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Wayne, prop guy?
On Sun, 6 Sep 2015 18:21:36 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote: On 9/6/2015 5:43 PM, wrote: On Sun, 6 Sep 2015 15:59:40 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: On 9/6/2015 1:09 PM, wrote: On Sun, 6 Sep 2015 12:53:42 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: Why is that? I have a storage locker full of regular bulbs and many CFL's that I am not going to use. I go get an appropriate LED instead. In some places I like using the dimmable "Daylight" color temperature. Great in the garages, etc. They are harder to find though. Most are the cooler "soft white". The problem with dimming LEDs and even CFL is they do not change color and the color shift is the biggest part of the ambience of dimming them. My wife is having that problem at work too. They have about 50 PAR38s in the dining room ant at dinner time they want bright white. After dinner they want that orange glow of a dimmed incandescent for dancing.. We don't do much dancing in the house, garage or shed. :-) I have CFLs or T-8 Fluorescent in the garage and the sheds but the lights around the pool are incandescent (15w sign bulbs) and we dim them most of the time. We dance there ;-) Most of the lights in and around the house are on motion detectors so lighting is pretty much lost in the noise on our electric bill. I put LED flood lights in the backyard area. We have a lot of landscaping stuff (plants and bushes) out there with a bricked circle and stone "sitting wall". Used to have a concrete table on it but I moved that out (wasn't easy ... damn thing weighed about 400lbs) and put a fire pit in it's place. The LED floods light up the circular area and the two granite stairs that lead up to it. Looks nice at night. The floods are 120vac powered, have a DC power supply internal to them that powers six LEDs (in series). A timer in the cabana controls them. Also use one of the LED floods to illuminate the flag on our flagpole at night. They work great and I am surprised at how bright they are. I have another but one of the LED's blew out, so none would work. I saved it for the five remaining LED's in it that I can use to replace any that burn out in the working floods. Here's a pic taken at night: http://i802.photobucket.com/albums/yy303/Eisboch/backyard.jpg === Nice, too bad about the winters. :-) |
Wayne, prop guy?
Wayne.B wrote:
On Sun, 06 Sep 2015 17:36:17 -0400, wrote: I think the dry 12 KVA transformer might be the way to go. You should be able to find a spot for it inside somewhere out of the weather. === To mount it inside would require rewiring the internal shore power circuits. Too big a hassel. Outside, you just run it inline with your shore power cables and make a few inlet adapters for the various kinds of euro connectors. You can get them in a NEMA 3R (weather tight) enclosure. Just stow it inside when you are not using it. It will still be a steel can. === I could probably make a weather proof box out of starboard that would be cheaper, more attractive and more durable. Starboard is great stuff and you can work it with ordinary tools. But starboard might not take dropping as well as steel. |
Wayne, prop guy?
On 9/6/2015 8:13 PM, True North wrote:
On Sunday, 6 September 2015 13:23:09 UTC-3, Mr. Luddite wrote: On 9/6/2015 10:36 AM, Justan Olphart wrote: On 9/6/2015 11:05 AM, John H. wrote: On Sun, 06 Sep 2015 10:53:02 -0400, Wayne.B wrote: On Sun, 06 Sep 2015 07:36:11 -0400, John H. wrote: On Sat, 05 Sep 2015 15:22:02 -0400, Wayne.B wrote: On Sat, 05 Sep 2015 13:06:28 -0400, wrote: On Sat, 05 Sep 2015 12:02:18 -0400, John H. wrote: On Sat, 05 Sep 2015 11:38:29 -0400, wrote: On Sat, 05 Sep 2015 10:01:50 -0400, Wayne.B wrote: On Sat, 05 Sep 2015 09:35:34 -0400, John H. wrote: On Sat, 05 Sep 2015 08:39:31 -0400, Wayne.B wrote: On Sat, 05 Sep 2015 08:02:45 -0400, John H. wrote: On Fri, 04 Sep 2015 23:20:10 -0400, Wayne.B wrote: On Fri, 04 Sep 2015 11:29:18 -0400, wrote: On Fri, 04 Sep 2015 08:36:24 -0400, Wayne.B wrote: It also looks like it would be a good short cut on the way north to Newfoundland and Labrador. Sounds "cold" ;-) === Yah but... ...what I'd really like to do is cross to Europe by way of Greenland, Iceland and Scotland. Crazy? Of course, and it will probably never happen. A few weeks in Labrador might cure me with any luck, and I've always wanted to cruise Nova Scotia. When you grow up in the lake effect snow belt of upstate NY the ice never totally leaves your blood stream. :-) I read a while back about a group crossing made by owners of some brand of boat that I can't remember right now (Nordic Tug?). Perhaps there are brand or club group crossings that you could latch onto? === You're probably thinking about the Nordhavn Trans Atlantic Rally in 2004. http://www.nordhavn.com/rally/voyage/welcome.htm I followed that event closely and have corresponded with several of the participants. We met one of them last summer up in the Chesapeake and had dinner with them at Solomons. They say it will probably never happen again, and if it does, it will start without them. That rally took the southern route: Lauderdale to Bermuda, Bermuda to the Azores, and Azores to Gibralter. They encountered some really nasty head seas on the last leg to Gibralter and there were a number of boats that developed mechanical problems. Nordhavn's are quite a different boat than ours. They have a very long fuel range, long enough to cross oceans without refueling. We do not. On the other hand we have twin engines, more speed, and a lot of other redundancy so there are offsetting factors to an extent. The northern route that I'm thinking about has much shorter legs, the longest being about 3 or 4 days, and well within our fuel range. The advantage there is that you can get fairly reliable weather information over 3 or 4 days. The disadvantage is that the water is cold, there are ice hazzards, fog, and frequent weather changes. Yup, that's the one I was thinking of. Didn't know what route they took. If I were in your shoes, I'd sure be looking for some company along the way. It sounds like it would be a great adventure. Actually, the year beating around Europe is what I found really appealing. You mentioned shipping the boat back. Could you ship it to Rotterdam? Or would it be more cost effective to rent a boat in Europe to do some cruising? Sounds like a great idea. === It's entirely possible to ship the boat both ways and a fair number of people do that. One of our local boats from this area has been in the Med all summer, mostly in southern Spain and offshore islands. They have professional crew and a large operating budget however. It costs about $40K each way but saves a lot of fuel plus wear and tear on the boat. There's something about making the crossing via Labrador, Greenland and Iceland that appeals to my sense of adventure however. Cruising around the Med sounds like fun. Just be careful on the South and East sides. If you cruised around all winter, you could hit the window on the way back ... as long as the trip over was fun. I'd want to fit in a trip to Rotterdam and then down the Rhein for a ways...maybe to Basel. Yup Europe by boat does sound like a very interesting trip. Sort of a Viking cruise where you get to decide where you go and how long you stay. It does beg the question, how would the electrical shore tie work at 220v 50HZ. You might need to buy a big assed transformer. I imagine most of the motors would tolerate the 50 hz but you need to read the nameplate rating. That "transformer" might need to be a VFD. (lighter but more expensive) === All of my battery chargers are rated for 50/60 so that is not a problem. What is an issue is 220 V non-center tapped. For that you need an isolation transformer rated at 12 KVA/50 Hz. You can pick them up on EBAY for a half reasonable price but you need to build a weather proof enclosure and install some Euro style inlet connectors. The isolation transformer also solves the GFI tripping issue which is common on some Euro docks. Could you not get by with a small generator? === Sure but most marinas will not allow you to run a generator for any length of time if shore power is available. We have two, a 20KW and a 15KW, both diesels of course. The problem is adapting Euro style shore power so that you don't need to run the generators. European power is typically 220 volt, 50 Hz, with no neutral connection. Most US boats are set up just like your house with two 120 volt legs that are 180 degrees out of phase with each other so that they add up to 220 volts for larger appliances. Most of our stuff will run on 50 HZ power but you need an center tapped isolation transformer to create the two 120 volt legs from a single 220. Maybe Luddite would loan you his small Honda. Quiet and will power a refrigerator and dozens of LED's. -- Ban idiots, not guns! LEDs are great. I saved a bundle by converting my house lighting to LED. My camper is all DC LED too. Been slowly doing the same thing in our house. As the incandescent or CFL bulbs go out I've been replacing them with LED. Still have a bunch to go though. Here I can call an Energy Efficiency organization and they will come to the house and change all my bulbs to LEDs free of charge. Up till early summer, it was the CFL they would use as replacements. Change out all five of them? |
Wayne, prop guy?
On 9/6/2015 6:58 PM, Wayne.B wrote:
On Sun, 6 Sep 2015 18:21:36 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: On 9/6/2015 5:43 PM, wrote: On Sun, 6 Sep 2015 15:59:40 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: On 9/6/2015 1:09 PM, wrote: On Sun, 6 Sep 2015 12:53:42 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: Why is that? I have a storage locker full of regular bulbs and many CFL's that I am not going to use. I go get an appropriate LED instead. In some places I like using the dimmable "Daylight" color temperature. Great in the garages, etc. They are harder to find though. Most are the cooler "soft white". The problem with dimming LEDs and even CFL is they do not change color and the color shift is the biggest part of the ambience of dimming them. My wife is having that problem at work too. They have about 50 PAR38s in the dining room ant at dinner time they want bright white. After dinner they want that orange glow of a dimmed incandescent for dancing.. We don't do much dancing in the house, garage or shed. :-) I have CFLs or T-8 Fluorescent in the garage and the sheds but the lights around the pool are incandescent (15w sign bulbs) and we dim them most of the time. We dance there ;-) Most of the lights in and around the house are on motion detectors so lighting is pretty much lost in the noise on our electric bill. I put LED flood lights in the backyard area. We have a lot of landscaping stuff (plants and bushes) out there with a bricked circle and stone "sitting wall". Used to have a concrete table on it but I moved that out (wasn't easy ... damn thing weighed about 400lbs) and put a fire pit in it's place. The LED floods light up the circular area and the two granite stairs that lead up to it. Looks nice at night. The floods are 120vac powered, have a DC power supply internal to them that powers six LEDs (in series). A timer in the cabana controls them. Also use one of the LED floods to illuminate the flag on our flagpole at night. They work great and I am surprised at how bright they are. I have another but one of the LED's blew out, so none would work. I saved it for the five remaining LED's in it that I can use to replace any that burn out in the working floods. Here's a pic taken at night: http://i802.photobucket.com/albums/yy303/Eisboch/backyard.jpg === Nice, too bad about the winters. :-) Yeah. Last winter was a bitch. It was fun watching those LED lights though. I forgot they were out there and under over 4 feet of snow you couldn't see them at night. Then slowly, as the snow started melting in April you could see weird bright areas in the snow at night. Only then did I remember the floodlights. They all survived. This has proven to be a tough house to sell. As an equestrian property it is more geared towards the hobbyist with pasture/turnout areas sized for 2, maybe 3 horses. Many of the potential buyers are looking for a place for 10 or more horses. Conversely, those who are looking for a place for a couple of horses become a bit overwhelmed (especially the women) with the house. At just under 8,000 square feet it scares them. Hard to find the right buyer and fit. We are currently awaiting word from one potential buyer who wants it badly but it was a bit out of his price range. We lowered the price significantly in hopes of not spending another winter here but don't want to go any lower. He is pulling out all the stops trying to get financing. Crossing our fingers that he succeeds. |
Wayne, prop guy?
On Sun, 06 Sep 2015 18:15:05 -0500, Califbill billnews wrote:
Wayne.B wrote: On Sun, 06 Sep 2015 17:36:17 -0400, wrote: I think the dry 12 KVA transformer might be the way to go. You should be able to find a spot for it inside somewhere out of the weather. === To mount it inside would require rewiring the internal shore power circuits. Too big a hassel. Outside, you just run it inline with your shore power cables and make a few inlet adapters for the various kinds of euro connectors. You can get them in a NEMA 3R (weather tight) enclosure. Just stow it inside when you are not using it. It will still be a steel can. === I could probably make a weather proof box out of starboard that would be cheaper, more attractive and more durable. Starboard is great stuff and you can work it with ordinary tools. But starboard might not take dropping as well as steel. === Perhaps but a galvanized steel NEMA box will turn into a rust bucket in no time at all around salt water. I once priced out stainless NEMA boxes and they go for mucho dinero. Some of the reinforced plastic boxes seem OK but I haven't seen any big enough for a 12 KVA transformer. |
Wayne, prop guy?
On Sun, 6 Sep 2015 19:20:10 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote: This has proven to be a tough house to sell. === Tell you what, I'll lend you my house for two months in the winter if you'll lend me yours for two months in the summer. Ours is quite a bit smaller than yours but it's a *lot* larger than a boat or RV. I might even throw in use of the Searay if you cover maintenance and insurance. I don't think we'd like to care for horses however although I wouldn't mind riding one if they need exercise. |
Wayne, prop guy?
On Sun, 6 Sep 2015 18:21:36 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote: On 9/6/2015 5:43 PM, wrote: On Sun, 6 Sep 2015 15:59:40 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: On 9/6/2015 1:09 PM, wrote: On Sun, 6 Sep 2015 12:53:42 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: Why is that? I have a storage locker full of regular bulbs and many CFL's that I am not going to use. I go get an appropriate LED instead. In some places I like using the dimmable "Daylight" color temperature. Great in the garages, etc. They are harder to find though. Most are the cooler "soft white". The problem with dimming LEDs and even CFL is they do not change color and the color shift is the biggest part of the ambience of dimming them. My wife is having that problem at work too. They have about 50 PAR38s in the dining room ant at dinner time they want bright white. After dinner they want that orange glow of a dimmed incandescent for dancing.. We don't do much dancing in the house, garage or shed. :-) I have CFLs or T-8 Fluorescent in the garage and the sheds but the lights around the pool are incandescent (15w sign bulbs) and we dim them most of the time. We dance there ;-) Most of the lights in and around the house are on motion detectors so lighting is pretty much lost in the noise on our electric bill. I put LED flood lights in the backyard area. We have a lot of landscaping stuff (plants and bushes) out there with a bricked circle and stone "sitting wall". Used to have a concrete table on it but I moved that out (wasn't easy ... damn thing weighed about 400lbs) and put a fire pit in it's place. The LED floods light up the circular area and the two granite stairs that lead up to it. Looks nice at night. The floods are 120vac powered, have a DC power supply internal to them that powers six LEDs (in series). A timer in the cabana controls them. Also use one of the LED floods to illuminate the flag on our flagpole at night. They work great and I am surprised at how bright they are. I have another but one of the LED's blew out, so none would work. I saved it for the five remaining LED's in it that I can use to replace any that burn out in the working floods. Here's a pic taken at night: http://i802.photobucket.com/albums/yy303/Eisboch/backyard.jpg We have pretty much banned flood lights here. I have a 2 lamp par38 fixture over the pool that we never turn on and there is still one out back but I have the motion detector cranked down so far that it only comes on if you jump up and down in front of it. The lights that do come on when you walk around are very low level lighting. It is enough to see your way around at night but you don't need your sunglasses. |
Wayne, prop guy?
On Sunday, 6 September 2015 13:23:09 UTC-3, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 9/6/2015 10:36 AM, Justan Olphart wrote: On 9/6/2015 11:05 AM, John H. wrote: On Sun, 06 Sep 2015 10:53:02 -0400, Wayne.B wrote: On Sun, 06 Sep 2015 07:36:11 -0400, John H. wrote: On Sat, 05 Sep 2015 15:22:02 -0400, Wayne.B wrote: On Sat, 05 Sep 2015 13:06:28 -0400, wrote: On Sat, 05 Sep 2015 12:02:18 -0400, John H. wrote: On Sat, 05 Sep 2015 11:38:29 -0400, wrote: On Sat, 05 Sep 2015 10:01:50 -0400, Wayne.B wrote: On Sat, 05 Sep 2015 09:35:34 -0400, John H. wrote: On Sat, 05 Sep 2015 08:39:31 -0400, Wayne.B wrote: On Sat, 05 Sep 2015 08:02:45 -0400, John H. wrote: On Fri, 04 Sep 2015 23:20:10 -0400, Wayne.B wrote: On Fri, 04 Sep 2015 11:29:18 -0400, wrote: On Fri, 04 Sep 2015 08:36:24 -0400, Wayne.B wrote: It also looks like it would be a good short cut on the way north to Newfoundland and Labrador. Sounds "cold" ;-) === Yah but... ...what I'd really like to do is cross to Europe by way of Greenland, Iceland and Scotland. Crazy? Of course, and it will probably never happen. A few weeks in Labrador might cure me with any luck, and I've always wanted to cruise Nova Scotia. When you grow up in the lake effect snow belt of upstate NY the ice never totally leaves your blood stream. :-) I read a while back about a group crossing made by owners of some brand of boat that I can't remember right now (Nordic Tug?). Perhaps there are brand or club group crossings that you could latch onto? === You're probably thinking about the Nordhavn Trans Atlantic Rally in 2004. http://www.nordhavn.com/rally/voyage/welcome.htm I followed that event closely and have corresponded with several of the participants. We met one of them last summer up in the Chesapeake and had dinner with them at Solomons. They say it will probably never happen again, and if it does, it will start without them. That rally took the southern route: Lauderdale to Bermuda, Bermuda to the Azores, and Azores to Gibralter. They encountered some really nasty head seas on the last leg to Gibralter and there were a number of boats that developed mechanical problems. Nordhavn's are quite a different boat than ours. They have a very long fuel range, long enough to cross oceans without refueling. We do not. On the other hand we have twin engines, more speed, and a lot of other redundancy so there are offsetting factors to an extent. The northern route that I'm thinking about has much shorter legs, the longest being about 3 or 4 days, and well within our fuel range. The advantage there is that you can get fairly reliable weather information over 3 or 4 days. The disadvantage is that the water is cold, there are ice hazzards, fog, and frequent weather changes. Yup, that's the one I was thinking of. Didn't know what route they took. If I were in your shoes, I'd sure be looking for some company along the way. It sounds like it would be a great adventure. Actually, the year beating around Europe is what I found really appealing. You mentioned shipping the boat back. Could you ship it to Rotterdam? Or would it be more cost effective to rent a boat in Europe to do some cruising? Sounds like a great idea. === It's entirely possible to ship the boat both ways and a fair number of people do that. One of our local boats from this area has been in the Med all summer, mostly in southern Spain and offshore islands. They have professional crew and a large operating budget however. It costs about $40K each way but saves a lot of fuel plus wear and tear on the boat. There's something about making the crossing via Labrador, Greenland and Iceland that appeals to my sense of adventure however. Cruising around the Med sounds like fun. Just be careful on the South and East sides. If you cruised around all winter, you could hit the window on the way back ... as long as the trip over was fun. I'd want to fit in a trip to Rotterdam and then down the Rhein for a ways...maybe to Basel. Yup Europe by boat does sound like a very interesting trip. Sort of a Viking cruise where you get to decide where you go and how long you stay. It does beg the question, how would the electrical shore tie work at 220v 50HZ. You might need to buy a big assed transformer. I imagine most of the motors would tolerate the 50 hz but you need to read the nameplate rating. That "transformer" might need to be a VFD. (lighter but more expensive) === All of my battery chargers are rated for 50/60 so that is not a problem. What is an issue is 220 V non-center tapped. For that you need an isolation transformer rated at 12 KVA/50 Hz. You can pick them up on EBAY for a half reasonable price but you need to build a weather proof enclosure and install some Euro style inlet connectors. The isolation transformer also solves the GFI tripping issue which is common on some Euro docks. Could you not get by with a small generator? === Sure but most marinas will not allow you to run a generator for any length of time if shore power is available. We have two, a 20KW and a 15KW, both diesels of course. The problem is adapting Euro style shore power so that you don't need to run the generators. European power is typically 220 volt, 50 Hz, with no neutral connection. Most US boats are set up just like your house with two 120 volt legs that are 180 degrees out of phase with each other so that they add up to 220 volts for larger appliances. Most of our stuff will run on 50 HZ power but you need an center tapped isolation transformer to create the two 120 volt legs from a single 220. Maybe Luddite would loan you his small Honda. Quiet and will power a refrigerator and dozens of LED's. -- Ban idiots, not guns! LEDs are great. I saved a bundle by converting my house lighting to LED. My camper is all DC LED too. Been slowly doing the same thing in our house. As the incandescent or CFL bulbs go out I've been replacing them with LED. Still have a bunch to go though. Here I can call an Energy Efficiency organization and they will come to the house and change all my bulbs to LEDs free of charge. Up till early summer, it was the CFL they would use as replacements. |
Wayne, prop guy?
On Sun, 06 Sep 2015 18:24:18 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote: On Sun, 06 Sep 2015 17:36:17 -0400, wrote: I think the dry 12 KVA transformer might be the way to go. You should be able to find a spot for it inside somewhere out of the weather. === To mount it inside would require rewiring the internal shore power circuits. Too big a hassel. Outside, you just run it inline with your shore power cables and make a few inlet adapters for the various kinds of euro connectors. You can get them in a NEMA 3R (weather tight) enclosure. Just stow it inside when you are not using it. It will still be a steel can. === I could probably make a weather proof box out of starboard that would be cheaper, more attractive and more durable. Starboard is great stuff and you can work it with ordinary tools. Someone told me Home Depot has or can order star board and it is cheaper than the marine guys but I bet Shoreline might have it too. I will be there Tuesday after water for some other stuff I will ask. |
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