On 10/2/14 6:41 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 02 Oct 2014 16:36:16 -0400, F*O*A*D wrote:

On 10/2/14 4:16 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 02 Oct 2014 14:55:25 -0400, F*O*A*D wrote:

On 10/2/14 2:49 PM, wrote:

Who said anything about ME measuring anything except the insanities
brought by the unions. We were talking about 3d party testing of the
students.


At least you are consistent in your obvious *and* subtle arguments to
turn workers into "at will" serfs, under the total domination of
"corporations uber alles," and by corporations I mean employers.

Does that jerky knee bother you in the car? I bet you have dents in
the dash ;-)

What does any of this have to do with "corporations". These are
government schools.

If you actually looked at what I said in the parts you clipped I said
teachers should be paid for performance, not simply time in grade.
I understand that goes against the union mentality but we can see the
result.
It is not a measure of the average of the class. Performance should be
weighted by the improvement of each student.
I also think we should be throwing more money at the teachers who have
the toughest teachers as long as they are improving.

A big problem is the ignorant thugs. If we single them out for
additional discipline or even extra academic attention, you bump up
against the fact that they may screw up the "diversity" numbers.
Montgomery County had that problem


I defined corporations as employers. You don't think many large school
systems are operated just as ****-poorly as, say, Verizon or Comcast?
Corporate mindset.


The difference is, if I think Comcast is incompetent and I do, I
don't have to pay them. I have a satellite dish.
We pay for the public schools whether they perform or not so there is
far less incentive to improve. The teacher's union further impedes any
effort they attempt.
As I showed you before, our school board is 80% education community
apparachiks anyway so there is not much actual management vs labor
going on anyway.

How do you honestly pay teachers for "performance" when there are so
many outside factors and pressures that bear, and most of these are
beyond the control of the teachers. When we first moved here, I injured
my leg and while I was waiting for the doc in the ER, there was a guy
and his daughter in the next curtained booth. I don't know what the
reason for their visit was, but the nurse asked the dad what his
occupation was, and his response was, "Occupation, what does that mean?"
"What you do for a living," the nurse said.

Whoever taught that kid of his had to take into account the fact that
her dad was...uneducated and ignorant. How would you suggest that the
teacher deal with that student and overcome the home problems? And what
if the teacher has 15 of those kids in a class of 35?

It would certainly make sense if they were free to try different
things and reward the teachers who had success,

Right now they simply do the same thing over and over again expecting
a different result.



Classroom teachers, for the most part, are not "free" to try "different
things" that haven't been approved in advance by school administrators.
This doesn't mean they don't know how...it just means there is not much
variance allowed.

On Thu, 02 Oct 2014 18:51:47 -0400, F*O*A*D wrote:

Classroom teachers, for the most part, are not "free" to try "different
things" that haven't been approved in advance by school administrators.
This doesn't mean they don't know how...it just means there is not much
variance allowed.

===

What nonsense. Teachers have to teach the subject matter but their
style, effectiveness and commitment vary enormously.

On Thu, 02 Oct 2014 20:07:42 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote:

On Thu, 02 Oct 2014 18:51:47 -0400, F*O*A*D wrote:

Classroom teachers, for the most part, are not "free" to try "different
things" that haven't been approved in advance by school administrators.
This doesn't mean they don't know how...it just means there is not much
variance allowed.

===

What nonsense. Teachers have to teach the subject matter but their
style, effectiveness and commitment vary enormously.

The lack of knowledge about teaching displayed by Krause and his
buddy, BAO, is unreal.

You're correct, teachers are given the learning objectives for their
subject and grade. In Virginia, these objectives are listed in the
Standards of Learning. The manner in which the teacher enables the
students to accomplish the objectives is up to the teacher. A half
dozen teachers teaching the same subject will probably be using a half
dozen different techniques to do so.