On Wed, 4 Aug 2004 00:24:01 -0400, "JGK" wrote:
when at idle the motors are not that loud, granted they are louder than most, but they are not ear splitting and can even sound good to some people. =================================== Total baloney on all counts unless you're already stone deaf. Get you're hearing tested immediately. |
Loud boats
I suspect a judge would ask the LEO to search the boat. Anything that
doesn't belong on a racing boat would sink your idea. "JGK" wrote in message ... "Steve Alexanderson" Idon'tlikegreeneggsandspamIdon'tlikethemsamIamsal wrote in message ... KEYWORD = any pleasure vessel Slap a number on its side and its not a pleasure vessel anymore but rather a race boat.... thus the law does not apply. |
Loud boats
You've raised many valid points. Here are a few more to consider:
In article , "JGK" wrote: For Christ sakes you are making it sound like every boat that goes by is a 37' Cigarette Top Gun with twin 502,s running at 7500 RPM. In south Fla we have our fair share of them but give me a break, its not like the bay is thundering with the sound of Ocean Racers 24/7! I don't have one of these boats, wish I could afford one but I still enjoy seeing them run and yes even hearing them run. I guess many of you are not race fans, or gear heads that enjoyed working on your cars. The rough idle is caused by a hot cam, and when at idle the motors are not that loud, granted they are louder than most, but they are not ear splitting and can even sound good to some people. Not wanting offshore boats to run unmuffled IS NOT synomynous with any lack of appreciation for performance. I am sure that many of the posters who resent people who run their boats without a diverter, enjoy an auto or boat race as much as the next guy. The difference is: 1. It is an actual race vs someone showing off a toy. 2. They are making an informed decision and electing to partake in the event versus someone forcing them to listen to a bunch of noise. As for ear splitting sound. Maybe maybe not. My criteria for annoyance in this matter is obviously lower than yours, as I find it annoying long before any physical damage to my hearing is done. While I can't speak for everyone, for me it's often not just the noise, its the intent. If an unmuffled boat idles by, I may not like it, but as you state, it will come to pass. I have friendly acquaintances at a marina I frequent, two couples, each with an offshore. They idle in and out quickly and at reasonable times of day, no problem. To infer that we as a group are intolerant becuase we don't want to have to scream at the person next to us just becuase someone wants EVERYONE to hear how powerful his boat is by choosing not to use his exhaust diverter, well that may seem intolerant to you, but I might be more tolerant in far more areas. Don't judge me or anyone else just because we don't understand the need for anyone who can afford boating to call attention to themselves. The behaviour is selfish, and quite frankly, unessarily redundant. Some of these boats can cruise at over 100 mph which is a pretty impressive feat, basically that's like breakfast in Bimini and lunch in the Grove. In the bay there are speed limits which pretty much limit the sound because they are running just above idle, in manatee zones they are running at idle. When they go into the inlet to the ocean they throttle up and are out if earshot in a minute or two. Unless you are in another boat that can stay with them you wont hear them again. Were all impressed with the speed of these boats. I especially have an appreciation as I went from sailing into powerboating. I like sailing more than powerboating, but since the majority of my time on the water is going to a destination, I find powerboating more in line with the type of boating I do. I for one like to go fast on the water. I like to go fast on land. But I like the type of performance that hides itself until needed. You know, like the AMG Mercedes that could blow the doors off of a porsche. I have no problem with race boats being loud. I have the problem with someone who refuses to muffle their exhaust at idle because the want to get the extra 10HP at WOT they'll rarely if ever ever use on Lake Erie. In short, multiple people are paying for one persons ego. Seems that all you people are too quick to try to start finding laws to ban them are they really that much of a problem? A little noise and its time to call in the feds. Some of the people in these boats can be jerks, no doubt about that too, Someone mentioned mufflers on race cars, don't laugh some classes require mufflers. When racing Mazda Rotaries you definitely need a muffler. Again some of these boats have them. Which makes me wonder why the big gripe about the noise? If you figure the total number of boat, then take the number of go-fasts minus the number of go-fasts with mufflers the percentage of boats you are complaining about is very small. Which makes me wonder if envy comes into play here. Interesting "statistics". Now heres one for you: All it takes in ONE to be consistiently next to you and not exercising due courtesy, and maybe you won't find that "high performance" sound so appealing. How about the guy fifteen feet away, who is revving up each of engine to "tune" it in from of his girlfriend. How about the little dickhead fifty feet away who comes back for the bars at 3am and feels the need to rev his engines for a few minutes to show off. How about the idiot whose exhaust is two feet from the beam of your boat, where your bunk is, who starts his boat at 7:30 am sunday morning then leisurely proceeds, to remove his spring lines, power cord, fenders, takes a dump in the marina bathroom, quickly departing at 7:50am? These three people alone are the reasons I would vote for tougher noise laws within a mile from any shoreline. As a side note, twin high performance 502's at idle still smell a whole lot better than any diesel ever would. I don't exactly know what 502's smell like, but it can't be worse than a diesel :^) Bob Dimond |
Loud boats
On Wed, 04 Aug 2004 14:03:24 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote: Anything that doesn't belong on a racing boat would sink your idea. ============================================= You mean something like a cooler full of beer, high powered stereo and a bikini babe or two? Sounds pretty racy to me... |
Loud boats
"Wayne.B" wrote in message ... On Wed, 04 Aug 2004 14:03:24 GMT, "Doug Kanter" wrote: Anything that doesn't belong on a racing boat would sink your idea. ============================================= You mean something like a cooler full of beer, high powered stereo and a bikini babe or two? Sounds pretty racy to me... Maybe even just dishes. :-) |
Loud boats
"Bob D." wrote in message ... You've raised many valid points. Here are a few more to consider: In article , "JGK" wrote: For Christ sakes you are making it sound like every boat that goes by is a 37' Cigarette Top Gun with twin 502,s running at 7500 RPM. In south Fla we have our fair share of them but give me a break, its not like the bay is thundering with the sound of Ocean Racers 24/7! I don't have one of these boats, wish I could afford one but I still enjoy seeing them run and yes even hearing them run. I guess many of you are not race fans, or gear heads that enjoyed working on your cars. The rough idle is caused by a hot cam, and when at idle the motors are not that loud, granted they are louder than most, but they are not ear splitting and can even sound good to some people. Not wanting offshore boats to run unmuffled IS NOT synomynous with any lack of appreciation for performance. I am sure that many of the posters who resent people who run their boats without a diverter, enjoy an auto or boat race as much as the next guy. The difference is: 1. It is an actual race vs someone showing off a toy. 2. They are making an informed decision and electing to partake in the event versus someone forcing them to listen to a bunch of noise. As for ear splitting sound. Maybe maybe not. My criteria for annoyance in this matter is obviously lower than yours, as I find it annoying long before any physical damage to my hearing is done. While I can't speak for everyone, for me it's often not just the noise, its the intent. If an unmuffled boat idles by, I may not like it, but as you state, it will come to pass. I have friendly acquaintances at a marina I frequent, two couples, each with an offshore. They idle in and out quickly and at reasonable times of day, no problem. To infer that we as a group are intolerant becuase we don't want to have to scream at the person next to us just becuase someone wants EVERYONE to hear how powerful his boat is by choosing not to use his exhaust diverter, well that may seem intolerant to you, but I might be more tolerant in far more areas. Don't judge me or anyone else just because we don't understand the need for anyone who can afford boating to call attention to themselves. The behaviour is selfish, and quite frankly, unessarily redundant. Some of these boats can cruise at over 100 mph which is a pretty impressive feat, basically that's like breakfast in Bimini and lunch in the Grove. In the bay there are speed limits which pretty much limit the sound because they are running just above idle, in manatee zones they are running at idle. When they go into the inlet to the ocean they throttle up and are out if earshot in a minute or two. Unless you are in another boat that can stay with them you wont hear them again. Were all impressed with the speed of these boats. I especially have an appreciation as I went from sailing into powerboating. I like sailing more than powerboating, but since the majority of my time on the water is going to a destination, I find powerboating more in line with the type of boating I do. I for one like to go fast on the water. I like to go fast on land. But I like the type of performance that hides itself until needed. You know, like the AMG Mercedes that could blow the doors off of a porsche. I have no problem with race boats being loud. I have the problem with someone who refuses to muffle their exhaust at idle because the want to get the extra 10HP at WOT they'll rarely if ever ever use on Lake Erie. In short, multiple people are paying for one persons ego. Seems that all you people are too quick to try to start finding laws to ban them are they really that much of a problem? A little noise and its time to call in the feds. Some of the people in these boats can be jerks, no doubt about that too, Someone mentioned mufflers on race cars, don't laugh some classes require mufflers. When racing Mazda Rotaries you definitely need a muffler. Again some of these boats have them. Which makes me wonder why the big gripe about the noise? If you figure the total number of boat, then take the number of go-fasts minus the number of go-fasts with mufflers the percentage of boats you are complaining about is very small. Which makes me wonder if envy comes into play here. Interesting "statistics". Now heres one for you: All it takes in ONE to be consistiently next to you and not exercising due courtesy, and maybe you won't find that "high performance" sound so appealing. How about the guy fifteen feet away, who is revving up each of engine to "tune" it in from of his girlfriend. How about the little dickhead fifty feet away who comes back for the bars at 3am and feels the need to rev his engines for a few minutes to show off. How about the idiot whose exhaust is two feet from the beam of your boat, where your bunk is, who starts his boat at 7:30 am sunday morning then leisurely proceeds, to remove his spring lines, power cord, fenders, takes a dump in the marina bathroom, quickly departing at 7:50am? These three people alone are the reasons I would vote for tougher noise laws within a mile from any shoreline. As a side note, twin high performance 502's at idle still smell a whole lot better than any diesel ever would. I don't exactly know what 502's smell like, but it can't be worse than a diesel :^) Bob Dimond When people say "Our military has lost track of hundreds of Stinger missiles and they have gotten into the wrong hands", it's really true. I know whose hands are the right ones. :-) |
Loud boats
It's just more thoughtless behavior from the ego challenged "look at
me" crowd. There's no reason at all why a pair of 454s has to be louder than any other well mannered I/O except that the owners prefer it that way. Im not sure I agree... First, a less restictive (louder) exhaust is in fact a performance enhancment. And not "all" high-performance boaters are "look at me" people. I have been building high-performance boat engines for years, and do more so for R&D, than fun and thrills. Thus why I go out at the least busy times. Take care. -- -Netsock "It's just about going fast...that's all..." http://home.insight.rr.com/cgreen/ |
Loud boats
"Netsock" wrote in message
... It's just more thoughtless behavior from the ego challenged "look at me" crowd. There's no reason at all why a pair of 454s has to be louder than any other well mannered I/O except that the owners prefer it that way. Im not sure I agree... First, a less restictive (louder) exhaust is in fact a performance enhancment. And not "all" high-performance boaters are "look at me" people. I have been building high-performance boat engines for years, and do more so for R&D, than fun and thrills. Thus why I go out at the least busy times. Take care. Yeah, but I'll bet you don't start your lawn mower at 7:00 AM, right? If you come home late, when the whole neighborhood's lights are out, I'd guess that you lean on your horn as a way of saying hello as you pull into the driveway. If your car's exhaust develops a leak and gets really loud, but you can't get to the mechanic for a couple of days, do you try and adjust your driving needs so as not to **** off the whole neighborhood? Maybe knock on your neighbor's door and say "Hey...sorry about the noise, it'll be fixed on Thursday"? There's a breed of people who just don't get it. Those are the ones we're talking about here. |
Loud boats
Subject: Loud boats
From: "Rod McInnis" "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... Cam timing and lift patterns. Capt. Bill Are they, in fact, misfiring at idle? An engine that is designed for high RPMs will often sacrifice low RPM (idle) performance to get the engine to breath better at high RPMs. At the higher RPMs the momentum (or lack thereof) is a substantial factor in the air flow. The exhaust gases flowing out the manifold have momentum, and can actually help scavenge the cylinder if the valves are left open a little past "top dead center". Likewise, it takes a while to get the air intake to start flowing, plus it takes a while to actually get the valves to open. It is common for a high RPM cam to have both the exhaust and intake valves open together for a short period of time. This works well at 6000 + RPM. It doesn't work well at 800 RPM. I wouldn't call it a "misfire" as much as the intake system is getting all messed up. Rod What he said. :-) Capt. Bill |
Loud boats
"Bob D." wrote in message
... You've raised many valid points. Here are a few more to consider: Not wanting offshore boats to run unmuffled IS NOT synomynous with any lack of appreciation for performance. I am sure that many of the posters who resent people who run their boats without a diverter, enjoy an auto or boat race as much as the next guy. The difference is: 1. It is an actual race vs someone showing off a toy. 2. They are making an informed decision and electing to partake in the event versus someone forcing them to listen to a bunch of noise. As for ear splitting sound. Maybe maybe not. My criteria for annoyance in this matter is obviously lower than yours, as I find it annoying long before any physical damage to my hearing is done. While I can't speak for everyone, for me it's often not just the noise, its the intent. If an unmuffled boat idles by, I may not like it, but as you state, it will come to pass. I have friendly acquaintances at a marina I frequent, two couples, each with an offshore. They idle in and out quickly and at reasonable times of day, no problem. I thought about this a lot and it seems that its not the loud boats at all. I appreciate the sound of performance engines and they are almost music to my ears. However I have a very low tolerance for rap music with the heavy bass, hate it when I'm at a light and the car behind me has a stereo that has so much bass it makes my rear view mirror vibrate. The sound of a Harley is irritating because if I had a Corvette that hit the same DB as those bikes I'd get a ticket but the Harleys are un touched, not to mention the little Japanese cars that now have more exhaust than engine. What we are complaining about are people who are rude and have no common curtsey for others. Not sure what can be done.... Yeah you can pass laws for noise, get them to enforce it but then you have a bigger problem with the government. Performance boats are not the problem. if I came home from fishing at 3 in the morning and decided to rinse my 125 outboard before I went to bed I'm sure the neighbors would think it was just as loud as what you are complaining about. Its the people not the bots that are a problem. Remember you cannot legislate morality or common sense. Less Government is better government. |
Loud boats
"Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... When people say "Our military has lost track of hundreds of Stinger missiles and they have gotten into the wrong hands", it's really true. I know whose hands are the right ones. :-) Damn you are one sick puppy... bitching about the inconsiderate people with the performance boats, then yapping about the barking dogs and trying to figure out if it would be better to shoot or poison them.. All things considered, I rather have the inconsiderate perfomance boater as a neighbor than you. |
Loud boats
"Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... I suspect a judge would ask the LEO to search the boat. Anything that doesn't belong on a racing boat would sink your idea. not really you can be out testing and in testing you would have different things aboard than if you were racing. If you claim to be racing production class... you could have everything a production boat came with stereo, coolers ect... |
Loud boats
|
Loud boats
On Thu, 05 Aug 2004 08:16:30 -0400, Dave Hall
wrote: As I get older, I find my tolerance for noise to be less, which is why I shoved a set of baffles in my exhausts. Yea, it trimmed a little off the top end, but I don't run flat out all that much any more, and it makes the boat much more friendly to everyone else. The last thing I want to do is make enemies of fellow boaters. ============================= Thank you. Please pass the advice onto others. |
Loud boats
In article , Dave Hall
wrote: That you would denigrate a person's recreational choice down to the category of "a toy" is telling in itself, and indicates a lack of understanding of the sport. Many people enjoy running fast, but do not desire (or cannot afford) to "race" officially. The same performance considerations affect both "official" racers and weekend warriors. Lack of understanding? Sorry but these ARE toys. Just as my boats are toys. They are not a necessity, and that is my word of choice. No offense was intended, but I'll certainly make no apologies for its use. What constitutes "a bunch of noise" is usually a matter of subjectivity and personal preference. Personally, my boating day would not be complete without hearing the sweet sounds of many finely tuned big blocks running at 4000 RPM as they pass by. Now these boats are not overly loud in my opinion. They do not impair conversation nor do they drown out the stereo. That's odd, an unmuffled boat exhaust within fifty feet of me with that exhaust aimed in my direction does in fact impair both my conversation and stereo listening enjoyment. Once again, if it's a quick arrival, departure, or passer by, I can deal with it. If its someone who feels the need to hear loud noises, then let them move near an AFB or NAS, rather than annoy those around them who merely wish to relax in peace and quiet. As for ear splitting sound. Maybe maybe not. My criteria for annoyance in this matter is obviously lower than yours, as I find it annoying long before any physical damage to my hearing is done. While I can't speak for everyone, for me it's often not just the noise, its the intent. If an unmuffled boat idles by, I may not like it, but as you state, it will come to pass. I have friendly acquaintances at a marina I frequent, two couples, each with an offshore. They idle in and out quickly and at reasonable times of day, no problem. Some people just don't get it. If you have a boat with unmuffled thru transoms with no diverter, then you have to be responsible enough to understand that not everyone likes and/or appreciates the sound. This feeling is also very time dependant. Amen. And for that we appreciate those of you that at least make the attempt of consideration. Unfortunately, I have seen all too many people who as you say "don't get it", that is why I and others have a problem. To infer that we as a group are intolerant becuase we don't want to have to scream at the person next to us just becuase someone wants EVERYONE to hear how powerful his boat is by choosing not to use his exhaust diverter, well that may seem intolerant to you, but I might be more tolerant in far more areas. Don't judge me or anyone else just because we don't understand the need for anyone who can afford boating to call attention to themselves. The behaviour is selfish, and quite frankly, unessarily redundant. Making the assumption that people who enjoy performance boats, are all going though a mid-life crisis, need a "penis extension", or are somehow just looking to show off, is being judgmental and stereotyping in the worst way. Your right, not everyone in your goup deserves to be maligned. As I stated, I have friendly acquaintances that do not fit this maligned description of offshore powerboaters. However, I've see far more people in these boats that exercise rude behavior that screams "Me, me, me. **** you." These people help myself and others to form a general opinion that is unfavorable. Don't blame me because alot of people I've come across in your category of boating cannot exercise even the least bit of common courtesy or common sense. I would agree right up until your quip about a person's ego. Once again you are making a judgement. There are many technical reasons why performance boats are loud. Considering that once you reach the 50 MPH area, it takes roughly between 10 and 15 HP to gain each additional 1 MPH, every little bit of gain helps. Installing a free flowing exhaust system (Including tuned headers or a better manifold), can net you up to 30 more HP (Which means 2 more MPH). It would be great if every boat had a "captain's call" exhaust diverter, but the truth is that many don't (mine doesn't). As I get older, I find my tolerance for noise to be less, which is why I shoved a set of baffles in my exhausts. Yea, it trimmed a little off the top end, but I don't run flat out all that much any more, and it makes the boat much more friendly to everyone else. The last thing I want to do is make enemies of fellow boaters. You don't agree with my last statement about ego, fine. No, not every boat has a diverter system. But maybe they should, and maybe they're use should be mandatory at idle speeds in a port. That would end our nitpicking of this topic real quick. I could be wrong here, but it was my understanding that all new performance boats were required to have this type of equipment. If so why aren't these devices being used by their captains? How you you describe someone who has this device, yet chooses to refrain from muffling their exhause at idle speed in a port? You don't have to explain that "every little bit helps", were all aware of that. But tell me, on Lake Erie, which is almost NEVER flat enough to run even close to WOT for these types of vessels, why does this person need an unmuffled exhaust to gain that extra 30HP that they cannot possibly use at their top end? If these things don't describe someone taking their ego out for exercise then what do they say? And please don't argue the "performance for performance's sake" aspect as if everyone in this boating category is so dedicated and methodical about performance that they should be wearing white lab coats, and jotting into notebooks. Frankly, I really don't see that. While I'll concede there are people who have a genuine interest, the guts, the skills, and the venue, for pushing the performance envelope within this boating goup, I do not think they comprise the majority. I think its ego for most. How about the guy fifteen feet away, who is revving up each of engine to "tune" it in from of his girlfriend. Most women have no clue (or do they want to know) what a tuned up engine is supposed to sound like, unless she's one of those rare female gearheads. If it were me reving the engine, my wife would turn to me and ask "Must you do that?" Unfortuantely, i am a bad typist. What I was trying to convey what this person was revving his engines for twenty minutes and not doing anything useful. It was merely to impress a woman who as you say did not have a clue. Even if he was doing something useful, with an unmuffled exhaust it might have been nice if he thought to warn his neighbors about what he was trying to do and how long it might take so we could make the choice to leave and come back later, rather than wondering how long we'll be subject to "RPM scales" How about the little dickhead fifty feet away who comes back for the bars at 3am and feels the need to rev his engines for a few minutes to show off. Who's he showing off to at 3:00 AM? For all I know, the Queen of England. At 3:00am does it matter? How about the idiot whose exhaust is two feet from the beam of your boat, where your bunk is, who starts his boat at 7:30 am sunday morning then leisurely proceeds, to remove his spring lines, power cord, fenders, takes a dump in the marina bathroom, quickly departing at 7:50am? I guess he wants to make sure the engine is thoroughly warmed up before shoving off. At 5:30 AM even normal outboards or standard inboards are loud. When I was a marina rat in 1982-84, I used to be woken up regularly at that time when the gung-ho fishermen would fire off toward that distant fishing hole. Yet those same guys had the nerve to bitch when we cruised back into the marina at 2:30 in the morning after a night of partying. And we didn't even have a performance boat then. High performance boat, fisherman, or sailboat. I have little respect for someone who doesn't plan a quick arrival or departure during quiet times. When you have a boat producing very loud exhaust noises this malignant feeling increases. When that exhaust is two feet from my bunk, I jot down his registration numbers and wish him good luck at ever seeing a dock space open to him in this marina in the future. These three people alone are the reasons I would vote for tougher noise laws within a mile from any shoreline. It's a shame that a few people wreck things for the rest of us. Dave Your right, Dave, it is a shame. You also cite excellent examples that bad behavior is by no means reserved for performance powerboaters. We could just as easily be talking about another group, and I would have stories to back my opinions up. You probably think I came into this discussion and am leaving with a permanent bias against performance power boaters, and you'd be at least half right. My experiences with alot of them have been less than useful. However, I would like to state that people like you, who can conduct a reasonable conversation, and excerises courtesy towards other boaters, goes a long way to help me stay a little more open minded, and judge the person by their behavior and not just the boat. Even if that boat happens to be louder than I like :^) Thank you, take care, and happy boating! Bob Dimond |
Loud boats
"JGK" wrote in message ... "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... When people say "Our military has lost track of hundreds of Stinger missiles and they have gotten into the wrong hands", it's really true. I know whose hands are the right ones. :-) Damn you are one sick puppy... bitching about the inconsiderate people with the performance boats, then yapping about the barking dogs and trying to figure out if it would be better to shoot or poison them.. All things considered, I rather have the inconsiderate perfomance boater as a neighbor than you. That's silly. You know that. |
Loud boats
"JGK" wrote in message
... Its the people not the bots that are a problem. But GENERALLY speaking, certain kinds of people seem to get their hands on certain kinds of toys, and aren't smart or considerate enough to use them without driving others crazy. So, the two things (people and toys) can't really be separated. |
Loud boats
I think the real answer is the manufacturers should set the boats up to
transmit more of the noise toward the inside of the boat and less outside. Then everyone is happy. |
Loud boats
"Doug Kanter" wrote in message ...
"JGK" wrote in message ... Its the people not the bots that are a problem. But GENERALLY speaking, certain kinds of people seem to get their hands on certain kinds of toys, and aren't smart or considerate enough to use them without driving others crazy. So, the two things (people and toys) can't really be separated. Around these parts, we call them "penis boats", because they are nothing more than a phallic symbol for those lacking in that department, UNLESS you actually race boats, different story all together. But, if you just generally go to where the crowds are, and make noise, etc., then yes, it's a substitute for a real penis. You know who you are... |
Loud boats
"WaIIy" wrote in message ... On Wed, 4 Aug 2004 22:32:46 -0400, "JGK" wrote: "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... When people say "Our military has lost track of hundreds of Stinger missiles and they have gotten into the wrong hands", it's really true. I know whose hands are the right ones. :-) Damn you are one sick puppy... bitching about the inconsiderate people with the performance boats, then yapping about the barking dogs and trying to figure out if it would be better to shoot or poison them.. All things considered, I rather have the inconsiderate perfomance boater as a neighbor than you. Actually, Doug is probably a pretty good neighbor. Hmmm. Wally defending ME? Something's fishy here. |
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Dave Hall wrote:
On 6 Aug 2004 04:44:47 -0700, (basskisser) wrote: "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "JGK" wrote in message ... Its the people not the bots that are a problem. But GENERALLY speaking, certain kinds of people seem to get their hands on certain kinds of toys, and aren't smart or considerate enough to use them without driving others crazy. So, the two things (people and toys) can't really be separated. Around these parts, we call them "penis boats", because they are nothing more than a phallic symbol for those lacking in that department, UNLESS you actually race boats, different story all together. But, if you just generally go to where the crowds are, and make noise, etc., then yes, it's a substitute for a real penis. You know who you are... You really need to get a clue, since you obviously know nothing about what you're talking about. Dave Oh, puh-lease, Dave. Buy a clue about something. Owners of superloud "pleasure boats" are desperately trying to demonstrate their "manhood" to all, just like the owenrs of superloud cars with "through" exhausts, or overage teeny-boppers with "throbbing" bass speakers and huge amps powering their car stereos. There's very little more annoying out on the Bay than trying to enjoy a relazing afternoon while penis boats go flying by at 60-80mph (and usually on their way to nowhere) with roaring, unmuffled exhausts and some overly sunburned type A asshole at the helm, hoping everyone notices. The usual comments are..."hmmm...any logs in the water out there he might hit?" -- "There's an old saying in Tennessee - I know it's in Texas, probably in Tennessee - that says, fool me once, shame on - shame on you. Fool me - you can't get fooled again." -George W. Bush, Nashville, Tenn., Sept. 17, 2002 |
Loud boats
"Dave Hall" wrote in message ... On 6 Aug 2004 04:44:47 -0700, (basskisser) wrote: "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "JGK" wrote in message ... Its the people not the bots that are a problem. But GENERALLY speaking, certain kinds of people seem to get their hands on certain kinds of toys, and aren't smart or considerate enough to use them without driving others crazy. So, the two things (people and toys) can't really be separated. Around these parts, we call them "penis boats", because they are nothing more than a phallic symbol for those lacking in that department, UNLESS you actually race boats, different story all together. But, if you just generally go to where the crowds are, and make noise, etc., then yes, it's a substitute for a real penis. You know who you are... You really need to get a clue, since you obviously know nothing about what you're talking about. Dave This will require focusing on the numbers in the paragraph. Imagine a body of water. It's between 50 and 200 feet deep everywhere, 4 miles wide, and the water's flat as a pancake with no wind. Imagine that it has an East side and a West side. For whatever reason, the fishing's terrific on the East side along the shore. There are 20 boats anchored or drifting in a zone from the shore to a half mile out. Not a sound. A penis boat is flying back and forth within 1/4 mile of those boats, over and over again, when it could be doing its thing on the opposite side of the body of water. Forget the wake. Pretend it does not exist. Focus on the noise. This is NOT what you like to call a "straw man". It's real. Why does the owner of the penis boat not understand the situation? If 10 of us had driveways right next to our neighbors' bedroom windows, and we all wanted to operate table saws on Saturday afternoon, how many of us might ask our neighbors if anyone's taking a nap before turning on the saws? |
Loud boats
On Tue, 10 Aug 2004 08:24:51 -0400, Harry Krause
wrote: Dave Hall wrote: On 6 Aug 2004 04:44:47 -0700, (basskisser) wrote: "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "JGK" wrote in message ... Its the people not the bots that are a problem. But GENERALLY speaking, certain kinds of people seem to get their hands on certain kinds of toys, and aren't smart or considerate enough to use them without driving others crazy. So, the two things (people and toys) can't really be separated. Around these parts, we call them "penis boats", because they are nothing more than a phallic symbol for those lacking in that department, UNLESS you actually race boats, different story all together. But, if you just generally go to where the crowds are, and make noise, etc., then yes, it's a substitute for a real penis. You know who you are... You really need to get a clue, since you obviously know nothing about what you're talking about. Dave Oh, puh-lease, Dave. Buy a clue about something. Owners of superloud "pleasure boats" are desperately trying to demonstrate their "manhood" to all, just like the owenrs of superloud cars with "through" exhausts, or overage teeny-boppers with "throbbing" bass speakers and huge amps powering their car stereos. There's very little more annoying out on the Bay than trying to enjoy a relazing afternoon while penis boats go flying by at 60-80mph (and usually on their way to nowhere) with roaring, unmuffled exhausts and some overly sunburned type A asshole at the helm, hoping everyone notices. The usual comments are..."hmmm...any logs in the water out there he might hit?" Gee, you don't stereotype too much do you? Like I said before, you obviously know little bout the sport or you wouldn't make silly claims like that..... Dave |
Loud boats
On Tue, 10 Aug 2004 14:02:12 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote: "Dave Hall" wrote in message .. . On 6 Aug 2004 04:44:47 -0700, (basskisser) wrote: "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "JGK" wrote in message ... Its the people not the bots that are a problem. But GENERALLY speaking, certain kinds of people seem to get their hands on certain kinds of toys, and aren't smart or considerate enough to use them without driving others crazy. So, the two things (people and toys) can't really be separated. Around these parts, we call them "penis boats", because they are nothing more than a phallic symbol for those lacking in that department, UNLESS you actually race boats, different story all together. But, if you just generally go to where the crowds are, and make noise, etc., then yes, it's a substitute for a real penis. You know who you are... You really need to get a clue, since you obviously know nothing about what you're talking about. Dave This will require focusing on the numbers in the paragraph. Imagine a body of water. It's between 50 and 200 feet deep everywhere, 4 miles wide, and the water's flat as a pancake with no wind. Imagine that it has an East side and a West side. For whatever reason, the fishing's terrific on the East side along the shore. There are 20 boats anchored or drifting in a zone from the shore to a half mile out. Not a sound. A penis boat is flying back and forth within 1/4 mile of those boats, over and over again, when it could be doing its thing on the opposite side of the body of water. Forget the wake. Pretend it does not exist. Focus on the noise. This is NOT what you like to call a "straw man". It's a perfect example of a strawman. It does not reflect reality. It's real. Assuming that you're 100% factual, and have not injected any bias or prejudice into your "strawman", the fact that ONE guy acts like an idiot does not translate to the whole sport being subject to the same prejudice. Why does the owner of the penis boat not understand the situation? You are projecting the actions of jetski's onto those of performance boat operators. Guys who spend $30k a piece on a custom set of big block engines, $800 a piece on custom stainless props, and over $100K total in the rest of the boat do not do that so that they can run back and forth in the same little 1/4 mile stretch of water. I know I wouldn't (and don't). It makes no sense. Dave |
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On 10 Aug 2004 12:04:38 -0700, (basskisser) wrote:
Dave Hall wrote in message . .. On 6 Aug 2004 04:44:47 -0700, (basskisser) wrote: "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "JGK" wrote in message ... Its the people not the bots that are a problem. But GENERALLY speaking, certain kinds of people seem to get their hands on certain kinds of toys, and aren't smart or considerate enough to use them without driving others crazy. So, the two things (people and toys) can't really be separated. Around these parts, we call them "penis boats", because they are nothing more than a phallic symbol for those lacking in that department, UNLESS you actually race boats, different story all together. But, if you just generally go to where the crowds are, and make noise, etc., then yes, it's a substitute for a real penis. You know who you are... You really need to get a clue, since you obviously know nothing about what you're talking about. Dave Why would one who is not racing boats, need to make them as loud as possible, only to gain a mile or two an hour? Why does one have to race to enjoy going fast? I used to enjoy playing an occasional game of football when I was a kid, that doesn't mean I need to join a professional team. Why would these people have a need to run them near people, instead of open water? How do you get to the open water? As for my last sentence, apparently my message stung you a little, so yes, " you know who you are". Yes I do, but obviously you don't. Dave |
Loud boats
"Dave Hall" wrote in message
... This will require focusing on the numbers in the paragraph. Imagine a body of water. It's between 50 and 200 feet deep everywhere, 4 miles wide, and the water's flat as a pancake with no wind. Imagine that it has an East side and a West side. For whatever reason, the fishing's terrific on the East side along the shore. There are 20 boats anchored or drifting in a zone from the shore to a half mile out. Not a sound. A penis boat is flying back and forth within 1/4 mile of those boats, over and over again, when it could be doing its thing on the opposite side of the body of water. Forget the wake. Pretend it does not exist. Focus on the noise. This is NOT what you like to call a "straw man". It's a perfect example of a strawman. It does not reflect reality. Sorry, Dave, but this refers to Lake George. The same scenario repeats itself on Seneca Lake, Cayuga Lake, Canandaigua Lake, Conesus Lake, and plenty of others. Assuming that you're 100% factual, and have not injected any bias or prejudice into your "strawman", the fact that ONE guy acts like an idiot does not translate to the whole sport being subject to the same prejudice. The "one guy" must have a lot of cousins who think alike, because they're everywhere. Why does the owner of the penis boat not understand the situation? You are projecting the actions of jetski's onto those of performance boat operators. Nobody mentioned jetskis. |
Loud boats
Dave Hall wrote in message . ..
On 10 Aug 2004 12:04:38 -0700, (basskisser) wrote: Dave Hall wrote in message . .. On 6 Aug 2004 04:44:47 -0700, (basskisser) wrote: "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "JGK" wrote in message ... Its the people not the bots that are a problem. But GENERALLY speaking, certain kinds of people seem to get their hands on certain kinds of toys, and aren't smart or considerate enough to use them without driving others crazy. So, the two things (people and toys) can't really be separated. Around these parts, we call them "penis boats", because they are nothing more than a phallic symbol for those lacking in that department, UNLESS you actually race boats, different story all together. But, if you just generally go to where the crowds are, and make noise, etc., then yes, it's a substitute for a real penis. You know who you are... You really need to get a clue, since you obviously know nothing about what you're talking about. Dave Why would one who is not racing boats, need to make them as loud as possible, only to gain a mile or two an hour? Why does one have to race to enjoy going fast? I used to enjoy playing an occasional game of football when I was a kid, that doesn't mean I need to join a professional team. Where did I say that you shouldn't enjoy going fast? What I asked was, does one mile an hour give you that much joy, to have to have completely open exhaust? Jeez, if so, walk, three miles an hour should really excite you! Why would these people have a need to run them near people, instead of open water? How do you get to the open water? You don't have to go wide open to get there do you? As for my last sentence, apparently my message stung you a little, so yes, " you know who you are". Yes I do, but obviously you don't. Ah, but I do.... |
Loud boats
"Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "Dave Hall" wrote in message ... This will require focusing on the numbers in the paragraph. Imagine a body of water. It's between 50 and 200 feet deep everywhere, 4 miles wide, and the water's flat as a pancake with no wind. Imagine that it has an East side and a West side. For whatever reason, the fishing's terrific on the East side along the shore. There are 20 boats anchored or drifting in a zone from the shore to a half mile out. Not a sound. A penis boat is flying back and forth within 1/4 mile of those boats, over and over again, when it could be doing its thing on the opposite side of the body of water. Forget the wake. Pretend it does not exist. Focus on the noise. This is NOT what you like to call a "straw man". It's a perfect example of a strawman. It does not reflect reality. Sorry, Dave, but this refers to Lake George. The same scenario repeats itself on Seneca Lake, Cayuga Lake, Canandaigua Lake, Conesus Lake, and plenty of others. Assuming that you're 100% factual, and have not injected any bias or prejudice into your "strawman", the fact that ONE guy acts like an idiot does not translate to the whole sport being subject to the same prejudice. The "one guy" must have a lot of cousins who think alike, because they're everywhere. Why does the owner of the penis boat not understand the situation? You are projecting the actions of jetski's onto those of performance boat operators. Nobody mentioned jetskis. And nobody mentioned sailboats. They may be quiet, but their tendency to think that they own the water, and can make a 90 degree turn in front of a power boat, whether the powerboat is doing a loud 60 or a quiet 25. |
Loud boats
"Harry Krause" wrote in message ... Dave Hall wrote: On 6 Aug 2004 04:44:47 -0700, (basskisser) wrote: "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "JGK" wrote in message ... Its the people not the bots that are a problem. But GENERALLY speaking, certain kinds of people seem to get their hands on certain kinds of toys, and aren't smart or considerate enough to use them without driving others crazy. So, the two things (people and toys) can't really be separated. Around these parts, we call them "penis boats", because they are nothing more than a phallic symbol for those lacking in that department, UNLESS you actually race boats, different story all together. But, if you just generally go to where the crowds are, and make noise, etc., then yes, it's a substitute for a real penis. You know who you are... You really need to get a clue, since you obviously know nothing about what you're talking about. Dave Oh, puh-lease, Dave. Buy a clue about something. Owners of superloud "pleasure boats" are desperately trying to demonstrate their "manhood" to all, just like the owenrs of superloud cars with "through" exhausts, or overage teeny-boppers with "throbbing" bass speakers and huge amps powering their car stereos. There's very little more annoying out on the Bay than trying to enjoy a relazing afternoon while penis boats go flying by at 60-80mph (and usually on their way to nowhere) with roaring, unmuffled exhausts and some overly sunburned type A asshole at the helm, hoping everyone notices. The usual comments are..."hmmm...any logs in the water out there he might hit?" It must be snowing in Hell.....I totally agree with you and basskisser. |
Loud boats
"Calif Bill" wrote in message ink.net... "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "Dave Hall" wrote in message ... This will require focusing on the numbers in the paragraph. Imagine a body of water. It's between 50 and 200 feet deep everywhere, 4 miles wide, and the water's flat as a pancake with no wind. Imagine that it has an East side and a West side. For whatever reason, the fishing's terrific on the East side along the shore. There are 20 boats anchored or drifting in a zone from the shore to a half mile out. Not a sound. A penis boat is flying back and forth within 1/4 mile of those boats, over and over again, when it could be doing its thing on the opposite side of the body of water. Forget the wake. Pretend it does not exist. Focus on the noise. This is NOT what you like to call a "straw man". It's a perfect example of a strawman. It does not reflect reality. Sorry, Dave, but this refers to Lake George. The same scenario repeats itself on Seneca Lake, Cayuga Lake, Canandaigua Lake, Conesus Lake, and plenty of others. Assuming that you're 100% factual, and have not injected any bias or prejudice into your "strawman", the fact that ONE guy acts like an idiot does not translate to the whole sport being subject to the same prejudice. The "one guy" must have a lot of cousins who think alike, because they're everywhere. Why does the owner of the penis boat not understand the situation? You are projecting the actions of jetski's onto those of performance boat operators. Nobody mentioned jetskis. And nobody mentioned sailboats. They may be quiet, but their tendency to think that they own the water, and can make a 90 degree turn in front of a power boat, whether the powerboat is doing a loud 60 or a quiet 25. I'm not stepping into THAT subject! :-) |
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