On Sun, 27 May 2018 18:09:25 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 5/27/2018 5:48 PM, Its Me wrote:
On Sunday, May 27, 2018 at 3:25:59 PM UTC-4, Mr. Luddite wrote:
So, today Kim Jong Un says he's all for meeting with Trump and the
"complete denuclearization of the Korean Peninsula."

Strange dude.

It's the pendulum effect. Sandler sales technique. When someone is eager, you push them away. Then they go. "I want to play"!

Trump is a irritating asshole, but he's no dummy.



Ha. I know that technique well although I never formally learned it. I
won a few large contracts by "no bidding" them. Drives a customer nuts.
They want to know why. You explain what bothers you about the contract
specs or requirements and they usually end up modifying it.

I had one that we were in the final meeting discussing terms and
conditions. We were about to be awarded a large contract by a
customer who was aware that we were also building two systems for
their competitor. They started getting all hussy about non-disclosures
and told me they were going to legally "tie me up" with respect to
their equipment which was really based on *our* standard design.

When I started getting lectured about this and it reached a certain
point I announced (in front of about 12 of their representatives)
that I was getting some bad vibes about this and I felt that in our best
mutual interests we should not enter into a contract. Picked up my
briefcase, put my paperwork back in it and told them I could see my way out.

12 people sat there at the conference table with their chins on their
chests.



Maybe Trump took lessons from you.

On 5/27/2018 7:31 PM, wrote:
On Sun, 27 May 2018 18:09:25 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 5/27/2018 5:48 PM, Its Me wrote:
On Sunday, May 27, 2018 at 3:25:59 PM UTC-4, Mr. Luddite wrote:
So, today Kim Jong Un says he's all for meeting with Trump and the
"complete denuclearization of the Korean Peninsula."

Strange dude.

It's the pendulum effect. Sandler sales technique. When someone is eager, you push them away. Then they go. "I want to play"!

Trump is a irritating asshole, but he's no dummy.



Ha. I know that technique well although I never formally learned it. I
won a few large contracts by "no bidding" them. Drives a customer nuts.
They want to know why. You explain what bothers you about the contract
specs or requirements and they usually end up modifying it.

I had one that we were in the final meeting discussing terms and
conditions. We were about to be awarded a large contract by a
customer who was aware that we were also building two systems for
their competitor. They started getting all hussy about non-disclosures
and told me they were going to legally "tie me up" with respect to
their equipment which was really based on *our* standard design.

When I started getting lectured about this and it reached a certain
point I announced (in front of about 12 of their representatives)
that I was getting some bad vibes about this and I felt that in our best
mutual interests we should not enter into a contract. Picked up my
briefcase, put my paperwork back in it and told them I could see my way out.

12 people sat there at the conference table with their chins on their
chests.




Maybe Trump took lessons from you.


Very doubtful.

But, every time I engage in a debate about Trump with Mrs.E. (who is a
Trumpster through and through), she reminds me that his negotiating
style is similar to what I used to do sometimes.

I earned a reputation as being fair and honest (that's what people tell
me anyway) but I always had the philosophy that you should never, ever
let anyone ... be it a customer, a potential customer, a vendor or even
an employee hold a gun to your head. Better to walk away than to cave,
even if it is to your disadvantage (which is usually short-term).

Mr. Luddite
- show quoted text -
Very doubtful.

But, every time I engage in a debate about Trump with Mrs.E. (who is a
Trumpster through and through), she reminds me that his negotiating
style is similar to what I used to do sometimes.

I earned a reputation as being fair and honest (that's what people tell
me anyway) but I always had the philosophy that you should never, ever
let anyone ... be it a customer, a potential customer, a vendor or even
an employee hold a gun to your head. Better to walk away than to cave,
even if it is to your disadvantage (which is usually short-term).
..........


My uncle had a large sawing operation, in which made him a millionaire. Two things he told me was to “treat everyone as a king but never kiss an ass�

The other was “some of the best business you can do with someone is no business at all....�

Pretty wise man.

On 5/27/2018 9:33 PM, Tim wrote:
Mr. Luddite
- show quoted text -
Very doubtful.

But, every time I engage in a debate about Trump with Mrs.E. (who is a
Trumpster through and through), she reminds me that his negotiating
style is similar to what I used to do sometimes.

I earned a reputation as being fair and honest (that's what people tell
me anyway) but I always had the philosophy that you should never, ever
let anyone ... be it a customer, a potential customer, a vendor or even
an employee hold a gun to your head. Better to walk away than to cave,
even if it is to your disadvantage (which is usually short-term).
.........


My uncle had a large sawing operation, in which made him a millionaire. Two things he told me was to “treat everyone as a king but never kiss an ass�

The other was “some of the best business you can do with someone is no business at all....�

Pretty wise man.


I'd say so.

It's probably an idealistic concept but if you strive for a business
relationship or contract in which both sides are "winners", it usually
works out pretty well. I saw a major shift in the business
philosophies over the years I was in business as more MBA types
became involved in contract negotiations. We won the contracts
due to decisions made by engineering and technical types but
when it came to nailing down terms and conditions the MBA's took
over and they were tough to deal with if you subscribed to the
old fashioned idea of being good for both parties. They wanted to
screw you and your company to the wall which really didn't benefit
the customer in the long run. It got to the point on a few
occasions when I simply said, "Can't accept your terms, sorry".
When that happened the technical group would come to the rescue
and get the MBA types to ease up.

One of the big issues was payment terms. We received progress payments
based on the achievement of critical milestones in the project that
typically ran for 8 months to a year or more. The old standard (common
everywhere) was that invoices were due net 30 days. I financed
most of these projects using the customer's payments, so it was
important to achieve the milestone and equally important to get
paid on time. The MBA types started demanding net 60, net 90
and even net 120 day payment terms. Couldn't accept that.