F*O*A*D wrote:
On 4/11/14, 10:23 PM, Califbill wrote:
H*a*r*r*o*l*d wrote:
On 4/11/2014 4:35 PM, F*O*A*D wrote:
On 4/11/14, 2:51 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 4/11/2014 11:07 AM, F*O*A*D wrote:
In the past if you wanted to buy a modern firearm here, you filled out a
couple of forms at the gunshop. If the purchase was a rifle or shotgun,
the usual phone background check was made and if you were ok, you took
the gun home that day. If you were buying a handgun, you had to wait
seven to 10 business days while the state police completed an additional
background check.

Simple enough.

Now, there's another layer.

If you are a civilian with no military background and you are not a cop,
you have to obtain a state Handgun Qualification License (HQL), and
there are several variables.

First time purchasers of handguns have to show proof they've taken a
qualifying handgun training course. I think that is a good idea.

Those without an existing carry permit also have to have submitted on
their behalf ($50) a set of electronic fingerprints taken by a couple of
local sheriff offices or by commercial vendors.

Everyone has to get the HQL and some get a pass on the training and
fingerprinting.

It takes the state about a week to issue the HQL.

The net effect is that the costs involved in obtaining a handgun have
gone up and are now about $100 if you have to get fingerprinted, and
another $25 if you have to get training, and the new processes add about
two weeks to getting the final OK from the staties.


Still not as onerous as in Massachusetts. Requirements here have been
for years:

1. Proof of attending NRA approved safety course.
2. Two classes of handgun permits, Class A and Class B.
Class A is for concealed carry and for all lawful, large capacity
firearms. MA restricts what "large capacity" is however, typically
no more than 10 rounds.

Class "B" is home defense and for transporting to shooting ranges
and certain hunting activities. No concealed carry.

3. The issuance of a Class "A" is up to the local police department.
You must have a good reason for a Class A, concealed carry permit.

4. In all permit classes, the local police chief can put restrictions
on the license, i.e. hunting only or whatever suits his fancy.

5. Mug shots and fingerprinting mandatory. Background check performed
by State Police. No prior court convictions other than minor
traffic violations. It can take up to 8-9 weeks to receive an approved
permit. Some people have waited for several months.




Well, that's a bit more than we have to go through here, but not a lot
more, other than the time period.

I ended up ordering a Ruger revolver after trying out a few Rugers and
S&W's on the range. Both brands are finished nicely, the way you would
expect them to be, with the Smiths maybe a tiny bit better. Both brands
of revolver locked up as tight as you would want.

I did notice, though, that the three S&W's I tried, one new, two used,
had a bit of trigger creep. The Rugers, again two used, one new, did
not. Typically, I'd have to pay a gunsmith $100-$125 to tune up the
action to get rid of the trigger creep and smooth out the action.

What's trigger creep?

Probably not what he is describing. Creep is travel distance after you get
some resistance, Slack is distance before and resistance. He is probably
referring to creep as roughness during the resistance travel.


No, I am not.

Then, you describing the person pulling the trigger?

On 4/11/2014 10:23 PM, Califbill wrote:
H*a*r*r*o*l*d wrote:
On 4/11/2014 4:35 PM, F*O*A*D wrote:
On 4/11/14, 2:51 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 4/11/2014 11:07 AM, F*O*A*D wrote:
In the past if you wanted to buy a modern firearm here, you filled out a
couple of forms at the gunshop. If the purchase was a rifle or shotgun,
the usual phone background check was made and if you were ok, you took
the gun home that day. If you were buying a handgun, you had to wait
seven to 10 business days while the state police completed an additional
background check.

Simple enough.

Now, there's another layer.

If you are a civilian with no military background and you are not a cop,
you have to obtain a state Handgun Qualification License (HQL), and
there are several variables.

First time purchasers of handguns have to show proof they've taken a
qualifying handgun training course. I think that is a good idea.

Those without an existing carry permit also have to have submitted on
their behalf ($50) a set of electronic fingerprints taken by a couple of
local sheriff offices or by commercial vendors.

Everyone has to get the HQL and some get a pass on the training and
fingerprinting.

It takes the state about a week to issue the HQL.

The net effect is that the costs involved in obtaining a handgun have
gone up and are now about $100 if you have to get fingerprinted, and
another $25 if you have to get training, and the new processes add about
two weeks to getting the final OK from the staties.


Still not as onerous as in Massachusetts. Requirements here have been
for years:

1. Proof of attending NRA approved safety course.
2. Two classes of handgun permits, Class A and Class B.
Class A is for concealed carry and for all lawful, large capacity
firearms. MA restricts what "large capacity" is however, typically
no more than 10 rounds.

Class "B" is home defense and for transporting to shooting ranges
and certain hunting activities. No concealed carry.

3. The issuance of a Class "A" is up to the local police department.
You must have a good reason for a Class A, concealed carry permit.

4. In all permit classes, the local police chief can put restrictions
on the license, i.e. hunting only or whatever suits his fancy.

5. Mug shots and fingerprinting mandatory. Background check performed
by State Police. No prior court convictions other than minor
traffic violations. It can take up to 8-9 weeks to receive an approved
permit. Some people have waited for several months.




Well, that's a bit more than we have to go through here, but not a lot
more, other than the time period.

I ended up ordering a Ruger revolver after trying out a few Rugers and
S&W's on the range. Both brands are finished nicely, the way you would
expect them to be, with the Smiths maybe a tiny bit better. Both brands
of revolver locked up as tight as you would want.

I did notice, though, that the three S&W's I tried, one new, two used,
had a bit of trigger creep. The Rugers, again two used, one new, did
not. Typically, I'd have to pay a gunsmith $100-$125 to tune up the
action to get rid of the trigger creep and smooth out the action.

What's trigger creep?

Probably not what he is describing. Creep is travel distance after you get
some resistance, Slack is distance before and resistance. He is probably
referring to creep as roughness during the resistance travel.

Well then Krause is full of bull****. I shot a SW 686-6+ and the trigger
was smooth as silk with no slack.

On 4/12/14, 2:53 AM, Califbill wrote:
F*O*A*D wrote:
On 4/11/14, 10:23 PM, Califbill wrote:
H*a*r*r*o*l*d wrote:
On 4/11/2014 4:35 PM, F*O*A*D wrote:
On 4/11/14, 2:51 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 4/11/2014 11:07 AM, F*O*A*D wrote:
In the past if you wanted to buy a modern firearm here, you filled out a
couple of forms at the gunshop. If the purchase was a rifle or shotgun,
the usual phone background check was made and if you were ok, you took
the gun home that day. If you were buying a handgun, you had to wait
seven to 10 business days while the state police completed an additional
background check.

Simple enough.

Now, there's another layer.

If you are a civilian with no military background and you are not a cop,
you have to obtain a state Handgun Qualification License (HQL), and
there are several variables.

First time purchasers of handguns have to show proof they've taken a
qualifying handgun training course. I think that is a good idea.

Those without an existing carry permit also have to have submitted on
their behalf ($50) a set of electronic fingerprints taken by a couple of
local sheriff offices or by commercial vendors.

Everyone has to get the HQL and some get a pass on the training and
fingerprinting.

It takes the state about a week to issue the HQL.

The net effect is that the costs involved in obtaining a handgun have
gone up and are now about $100 if you have to get fingerprinted, and
another $25 if you have to get training, and the new processes add about
two weeks to getting the final OK from the staties.


Still not as onerous as in Massachusetts. Requirements here have been
for years:

1. Proof of attending NRA approved safety course.
2. Two classes of handgun permits, Class A and Class B.
Class A is for concealed carry and for all lawful, large capacity
firearms. MA restricts what "large capacity" is however, typically
no more than 10 rounds.

Class "B" is home defense and for transporting to shooting ranges
and certain hunting activities. No concealed carry.

3. The issuance of a Class "A" is up to the local police department.
You must have a good reason for a Class A, concealed carry permit.

4. In all permit classes, the local police chief can put restrictions
on the license, i.e. hunting only or whatever suits his fancy.

5. Mug shots and fingerprinting mandatory. Background check performed
by State Police. No prior court convictions other than minor
traffic violations. It can take up to 8-9 weeks to receive an approved
permit. Some people have waited for several months.




Well, that's a bit more than we have to go through here, but not a lot
more, other than the time period.

I ended up ordering a Ruger revolver after trying out a few Rugers and
S&W's on the range. Both brands are finished nicely, the way you would
expect them to be, with the Smiths maybe a tiny bit better. Both brands
of revolver locked up as tight as you would want.

I did notice, though, that the three S&W's I tried, one new, two used,
had a bit of trigger creep. The Rugers, again two used, one new, did
not. Typically, I'd have to pay a gunsmith $100-$125 to tune up the
action to get rid of the trigger creep and smooth out the action.

What's trigger creep?

Probably not what he is describing. Creep is travel distance after you get
some resistance, Slack is distance before and resistance. He is probably
referring to creep as roughness during the resistance travel.


No, I am not.

Then, you describing the person pulling the trigger?


Slack usually is described as the rearward movement of the trigger
before it engages the sear. Trigger creep describes the rearward
movement of the trigger after the sear is engaged and before the gun
mechanism fires the round. It's not roughness, it's distance.
"Roughness" is another aspect of trigger pull. You can have trigger
creep without roughness in the trigger mechanisms. Roughness you can
actually feel in the mechanism usually is a telltale sign of a poorly
finished gun.

The custom CZ I sold had no slack or trigger creep. The S&Ws at the
range, as I noted above, had a bit of trigger creep. The Rugers did
not. Perhaps the S&Ws had seen a lot more use than the Rugers

A good gunsmith who knows how to use stones can usually get rid of
trigger creep. I have a Ruger Mark III target pistol that has a bit of
slack and a tiny bit of trigger creep. Were I competing with the gun,
I'd pay a smith to take out the trigger creep.

On 4/12/2014 7:59 AM, F*O*A*D wrote:
On 4/12/14, 2:53 AM, Califbill wrote:
F*O*A*D wrote:
On 4/11/14, 10:23 PM, Califbill wrote:
H*a*r*r*o*l*d wrote:
On 4/11/2014 4:35 PM, F*O*A*D wrote:
On 4/11/14, 2:51 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 4/11/2014 11:07 AM, F*O*A*D wrote:
In the past if you wanted to buy a modern firearm here, you
filled out a
couple of forms at the gunshop. If the purchase was a rifle or
shotgun,
the usual phone background check was made and if you were ok,
you took
the gun home that day. If you were buying a handgun, you had to
wait
seven to 10 business days while the state police completed an
additional
background check.

Simple enough.

Now, there's another layer.

If you are a civilian with no military background and you are
not a cop,
you have to obtain a state Handgun Qualification License (HQL), and
there are several variables.

First time purchasers of handguns have to show proof they've
taken a
qualifying handgun training course. I think that is a good idea.

Those without an existing carry permit also have to have
submitted on
their behalf ($50) a set of electronic fingerprints taken by a
couple of
local sheriff offices or by commercial vendors.

Everyone has to get the HQL and some get a pass on the training and
fingerprinting.

It takes the state about a week to issue the HQL.

The net effect is that the costs involved in obtaining a handgun
have
gone up and are now about $100 if you have to get fingerprinted,
and
another $25 if you have to get training, and the new processes
add about
two weeks to getting the final OK from the staties.


Still not as onerous as in Massachusetts. Requirements here
have been
for years:

1. Proof of attending NRA approved safety course.
2. Two classes of handgun permits, Class A and Class B.
Class A is for concealed carry and for all lawful, large
capacity
firearms. MA restricts what "large capacity" is however,
typically
no more than 10 rounds.

Class "B" is home defense and for transporting to shooting
ranges
and certain hunting activities. No concealed carry.

3. The issuance of a Class "A" is up to the local police
department.
You must have a good reason for a Class A, concealed carry
permit.

4. In all permit classes, the local police chief can put
restrictions
on the license, i.e. hunting only or whatever suits his
fancy.

5. Mug shots and fingerprinting mandatory. Background check
performed
by State Police. No prior court convictions other than minor
traffic violations. It can take up to 8-9 weeks to receive an
approved
permit. Some people have waited for several months.




Well, that's a bit more than we have to go through here, but not a
lot
more, other than the time period.

I ended up ordering a Ruger revolver after trying out a few Rugers
and
S&W's on the range. Both brands are finished nicely, the way you
would
expect them to be, with the Smiths maybe a tiny bit better. Both
brands
of revolver locked up as tight as you would want.

I did notice, though, that the three S&W's I tried, one new, two
used,
had a bit of trigger creep. The Rugers, again two used, one new, did
not. Typically, I'd have to pay a gunsmith $100-$125 to tune up the
action to get rid of the trigger creep and smooth out the action.

What's trigger creep?

Probably not what he is describing. Creep is travel distance after
you get
some resistance, Slack is distance before and resistance. He is
probably
referring to creep as roughness during the resistance travel.


No, I am not.

Then, you describing the person pulling the trigger?


Slack usually is described as the rearward movement of the trigger
before it engages the sear. Trigger creep describes the rearward
movement of the trigger after the sear is engaged and before the gun
mechanism fires the round. It's not roughness, it's distance.
"Roughness" is another aspect of trigger pull. You can have trigger
creep without roughness in the trigger mechanisms. Roughness you can
actually feel in the mechanism usually is a telltale sign of a poorly
finished gun.

The custom CZ I sold had no slack or trigger creep. The S&Ws at the
range, as I noted above, had a bit of trigger creep. The Rugers did
not. Perhaps the S&Ws had seen a lot more use than the Rugers

A good gunsmith who knows how to use stones can usually get rid of
trigger creep. I have a Ruger Mark III target pistol that has a bit of
slack and a tiny bit of trigger creep. Were I competing with the gun,
I'd pay a smith to take out the trigger creep.
The custom CZ you had was a dangerous gun. I wouldn't give you a nickle
for it.

BAR wrote:
In article , says...

On 4/12/14, 2:53 AM, Califbill wrote:
F*O*A*D wrote:
On 4/11/14, 10:23 PM, Califbill wrote:
H*a*r*r*o*l*d wrote:
On 4/11/2014 4:35 PM, F*O*A*D wrote:
On 4/11/14, 2:51 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 4/11/2014 11:07 AM, F*O*A*D wrote:
In the past if you wanted to buy a modern firearm here, you filled out a
couple of forms at the gunshop. If the purchase was a rifle or shotgun,
the usual phone background check was made and if you were ok, you took
the gun home that day. If you were buying a handgun, you had to wait
seven to 10 business days while the state police completed an additional
background check.

Simple enough.

Now, there's another layer.

If you are a civilian with no military background and you are not a cop,
you have to obtain a state Handgun Qualification License (HQL), and
there are several variables.

First time purchasers of handguns have to show proof they've taken a
qualifying handgun training course. I think that is a good idea.

Those without an existing carry permit also have to have submitted on
their behalf ($50) a set of electronic fingerprints taken by a couple of
local sheriff offices or by commercial vendors.

Everyone has to get the HQL and some get a pass on the training and
fingerprinting.

It takes the state about a week to issue the HQL.

The net effect is that the costs involved in obtaining a handgun have
gone up and are now about $100 if you have to get fingerprinted, and
another $25 if you have to get training, and the new processes add about
two weeks to getting the final OK from the staties.


Still not as onerous as in Massachusetts. Requirements here have been
for years:

1. Proof of attending NRA approved safety course.
2. Two classes of handgun permits, Class A and Class B.
Class A is for concealed carry and for all lawful, large capacity
firearms. MA restricts what "large capacity" is however, typically
no more than 10 rounds.

Class "B" is home defense and for transporting to shooting ranges
and certain hunting activities. No concealed carry.

3. The issuance of a Class "A" is up to the local police department.
You must have a good reason for a Class A, concealed carry permit.

4. In all permit classes, the local police chief can put restrictions
on the license, i.e. hunting only or whatever suits his fancy.

5. Mug shots and fingerprinting mandatory. Background check performed
by State Police. No prior court convictions other than minor
traffic violations. It can take up to 8-9 weeks to receive an approved
permit. Some people have waited for several months.




Well, that's a bit more than we have to go through here, but not a lot
more, other than the time period.

I ended up ordering a Ruger revolver after trying out a few Rugers and
S&W's on the range. Both brands are finished nicely, the way you would
expect them to be, with the Smiths maybe a tiny bit better. Both brands
of revolver locked up as tight as you would want.

I did notice, though, that the three S&W's I tried, one new, two used,
had a bit of trigger creep. The Rugers, again two used, one new, did
not. Typically, I'd have to pay a gunsmith $100-$125 to tune up the
action to get rid of the trigger creep and smooth out the action.

What's trigger creep?

Probably not what he is describing. Creep is travel distance after you get
some resistance, Slack is distance before and resistance. He is probably
referring to creep as roughness during the resistance travel.


No, I am not.

Then, you describing the person pulling the trigger?


Slack usually is described as the rearward movement of the trigger
before it engages the sear. Trigger creep describes the rearward
movement of the trigger after the sear is engaged and before the gun
mechanism fires the round. It's not roughness, it's distance.
"Roughness" is another aspect of trigger pull. You can have trigger
creep without roughness in the trigger mechanisms. Roughness you can
actually feel in the mechanism usually is a telltale sign of a poorly
finished gun.

The custom CZ I sold had no slack or trigger creep. The S&Ws at the
range, as I noted above, had a bit of trigger creep. The Rugers did
not. Perhaps the S&Ws had seen a lot more use than the Rugers

A good gunsmith who knows how to use stones can usually get rid of
trigger creep. I have a Ruger Mark III target pistol that has a bit of
slack and a tiny bit of trigger creep. Were I competing with the gun,
I'd pay a smith to take out the trigger creep.

Aren't you prohibited form possessing firearms in Maryland? Too bad you
moved out of Virginia. If you had stayed in Virginia you could have
continued to kill stumpy on a weekly basis.

Bertie! You are still here? I guess you aren't filtered yet on my iPhone
app. No, **** for brains, I am not prohibited from legally buying regulated
firearms in Maryland. I just bought a new revolver that will be shipped
soon to a local FFL. You should cut back on those Bircher fantasies about
me. Why don't you go apply for a Maryland carry permit? Oh darn... *you*
can't get one. 😟

On Saturday, April 12, 2014 9:49:37 AM UTC-4, F. O. A. D. wrote:
BAR wrote:

In article , says...



On 4/12/14, 2:53 AM, Califbill wrote:

F*O*A*D wrote:

On 4/11/14, 10:23 PM, Califbill wrote:

H*a*r*r*o*l*d wrote:

On 4/11/2014 4:35 PM, F*O*A*D wrote:

On 4/11/14, 2:51 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:

On 4/11/2014 11:07 AM, F*O*A*D wrote:

In the past if you wanted to buy a modern firearm here, you filled out a

couple of forms at the gunshop. If the purchase was a rifle or shotgun,

the usual phone background check was made and if you were ok, you took

the gun home that day. If you were buying a handgun, you had to wait

seven to 10 business days while the state police completed an additional

background check.



Simple enough.



Now, there's another layer.



If you are a civilian with no military background and you are not a cop,

you have to obtain a state Handgun Qualification License (HQL), and

there are several variables.



First time purchasers of handguns have to show proof they've taken a

qualifying handgun training course. I think that is a good idea..



Those without an existing carry permit also have to have submitted on

their behalf ($50) a set of electronic fingerprints taken by a couple of

local sheriff offices or by commercial vendors.



Everyone has to get the HQL and some get a pass on the training and

fingerprinting.



It takes the state about a week to issue the HQL.



The net effect is that the costs involved in obtaining a handgun have

gone up and are now about $100 if you have to get fingerprinted, and

another $25 if you have to get training, and the new processes add about

two weeks to getting the final OK from the staties.





Still not as onerous as in Massachusetts. Requirements here have been

for years:



1. Proof of attending NRA approved safety course.

2. Two classes of handgun permits, Class A and Class B.

Class A is for concealed carry and for all lawful, large capacity

firearms. MA restricts what "large capacity" is however, typically

no more than 10 rounds.



Class "B" is home defense and for transporting to shooting ranges

and certain hunting activities. No concealed carry.



3. The issuance of a Class "A" is up to the local police department.

You must have a good reason for a Class A, concealed carry permit.



4. In all permit classes, the local police chief can put restrictions

on the license, i.e. hunting only or whatever suits his fancy.



5. Mug shots and fingerprinting mandatory. Background check performed

by State Police. No prior court convictions other than minor

traffic violations. It can take up to 8-9 weeks to receive an approved

permit. Some people have waited for several months.









Well, that's a bit more than we have to go through here, but not a lot

more, other than the time period.



I ended up ordering a Ruger revolver after trying out a few Rugers and

S&W's on the range. Both brands are finished nicely, the way you would

expect them to be, with the Smiths maybe a tiny bit better. Both brands

of revolver locked up as tight as you would want.



I did notice, though, that the three S&W's I tried, one new, two used,

had a bit of trigger creep. The Rugers, again two used, one new, did

not. Typically, I'd have to pay a gunsmith $100-$125 to tune up the

action to get rid of the trigger creep and smooth out the action.



What's trigger creep?



Probably not what he is describing. Creep is travel distance after you get

some resistance, Slack is distance before and resistance. He is probably

referring to creep as roughness during the resistance travel.





No, I am not.



Then, you describing the person pulling the trigger?





Slack usually is described as the rearward movement of the trigger

before it engages the sear. Trigger creep describes the rearward

movement of the trigger after the sear is engaged and before the gun

mechanism fires the round. It's not roughness, it's distance.

"Roughness" is another aspect of trigger pull. You can have trigger

creep without roughness in the trigger mechanisms. Roughness you can

actually feel in the mechanism usually is a telltale sign of a poorly

finished gun.



The custom CZ I sold had no slack or trigger creep. The S&Ws at the

range, as I noted above, had a bit of trigger creep. The Rugers did

not. Perhaps the S&Ws had seen a lot more use than the Rugers



A good gunsmith who knows how to use stones can usually get rid of

trigger creep. I have a Ruger Mark III target pistol that has a bit of

slack and a tiny bit of trigger creep. Were I competing with the gun,

I'd pay a smith to take out the trigger creep.



Aren't you prohibited form possessing firearms in Maryland? Too bad you

moved out of Virginia. If you had stayed in Virginia you could have

continued to kill stumpy on a weekly basis.



Bertie! You are still here? I guess you aren't filtered yet on my iPhone

app. No, **** for brains, I am not prohibited from legally buying regulated

firearms in Maryland. I just bought a new revolver that will be shipped

soon to a local FFL. You should cut back on those Bircher fantasies about

me. Why don't you go apply for a Maryland carry permit? Oh darn... *you*

can't get one. 😟

Has the IRS come to audit your books yet, ****?

F*O*A*D wrote:
On 4/12/14, 2:53 AM, Califbill wrote:
F*O*A*D wrote:
On 4/11/14, 10:23 PM, Califbill wrote:
H*a*r*r*o*l*d wrote:
On 4/11/2014 4:35 PM, F*O*A*D wrote:
On 4/11/14, 2:51 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 4/11/2014 11:07 AM, F*O*A*D wrote:
In the past if you wanted to buy a modern firearm here, you filled out a
couple of forms at the gunshop. If the purchase was a rifle or shotgun,
the usual phone background check was made and if you were ok, you took
the gun home that day. If you were buying a handgun, you had to wait
seven to 10 business days while the state police completed an additional
background check.

Simple enough.

Now, there's another layer.

If you are a civilian with no military background and you are not a cop,
you have to obtain a state Handgun Qualification License (HQL), and
there are several variables.

First time purchasers of handguns have to show proof they've taken a
qualifying handgun training course. I think that is a good idea.

Those without an existing carry permit also have to have submitted on
their behalf ($50) a set of electronic fingerprints taken by a couple of
local sheriff offices or by commercial vendors.

Everyone has to get the HQL and some get a pass on the training and
fingerprinting.

It takes the state about a week to issue the HQL.

The net effect is that the costs involved in obtaining a handgun have
gone up and are now about $100 if you have to get fingerprinted, and
another $25 if you have to get training, and the new processes add about
two weeks to getting the final OK from the staties.


Still not as onerous as in Massachusetts. Requirements here have been
for years:

1. Proof of attending NRA approved safety course.
2. Two classes of handgun permits, Class A and Class B.
Class A is for concealed carry and for all lawful, large capacity
firearms. MA restricts what "large capacity" is however, typically
no more than 10 rounds.

Class "B" is home defense and for transporting to shooting ranges
and certain hunting activities. No concealed carry.

3. The issuance of a Class "A" is up to the local police department.
You must have a good reason for a Class A, concealed carry permit.

4. In all permit classes, the local police chief can put restrictions
on the license, i.e. hunting only or whatever suits his fancy.

5. Mug shots and fingerprinting mandatory. Background check performed
by State Police. No prior court convictions other than minor
traffic violations. It can take up to 8-9 weeks to receive an approved
permit. Some people have waited for several months.




Well, that's a bit more than we have to go through here, but not a lot
more, other than the time period.

I ended up ordering a Ruger revolver after trying out a few Rugers and
S&W's on the range. Both brands are finished nicely, the way you would
expect them to be, with the Smiths maybe a tiny bit better. Both brands
of revolver locked up as tight as you would want.

I did notice, though, that the three S&W's I tried, one new, two used,
had a bit of trigger creep. The Rugers, again two used, one new, did
not. Typically, I'd have to pay a gunsmith $100-$125 to tune up the
action to get rid of the trigger creep and smooth out the action.

What's trigger creep?

Probably not what he is describing. Creep is travel distance after you get
some resistance, Slack is distance before and resistance. He is probably
referring to creep as roughness during the resistance travel.


No, I am not.

Then, you describing the person pulling the trigger?


Slack usually is described as the rearward movement of the trigger before
it engages the sear. Trigger creep describes the rearward movement of the
trigger after the sear is engaged and before the gun mechanism fires the
round. It's not roughness, it's distance. "Roughness" is another aspect
of trigger pull. You can have trigger creep without roughness in the
trigger mechanisms. Roughness you can actually feel in the mechanism
usually is a telltale sign of a poorly finished gun.

The custom CZ I sold had no slack or trigger creep. The S&Ws at the
range, as I noted above, had a bit of trigger creep. The Rugers did not.
Perhaps the S&Ws had seen a lot more use than the Rugers

A good gunsmith who knows how to use stones can usually get rid of
trigger creep. I have a Ruger Mark III target pistol that has a bit of
slack and a tiny bit of trigger creep. Were I competing with the gun, I'd
pay a smith to take out the trigger creep.

No trigger creep, would be the proverbial "hair trigger". Not wanted, and
dangerous!

On 4/14/14, 12:16 AM, Califbill wrote:
F*O*A*D wrote:
On 4/12/14, 2:53 AM, Califbill wrote:
F*O*A*D wrote:
On 4/11/14, 10:23 PM, Califbill wrote:
H*a*r*r*o*l*d wrote:
On 4/11/2014 4:35 PM, F*O*A*D wrote:
On 4/11/14, 2:51 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 4/11/2014 11:07 AM, F*O*A*D wrote:
In the past if you wanted to buy a modern firearm here, you filled out a
couple of forms at the gunshop. If the purchase was a rifle or shotgun,
the usual phone background check was made and if you were ok, you took
the gun home that day. If you were buying a handgun, you had to wait
seven to 10 business days while the state police completed an additional
background check.

Simple enough.

Now, there's another layer.

If you are a civilian with no military background and you are not a cop,
you have to obtain a state Handgun Qualification License (HQL), and
there are several variables.

First time purchasers of handguns have to show proof they've taken a
qualifying handgun training course. I think that is a good idea.

Those without an existing carry permit also have to have submitted on
their behalf ($50) a set of electronic fingerprints taken by a couple of
local sheriff offices or by commercial vendors.

Everyone has to get the HQL and some get a pass on the training and
fingerprinting.

It takes the state about a week to issue the HQL.

The net effect is that the costs involved in obtaining a handgun have
gone up and are now about $100 if you have to get fingerprinted, and
another $25 if you have to get training, and the new processes add about
two weeks to getting the final OK from the staties.


Still not as onerous as in Massachusetts. Requirements here have been
for years:

1. Proof of attending NRA approved safety course.
2. Two classes of handgun permits, Class A and Class B.
Class A is for concealed carry and for all lawful, large capacity
firearms. MA restricts what "large capacity" is however, typically
no more than 10 rounds.

Class "B" is home defense and for transporting to shooting ranges
and certain hunting activities. No concealed carry.

3. The issuance of a Class "A" is up to the local police department.
You must have a good reason for a Class A, concealed carry permit.

4. In all permit classes, the local police chief can put restrictions
on the license, i.e. hunting only or whatever suits his fancy.

5. Mug shots and fingerprinting mandatory. Background check performed
by State Police. No prior court convictions other than minor
traffic violations. It can take up to 8-9 weeks to receive an approved
permit. Some people have waited for several months.




Well, that's a bit more than we have to go through here, but not a lot
more, other than the time period.

I ended up ordering a Ruger revolver after trying out a few Rugers and
S&W's on the range. Both brands are finished nicely, the way you would
expect them to be, with the Smiths maybe a tiny bit better. Both brands
of revolver locked up as tight as you would want.

I did notice, though, that the three S&W's I tried, one new, two used,
had a bit of trigger creep. The Rugers, again two used, one new, did
not. Typically, I'd have to pay a gunsmith $100-$125 to tune up the
action to get rid of the trigger creep and smooth out the action.

What's trigger creep?

Probably not what he is describing. Creep is travel distance after you get
some resistance, Slack is distance before and resistance. He is probably
referring to creep as roughness during the resistance travel.


No, I am not.

Then, you describing the person pulling the trigger?


Slack usually is described as the rearward movement of the trigger before
it engages the sear. Trigger creep describes the rearward movement of the
trigger after the sear is engaged and before the gun mechanism fires the
round. It's not roughness, it's distance. "Roughness" is another aspect
of trigger pull. You can have trigger creep without roughness in the
trigger mechanisms. Roughness you can actually feel in the mechanism
usually is a telltale sign of a poorly finished gun.

The custom CZ I sold had no slack or trigger creep. The S&Ws at the
range, as I noted above, had a bit of trigger creep. The Rugers did not.
Perhaps the S&Ws had seen a lot more use than the Rugers

A good gunsmith who knows how to use stones can usually get rid of
trigger creep. I have a Ruger Mark III target pistol that has a bit of
slack and a tiny bit of trigger creep. Were I competing with the gun, I'd
pay a smith to take out the trigger creep.

No trigger creep, would be the proverbial "hair trigger". Not wanted, and
dangerous!


Try shooting USPSA with semi-auto suffering from trigger creep. You'll
never win.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-2_8X5eg3uE

Or in the really big leagues:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SEXJrgugePI

No trigger creep in these firearms.

In article , says...


Try shooting USPSA with semi-auto suffering from trigger creep. You'll
never win.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-2_8X5eg3uE

Or in the really big leagues:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SEXJrgugePI

No trigger creep in these firearms.

About as exciting as a typing contest.

On 4/14/2014 6:50 AM, F*O*A*D wrote:
On 4/14/14, 12:16 AM, Califbill wrote:
F*O*A*D wrote:
On 4/12/14, 2:53 AM, Califbill wrote:
F*O*A*D wrote:
On 4/11/14, 10:23 PM, Califbill wrote:
H*a*r*r*o*l*d wrote:
On 4/11/2014 4:35 PM, F*O*A*D wrote:
On 4/11/14, 2:51 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 4/11/2014 11:07 AM, F*O*A*D wrote:
In the past if you wanted to buy a modern firearm here, you
filled out a
couple of forms at the gunshop. If the purchase was a rifle or
shotgun,
the usual phone background check was made and if you were ok,
you took
the gun home that day. If you were buying a handgun, you had
to wait
seven to 10 business days while the state police completed an
additional
background check.

Simple enough.

Now, there's another layer.

If you are a civilian with no military background and you are
not a cop,
you have to obtain a state Handgun Qualification License
(HQL), and
there are several variables.

First time purchasers of handguns have to show proof they've
taken a
qualifying handgun training course. I think that is a good idea.

Those without an existing carry permit also have to have
submitted on
their behalf ($50) a set of electronic fingerprints taken by a
couple of
local sheriff offices or by commercial vendors.

Everyone has to get the HQL and some get a pass on the
training and
fingerprinting.

It takes the state about a week to issue the HQL.

The net effect is that the costs involved in obtaining a
handgun have
gone up and are now about $100 if you have to get
fingerprinted, and
another $25 if you have to get training, and the new processes
add about
two weeks to getting the final OK from the staties.


Still not as onerous as in Massachusetts. Requirements here
have been
for years:

1. Proof of attending NRA approved safety course.
2. Two classes of handgun permits, Class A and Class B.
Class A is for concealed carry and for all lawful,
large capacity
firearms. MA restricts what "large capacity" is
however, typically
no more than 10 rounds.

Class "B" is home defense and for transporting to
shooting ranges
and certain hunting activities. No concealed carry.

3. The issuance of a Class "A" is up to the local police
department.
You must have a good reason for a Class A, concealed
carry permit.

4. In all permit classes, the local police chief can put
restrictions
on the license, i.e. hunting only or whatever suits
his fancy.

5. Mug shots and fingerprinting mandatory. Background check
performed
by State Police. No prior court convictions other than
minor
traffic violations. It can take up to 8-9 weeks to receive an
approved
permit. Some people have waited for several months.




Well, that's a bit more than we have to go through here, but not
a lot
more, other than the time period.

I ended up ordering a Ruger revolver after trying out a few
Rugers and
S&W's on the range. Both brands are finished nicely, the way you
would
expect them to be, with the Smiths maybe a tiny bit better. Both
brands
of revolver locked up as tight as you would want.

I did notice, though, that the three S&W's I tried, one new, two
used,
had a bit of trigger creep. The Rugers, again two used, one new,
did
not. Typically, I'd have to pay a gunsmith $100-$125 to tune up the
action to get rid of the trigger creep and smooth out the action.

What's trigger creep?

Probably not what he is describing. Creep is travel distance
after you get
some resistance, Slack is distance before and resistance. He is
probably
referring to creep as roughness during the resistance travel.


No, I am not.

Then, you describing the person pulling the trigger?


Slack usually is described as the rearward movement of the trigger
before
it engages the sear. Trigger creep describes the rearward movement of
the
trigger after the sear is engaged and before the gun mechanism fires the
round. It's not roughness, it's distance. "Roughness" is another aspect
of trigger pull. You can have trigger creep without roughness in the
trigger mechanisms. Roughness you can actually feel in the mechanism
usually is a telltale sign of a poorly finished gun.

The custom CZ I sold had no slack or trigger creep. The S&Ws at the
range, as I noted above, had a bit of trigger creep. The Rugers did
not.
Perhaps the S&Ws had seen a lot more use than the Rugers

A good gunsmith who knows how to use stones can usually get rid of
trigger creep. I have a Ruger Mark III target pistol that has a bit of
slack and a tiny bit of trigger creep. Were I competing with the gun,
I'd
pay a smith to take out the trigger creep.

No trigger creep, would be the proverbial "hair trigger". Not wanted, and
dangerous!


Try shooting USPSA with semi-auto suffering from trigger creep. You'll
never win.
What is trigger creep? Is it contagious?