My 88 year old mother, RN for about 65 years, says it is murder. If you
waited 45 seconds and 14" that baby would be in the doctors arms. Then is
it OK to poke it in the head and suck out it's brains? And this is a lady
who supports abortions.
Bill

"jps" wrote in message
...
"Dave Hall" wrote in message
...

If you dislike and distrust government so much, then why do you support
a political ideology which relies on greater governmental control and
involvement?

The Patrioit Act?
Partial Birth Abortion? (even my 79 yr. old reasonably conservative mother
says that's an invasion of women's bodies)
Government headcount growing at a faster pace than ever in history?
Bigger Gov't deficits than any other time in history?

Are you assuming I'm a Republican Dave?

On Tue, 11 Nov 2003 00:59:04 GMT, "Calif Bill"
wrote:

My 88 year old mother, RN for about 65 years, says it is murder.

This is a good example of a logical fallacy called "argumentum ad verecundiam,"
or "appeal to authority."

The argument about abortion is far more a "moral" issue than it is a medical
one. Therefore, the fact that your 88 year old mother is an RN has no probative
or persuasive value in the argument.

If you wanted to make an argument like that, you'd have done better to say, "My
88 year old mother, a federal prosecutor for about 65 years, says it is murder."

Did you pick up that burgundy paint for my Four Winns?

Joe Parsons

If you
waited 45 seconds and 14" that baby would be in the doctors arms. Then is
it OK to poke it in the head and suck out it's brains? And this is a lady
who supports abortions.
Bill

"jps" wrote in message
...
"Dave Hall" wrote in message
...

If you dislike and distrust government so much, then why do you support
a political ideology which relies on greater governmental control and
involvement?

The Patrioit Act?
Partial Birth Abortion? (even my 79 yr. old reasonably conservative mother
says that's an invasion of women's bodies)
Government headcount growing at a faster pace than ever in history?
Bigger Gov't deficits than any other time in history?

Are you assuming I'm a Republican Dave?

The argument about abortion is far more a "moral" issue than it is a
medical
one.

You're right, it is, but to stab a hole in the head and suck the brains out
of a baby's head during delivery is murder.

"Joe" wrote in message ...
The argument about abortion is far more a "moral" issue than it is a
medical
one.

You're right, it is, but to stab a hole in the head and suck the brains out
of a baby's head during delivery is murder.

So is starting a war and getting a bunch of innocent people killed murder?
Is having criminals killed, then joking about it murder?
Is death, because of failure to take care of our elderly murder?

"Joe Parsons" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 11 Nov 2003 00:59:04 GMT, "Calif Bill"

wrote:

My 88 year old mother, RN for about 65 years, says it is murder.

This is a good example of a logical fallacy called "argumentum ad
verecundiam,"
or "appeal to authority."

The argument about abortion is far more a "moral" issue than it is a
medical
one. Therefore, the fact that your 88 year old mother is an RN has no
probative
or persuasive value in the argument.

If you wanted to make an argument like that, you'd have done better to
say, "My
88 year old mother, a federal prosecutor for about 65 years, says it is
murder."

Did you pick up that burgundy paint for my Four Winns?

Joe Parsons

If you
waited 45 seconds and 14" that baby would be in the doctors arms. Then
is
it OK to poke it in the head and suck out it's brains? And this is a
lady
who supports abortions.
Bill

"jps" wrote in message
...
"Dave Hall" wrote in message
...

If you dislike and distrust government so much, then why do you
support
a political ideology which relies on greater governmental control and
involvement?

The Patrioit Act?
Partial Birth Abortion? (even my 79 yr. old reasonably conservative
mother
says that's an invasion of women's bodies)
Government headcount growing at a faster pace than ever in history?
Bigger Gov't deficits than any other time in history?

Are you assuming I'm a Republican Dave?





Picked up the Burgundy paint for my Jetcraft at San Leandro Color off Dutton
and E. 14th. $16 and they put it in a spray can for me. I listen to my
mom, don't you. I go along with her opinion. She has delivered babies. Fi
rst one in first year nurses training to an epileptic mother. She almost
gave up nursing then. Her opinion is it is a viable baby at that the time
that labor is going on and 8+ months into pregnancy. My Godson was 2# and
7.5 months at birth. 30 now and going to be a dad himself in May. If it is
the mom's life that is in danger, why not do a C section or the fact that
the baby continues it birth trip after being stabbed in the head, negates
fact that the mom dies if the baby is born. The Federal prosecutor would
now say it is murder.

On Tue, 11 Nov 2003 03:57:04 GMT, "Calif Bill"
wrote:

"Joe Parsons" wrote in message
.. .
On Tue, 11 Nov 2003 00:59:04 GMT, "Calif Bill"

wrote:

My 88 year old mother, RN for about 65 years, says it is murder.

This is a good example of a logical fallacy called "argumentum ad
verecundiam,"
or "appeal to authority."

The argument about abortion is far more a "moral" issue than it is a
medical
one. Therefore, the fact that your 88 year old mother is an RN has no
probative
or persuasive value in the argument.

If you wanted to make an argument like that, you'd have done better to
say, "My
88 year old mother, a federal prosecutor for about 65 years, says it is
murder."

Did you pick up that burgundy paint for my Four Winns?

Joe Parsons

If you
waited 45 seconds and 14" that baby would be in the doctors arms. Then
is
it OK to poke it in the head and suck out it's brains? And this is a
lady
who supports abortions.
Bill

"jps" wrote in message
...
"Dave Hall" wrote in message
...

If you dislike and distrust government so much, then why do you
support
a political ideology which relies on greater governmental control and
involvement?

The Patrioit Act?
Partial Birth Abortion? (even my 79 yr. old reasonably conservative
mother
says that's an invasion of women's bodies)
Government headcount growing at a faster pace than ever in history?
Bigger Gov't deficits than any other time in history?

Are you assuming I'm a Republican Dave?





Picked up the Burgundy paint for my Jetcraft at San Leandro Color off Dutton
and E. 14th. $16 and they put it in a spray can for me. I listen to my
mom, don't you.

When she was alive, I *always* listened to my mother--especially when she taught
me that I should make up my own mind.

I go along with her opinion.

So it would appear--and that's fine; but the *only* point I want to make about
what you said is that the fact that your mother is 88 years old and a nurse has
no probative or persuasive value with respect to this highly charged issue.

Joe Parsons

She has delivered babies. Fi
rst one in first year nurses training to an epileptic mother. She almost
gave up nursing then. Her opinion is it is a viable baby at that the time
that labor is going on and 8+ months into pregnancy. My Godson was 2# and
7.5 months at birth. 30 now and going to be a dad himself in May. If it is
the mom's life that is in danger, why not do a C section or the fact that
the baby continues it birth trip after being stabbed in the head, negates
fact that the mom dies if the baby is born. The Federal prosecutor would
now say it is murder.

I think a nurse has some persuasive value in this argument. And I support
legal abortion. Old enough to remember dead girls making the news from back
ally botched abortions. But when a baby is 33% out the mom, and is stabbed
in the head and debrained, that is not abortion. That is a killing! The
sad thing is the amount of abortions. Reaaly sad when it becomes a birth
control method. Enough birth control methods out there to stop the
pregnancy from ever happening.
Bill

"Joe Parsons" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 11 Nov 2003 03:57:04 GMT, "Calif Bill"

wrote:

"Joe Parsons" wrote in message
.. .
On Tue, 11 Nov 2003 00:59:04 GMT, "Calif Bill"

wrote:

My 88 year old mother, RN for about 65 years, says it is murder.

This is a good example of a logical fallacy called "argumentum ad
verecundiam,"
or "appeal to authority."

The argument about abortion is far more a "moral" issue than it is a
medical
one. Therefore, the fact that your 88 year old mother is an RN has no
probative
or persuasive value in the argument.

If you wanted to make an argument like that, you'd have done better to
say, "My
88 year old mother, a federal prosecutor for about 65 years, says it is
murder."

Did you pick up that burgundy paint for my Four Winns?

Joe Parsons

If you
waited 45 seconds and 14" that baby would be in the doctors arms.
Then
is
it OK to poke it in the head and suck out it's brains? And this is a
lady
who supports abortions.
Bill

"jps" wrote in message
...
"Dave Hall" wrote in message
...

If you dislike and distrust government so much, then why do you
support
a political ideology which relies on greater governmental control
and
involvement?

The Patrioit Act?
Partial Birth Abortion? (even my 79 yr. old reasonably conservative
mother
says that's an invasion of women's bodies)
Government headcount growing at a faster pace than ever in history?
Bigger Gov't deficits than any other time in history?

Are you assuming I'm a Republican Dave?





Picked up the Burgundy paint for my Jetcraft at San Leandro Color off
Dutton
and E. 14th. $16 and they put it in a spray can for me. I listen to my
mom, don't you.

When she was alive, I *always* listened to my mother--especially when she
taught
me that I should make up my own mind.

I go along with her opinion.

So it would appear--and that's fine; but the *only* point I want to make
about
what you said is that the fact that your mother is 88 years old and a
nurse has
no probative or persuasive value with respect to this highly charged
issue.

Joe Parsons

She has delivered babies. Fi
rst one in first year nurses training to an epileptic mother. She almost
gave up nursing then. Her opinion is it is a viable baby at that the
time
that labor is going on and 8+ months into pregnancy. My Godson was 2#
and
7.5 months at birth. 30 now and going to be a dad himself in May. If it
is
the mom's life that is in danger, why not do a C section or the fact that
the baby continues it birth trip after being stabbed in the head, negates
fact that the mom dies if the baby is born. The Federal prosecutor would
now say it is murder.

"Calif Bill" wrote in message
news
I think a nurse has some persuasive value in this argument. And I support
legal abortion. Old enough to remember dead girls making the news from
back
ally botched abortions. But when a baby is 33% out the mom, and is
stabbed
in the head and debrained, that is not abortion. That is a killing! The
sad thing is the amount of abortions. Reaaly sad when it becomes a birth
control method. Enough birth control methods out there to stop the
pregnancy from ever happening.
Bill


Don't worry Bill, this is where Mr. Parsons steps in and says he never
disagreed with you opinion, just the fact that you used your mothers nursing
experience to support your argument.

On Tue, 11 Nov 2003 05:24:39 GMT, "Joe" wrote:

"Calif Bill" wrote in message
news
I think a nurse has some persuasive value in this argument. And I support
legal abortion. Old enough to remember dead girls making the news from
back
ally botched abortions. But when a baby is 33% out the mom, and is
stabbed
in the head and debrained, that is not abortion. That is a killing! The
sad thing is the amount of abortions. Reaaly sad when it becomes a birth
control method. Enough birth control methods out there to stop the
pregnancy from ever happening.
Bill


Don't worry Bill, this is where Mr. Parsons steps in and says he never
disagreed with you opinion, just the fact that you used your mothers nursing
experience to support your argument.

What have I ever posted to this (or any) newsgroup that might give you the
impression that I am unable or unwilling to express my own opinion?

I'd be much obliged if you would refrain from attempting to speak for me.

Joe Parsons

Calif Bill wrote:
My 88 year old mother, RN for about 65 years, says it is murder. If you
waited 45 seconds and 14" that baby would be in the doctors arms. Then is
it OK to poke it in the head and suck out it's brains? And this is a lady
who supports abortions.
Bill

"jps" wrote in message
...
"Dave Hall" wrote in message
...

If you dislike and distrust government so much, then why do you support
a political ideology which relies on greater governmental control and
involvement?

The Patrioit Act?
Partial Birth Abortion? (even my 79 yr. old reasonably conservative mother
says that's an invasion of women's bodies)
Government headcount growing at a faster pace than ever in history?
Bigger Gov't deficits than any other time in history?

Are you assuming I'm a Republican Dave?


Your 88-year-old mother is entitled to her opinion, but it doesn't sound
as if she is in a position to push her beliefs onto others.

One of my problems with anti-choicers is that most of them don't give a
crap about the millions of "unwanted" children already in this country.
They are "pro-life" until there is a live birth, and then they don't
give a crap how that child lives.


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