On 7/23/2015 3:29 PM, Keyser Söze wrote:
On 7/23/15 3:22 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 23 Jul 2015 11:36:31 -0500, Califbill billnews wrote:


If you set up a building trades table at career day, you would be a
pretty lonely guy.

That must be why there is a waiting list in most of the skilled trades
nationwide to get into union-contractor apprenticeship programs.


Slackers all, looking for handouts.

--

Respectfully submitted by Justan

Laugh of the day from Krause

"I'm not to blame anymore for the atmosphere in here.
I've been "born again" as a nice guy."

On 7/23/15 4:58 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 23 Jul 2015 15:54:31 -0400, Justan Olphat
wrote:

On 7/23/2015 3:29 PM, Keyser Söze wrote:
On 7/23/15 3:22 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 23 Jul 2015 11:36:31 -0500, Califbill billnews wrote:


If you set up a building trades table at career day, you would be a
pretty lonely guy.

That must be why there is a waiting list in most of the skilled trades
nationwide to get into union-contractor apprenticeship programs.


Slackers all, looking for handouts.

Union apprenticeship programs are really designed to limit the number
of people coming into the trade and they have a very limited number of
slots.


Not for the reasons you think you know.

On 7/23/15 5:47 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 23 Jul 2015 17:19:20 -0400, Keyser Söze
wrote:

On 7/23/15 4:58 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 23 Jul 2015 15:54:31 -0400, Justan Olphat
wrote:

On 7/23/2015 3:29 PM, Keyser Söze wrote:
On 7/23/15 3:22 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 23 Jul 2015 11:36:31 -0500, Califbill billnews wrote:


If you set up a building trades table at career day, you would be a
pretty lonely guy.

That must be why there is a waiting list in most of the skilled trades
nationwide to get into union-contractor apprenticeship programs.


Slackers all, looking for handouts.

Union apprenticeship programs are really designed to limit the number
of people coming into the trade and they have a very limited number of
slots.


Not for the reasons you think you know.

That is certainly not what they say but if they really wanted more
people in the trade, they would have more slots. It is like the AMAS,
they bitch about the lack of doctors, then do everything they can to
limit the number who can be there.

The industry that should be limiting the numbers are lawyers and we
crank out 100,000 more every year



Adding "more slots" requires spending millions more on facilities,
training trainers, paying trainers, and much more. It takes three to
five years to properly train in the classroom and on the job a qualified
journeyman or woman. You apparently think the training is done via some
sort of rump group on the job site before work begins each morning.
Well, maybe that works for stick builders in your part of Florida, eh?

On 7/23/2015 6:47 PM, Keyser Söze wrote:
On 7/23/15 5:47 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 23 Jul 2015 17:19:20 -0400, Keyser Söze
wrote:

On 7/23/15 4:58 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 23 Jul 2015 15:54:31 -0400, Justan Olphat
wrote:

On 7/23/2015 3:29 PM, Keyser Söze wrote:
On 7/23/15 3:22 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 23 Jul 2015 11:36:31 -0500, Califbill billnews wrote:


If you set up a building trades table at career day, you would be a
pretty lonely guy.

That must be why there is a waiting list in most of the skilled
trades
nationwide to get into union-contractor apprenticeship programs.


Slackers all, looking for handouts.

Union apprenticeship programs are really designed to limit the number
of people coming into the trade and they have a very limited number of
slots.


Not for the reasons you think you know.

That is certainly not what they say but if they really wanted more
people in the trade, they would have more slots. It is like the AMAS,
they bitch about the lack of doctors, then do everything they can to
limit the number who can be there.

The industry that should be limiting the numbers are lawyers and we
crank out 100,000 more every year



Adding "more slots" requires spending millions more on facilities,
training trainers, paying trainers, and much more. It takes three to
five years to properly train in the classroom and on the job a qualified
journeyman or woman. You apparently think the training is done via some
sort of rump group on the job site before work begins each morning.
Well, maybe that works for stick builders in your part of Florida, eh?


Slow learners, huh?

On 7/23/15 6:57 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 7/23/2015 6:47 PM, Keyser Söze wrote:
On 7/23/15 5:47 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 23 Jul 2015 17:19:20 -0400, Keyser Söze
wrote:

On 7/23/15 4:58 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 23 Jul 2015 15:54:31 -0400, Justan Olphat
wrote:

On 7/23/2015 3:29 PM, Keyser Söze wrote:
On 7/23/15 3:22 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 23 Jul 2015 11:36:31 -0500, Califbill billnews wrote:


If you set up a building trades table at career day, you would be a
pretty lonely guy.

That must be why there is a waiting list in most of the skilled
trades
nationwide to get into union-contractor apprenticeship programs.


Slackers all, looking for handouts.

Union apprenticeship programs are really designed to limit the number
of people coming into the trade and they have a very limited number of
slots.


Not for the reasons you think you know.

That is certainly not what they say but if they really wanted more
people in the trade, they would have more slots. It is like the AMAS,
they bitch about the lack of doctors, then do everything they can to
limit the number who can be there.

The industry that should be limiting the numbers are lawyers and we
crank out 100,000 more every year



Adding "more slots" requires spending millions more on facilities,
training trainers, paying trainers, and much more. It takes three to
five years to properly train in the classroom and on the job a qualified
journeyman or woman. You apparently think the training is done via some
sort of rump group on the job site before work begins each morning.
Well, maybe that works for stick builders in your part of Florida, eh?


Slow learners, huh?



It's always a grin to watch the plutocrats and wannabes put down the
difficulties involved in learning how to be a competent building
tradesman who works on large commercial buildings. I doubt anyone here
could learn or pass the specialty welding requirements involved, for
example, in a pharma plant, or a nuclear plant, or the chemistry
requirements involved in high strength cold weather mortar mixing or
coloration for bricklaying, or the building, running and maintenance of
a large-scale power plant. These workers aren't nailing together 2x4's
to build the wall frames of a stick built house, or using glue to
assembly plumbing pipe.

wrote:
On Thu, 23 Jul 2015 19:15:57 -0400, Keyser Söze
wrote:

On 7/23/15 6:57 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 7/23/2015 6:47 PM, Keyser Söze wrote:
On 7/23/15 5:47 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 23 Jul 2015 17:19:20 -0400, Keyser Söze
wrote:

On 7/23/15 4:58 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 23 Jul 2015 15:54:31 -0400, Justan Olphat
wrote:

On 7/23/2015 3:29 PM, Keyser Söze wrote:
On 7/23/15 3:22 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 23 Jul 2015 11:36:31 -0500, Califbill billnews wrote:


If you set up a building trades table at career day, you would be a
pretty lonely guy.

That must be why there is a waiting list in most of the skilled
trades
nationwide to get into union-contractor apprenticeship programs.


Slackers all, looking for handouts.

Union apprenticeship programs are really designed to limit the number
of people coming into the trade and they have a very limited number of
slots.


Not for the reasons you think you know.

That is certainly not what they say but if they really wanted more
people in the trade, they would have more slots. It is like the AMAS,
they bitch about the lack of doctors, then do everything they can to
limit the number who can be there.

The industry that should be limiting the numbers are lawyers and we
crank out 100,000 more every year



Adding "more slots" requires spending millions more on facilities,
training trainers, paying trainers, and much more. It takes three to
five years to properly train in the classroom and on the job a qualified
journeyman or woman. You apparently think the training is done via some
sort of rump group on the job site before work begins each morning.
Well, maybe that works for stick builders in your part of Florida, eh?


Slow learners, huh?



It's always a grin to watch the plutocrats and wannabes put down the
difficulties involved in learning how to be a competent building
tradesman who works on large commercial buildings. I doubt anyone here
could learn or pass the specialty welding requirements involved, for
example, in a pharma plant, or a nuclear plant, or the chemistry
requirements involved in high strength cold weather mortar mixing or
coloration for bricklaying, or the building, running and maintenance of
a large-scale power plant. These workers aren't nailing together 2x4's
to build the wall frames of a stick built house, or using glue to
assembly plumbing pipe.


But most of the construction is not in nuclear plants and most
commercial buildings are not welded together.
Most construction guys build houses or low rise commercial that uses
the same techniques.



I am IAEI, ICBO and ICC certified in commercial electric along with a
Florida license. I do know what is involved.

They have even changed the code to allow "glued" plastic pipe and
Romex in commercial in most states.

Yes, well I am sure everything you know about construction can be taught in
one afternoon course at the local JuCo, right? Or perhaps via a popup book.
😀 Who needs apprenticeship programs?
--
Sent from my iPhone 6+

On Fri, 24 Jul 2015 02:11:36 -0400, wrote:

I know the unions hate the idea of snap together conduit and
preassembled electrical boxes but that is the way the industry is
going. Plumbers are not packing cast iron drain pipe joints with Oakum
and lead and roof trusses come in on trucks from factories instead of
framing rafters with hand cut lumber. It may be sad that we are losing
some of those skills but we are also losing the skill of using a
typewriter, operating a slide rule and navigating with a sextant.
It is not the 20th century anymore.

===

Well said.

Greg, you left out the vanishing art of Morse Code, shorthand, and manual writing in general,

On 7/23/15 8:12 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 23 Jul 2015 18:57:37 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:


Adding "more slots" requires spending millions more on facilities,
training trainers, paying trainers, and much more. It takes three to
five years to properly train in the classroom and on the job a qualified
journeyman or woman. You apparently think the training is done via some
sort of rump group on the job site before work begins each morning.
Well, maybe that works for stick builders in your part of Florida, eh?


Slow learners, huh?


No just that throttling I was talking about.

A lot of guys will just go get a "helper" job for a contractor and be
ready to sit for the journeyman exam in a year or two if they are
willing to do some book work at night.

We had a little study group on the old Prodigy BBs and several of us
got our inspector certifications for free. Fortunately one of the guys
was Joe Tedesco, a road warrior for IAEI and he pitched us his whole
road show, along with practice questions and assignments. All of us
smoked the IAEI tests and I also knocked out the ICBO and SBCCI
(residential, commercial and plan review)
I was standing in the parking lot in 45 minutes on the 3 hour
residential SBCCI test (100 questions) but it was the 3d time I had
taken that same basic test in less than a year. ;-)

Other guys got their contractors licenses or became inspectors, two
did both.

Old Joe was a "Bastin" guy from up in your neck of the woods.


None of that has anything to do with being able to weld the piping for a
pharma manufacturing facility, as just one example.

On 7/23/2015 8:15 PM, Keyser Söze wrote:
On 7/23/15 8:12 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 23 Jul 2015 18:57:37 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:


Adding "more slots" requires spending millions more on facilities,
training trainers, paying trainers, and much more. It takes three to
five years to properly train in the classroom and on the job a
qualified
journeyman or woman. You apparently think the training is done via some
sort of rump group on the job site before work begins each morning.
Well, maybe that works for stick builders in your part of Florida, eh?


Slow learners, huh?


No just that throttling I was talking about.

A lot of guys will just go get a "helper" job for a contractor and be
ready to sit for the journeyman exam in a year or two if they are
willing to do some book work at night.

We had a little study group on the old Prodigy BBs and several of us
got our inspector certifications for free. Fortunately one of the guys
was Joe Tedesco, a road warrior for IAEI and he pitched us his whole
road show, along with practice questions and assignments. All of us
smoked the IAEI tests and I also knocked out the ICBO and SBCCI
(residential, commercial and plan review)
I was standing in the parking lot in 45 minutes on the 3 hour
residential SBCCI test (100 questions) but it was the 3d time I had
taken that same basic test in less than a year. ;-)

Other guys got their contractors licenses or became inspectors, two
did both.

Old Joe was a "Bastin" guy from up in your neck of the woods.


None of that has anything to do with being able to weld the piping for a
pharma manufacturing facility, as just one example.


Harry, there are many ways in which one can become certified at
different levels of welding, including a nuclear certification.
Same holds true for boiler makers, pipe fitters, electricians,
carpenters, plumbers and virtually all trades at all levels.
You don't have to be union to become certified or licensed.