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Keeping that family safe
Good thing they had access to a gun. Otherwise, they might all be dead. Guns in the home make everyone safer from living. "A gunman killed at least six people in a shooting in Spring, Texas on Wednesday, according to local media reports. The Harris County Sheriff's Department told the Associated Press that four children and two adults were killed. Deputies called the shooting a "domestic dispute," KPRC reported. A mother and a child were taken to the hospital after the shooting, but the child has since died, according to KTRK. At the time, the mother taken to the hospital is the only survivor from the shooting. A standoff with the suspect is currently under way. The suspect is reportedly related to the victims." |
Keeping that family safe
On 7/9/2014 10:40 PM, jps wrote:
Good thing they had access to a gun. Otherwise, they might all be dead. Guns in the home make everyone safer from living. "A gunman killed at least six people in a shooting in Spring, Texas on Wednesday, according to local media reports. The Harris County Sheriff's Department told the Associated Press that four children and two adults were killed. Deputies called the shooting a "domestic dispute," KPRC reported. A mother and a child were taken to the hospital after the shooting, but the child has since died, according to KTRK. At the time, the mother taken to the hospital is the only survivor from the shooting. A standoff with the suspect is currently under way. The suspect is reportedly related to the victims." Whooo hoooo, awesome... It's like what, 15 seconds in Chicago? You are a hypocrite jp, right down to you owning guns till you decided it wasn't good for you anymore.. |
Keeping that family safe
On Wednesday, July 9, 2014 7:40:05 PM UTC-7, jps wrote:
Good thing they had access to a gun. Otherwise, they might all be dead. Guns in the home make everyone safer from living. "A gunman killed at least six people in a shooting in Spring, Texas on Wednesday, according to local media reports. The Harris County Sheriff's Department told the Associated Press that four children and two adults were killed. Deputies called the shooting a "domestic dispute," KPRC reported. A mother and a child were taken to the hospital after the shooting, but the child has since died, according to KTRK. At the time, the mother taken to the hospital is the only survivor from the shooting. A standoff with the suspect is currently under way. The suspect is reportedly related to the victims." Cool story, Bro! |
Keeping that family safe
On Wednesday, July 9, 2014 7:40:05 PM UTC-7, jps wrote:
Good thing they had access to a gun. Otherwise, they might all be dead. Guns in the home make everyone safer from living. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cIdKIM2btoA have a beautiful day. |
Keeping that family safe
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Keeping that family safe
On Thu, 10 Jul 2014 18:38:25 -0700, jps wrote:
I'm waiting for a Conservative Senator's kid to be shot accidentally so that congress might reconsider closing sales loopholes and instituting a mental health database and policy with some teeth. === Be careful what you ask for, that's my advice. It might turn out to be an example of the cure being worse than the disease. The vast majority of shootings occur in inner city ghettos and are drug related. Those facts are indisputable whether we like it or not. Do you really think that all of these drug selling gang members are going to show up in a mental health database? More likely you or your neighbor's wife, and the label will follow you around forever. |
Keeping that family safe
On Thu, 10 Jul 2014 21:49:19 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote: On Thu, 10 Jul 2014 18:38:25 -0700, jps wrote: I'm waiting for a Conservative Senator's kid to be shot accidentally so that congress might reconsider closing sales loopholes and instituting a mental health database and policy with some teeth. === Be careful what you ask for, that's my advice. It might turn out to be an example of the cure being worse than the disease. The vast majority of shootings occur in inner city ghettos and are drug related. Those facts are indisputable whether we like it or not. Do you really think that all of these drug selling gang members are going to show up in a mental health database? More likely you or your neighbor's wife, and the label will follow you around forever. The vast majority are suicides, somewhere around 17 - 19,000 a year. Murders are around 11,000 a year. |
Keeping that family safe
jps wrote:
On Thu, 10 Jul 2014 21:49:19 -0400, Wayne.B wrote: On Thu, 10 Jul 2014 18:38:25 -0700, jps wrote: I'm waiting for a Conservative Senator's kid to be shot accidentally so that congress might reconsider closing sales loopholes and instituting a mental health database and policy with some teeth. === Be careful what you ask for, that's my advice. It might turn out to be an example of the cure being worse than the disease. The vast majority of shootings occur in inner city ghettos and are drug related. Those facts are indisputable whether we like it or not. Do you really think that all of these drug selling gang members are going to show up in a mental health database? More likely you or your neighbor's wife, and the label will follow you around forever. The vast majority are suicides, somewhere around 17 - 19,000 a year. Murders are around 11,000 a year. Actually murders over 16,000. Only 11000 via firearm. |
Keeping that family safe
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Keeping that family safe
On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 00:36:58 -0400, wrote:
On Thu, 10 Jul 2014 20:01:21 -0700, jps wrote: 31000? that sounds like a number straight from your ass. Yes, I understand why you'd think that. An extraordinary number, isn't it? http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/fastats/injury.htm All firearm deaths Number of deaths: 31,672 Ok then you need to look at all automobile deaths, not just hot cars. You end up with the same kind of number 33,561 in 2012 ****, you listening to Wayne LaPierre tapes on your cassette machine? What the **** do the death rates in cars and as a result of guns have to do with one another? Logic is failing you, perhaps you should leave it be. |
Keeping that family safe
On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 00:58:34 -0500, Califbill
wrote: jps wrote: On Thu, 10 Jul 2014 21:49:19 -0400, Wayne.B wrote: On Thu, 10 Jul 2014 18:38:25 -0700, jps wrote: I'm waiting for a Conservative Senator's kid to be shot accidentally so that congress might reconsider closing sales loopholes and instituting a mental health database and policy with some teeth. === Be careful what you ask for, that's my advice. It might turn out to be an example of the cure being worse than the disease. The vast majority of shootings occur in inner city ghettos and are drug related. Those facts are indisputable whether we like it or not. Do you really think that all of these drug selling gang members are going to show up in a mental health database? More likely you or your neighbor's wife, and the label will follow you around forever. The vast majority are suicides, somewhere around 17 - 19,000 a year. Murders are around 11,000 a year. Actually murders over 16,000. Only 11000 via firearm. So, 66%+ of murders are committed by gun. Very impressive. |
Keeping that family safe
On 7/11/2014 2:11 AM, jps wrote:
On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 00:40:45 -0400, wrote: On Thu, 10 Jul 2014 20:02:33 -0700, jps wrote: The vast majority are suicides, somewhere around 17 - 19,000 a year. Murders are around 11,000 a year. So you think if there were no guns, there would be no suicides? Just look at Japan, one of your ideal countries. No guns and a much higher suicide rate than the US. The more you drill down on the numbers, the worse your case gets. I have pointed out Australia many times. They got rid of most of their guns and it had very little effect of on the slope of their murder rate. Well, we certainly did shift real quick there, eh? Went from 31,000 gun deaths a year coming out of my ass to, wouldn't it happen anyway? And you're dead wrong about Australia, they've virtually eliminated mass shootings from their society. My point is, if guns make a country safer, we should be the safest ****ing country on the planet. They don't and we're not. Greg said that getting rid of most of their guns has had little effect on the slope of the murder rate in Australia. Your rebuttal was that Australia has virtually eliminated mass shootings. If both statements are true, the elimination of guns has had little effect on Australia's murder rate. I think that was his point. One thing that is totally ignored in this great gun debate is the cultural and ethnic diversity of the United States compared to any other country on the planet. It has both positive and negative ramifications on our society. The "Great Melting Pot" isn't utopia. Guns don't create racial intolerance, conflicts based on religious beliefs, conflicts of cultural or ethnic traditions or the inner city gang wars that Wayne accurately points out represents the vast majority of gun related deaths. Personally I also think that the slow shredding of unifying traditions that have been challenged by groups focused only on their belief system serves to further polarize the country and puts an emphasis on our cultural, religious and ethnic diversity as we slide into a "progressive" liberal never-never land. We are slowly removing the measuring sticks of our societal structure that includes the good with the bad and replacing it with a free-for-all "anything goes" mentality that is increasingly based on an entitlement philosophy. So, going back to guns. They are not the *reason* for our problems. |
Keeping that family safe
On 7/11/14, 6:57 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 7/11/2014 2:11 AM, jps wrote: On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 00:40:45 -0400, wrote: On Thu, 10 Jul 2014 20:02:33 -0700, jps wrote: The vast majority are suicides, somewhere around 17 - 19,000 a year. Murders are around 11,000 a year. So you think if there were no guns, there would be no suicides? Just look at Japan, one of your ideal countries. No guns and a much higher suicide rate than the US. The more you drill down on the numbers, the worse your case gets. I have pointed out Australia many times. They got rid of most of their guns and it had very little effect of on the slope of their murder rate. Well, we certainly did shift real quick there, eh? Went from 31,000 gun deaths a year coming out of my ass to, wouldn't it happen anyway? And you're dead wrong about Australia, they've virtually eliminated mass shootings from their society. My point is, if guns make a country safer, we should be the safest ****ing country on the planet. They don't and we're not. Greg said that getting rid of most of their guns has had little effect on the slope of the murder rate in Australia. Your rebuttal was that Australia has virtually eliminated mass shootings. If both statements are true, the elimination of guns has had little effect on Australia's murder rate. I think that was his point. One thing that is totally ignored in this great gun debate is the cultural and ethnic diversity of the United States compared to any other country on the planet. It has both positive and negative ramifications on our society. The "Great Melting Pot" isn't utopia. Guns don't create racial intolerance, conflicts based on religious beliefs, conflicts of cultural or ethnic traditions or the inner city gang wars that Wayne accurately points out represents the vast majority of gun related deaths. Personally I also think that the slow shredding of unifying traditions that have been challenged by groups focused only on their belief system serves to further polarize the country and puts an emphasis on our cultural, religious and ethnic diversity as we slide into a "progressive" liberal never-never land. We are slowly removing the measuring sticks of our societal structure that includes the good with the bad and replacing it with a free-for-all "anything goes" mentality that is increasingly based on an entitlement philosophy. So, going back to guns. They are not the *reason* for our problems. My guess is that JPS believes guns do not make a country safer. I agree with him. -- Republicans . . . the anti-immigrant, anti-contraception, anti-student, anti-middle class, pro-impeachment party that shut down the government last year for no reason. |
Keeping that family safe
On 7/11/2014 7:55 AM, F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/11/14, 6:57 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote: On 7/11/2014 2:11 AM, jps wrote: On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 00:40:45 -0400, wrote: On Thu, 10 Jul 2014 20:02:33 -0700, jps wrote: The vast majority are suicides, somewhere around 17 - 19,000 a year. Murders are around 11,000 a year. So you think if there were no guns, there would be no suicides? Just look at Japan, one of your ideal countries. No guns and a much higher suicide rate than the US. The more you drill down on the numbers, the worse your case gets. I have pointed out Australia many times. They got rid of most of their guns and it had very little effect of on the slope of their murder rate. Well, we certainly did shift real quick there, eh? Went from 31,000 gun deaths a year coming out of my ass to, wouldn't it happen anyway? And you're dead wrong about Australia, they've virtually eliminated mass shootings from their society. My point is, if guns make a country safer, we should be the safest ****ing country on the planet. They don't and we're not. Greg said that getting rid of most of their guns has had little effect on the slope of the murder rate in Australia. Your rebuttal was that Australia has virtually eliminated mass shootings. If both statements are true, the elimination of guns has had little effect on Australia's murder rate. I think that was his point. One thing that is totally ignored in this great gun debate is the cultural and ethnic diversity of the United States compared to any other country on the planet. It has both positive and negative ramifications on our society. The "Great Melting Pot" isn't utopia. Guns don't create racial intolerance, conflicts based on religious beliefs, conflicts of cultural or ethnic traditions or the inner city gang wars that Wayne accurately points out represents the vast majority of gun related deaths. Personally I also think that the slow shredding of unifying traditions that have been challenged by groups focused only on their belief system serves to further polarize the country and puts an emphasis on our cultural, religious and ethnic diversity as we slide into a "progressive" liberal never-never land. We are slowly removing the measuring sticks of our societal structure that includes the good with the bad and replacing it with a free-for-all "anything goes" mentality that is increasingly based on an entitlement philosophy. So, going back to guns. They are not the *reason* for our problems. My guess is that JPS believes guns do not make a country safer. I agree with him. As a 65 year old living in an increasingly drug infested society and a growing expectation of "what's your's is mine" ... I feel somewhat safer having a last resort means of self defense available. I never felt that way when I was younger. Not to make light of a serious issue but it's like having a fire extinguisher. Hopefully and statistically you will never need it but if you should, it could save lives and property. |
Keeping that family safe
On 7/11/14, 8:05 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 7/11/2014 7:55 AM, F*O*A*D wrote: On 7/11/14, 6:57 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote: On 7/11/2014 2:11 AM, jps wrote: On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 00:40:45 -0400, wrote: On Thu, 10 Jul 2014 20:02:33 -0700, jps wrote: The vast majority are suicides, somewhere around 17 - 19,000 a year. Murders are around 11,000 a year. So you think if there were no guns, there would be no suicides? Just look at Japan, one of your ideal countries. No guns and a much higher suicide rate than the US. The more you drill down on the numbers, the worse your case gets. I have pointed out Australia many times. They got rid of most of their guns and it had very little effect of on the slope of their murder rate. Well, we certainly did shift real quick there, eh? Went from 31,000 gun deaths a year coming out of my ass to, wouldn't it happen anyway? And you're dead wrong about Australia, they've virtually eliminated mass shootings from their society. My point is, if guns make a country safer, we should be the safest ****ing country on the planet. They don't and we're not. Greg said that getting rid of most of their guns has had little effect on the slope of the murder rate in Australia. Your rebuttal was that Australia has virtually eliminated mass shootings. If both statements are true, the elimination of guns has had little effect on Australia's murder rate. I think that was his point. One thing that is totally ignored in this great gun debate is the cultural and ethnic diversity of the United States compared to any other country on the planet. It has both positive and negative ramifications on our society. The "Great Melting Pot" isn't utopia. Guns don't create racial intolerance, conflicts based on religious beliefs, conflicts of cultural or ethnic traditions or the inner city gang wars that Wayne accurately points out represents the vast majority of gun related deaths. Personally I also think that the slow shredding of unifying traditions that have been challenged by groups focused only on their belief system serves to further polarize the country and puts an emphasis on our cultural, religious and ethnic diversity as we slide into a "progressive" liberal never-never land. We are slowly removing the measuring sticks of our societal structure that includes the good with the bad and replacing it with a free-for-all "anything goes" mentality that is increasingly based on an entitlement philosophy. So, going back to guns. They are not the *reason* for our problems. My guess is that JPS believes guns do not make a country safer. I agree with him. As a 65 year old living in an increasingly drug infested society and a growing expectation of "what's your's is mine" ... I feel somewhat safer having a last resort means of self defense available. I never felt that way when I was younger. Not to make light of a serious issue but it's like having a fire extinguisher. Hopefully and statistically you will never need it but if you should, it could save lives and property. In *this* country, you are assuredly correct, but that's not my point. -- Republicans . . . the anti-immigrant, anti-contraception, anti-student, anti-middle class, pro-impeachment party that shut down the government last year for no reason. |
Keeping that family safe
On 7/11/2014 8:10 AM, F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/11/14, 8:05 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote: On 7/11/2014 7:55 AM, F*O*A*D wrote: On 7/11/14, 6:57 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote: On 7/11/2014 2:11 AM, jps wrote: On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 00:40:45 -0400, wrote: On Thu, 10 Jul 2014 20:02:33 -0700, jps wrote: The vast majority are suicides, somewhere around 17 - 19,000 a year. Murders are around 11,000 a year. So you think if there were no guns, there would be no suicides? Just look at Japan, one of your ideal countries. No guns and a much higher suicide rate than the US. The more you drill down on the numbers, the worse your case gets. I have pointed out Australia many times. They got rid of most of their guns and it had very little effect of on the slope of their murder rate. Well, we certainly did shift real quick there, eh? Went from 31,000 gun deaths a year coming out of my ass to, wouldn't it happen anyway? And you're dead wrong about Australia, they've virtually eliminated mass shootings from their society. My point is, if guns make a country safer, we should be the safest ****ing country on the planet. They don't and we're not. Greg said that getting rid of most of their guns has had little effect on the slope of the murder rate in Australia. Your rebuttal was that Australia has virtually eliminated mass shootings. If both statements are true, the elimination of guns has had little effect on Australia's murder rate. I think that was his point. One thing that is totally ignored in this great gun debate is the cultural and ethnic diversity of the United States compared to any other country on the planet. It has both positive and negative ramifications on our society. The "Great Melting Pot" isn't utopia. Guns don't create racial intolerance, conflicts based on religious beliefs, conflicts of cultural or ethnic traditions or the inner city gang wars that Wayne accurately points out represents the vast majority of gun related deaths. Personally I also think that the slow shredding of unifying traditions that have been challenged by groups focused only on their belief system serves to further polarize the country and puts an emphasis on our cultural, religious and ethnic diversity as we slide into a "progressive" liberal never-never land. We are slowly removing the measuring sticks of our societal structure that includes the good with the bad and replacing it with a free-for-all "anything goes" mentality that is increasingly based on an entitlement philosophy. So, going back to guns. They are not the *reason* for our problems. My guess is that JPS believes guns do not make a country safer. I agree with him. As a 65 year old living in an increasingly drug infested society and a growing expectation of "what's your's is mine" ... I feel somewhat safer having a last resort means of self defense available. I never felt that way when I was younger. Not to make light of a serious issue but it's like having a fire extinguisher. Hopefully and statistically you will never need it but if you should, it could save lives and property. In *this* country, you are assuredly correct, but that's not my point. Not to sound like Wayne LaPierre (who goes to extremes) there are *many* things in our society that we'd be safer without but it's not practical or beneficial to eliminate them. As long as we have gun toting criminals, out of their mind meth addicts and an "entertainment" industry that glorifies killing, blood and guts that increasingly desensitizes people .... especially young people ... we are all at some level of risk of becoming a victim. The risk may small and not as high in all areas but it still exists. I feel a little "safer" knowing I may be able to protect myself and my wife. In other words, if we became the victim of a violent crime and my wife was seriously hurt or even killed ... I don't think I could live with myself knowing that I may have been able to prevent it. If some of our societal problems were addressed maybe there would be no need for guns in the interest of self defense but we are moving in the wrong direction to achieve that. |
Keeping that family safe
On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 08:05:18 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote: Not to make light of a serious issue but it's like having a fire extinguisher. Hopefully and statistically you will never need it but if you should, it could save lives and property. === Good analogy. |
Keeping that family safe
On 7/11/2014 2:11 AM, jps wrote:
On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 00:40:45 -0400, wrote: On Thu, 10 Jul 2014 20:02:33 -0700, jps wrote: The vast majority are suicides, somewhere around 17 - 19,000 a year. Murders are around 11,000 a year. So you think if there were no guns, there would be no suicides? Just look at Japan, one of your ideal countries. No guns and a much higher suicide rate than the US. The more you drill down on the numbers, the worse your case gets. I have pointed out Australia many times. They got rid of most of their guns and it had very little effect of on the slope of their murder rate. Well, we certainly did shift real quick there, eh? Went from 31,000 gun deaths a year coming out of my ass to, wouldn't it happen anyway? And you're dead wrong about Australia, they've virtually eliminated mass shootings from their society. Well, we certainly did shift real quick there eh? Mass murders? He was talking about the general murder rate... b My point is, if guns make a country safer, we should be the safest ****ing country on the planet. They don't and we're not. |
Keeping that family safe
On Friday, July 11, 2014 5:33:33 AM UTC-7, Mr. Luddite wrote:
Not to sound like Wayne LaPierre (who goes to extremes) there are *many* things in our society that we'd be safer without but it's not practical or beneficial to eliminate them. As long as we have gun toting criminals, out of their mind meth addicts and an "entertainment" industry that glorifies killing, blood and guts that increasingly desensitizes people .... especially young people ... we are all at some level of risk of becoming a victim. The risk may small and not as high in all areas but it still exists. I feel a little "safer" knowing I may be able to protect myself and my wife. In other words, if we became the victim of a violent crime and my wife was seriously hurt or even killed ... I don't think I could live with myself knowing that I may have been able to prevent it. If some of our societal problems were addressed maybe there would be no need for guns in the interest of self defense but we are moving in the wrong direction to achieve that. Rich, that's some pretty good reasoning... |
Keeping that family safe
On 7/11/2014 6:55 AM, F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/11/14, 6:57 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote: On 7/11/2014 2:11 AM, jps wrote: On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 00:40:45 -0400, wrote: On Thu, 10 Jul 2014 20:02:33 -0700, jps wrote: The vast majority are suicides, somewhere around 17 - 19,000 a year. Murders are around 11,000 a year. So you think if there were no guns, there would be no suicides? Just look at Japan, one of your ideal countries. No guns and a much higher suicide rate than the US. The more you drill down on the numbers, the worse your case gets. I have pointed out Australia many times. They got rid of most of their guns and it had very little effect of on the slope of their murder rate. Well, we certainly did shift real quick there, eh? Went from 31,000 gun deaths a year coming out of my ass to, wouldn't it happen anyway? And you're dead wrong about Australia, they've virtually eliminated mass shootings from their society. My point is, if guns make a country safer, we should be the safest ****ing country on the planet. They don't and we're not. Greg said that getting rid of most of their guns has had little effect on the slope of the murder rate in Australia. Your rebuttal was that Australia has virtually eliminated mass shootings. If both statements are true, the elimination of guns has had little effect on Australia's murder rate. I think that was his point. One thing that is totally ignored in this great gun debate is the cultural and ethnic diversity of the United States compared to any other country on the planet. It has both positive and negative ramifications on our society. The "Great Melting Pot" isn't utopia. Guns don't create racial intolerance, conflicts based on religious beliefs, conflicts of cultural or ethnic traditions or the inner city gang wars that Wayne accurately points out represents the vast majority of gun related deaths. Personally I also think that the slow shredding of unifying traditions that have been challenged by groups focused only on their belief system serves to further polarize the country and puts an emphasis on our cultural, religious and ethnic diversity as we slide into a "progressive" liberal never-never land. We are slowly removing the measuring sticks of our societal structure that includes the good with the bad and replacing it with a free-for-all "anything goes" mentality that is increasingly based on an entitlement philosophy. So, going back to guns. They are not the *reason* for our problems. My guess is that JPS believes guns do not make a country safer. I agree with him. What would make a country safer? -- "I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them". Thomas Jefferson |
Keeping that family safe
On 7/11/2014 7:10 AM, F*O*A*D wrote:
On 7/11/14, 8:05 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote: On 7/11/2014 7:55 AM, F*O*A*D wrote: On 7/11/14, 6:57 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote: On 7/11/2014 2:11 AM, jps wrote: On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 00:40:45 -0400, wrote: On Thu, 10 Jul 2014 20:02:33 -0700, jps wrote: The vast majority are suicides, somewhere around 17 - 19,000 a year. Murders are around 11,000 a year. So you think if there were no guns, there would be no suicides? Just look at Japan, one of your ideal countries. No guns and a much higher suicide rate than the US. The more you drill down on the numbers, the worse your case gets. I have pointed out Australia many times. They got rid of most of their guns and it had very little effect of on the slope of their murder rate. Well, we certainly did shift real quick there, eh? Went from 31,000 gun deaths a year coming out of my ass to, wouldn't it happen anyway? And you're dead wrong about Australia, they've virtually eliminated mass shootings from their society. My point is, if guns make a country safer, we should be the safest ****ing country on the planet. They don't and we're not. Greg said that getting rid of most of their guns has had little effect on the slope of the murder rate in Australia. Your rebuttal was that Australia has virtually eliminated mass shootings. If both statements are true, the elimination of guns has had little effect on Australia's murder rate. I think that was his point. One thing that is totally ignored in this great gun debate is the cultural and ethnic diversity of the United States compared to any other country on the planet. It has both positive and negative ramifications on our society. The "Great Melting Pot" isn't utopia. Guns don't create racial intolerance, conflicts based on religious beliefs, conflicts of cultural or ethnic traditions or the inner city gang wars that Wayne accurately points out represents the vast majority of gun related deaths. Personally I also think that the slow shredding of unifying traditions that have been challenged by groups focused only on their belief system serves to further polarize the country and puts an emphasis on our cultural, religious and ethnic diversity as we slide into a "progressive" liberal never-never land. We are slowly removing the measuring sticks of our societal structure that includes the good with the bad and replacing it with a free-for-all "anything goes" mentality that is increasingly based on an entitlement philosophy. So, going back to guns. They are not the *reason* for our problems. My guess is that JPS believes guns do not make a country safer. I agree with him. As a 65 year old living in an increasingly drug infested society and a growing expectation of "what's your's is mine" ... I feel somewhat safer having a last resort means of self defense available. I never felt that way when I was younger. Not to make light of a serious issue but it's like having a fire extinguisher. Hopefully and statistically you will never need it but if you should, it could save lives and property. In *this* country, you are assuredly correct, but that's not my point. Harry contradicts himself and attempts to do a reach around. What an asshole. -- "I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them". Thomas Jefferson |
Keeping that family safe
On 7/11/2014 7:33 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 7/11/2014 8:10 AM, F*O*A*D wrote: On 7/11/14, 8:05 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote: On 7/11/2014 7:55 AM, F*O*A*D wrote: On 7/11/14, 6:57 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote: On 7/11/2014 2:11 AM, jps wrote: On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 00:40:45 -0400, wrote: On Thu, 10 Jul 2014 20:02:33 -0700, jps wrote: The vast majority are suicides, somewhere around 17 - 19,000 a year. Murders are around 11,000 a year. So you think if there were no guns, there would be no suicides? Just look at Japan, one of your ideal countries. No guns and a much higher suicide rate than the US. The more you drill down on the numbers, the worse your case gets. I have pointed out Australia many times. They got rid of most of their guns and it had very little effect of on the slope of their murder rate. Well, we certainly did shift real quick there, eh? Went from 31,000 gun deaths a year coming out of my ass to, wouldn't it happen anyway? And you're dead wrong about Australia, they've virtually eliminated mass shootings from their society. My point is, if guns make a country safer, we should be the safest ****ing country on the planet. They don't and we're not. Greg said that getting rid of most of their guns has had little effect on the slope of the murder rate in Australia. Your rebuttal was that Australia has virtually eliminated mass shootings. If both statements are true, the elimination of guns has had little effect on Australia's murder rate. I think that was his point. One thing that is totally ignored in this great gun debate is the cultural and ethnic diversity of the United States compared to any other country on the planet. It has both positive and negative ramifications on our society. The "Great Melting Pot" isn't utopia. Guns don't create racial intolerance, conflicts based on religious beliefs, conflicts of cultural or ethnic traditions or the inner city gang wars that Wayne accurately points out represents the vast majority of gun related deaths. Personally I also think that the slow shredding of unifying traditions that have been challenged by groups focused only on their belief system serves to further polarize the country and puts an emphasis on our cultural, religious and ethnic diversity as we slide into a "progressive" liberal never-never land. We are slowly removing the measuring sticks of our societal structure that includes the good with the bad and replacing it with a free-for-all "anything goes" mentality that is increasingly based on an entitlement philosophy. So, going back to guns. They are not the *reason* for our problems. My guess is that JPS believes guns do not make a country safer. I agree with him. As a 65 year old living in an increasingly drug infested society and a growing expectation of "what's your's is mine" ... I feel somewhat safer having a last resort means of self defense available. I never felt that way when I was younger. Not to make light of a serious issue but it's like having a fire extinguisher. Hopefully and statistically you will never need it but if you should, it could save lives and property. In *this* country, you are assuredly correct, but that's not my point. Not to sound like Wayne LaPierre (who goes to extremes) there are *many* things in our society that we'd be safer without but it's not practical or beneficial to eliminate them. As long as we have gun toting criminals, out of their mind meth addicts and an "entertainment" industry that glorifies killing, blood and guts that increasingly desensitizes people .... especially young people ... we are all at some level of risk of becoming a victim. The risk may small and not as high in all areas but it still exists. I feel a little "safer" knowing I may be able to protect myself and my wife. In other words, if we became the victim of a violent crime and my wife was seriously hurt or even killed ... I don't think I could live with myself knowing that I may have been able to prevent it. If some of our societal problems were addressed maybe there would be no need for guns in the interest of self defense but we are moving in the wrong direction to achieve that. You've won over Krause. Will JPS be next? -- "I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them". Thomas Jefferson |
Keeping that family safe
On 7/11/2014 10:33 AM, H*a*r*r*o*l*d wrote:
On 7/11/2014 7:33 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote: On 7/11/2014 8:10 AM, F*O*A*D wrote: On 7/11/14, 8:05 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote: On 7/11/2014 7:55 AM, F*O*A*D wrote: On 7/11/14, 6:57 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote: On 7/11/2014 2:11 AM, jps wrote: On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 00:40:45 -0400, wrote: On Thu, 10 Jul 2014 20:02:33 -0700, jps wrote: The vast majority are suicides, somewhere around 17 - 19,000 a year. Murders are around 11,000 a year. So you think if there were no guns, there would be no suicides? Just look at Japan, one of your ideal countries. No guns and a much higher suicide rate than the US. The more you drill down on the numbers, the worse your case gets. I have pointed out Australia many times. They got rid of most of their guns and it had very little effect of on the slope of their murder rate. Well, we certainly did shift real quick there, eh? Went from 31,000 gun deaths a year coming out of my ass to, wouldn't it happen anyway? And you're dead wrong about Australia, they've virtually eliminated mass shootings from their society. My point is, if guns make a country safer, we should be the safest ****ing country on the planet. They don't and we're not. Greg said that getting rid of most of their guns has had little effect on the slope of the murder rate in Australia. Your rebuttal was that Australia has virtually eliminated mass shootings. If both statements are true, the elimination of guns has had little effect on Australia's murder rate. I think that was his point. One thing that is totally ignored in this great gun debate is the cultural and ethnic diversity of the United States compared to any other country on the planet. It has both positive and negative ramifications on our society. The "Great Melting Pot" isn't utopia. Guns don't create racial intolerance, conflicts based on religious beliefs, conflicts of cultural or ethnic traditions or the inner city gang wars that Wayne accurately points out represents the vast majority of gun related deaths. Personally I also think that the slow shredding of unifying traditions that have been challenged by groups focused only on their belief system serves to further polarize the country and puts an emphasis on our cultural, religious and ethnic diversity as we slide into a "progressive" liberal never-never land. We are slowly removing the measuring sticks of our societal structure that includes the good with the bad and replacing it with a free-for-all "anything goes" mentality that is increasingly based on an entitlement philosophy. So, going back to guns. They are not the *reason* for our problems. My guess is that JPS believes guns do not make a country safer. I agree with him. As a 65 year old living in an increasingly drug infested society and a growing expectation of "what's your's is mine" ... I feel somewhat safer having a last resort means of self defense available. I never felt that way when I was younger. Not to make light of a serious issue but it's like having a fire extinguisher. Hopefully and statistically you will never need it but if you should, it could save lives and property. In *this* country, you are assuredly correct, but that's not my point. Not to sound like Wayne LaPierre (who goes to extremes) there are *many* things in our society that we'd be safer without but it's not practical or beneficial to eliminate them. As long as we have gun toting criminals, out of their mind meth addicts and an "entertainment" industry that glorifies killing, blood and guts that increasingly desensitizes people .... especially young people ... we are all at some level of risk of becoming a victim. The risk may small and not as high in all areas but it still exists. I feel a little "safer" knowing I may be able to protect myself and my wife. In other words, if we became the victim of a violent crime and my wife was seriously hurt or even killed ... I don't think I could live with myself knowing that I may have been able to prevent it. If some of our societal problems were addressed maybe there would be no need for guns in the interest of self defense but we are moving in the wrong direction to achieve that. You've won over Krause. Will JPS be next? I am not trying to "win over" anybody however I take exception sometimes to people who, because they oppose an issue, think *everyone* should be in opposition also. I think if some people paid more attention to how they influence others for whom they are responsible and less attention to what everyone else is doing we'd all be better off. |
Keeping that family safe
On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 09:33:50 -0500, H*a*r*r*o*l*d wrote:
On 7/11/2014 7:33 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote: On 7/11/2014 8:10 AM, F*O*A*D wrote: On 7/11/14, 8:05 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote: On 7/11/2014 7:55 AM, F*O*A*D wrote: On 7/11/14, 6:57 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote: On 7/11/2014 2:11 AM, jps wrote: On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 00:40:45 -0400, wrote: On Thu, 10 Jul 2014 20:02:33 -0700, jps wrote: The vast majority are suicides, somewhere around 17 - 19,000 a year. Murders are around 11,000 a year. So you think if there were no guns, there would be no suicides? Just look at Japan, one of your ideal countries. No guns and a much higher suicide rate than the US. The more you drill down on the numbers, the worse your case gets. I have pointed out Australia many times. They got rid of most of their guns and it had very little effect of on the slope of their murder rate. Well, we certainly did shift real quick there, eh? Went from 31,000 gun deaths a year coming out of my ass to, wouldn't it happen anyway? And you're dead wrong about Australia, they've virtually eliminated mass shootings from their society. My point is, if guns make a country safer, we should be the safest ****ing country on the planet. They don't and we're not. Greg said that getting rid of most of their guns has had little effect on the slope of the murder rate in Australia. Your rebuttal was that Australia has virtually eliminated mass shootings. If both statements are true, the elimination of guns has had little effect on Australia's murder rate. I think that was his point. One thing that is totally ignored in this great gun debate is the cultural and ethnic diversity of the United States compared to any other country on the planet. It has both positive and negative ramifications on our society. The "Great Melting Pot" isn't utopia. Guns don't create racial intolerance, conflicts based on religious beliefs, conflicts of cultural or ethnic traditions or the inner city gang wars that Wayne accurately points out represents the vast majority of gun related deaths. Personally I also think that the slow shredding of unifying traditions that have been challenged by groups focused only on their belief system serves to further polarize the country and puts an emphasis on our cultural, religious and ethnic diversity as we slide into a "progressive" liberal never-never land. We are slowly removing the measuring sticks of our societal structure that includes the good with the bad and replacing it with a free-for-all "anything goes" mentality that is increasingly based on an entitlement philosophy. So, going back to guns. They are not the *reason* for our problems. My guess is that JPS believes guns do not make a country safer. I agree with him. As a 65 year old living in an increasingly drug infested society and a growing expectation of "what's your's is mine" ... I feel somewhat safer having a last resort means of self defense available. I never felt that way when I was younger. Not to make light of a serious issue but it's like having a fire extinguisher. Hopefully and statistically you will never need it but if you should, it could save lives and property. In *this* country, you are assuredly correct, but that's not my point. Not to sound like Wayne LaPierre (who goes to extremes) there are *many* things in our society that we'd be safer without but it's not practical or beneficial to eliminate them. As long as we have gun toting criminals, out of their mind meth addicts and an "entertainment" industry that glorifies killing, blood and guts that increasingly desensitizes people .... especially young people ... we are all at some level of risk of becoming a victim. The risk may small and not as high in all areas but it still exists. I feel a little "safer" knowing I may be able to protect myself and my wife. In other words, if we became the victim of a violent crime and my wife was seriously hurt or even killed ... I don't think I could live with myself knowing that I may have been able to prevent it. If some of our societal problems were addressed maybe there would be no need for guns in the interest of self defense but we are moving in the wrong direction to achieve that. You've won over Krause. Will JPS be next? 'Sound reasoning' is not in either's ammo bag. |
Keeping that family safe
On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 09:19:44 -0500, H*a*r*r*o*l*d wrote:
On 7/11/2014 6:55 AM, F*O*A*D wrote: On 7/11/14, 6:57 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote: On 7/11/2014 2:11 AM, jps wrote: On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 00:40:45 -0400, wrote: On Thu, 10 Jul 2014 20:02:33 -0700, jps wrote: The vast majority are suicides, somewhere around 17 - 19,000 a year. Murders are around 11,000 a year. So you think if there were no guns, there would be no suicides? Just look at Japan, one of your ideal countries. No guns and a much higher suicide rate than the US. The more you drill down on the numbers, the worse your case gets. I have pointed out Australia many times. They got rid of most of their guns and it had very little effect of on the slope of their murder rate. Well, we certainly did shift real quick there, eh? Went from 31,000 gun deaths a year coming out of my ass to, wouldn't it happen anyway? And you're dead wrong about Australia, they've virtually eliminated mass shootings from their society. My point is, if guns make a country safer, we should be the safest ****ing country on the planet. They don't and we're not. Greg said that getting rid of most of their guns has had little effect on the slope of the murder rate in Australia. Your rebuttal was that Australia has virtually eliminated mass shootings. If both statements are true, the elimination of guns has had little effect on Australia's murder rate. I think that was his point. One thing that is totally ignored in this great gun debate is the cultural and ethnic diversity of the United States compared to any other country on the planet. It has both positive and negative ramifications on our society. The "Great Melting Pot" isn't utopia. Guns don't create racial intolerance, conflicts based on religious beliefs, conflicts of cultural or ethnic traditions or the inner city gang wars that Wayne accurately points out represents the vast majority of gun related deaths. Personally I also think that the slow shredding of unifying traditions that have been challenged by groups focused only on their belief system serves to further polarize the country and puts an emphasis on our cultural, religious and ethnic diversity as we slide into a "progressive" liberal never-never land. We are slowly removing the measuring sticks of our societal structure that includes the good with the bad and replacing it with a free-for-all "anything goes" mentality that is increasingly based on an entitlement philosophy. So, going back to guns. They are not the *reason* for our problems. My guess is that JPS believes guns do not make a country safer. I agree with him. What would make a country safer? Border security, condoms or sterilization, mandatory high school education, drug tests for welfare recipients, voter ID's, and others. |
Keeping that family safe
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Keeping that family safe
On 7/11/2014 9:56 AM, Poquito Loco wrote:
On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 09:19:44 -0500, H*a*r*r*o*l*d wrote: On 7/11/2014 6:55 AM, F*O*A*D wrote: On 7/11/14, 6:57 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote: On 7/11/2014 2:11 AM, jps wrote: On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 00:40:45 -0400, wrote: On Thu, 10 Jul 2014 20:02:33 -0700, jps wrote: The vast majority are suicides, somewhere around 17 - 19,000 a year. Murders are around 11,000 a year. So you think if there were no guns, there would be no suicides? Just look at Japan, one of your ideal countries. No guns and a much higher suicide rate than the US. The more you drill down on the numbers, the worse your case gets. I have pointed out Australia many times. They got rid of most of their guns and it had very little effect of on the slope of their murder rate. Well, we certainly did shift real quick there, eh? Went from 31,000 gun deaths a year coming out of my ass to, wouldn't it happen anyway? And you're dead wrong about Australia, they've virtually eliminated mass shootings from their society. My point is, if guns make a country safer, we should be the safest ****ing country on the planet. They don't and we're not. Greg said that getting rid of most of their guns has had little effect on the slope of the murder rate in Australia. Your rebuttal was that Australia has virtually eliminated mass shootings. If both statements are true, the elimination of guns has had little effect on Australia's murder rate. I think that was his point. One thing that is totally ignored in this great gun debate is the cultural and ethnic diversity of the United States compared to any other country on the planet. It has both positive and negative ramifications on our society. The "Great Melting Pot" isn't utopia. Guns don't create racial intolerance, conflicts based on religious beliefs, conflicts of cultural or ethnic traditions or the inner city gang wars that Wayne accurately points out represents the vast majority of gun related deaths. Personally I also think that the slow shredding of unifying traditions that have been challenged by groups focused only on their belief system serves to further polarize the country and puts an emphasis on our cultural, religious and ethnic diversity as we slide into a "progressive" liberal never-never land. We are slowly removing the measuring sticks of our societal structure that includes the good with the bad and replacing it with a free-for-all "anything goes" mentality that is increasingly based on an entitlement philosophy. So, going back to guns. They are not the *reason* for our problems. My guess is that JPS believes guns do not make a country safer. I agree with him. What would make a country safer? Border security, condoms or sterilization, mandatory high school education, drug tests for welfare recipients, voter ID's, and others. I think you are on the right track -- "I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them". Thomas Jefferson |
Keeping that family safe
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Keeping that family safe
jps wrote:
On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 00:58:34 -0500, Califbill wrote: jps wrote: On Thu, 10 Jul 2014 21:49:19 -0400, Wayne.B wrote: On Thu, 10 Jul 2014 18:38:25 -0700, jps wrote: I'm waiting for a Conservative Senator's kid to be shot accidentally so that congress might reconsider closing sales loopholes and instituting a mental health database and policy with some teeth. === Be careful what you ask for, that's my advice. It might turn out to be an example of the cure being worse than the disease. The vast majority of shootings occur in inner city ghettos and are drug related. Those facts are indisputable whether we like it or not. Do you really think that all of these drug selling gang members are going to show up in a mental health database? More likely you or your neighbor's wife, and the label will follow you around forever. The vast majority are suicides, somewhere around 17 - 19,000 a year. Murders are around 11,000 a year. Actually murders over 16,000. Only 11000 via firearm. So, 66%+ of murders are committed by gun. Very impressive. Means guns are not the problem! |
Keeping that family safe
jps wrote:
On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 00:40:45 -0400, wrote: On Thu, 10 Jul 2014 20:02:33 -0700, jps wrote: The vast majority are suicides, somewhere around 17 - 19,000 a year. Murders are around 11,000 a year. So you think if there were no guns, there would be no suicides? Just look at Japan, one of your ideal countries. No guns and a much higher suicide rate than the US. The more you drill down on the numbers, the worse your case gets. I have pointed out Australia many times. They got rid of most of their guns and it had very little effect of on the slope of their murder rate. Well, we certainly did shift real quick there, eh? Went from 31,000 gun deaths a year coming out of my ass to, wouldn't it happen anyway? And you're dead wrong about Australia, they've virtually eliminated mass shootings from their society. My point is, if guns make a country safer, we should be the safest ****ing country on the planet. They don't and we're not. Most of our mass shootings are in gun controlled cities and involve the Drug War. Are you only concerned about mass shootings by nut cases? |
Keeping that family safe
On 7/11/2014 1:17 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 12:04:47 -0500, Califbill wrote: jps wrote: On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 00:40:45 -0400, wrote: On Thu, 10 Jul 2014 20:02:33 -0700, jps wrote: The vast majority are suicides, somewhere around 17 - 19,000 a year. Murders are around 11,000 a year. So you think if there were no guns, there would be no suicides? Just look at Japan, one of your ideal countries. No guns and a much higher suicide rate than the US. The more you drill down on the numbers, the worse your case gets. I have pointed out Australia many times. They got rid of most of their guns and it had very little effect of on the slope of their murder rate. Well, we certainly did shift real quick there, eh? Went from 31,000 gun deaths a year coming out of my ass to, wouldn't it happen anyway? And you're dead wrong about Australia, they've virtually eliminated mass shootings from their society. My point is, if guns make a country safer, we should be the safest ****ing country on the planet. They don't and we're not. Most of our mass shootings are in gun controlled cities and involve the Drug War. Are you only concerned about mass shootings by nut cases? JP only cares about the shootings that make the news. It is not news when black people shoot each other so he doesn't care. If someone said "guns don't kill people, blacks and hispanics with guns kill people" they would be called racist ... but it would still be statistically true. If you take them out of the totals we cut the murder rate (per 100,000) in half. "Shallow" |
Keeping that family safe
On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 13:17:51 -0400, wrote:
On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 12:04:47 -0500, Califbill wrote: jps wrote: On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 00:40:45 -0400, wrote: On Thu, 10 Jul 2014 20:02:33 -0700, jps wrote: The vast majority are suicides, somewhere around 17 - 19,000 a year. Murders are around 11,000 a year. So you think if there were no guns, there would be no suicides? Just look at Japan, one of your ideal countries. No guns and a much higher suicide rate than the US. The more you drill down on the numbers, the worse your case gets. I have pointed out Australia many times. They got rid of most of their guns and it had very little effect of on the slope of their murder rate. Well, we certainly did shift real quick there, eh? Went from 31,000 gun deaths a year coming out of my ass to, wouldn't it happen anyway? And you're dead wrong about Australia, they've virtually eliminated mass shootings from their society. My point is, if guns make a country safer, we should be the safest ****ing country on the planet. They don't and we're not. Most of our mass shootings are in gun controlled cities and involve the Drug War. Are you only concerned about mass shootings by nut cases? JP only cares about the shootings that make the news. It is not news when black people shoot each other so he doesn't care. If someone said "guns don't kill people, blacks and hispanics with guns kill people" they would be called racist ... but it would still be statistically true. If you take them out of the totals we cut the murder rate (per 100,000) in half. It's only racist if I say it. It's disregarded if someone else says it, 'cause the truth hurts. |
Keeping that family safe
On 7/11/14, 2:11 PM, Poquito Loco wrote:
It's only racist if I say it. It's disregarded if someone else says it, 'cause the truth hurts. snerk You've got "smug, self-satisfied, racist asshole" down pat, Herring. -- Republicans . . . the anti-immigrant, anti-contraception, anti-student, anti-middle class, pro-impeachment party that shut down the government last year for no reason. |
Keeping that family safe
On 7/11/2014 2:43 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 14:11:17 -0400, Poquito Loco wrote: On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 13:17:51 -0400, wrote: On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 12:04:47 -0500, Califbill wrote: jps wrote: On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 00:40:45 -0400, wrote: On Thu, 10 Jul 2014 20:02:33 -0700, jps wrote: The vast majority are suicides, somewhere around 17 - 19,000 a year. Murders are around 11,000 a year. So you think if there were no guns, there would be no suicides? Just look at Japan, one of your ideal countries. No guns and a much higher suicide rate than the US. The more you drill down on the numbers, the worse your case gets. I have pointed out Australia many times. They got rid of most of their guns and it had very little effect of on the slope of their murder rate. Well, we certainly did shift real quick there, eh? Went from 31,000 gun deaths a year coming out of my ass to, wouldn't it happen anyway? And you're dead wrong about Australia, they've virtually eliminated mass shootings from their society. My point is, if guns make a country safer, we should be the safest ****ing country on the planet. They don't and we're not. Most of our mass shootings are in gun controlled cities and involve the Drug War. Are you only concerned about mass shootings by nut cases? JP only cares about the shootings that make the news. It is not news when black people shoot each other so he doesn't care. If someone said "guns don't kill people, blacks and hispanics with guns kill people" they would be called racist ... but it would still be statistically true. If you take them out of the totals we cut the murder rate (per 100,000) in half. It's only racist if I say it. It's disregarded if someone else says it, 'cause the truth hurts. I find it interesting that there is a black guy on CNN as we speak saying that the surge of violence in New York this summer is because they stopped "stop and frisk" and that although black people were affected by that policy, they are affected more by this surge of violent crime, since they are disproportionalely represented as victims. I saw a black politician from NY saying the same thing yesterday... I did not recognize his name so I don't remember it... |
Keeping that family safe
On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 12:04:46 -0500, Califbill
wrote: jps wrote: On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 00:58:34 -0500, Califbill wrote: jps wrote: On Thu, 10 Jul 2014 21:49:19 -0400, Wayne.B wrote: On Thu, 10 Jul 2014 18:38:25 -0700, jps wrote: I'm waiting for a Conservative Senator's kid to be shot accidentally so that congress might reconsider closing sales loopholes and instituting a mental health database and policy with some teeth. === Be careful what you ask for, that's my advice. It might turn out to be an example of the cure being worse than the disease. The vast majority of shootings occur in inner city ghettos and are drug related. Those facts are indisputable whether we like it or not. Do you really think that all of these drug selling gang members are going to show up in a mental health database? More likely you or your neighbor's wife, and the label will follow you around forever. The vast majority are suicides, somewhere around 17 - 19,000 a year. Murders are around 11,000 a year. Actually murders over 16,000. Only 11000 via firearm. So, 66%+ of murders are committed by gun. Very impressive. Means guns are not the problem! Means guns make it easier to commit murder. |
Keeping that family safe
On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 14:43:02 -0400, wrote:
On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 14:11:17 -0400, Poquito Loco wrote: On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 13:17:51 -0400, wrote: On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 12:04:47 -0500, Califbill wrote: jps wrote: On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 00:40:45 -0400, wrote: On Thu, 10 Jul 2014 20:02:33 -0700, jps wrote: The vast majority are suicides, somewhere around 17 - 19,000 a year. Murders are around 11,000 a year. So you think if there were no guns, there would be no suicides? Just look at Japan, one of your ideal countries. No guns and a much higher suicide rate than the US. The more you drill down on the numbers, the worse your case gets. I have pointed out Australia many times. They got rid of most of their guns and it had very little effect of on the slope of their murder rate. Well, we certainly did shift real quick there, eh? Went from 31,000 gun deaths a year coming out of my ass to, wouldn't it happen anyway? And you're dead wrong about Australia, they've virtually eliminated mass shootings from their society. My point is, if guns make a country safer, we should be the safest ****ing country on the planet. They don't and we're not. Most of our mass shootings are in gun controlled cities and involve the Drug War. Are you only concerned about mass shootings by nut cases? JP only cares about the shootings that make the news. It is not news when black people shoot each other so he doesn't care. If someone said "guns don't kill people, blacks and hispanics with guns kill people" they would be called racist ... but it would still be statistically true. If you take them out of the totals we cut the murder rate (per 100,000) in half. It's only racist if I say it. It's disregarded if someone else says it, 'cause the truth hurts. I find it interesting that there is a black guy on CNN as we speak saying that the surge of violence in New York this summer is because they stopped "stop and frisk" and that although black people were affected by that policy, they are affected more by this surge of violent crime, since they are disproportionalely represented as victims. If it's blacks it's a 'so what' from jps and Krause. To mention it is racist. |
Keeping that family safe
On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 08:05:18 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote: On 7/11/2014 7:55 AM, F*O*A*D wrote: On 7/11/14, 6:57 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote: On 7/11/2014 2:11 AM, jps wrote: On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 00:40:45 -0400, wrote: On Thu, 10 Jul 2014 20:02:33 -0700, jps wrote: The vast majority are suicides, somewhere around 17 - 19,000 a year. Murders are around 11,000 a year. So you think if there were no guns, there would be no suicides? Just look at Japan, one of your ideal countries. No guns and a much higher suicide rate than the US. The more you drill down on the numbers, the worse your case gets. I have pointed out Australia many times. They got rid of most of their guns and it had very little effect of on the slope of their murder rate. Well, we certainly did shift real quick there, eh? Went from 31,000 gun deaths a year coming out of my ass to, wouldn't it happen anyway? And you're dead wrong about Australia, they've virtually eliminated mass shootings from their society. My point is, if guns make a country safer, we should be the safest ****ing country on the planet. They don't and we're not. Greg said that getting rid of most of their guns has had little effect on the slope of the murder rate in Australia. Your rebuttal was that Australia has virtually eliminated mass shootings. If both statements are true, the elimination of guns has had little effect on Australia's murder rate. I think that was his point. One thing that is totally ignored in this great gun debate is the cultural and ethnic diversity of the United States compared to any other country on the planet. It has both positive and negative ramifications on our society. The "Great Melting Pot" isn't utopia. Guns don't create racial intolerance, conflicts based on religious beliefs, conflicts of cultural or ethnic traditions or the inner city gang wars that Wayne accurately points out represents the vast majority of gun related deaths. Personally I also think that the slow shredding of unifying traditions that have been challenged by groups focused only on their belief system serves to further polarize the country and puts an emphasis on our cultural, religious and ethnic diversity as we slide into a "progressive" liberal never-never land. We are slowly removing the measuring sticks of our societal structure that includes the good with the bad and replacing it with a free-for-all "anything goes" mentality that is increasingly based on an entitlement philosophy. So, going back to guns. They are not the *reason* for our problems. My guess is that JPS believes guns do not make a country safer. I agree with him. As a 65 year old living in an increasingly drug infested society and a growing expectation of "what's your's is mine" ... I feel somewhat safer having a last resort means of self defense available. I never felt that way when I was younger. Not to make light of a serious issue but it's like having a fire extinguisher. Hopefully and statistically you will never need it but if you should, it could save lives and property. A serious answer to a serious concern. I appreciate that. Unfortunately, in the hands of someone less stable, that same weapon is more likely to be used against themselves, a family member or someone they know. In terms of odds, homes with guns are something like 7 times more likely to have a gun-related death or injury, either by accident or on purpuse. I do not believe this is the result of the environment immediately outside the home, unless you reside in the worst parts of Chicago where the danger outside may eclipse the danger a weapon poses inside the home. |
Keeping that family safe
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Keeping that family safe
On 7/11/2014 6:17 PM, jps wrote:
On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 08:05:18 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: On 7/11/2014 7:55 AM, F*O*A*D wrote: On 7/11/14, 6:57 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote: On 7/11/2014 2:11 AM, jps wrote: On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 00:40:45 -0400, wrote: On Thu, 10 Jul 2014 20:02:33 -0700, jps wrote: The vast majority are suicides, somewhere around 17 - 19,000 a year. Murders are around 11,000 a year. So you think if there were no guns, there would be no suicides? Just look at Japan, one of your ideal countries. No guns and a much higher suicide rate than the US. The more you drill down on the numbers, the worse your case gets. I have pointed out Australia many times. They got rid of most of their guns and it had very little effect of on the slope of their murder rate. Well, we certainly did shift real quick there, eh? Went from 31,000 gun deaths a year coming out of my ass to, wouldn't it happen anyway? And you're dead wrong about Australia, they've virtually eliminated mass shootings from their society. My point is, if guns make a country safer, we should be the safest ****ing country on the planet. They don't and we're not. Greg said that getting rid of most of their guns has had little effect on the slope of the murder rate in Australia. Your rebuttal was that Australia has virtually eliminated mass shootings. If both statements are true, the elimination of guns has had little effect on Australia's murder rate. I think that was his point. One thing that is totally ignored in this great gun debate is the cultural and ethnic diversity of the United States compared to any other country on the planet. It has both positive and negative ramifications on our society. The "Great Melting Pot" isn't utopia. Guns don't create racial intolerance, conflicts based on religious beliefs, conflicts of cultural or ethnic traditions or the inner city gang wars that Wayne accurately points out represents the vast majority of gun related deaths. Personally I also think that the slow shredding of unifying traditions that have been challenged by groups focused only on their belief system serves to further polarize the country and puts an emphasis on our cultural, religious and ethnic diversity as we slide into a "progressive" liberal never-never land. We are slowly removing the measuring sticks of our societal structure that includes the good with the bad and replacing it with a free-for-all "anything goes" mentality that is increasingly based on an entitlement philosophy. So, going back to guns. They are not the *reason* for our problems. My guess is that JPS believes guns do not make a country safer. I agree with him. As a 65 year old living in an increasingly drug infested society and a growing expectation of "what's your's is mine" ... I feel somewhat safer having a last resort means of self defense available. I never felt that way when I was younger. Not to make light of a serious issue but it's like having a fire extinguisher. Hopefully and statistically you will never need it but if you should, it could save lives and property. A serious answer to a serious concern. I appreciate that. Unfortunately, in the hands of someone less stable, that same weapon is more likely to be used against themselves, a family member or someone they know. In terms of odds, homes with guns are something like 7 times more likely to have a gun-related death or injury, either by accident or on purpuse. I do not believe this is the result of the environment immediately outside the home, unless you reside in the worst parts of Chicago where the danger outside may eclipse the danger a weapon poses inside the home. ....and homes with stairs are more than 95% more likely to have someone injured falling down stairs... Either way, your second arguement is bs too, if I lived in Chicago, I would be much more likely to keep my gun out and loaded than say, your imaginary gated community... |
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