On Sat, 1 Nov 2003 14:20:52 -0800, "jps" wrote:

"JohnH" wrote in message
.. .

Yes, I was there. Yes, I was wounded. Yes, I was awarded a Purple Heart.
No, not
baseless rhetoric.

So, what you're saying is that your Purple Heart was based on stupidity or
coincidence so everyone else's must've been too.

A Purple Heart is based on only one thing: being wounded in action while serving
as a member of the U.S. Armed Services.

So all one can reliably conclude is that the recipient of a Purple Heart served
on active duty, saw some sort of action and was wounded.

I don't think it takes a genius to agree that a serviceperson (awkward inclusive
language!) can get wounded as severely while doing something smart and brave as
they can doing something stupid and not-so-brave. Either situation meets the
criteria for the Purple Heart.

Joe Parsons



Do you pick candidates without knowing what they propose to do? Is it
based on
who has the "best" anti-Bush rhetoric?

Bush was chosen based on his anti Clinton rhetoric. Why shouldn't the dems
do the same thing?

"Joe Parsons" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 1 Nov 2003 14:20:52 -0800, "jps" wrote:

"JohnH" wrote in message
.. .

Yes, I was there. Yes, I was wounded. Yes, I was awarded a Purple
Heart.
No, not
baseless rhetoric.

So, what you're saying is that your Purple Heart was based on stupidity
or
coincidence so everyone else's must've been too.

A Purple Heart is based on only one thing: being wounded in action while
serving
as a member of the U.S. Armed Services.

So all one can reliably conclude is that the recipient of a Purple Heart
served
on active duty, saw some sort of action and was wounded.

I don't think it takes a genius to agree that a serviceperson (awkward
inclusive
language!) can get wounded as severely while doing something smart and
brave as
they can doing something stupid and not-so-brave. Either situation meets
the
criteria for the Purple Heart.

Kerry requested the transfer just days after a March 13, 1969 incident for
which he was awarded a Bronze Star. Kerry, while under fire, rescued a Green
Beret who had fallen overboard. Kerry had been wounded just moments earlier
when a mine detonated near his "swift boat," the small vessels that made
forays into the Mekong River delta.

"The man was receiving sniper fire from both banks," according to Kerry's
Bronze Star citation. "Lt. Kerry directed his gunners to provide suppressing
fire, while from an exposed position on the bow, his arm bleeding and in
pain, with disregard for his personal safety, he pulled the man aboard."



Doesn't sound accidental that Kerry was awarded three Purple Hearts and a
Bronze Star.

"jps" wrote in message
...

"Joe Parsons" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 1 Nov 2003 14:20:52 -0800, "jps" wrote:

"JohnH" wrote in message
.. .

Yes, I was there. Yes, I was wounded. Yes, I was awarded a Purple
Heart.
No, not
baseless rhetoric.

So, what you're saying is that your Purple Heart was based on stupidity
or
coincidence so everyone else's must've been too.

A Purple Heart is based on only one thing: being wounded in action while
serving
as a member of the U.S. Armed Services.

So all one can reliably conclude is that the recipient of a Purple Heart
served
on active duty, saw some sort of action and was wounded.

I don't think it takes a genius to agree that a serviceperson (awkward
inclusive
language!) can get wounded as severely while doing something smart and
brave as
they can doing something stupid and not-so-brave. Either situation
meets
the
criteria for the Purple Heart.

Kerry requested the transfer just days after a March 13, 1969 incident for
which he was awarded a Bronze Star. Kerry, while under fire, rescued a
Green
Beret who had fallen overboard. Kerry had been wounded just moments
earlier
when a mine detonated near his "swift boat," the small vessels that made
forays into the Mekong River delta.

"The man was receiving sniper fire from both banks," according to Kerry's
Bronze Star citation. "Lt. Kerry directed his gunners to provide
suppressing
fire, while from an exposed position on the bow, his arm bleeding and in
pain, with disregard for his personal safety, he pulled the man aboard."



Doesn't sound accidental that Kerry was awarded three Purple Hearts and a
Bronze Star.



Purple hearts and Medals do not make a person presidential material. Audi
Murphy was the most decorated soldier in WWII. Did not have a high school
education. My uncle spent 4.5 years in the South Pacific as a shooter in WW
II. 5 purple hearts that he even picked up. Bronze star with Oak leaf
clusters. Great guy, but would not have made a good political leader.
There were smart guys and not so smart guys getting shot in all the wars.
Friend was a medic and then a pilot in Viet Nam. Shot down a couple of
times, captured and escaped one time. Ph.D. degree now. John McCain was a
pilot also, did not escape and does not have a Ph.D.. Does not that make
him ineligible for office under your criteria?

"Calif Bill" wrote in message
nk.net...

Purple hearts and Medals do not make a person presidential material. Audi
Murphy was the most decorated soldier in WWII. Did not have a high school
education. My uncle spent 4.5 years in the South Pacific as a shooter in
WW
II. 5 purple hearts that he even picked up. Bronze star with Oak leaf
clusters. Great guy, but would not have made a good political leader.
There were smart guys and not so smart guys getting shot in all the wars.
Friend was a medic and then a pilot in Viet Nam. Shot down a couple of
times, captured and escaped one time. Ph.D. degree now. John McCain was
a
pilot also, did not escape and does not have a Ph.D.. Does not that make
him ineligible for office under your criteria?

I didn't establish any criteria...

The reason the info on Kerry was posted was in response to the part time
math teacher's assertion that none of the dems in the race had any balls.

I'd say it takes balls, while wounded and bleeding, to jump out on the bow
of a vessel in the middle of a firefight to pull someone aboard who would've
been doomed.

So, assuming the "balls" question is answered, don't you think this shows
leadership skills and a willingness to be responsible?

That's a hell of a lot more than we're getting now.

jps wrote:

"Calif Bill" wrote in message
nk.net...

Purple hearts and Medals do not make a person presidential material. Audi
Murphy was the most decorated soldier in WWII. Did not have a high school
education. My uncle spent 4.5 years in the South Pacific as a shooter in
WW
II. 5 purple hearts that he even picked up. Bronze star with Oak leaf
clusters. Great guy, but would not have made a good political leader.
There were smart guys and not so smart guys getting shot in all the wars.
Friend was a medic and then a pilot in Viet Nam. Shot down a couple of
times, captured and escaped one time. Ph.D. degree now. John McCain was
a
pilot also, did not escape and does not have a Ph.D.. Does not that make
him ineligible for office under your criteria?

I didn't establish any criteria...

The reason the info on Kerry was posted was in response to the part time
math teacher's assertion that none of the dems in the race had any balls.

Was the part-time math teacher positing that Bush had balls? His father
did, but Dubya? He's just a frat boy.

Calif Bill wrote:
"jps" wrote in message
...

"Joe Parsons" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 1 Nov 2003 14:20:52 -0800, "jps" wrote:

"JohnH" wrote in message
.. .

Yes, I was there. Yes, I was wounded. Yes, I was awarded a Purple
Heart.
No, not
baseless rhetoric.

So, what you're saying is that your Purple Heart was based on stupidity
or
coincidence so everyone else's must've been too.

A Purple Heart is based on only one thing: being wounded in action while
serving
as a member of the U.S. Armed Services.

So all one can reliably conclude is that the recipient of a Purple Heart
served
on active duty, saw some sort of action and was wounded.

I don't think it takes a genius to agree that a serviceperson (awkward
inclusive
language!) can get wounded as severely while doing something smart and
brave as
they can doing something stupid and not-so-brave. Either situation
meets
the
criteria for the Purple Heart.

Kerry requested the transfer just days after a March 13, 1969 incident for
which he was awarded a Bronze Star. Kerry, while under fire, rescued a
Green
Beret who had fallen overboard. Kerry had been wounded just moments
earlier
when a mine detonated near his "swift boat," the small vessels that made
forays into the Mekong River delta.

"The man was receiving sniper fire from both banks," according to Kerry's
Bronze Star citation. "Lt. Kerry directed his gunners to provide
suppressing
fire, while from an exposed position on the bow, his arm bleeding and in
pain, with disregard for his personal safety, he pulled the man aboard."



Doesn't sound accidental that Kerry was awarded three Purple Hearts and a
Bronze Star.



Purple hearts and Medals do not make a person presidential material.

But in your mind, skipping out on the last year of duty in the Texas Air
National Guard qualifies you if you are Dubya the Chimp?

I don't believe "military service" qualifies or disqualifies anyone for
political office. Some who serve in the military are able to develop or
improve existing skills that might be important later in life. Many
others do not.

Look at who we have in the White House now. A dull, inarticulate moron,
a boozing, coke-snorting frat boy whose life was fed to him on a silver
spoon. Obviously, to Boobus Americanus, there are no significant
qualifications one must have to hold higher office.

On Sat, 1 Nov 2003 16:22:19 -0800, "jps" wrote:

"Joe Parsons" wrote in message
.. .
On Sat, 1 Nov 2003 14:20:52 -0800, "jps" wrote:

"JohnH" wrote in message
.. .

Yes, I was there. Yes, I was wounded. Yes, I was awarded a Purple
Heart.
No, not
baseless rhetoric.

So, what you're saying is that your Purple Heart was based on stupidity
or
coincidence so everyone else's must've been too.

A Purple Heart is based on only one thing: being wounded in action while
serving
as a member of the U.S. Armed Services.

So all one can reliably conclude is that the recipient of a Purple Heart
served
on active duty, saw some sort of action and was wounded.

I don't think it takes a genius to agree that a serviceperson (awkward
inclusive
language!) can get wounded as severely while doing something smart and
brave as
they can doing something stupid and not-so-brave. Either situation meets
the
criteria for the Purple Heart.

Kerry requested the transfer just days after a March 13, 1969 incident for
which he was awarded a Bronze Star. Kerry, while under fire, rescued a Green
Beret who had fallen overboard. Kerry had been wounded just moments earlier
when a mine detonated near his "swift boat," the small vessels that made
forays into the Mekong River delta.

"The man was receiving sniper fire from both banks," according to Kerry's
Bronze Star citation. "Lt. Kerry directed his gunners to provide suppressing
fire, while from an exposed position on the bow, his arm bleeding and in
pain, with disregard for his personal safety, he pulled the man aboard."



Doesn't sound accidental that Kerry was awarded three Purple Hearts and a
Bronze Star.

Nothing in my comments about the Order of the Purple Heart should be construed
as being anything other than respectful. During armed conflict, many people do
things we might call "stupid," and which resulted in their being wounded. They
are no less deserving of respect.

There is a huge difference between a medal like the Bronze Star, which is
awarded based on "heroic or meritorious achievement or service" and a Purple
Heart, which is awarded solely upon the recipient's having been wounded.

The criteria by which a Purple Heart is awarded are quite specific.

Joe Parsons

A Purple Heart is based on only one thing: being wounded in action while
serving
as a member of the U.S. Armed Services.

The wound must come from an instrument of war in the hands of the enemy.
Simply being wounded in action is not enough to be awarded the Purple Heart.

The wound must come from an instrument of war in the hands of the enemy.
Simply being wounded in action is not enough to be awarded the Purple Heart.


Not according to the official rules.

You can get a Purple Heart for death or wound by friendly fire, if there is a
good indication that the friendly fire was intended for the enemy.

You can get a Purple Heart for injuries suffered in a parachute landing,
provided that the parachuting was required as a result of hostile
fire.

Also, for traffic accidents that result from hostile fire. You are walking down
the sidewalk in Baghdad. A terrorist sniper takes out the driver of a personel
carrier and that carrier then proceeds to run up onto the sidewalk and breaks
your legs. According to the rules you might be elegible for the award after
being hit by a US truck, since the traffic accident was caused by hostile fire.

*******

(6) It is not intended that such a strict interpretation of the requirement for
the wound or injury to be caused by direct result of hostile action be taken
that it would preclude the award being made to deserving personnel. Commanders
must also take into consideration, the circumstances surrounding an injury,
even if it appears to meet the criteria. Note the following examples:

(a) In case such as an individual injured while making a parachute landing from
an aircraft that had been brought down enemy fire; or, an individual injured as
a result of a vehicle accident caused by enemy fire, the decision will be made
in favor of the individual and the award will be made.

(b) Individuals wounded or killed as a result of "friendly fire" in the "heat
of battle" will be awarded the Purple Heart as long as the "friendly"
projectile or agent was released with the full intent of inflicting damage or
destroying enemy troops or equipment.

(c) Individuals injured as a result of their own negligence; for example,
driving or walking through an unauthorized area known to have been mined or
placed off limits or searching for or picking up unexploded munitions as war
souvenirs, will not be awarded the Purple Heart as they clearly were not
injured as a result of enemy action, but rather by their own negligence.

http://www.purpleheart.org/Awd_of_PH.htm

On Sun, 02 Nov 2003 04:21:47 GMT, "Joe" wrote:

A Purple Heart is based on only one thing: being wounded in action while
serving
as a member of the U.S. Armed Services.

The wound must come from an instrument of war in the hands of the enemy.
Simply being wounded in action is not enough to be awarded the Purple Heart.

Here are the specific criteria:

(4) Examples of enemy-related injuries which clearly justify award of the Purple
Heart are as follows:

(a) Injury caused by enemy bullet, shrapnel, or other projectile created by
enemy action.
(b) Injury caused by enemy placed mine or trap.
(c) Injury caused by enemy released chemical, biological, or nuclear agent.
(d) Injury caused by vehicle or aircraft accident resulting from enemy
fire.
(e) Concussion injuries caused as a result of enemy generated explosions.

(5) Examples of injuries or wounds which clearly do not qualify for award of the
Purple Heart are as follows:

(a) Frostbite or trench foot injuries.
(b) Heat stroke.
(c) Food poisoning not caused by enemy agents.
(d) Chemical, biological, or nuclear agents not released by the enemy.
(e) Battle fatigue.
(f) Disease not directly caused by enemy agents.
(g) Accidents, to include explosive, aircraft, vehicular, and other
accidental wounding not related to or caused by enemy action.
(h) Self-inflicted wounds, except when in the heat of battle, and not
involving gross negligence.
(i) Post traumatic stressdisorders.
(j) Jump injuries not caused by enemy action.

"Friendly fire" (the ultimate oxymoron) is explicitly included in the criteria.

A pilot whose plane is shot down by enemy fire and who is injured during the
parachute landing will receive the award.

Joe Parsons