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F.O.A.D. September 6th 13 08:49 PM

Greg, speaking of following the money...
 
Dropped my iMac off at the apple store today, and the checkover and
preauthorized repair data generated the following:

Problem Description/Diagnosis

Issue: Hard drive not mounting

Steps to Reproduce: Verified at bar, machine qualifies for HARD DRIVE
repair program for seagate

Proposed Resolution: Replace hard drive under quality program
Cosmetic Condition of iMac: Great no apparent damage

Estimated Turn Around Time: We'll call you in 3 - 5 days

Mac OS Version: 10.8.4
Hard Drive Size: 1000 GB
Memory Size: 8 GB
iLife Version: n/a



Repair Estimate
Item Number Description Price Amount Due
661-5520 Hard Drive, 1TB, 3.5", 7200, SATA $ 226.14 $ 0.00
S1490LL/A Hardware Repair Labor $ 39.00 $ 0.00
Total (Tax not included) $ 265.14 $ 0.00

Apple prices the retail of that drive at three times what you can buy a
similar one from just about anyone, but certainly lowballs the labor
charge, since it is a pain in the ass to open up an iMac sans the proper
tools, knowledge and guts. (all glass on the front, et cetera)
I would have guessed $125 on the drive and $125 labor.

Anyway, they were out of the drives, but more were scheduled to come in
today or monday, so I left the computer there.

No cost to me because of "quality" program.




John H[_2_] September 6th 13 09:01 PM

Greg, speaking of following the money...
 
On Fri, 06 Sep 2013 15:49:57 -0400, "F.O.A.D." wrote:

Dropped my iMac off at the apple store today, and the checkover and
preauthorized repair data generated the following:

Problem Description/Diagnosis

Issue: Hard drive not mounting

Steps to Reproduce: Verified at bar, machine qualifies for HARD DRIVE
repair program for seagate

Proposed Resolution: Replace hard drive under quality program
Cosmetic Condition of iMac: Great no apparent damage

Estimated Turn Around Time: We'll call you in 3 - 5 days

Mac OS Version: 10.8.4
Hard Drive Size: 1000 GB
Memory Size: 8 GB
iLife Version: n/a



Repair Estimate
Item Number Description Price Amount Due
661-5520 Hard Drive, 1TB, 3.5", 7200, SATA $ 226.14 $ 0.00
S1490LL/A Hardware Repair Labor $ 39.00 $ 0.00
Total (Tax not included) $ 265.14 $ 0.00

Apple prices the retail of that drive at three times what you can buy a
similar one from just about anyone, but certainly lowballs the labor
charge, since it is a pain in the ass to open up an iMac sans the proper
tools, knowledge and guts. (all glass on the front, et cetera)
I would have guessed $125 on the drive and $125 labor.

Anyway, they were out of the drives, but more were scheduled to come in
today or monday, so I left the computer there.

No cost to me because of "quality" program.



So your Mac blew a hard drive. What's to brag about? I've never had a computer blow a hard drive.

John (Gun Nut) H.
--

Hope you're having a great day!

F.O.A.D. September 6th 13 09:27 PM

Greg, speaking of following the money...
 
On 9/6/13 4:17 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 06 Sep 2013 15:49:57 -0400, "F.O.A.D." wrote:

Dropped my iMac off at the apple store today, and the checkover and
preauthorized repair data generated the following:

Problem Description/Diagnosis

Issue: Hard drive not mounting

Steps to Reproduce: Verified at bar, machine qualifies for HARD DRIVE
repair program for seagate

Proposed Resolution: Replace hard drive under quality program
Cosmetic Condition of iMac: Great no apparent damage

Estimated Turn Around Time: We'll call you in 3 - 5 days

Mac OS Version: 10.8.4
Hard Drive Size: 1000 GB
Memory Size: 8 GB
iLife Version: n/a



Repair Estimate
Item Number Description Price Amount Due
661-5520 Hard Drive, 1TB, 3.5", 7200, SATA $ 226.14 $ 0.00
S1490LL/A Hardware Repair Labor $ 39.00 $ 0.00
Total (Tax not included) $ 265.14 $ 0.00

Apple prices the retail of that drive at three times what you can buy a
similar one from just about anyone, but certainly lowballs the labor
charge, since it is a pain in the ass to open up an iMac sans the proper
tools, knowledge and guts. (all glass on the front, et cetera)
I would have guessed $125 on the drive and $125 labor.

Anyway, they were out of the drives, but more were scheduled to come in
today or monday, so I left the computer there.

No cost to me because of "quality" program.


Disk drives are expendables. I am surprised they are not easier to get
out of a Mac. All of my laptops have drives you can get out without
really taking anything apart. (hat IMac looks like a laptop with a
stand and a detached keyboard)
I used to have a couple drives for my old Thinkpad and I swapped them
all the time. One was my "business" system, the other my personal
stuff.

For around the house I still like a computer with a case and card
slots ... but I am a hobbyist. ;-)


The iMacs are apple complex. You have to remove the glass front panel,
which is held in by the sweat that forms in the belly buttons of
Victoria's Secret models. Or, you can watch this video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_vW8lGupPc8

In any event, apparently several million of the Seagate drives that
apple bought were prone to early failure, so apple sent out recall
notices to replace them all. I waited since mine was doing okay.

I'd guess drive failures are the most common problems on computers.



skin a cat September 6th 13 09:32 PM

Greg, speaking of following the money...
 
On 9/6/2013 4:19 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 06 Sep 2013 16:01:52 -0400, John H
wrote:

So your Mac blew a hard drive. What's to brag about? I've never had a computer blow a hard drive.


It is the most common computer failure


only precluded by "user head malfunction" or "the idiot tapping on the
keyboard".. :)

Mr. Luddite September 6th 13 10:02 PM

Greg, speaking of following the money...
 


"F.O.A.D." wrote in message
m...


I'd guess drive failures are the most common problems on computers.

------------------------------------

With "Cloud" storage and solid state memory like high density SDXC
cards, disk drives are probably going to join the ranks of the
obsolete.
Lexan just introduced a 256Gb card and Sandisk has developed one which
makes it possible to manufacture cards with storage capacity up to 2
terabytes.

I don't use more than 25 percent of the hard drive capacities on
either of my laptops.


F.O.A.D. September 6th 13 10:10 PM

Greg, speaking of following the money...
 
On 9/6/13 5:02 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:


"F.O.A.D." wrote in message
m...


I'd guess drive failures are the most common problems on computers.

------------------------------------

With "Cloud" storage and solid state memory like high density SDXC
cards, disk drives are probably going to join the ranks of the obsolete.
Lexan just introduced a 256Gb card and Sandisk has developed one which
makes it possible to manufacture cards with storage capacity up to 2
terabytes.

I don't use more than 25 percent of the hard drive capacities on either
of my laptops.


I have a mini SDXC card in my laptop...it's no bigger than a little
finger nail and it has a 64 GB capacity. These external solid state
drives, though, are still slow because they use a USB like interface.
The SSD in the laptop, however, seems faster than greased lightning.

You're right, of course, the handwriting is on the wall for spinning
drives.

Mr. Luddite September 6th 13 10:42 PM

Greg, speaking of following the money...
 


"F.O.A.D." wrote in message
m...

On 9/6/13 5:02 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:


"F.O.A.D." wrote in message
m...


I'd guess drive failures are the most common problems on computers.

------------------------------------

With "Cloud" storage and solid state memory like high density SDXC
cards, disk drives are probably going to join the ranks of the
obsolete.
Lexan just introduced a 256Gb card and Sandisk has developed one
which
makes it possible to manufacture cards with storage capacity up to 2
terabytes.

I don't use more than 25 percent of the hard drive capacities on
either
of my laptops.


I have a mini SDXC card in my laptop...it's no bigger than a little
finger nail and it has a 64 GB capacity. These external solid state
drives, though, are still slow because they use a USB like interface.
The SSD in the laptop, however, seems faster than greased lightning.

You're right, of course, the handwriting is on the wall for spinning
drives.

---------------------------

Another one for the scrap book. Back in the mid 80's the company I
was working for at the time designed and built a vacuum deposition
system for Seagate that deposited the magnetic storage media on the
disks. They were physically huge back then and certainly not the
high density of the drives available today. We also built another
system for a subsidy of Alcoa who were getting into making the storage
disks. This was all early in the game. The Alcoa system required an
amorphous hard carbon coating as well that protected and added
lubricity to the disk to prevent crashes due to the head hitting the
drive. All obsolete now.



F.O.A.D. September 6th 13 11:02 PM

Greg, speaking of following the money...
 
On 9/6/13 5:42 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
an amorphous hard carbon coating as well that protected and added lubricity



Does Mrs. Luddite know you talk like that? :)

Mr. Luddite September 7th 13 12:28 AM

Greg, speaking of following the money...
 


"F.O.A.D." wrote in message
...

On 9/6/13 5:42 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
an amorphous hard carbon coating as well that protected and added
lubricity



Does Mrs. Luddite know you talk like that? :)

--------------------------

She probably typed the technical proposal. We didn't have computers
or word processors then so they were all written in longhand on legal
pads. I'd do the electrical. process and control sections and another
guy did the writing for the mechanical hardware. I'd utilize the
original "cut and paste" method for all the boilerplate sections.
Then they went to Mrs.E. and another typist and typed up on IBM
Selectric typewriters that had that rotating font ball.

That's when I got in the habit of getting up at about 2 am when Mrs.
E. and the mud rats (kids) were sleeping and I'd make a pot of coffee,
sit down at my desk and start writing. I could finish my part of a
40-50 page technical proposal by 8 or 9 am if it was similar to
something we had built before.

Here's a long winded story. Delete and skip if you're not interested
but it was quite a big deal for me back in 1990:

The longest proposal .... and the one that took the most time .... was
for a unique, large system for the Laboratory for Laser Energetics at
the University of Rochester. They had a huge program called "Omega"
funded by the DOE and the DOD for building a laser system consisting
of 60 beams that focused their energy onto a "target" the size of a
piece of rice. The "official" goal at the time was to produce energy
by nuclear fusion by compressing deuterium ... an abundant element
found in sea water with very high powered lasers. There were also
defense applications, allowing nuclear research without having to blow
stuff up.

I had just incorporated my company when this project came along. As
"newbies" in the industry, we typically got the scraps of contracts
that the big boys weren't interested in. The UofR request for
technical proposals and price quotations went out world-wide to all
the major manufacturers of custom vacuum deposition systems ... about
13 companies in total. We were not on the original bidder's list
because we were so small and unknown at the time. A friend in
another company called me and said his company was going to "no-bid"
the project and asked me if I wanted the technical specifications to
look at. I said, "sure" ... and then called the UofR purchasing
department to see if they would accept a proposal and quotation from
us. He welcomed all comers, and said yes.

I had absolutely no allusions that we would ever get the contract,
but I figured it was an opportunity to submit a strong technical
proposal, get our name out there, and maybe get on the bidder's list
for future, smaller contracts. With that in mind, I suggested to
Mrs. E. that she take the kids on a vacation to Disneyworld with some
friends and I spent over a week researching the requirements and
writing the best proposal I could.

It was submitted and I basically put it out of my mind and
concentrated on getting contracts that were more realistic for the
size of the company.
About 3 months later we received notice that a more detailed
specification was being forwarded to a small group of the original
bidders.
We had 48 hours to respond to it.

When I reviewed the new spec, I realized that they had now included
some specific process criteria that the successful bidder would be
obligated to achieve. Now I was getting a little nervous. I read
the requirements and felt that some were beyond current state of the
art and were probably not achievable.

After much thought, I called the assistant to the project leader at
the UofR and respectfully withdrew our bid. He thanked me for the
time and effort and said he'd forward my withdrawal to the program
leader.

A half hour later, the project leader called. He wanted to know why I
withdrew our bid. I explained that there were two parts of the
process (had to do with the uniformity of coating over a very large
optic) that I did not feel was possible to achieve. He wanted to
know why and we talked a bit about this.

He then told me that he knew they weren't achievable and that we were
the only company out of three that made the final "cut" that took
exception to that part of the spec. He *strongly* encouraged me to
send a revised proposal taking exceptions to any part of the spec that
I didn't feel comfortable with. He then told me that our price had
"plenty of room" for adjustment and told me to make sure I was
comfortable with it.

So, I did as he instructed ... took exceptions a couple of the
spec's requirements and added another $100k to the price for
"insurance". Two weeks later I received a call from one of the other
companies that had bid, offering congratulations. "About what?" I
asked. "You don't know? ... You won the UofR project".

I called the project leader and he confirmed it. He asked to keep it
quiet for a couple of days because they were contacting and thanking
all the other bidders before making a formal announcement.

That project was a huge success, both for us and the UofR and it put
my little company on the "map" so to speak. Good memories.




Wayne.B September 7th 13 12:42 AM

Greg, speaking of following the money...
 
On Fri, 6 Sep 2013 19:28:13 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

She probably typed the technical proposal. We didn't have computers
or word processors then so they were all written in longhand on legal
pads. I'd do the electrical. process and control sections and another
guy did the writing for the mechanical hardware. I'd utilize the
original "cut and paste" method for all the boilerplate sections.
Then they went to Mrs.E. and another typist and typed up on IBM
Selectric typewriters that had that rotating font ball.

That's when I got in the habit of getting up at about 2 am when Mrs.
E. and the mud rats (kids) were sleeping and I'd make a pot of coffee,
sit down at my desk and start writing. I could finish my part of a
40-50 page technical proposal by 8 or 9 am if it was similar to
something we had built before.

Here's a long winded story. Delete and skip if you're not interested
but it was quite a big deal for me back in 1990:

The longest proposal .... and the one that took the most time .... was
for a unique, large system for the Laboratory for Laser Energetics at
the University of Rochester. They had a huge program called "Omega"
funded by the DOE and the DOD for building a laser system consisting
of 60 beams that focused their energy onto a "target" the size of a
piece of rice. The "official" goal at the time was to produce energy
by nuclear fusion by compressing deuterium ... an abundant element
found in sea water with very high powered lasers. There were also
defense applications, allowing nuclear research without having to blow
stuff up.

I had just incorporated my company when this project came along. As
"newbies" in the industry, we typically got the scraps of contracts
that the big boys weren't interested in. The UofR request for
technical proposals and price quotations went out world-wide to all
the major manufacturers of custom vacuum deposition systems ... about
13 companies in total. We were not on the original bidder's list
because we were so small and unknown at the time. A friend in
another company called me and said his company was going to "no-bid"
the project and asked me if I wanted the technical specifications to
look at. I said, "sure" ... and then called the UofR purchasing
department to see if they would accept a proposal and quotation from
us. He welcomed all comers, and said yes.

I had absolutely no allusions that we would ever get the contract,
but I figured it was an opportunity to submit a strong technical
proposal, get our name out there, and maybe get on the bidder's list
for future, smaller contracts. With that in mind, I suggested to
Mrs. E. that she take the kids on a vacation to Disneyworld with some
friends and I spent over a week researching the requirements and
writing the best proposal I could.

It was submitted and I basically put it out of my mind and
concentrated on getting contracts that were more realistic for the
size of the company.
About 3 months later we received notice that a more detailed
specification was being forwarded to a small group of the original
bidders.
We had 48 hours to respond to it.

When I reviewed the new spec, I realized that they had now included
some specific process criteria that the successful bidder would be
obligated to achieve. Now I was getting a little nervous. I read
the requirements and felt that some were beyond current state of the
art and were probably not achievable.

After much thought, I called the assistant to the project leader at
the UofR and respectfully withdrew our bid. He thanked me for the
time and effort and said he'd forward my withdrawal to the program
leader.

A half hour later, the project leader called. He wanted to know why I
withdrew our bid. I explained that there were two parts of the
process (had to do with the uniformity of coating over a very large
optic) that I did not feel was possible to achieve. He wanted to
know why and we talked a bit about this.

He then told me that he knew they weren't achievable and that we were
the only company out of three that made the final "cut" that took
exception to that part of the spec. He *strongly* encouraged me to
send a revised proposal taking exceptions to any part of the spec that
I didn't feel comfortable with. He then told me that our price had
"plenty of room" for adjustment and told me to make sure I was
comfortable with it.

So, I did as he instructed ... took exceptions a couple of the
spec's requirements and added another $100k to the price for
"insurance". Two weeks later I received a call from one of the other
companies that had bid, offering congratulations. "About what?" I
asked. "You don't know? ... You won the UofR project".

I called the project leader and he confirmed it. He asked to keep it
quiet for a couple of days because they were contacting and thanking
all the other bidders before making a formal announcement.

That project was a huge success, both for us and the UofR and it put
my little company on the "map" so to speak. Good memories.


===

Great suuccess story, thanks for sharing. It's always nice to see
honesty and hard work pay off in the end.

[email protected] September 7th 13 02:28 AM

Greg, speaking of following the money...
 
On Friday, September 6, 2013 7:42:42 PM UTC-4, Wayne. B wrote:
On Fri, 6 Sep 2013 19:28:13 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"

wrote:



She probably typed the technical proposal. We didn't have computers


or word processors then so they were all written in longhand on legal


pads. I'd do the electrical. process and control sections and another


guy did the writing for the mechanical hardware. I'd utilize the


original "cut and paste" method for all the boilerplate sections.


Then they went to Mrs.E. and another typist and typed up on IBM


Selectric typewriters that had that rotating font ball.




That's when I got in the habit of getting up at about 2 am when Mrs.


E. and the mud rats (kids) were sleeping and I'd make a pot of coffee,


sit down at my desk and start writing. I could finish my part of a


40-50 page technical proposal by 8 or 9 am if it was similar to


something we had built before.




Here's a long winded story. Delete and skip if you're not interested


but it was quite a big deal for me back in 1990:




The longest proposal .... and the one that took the most time .... was


for a unique, large system for the Laboratory for Laser Energetics at


the University of Rochester. They had a huge program called "Omega"


funded by the DOE and the DOD for building a laser system consisting


of 60 beams that focused their energy onto a "target" the size of a


piece of rice. The "official" goal at the time was to produce energy


by nuclear fusion by compressing deuterium ... an abundant element


found in sea water with very high powered lasers. There were also


defense applications, allowing nuclear research without having to blow


stuff up.




I had just incorporated my company when this project came along. As


"newbies" in the industry, we typically got the scraps of contracts


that the big boys weren't interested in. The UofR request for


technical proposals and price quotations went out world-wide to all


the major manufacturers of custom vacuum deposition systems ... about


13 companies in total. We were not on the original bidder's list


because we were so small and unknown at the time. A friend in


another company called me and said his company was going to "no-bid"


the project and asked me if I wanted the technical specifications to


look at. I said, "sure" ... and then called the UofR purchasing


department to see if they would accept a proposal and quotation from


us. He welcomed all comers, and said yes.




I had absolutely no allusions that we would ever get the contract,


but I figured it was an opportunity to submit a strong technical


proposal, get our name out there, and maybe get on the bidder's list


for future, smaller contracts. With that in mind, I suggested to


Mrs. E. that she take the kids on a vacation to Disneyworld with some


friends and I spent over a week researching the requirements and


writing the best proposal I could.




It was submitted and I basically put it out of my mind and


concentrated on getting contracts that were more realistic for the


size of the company.


About 3 months later we received notice that a more detailed


specification was being forwarded to a small group of the original


bidders.


We had 48 hours to respond to it.




When I reviewed the new spec, I realized that they had now included


some specific process criteria that the successful bidder would be


obligated to achieve. Now I was getting a little nervous. I read


the requirements and felt that some were beyond current state of the


art and were probably not achievable.




After much thought, I called the assistant to the project leader at


the UofR and respectfully withdrew our bid. He thanked me for the


time and effort and said he'd forward my withdrawal to the program


leader.




A half hour later, the project leader called. He wanted to know why I


withdrew our bid. I explained that there were two parts of the


process (had to do with the uniformity of coating over a very large


optic) that I did not feel was possible to achieve. He wanted to


know why and we talked a bit about this.




He then told me that he knew they weren't achievable and that we were


the only company out of three that made the final "cut" that took


exception to that part of the spec. He *strongly* encouraged me to


send a revised proposal taking exceptions to any part of the spec that


I didn't feel comfortable with. He then told me that our price had


"plenty of room" for adjustment and told me to make sure I was


comfortable with it.




So, I did as he instructed ... took exceptions a couple of the


spec's requirements and added another $100k to the price for


"insurance". Two weeks later I received a call from one of the other


companies that had bid, offering congratulations. "About what?" I


asked. "You don't know? ... You won the UofR project".




I called the project leader and he confirmed it. He asked to keep it


quiet for a couple of days because they were contacting and thanking


all the other bidders before making a formal announcement.




That project was a huge success, both for us and the UofR and it put


my little company on the "map" so to speak. Good memories.




===



Great suuccess story, thanks for sharing. It's always nice to see

honesty and hard work pay off in the end.


I agree. The company I work for is a family owned business that I started with over 30 years ago. Their success story is similar... winning contracts with large entities that just wanted someone to partner with to get the job done. We've been very successful in doing that over the years, but it's coming to an end.

We're now hooked up with some very large companies that we are integrating to, and the large direct sell companies that we've been doing business with are changing as well. The bigger and more sucessful you are, the less fun it is.

Among other things, this country was built on the small business men who did the very things that our company does (or did). The excessive regulations that are now in place stifle that free enterprise.


[email protected] September 7th 13 02:30 AM

Greg, speaking of following the money...
 
On Friday, September 6, 2013 4:01:52 PM UTC-4, John H wrote:

So your Mac blew a hard drive. What's to brag about? I've never had a computer blow a hard drive.



It just COULDN'T take any more Krause **** lies...it " imploded"..

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

[email protected] September 7th 13 02:32 AM

Greg, speaking of following the money...
 
On Friday, September 6, 2013 7:28:13 PM UTC-4, Mr. Luddite wrote:
"F.O.A.D." wrote in message

...



On 9/6/13 5:42 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:

an amorphous hard carbon coating as well that protected and added


lubricity






Does Mrs. Luddite know you talk like that? :)



--------------------------



She probably typed the technical proposal. We didn't have computers

or word processors then so they were all written in longhand on legal

pads. I'd do the electrical. process and control sections and another

guy did the writing for the mechanical hardware. I'd utilize the

original "cut and paste" method for all the boilerplate sections.

Then they went to Mrs.E. and another typist and typed up on IBM

Selectric typewriters that had that rotating font ball.



That's when I got in the habit of getting up at about 2 am when Mrs.

E. and the mud rats (kids) were sleeping and I'd make a pot of coffee,

sit down at my desk and start writing. I could finish my part of a

40-50 page technical proposal by 8 or 9 am if it was similar to

something we had built before.



Here's a long winded story. Delete and skip if you're not interested

but it was quite a big deal for me back in 1990:



The longest proposal .... and the one that took the most time .... was

for a unique, large system for the Laboratory for Laser Energetics at

the University of Rochester. They had a huge program called "Omega"

funded by the DOE and the DOD for building a laser system consisting

of 60 beams that focused their energy onto a "target" the size of a

piece of rice. The "official" goal at the time was to produce energy

by nuclear fusion by compressing deuterium ... an abundant element

found in sea water with very high powered lasers. There were also

defense applications, allowing nuclear research without having to blow

stuff up.



I had just incorporated my company when this project came along. As

"newbies" in the industry, we typically got the scraps of contracts

that the big boys weren't interested in. The UofR request for

technical proposals and price quotations went out world-wide to all

the major manufacturers of custom vacuum deposition systems ... about

13 companies in total. We were not on the original bidder's list

because we were so small and unknown at the time. A friend in

another company called me and said his company was going to "no-bid"

the project and asked me if I wanted the technical specifications to

look at. I said, "sure" ... and then called the UofR purchasing

department to see if they would accept a proposal and quotation from

us. He welcomed all comers, and said yes.



I had absolutely no allusions that we would ever get the contract,

but I figured it was an opportunity to submit a strong technical

proposal, get our name out there, and maybe get on the bidder's list

for future, smaller contracts. With that in mind, I suggested to

Mrs. E. that she take the kids on a vacation to Disneyworld with some

friends and I spent over a week researching the requirements and

writing the best proposal I could.



It was submitted and I basically put it out of my mind and

concentrated on getting contracts that were more realistic for the

size of the company.

About 3 months later we received notice that a more detailed

specification was being forwarded to a small group of the original

bidders.

We had 48 hours to respond to it.



When I reviewed the new spec, I realized that they had now included

some specific process criteria that the successful bidder would be

obligated to achieve. Now I was getting a little nervous. I read

the requirements and felt that some were beyond current state of the

art and were probably not achievable.



After much thought, I called the assistant to the project leader at

the UofR and respectfully withdrew our bid. He thanked me for the

time and effort and said he'd forward my withdrawal to the program

leader.



A half hour later, the project leader called. He wanted to know why I

withdrew our bid. I explained that there were two parts of the

process (had to do with the uniformity of coating over a very large

optic) that I did not feel was possible to achieve. He wanted to

know why and we talked a bit about this.



He then told me that he knew they weren't achievable and that we were

the only company out of three that made the final "cut" that took

exception to that part of the spec. He *strongly* encouraged me to

send a revised proposal taking exceptions to any part of the spec that

I didn't feel comfortable with. He then told me that our price had

"plenty of room" for adjustment and told me to make sure I was

comfortable with it.



So, I did as he instructed ... took exceptions a couple of the

spec's requirements and added another $100k to the price for

"insurance". Two weeks later I received a call from one of the other

companies that had bid, offering congratulations. "About what?" I

asked. "You don't know? ... You won the UofR project".



I called the project leader and he confirmed it. He asked to keep it

quiet for a couple of days because they were contacting and thanking

all the other bidders before making a formal announcement.



That project was a huge success, both for us and the UofR and it put

my little company on the "map" so to speak. Good memories.


............ what a whole lot of **** ALL !!!!! .........................

F.O.A.D. September 7th 13 12:22 PM

Greg, speaking of following the money...
 
On 9/6/13 7:28 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:


"F.O.A.D." wrote in message
...

On 9/6/13 5:42 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
an amorphous hard carbon coating as well that protected and added
lubricity



Does Mrs. Luddite know you talk like that? :)

--------------------------

She probably typed the technical proposal. We didn't have computers or
word processors then so they were all written in longhand on legal
pads. I'd do the electrical. process and control sections and another
guy did the writing for the mechanical hardware. I'd utilize the
original "cut and paste" method for all the boilerplate sections. Then
they went to Mrs.E. and another typist and typed up on IBM Selectric
typewriters that had that rotating font ball.

That's when I got in the habit of getting up at about 2 am when Mrs. E.
and the mud rats (kids) were sleeping and I'd make a pot of coffee, sit
down at my desk and start writing. I could finish my part of a 40-50
page technical proposal by 8 or 9 am if it was similar to something we
had built before.

Here's a long winded story. Delete and skip if you're not interested
but it was quite a big deal for me back in 1990:

The longest proposal .... and the one that took the most time .... was
for a unique, large system for the Laboratory for Laser Energetics at
the University of Rochester. They had a huge program called "Omega"
funded by the DOE and the DOD for building a laser system consisting of
60 beams that focused their energy onto a "target" the size of a piece
of rice. The "official" goal at the time was to produce energy by
nuclear fusion by compressing deuterium ... an abundant element found in
sea water with very high powered lasers. There were also defense
applications, allowing nuclear research without having to blow stuff up.

I had just incorporated my company when this project came along. As
"newbies" in the industry, we typically got the scraps of contracts that
the big boys weren't interested in. The UofR request for technical
proposals and price quotations went out world-wide to all the major
manufacturers of custom vacuum deposition systems ... about 13
companies in total. We were not on the original bidder's list because
we were so small and unknown at the time. A friend in another company
called me and said his company was going to "no-bid" the project and
asked me if I wanted the technical specifications to look at. I said,
"sure" ... and then called the UofR purchasing department to see if they
would accept a proposal and quotation from us. He welcomed all
comers, and said yes.

I had absolutely no allusions that we would ever get the contract, but I
figured it was an opportunity to submit a strong technical proposal, get
our name out there, and maybe get on the bidder's list for future,
smaller contracts. With that in mind, I suggested to Mrs. E. that
she take the kids on a vacation to Disneyworld with some friends and I
spent over a week researching the requirements and writing the best
proposal I could.

It was submitted and I basically put it out of my mind and concentrated
on getting contracts that were more realistic for the size of the company.
About 3 months later we received notice that a more detailed
specification was being forwarded to a small group of the original bidders.
We had 48 hours to respond to it.

When I reviewed the new spec, I realized that they had now included
some specific process criteria that the successful bidder would be
obligated to achieve. Now I was getting a little nervous. I read the
requirements and felt that some were beyond current state of the art and
were probably not achievable.

After much thought, I called the assistant to the project leader at the
UofR and respectfully withdrew our bid. He thanked me for the time and
effort and said he'd forward my withdrawal to the program leader.

A half hour later, the project leader called. He wanted to know why I
withdrew our bid. I explained that there were two parts of the process
(had to do with the uniformity of coating over a very large optic) that
I did not feel was possible to achieve. He wanted to know why and we
talked a bit about this.

He then told me that he knew they weren't achievable and that we were
the only company out of three that made the final "cut" that took
exception to that part of the spec. He *strongly* encouraged me to
send a revised proposal taking exceptions to any part of the spec that I
didn't feel comfortable with. He then told me that our price had
"plenty of room" for adjustment and told me to make sure I was
comfortable with it.

So, I did as he instructed ... took exceptions a couple of the spec's
requirements and added another $100k to the price for "insurance". Two
weeks later I received a call from one of the other companies that had
bid, offering congratulations. "About what?" I asked. "You don't
know? ... You won the UofR project".

I called the project leader and he confirmed it. He asked to keep it
quiet for a couple of days because they were contacting and thanking all
the other bidders before making a formal announcement.

That project was a huge success, both for us and the UofR and it put my
little company on the "map" so to speak. Good memories.




Thank goodness you went to Amity Regional! :)

Got an email that came in after 11 pm last night from Apple...my iMac is
ready to be picked up. One of the reasons why I like Apple is that the
company from a customer point of view is run the way companies used to
be run...on the basis of good service and keeping customers happy.
Naturally, there are times when Apple fails but for the most part, it
has done well by me. Yes, that service is reflected in its prices...as
well it should be.

Hank©[_3_] September 7th 13 12:44 PM

Greg, speaking of following the money...
 
On 9/7/2013 7:22 AM, F.O.A.D. wrote:
On 9/6/13 7:28 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:


"F.O.A.D." wrote in message
...

On 9/6/13 5:42 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
an amorphous hard carbon coating as well that protected and added
lubricity



Does Mrs. Luddite know you talk like that? :)

--------------------------

She probably typed the technical proposal. We didn't have computers or
word processors then so they were all written in longhand on legal
pads. I'd do the electrical. process and control sections and another
guy did the writing for the mechanical hardware. I'd utilize the
original "cut and paste" method for all the boilerplate sections. Then
they went to Mrs.E. and another typist and typed up on IBM Selectric
typewriters that had that rotating font ball.

That's when I got in the habit of getting up at about 2 am when Mrs. E.
and the mud rats (kids) were sleeping and I'd make a pot of coffee, sit
down at my desk and start writing. I could finish my part of a 40-50
page technical proposal by 8 or 9 am if it was similar to something we
had built before.

Here's a long winded story. Delete and skip if you're not interested
but it was quite a big deal for me back in 1990:

The longest proposal .... and the one that took the most time .... was
for a unique, large system for the Laboratory for Laser Energetics at
the University of Rochester. They had a huge program called "Omega"
funded by the DOE and the DOD for building a laser system consisting of
60 beams that focused their energy onto a "target" the size of a piece
of rice. The "official" goal at the time was to produce energy by
nuclear fusion by compressing deuterium ... an abundant element found in
sea water with very high powered lasers. There were also defense
applications, allowing nuclear research without having to blow stuff up.

I had just incorporated my company when this project came along. As
"newbies" in the industry, we typically got the scraps of contracts that
the big boys weren't interested in. The UofR request for technical
proposals and price quotations went out world-wide to all the major
manufacturers of custom vacuum deposition systems ... about 13
companies in total. We were not on the original bidder's list because
we were so small and unknown at the time. A friend in another company
called me and said his company was going to "no-bid" the project and
asked me if I wanted the technical specifications to look at. I said,
"sure" ... and then called the UofR purchasing department to see if they
would accept a proposal and quotation from us. He welcomed all
comers, and said yes.

I had absolutely no allusions that we would ever get the contract, but I
figured it was an opportunity to submit a strong technical proposal, get
our name out there, and maybe get on the bidder's list for future,
smaller contracts. With that in mind, I suggested to Mrs. E. that
she take the kids on a vacation to Disneyworld with some friends and I
spent over a week researching the requirements and writing the best
proposal I could.

It was submitted and I basically put it out of my mind and concentrated
on getting contracts that were more realistic for the size of the
company.
About 3 months later we received notice that a more detailed
specification was being forwarded to a small group of the original
bidders.
We had 48 hours to respond to it.

When I reviewed the new spec, I realized that they had now included
some specific process criteria that the successful bidder would be
obligated to achieve. Now I was getting a little nervous. I read the
requirements and felt that some were beyond current state of the art and
were probably not achievable.

After much thought, I called the assistant to the project leader at the
UofR and respectfully withdrew our bid. He thanked me for the time and
effort and said he'd forward my withdrawal to the program leader.

A half hour later, the project leader called. He wanted to know why I
withdrew our bid. I explained that there were two parts of the process
(had to do with the uniformity of coating over a very large optic) that
I did not feel was possible to achieve. He wanted to know why and we
talked a bit about this.

He then told me that he knew they weren't achievable and that we were
the only company out of three that made the final "cut" that took
exception to that part of the spec. He *strongly* encouraged me to
send a revised proposal taking exceptions to any part of the spec that I
didn't feel comfortable with. He then told me that our price had
"plenty of room" for adjustment and told me to make sure I was
comfortable with it.

So, I did as he instructed ... took exceptions a couple of the spec's
requirements and added another $100k to the price for "insurance". Two
weeks later I received a call from one of the other companies that had
bid, offering congratulations. "About what?" I asked. "You don't
know? ... You won the UofR project".

I called the project leader and he confirmed it. He asked to keep it
quiet for a couple of days because they were contacting and thanking all
the other bidders before making a formal announcement.

That project was a huge success, both for us and the UofR and it put my
little company on the "map" so to speak. Good memories.




Thank goodness you went to Amity Regional! :)

Got an email that came in after 11 pm last night from Apple...my iMac is
ready to be picked up. One of the reasons why I like Apple is that the
company from a customer point of view is run the way companies used to
be run...on the basis of good service and keeping customers happy.
Naturally, there are times when Apple fails but for the most part, it
has done well by me. Yes, that service is reflected in its prices...as
well it should be.


We don't need to know every time you or one of your toys hiccups.

Mr. Luddite September 7th 13 01:08 PM

Greg, speaking of following the money...
 


"F.O.A.D." wrote in message
m...


Got an email that came in after 11 pm last night from Apple...my iMac
is
ready to be picked up. One of the reasons why I like Apple is that the
company from a customer point of view is run the way companies used to
be run...on the basis of good service and keeping customers happy.
Naturally, there are times when Apple fails but for the most part, it
has done well by me. Yes, that service is reflected in its prices...as
well it should be.

----------------------------------

My daughter works in a dentist's office and she inherited one of those
27" iMac systems (the ones with the computer guts built into the
display) when the office updated their equipment. Mrs.E. saw it
and has been "hinting" around .. i.e. birthday, Christmas,
anniversary, full moon, whatever ... about how much she likes it and
wants one. The only concern I have is I know nothing about Macs
having used PCs all my life and since I am the resident IT department
in our house, I really don't want to get involved with maintaining and
upgrading a computer system that I am not familiar with or use. I
really am not into computers that much.



Hank©[_3_] September 7th 13 01:29 PM

Greg, speaking of following the money...
 
On 9/7/2013 8:08 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:


"F.O.A.D." wrote in message
m...


Got an email that came in after 11 pm last night from Apple...my iMac is
ready to be picked up. One of the reasons why I like Apple is that the
company from a customer point of view is run the way companies used to
be run...on the basis of good service and keeping customers happy.
Naturally, there are times when Apple fails but for the most part, it
has done well by me. Yes, that service is reflected in its prices...as
well it should be.

----------------------------------

My daughter works in a dentist's office and she inherited one of those
27" iMac systems (the ones with the computer guts built into the
display) when the office updated their equipment. Mrs.E. saw it and
has been "hinting" around .. i.e. birthday, Christmas, anniversary,
full moon, whatever ... about how much she likes it and wants one. The
only concern I have is I know nothing about Macs having used PCs all my
life and since I am the resident IT department in our house, I really
don't want to get involved with maintaining and upgrading a computer
system that I am not familiar with or use. I really am not into
computers that much.


If it hiccups then just carry it in to your neighborhood Apple store.
The friendly folks there will bend over backwards and jump through hoops
to cure it's hiccups, or so we've been led to believe.

John H[_2_] September 7th 13 02:24 PM

Greg, speaking of following the money...
 
On Fri, 6 Sep 2013 19:28:13 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" wrote:



"F.O.A.D." wrote in message
...

On 9/6/13 5:42 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
an amorphous hard carbon coating as well that protected and added
lubricity



Does Mrs. Luddite know you talk like that? :)

--------------------------

She probably typed the technical proposal. We didn't have computers
or word processors then so they were all written in longhand on legal
pads. I'd do the electrical. process and control sections and another
guy did the writing for the mechanical hardware. I'd utilize the
original "cut and paste" method for all the boilerplate sections.
Then they went to Mrs.E. and another typist and typed up on IBM
Selectric typewriters that had that rotating font ball.

That's when I got in the habit of getting up at about 2 am when Mrs.
E. and the mud rats (kids) were sleeping and I'd make a pot of coffee,
sit down at my desk and start writing. I could finish my part of a
40-50 page technical proposal by 8 or 9 am if it was similar to
something we had built before.

Here's a long winded story. Delete and skip if you're not interested
but it was quite a big deal for me back in 1990:

The longest proposal .... and the one that took the most time .... was
for a unique, large system for the Laboratory for Laser Energetics at
the University of Rochester. They had a huge program called "Omega"
funded by the DOE and the DOD for building a laser system consisting
of 60 beams that focused their energy onto a "target" the size of a
piece of rice. The "official" goal at the time was to produce energy
by nuclear fusion by compressing deuterium ... an abundant element
found in sea water with very high powered lasers. There were also
defense applications, allowing nuclear research without having to blow
stuff up.

I had just incorporated my company when this project came along. As
"newbies" in the industry, we typically got the scraps of contracts
that the big boys weren't interested in. The UofR request for
technical proposals and price quotations went out world-wide to all
the major manufacturers of custom vacuum deposition systems ... about
13 companies in total. We were not on the original bidder's list
because we were so small and unknown at the time. A friend in
another company called me and said his company was going to "no-bid"
the project and asked me if I wanted the technical specifications to
look at. I said, "sure" ... and then called the UofR purchasing
department to see if they would accept a proposal and quotation from
us. He welcomed all comers, and said yes.

I had absolutely no allusions that we would ever get the contract,
but I figured it was an opportunity to submit a strong technical
proposal, get our name out there, and maybe get on the bidder's list
for future, smaller contracts. With that in mind, I suggested to
Mrs. E. that she take the kids on a vacation to Disneyworld with some
friends and I spent over a week researching the requirements and
writing the best proposal I could.

It was submitted and I basically put it out of my mind and
concentrated on getting contracts that were more realistic for the
size of the company.
About 3 months later we received notice that a more detailed
specification was being forwarded to a small group of the original
bidders.
We had 48 hours to respond to it.

When I reviewed the new spec, I realized that they had now included
some specific process criteria that the successful bidder would be
obligated to achieve. Now I was getting a little nervous. I read
the requirements and felt that some were beyond current state of the
art and were probably not achievable.

After much thought, I called the assistant to the project leader at
the UofR and respectfully withdrew our bid. He thanked me for the
time and effort and said he'd forward my withdrawal to the program
leader.

A half hour later, the project leader called. He wanted to know why I
withdrew our bid. I explained that there were two parts of the
process (had to do with the uniformity of coating over a very large
optic) that I did not feel was possible to achieve. He wanted to
know why and we talked a bit about this.

He then told me that he knew they weren't achievable and that we were
the only company out of three that made the final "cut" that took
exception to that part of the spec. He *strongly* encouraged me to
send a revised proposal taking exceptions to any part of the spec that
I didn't feel comfortable with. He then told me that our price had
"plenty of room" for adjustment and told me to make sure I was
comfortable with it.

So, I did as he instructed ... took exceptions a couple of the
spec's requirements and added another $100k to the price for
"insurance". Two weeks later I received a call from one of the other
companies that had bid, offering congratulations. "About what?" I
asked. "You don't know? ... You won the UofR project".

I called the project leader and he confirmed it. He asked to keep it
quiet for a couple of days because they were contacting and thanking
all the other bidders before making a formal announcement.

That project was a huge success, both for us and the UofR and it put
my little company on the "map" so to speak. Good memories.



Great story, but I didn't see how union involvement helped in any way.

John (Gun Nut) H.
--

Hope you're having a great day!

Hank©[_3_] September 7th 13 02:50 PM

Greg, speaking of following the money...
 
On 9/7/2013 9:24 AM, John H wrote:
On Fri, 6 Sep 2013 19:28:13 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" wrote:



"F.O.A.D." wrote in message
...

On 9/6/13 5:42 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
an amorphous hard carbon coating as well that protected and added
lubricity



Does Mrs. Luddite know you talk like that? :)

--------------------------

She probably typed the technical proposal. We didn't have computers
or word processors then so they were all written in longhand on legal
pads. I'd do the electrical. process and control sections and another
guy did the writing for the mechanical hardware. I'd utilize the
original "cut and paste" method for all the boilerplate sections.
Then they went to Mrs.E. and another typist and typed up on IBM
Selectric typewriters that had that rotating font ball.

That's when I got in the habit of getting up at about 2 am when Mrs.
E. and the mud rats (kids) were sleeping and I'd make a pot of coffee,
sit down at my desk and start writing. I could finish my part of a
40-50 page technical proposal by 8 or 9 am if it was similar to
something we had built before.

Here's a long winded story. Delete and skip if you're not interested
but it was quite a big deal for me back in 1990:

The longest proposal .... and the one that took the most time .... was
for a unique, large system for the Laboratory for Laser Energetics at
the University of Rochester. They had a huge program called "Omega"
funded by the DOE and the DOD for building a laser system consisting
of 60 beams that focused their energy onto a "target" the size of a
piece of rice. The "official" goal at the time was to produce energy
by nuclear fusion by compressing deuterium ... an abundant element
found in sea water with very high powered lasers. There were also
defense applications, allowing nuclear research without having to blow
stuff up.

I had just incorporated my company when this project came along. As
"newbies" in the industry, we typically got the scraps of contracts
that the big boys weren't interested in. The UofR request for
technical proposals and price quotations went out world-wide to all
the major manufacturers of custom vacuum deposition systems ... about
13 companies in total. We were not on the original bidder's list
because we were so small and unknown at the time. A friend in
another company called me and said his company was going to "no-bid"
the project and asked me if I wanted the technical specifications to
look at. I said, "sure" ... and then called the UofR purchasing
department to see if they would accept a proposal and quotation from
us. He welcomed all comers, and said yes.

I had absolutely no allusions that we would ever get the contract,
but I figured it was an opportunity to submit a strong technical
proposal, get our name out there, and maybe get on the bidder's list
for future, smaller contracts. With that in mind, I suggested to
Mrs. E. that she take the kids on a vacation to Disneyworld with some
friends and I spent over a week researching the requirements and
writing the best proposal I could.

It was submitted and I basically put it out of my mind and
concentrated on getting contracts that were more realistic for the
size of the company.
About 3 months later we received notice that a more detailed
specification was being forwarded to a small group of the original
bidders.
We had 48 hours to respond to it.

When I reviewed the new spec, I realized that they had now included
some specific process criteria that the successful bidder would be
obligated to achieve. Now I was getting a little nervous. I read
the requirements and felt that some were beyond current state of the
art and were probably not achievable.

After much thought, I called the assistant to the project leader at
the UofR and respectfully withdrew our bid. He thanked me for the
time and effort and said he'd forward my withdrawal to the program
leader.

A half hour later, the project leader called. He wanted to know why I
withdrew our bid. I explained that there were two parts of the
process (had to do with the uniformity of coating over a very large
optic) that I did not feel was possible to achieve. He wanted to
know why and we talked a bit about this.

He then told me that he knew they weren't achievable and that we were
the only company out of three that made the final "cut" that took
exception to that part of the spec. He *strongly* encouraged me to
send a revised proposal taking exceptions to any part of the spec that
I didn't feel comfortable with. He then told me that our price had
"plenty of room" for adjustment and told me to make sure I was
comfortable with it.

So, I did as he instructed ... took exceptions a couple of the
spec's requirements and added another $100k to the price for
"insurance". Two weeks later I received a call from one of the other
companies that had bid, offering congratulations. "About what?" I
asked. "You don't know? ... You won the UofR project".

I called the project leader and he confirmed it. He asked to keep it
quiet for a couple of days because they were contacting and thanking
all the other bidders before making a formal announcement.

That project was a huge success, both for us and the UofR and it put
my little company on the "map" so to speak. Good memories.



Great story, but I didn't see how union involvement helped in any way.

John (Gun Nut) H.

Some folks can stand on their own two feet make it through life without
union help.

John H[_2_] September 7th 13 03:00 PM

Greg, speaking of following the money...
 
On Sat, 07 Sep 2013 09:50:17 -0400, Hank© wrote:

On 9/7/2013 9:24 AM, John H wrote:
On Fri, 6 Sep 2013 19:28:13 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" wrote:



"F.O.A.D." wrote in message
...

On 9/6/13 5:42 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
an amorphous hard carbon coating as well that protected and added
lubricity


Does Mrs. Luddite know you talk like that? :)

--------------------------

She probably typed the technical proposal. We didn't have computers
or word processors then so they were all written in longhand on legal
pads. I'd do the electrical. process and control sections and another
guy did the writing for the mechanical hardware. I'd utilize the
original "cut and paste" method for all the boilerplate sections.
Then they went to Mrs.E. and another typist and typed up on IBM
Selectric typewriters that had that rotating font ball.

That's when I got in the habit of getting up at about 2 am when Mrs.
E. and the mud rats (kids) were sleeping and I'd make a pot of coffee,
sit down at my desk and start writing. I could finish my part of a
40-50 page technical proposal by 8 or 9 am if it was similar to
something we had built before.

Here's a long winded story. Delete and skip if you're not interested
but it was quite a big deal for me back in 1990:

The longest proposal .... and the one that took the most time .... was
for a unique, large system for the Laboratory for Laser Energetics at
the University of Rochester. They had a huge program called "Omega"
funded by the DOE and the DOD for building a laser system consisting
of 60 beams that focused their energy onto a "target" the size of a
piece of rice. The "official" goal at the time was to produce energy
by nuclear fusion by compressing deuterium ... an abundant element
found in sea water with very high powered lasers. There were also
defense applications, allowing nuclear research without having to blow
stuff up.

I had just incorporated my company when this project came along. As
"newbies" in the industry, we typically got the scraps of contracts
that the big boys weren't interested in. The UofR request for
technical proposals and price quotations went out world-wide to all
the major manufacturers of custom vacuum deposition systems ... about
13 companies in total. We were not on the original bidder's list
because we were so small and unknown at the time. A friend in
another company called me and said his company was going to "no-bid"
the project and asked me if I wanted the technical specifications to
look at. I said, "sure" ... and then called the UofR purchasing
department to see if they would accept a proposal and quotation from
us. He welcomed all comers, and said yes.

I had absolutely no allusions that we would ever get the contract,
but I figured it was an opportunity to submit a strong technical
proposal, get our name out there, and maybe get on the bidder's list
for future, smaller contracts. With that in mind, I suggested to
Mrs. E. that she take the kids on a vacation to Disneyworld with some
friends and I spent over a week researching the requirements and
writing the best proposal I could.

It was submitted and I basically put it out of my mind and
concentrated on getting contracts that were more realistic for the
size of the company.
About 3 months later we received notice that a more detailed
specification was being forwarded to a small group of the original
bidders.
We had 48 hours to respond to it.

When I reviewed the new spec, I realized that they had now included
some specific process criteria that the successful bidder would be
obligated to achieve. Now I was getting a little nervous. I read
the requirements and felt that some were beyond current state of the
art and were probably not achievable.

After much thought, I called the assistant to the project leader at
the UofR and respectfully withdrew our bid. He thanked me for the
time and effort and said he'd forward my withdrawal to the program
leader.

A half hour later, the project leader called. He wanted to know why I
withdrew our bid. I explained that there were two parts of the
process (had to do with the uniformity of coating over a very large
optic) that I did not feel was possible to achieve. He wanted to
know why and we talked a bit about this.

He then told me that he knew they weren't achievable and that we were
the only company out of three that made the final "cut" that took
exception to that part of the spec. He *strongly* encouraged me to
send a revised proposal taking exceptions to any part of the spec that
I didn't feel comfortable with. He then told me that our price had
"plenty of room" for adjustment and told me to make sure I was
comfortable with it.

So, I did as he instructed ... took exceptions a couple of the
spec's requirements and added another $100k to the price for
"insurance". Two weeks later I received a call from one of the other
companies that had bid, offering congratulations. "About what?" I
asked. "You don't know? ... You won the UofR project".

I called the project leader and he confirmed it. He asked to keep it
quiet for a couple of days because they were contacting and thanking
all the other bidders before making a formal announcement.

That project was a huge success, both for us and the UofR and it put
my little company on the "map" so to speak. Good memories.



Great story, but I didn't see how union involvement helped in any way.

John (Gun Nut) H.

Some folks can stand on their own two feet make it through life without
union help.


Amen.

John (Gun Nut) H.
--

Hope you're having a great day!

Mr. Luddite September 7th 13 03:25 PM

Greg, speaking of following the money...
 


"John H" wrote in message
...

On Fri, 6 Sep 2013 19:28:13 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:


That project was a huge success, both for us and the UofR and it put
my little company on the "map" so to speak. Good memories.



Great story, but I didn't see how union involvement helped in any way.

John (Gun Nut) H.

------------------------------

Oh, a union electrician was involved but he certainly didn't help.

The facility administrators, being good do-bees, hired union
contractors to install all the power wiring required in the lab where
the system we built was installed. Without going into boring details,
our system included a very large isolation transformer to power
radiant heaters located inside the vacuum chamber. Without the
transformer, the heaters would arc at certain vacuum levels and they
are commonly used in the industry for this purpose. The transformers
used are over-rated for the heater power requirements, so at full load
they are operating at 75 percent of their rated capacity. The
problem with them is that they get very hot in normal operation. The
one we used with this particular system had a temperature rise rating
of 150 degrees C (above ambient, room temperature). In our system it
measured 118 degrees at full power. That is well within normal
operation.

The system was being run one day, developing the optical coatings
required for the program. A union electrician was in the lab
installing some unrelated wiring and noticed that the transformer was
hot. He made a big stink about it and reported it to whomever he
reports to. Next thing you know, I received a call requesting that I
visit the lab immediately.

I drove to Rochester and met with the project leader. I explained
that the temperature rise was normal and well within the specs for the
transformer. He knew that but said that because the union
electrician had filed a report, the Director of the lab (the big guy)
wanted to talk to me about it.

The Director was a retired Navy nuclear sub commander and was referred
to as "The Captain". He was a gruff SOB and still liked to bark out
orders. He started the meeting by telling me that they were under a
severe scheduling commitment, needed to use the vacuum system and he
wanted it fixed, "NOW".

I explained to him that there was nothing wrong with it. It was
normal operation and showed him the spec sheets for the transformer.
At first he claimed that the electrician who reported it said it
wasn't normal and we got into a bit of a debate about it. He finally
calmed down after seeing the specs but it became obvious that this was
now more of a political issue with the city inspector and all getting
involved. He asked me to "megger" the transformer (this is a
process of applying high voltage to the transformer windings to test
the insulation) and also for additional copies of the manufacturer's
spec sheets, which I did while he conducted further investigation. He
told me I was to remain "on site" until the matter was resolved.

Well, I was in the Navy for 9 years but I wasn't about to take orders
from this guy as a civilian. I told him (politely) that the
transformer was fine, it met all electrical code specs in terms of
ratings. The application was unique due to the system's process
requirements but similar transformers were in operation in many other
systems and I was leaving in the morning. I also told him that since
he felt obligated to pursue it further with his contractors due to
their alleged safety concern, I felt obligated to disable the control
system so the system could not be used until he was satisfied
everything was ok.

That did it. He left, then came back a half hour later and
apologized for the wild goose chase and told me he was satisfied the
system was safe to operate. By now it was 6pm and he invited the
project engineer, me and some of the lab techs to go have dinner and a
couple of beers. Turns out he was a decent guy and we shared a few
"sea tales".

The problem that exists in this kind of technology is that the
National Electric Code doesn't cover many of the unique configurations
required for the design and operation of custom equipment like this.
Just because it's not covered in the Code Book doesn't mean you can't
do it. The requirements of the system and process supersedes the
Codes if they are in conflict. The union electrician, unfamiliar
with the equipment, jumped to conclusions and made a stink about
nothing. He just reads the book.



BAR[_2_] September 7th 13 03:48 PM

Greg, speaking of following the money...
 
In article , says...

Dropped my iMac off at the apple store today, and the checkover and
preauthorized repair data generated the following:

Problem Description/Diagnosis

Issue: Hard drive not mounting

Steps to Reproduce: Verified at bar, machine qualifies for HARD DRIVE
repair program for seagate

Proposed Resolution: Replace hard drive under quality program
Cosmetic Condition of iMac: Great no apparent damage

Estimated Turn Around Time: We'll call you in 3 - 5 days

Mac OS Version: 10.8.4
Hard Drive Size: 1000 GB
Memory Size: 8 GB
iLife Version: n/a



Repair Estimate
Item Number Description Price Amount Due
661-5520 Hard Drive, 1TB, 3.5", 7200, SATA $ 226.14 $ 0.00
S1490LL/A Hardware Repair Labor $ 39.00 $ 0.00
Total (Tax not included) $ 265.14 $ 0.00

Apple prices the retail of that drive at three times what you can buy a
similar one from just about anyone, but certainly lowballs the labor
charge, since it is a pain in the ass to open up an iMac sans the proper
tools, knowledge and guts. (all glass on the front, et cetera)
I would have guessed $125 on the drive and $125 labor.

Anyway, they were out of the drives, but more were scheduled to come in
today or monday, so I left the computer there.

No cost to me because of "quality" program.


I buy the cheapest "computers" I can buy. At this point in their evolution it computers are a
comodity and there is no reason to pay more that $250 for the "system" unit. If it breaks,
throw it away and buy a new one. Keep your files backed up with one of the online backup
utilities.

BAR[_2_] September 7th 13 03:49 PM

Greg, speaking of following the money...
 
In article , says...

On Fri, 06 Sep 2013 15:49:57 -0400, "F.O.A.D." wrote:

Dropped my iMac off at the apple store today, and the checkover and
preauthorized repair data generated the following:

Problem Description/Diagnosis

Issue: Hard drive not mounting

Steps to Reproduce: Verified at bar, machine qualifies for HARD DRIVE
repair program for seagate

Proposed Resolution: Replace hard drive under quality program
Cosmetic Condition of iMac: Great no apparent damage

Estimated Turn Around Time: We'll call you in 3 - 5 days

Mac OS Version: 10.8.4
Hard Drive Size: 1000 GB
Memory Size: 8 GB
iLife Version: n/a



Repair Estimate
Item Number Description Price Amount Due
661-5520 Hard Drive, 1TB, 3.5", 7200, SATA $ 226.14 $ 0.00
S1490LL/A Hardware Repair Labor $ 39.00 $ 0.00
Total (Tax not included) $ 265.14 $ 0.00

Apple prices the retail of that drive at three times what you can buy a
similar one from just about anyone, but certainly lowballs the labor
charge, since it is a pain in the ass to open up an iMac sans the proper
tools, knowledge and guts. (all glass on the front, et cetera)
I would have guessed $125 on the drive and $125 labor.

Anyway, they were out of the drives, but more were scheduled to come in
today or monday, so I left the computer there.

No cost to me because of "quality" program.



So your Mac blew a hard drive. What's to brag about? I've never had a computer blow a hard drive.

John (Gun Nut) H.


You don't store on your hard drive what Harry stores on his hard drive, if you did your hard
drive would commit suicide too.

iBoaterer[_3_] September 7th 13 04:27 PM

Greg, speaking of following the money...
 
In article ,
says...

On 9/6/2013 4:19 PM,
wrote:
On Fri, 06 Sep 2013 16:01:52 -0400, John H
wrote:

So your Mac blew a hard drive. What's to brag about? I've never had a computer blow a hard drive.


It is the most common computer failure


only precluded by "user head malfunction" or "the idiot tapping on the
keyboard".. :)


Wow, what a great alleged technical guru, if you had any real clients,
I'd be sure to pass your wisdom along to them.

iBoaterer[_3_] September 7th 13 04:29 PM

Greg, speaking of following the money...
 
In article ,
says...

"F.O.A.D." wrote in message
m...


I'd guess drive failures are the most common problems on computers.

------------------------------------

With "Cloud" storage and solid state memory like high density SDXC
cards, disk drives are probably going to join the ranks of the
obsolete.
Lexan just introduced a 256Gb card and Sandisk has developed one which
makes it possible to manufacture cards with storage capacity up to 2
terabytes.

I don't use more than 25 percent of the hard drive capacities on
either of my laptops.


CD's have already made it to the obsolete bin!

iBoaterer[_3_] September 7th 13 04:31 PM

Greg, speaking of following the money...
 
In article ,
says...

"F.O.A.D." wrote in message
m...


Got an email that came in after 11 pm last night from Apple...my iMac
is
ready to be picked up. One of the reasons why I like Apple is that the
company from a customer point of view is run the way companies used to
be run...on the basis of good service and keeping customers happy.
Naturally, there are times when Apple fails but for the most part, it
has done well by me. Yes, that service is reflected in its prices...as
well it should be.

----------------------------------

My daughter works in a dentist's office and she inherited one of those
27" iMac systems (the ones with the computer guts built into the
display) when the office updated their equipment. Mrs.E. saw it
and has been "hinting" around .. i.e. birthday, Christmas,
anniversary, full moon, whatever ... about how much she likes it and
wants one. The only concern I have is I know nothing about Macs
having used PCs all my life and since I am the resident IT department
in our house, I really don't want to get involved with maintaining and
upgrading a computer system that I am not familiar with or use. I
really am not into computers that much.


Software availablity sucks. But, for everyday general use, not so much.

F.O.A.D. September 7th 13 05:02 PM

Greg, speaking of following the money...
 
On 9/7/13 8:08 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:


"F.O.A.D." wrote in message
m...


Got an email that came in after 11 pm last night from Apple...my iMac is
ready to be picked up. One of the reasons why I like Apple is that the
company from a customer point of view is run the way companies used to
be run...on the basis of good service and keeping customers happy.
Naturally, there are times when Apple fails but for the most part, it
has done well by me. Yes, that service is reflected in its prices...as
well it should be.

----------------------------------

My daughter works in a dentist's office and she inherited one of those
27" iMac systems (the ones with the computer guts built into the
display) when the office updated their equipment. Mrs.E. saw it and
has been "hinting" around .. i.e. birthday, Christmas, anniversary,
full moon, whatever ... about how much she likes it and wants one. The
only concern I have is I know nothing about Macs having used PCs all my
life and since I am the resident IT department in our house, I really
don't want to get involved with maintaining and upgrading a computer
system that I am not familiar with or use. I really am not into
computers that much.




Just buy AppleCare when you buy the iMac (new iMacs supposedly are
coming out in the next couple of months). There's a wide range of free
classes plus first-rate phone help from English speaking techs who have
no attitude. Most bigtime software works the same on a Mac as it does on
windows, plus there are easy ways to run existing windows software on a mac.

It takes about two weeks for an experienced windows user to get used to
the differences in the mac operating system. You and your wife will have
the usual couple of days of frustration, and then you'll see how easy it
is to use a MAc


iBoaterer[_3_] September 7th 13 06:24 PM

Greg, speaking of following the money...
 
In article ,
says...

On Sat, 7 Sep 2013 11:29:02 -0400, iBoaterer wrote:

CD's have already made it to the obsolete bin!


Storing content on little bits of plastic is going the way of the
buggy whip.
The Blue Ray machine may be the last gasp of that technology and I am
not biting.


Same here, never have. Netflix!

Spinning magnetic media only has the advantage of being cheap but it
is cheap so you can afford redundancy.
There is no reason these days that you are not running RAID arrays for
any data you really want to keep.
I have 2 arrays on this machine alone.
Anything I really care about is mirrored on other machines anyway.

Financial stuff is on a removable drive that is only plugged in when I
am using it, copied to a back up and both stored away.


I bought a 2 terabyte portable drive for all of my work and financial
files, etc. I also have a solid state seagate for daily backup.



uihamat9 September 7th 13 07:30 PM

UP!Důng bia tiger nha bác

iBoaterer[_3_] September 7th 13 09:03 PM

Greg, speaking of following the money...
 
In article ,
says...

On Sat, 7 Sep 2013 13:24:36 -0400, iBoaterer wrote:


I bought a 2 terabyte portable drive for all of my work and financial
files, etc. I also have a solid state seagate for daily backup.


2 terabytes? They could run the New York Stock Exchange with less DASD
than that. ;-)


We keep and use old files from several years ago. Some design files are
30 gigs or so. Add to that files from others on the design teams, plus
spreadsheets, correspondence, and on and on.



F.O.A.D. September 7th 13 09:15 PM

Greg, speaking of following the money...
 
On 9/7/13 4:03 PM, iBoaterer wrote:
In article ,
says...

On Sat, 7 Sep 2013 13:24:36 -0400, iBoaterer wrote:


I bought a 2 terabyte portable drive for all of my work and financial
files, etc. I also have a solid state seagate for daily backup.


2 terabytes? They could run the New York Stock Exchange with less DASD
than that. ;-)


We keep and use old files from several years ago. Some design files are
30 gigs or so. Add to that files from others on the design teams, plus
spreadsheets, correspondence, and on and on.


I have four two terabyte drives in my server, with one of those drives
running a compressed backup of what is on the other three drives.

I think I about two terabytes of data on the server which consists of
backups of the three computers in the house, folders for archives, about
750 GB of movies, et cetera. I do nightly backups of my desktop, plus
weekly backups of my wife's computer and my laptop. I also run an apple
Time Machine backup of my desktop computer to a separate external one
terabyte drive.

Mr. Luddite September 7th 13 09:53 PM

Greg, speaking of following the money...
 


"F.O.A.D." wrote in message ...

On 9/7/13 4:03 PM, iBoaterer wrote:
In article ,
says...

On Sat, 7 Sep 2013 13:24:36 -0400, iBoaterer
wrote:


I bought a 2 terabyte portable drive for all of my work and
financial
files, etc. I also have a solid state seagate for daily backup.


2 terabytes? They could run the New York Stock Exchange with less
DASD
than that. ;-)


We keep and use old files from several years ago. Some design files
are
30 gigs or so. Add to that files from others on the design teams,
plus
spreadsheets, correspondence, and on and on.


I have four two terabyte drives in my server, with one of those drives
running a compressed backup of what is on the other three drives.

I think I about two terabytes of data on the server which consists of
backups of the three computers in the house, folders for archives,
about
750 GB of movies, et cetera. I do nightly backups of my desktop, plus
weekly backups of my wife's computer and my laptop. I also run an
apple
Time Machine backup of my desktop computer to a separate external one
terabyte drive.

----------------------------

Pull the plug and you have nothing.



F.O.A.D. September 7th 13 10:14 PM

Greg, speaking of following the money...
 
On 9/7/13 4:53 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:


"F.O.A.D." wrote in message ...

On 9/7/13 4:03 PM, iBoaterer wrote:
In article ,
says...

On Sat, 7 Sep 2013 13:24:36 -0400, iBoaterer wrote:


I bought a 2 terabyte portable drive for all of my work and financial
files, etc. I also have a solid state seagate for daily backup.


2 terabytes? They could run the New York Stock Exchange with less DASD
than that. ;-)


We keep and use old files from several years ago. Some design files are
30 gigs or so. Add to that files from others on the design teams, plus
spreadsheets, correspondence, and on and on.


I have four two terabyte drives in my server, with one of those drives
running a compressed backup of what is on the other three drives.

I think I about two terabytes of data on the server which consists of
backups of the three computers in the house, folders for archives, about
750 GB of movies, et cetera. I do nightly backups of my desktop, plus
weekly backups of my wife's computer and my laptop. I also run an apple
Time Machine backup of my desktop computer to a separate external one
terabyte drive.

----------------------------

Pull the plug and you have nothing.



Also have a 17KW generator and a buried 500 gallon LP gas tank. :)

The Judge September 7th 13 10:38 PM

Greg, speaking of following the money...
 


"F.O.A.D." wrote in message
...

On 9/7/13 4:53 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:


"F.O.A.D." wrote in message
...

On 9/7/13 4:03 PM, iBoaterer wrote:
In article ,
says...

On Sat, 7 Sep 2013 13:24:36 -0400, iBoaterer
wrote:


I bought a 2 terabyte portable drive for all of my work and
financial
files, etc. I also have a solid state seagate for daily backup.


2 terabytes? They could run the New York Stock Exchange with less
DASD
than that. ;-)


We keep and use old files from several years ago. Some design files
are
30 gigs or so. Add to that files from others on the design teams,
plus
spreadsheets, correspondence, and on and on.


I have four two terabyte drives in my server, with one of those
drives
running a compressed backup of what is on the other three drives.

I think I about two terabytes of data on the server which consists
of
backups of the three computers in the house, folders for archives,
about
750 GB of movies, et cetera. I do nightly backups of my desktop,
plus
weekly backups of my wife's computer and my laptop. I also run an
apple
Time Machine backup of my desktop computer to a separate external
one
terabyte drive.

----------------------------

Pull the plug and you have nothing.



Also have a 17KW generator and a buried 500 gallon LP gas tank. :)

--------------------------

Ah .... a "prepper" huh?



BAR[_2_] September 8th 13 01:36 AM

Greg, speaking of following the money...
 
In article , "The Judge" says...

"F.O.A.D." wrote in message
...

On 9/7/13 4:53 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:


"F.O.A.D." wrote in message
...

On 9/7/13 4:03 PM, iBoaterer wrote:
In article ,
says...

On Sat, 7 Sep 2013 13:24:36 -0400, iBoaterer
wrote:


I bought a 2 terabyte portable drive for all of my work and
financial
files, etc. I also have a solid state seagate for daily backup.


2 terabytes? They could run the New York Stock Exchange with less
DASD
than that. ;-)

We keep and use old files from several years ago. Some design files
are
30 gigs or so. Add to that files from others on the design teams,
plus
spreadsheets, correspondence, and on and on.


I have four two terabyte drives in my server, with one of those
drives
running a compressed backup of what is on the other three drives.

I think I about two terabytes of data on the server which consists
of
backups of the three computers in the house, folders for archives,
about
750 GB of movies, et cetera. I do nightly backups of my desktop,
plus
weekly backups of my wife's computer and my laptop. I also run an
apple
Time Machine backup of my desktop computer to a separate external
one
terabyte drive.

----------------------------

Pull the plug and you have nothing.



Also have a 17KW generator and a buried 500 gallon LP gas tank. :)

--------------------------

Ah .... a "prepper" huh?


If he was a real prepper he would use gasoline or diesel, fuel you can easily obtain.

If I had a generator at this house I currently own it would run on natural gas.

Earl[_91_] September 8th 13 02:53 AM

Greg, speaking of following the money...
 
John H wrote:
On Fri, 6 Sep 2013 19:28:13 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" wrote:


"F.O.A.D." wrote in message
...

On 9/6/13 5:42 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
an amorphous hard carbon coating as well that protected and added
lubricity


Does Mrs. Luddite know you talk like that? :)

--------------------------

She probably typed the technical proposal. We didn't have computers
or word processors then so they were all written in longhand on legal
pads. I'd do the electrical. process and control sections and another
guy did the writing for the mechanical hardware. I'd utilize the
original "cut and paste" method for all the boilerplate sections.
Then they went to Mrs.E. and another typist and typed up on IBM
Selectric typewriters that had that rotating font ball.

That's when I got in the habit of getting up at about 2 am when Mrs.
E. and the mud rats (kids) were sleeping and I'd make a pot of coffee,
sit down at my desk and start writing. I could finish my part of a
40-50 page technical proposal by 8 or 9 am if it was similar to
something we had built before.

Here's a long winded story. Delete and skip if you're not interested
but it was quite a big deal for me back in 1990:

The longest proposal .... and the one that took the most time .... was
for a unique, large system for the Laboratory for Laser Energetics at
the University of Rochester. They had a huge program called "Omega"
funded by the DOE and the DOD for building a laser system consisting
of 60 beams that focused their energy onto a "target" the size of a
piece of rice. The "official" goal at the time was to produce energy
by nuclear fusion by compressing deuterium ... an abundant element
found in sea water with very high powered lasers. There were also
defense applications, allowing nuclear research without having to blow
stuff up.

I had just incorporated my company when this project came along. As
"newbies" in the industry, we typically got the scraps of contracts
that the big boys weren't interested in. The UofR request for
technical proposals and price quotations went out world-wide to all
the major manufacturers of custom vacuum deposition systems ... about
13 companies in total. We were not on the original bidder's list
because we were so small and unknown at the time. A friend in
another company called me and said his company was going to "no-bid"
the project and asked me if I wanted the technical specifications to
look at. I said, "sure" ... and then called the UofR purchasing
department to see if they would accept a proposal and quotation from
us. He welcomed all comers, and said yes.

I had absolutely no allusions that we would ever get the contract,
but I figured it was an opportunity to submit a strong technical
proposal, get our name out there, and maybe get on the bidder's list
for future, smaller contracts. With that in mind, I suggested to
Mrs. E. that she take the kids on a vacation to Disneyworld with some
friends and I spent over a week researching the requirements and
writing the best proposal I could.

It was submitted and I basically put it out of my mind and
concentrated on getting contracts that were more realistic for the
size of the company.
About 3 months later we received notice that a more detailed
specification was being forwarded to a small group of the original
bidders.
We had 48 hours to respond to it.

When I reviewed the new spec, I realized that they had now included
some specific process criteria that the successful bidder would be
obligated to achieve. Now I was getting a little nervous. I read
the requirements and felt that some were beyond current state of the
art and were probably not achievable.

After much thought, I called the assistant to the project leader at
the UofR and respectfully withdrew our bid. He thanked me for the
time and effort and said he'd forward my withdrawal to the program
leader.

A half hour later, the project leader called. He wanted to know why I
withdrew our bid. I explained that there were two parts of the
process (had to do with the uniformity of coating over a very large
optic) that I did not feel was possible to achieve. He wanted to
know why and we talked a bit about this.

He then told me that he knew they weren't achievable and that we were
the only company out of three that made the final "cut" that took
exception to that part of the spec. He *strongly* encouraged me to
send a revised proposal taking exceptions to any part of the spec that
I didn't feel comfortable with. He then told me that our price had
"plenty of room" for adjustment and told me to make sure I was
comfortable with it.

So, I did as he instructed ... took exceptions a couple of the
spec's requirements and added another $100k to the price for
"insurance". Two weeks later I received a call from one of the other
companies that had bid, offering congratulations. "About what?" I
asked. "You don't know? ... You won the UofR project".

I called the project leader and he confirmed it. He asked to keep it
quiet for a couple of days because they were contacting and thanking
all the other bidders before making a formal announcement.

That project was a huge success, both for us and the UofR and it put
my little company on the "map" so to speak. Good memories.


Great story, but I didn't see how union involvement helped in any way.

John (Gun Nut) H.

They unloaded the Chinese computers off of the truck for $75/hour.

Earl[_91_] September 8th 13 02:58 AM

Greg, speaking of following the money...
 
F.O.A.D. wrote:
On 9/7/13 4:03 PM, iBoaterer wrote:
In article ,
says...

On Sat, 7 Sep 2013 13:24:36 -0400, iBoaterer wrote:


I bought a 2 terabyte portable drive for all of my work and financial
files, etc. I also have a solid state seagate for daily backup.


2 terabytes? They could run the New York Stock Exchange with less DASD
than that. ;-)


We keep and use old files from several years ago. Some design files are
30 gigs or so. Add to that files from others on the design teams, plus
spreadsheets, correspondence, and on and on.


I have four two terabyte drives in my server, with one of those drives
running a compressed backup of what is on the other three drives.

I think I about two terabytes of data on the server which consists of
backups of the three computers in the house, folders for archives,
about 750 GB of movies, et cetera. I do nightly backups of my desktop,
plus weekly backups of my wife's computer and my laptop. I also run an
apple Time Machine backup of my desktop computer to a separate
external one terabyte drive.

Sure you do. Got your taxes and other judgement paid yet, sailor?


Earl[_91_] September 8th 13 03:00 AM

Greg, speaking of following the money...
 
F.O.A.D. wrote:
On 9/7/13 4:53 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:


"F.O.A.D." wrote in message ...

On 9/7/13 4:03 PM, iBoaterer wrote:
In article ,
says...

On Sat, 7 Sep 2013 13:24:36 -0400, iBoaterer wrote:


I bought a 2 terabyte portable drive for all of my work and financial
files, etc. I also have a solid state seagate for daily backup.


2 terabytes? They could run the New York Stock Exchange with less DASD
than that. ;-)

We keep and use old files from several years ago. Some design files are
30 gigs or so. Add to that files from others on the design teams, plus
spreadsheets, correspondence, and on and on.


I have four two terabyte drives in my server, with one of those drives
running a compressed backup of what is on the other three drives.

I think I about two terabytes of data on the server which consists of
backups of the three computers in the house, folders for archives, about
750 GB of movies, et cetera. I do nightly backups of my desktop, plus
weekly backups of my wife's computer and my laptop. I also run an apple
Time Machine backup of my desktop computer to a separate external one
terabyte drive.

----------------------------

Pull the plug and you have nothing.



Also have a 17KW generator and a buried 500 gallon LP gas tank. :)

17Kw is small for a house the size your wife owns. A 25Kw would be the
minimum. Could you be lying again?

Earl[_91_] September 8th 13 03:03 AM

Greg, speaking of following the money...
 
wrote:
On Sat, 07 Sep 2013 16:15:04 -0400, "F.O.A.D." wrote:

On 9/7/13 4:03 PM, iBoaterer wrote:
In article ,
says...
On Sat, 7 Sep 2013 13:24:36 -0400, iBoaterer wrote:


I bought a 2 terabyte portable drive for all of my work and financial
files, etc. I also have a solid state seagate for daily backup.

2 terabytes? They could run the New York Stock Exchange with less DASD
than that. ;-)
We keep and use old files from several years ago. Some design files are
30 gigs or so. Add to that files from others on the design teams, plus
spreadsheets, correspondence, and on and on.


I have four two terabyte drives in my server, with one of those drives
running a compressed backup of what is on the other three drives.

I think I about two terabytes of data on the server which consists of
backups of the three computers in the house, folders for archives, about
750 GB of movies, et cetera. I do nightly backups of my desktop, plus
weekly backups of my wife's computer and my laptop. I also run an apple
Time Machine backup of my desktop computer to a separate external one
terabyte drive.

Why not RAID them? With 4 drives you can set up a fairly high
efficiency array and have a soft failure of any single drive. With
some controllers you don't even need to bring the system down to swap
out the bad drive. The whole thing is invisible to the OS.
SATA hardware itself is hot swap capable.

He can't afford to pay his taxes. Do you really think he can afford a
$1500 Raid controller?

John H[_2_] September 8th 13 12:56 PM

Greg, speaking of following the money...
 
On Sat, 07 Sep 2013 17:14:07 -0400, "F.O.A.D." wrote:

On 9/7/13 4:53 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:


"F.O.A.D." wrote in message ...

On 9/7/13 4:03 PM, iBoaterer wrote:
In article ,
says...

On Sat, 7 Sep 2013 13:24:36 -0400, iBoaterer wrote:


I bought a 2 terabyte portable drive for all of my work and financial
files, etc. I also have a solid state seagate for daily backup.


2 terabytes? They could run the New York Stock Exchange with less DASD
than that. ;-)

We keep and use old files from several years ago. Some design files are
30 gigs or so. Add to that files from others on the design teams, plus
spreadsheets, correspondence, and on and on.


I have four two terabyte drives in my server, with one of those drives
running a compressed backup of what is on the other three drives.

I think I about two terabytes of data on the server which consists of
backups of the three computers in the house, folders for archives, about
750 GB of movies, et cetera. I do nightly backups of my desktop, plus
weekly backups of my wife's computer and my laptop. I also run an apple
Time Machine backup of my desktop computer to a separate external one
terabyte drive.

----------------------------

Pull the plug and you have nothing.



Also have a 17KW generator and a buried 500 gallon LP gas tank. :)


....and a Maryland red barn, and two owls in a tree down by the creek, and a twin-diesel, Volvo
powered trawler to keep up with Wayne, and a well-ridden Ducati motorcycle, and a printer from
WalMart. What more could a guy want?

John (Gun Nut) H.
--

Hope you're having a great day!


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