Tick Tock
 

On Saturday, 24 February 2018 17:19:51 UTC-4, wrote:
On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 14:50:08 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

On 2/24/18 2:39 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 2/24/2018 2:25 PM, justan wrote:
Wrote in message:
On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 09:36:12 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

I'll betcha it's not so much a case of being anti-gun as it is legal
beagles recognizing that litigation could extend not only to the
shooter, the store that sold him the firearm (already happens) and to
the financing agency that made the purchase possible.Â* I'll bet more
credit card issuers will start prohibiting the use of their cards for
firearm purchases in the future.

There is legislation in place that shields sellers and manufacturers..
The left really wants to change that but not with much success so far.

Tick Tock
 

Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 2/24/2018 1:52 PM, Keyser Soze wrote:
On 2/24/18 1:34 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 2/24/2018 1:02 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 09:36:12 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

I'll betcha it's not so much a case of being anti-gun as it is legal
beagles recognizing that litigation could extend not only to the
shooter, the store that sold him the firearm (already happens) and to
the financing agency that made the purchase possible.Â* I'll bet more
credit card issuers will start prohibiting the use of their cards for
firearm purchases in the future.

There is legislation in place that shields sellers and manufacturers.
The left really wants to change that but not with much success so far.
This credit card thing is just kubuki theater. Like you say, once the
water calms down I bet it goes away, particularly if a number of big
chains decide to tell them to **** off.
Like someone said before, where does this stop? Are they going to stop
processing charges for dangerous food next? Far more people die from
obesity related disease than from guns, by a couple orders of
magnitude



I'll bet in 2 weeks we won't be discussing AR-15s here either. The
subject will die as usual in the media as well once all the funerals
are over.

Unless there's another mass shooting.

Unless?Â* Unless?

Yeah. I guess I should have said, "Until".


Each week in Chicago and Bulletmore. Just people of color do not seem to
count.

Tick Tock
 

On 2/24/2018 4:22 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 14:58:59 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 2/24/2018 2:50 PM, Keyser Soze wrote:
On 2/24/18 2:39 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 2/24/2018 2:25 PM, justan wrote:
Wrote in message:
On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 09:36:12 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

I'll betcha it's not so much a case of being anti-gun as it is legal
beagles recognizing that litigation could extend not only to the
shooter, the store that sold him the firearm (already happens) and to
the financing agency that made the purchase possible.Â* I'll bet more
credit card issuers will start prohibiting the use of their cards for
firearm purchases in the future.

There is legislation in place that shields sellers and manufacturers.
The left really wants to change that but not with much success so far.
This credit card thing is just kubuki theater. Like you say, once the
water calms down I bet it goes away, particularly if a number of big
chains decide to tell them to **** off.
Like someone said before, where does this stop? Are they going to stop
processing charges for dangerous food next? Far more people die from
obesity related disease than from guns, by a couple orders of
magnitude


Why don't we just ban everything the ATF people regulate and be
Â* done with it. Of the three, I don't know which is
Â* deadliest.



Greg seems to think that all of our society problems are mutually
inclusive, meaning you can only fix 'em if you fix *all* of them at
once.Â* It's ok to take one or two at a time.



My take on Greg is that he has no interest in anything other than the
anti-rule, anti-regulation, anti-societal libertarian nonsense. That
means no regulatory efforts to fix anything. Don't like dirty air? Wear
a gas mask. Dirty water? Filter it. Too many high-powered guns in the
wrong hands? Wear body armor.


I like Greg and have respect for his accomplishments, knowledge and
technical expertise. But I don't think I've ever come across anyone
who can come up with as many reasons why you *can't* do something as he
can. It makes me chuckle sometimes.

It's a little surprising because usually those with a technical or
engineering bent are just the opposite. Tell an engineer he can't do
something and he'll spend a lifetime trying to prove you wrong.


I lived my life on the other end of that product cycle and I see what
engineers can't do.
If they weren't wrong so often I would not have had a job.
I didn't lose my job because they got any better. It was just because
we simply throw away their mistakes and buy a new one instead of
trying to fix it.


Well that certainly explains it in a nutshell. Fire the engineering
department. Don't need it.

Tick Tock
 

On 2/24/2018 4:18 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 14:39:58 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 2/24/2018 2:25 PM, justan wrote:
Wrote in message:
On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 09:36:12 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

I'll betcha it's not so much a case of being anti-gun as it is legal
beagles recognizing that litigation could extend not only to the
shooter, the store that sold him the firearm (already happens) and to
the financing agency that made the purchase possible. I'll bet more
credit card issuers will start prohibiting the use of their cards for
firearm purchases in the future.

There is legislation in place that shields sellers and manufacturers.
The left really wants to change that but not with much success so far.
This credit card thing is just kubuki theater. Like you say, once the
water calms down I bet it goes away, particularly if a number of big
chains decide to tell them to **** off.
Like someone said before, where does this stop? Are they going to stop
processing charges for dangerous food next? Far more people die from
obesity related disease than from guns, by a couple orders of
magnitude


Why don't we just ban everything the ATF people regulate and be
done with it. Of the three, I don't know which is
deadliest.



Greg seems to think that all of our society problems are mutually
inclusive, meaning you can only fix 'em if you fix *all* of them at
once. It's ok to take one or two at a time.


Certainly true but why start with the one that causes a few hundred
deaths and ignore the ones that cause tens of thousands or even
millions?
Oh I forgot, they aren't news and the fix would be inconvenient for a
lot of people.



I give you this. You're amazing. :-)

(not trying to bust your chops but I am very, very thankful that not all
share your logic.)

Tick Tock
 

On 2/24/2018 4:27 PM, Bill wrote:
Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 2/24/2018 1:52 PM, Keyser Soze wrote:
On 2/24/18 1:34 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 2/24/2018 1:02 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 09:36:12 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

I'll betcha it's not so much a case of being anti-gun as it is legal
beagles recognizing that litigation could extend not only to the
shooter, the store that sold him the firearm (already happens) and to
the financing agency that made the purchase possible.Â* I'll bet more
credit card issuers will start prohibiting the use of their cards for
firearm purchases in the future.

There is legislation in place that shields sellers and manufacturers.
The left really wants to change that but not with much success so far.
This credit card thing is just kubuki theater. Like you say, once the
water calms down I bet it goes away, particularly if a number of big
chains decide to tell them to **** off.
Like someone said before, where does this stop? Are they going to stop
processing charges for dangerous food next? Far more people die from
obesity related disease than from guns, by a couple orders of
magnitude



I'll bet in 2 weeks we won't be discussing AR-15s here either. The
subject will die as usual in the media as well once all the funerals
are over.

Unless there's another mass shooting.

Unless?Â* Unless?

Yeah. I guess I should have said, "Until".


Each week in Chicago and Bulletmore. Just people of color do not seem to
count.



I really don't have much compassion for gang members shooting each other
unless innocents are hurt or killed.

I have a *lot* of compassion and concern for nut cases entering
schools and killing 15 to 20 innocent kids ranging from 6 to 17 years old.

A parent's most important responsibility is the safety and well-being of
the kids they bring into this world. I can't begin to imagine the
anguish the parents of the recently deceased kids must feel.

Tick Tock
 

On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 12:56:59 -0500, wrote:

On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 09:01:12 -0500, John H.
wrote:

On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 01:36:45 -0500, wrote:

On Fri, 23 Feb 2018 17:03:00 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

One of my points is that the sales data sent doesn't have to identify the merchandise, and even if it does it can be obscured. When Rural King starts losing sales because credit card X won't approve transactions, you can bet they'll fix that in a flash. You'll be buying $479 worth of Purina. :)



This action is being considered by the banks that issue the credit
cards. There's no reason for them to "fix" it if they decide not to
honor firearms sales.

The merchants and customers are going to be the ones who fix it.
Credit card companies court them, not the other way around. If Rural
King says I will only honor cards that accept gun sales, they won't
have any problem finding bankers who will go along. I am sure there
are banks who would love to get NRAs business.
I am just not sure how this would really work. If Chase says they will
not honor a gun purchase but BoA will, how does the merchant know?

The computer won't let the charge go through from that vendor.

What will Visa/ MC say about it? Who gets stuck when the charge is
denied and the customer has already left the store?

The charge is denied when the card is run through the machine.

Like others have said, the merchant will just stop sending merchandise
details with the charge, assuming they do now.

It's not the details of the charge, it's the vendor itself.

I know when we had the store, everything was just "merchandise". Visa
and MC only got what we entered into the machine and that was what
came from the card swipe or manual entry and the amount. That is also
all I ever see on my CC receipt, along with the system generated
transaction number.
If I am making a claim against the credit card company, I need to
attach the actual sales receipt with that transaction number on it.

You need to go read the article posted by Luddite.

So you are saying Visa will stop taking charges from Walmart, not
bloody likely.
If they do, expect Visa/MC to get some new competition.

Makes no difference, WalMart stopped selling 'assault' rifles a while back.

https://www.nytimes.com/2015/08/27/b...us-stores.html

Tick Tock
 

On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 14:58:59 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" wrote:

On 2/24/2018 2:50 PM, Keyser Soze wrote:
On 2/24/18 2:39 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 2/24/2018 2:25 PM, justan wrote:
Wrote in message:
On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 09:36:12 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

I'll betcha it's not so much a case of being anti-gun as it is legal
beagles recognizing that litigation could extend not only to the
shooter, the store that sold him the firearm (already happens) and to
the financing agency that made the purchase possible.* I'll bet more
credit card issuers will start prohibiting the use of their cards for
firearm purchases in the future.

There is legislation in place that shields sellers and manufacturers.
The left really wants to change that but not with much success so far.
This credit card thing is just kubuki theater. Like you say, once the
water calms down I bet it goes away, particularly if a number of big
chains decide to tell them to **** off.
Like someone said before, where does this stop? Are they going to stop
processing charges for dangerous food next? Far more people die from
obesity related disease than from guns, by a couple orders of
magnitude


Why don't we just ban everything the ATF people regulate and be
* done with it. Of the three, I don't know which is
* deadliest.



Greg seems to think that all of our society problems are mutually
inclusive, meaning you can only fix 'em if you fix *all* of them at
once.* It's ok to take one or two at a time.



My take on Greg is that he has no interest in anything other than the
anti-rule, anti-regulation, anti-societal libertarian nonsense. That
means no regulatory efforts to fix anything. Don't like dirty air? Wear
a gas mask. Dirty water? Filter it. Too many high-powered guns in the
wrong hands? Wear body armor.


I like Greg and have respect for his accomplishments, knowledge and
technical expertise. But I don't think I've ever come across anyone
who can come up with as many reasons why you *can't* do something as he
can. It makes me chuckle sometimes.

It's a little surprising because usually those with a technical or
engineering bent are just the opposite. Tell an engineer he can't do
something and he'll spend a lifetime trying to prove you wrong.

I don't believe Greg is arguing 'you can't do it'. I believe he's arguing 'you can do it, but it
will make little or no difference'.

For the most part, I agree. I don't think banning the sale of 'assault' rifles will stop school
shootings. I doubt it will slow them down. I don't think raising the minimum age for purchase will
stop school shootings, at least for the next two or three generations. There are too many 'assault'
rifles on the streets (eight million by some estimates).

And, I agree that further infringement of the 'right to bear arms' will lead to even more attempts
for more infringement. (The slippery slope concept.) To say the final goal of many liberals is *not*
a banning of firearms is to be naive.

Tick Tock
 

On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 13:26:16 -0800 (PST), True North
wrote:

On Saturday, 24 February 2018 17:19:51 UTC-4, wrote:
On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 14:50:08 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

On 2/24/18 2:39 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 2/24/2018 2:25 PM, justan wrote:
Wrote in message:
On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 09:36:12 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

I'll betcha it's not so much a case of being anti-gun as it is legal
beagles recognizing that litigation could extend not only to the
shooter, the store that sold him the firearm (already happens) and to
the financing agency that made the purchase possible.Â* I'll bet more
credit card issuers will start prohibiting the use of their cards for
firearm purchases in the future.

There is legislation in place that shields sellers and manufacturers.
The left really wants to change that but not with much success so far.
This credit card thing is just kubuki theater. Like you say, once the
water calms down I bet it goes away, particularly if a number of big
chains decide to tell them to **** off.
Like someone said before, where does this stop? Are they going to stop
processing charges for dangerous food next? Far more people die from
obesity related disease than from guns, by a couple orders of
magnitude


Why don't we just ban everything the ATF people regulate and be
Â* done with it. Of the three, I don't know which is
Â* deadliest.



Greg seems to think that all of our society problems are mutually
inclusive, meaning you can only fix 'em if you fix *all* of them at
once.Â* It's ok to take one or two at a time.



My take on Greg is that he has no interest in anything other than the
anti-rule, anti-regulation, anti-societal libertarian nonsense. That
means no regulatory efforts to fix anything. Don't like dirty air? Wear
a gas mask. Dirty water? Filter it. Too many high-powered guns in the
wrong hands? Wear body armor.

I am sure I am doing more about water quality than anyone else here

We should compare quarterly water bills. I end up paying four times the basic water volume rate because of all the added on taxes/charges/fees etc for wastewater processing environmental charges etc.

I don't have a water bill. I get mine from a hole in the yard. That is
one reason why I am interested in water quality. The other is because
I want to protect where I boat.

Tick Tock
 

On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 13:26:16 -0800 (PST), True North wrote:

On Saturday, 24 February 2018 17:19:51 UTC-4, wrote:
On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 14:50:08 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

On 2/24/18 2:39 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 2/24/2018 2:25 PM, justan wrote:
Wrote in message:
On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 09:36:12 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

I'll betcha it's not so much a case of being anti-gun as it is legal
beagles recognizing that litigation could extend not only to the
shooter, the store that sold him the firearm (already happens) and to
the financing agency that made the purchase possible.* I'll bet more
credit card issuers will start prohibiting the use of their cards for
firearm purchases in the future.

There is legislation in place that shields sellers and manufacturers.
The left really wants to change that but not with much success so far.
This credit card thing is just kubuki theater. Like you say, once the
water calms down I bet it goes away, particularly if a number of big
chains decide to tell them to **** off.
Like someone said before, where does this stop? Are they going to stop
processing charges for dangerous food next? Far more people die from
obesity related disease than from guns, by a couple orders of
magnitude


Why don't we just ban everything the ATF people regulate and be
* done with it. Of the three, I don't know which is
* deadliest.



Greg seems to think that all of our society problems are mutually
inclusive, meaning you can only fix 'em if you fix *all* of them at
once.* It's ok to take one or two at a time.



My take on Greg is that he has no interest in anything other than the
anti-rule, anti-regulation, anti-societal libertarian nonsense. That
means no regulatory efforts to fix anything. Don't like dirty air? Wear
a gas mask. Dirty water? Filter it. Too many high-powered guns in the
wrong hands? Wear body armor.

I am sure I am doing more about water quality than anyone else here

We should compare quarterly water bills. I end up paying four times the basic water volume rate because of all the added on taxes/charges/fees etc for wastewater processing environmental charges etc.

How are you improving water quality more than Greg is?

Tick Tock
 

On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 16:29:37 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 2/24/2018 4:22 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 14:58:59 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 2/24/2018 2:50 PM, Keyser Soze wrote:
On 2/24/18 2:39 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 2/24/2018 2:25 PM, justan wrote:
Wrote in message:
On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 09:36:12 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

I'll betcha it's not so much a case of being anti-gun as it is legal
beagles recognizing that litigation could extend not only to the
shooter, the store that sold him the firearm (already happens) and to
the financing agency that made the purchase possible.Â* I'll bet more
credit card issuers will start prohibiting the use of their cards for
firearm purchases in the future.

There is legislation in place that shields sellers and manufacturers.
The left really wants to change that but not with much success so far.
This credit card thing is just kubuki theater. Like you say, once the
water calms down I bet it goes away, particularly if a number of big
chains decide to tell them to **** off.
Like someone said before, where does this stop? Are they going to stop
processing charges for dangerous food next? Far more people die from
obesity related disease than from guns, by a couple orders of
magnitude


Why don't we just ban everything the ATF people regulate and be
Â* done with it. Of the three, I don't know which is
Â* deadliest.



Greg seems to think that all of our society problems are mutually
inclusive, meaning you can only fix 'em if you fix *all* of them at
once.Â* It's ok to take one or two at a time.



My take on Greg is that he has no interest in anything other than the
anti-rule, anti-regulation, anti-societal libertarian nonsense. That
means no regulatory efforts to fix anything. Don't like dirty air? Wear
a gas mask. Dirty water? Filter it. Too many high-powered guns in the
wrong hands? Wear body armor.


I like Greg and have respect for his accomplishments, knowledge and
technical expertise. But I don't think I've ever come across anyone
who can come up with as many reasons why you *can't* do something as he
can. It makes me chuckle sometimes.

It's a little surprising because usually those with a technical or
engineering bent are just the opposite. Tell an engineer he can't do
something and he'll spend a lifetime trying to prove you wrong.


I lived my life on the other end of that product cycle and I see what
engineers can't do.
If they weren't wrong so often I would not have had a job.
I didn't lose my job because they got any better. It was just because
we simply throw away their mistakes and buy a new one instead of
trying to fix it.


Well that certainly explains it in a nutshell. Fire the engineering
department. Don't need it.


You don't want to fire them but they do need a little more real world
experience. That was one of the jobs I had, service planning, in
Endicott. Basically we were feeding back how things that worked
perfectly in the lab were not doing as well in the customer's office.

More on point is a lot of times in the Maps they had useless
procedures than never fixed anything but wasted a lot of time and
resources. We tried to cut through that clutter.
Your "ban military guns" falls into that category. It is a lot of
effort for very little return. There are perhaps 50-100 million that
would fall into that broad category that are here and not going
anywhere.

Tick Tock
 

On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 16:22:22 -0500, wrote:

On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 14:58:59 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 2/24/2018 2:50 PM, Keyser Soze wrote:
On 2/24/18 2:39 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 2/24/2018 2:25 PM, justan wrote:
Wrote in message:
On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 09:36:12 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

I'll betcha it's not so much a case of being anti-gun as it is legal
beagles recognizing that litigation could extend not only to the
shooter, the store that sold him the firearm (already happens) and to
the financing agency that made the purchase possible.* I'll bet more
credit card issuers will start prohibiting the use of their cards for
firearm purchases in the future.

There is legislation in place that shields sellers and manufacturers.
The left really wants to change that but not with much success so far.
This credit card thing is just kubuki theater. Like you say, once the
water calms down I bet it goes away, particularly if a number of big
chains decide to tell them to **** off.
Like someone said before, where does this stop? Are they going to stop
processing charges for dangerous food next? Far more people die from
obesity related disease than from guns, by a couple orders of
magnitude


Why don't we just ban everything the ATF people regulate and be
* done with it. Of the three, I don't know which is
* deadliest.



Greg seems to think that all of our society problems are mutually
inclusive, meaning you can only fix 'em if you fix *all* of them at
once.* It's ok to take one or two at a time.



My take on Greg is that he has no interest in anything other than the
anti-rule, anti-regulation, anti-societal libertarian nonsense. That
means no regulatory efforts to fix anything. Don't like dirty air? Wear
a gas mask. Dirty water? Filter it. Too many high-powered guns in the
wrong hands? Wear body armor.


I like Greg and have respect for his accomplishments, knowledge and
technical expertise. But I don't think I've ever come across anyone
who can come up with as many reasons why you *can't* do something as he
can. It makes me chuckle sometimes.

It's a little surprising because usually those with a technical or
engineering bent are just the opposite. Tell an engineer he can't do
something and he'll spend a lifetime trying to prove you wrong.

I lived my life on the other end of that product cycle and I see what
engineers can't do.
If they weren't wrong so often I would not have had a job.
I didn't lose my job because they got any better. It was just because
we simply throw away their mistakes and buy a new one instead of
trying to fix it.


===

I think you'd have to concede that the electronics of today are orders
of magnitude more reliable than 50 or 60 years ago. Even more
importantly, the complex electromechanical devices that IBM was famous
for, have mostly been phased out.

---
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
http://www.avg.com

Tick Tock
 

On 2/24/2018 5:22 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 13:26:16 -0800 (PST), True North
wrote:

On Saturday, 24 February 2018 17:19:51 UTC-4, wrote:
On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 14:50:08 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

On 2/24/18 2:39 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 2/24/2018 2:25 PM, justan wrote:
Wrote in message:
On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 09:36:12 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

I'll betcha it's not so much a case of being anti-gun as it is legal
beagles recognizing that litigation could extend not only to the
shooter, the store that sold him the firearm (already happens) and to
the financing agency that made the purchase possible.Â* I'll bet more
credit card issuers will start prohibiting the use of their cards for
firearm purchases in the future.

There is legislation in place that shields sellers and manufacturers.
The left really wants to change that but not with much success so far.
This credit card thing is just kubuki theater. Like you say, once the
water calms down I bet it goes away, particularly if a number of big
chains decide to tell them to **** off.
Like someone said before, where does this stop? Are they going to stop
processing charges for dangerous food next? Far more people die from
obesity related disease than from guns, by a couple orders of
magnitude


Why don't we just ban everything the ATF people regulate and be
Â* done with it. Of the three, I don't know which is
Â* deadliest.



Greg seems to think that all of our society problems are mutually
inclusive, meaning you can only fix 'em if you fix *all* of them at
once.Â* It's ok to take one or two at a time.



My take on Greg is that he has no interest in anything other than the
anti-rule, anti-regulation, anti-societal libertarian nonsense. That
means no regulatory efforts to fix anything. Don't like dirty air? Wear
a gas mask. Dirty water? Filter it. Too many high-powered guns in the
wrong hands? Wear body armor.

I am sure I am doing more about water quality than anyone else here

We should compare quarterly water bills. I end up paying four times the basic water volume rate because of all the added on taxes/charges/fees etc for wastewater processing environmental charges etc.

I don't have a water bill. I get mine from a hole in the yard. That is
one reason why I am interested in water quality. The other is because
I want to protect where I boat.



The water is one thing about Florida that I don't miss at all. The
carbon filter tank, water softener tank and whatever that blue chemical
you had to add to remove the pungent sulfur stink so you could take a
shower was a pain in the ass. We replaced all the tanks, filters and
equipment in the first house we bought down there with a fully automated
system hoping it would improve the water quality. It didn't. Bought a
water dispenser/cooler for drinking water purchased in 5 gallon jugs
from Publix.

Tick Tock
 

On 2/24/2018 6:12 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 16:22:22 -0500, wrote:

On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 14:58:59 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 2/24/2018 2:50 PM, Keyser Soze wrote:
On 2/24/18 2:39 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 2/24/2018 2:25 PM, justan wrote:
Wrote in message:
On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 09:36:12 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

I'll betcha it's not so much a case of being anti-gun as it is legal
beagles recognizing that litigation could extend not only to the
shooter, the store that sold him the firearm (already happens) and to
the financing agency that made the purchase possible.Â* I'll bet more
credit card issuers will start prohibiting the use of their cards for
firearm purchases in the future.

There is legislation in place that shields sellers and manufacturers.
The left really wants to change that but not with much success so far.
This credit card thing is just kubuki theater. Like you say, once the
water calms down I bet it goes away, particularly if a number of big
chains decide to tell them to **** off.
Like someone said before, where does this stop? Are they going to stop
processing charges for dangerous food next? Far more people die from
obesity related disease than from guns, by a couple orders of
magnitude


Why don't we just ban everything the ATF people regulate and be
Â* done with it. Of the three, I don't know which is
Â* deadliest.



Greg seems to think that all of our society problems are mutually
inclusive, meaning you can only fix 'em if you fix *all* of them at
once.Â* It's ok to take one or two at a time.



My take on Greg is that he has no interest in anything other than the
anti-rule, anti-regulation, anti-societal libertarian nonsense. That
means no regulatory efforts to fix anything. Don't like dirty air? Wear
a gas mask. Dirty water? Filter it. Too many high-powered guns in the
wrong hands? Wear body armor.


I like Greg and have respect for his accomplishments, knowledge and
technical expertise. But I don't think I've ever come across anyone
who can come up with as many reasons why you *can't* do something as he
can. It makes me chuckle sometimes.

It's a little surprising because usually those with a technical or
engineering bent are just the opposite. Tell an engineer he can't do
something and he'll spend a lifetime trying to prove you wrong.

I lived my life on the other end of that product cycle and I see what
engineers can't do.
If they weren't wrong so often I would not have had a job.
I didn't lose my job because they got any better. It was just because
we simply throw away their mistakes and buy a new one instead of
trying to fix it.


===

I think you'd have to concede that the electronics of today are orders
of magnitude more reliable than 50 or 60 years ago. Even more
importantly, the complex electromechanical devices that IBM was famous
for, have mostly been phased out.


Very true and one of the reasons in hindsight that I am grateful that I
never tried to pursue a career in engineering using discrete components
and devices. The basic electronic engineering education I received led
to another, more physics related field that I enjoyed very much.

Tick Tock
 

On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 16:32:43 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 2/24/2018 4:18 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 14:39:58 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 2/24/2018 2:25 PM, justan wrote:
Wrote in message:
On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 09:36:12 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

I'll betcha it's not so much a case of being anti-gun as it is legal
beagles recognizing that litigation could extend not only to the
shooter, the store that sold him the firearm (already happens) and to
the financing agency that made the purchase possible. I'll bet more
credit card issuers will start prohibiting the use of their cards for
firearm purchases in the future.

There is legislation in place that shields sellers and manufacturers.
The left really wants to change that but not with much success so far.
This credit card thing is just kubuki theater. Like you say, once the
water calms down I bet it goes away, particularly if a number of big
chains decide to tell them to **** off.
Like someone said before, where does this stop? Are they going to stop
processing charges for dangerous food next? Far more people die from
obesity related disease than from guns, by a couple orders of
magnitude


Why don't we just ban everything the ATF people regulate and be
done with it. Of the three, I don't know which is
deadliest.



Greg seems to think that all of our society problems are mutually
inclusive, meaning you can only fix 'em if you fix *all* of them at
once. It's ok to take one or two at a time.


Certainly true but why start with the one that causes a few hundred
deaths and ignore the ones that cause tens of thousands or even
millions?
Oh I forgot, they aren't news and the fix would be inconvenient for a
lot of people.



I give you this. You're amazing. :-)

(not trying to bust your chops but I am very, very thankful that not all
share your logic.)

You are pretty amazing yourself. You say you want to stop the killing
and then you say you will start with the weapon that kills the least
number of people.
You top that by saying this is not a slippery slope.
After the ARs are gone and the killers move to Mini 14s or Harry's
Scorpion, they will have to go. Then will it be shotguns or pistols
next.

Just as a sanity check, when you look into that bogus "18 school
shootings in 2018" (most were not any kind of actual murder attempt
and some were not even at an open school)
THEY WERE ALL HANDGUNS except Parkland.

Tick Tock
 

On 2/24/2018 6:44 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 16:32:43 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 2/24/2018 4:18 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 14:39:58 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 2/24/2018 2:25 PM, justan wrote:
Wrote in message:
On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 09:36:12 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

I'll betcha it's not so much a case of being anti-gun as it is legal
beagles recognizing that litigation could extend not only to the
shooter, the store that sold him the firearm (already happens) and to
the financing agency that made the purchase possible. I'll bet more
credit card issuers will start prohibiting the use of their cards for
firearm purchases in the future.

There is legislation in place that shields sellers and manufacturers.
The left really wants to change that but not with much success so far.
This credit card thing is just kubuki theater. Like you say, once the
water calms down I bet it goes away, particularly if a number of big
chains decide to tell them to **** off.
Like someone said before, where does this stop? Are they going to stop
processing charges for dangerous food next? Far more people die from
obesity related disease than from guns, by a couple orders of
magnitude


Why don't we just ban everything the ATF people regulate and be
done with it. Of the three, I don't know which is
deadliest.



Greg seems to think that all of our society problems are mutually
inclusive, meaning you can only fix 'em if you fix *all* of them at
once. It's ok to take one or two at a time.


Certainly true but why start with the one that causes a few hundred
deaths and ignore the ones that cause tens of thousands or even
millions?
Oh I forgot, they aren't news and the fix would be inconvenient for a
lot of people.



I give you this. You're amazing. :-)

(not trying to bust your chops but I am very, very thankful that not all
share your logic.)

You are pretty amazing yourself. You say you want to stop the killing
and then you say you will start with the weapon that kills the least
number of people.
You top that by saying this is not a slippery slope.
After the ARs are gone and the killers move to Mini 14s or Harry's
Scorpion, they will have to go. Then will it be shotguns or pistols
next.

Just as a sanity check, when you look into that bogus "18 school
shootings in 2018" (most were not any kind of actual murder attempt
and some were not even at an open school)
THEY WERE ALL HANDGUNS except Parkland.



Ok, ok Greg. Calm down. I am not busting your chops. But, I think
there's an element of the purposeful slaughter of a bunch of innocent
kids regardless of the weapon involved that maybe I am oversensitive to.
I can't septically (sp?) step away from that and compare it to auto
accidents or gangland slayings and arrive at a conclusion that it really
isn't all that bad, all things considered.

I think that ultimately the USA would be better off with no guns in the
hands of civilians, other than those purely designed for
recreational/competitive shooting or hunting. Certainly no need for
semi-automatic, copies of military weapons. But I don't think it will
be anytime soon. The "slippery slope" argument always comes up.
I like to believe that as generations go by each gets a little smarter
and wiser and at some point concepts that originated almost 250 years
ago have become a bit outdated.

The need for a "regulated militia" is a crock now-a-days, IMO. I accept
moving on with the times when the time is right. I think too many
people are clinging to miss-interpreted words, excuses and reasons that
are more obsolete than your Win 98 computers. :-)

I still have guns and will renew my permit later this year when due. My
only reason for having them is because of the world we live in and the
very remote but possible potential that I may need a gun as a last
resort means of defense for me and my wife still exists. I'd much
rather live in a world ... and pass on to my grandchildren a world ...
that owning a gun for self defense is no longer needed or even thought
about.

Tick Tock
 

Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 2/24/2018 4:22 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 14:58:59 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 2/24/2018 2:50 PM, Keyser Soze wrote:
On 2/24/18 2:39 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 2/24/2018 2:25 PM, justan wrote:
Wrote in message:
On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 09:36:12 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

I'll betcha it's not so much a case of being anti-gun as it is legal
beagles recognizing that litigation could extend not only to the
shooter, the store that sold him the firearm (already happens) and to
the financing agency that made the purchase possible.Â* I'll bet more
credit card issuers will start prohibiting the use of their cards for
firearm purchases in the future.

There is legislation in place that shields sellers and manufacturers.
The left really wants to change that but not with much success so far.
This credit card thing is just kubuki theater. Like you say, once the
water calms down I bet it goes away, particularly if a number of big
chains decide to tell them to **** off.
Like someone said before, where does this stop? Are they going to stop
processing charges for dangerous food next? Far more people die from
obesity related disease than from guns, by a couple orders of
magnitude


Why don't we just ban everything the ATF people regulate and be
Â* done with it. Of the three, I don't know which is
Â* deadliest.



Greg seems to think that all of our society problems are mutually
inclusive, meaning you can only fix 'em if you fix *all* of them at
once.Â* It's ok to take one or two at a time.



My take on Greg is that he has no interest in anything other than the
anti-rule, anti-regulation, anti-societal libertarian nonsense. That
means no regulatory efforts to fix anything. Don't like dirty air? Wear
a gas mask. Dirty water? Filter it. Too many high-powered guns in the
wrong hands? Wear body armor.


I like Greg and have respect for his accomplishments, knowledge and
technical expertise. But I don't think I've ever come across anyone
who can come up with as many reasons why you *can't* do something as he
can. It makes me chuckle sometimes.

It's a little surprising because usually those with a technical or
engineering bent are just the opposite. Tell an engineer he can't do
something and he'll spend a lifetime trying to prove you wrong.


I lived my life on the other end of that product cycle and I see what
engineers can't do.
If they weren't wrong so often I would not have had a job.
I didn't lose my job because they got any better. It was just because
we simply throw away their mistakes and buy a new one instead of
trying to fix it.


Well that certainly explains it in a nutshell. Fire the engineering
department. Don't need it.




I did sustaining engineering for one company. Fixed lots of design
errors. Made a really nice living. Worked my way through fixing
mainframes. Also a decent income.

Tick Tock
 

On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 16:42:36 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

Each week in Chicago and Bulletmore. Just people of color do not seem to
count.



I really don't have much compassion for gang members shooting each other
unless innocents are hurt or killed.

I have a *lot* of compassion and concern for nut cases entering
schools and killing 15 to 20 innocent kids ranging from 6 to 17 years old.

A parent's most important responsibility is the safety and well-being of
the kids they bring into this world. I can't begin to imagine the
anguish the parents of the recently deceased kids must feel.


Unfortunately innocents do get killed in these gang shootings.

As for the kids, it makes far more sense to harden the schools and get
more serious about identifying the people who would want to do harm in
there. Playing Whack a mole with the various weapons they might use is
just trying to prevent the last tragedy, not the next one.

Tick Tock
 

On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 18:12:18 -0500,
wrote:

On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 16:22:22 -0500, wrote:

On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 14:58:59 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 2/24/2018 2:50 PM, Keyser Soze wrote:
On 2/24/18 2:39 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 2/24/2018 2:25 PM, justan wrote:
Wrote in message:
On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 09:36:12 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

I'll betcha it's not so much a case of being anti-gun as it is legal
beagles recognizing that litigation could extend not only to the
shooter, the store that sold him the firearm (already happens) and to
the financing agency that made the purchase possible.Â* I'll bet more
credit card issuers will start prohibiting the use of their cards for
firearm purchases in the future.

There is legislation in place that shields sellers and manufacturers.
The left really wants to change that but not with much success so far.
This credit card thing is just kubuki theater. Like you say, once the
water calms down I bet it goes away, particularly if a number of big
chains decide to tell them to **** off.
Like someone said before, where does this stop? Are they going to stop
processing charges for dangerous food next? Far more people die from
obesity related disease than from guns, by a couple orders of
magnitude


Why don't we just ban everything the ATF people regulate and be
Â* done with it. Of the three, I don't know which is
Â* deadliest.



Greg seems to think that all of our society problems are mutually
inclusive, meaning you can only fix 'em if you fix *all* of them at
once.Â* It's ok to take one or two at a time.



My take on Greg is that he has no interest in anything other than the
anti-rule, anti-regulation, anti-societal libertarian nonsense. That
means no regulatory efforts to fix anything. Don't like dirty air? Wear
a gas mask. Dirty water? Filter it. Too many high-powered guns in the
wrong hands? Wear body armor.


I like Greg and have respect for his accomplishments, knowledge and
technical expertise. But I don't think I've ever come across anyone
who can come up with as many reasons why you *can't* do something as he
can. It makes me chuckle sometimes.

It's a little surprising because usually those with a technical or
engineering bent are just the opposite. Tell an engineer he can't do
something and he'll spend a lifetime trying to prove you wrong.

I lived my life on the other end of that product cycle and I see what
engineers can't do.
If they weren't wrong so often I would not have had a job.
I didn't lose my job because they got any better. It was just because
we simply throw away their mistakes and buy a new one instead of
trying to fix it.


===

I think you'd have to concede that the electronics of today are orders
of magnitude more reliable than 50 or 60 years ago. Even more
importantly, the complex electromechanical devices that IBM was famous
for, have mostly been phased out.

Things are certainly more reliable but when they break, you just cut
open the box and replace it. Nobody fixes anything anymore.
We got rid of the electromechanical stuff when we got rid of paper. It
took 40 years but they are finally doing it.
I guess there are still production printers but I doubt check sorters
are really much of a thing. They just scan the paper and toss it.
These days a check doesn't really have to ever leave your sight. An
increasing number of merchants just scan the check and hand it back to
you. They may just read the MICR line.
I doubt tape is really a thing and disk drives are like BIC lighters.
If you have any trouble from them you just throw them away. Most are
in RAID arrays and can be hot swapped.

Tick Tock
 

On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 18:25:22 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 2/24/2018 5:22 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 13:26:16 -0800 (PST), True North
wrote:

On Saturday, 24 February 2018 17:19:51 UTC-4, wrote:
On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 14:50:08 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

On 2/24/18 2:39 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 2/24/2018 2:25 PM, justan wrote:
Wrote in message:
On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 09:36:12 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

I'll betcha it's not so much a case of being anti-gun as it is legal
beagles recognizing that litigation could extend not only to the
shooter, the store that sold him the firearm (already happens) and to
the financing agency that made the purchase possible.Â* I'll bet more
credit card issuers will start prohibiting the use of their cards for
firearm purchases in the future.

There is legislation in place that shields sellers and manufacturers.
The left really wants to change that but not with much success so far.
This credit card thing is just kubuki theater. Like you say, once the
water calms down I bet it goes away, particularly if a number of big
chains decide to tell them to **** off.
Like someone said before, where does this stop? Are they going to stop
processing charges for dangerous food next? Far more people die from
obesity related disease than from guns, by a couple orders of
magnitude


Why don't we just ban everything the ATF people regulate and be
Â* done with it. Of the three, I don't know which is
Â* deadliest.



Greg seems to think that all of our society problems are mutually
inclusive, meaning you can only fix 'em if you fix *all* of them at
once.Â* It's ok to take one or two at a time.



My take on Greg is that he has no interest in anything other than the
anti-rule, anti-regulation, anti-societal libertarian nonsense. That
means no regulatory efforts to fix anything. Don't like dirty air? Wear
a gas mask. Dirty water? Filter it. Too many high-powered guns in the
wrong hands? Wear body armor.

I am sure I am doing more about water quality than anyone else here

We should compare quarterly water bills. I end up paying four times the basic water volume rate because of all the added on taxes/charges/fees etc for wastewater processing environmental charges etc.

I don't have a water bill. I get mine from a hole in the yard. That is
one reason why I am interested in water quality. The other is because
I want to protect where I boat.



The water is one thing about Florida that I don't miss at all. The
carbon filter tank, water softener tank and whatever that blue chemical
you had to add to remove the pungent sulfur stink so you could take a
shower was a pain in the ass. We replaced all the tanks, filters and
equipment in the first house we bought down there with a fully automated
system hoping it would improve the water quality. It didn't. Bought a
water dispenser/cooler for drinking water purchased in 5 gallon jugs
from Publix.

We have a big aerator that takes out the sulfur and any sand we might
kick up, I have an R/O system for the drinking water and a water
softener. It is really pretty easy to maintain. The "city water" is
not much better and it is pretty expensive. Our neighborhood fights it
every time they bring it up.

Tick Tock
 

On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 18:37:02 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 2/24/2018 6:12 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 16:22:22 -0500, wrote:

On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 14:58:59 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 2/24/2018 2:50 PM, Keyser Soze wrote:
On 2/24/18 2:39 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 2/24/2018 2:25 PM, justan wrote:
Wrote in message:
On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 09:36:12 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

I'll betcha it's not so much a case of being anti-gun as it is legal
beagles recognizing that litigation could extend not only to the
shooter, the store that sold him the firearm (already happens) and to
the financing agency that made the purchase possible.Â* I'll bet more
credit card issuers will start prohibiting the use of their cards for
firearm purchases in the future.

There is legislation in place that shields sellers and manufacturers.
The left really wants to change that but not with much success so far.
This credit card thing is just kubuki theater. Like you say, once the
water calms down I bet it goes away, particularly if a number of big
chains decide to tell them to **** off.
Like someone said before, where does this stop? Are they going to stop
processing charges for dangerous food next? Far more people die from
obesity related disease than from guns, by a couple orders of
magnitude


Why don't we just ban everything the ATF people regulate and be
Â* done with it. Of the three, I don't know which is
Â* deadliest.



Greg seems to think that all of our society problems are mutually
inclusive, meaning you can only fix 'em if you fix *all* of them at
once.Â* It's ok to take one or two at a time.



My take on Greg is that he has no interest in anything other than the
anti-rule, anti-regulation, anti-societal libertarian nonsense. That
means no regulatory efforts to fix anything. Don't like dirty air? Wear
a gas mask. Dirty water? Filter it. Too many high-powered guns in the
wrong hands? Wear body armor.


I like Greg and have respect for his accomplishments, knowledge and
technical expertise. But I don't think I've ever come across anyone
who can come up with as many reasons why you *can't* do something as he
can. It makes me chuckle sometimes.

It's a little surprising because usually those with a technical or
engineering bent are just the opposite. Tell an engineer he can't do
something and he'll spend a lifetime trying to prove you wrong.

I lived my life on the other end of that product cycle and I see what
engineers can't do.
If they weren't wrong so often I would not have had a job.
I didn't lose my job because they got any better. It was just because
we simply throw away their mistakes and buy a new one instead of
trying to fix it.


===

I think you'd have to concede that the electronics of today are orders
of magnitude more reliable than 50 or 60 years ago. Even more
importantly, the complex electromechanical devices that IBM was famous
for, have mostly been phased out.


Very true and one of the reasons in hindsight that I am grateful that I
never tried to pursue a career in engineering using discrete components
and devices. The basic electronic engineering education I received led
to another, more physics related field that I enjoyed very much.

I got lucky that ICs were really coming of age just about the time I
really got serious about building things. I really like CMOS. If it
was not so easy and so reliable, I might have embraced
microprocessors. When you add SSRs to the mix, you can get some stuff
going. My spa controller is all CMOS with SSRs driving the 2.5HP
motor, a 3/4-1/10 2 speed motor and an 11kw heater.
The thermostat is an op amp and a thermistor water sensor (Ford part)
The whole thing is clocked with a 555.
The pool controller is even simpler. An intermatic timer motor with 3
cams on it that operate switches for the time base and the rest is
just a clever way to wire toggle switches. It runs the solar, gas
heater and pump.

I am still thinking about playing with something like a Raspberry PI
(or the other one) but I am not sure what I would do with it.
Maybe some kind of data acquisition thing like a tide stage sond. I
had a plan for one using a PC and a game card, I had the software
written but I did not want another PC running all the time.

Tick Tock
 

On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 19:30:19 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 2/24/2018 6:44 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 16:32:43 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 2/24/2018 4:18 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 14:39:58 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 2/24/2018 2:25 PM, justan wrote:
Wrote in message:
On Sat, 24 Feb 2018 09:36:12 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

I'll betcha it's not so much a case of being anti-gun as it is legal
beagles recognizing that litigation could extend not only to the
shooter, the store that sold him the firearm (already happens) and to
the financing agency that made the purchase possible. I'll bet more
credit card issuers will start prohibiting the use of their cards for
firearm purchases in the future.

There is legislation in place that shields sellers and manufacturers.
The left really wants to change that but not with much success so far.
This credit card thing is just kubuki theater. Like you say, once the
water calms down I bet it goes away, particularly if a number of big
chains decide to tell them to **** off.
Like someone said before, where does this stop? Are they going to stop
processing charges for dangerous food next? Far more people die from
obesity related disease than from guns, by a couple orders of
magnitude


Why don't we just ban everything the ATF people regulate and be
done with it. Of the three, I don't know which is
deadliest.



Greg seems to think that all of our society problems are mutually
inclusive, meaning you can only fix 'em if you fix *all* of them at
once. It's ok to take one or two at a time.


Certainly true but why start with the one that causes a few hundred
deaths and ignore the ones that cause tens of thousands or even
millions?
Oh I forgot, they aren't news and the fix would be inconvenient for a
lot of people.



I give you this. You're amazing. :-)

(not trying to bust your chops but I am very, very thankful that not all
share your logic.)

You are pretty amazing yourself. You say you want to stop the killing
and then you say you will start with the weapon that kills the least
number of people.
You top that by saying this is not a slippery slope.
After the ARs are gone and the killers move to Mini 14s or Harry's
Scorpion, they will have to go. Then will it be shotguns or pistols
next.

Just as a sanity check, when you look into that bogus "18 school
shootings in 2018" (most were not any kind of actual murder attempt
and some were not even at an open school)
THEY WERE ALL HANDGUNS except Parkland.



Ok, ok Greg. Calm down. I am not busting your chops. But, I think
there's an element of the purposeful slaughter of a bunch of innocent
kids regardless of the weapon involved that maybe I am oversensitive to.
I can't septically (sp?) step away from that and compare it to auto
accidents or gangland slayings and arrive at a conclusion that it really
isn't all that bad, all things considered.

I think that ultimately the USA would be better off with no guns in the
hands of civilians, other than those purely designed for
recreational/competitive shooting or hunting. Certainly no need for
semi-automatic, copies of military weapons. But I don't think it will
be anytime soon. The "slippery slope" argument always comes up.
I like to believe that as generations go by each gets a little smarter
and wiser and at some point concepts that originated almost 250 years
ago have become a bit outdated.

Unfortunately if you think getting older is making us smarter and
having more capable guns is dumb, we are going the other way.

I do blame Hollywood for the increase of the lethality of the guns we
buy because people buy what they see. The same peace loving gun
grabbing Hollywood types can't seem to make a movie without machine
guns, massive explosions and lots of gratuitous violence. I have given
up on "action" movies altogether They are just roadrunner cartoons
with more realistic killing.

The need for a "regulated militia" is a crock now-a-days, IMO. I accept
moving on with the times when the time is right. I think too many
people are clinging to miss-interpreted words, excuses and reasons that
are more obsolete than your Win 98 computers. :-)

Heller affirms that this is not about a well regulated militia any
more than the war on religion is about "laws" "congress" makes.

I still have guns and will renew my permit later this year when due. My
only reason for having them is because of the world we live in and the
very remote but possible potential that I may need a gun as a last
resort means of defense for me and my wife still exists. I'd much
rather live in a world ... and pass on to my grandchildren a world ...
that owning a gun for self defense is no longer needed or even thought
about.

I still have some too but only 2 are really for any kind of self
defense (a pistol and a shotgun)
The rest are stuffed away. I probably should divest myself of the ones
I may never use again. I am just not sure which ones they would be
since I don't really have any duplicates.

Tick Tock
 

On Sun, 25 Feb 2018 00:40:45 -0000 (UTC), Bill
wrote:

I did sustaining engineering for one company. Fixed lots of design
errors. Made a really nice living. Worked my way through fixing
mainframes. Also a decent income.

Of all the jobs I had, mainframes were my favorite thing to fix, I was
real good on just about any kind of big printer, 1403 and 3800 in
particular (little ones, not so much) and I became pretty good on
check sorters but they were never my favorite thing to do. Check
sorters are not that much "fixing" as just replacing parts
preemptively by the box load. We started using our drill drivers and
mass attacking them 2 or 3 guys at a time.
I also liked the instructor job but I didn't want to work in DC or
Atlanta. Plant jobs (service planning) were fun for a while but I got
bored. I did not want to be Dilbert in a cube.
It was better when I could do it remotely from Ft Myers (then called
service delivery) and it was just logistic planning. Unfortunately all
of that went away along with the 6 man territory I was managing at the
time.