I have to ask, is this supposed to be
"the land of the free
and the home of the brave"
or the land of the timid living
in fear of people with cameras?

--
Galen Hekhuis NpD, JFR, GWA
We are the CroMagnon of the future

One of our local runs was closed immediately after 9-11. It is a 4 mile class 2
run about an hour west of washington dc - the put in is below a dam on goose
creek. the water above the dam is the reservoir for drinking water for fairfax
county (just outside dc)...the fear was terrorists putting chemicals in the
water. Of course chemicals could be dropped in at the bridge just 5 miles
upstream of the dam....oh well...

the run can actually still be made - but a 1 mile carry is necessary as the
access road has been gated... seemd to me having a bunch of kayakers and
fisherman would be a good thing - now you have a virtually empty area....

i've moved from that area - but that was such a great little novice run & a fun
play run at some levels....Seth actually did some of his training for the Worlds
at the hole at the "golf Course rapid"....we had to paddle up from the take out
- okay for me in a kayak - but rough for him as a C-boater at the right
levels....

sheila

Yeah, I was wondering about how the law prohibiting photographing
industrial installations is worded.

And about just who is qualified to judge the appropriateness of the
photographer's subject. Seems to me there could be some "art" in a
smoking industrial complex set against a background of nature.

Guess we'll just have to ask John A.

Seems like a lot of cosmetic frenzy with "protecting the public" while
the larger (more difficult) problems go unaddressed.




On Sat, 03 Jul 2004 14:00:16 -0400, Galen Hekhuis
wrote:

I have to ask, is this supposed to be
"the land of the free
and the home of the brave"
or the land of the timid living
in fear of people with cameras?

In another forum I read there was an article recently posted about kayaks
being used in that area for transporting "BC Bud" into the U.S.

Why would you transport Budweiser into the U.S. Seems like we should be
putting more effort into getting rid of it....

--Chris

Chris Webster ) writes:
In another forum I read there was an article recently posted about kayaks
being used in that area for transporting "BC Bud" into the U.S.

Why would you transport Budweiser into the U.S. Seems like we should be
putting more effort into getting rid of it....

plant buds, not the brand name

so, okay, kayaks can be used for evil, that's terroism, not transporting
plant buds, as well as, um, nonsense and wasting time. if only kayaks had
some useful purpose by which they could be justified and defended. okay,
tourism, but tourism itself is nonsense and wasting time, a nonsense way
of redistributing income, like a government social program. the only
counter argument a politican might go for is restricting kayaks takes
money out of remote economically depressed regions of the country.


--
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
William R Watt National Capital FreeNet Ottawa's free community network
homepage: www.ncf.ca/~ag384/top.htm
warning: non-freenet email must have "notspam" in subject or it's returned

(William R. Watt) wrote in
:

Chris Webster ) writes:
In another forum I read there was an article recently posted about
kayaks being used in that area for transporting "BC Bud" into the
U.S.

Why would you transport Budweiser into the U.S. Seems like we should
be putting more effort into getting rid of it....

plant buds, not the brand name

so, okay, kayaks can be used for evil, that's terroism, not
transporting plant buds, as well as, um, nonsense and wasting time. if
only kayaks had some useful purpose by which they could be justified
and defended.

When the inuit and Greenlanders hunted to put food on their tables did they
do it in kayaks or canoes?

In a very recent posting you implied that someone spent too much money on a
kevlar canoe as paddling in general by inference is primarily a recreational
activity. Why do you suppose that those that paddle the longest distances
(i.e. circumnavigating large islands) do so in a kayak instead of a canoe?

(Bobo) writes:
....

Just my $0.02: pretty much anything can be construed as terrorism.
Photographers have been harassed regularly for photographing near
certain sites, including trains (a popular hobby, it appears). In
general, for those of you who are also unfortunate enough to live here,
this is the United States, and the number one rule for survival in the
US is to assume *everything* is illegal unless proven otherwise.

The US is run by a bunch of paranoid fruitcakes bent on world domination,
and John Ashcroft & Co. see terrorists in every shadow. In fact, it
seems they're more interested in keeping dissenters silent. Everyone
who has a contrary opinion and everyone who has the nerve to engage in
an activity which is out of the ordinary is immediately assumed to be
a "terrorist".

Anyway, I could go on for days. Like I said, just assume everything is
illegal - it probably is. And after you get harassed, you'll have to
prove your innocence. Welcome to America.


--
Claudia Engel (no emails please)
aka: Engelchen

"Rick" writes:
I don't know about you, but considering how many wonderful things one can
videotape from a kayak, including whales, natural settings, etc., an oil
refinery is right down on the bottom of my list, just above the interesting
poop I took this morning. While I doubt the individual was a terrorist, I
certainly have to question his/her sanity.

Perhaps the person in the boat had concerns about environment pollution,
etc... coming from the oil refinery and wanted video evidence? If they
can put *us* under surveillance, then we can do likewise.


--
Claudia Engel (no emails please)
aka: Engelchen

(Tchswoods) writes:
actions taken by our government. I am after all one of the "hysterical"
librarians (Per Ashcroft) opposed to the "USA PATRIOT" act. I am also an NEA
member and for the sake of fairness and accuracy, I should point out that it
was Education Secretary Rod Paige who characterized the National Education
Association as "a terrorist organization" last February. Bush has not (as far
as I know) spoken on the topic yet.

I need to get out of this country while it's still legal to do so...


--
Claudia Engel (no emails please)
aka: Engelchen

Claudia Engel wrote:

Just my $0.02: pretty much anything can be construed as terrorism.
Photographers have been harassed regularly for photographing near
certain sites, including trains (a popular hobby, it appears). In
general, for those of you who are also unfortunate enough to live here,
this is the United States, and the number one rule for survival in the
US is to assume *everything* is illegal unless proven otherwise.

The US is run by a bunch of paranoid fruitcakes bent on world domination,
and John Ashcroft & Co. see terrorists in every shadow. In fact, it
seems they're more interested in keeping dissenters silent. Everyone
who has a contrary opinion and everyone who has the nerve to engage in
an activity which is out of the ordinary is immediately assumed to be
a "terrorist".

Anyway, I could go on for days. Like I said, just assume everything is
illegal - it probably is. And after you get harassed, you'll have to
prove your innocence. Welcome to America.

Sounds to me like one of the most important means to really be free is
slowly taken out of the hands of the people: the right to control your
government.

I sure hope that the U.S. voters use their right to vote away Bush and
his cronies before the current administration manages to take even more
freedom away from the people. :-(

As for leaving the U.S. when you strongly disagree with the government,
that gives the administration exactly what they want: people who think
for themselves and who oppose them leave, the mindless masses stay.
Please try to turn the tides during the elections before really giving
up... (Yes I know, the last elections weren't something to instill
confidence in the election process.)

Good luck over there!

--
Wilko van den Bergh Wilkoa t)dse(d o tnl
Eindhoven The Netherlands Europe
Look at the possibilities, don't worry about the limitations.
http://wilko.webzone.ru/