On 9/7/16 9:43 AM, justan wrote:
Keyser Soze Wrote in message:
On 9/7/16 8:40 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 9/6/2016 8:00 PM, Keyser Soze wrote:
On 9/6/16 7:29 PM, justan wrote:
Keyser Soze Wrote in message:
On 9/6/16 5:44 PM, Wayne.B wrote:
On Tue, 6 Sep 2016 17:07:41 -0400 (EDT), justan wrote:

Leaving students bewildered and stranded. Anyone know more about
this government action against education?

===

The problem is that studens were misled about their employment
opportunities and then defaulted on their government backed student
loans when they couldn't get jobs. The ITT training wasn't quite as
rigorous as the US Navy's and neither were their admission standards.



The Navy has admission standards? Beyond fogging a mirror?


You'd be surprised.


Not if you got in...

The problem with your accusations is that you have no idea what you are
talking about. The Navy has many jobs ... called "ratings" ... and each
one has a minimum score required (along with other specific
requirements), to attend the rating's particular school(s). Some
require enlistments beyond the typical 4 years due to the length of the
schools and the educational investment the government makes. Without
giving away any unnecessary details, the rating and schools "Justan"
attended required one of the highest qualifying scores. You may be
good at sentence structure, prepositional phrases and teaching bonehead
English but it's highly unlikely you would have qualified for the Navy
schools he attended.




Oh, yeah, because the "details" from 50 years ago are significant today.
I get it.


Nothing stands still like the English language.
Once you master
it, it's yours for life. That holds true for most of the union
trades as well. Rules and standards change a bit but once a brick
stacker always a brick stacker. Technology is a different story.
You can't stagnate like an English proffessor and expect to move
along or even keep a job. So you're right. You also proved that a
pedestrian skill set like you have is not that hard to come by
and is of little value, especially for bragging rights.


What the hell would you know about intellectual pursuits? Answer?
Nothing. And you don't seem to know much about the skilled trades,
either. In fact, there's little evidence here you know much about anything.

On Wednesday, September 7, 2016 at 9:32:00 AM UTC-5, Keyser Soze wrote:
On 9/7/16 9:43 AM, justan wrote:
Keyser Soze Wrote in message:
On 9/7/16 8:40 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 9/6/2016 8:00 PM, Keyser Soze wrote:
On 9/6/16 7:29 PM, justan wrote:
Keyser Soze Wrote in message:
On 9/6/16 5:44 PM, Wayne.B wrote:
On Tue, 6 Sep 2016 17:07:41 -0400 (EDT), justan wrote:

Leaving students bewildered and stranded. Anyone know more about
this government action against education?

===

The problem is that studens were misled about their employment
opportunities and then defaulted on their government backed student
loans when they couldn't get jobs. The ITT training wasn't quite as
rigorous as the US Navy's and neither were their admission standards.



The Navy has admission standards? Beyond fogging a mirror?


You'd be surprised.


Not if you got in...

The problem with your accusations is that you have no idea what you are
talking about. The Navy has many jobs ... called "ratings" ... and each
one has a minimum score required (along with other specific
requirements), to attend the rating's particular school(s). Some
require enlistments beyond the typical 4 years due to the length of the
schools and the educational investment the government makes. Without
giving away any unnecessary details, the rating and schools "Justan"
attended required one of the highest qualifying scores. You may be
good at sentence structure, prepositional phrases and teaching bonehead
English but it's highly unlikely you would have qualified for the Navy
schools he attended.




Oh, yeah, because the "details" from 50 years ago are significant today.
I get it.


Nothing stands still like the English language.
Once you master
it, it's yours for life. That holds true for most of the union
trades as well. Rules and standards change a bit but once a brick
stacker always a brick stacker. Technology is a different story.
You can't stagnate like an English proffessor and expect to move
along or even keep a job. So you're right. You also proved that a
pedestrian skill set like you have is not that hard to come by
and is of little value, especially for bragging rights.


What the hell would you know about intellectual pursuits? Answer?
Nothing. And you don't seem to know much about the skilled trades,
either. In fact, there's little evidence here you know much about anything.

Harry, my son knows a lot about the "skilled trades" He bought his Carpenters union card and went to work the next week building scaffolding in power plants at the rate of $28-32 bucks an hr. pplus overtime, plus per dium.(about a hundred a day whether he can spend it or not)

Besides his card, the only thing else he has invested is a lunch bucket and a couple special wrenches. And when he's laid off he does a lot of fishing and gets $400.00 a week. Yes, he knows a lot about the "skilled trades"

On 9/11/16 3:42 PM, Tim wrote:
On Wednesday, September 7, 2016 at 9:32:00 AM UTC-5, Keyser Soze wrote:
On 9/7/16 9:43 AM, justan wrote:
Keyser Soze Wrote in message:
On 9/7/16 8:40 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 9/6/2016 8:00 PM, Keyser Soze wrote:
On 9/6/16 7:29 PM, justan wrote:
Keyser Soze Wrote in message:
On 9/6/16 5:44 PM, Wayne.B wrote:
On Tue, 6 Sep 2016 17:07:41 -0400 (EDT), justan wrote:

Leaving students bewildered and stranded. Anyone know more about
this government action against education?

===

The problem is that studens were misled about their employment
opportunities and then defaulted on their government backed student
loans when they couldn't get jobs. The ITT training wasn't quite as
rigorous as the US Navy's and neither were their admission standards.



The Navy has admission standards? Beyond fogging a mirror?


You'd be surprised.


Not if you got in...

The problem with your accusations is that you have no idea what you are
talking about. The Navy has many jobs ... called "ratings" ... and each
one has a minimum score required (along with other specific
requirements), to attend the rating's particular school(s). Some
require enlistments beyond the typical 4 years due to the length of the
schools and the educational investment the government makes. Without
giving away any unnecessary details, the rating and schools "Justan"
attended required one of the highest qualifying scores. You may be
good at sentence structure, prepositional phrases and teaching bonehead
English but it's highly unlikely you would have qualified for the Navy
schools he attended.




Oh, yeah, because the "details" from 50 years ago are significant today.
I get it.


Nothing stands still like the English language.
Once you master
it, it's yours for life. That holds true for most of the union
trades as well. Rules and standards change a bit but once a brick
stacker always a brick stacker. Technology is a different story.
You can't stagnate like an English proffessor and expect to move
along or even keep a job. So you're right. You also proved that a
pedestrian skill set like you have is not that hard to come by
and is of little value, especially for bragging rights.


What the hell would you know about intellectual pursuits? Answer?
Nothing. And you don't seem to know much about the skilled trades,
either. In fact, there's little evidence here you know much about anything.

Harry, my son knows a lot about the "skilled trades" He bought his Carpenters union card and went to work the next week building scaffolding in power plants at the rate of $28-32 bucks an hr. pplus overtime, plus per dium.(about a hundred a day whether he can spend it or not)

Besides his card, the only thing else he has invested is a lunch bucket and a couple special wrenches. And when he's laid off he does a lot of fishing and gets $400.00 a week. Yes, he knows a lot about the "skilled trades"


Are you making some sort of universal truth about your son's experience?

On 9/11/16 3:42 PM, Tim wrote:
On Wednesday, September 7, 2016 at 9:32:00 AM UTC-5, Keyser Soze wrote:
On 9/7/16 9:43 AM, justan wrote:
Keyser Soze Wrote in message:
On 9/7/16 8:40 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 9/6/2016 8:00 PM, Keyser Soze wrote:
On 9/6/16 7:29 PM, justan wrote:
Keyser Soze Wrote in message:
On 9/6/16 5:44 PM, Wayne.B wrote:
- show quoted text -
Are you making some sort of universal truth about your son's experience?
....

Are you trying to make the unionized laborer part of an elitist group?

On 9/11/16 7:40 PM, Tim wrote:
On 9/11/16 3:42 PM, Tim wrote:
On Wednesday, September 7, 2016 at 9:32:00 AM UTC-5, Keyser Soze wrote:
On 9/7/16 9:43 AM, justan wrote:
Keyser Soze Wrote in message:
On 9/7/16 8:40 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 9/6/2016 8:00 PM, Keyser Soze wrote:
On 9/6/16 7:29 PM, justan wrote:
Keyser Soze Wrote in message:
On 9/6/16 5:44 PM, Wayne.B wrote:
- show quoted text -
Are you making some sort of universal truth about your son's experience?
...

Are you trying to make the unionized laborer part of an elitist group?


You mean the ones who have gone through three to four years of serious
apprenticeship training and on the job training? Absolutely in
comparison to those who haven't.

On Sun, 11 Sep 2016 19:42:19 -0400, Keyser Soze
wrote:


You mean the ones who have gone through three to four years of serious
apprenticeship training and on the job training? Absolutely in
comparison to those who haven't.

I am having a hard time thinking of a trade that takes 4 years to
learn. This is more about limiting the number of people who can get
into the trades.
There may have been a time when trades were arts but technology has
made the most intricate skills obsolete. Nobody is packing oakum in
cast iron pipe and filling it with molten lead.

On 9/11/16 8:00 PM, wrote:
On Sun, 11 Sep 2016 19:42:19 -0400, Keyser Soze
wrote:


You mean the ones who have gone through three to four years of serious
apprenticeship training and on the job training? Absolutely in
comparison to those who haven't.

I am having a hard time thinking of a trade that takes 4 years to
learn. This is more about limiting the number of people who can get
into the trades.
There may have been a time when trades were arts but technology has
made the most intricate skills obsolete. Nobody is packing oakum in
cast iron pipe and filling it with molten lead.


Your experience on jobsites that are more than stick built houses and
tilt up strip malls obviously is limited. Try laying out and building a
one wythe serpentine wall 100' feet long, building a 12 story
loadbearing office building, doing the pipe welding for a nuclear
facility or the iron work on a 60-story building and get back to me with
your two weeks of training. Your arrogance about the lack of skills of
construction craftworkers never ceases to astonish.

On Sunday, September 11, 2016 at 6:42:21 PM UTC-5, Keyser Soze wrote:
On 9/11/16 7:40 PM, Tim wrote:
On 9/11/16 3:42 PM, Tim wrote:
On Wednesday, September 7, 2016 at 9:32:00 AM UTC-5, Keyser Soze wrote:
On 9/7/16 9:43 AM, justan wrote:
Keyser Soze Wrote in message:
On 9/7/16 8:40 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 9/6/2016 8:00 PM, Keyser Soze wrote:
On 9/6/16 7:29 PM, justan wrote:
Keyser Soze Wrote in message:
On 9/6/16 5:44 PM, Wayne.B wrote:
- show quoted text -
Are you making some sort of universal truth about your son's experience?
...

Are you trying to make the unionized laborer part of an elitist group?


You mean the ones who have gone through three to four years of serious
apprenticeship training and on the job training? Absolutely in
comparison to those who haven't.

The ones who skipped the job training and flashed some money and bought the card?

On 9/12/16 7:43 AM, Tim wrote:
On Sunday, September 11, 2016 at 6:42:21 PM UTC-5, Keyser Soze wrote:
On 9/11/16 7:40 PM, Tim wrote:
On 9/11/16 3:42 PM, Tim wrote:
On Wednesday, September 7, 2016 at 9:32:00 AM UTC-5, Keyser Soze wrote:
On 9/7/16 9:43 AM, justan wrote:
Keyser Soze Wrote in message:
On 9/7/16 8:40 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 9/6/2016 8:00 PM, Keyser Soze wrote:
On 9/6/16 7:29 PM, justan wrote:
Keyser Soze Wrote in message:
On 9/6/16 5:44 PM, Wayne.B wrote:
- show quoted text -
Are you making some sort of universal truth about your son's experience?
...

Are you trying to make the unionized laborer part of an elitist group?


You mean the ones who have gone through three to four years of serious
apprenticeship training and on the job training? Absolutely in
comparison to those who haven't.

The ones who skipped the job training and flashed some money and bought the card?


Is that common in the Schnautz family? I suppose if you are building
wood scaffolds, all you need is a hammer, a baseball cap and Keds.