On 7/14/2015 10:46 AM, Wayne.B wrote:
On Tue, 14 Jul 2015 10:36:04 -0400, John H.
wrote:

On Tue, 14 Jul 2015 07:35:00 -0400, Wayne.B wrote:


Previously uncharted reef in Artic Ocean may be to blame.

http://gcaptain.com/shell-icebreaker-msv-fennica-damaged-in-alaska-report/#.VaTydPkuPOo


================================================

We now return you to the Harry Krause political crap programming.

When I think of a shoal, I think of sand or gravel. Not something that would put a
gash in an icebreaker's hull.

Weird. Wonder if it might have scraped a metal protrusion on a pier.

===

The original news article said "uncharted reef." A reef can be coral,
rock, oyster shells or whatever. In Maine they call them ledges and
are usually rock. In Florida they are usually sand, mud or oysters
and are usually called bars or banks.

The guys who originally explored Florida Bay north of the Keys had an
interesting sense of humor. There is one shoal called First National
Bank. It is fairly close to a small island called Dildo Key. :-)



Thankfully the ones encountered on the ICW from the Carolinas' downward
are nice soft sand. Don't ask how I know. There's one place though
.... called "the Rock Pile" ... where you have to be very careful. When
we went through heading south there was a beautiful 50 something foot
Sportsfish up on the bank with a huge hole in it's hull.

On 7/14/15 11:05 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 7/14/2015 10:46 AM, Wayne.B wrote:
On Tue, 14 Jul 2015 10:36:04 -0400, John H.
wrote:

On Tue, 14 Jul 2015 07:35:00 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote:


Previously uncharted reef in Artic Ocean may be to blame.

http://gcaptain.com/shell-icebreaker-msv-fennica-damaged-in-alaska-report/#.VaTydPkuPOo



================================================

We now return you to the Harry Krause political crap programming.

When I think of a shoal, I think of sand or gravel. Not something
that would put a
gash in an icebreaker's hull.

Weird. Wonder if it might have scraped a metal protrusion on a pier.

===

The original news article said "uncharted reef." A reef can be coral,
rock, oyster shells or whatever. In Maine they call them ledges and
are usually rock. In Florida they are usually sand, mud or oysters
and are usually called bars or banks.

The guys who originally explored Florida Bay north of the Keys had an
interesting sense of humor. There is one shoal called First National
Bank. It is fairly close to a small island called Dildo Key. :-)



Thankfully the ones encountered on the ICW from the Carolinas' downward
are nice soft sand. Don't ask how I know. There's one place though
... called "the Rock Pile" ... where you have to be very careful. When
we went through heading south there was a beautiful 50 something foot
Sportsfish up on the bank with a huge hole in it's hull.


There's a nifty tombolo in the area in Connecticut where we used to race
BlueJays when I was a kid. Once in a while, a newbie to the area would
smack his boat into it at half tide. Perhaps W'hine will similarly find
it someday.

On 7/14/15 11:08 AM, wrote:
On Tue, 14 Jul 2015 10:36:04 -0400, John H.
wrote:

On Tue, 14 Jul 2015 07:35:00 -0400, Wayne.B wrote:


Previously uncharted reef in Artic Ocean may be to blame.

http://gcaptain.com/shell-icebreaker-msv-fennica-damaged-in-alaska-report/#.VaTydPkuPOo


================================================

We now return you to the Harry Krause political crap programming.

When I think of a shoal, I think of sand or gravel. Not something that would put a
gash in an icebreaker's hull.

Weird. Wonder if it might have scraped a metal protrusion on a pier.

I didn't see much sand in Alaska. The beaches seem to be volcanic
rock, rounded by the surf. It is that black stuff you see around
gardens and such in the lower 48. I saw a lot of the same rock in New
Zealand
They also have regular old granite looking stuff.
http://gfretwell.com/ftp/alaska/Denali%20trail.jpg

Ice Breakers is a part of the CG that I had absolutely zero interest
in but I still ended up in some pretty cold water in the North
Atlantic. Fortunately we also went south occasionally ;-)


I appreciate the fact that you helped defend our coastlines from those
North Vietnamese submarines...

On 7/14/15 11:46 AM, wrote:
On Tue, 14 Jul 2015 11:05:38 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:




Thankfully the ones encountered on the ICW from the Carolinas' downward
are nice soft sand. Don't ask how I know. There's one place though
... called "the Rock Pile" ... where you have to be very careful. When
we went through heading south there was a beautiful 50 something foot
Sportsfish up on the bank with a huge hole in it's hull.

That is true until you get to the keys. Then you start seeing those
coral heads that may be a couple feet underwater. They will do a job
on shafts struts and wheels.
Up in Alaska it seems everything is rock of some kind. Tin boats and
jet drives are very popular.


I've often wondered how much bottom abuse those alum boats can take.

On 7/14/2015 11:50 AM, Keyser Söze wrote:
On 7/14/15 11:46 AM, wrote:
On Tue, 14 Jul 2015 11:05:38 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:




Thankfully the ones encountered on the ICW from the Carolinas' downward
are nice soft sand. Don't ask how I know. There's one place though
... called "the Rock Pile" ... where you have to be very careful. When
we went through heading south there was a beautiful 50 something foot
Sportsfish up on the bank with a huge hole in it's hull.

That is true until you get to the keys. Then you start seeing those
coral heads that may be a couple feet underwater. They will do a job
on shafts struts and wheels.
Up in Alaska it seems everything is rock of some kind. Tin boats and
jet drives are very popular.


I've often wondered how much bottom abuse those alum boats can take.


I doubt they can take much. Hull is pretty thin. I think the idea is
that they are much easier to repair than an inch thick fiberglass hull.

Keyser Söze wrote:
On 7/14/15 11:46 AM, wrote:
On Tue, 14 Jul 2015 11:05:38 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:




Thankfully the ones encountered on the ICW from the Carolinas' downward
are nice soft sand. Don't ask how I know. There's one place though
... called "the Rock Pile" ... where you have to be very careful. When
we went through heading south there was a beautiful 50 something foot
Sportsfish up on the bank with a huge hole in it's hull.

That is true until you get to the keys. Then you start seeing those
coral heads that may be a couple feet underwater. They will do a job
on shafts struts and wheels.
Up in Alaska it seems everything is rock of some kind. Tin boats and
jet drives are very popular.


I've often wondered how much bottom abuse those alum boats can take.

Depends on the boat. Mine is 3/16 bottom, and does have some dents. The
bigger boats are 1/4" and take lots of abuse. Worse is like in the Rogue
River, as the rock shelves are sharp, so slice the boat.

Keyser Söze wrote:
On 7/14/15 11:05 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 7/14/2015 10:46 AM, Wayne.B wrote:
On Tue, 14 Jul 2015 10:36:04 -0400, John H.
wrote:

On Tue, 14 Jul 2015 07:35:00 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote:


Previously uncharted reef in Artic Ocean may be to blame.

http://gcaptain.com/shell-icebreaker-msv-fennica-damaged-in-alaska-report/#.VaTydPkuPOo



================================================

We now return you to the Harry Krause political crap programming.

When I think of a shoal, I think of sand or gravel. Not something
that would put a
gash in an icebreaker's hull.

Weird. Wonder if it might have scraped a metal protrusion on a pier.

===

The original news article said "uncharted reef." A reef can be coral,
rock, oyster shells or whatever. In Maine they call them ledges and
are usually rock. In Florida they are usually sand, mud or oysters
and are usually called bars or banks.

The guys who originally explored Florida Bay north of the Keys had an
interesting sense of humor. There is one shoal called First National
Bank. It is fairly close to a small island called Dildo Key. :-)



Thankfully the ones encountered on the ICW from the Carolinas' downward
are nice soft sand. Don't ask how I know. There's one place though
... called "the Rock Pile" ... where you have to be very careful. When
we went through heading south there was a beautiful 50 something foot
Sportsfish up on the bank with a huge hole in it's hull.


There's a nifty tombolo in the area in Connecticut where we used to race
BlueJays when I was a kid. Once in a while, a newbie to the area would
smack his boat into it at half tide. Perhaps W'hine will similarly find it someday.

Just got back from boating East coast Vancouver Island. Heard of at least
2 boats connecting with rocks while monitoring the VHF. At least one
total. There were lots of shoals and rocks around the islands. Luckily I
draw about 12" so not as endangered.

wrote:
On Tue, 14 Jul 2015 10:36:04 -0400, John H.
wrote:

On Tue, 14 Jul 2015 07:35:00 -0400, Wayne.B wrote:


Previously uncharted reef in Artic Ocean may be to blame.

http://gcaptain.com/shell-icebreaker-msv-fennica-damaged-in-alaska-report/#.VaTydPkuPOo


================================================

We now return you to the Harry Krause political crap programming.

When I think of a shoal, I think of sand or gravel. Not something that would put a
gash in an icebreaker's hull.

Weird. Wonder if it might have scraped a metal protrusion on a pier.

I didn't see much sand in Alaska. The beaches seem to be volcanic
rock, rounded by the surf. It is that black stuff you see around
gardens and such in the lower 48. I saw a lot of the same rock in New
Zealand
They also have regular old granite looking stuff.
http://gfretwell.com/ftp/alaska/Denali%20trail.jpg

Ice Breakers is a part of the CG that I had absolutely zero interest
in but I still ended up in some pretty cold water in the North
Atlantic. Fortunately we also went south occasionally ;-)

My neighbors in the early 70's kids joined the CG. Ended up on icebreaker.
Said using steam hoses to melt ice was interesting. Not fun. Would end
up with huge amounts of ice on the rails.

wrote:
On Tue, 14 Jul 2015 13:48:03 -0500, Califbill billnews wrote:

wrote:
On Tue, 14 Jul 2015 10:36:04 -0400, John H.
wrote:

On Tue, 14 Jul 2015 07:35:00 -0400, Wayne.B wrote:


Previously uncharted reef in Artic Ocean may be to blame.

http://gcaptain.com/shell-icebreaker-msv-fennica-damaged-in-alaska-report/#.VaTydPkuPOo


================================================

We now return you to the Harry Krause political crap programming.

When I think of a shoal, I think of sand or gravel. Not something that would put a
gash in an icebreaker's hull.

Weird. Wonder if it might have scraped a metal protrusion on a pier.

I didn't see much sand in Alaska. The beaches seem to be volcanic
rock, rounded by the surf. It is that black stuff you see around
gardens and such in the lower 48. I saw a lot of the same rock in New
Zealand
They also have regular old granite looking stuff.
http://gfretwell.com/ftp/alaska/Denali%20trail.jpg

Ice Breakers is a part of the CG that I had absolutely zero interest
in but I still ended up in some pretty cold water in the North
Atlantic. Fortunately we also went south occasionally ;-)

My neighbors in the early 70's kids joined the CG. Ended up on icebreaker.
Said using steam hoses to melt ice was interesting. Not fun. Would end
up with huge amounts of ice on the rails.

We chipped a bit of ice in the North Atlantic. We were using chipping
hammers. It was mostly to clear the ladders and ordinance but there
was a little concern about being top heavy. That was mostly unfounded
from what the old timers said. We were running the heat pretty good so
most of the ship was clear but you did accumulate a lot of ice on
things like ladders that stand away from the hull and superstructure.
They cleared the "tubs" just to deal with ice that might fall on the
decks and kill someone walking under it. Usually one good whack from
above and the whole thing would fall.

I met a guy years ago who worked the King Crab boats. He said the last
trip he would ever go on, they had 18" of ice on 1" stainless rails. They
were listing 40 degrees, and dumped the crab pots. They never saw their
sister ship again. I guess 0 degree or less temps and very high winds are
deadly.

wrote:
On Tue, 14 Jul 2015 13:48:03 -0500, Califbill billnews wrote:

Keyser Söze wrote:
On 7/14/15 11:46 AM, wrote:
On Tue, 14 Jul 2015 11:05:38 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:




Thankfully the ones encountered on the ICW from the Carolinas' downward
are nice soft sand. Don't ask how I know. There's one place though
... called "the Rock Pile" ... where you have to be very careful. When
we went through heading south there was a beautiful 50 something foot
Sportsfish up on the bank with a huge hole in it's hull.

That is true until you get to the keys. Then you start seeing those
coral heads that may be a couple feet underwater. They will do a job
on shafts struts and wheels.
Up in Alaska it seems everything is rock of some kind. Tin boats and
jet drives are very popular.


I've often wondered how much bottom abuse those alum boats can take.

Depends on the boat. Mine is 3/16 bottom, and does have some dents. The
bigger boats are 1/4" and take lots of abuse. Worse is like in the Rogue
River, as the rock shelves are sharp, so slice the boat.

That is even thicker than I was guessing by tapping on the hull. I
know it was a real heavy tin boat.

Some of the boats that run really shallow, nasty waters add a steel plate
to part of the bottom. Some add UHMW sheets.