On 10/2/2015 7:28 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 2 Oct 2015 18:41:37 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

None of this is a big deal nor is it difficult or expensive.

===

If you don't mind living in an over regulated police state.

Personally I'd rather take my chances with a rare/occasional bad guy
than need a permit every time I turn around. In my opinion we are
already over regulated, especially in the north eastern population
centers where most of this springs from.



There is plenty of over regulation that I find annoying or frustrating
.... the ban of some popular handguns up here due to the attorney general
and the safety testing labs confusing "certification" process is a good
example ...but getting a permit to legally own a firearm isn't one of my
beefs. It's really a simple process and as long as you are not a
convicted felon your application is generally approved. There's a bit
of a safety net for the public in the process though. It's up to the
local police chief to give final approval and to include any
restrictions. Handgun permits in MA is a "may" issue rather than a
"shall" issue. If an applicant is known by the police department to
have a history of violence, drug or alcohol abuse or other problems that
may not have lead to an arrest or conviction, the permit may be
disapproved. At least it can weed out some who probably shouldn't own
a gun.

On Fri, 2 Oct 2015 20:44:31 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 10/2/2015 7:28 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 2 Oct 2015 18:41:37 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

None of this is a big deal nor is it difficult or expensive.

===

If you don't mind living in an over regulated police state.

Personally I'd rather take my chances with a rare/occasional bad guy
than need a permit every time I turn around. In my opinion we are
already over regulated, especially in the north eastern population
centers where most of this springs from.



There is plenty of over regulation that I find annoying or frustrating
... the ban of some popular handguns up here due to the attorney general
and the safety testing labs confusing "certification" process is a good
example ...but getting a permit to legally own a firearm isn't one of my
beefs. It's really a simple process and as long as you are not a
convicted felon your application is generally approved. There's a bit
of a safety net for the public in the process though. It's up to the
local police chief to give final approval and to include any
restrictions. Handgun permits in MA is a "may" issue rather than a
"shall" issue. If an applicant is known by the police department to
have a history of violence, drug or alcohol abuse or other problems that
may not have lead to an arrest or conviction, the permit may be
disapproved. At least it can weed out some who probably shouldn't own
a gun.

===

All of that is a royal PITA and puts you at the whim of a local law
enforcement officer who may or may not be a reasonable person. If you
get a hard liner in your local PD who'd rather not be bothered by the
whole process, and/or wants to err only on the side of safety, they
might just refuse to issue any permits. It puts the cops into the
role of social scientists which they are ill suited for and opens up
the very real possibility for cronyism and corruption.

On 10/2/2015 9:07 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 2 Oct 2015 20:44:31 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 10/2/2015 7:28 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 2 Oct 2015 18:41:37 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

None of this is a big deal nor is it difficult or expensive.

===

If you don't mind living in an over regulated police state.

Personally I'd rather take my chances with a rare/occasional bad guy
than need a permit every time I turn around. In my opinion we are
already over regulated, especially in the north eastern population
centers where most of this springs from.



There is plenty of over regulation that I find annoying or frustrating
... the ban of some popular handguns up here due to the attorney general
and the safety testing labs confusing "certification" process is a good
example ...but getting a permit to legally own a firearm isn't one of my
beefs. It's really a simple process and as long as you are not a
convicted felon your application is generally approved. There's a bit
of a safety net for the public in the process though. It's up to the
local police chief to give final approval and to include any
restrictions. Handgun permits in MA is a "may" issue rather than a
"shall" issue. If an applicant is known by the police department to
have a history of violence, drug or alcohol abuse or other problems that
may not have lead to an arrest or conviction, the permit may be
disapproved. At least it can weed out some who probably shouldn't own
a gun.

===

All of that is a royal PITA and puts you at the whim of a local law
enforcement officer who may or may not be a reasonable person. If you
get a hard liner in your local PD who'd rather not be bothered by the
whole process, and/or wants to err only on the side of safety, they
might just refuse to issue any permits. It puts the cops into the
role of social scientists which they are ill suited for and opens up
the very real possibility for cronyism and corruption.



Doesn't work that way now-a-days. There was a time up here when the
local police chief could (and did) make it policy to deny virtually
all gun permits. It was that way back in the 1980's when I first
thought about getting a permit. I was talking to my lawyer about it
and he basically said, "Forget it". The policy of the chief in the town
I lived did not include issuance of gun permits.

But that changed due to lawsuits brought by several people in several
towns. The towns (and police) lost, due to the terms of the 2nd.

So, now the local police have to have a reason to refuse a permit.
They are still allowed some discretion ... and I think that is good.
If anyone is refused, they can always appeal or sue. Probably not
worth it if you have a reputation of violence or being a problem in
the community though.

On Fri, 2 Oct 2015 21:20:31 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

Doesn't work that way now-a-days. There was a time up here when the
local police chief could (and did) make it policy to deny virtually
all gun permits. It was that way back in the 1980's when I first
thought about getting a permit. I was talking to my lawyer about it
and he basically said, "Forget it". The policy of the chief in the town
I lived did not include issuance of gun permits.

That is the same way it works with "Form 4s" (ATF form for machine
guns and silencers) but there is a "trust" loophole that lets you get
around it.