On 20/10/2011 7:26 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 20 Oct 2011 19:12:03 -0400, X `
wrote:

In March, you Republicans said Obama didn't act quickly enough and with
enough force in going after Gaddafi.

Then when Obama acted, you said Obama acted too hastily, acted
unconstitutionally and needed to be impeached.

Today, you say Obama didn't act soon enough.

Pobrecitos. You can't handle the fact that **** gets done nowadays. In 6
months, Libya went from status quo to Gaddafi dead, something at which
Saint Ronny Raegan tried and failed. Osama bin Laden is dead, something
Dubya couldn't do in 8 years. Now, with US and NATO assistance, the
Libyan government has changed hands and Gaddafi is dead.

The open question will be whether we are actually better off with him
gone. As the Clinton people used to say about Saddam, we had Qdaffy
"contained". (a lot more than Saddam)

This whole Arab Spring thing can still blow up in our face if these
guys don't turn out to be the peace loving people we hope they will
be. I can remember people talking about what a great guy Castro was
because he defeated that evil dictator Batista and how he was going to
bring freedom to the island.. That lasted about 6 weeks until Castro
said, "Oh wait. Maybe I am really a communist" (after denying it for
years) and started nationalizing the whole island. Two years later we
damned near had WWIII over Cuba.

This time it might be WWIII over Israel.

Actually here is what I think is happening.

More or less most leaders in the middle east had US support to get their
power or maintain it. Even Saudi. The policy was lots of little
fiefdom countries not run by radical Islam types.

Now the policy is to depose them, and let the Arab/middle eat unity as a
radical Islamic nation. I think Saudi was intending to be the center
of this, but realized all too late it was going to be Muslim
Brotherhood. So like Egypt, democracy has ended, Muslim Brotherhood now
have it as a Muslim/Islam state ignoring justice for the non-Muslims as
they are persecuted.

Arab Spring alright, it is the rise of the Islam/Sharia super-state.
Just might take a few more year to find most of the Arab world is no
longer US friendly at all. Iraq and Afghanistan will fall hours after
Americans leave. Be worse than Vietnam.

A huge long term problem. Iran and Pakistan now have nukes. USA broke,
Islam unifying slowly having their AK-47 elections....

Going to be interesting in say 5 years.
--
Eat the rich, screw the companies and wonder why there are no jobs. But
we have big huge government we can't afford...
-- Obama and the lefty fleabagger attitude

On Fri, 21 Oct 2011 12:14:39 -0400, wrote:

On Thu, 20 Oct 2011 21:47:27 -0700, jps wrote:

On Fri, 21 Oct 2011 00:16:53 -0400, wrote:

On Thu, 20 Oct 2011 21:33:25 -0400, X ` Man
wrote:

This whole Arab Spring thing can still blow up in our face if these
guys don't turn out to be the peace loving people we hope they will
be. I can remember people talking about what a great guy Castro was
because he defeated that evil dictator Batista and how he was going to
bring freedom to the island.. That lasted about 6 weeks until Castro
said, "Oh wait. Maybe I am really a communist" (after denying it for
years) and started nationalizing the whole island. Two years later we
damned near had WWIII over Cuba.

This time it might be WWIII over Israel.

Fortunately, we didn't have an absolute dummy in the white house during
the cuban missle crisis. We did have an absolute dummy in the white
house from 2001 to January 2009. You know, the guy who started two wars
with countries not at war with us. That dummy.

JFK was pretty stupid in that affair and was clearly thinking with his
dick not his brain.
He took this whole thing to the brink of WWIII for exactly the same
deal he could have had 10 months before without any drama.
The Soviets wanted our missiles out of Turkey, they pushed the issue
by putting missiles in Cuba and in the end we pulled the missiles out
of Turkey.
We just had a dick measuring contest that almost destroyed the world
before we did it.
I never thought this was a success, on any level. All we proved was
that the Soviets were not as crazy as we thought they were. What we
didn't understand was that Castro had operational control of some of
those missiles and that they were capable of firing them. (a serious
CIA failure)

And Bush wanted to measure dicks with somebody who didn't have one.

We will have spent 5000 American lives, 50,000 wounded, 1 million
Iraqis dead or displaced.

All for a dick measurement against no one.

I agree Iraq was stupid but it wasn't toying with thermonuclear war.

Your point being?

On 10/21/2011 2:20 PM, jps wrote:
On Fri, 21 Oct 2011 12:14:39 -0400, wrote:

On Thu, 20 Oct 2011 21:47:27 -0700, wrote:

On Fri, 21 Oct 2011 00:16:53 -0400, wrote:

On Thu, 20 Oct 2011 21:33:25 -0400, X `
wrote:

This whole Arab Spring thing can still blow up in our face if these
guys don't turn out to be the peace loving people we hope they will
be. I can remember people talking about what a great guy Castro was
because he defeated that evil dictator Batista and how he was going to
bring freedom to the island.. That lasted about 6 weeks until Castro
said, "Oh wait. Maybe I am really a communist" (after denying it for
years) and started nationalizing the whole island. Two years later we
damned near had WWIII over Cuba.

This time it might be WWIII over Israel.

Fortunately, we didn't have an absolute dummy in the white house during
the cuban missle crisis. We did have an absolute dummy in the white
house from 2001 to January 2009. You know, the guy who started two wars
with countries not at war with us. That dummy.

JFK was pretty stupid in that affair and was clearly thinking with his
dick not his brain.
He took this whole thing to the brink of WWIII for exactly the same
deal he could have had 10 months before without any drama.
The Soviets wanted our missiles out of Turkey, they pushed the issue
by putting missiles in Cuba and in the end we pulled the missiles out
of Turkey.
We just had a dick measuring contest that almost destroyed the world
before we did it.
I never thought this was a success, on any level. All we proved was
that the Soviets were not as crazy as we thought they were. What we
didn't understand was that Castro had operational control of some of
those missiles and that they were capable of firing them. (a serious
CIA failure)

And Bush wanted to measure dicks with somebody who didn't have one.

We will have spent 5000 American lives, 50,000 wounded, 1 million
Iraqis dead or displaced.

All for a dick measurement against no one.

I agree Iraq was stupid but it wasn't toying with thermonuclear war.

Your point being?

His point being that Kennedy was "toying with thermonuclear war"... What
is so hard about that. Are you such an ideologue, you can't even read a
plainly put statement? Really...

And quite frankly, the one obvious reason we went into Iraq (if we
suggest there was an alternative for the sake of "this" argument), poke
holes in the suggestion that we went in to try and get some American
troops and supply lines closer to Iran, who is still working furiously
to get a nuke to Isreal, Saudi, USA, and Europe... Think about it, if
you can get the Bush Derangement Syndrome under control for a minute...

On 20/10/2011 10:16 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 20 Oct 2011 21:33:25 -0400, X `
wrote:

This whole Arab Spring thing can still blow up in our face if these
guys don't turn out to be the peace loving people we hope they will
be. I can remember people talking about what a great guy Castro was
because he defeated that evil dictator Batista and how he was going to
bring freedom to the island.. That lasted about 6 weeks until Castro
said, "Oh wait. Maybe I am really a communist" (after denying it for
years) and started nationalizing the whole island. Two years later we
damned near had WWIII over Cuba.

This time it might be WWIII over Israel.

Fortunately, we didn't have an absolute dummy in the white house during
the cuban missle crisis. We did have an absolute dummy in the white
house from 2001 to January 2009. You know, the guy who started two wars
with countries not at war with us. That dummy.

JFK was pretty stupid in that affair and was clearly thinking with his
dick not his brain.

I thought it was a good move. No nukes 10 minutes away.

He took this whole thing to the brink of WWIII for exactly the same
deal he could have had 10 months before without any drama.

Maybe sensationalized. 0bama is moving back into it. You should see
what the Chinese and Russian news say about the US-Euro Debtors
Regime...Syria might be the one to start it up all over again.

The Soviets wanted our missiles out of Turkey, they pushed the issue
by putting missiles in Cuba and in the end we pulled the missiles out
of Turkey.

Yep, DC hypocrisy.

We just had a dick measuring contest that almost destroyed the world
before we did it.

Another reason why big government is bad. Becomes a political power
**** fest at the citizens expense. Be it JFK or 0bama or in-between.

I never thought this was a success, on any level. All we proved was
that the Soviets were not as crazy as we thought they were. What we
didn't understand was that Castro had operational control of some of
those missiles and that they were capable of firing them. (a serious
CIA failure)

Yep. But both sides got what they wanted politically. And excuse to
spend trillions on war machinery making war industrialists lots of money
off the taxpayers.
--
Eat the rich, screw the companies and wonder why there are no jobs. But
we have big huge government we can't afford...
-- Obama and the lefty fleabagger attitude

On 20/10/2011 10:47 PM, jps wrote:
On Fri, 21 Oct 2011 00:16:53 -0400, wrote:

On Thu, 20 Oct 2011 21:33:25 -0400, X `
wrote:

This whole Arab Spring thing can still blow up in our face if these
guys don't turn out to be the peace loving people we hope they will
be. I can remember people talking about what a great guy Castro was
because he defeated that evil dictator Batista and how he was going to
bring freedom to the island.. That lasted about 6 weeks until Castro
said, "Oh wait. Maybe I am really a communist" (after denying it for
years) and started nationalizing the whole island. Two years later we
damned near had WWIII over Cuba.

This time it might be WWIII over Israel.

Fortunately, we didn't have an absolute dummy in the white house during
the cuban missle crisis. We did have an absolute dummy in the white
house from 2001 to January 2009. You know, the guy who started two wars
with countries not at war with us. That dummy.

JFK was pretty stupid in that affair and was clearly thinking with his
dick not his brain.
He took this whole thing to the brink of WWIII for exactly the same
deal he could have had 10 months before without any drama.
The Soviets wanted our missiles out of Turkey, they pushed the issue
by putting missiles in Cuba and in the end we pulled the missiles out
of Turkey.
We just had a dick measuring contest that almost destroyed the world
before we did it.
I never thought this was a success, on any level. All we proved was
that the Soviets were not as crazy as we thought they were. What we
didn't understand was that Castro had operational control of some of
those missiles and that they were capable of firing them. (a serious
CIA failure)

And Bush wanted to measure dicks with somebody who didn't have one.

We will have spent 5000 American lives, 50,000 wounded, 1 million
Iraqis dead or displaced.

All for a dick measurement against no one.

And with Democrat approval no less. You seem to forget that.
--
Eat the rich, screw the companies and wonder why there are no jobs. But
we have big huge government we can't afford...
-- Obama and the lefty fleabagger attitude

On 21/10/2011 7:04 AM, X ` Man wrote:
On 10/21/11 8:56 AM, Eisboch wrote:


"X ` Man" wrote in message
m...


Fortunately, we didn't have an absolute dummy in the white house during
the cuban missle crisis. We did have an absolute dummy in the white
house from 2001 to January 2009. You know, the guy who started two wars
with countries not at war with us. That dummy.

------------------------------------------------------------------

I am old enough to remember well the Cuban missile crisis and watching
JFK on television announcing the blockade.
It turns out he made the right choice of his options but most historians
agree that we were never closer to WWIII.
It could have gone another way. Khrushchev also got much of what he
wanted in under reported, secret negotiations.

I think many are too quick to condemn Bush for some of his decisions and
seem to forget that forcing Saddam Hussein
from power was not without at least 6 months of international discussion
and debate in the UN. Hussein was becoming increasingly more
defiant of the resolutions imposed by the international community (UN)
following his invasion of Kuwait, firing on
aircraft patrolling the "no fly" zone, etc. I am sure there was some
pressure from other nations as well to keep him in check.

We can only speculate on what actions Hussein would have taken if he was
not confronted. If Bush had done nothing and
Hussein had become more aggressive again, internally and with neighbors,
Bush would be regarded as a dummy for not doing anything rather than
being a dummy for the action he took. Tough job, being POTUS. I surely
would never want it.

President Obama rightly deserves some credit for helping rid the world
of Gaddafi. Hussein was also a war mongering
dictator who ruled by imposing terror on Iraqi citizens who didn't
pledge their allegiance to him. So why is Bush a dummy
and Obama a hero?

The argument that Obama took a "back seat" role versus a major military
action doesn't hold up. Different situations, different
difficulties and challenges.





I was in my first year of college when the Cuban missile crisis took
place. Kennedy was smart enough to go for the blockade instead of
bombing the missile sites, which would have resulted in the deaths of a
lot of Russian personnel.

The Cuban missile problem was real. The Bush Administration lied us into
Iraq and Afghanistan. Neither of those countries was involved in 9-11.

Not at all. There were terrorists there. But admit, it was an excuse.

Should have just bombed them for 30 days and leveled the government,
then leave. Play the terrorist hit and run tactics and forget the
ground WW II style war.
--
Eat the rich, screw the companies and wonder why there are no jobs. But
we have big huge government we can't afford...
-- Obama and the lefty fleabagger attitude

In article ,
says...

On 10/21/2011 2:20 PM, jps wrote:
On Fri, 21 Oct 2011 12:14:39 -0400, wrote:

On Thu, 20 Oct 2011 21:47:27 -0700, wrote:

On Fri, 21 Oct 2011 00:16:53 -0400, wrote:

On Thu, 20 Oct 2011 21:33:25 -0400, X `
wrote:

This whole Arab Spring thing can still blow up in our face if these
guys don't turn out to be the peace loving people we hope they will
be. I can remember people talking about what a great guy Castro was
because he defeated that evil dictator Batista and how he was going to
bring freedom to the island.. That lasted about 6 weeks until Castro
said, "Oh wait. Maybe I am really a communist" (after denying it for
years) and started nationalizing the whole island. Two years later we
damned near had WWIII over Cuba.

This time it might be WWIII over Israel.

Fortunately, we didn't have an absolute dummy in the white house during
the cuban missle crisis. We did have an absolute dummy in the white
house from 2001 to January 2009. You know, the guy who started two wars
with countries not at war with us. That dummy.

JFK was pretty stupid in that affair and was clearly thinking with his
dick not his brain.
He took this whole thing to the brink of WWIII for exactly the same
deal he could have had 10 months before without any drama.
The Soviets wanted our missiles out of Turkey, they pushed the issue
by putting missiles in Cuba and in the end we pulled the missiles out
of Turkey.
We just had a dick measuring contest that almost destroyed the world
before we did it.
I never thought this was a success, on any level. All we proved was
that the Soviets were not as crazy as we thought they were. What we
didn't understand was that Castro had operational control of some of
those missiles and that they were capable of firing them. (a serious
CIA failure)

And Bush wanted to measure dicks with somebody who didn't have one.

We will have spent 5000 American lives, 50,000 wounded, 1 million
Iraqis dead or displaced.

All for a dick measurement against no one.

I agree Iraq was stupid but it wasn't toying with thermonuclear war.

Your point being?

His point being that Kennedy was "toying with thermonuclear war"... What
is so hard about that. Are you such an ideologue, you can't even read a
plainly put statement? Really...

And quite frankly, the one obvious reason we went into Iraq (if we
suggest there was an alternative for the sake of "this" argument), poke
holes in the suggestion that we went in to try and get some American
troops and supply lines closer to Iran, who is still working furiously
to get a nuke to Isreal, Saudi, USA, and Europe... Think about it, if
you can get the Bush Derangement Syndrome under control for a minute...

That's about the stupidest excuse for going there that I've ever heard!

On 10/21/2011 2:53 PM, iBoaterer wrote:
In ,
says...

On 10/21/2011 2:20 PM, jps wrote:
On Fri, 21 Oct 2011 12:14:39 -0400, wrote:

On Thu, 20 Oct 2011 21:47:27 -0700, wrote:

On Fri, 21 Oct 2011 00:16:53 -0400, wrote:

On Thu, 20 Oct 2011 21:33:25 -0400, X `
wrote:

This whole Arab Spring thing can still blow up in our face if these
guys don't turn out to be the peace loving people we hope they will
be. I can remember people talking about what a great guy Castro was
because he defeated that evil dictator Batista and how he was going to
bring freedom to the island.. That lasted about 6 weeks until Castro
said, "Oh wait. Maybe I am really a communist" (after denying it for
years) and started nationalizing the whole island. Two years later we
damned near had WWIII over Cuba.

This time it might be WWIII over Israel.

Fortunately, we didn't have an absolute dummy in the white house during
the cuban missle crisis. We did have an absolute dummy in the white
house from 2001 to January 2009. You know, the guy who started two wars
with countries not at war with us. That dummy.

JFK was pretty stupid in that affair and was clearly thinking with his
dick not his brain.
He took this whole thing to the brink of WWIII for exactly the same
deal he could have had 10 months before without any drama.
The Soviets wanted our missiles out of Turkey, they pushed the issue
by putting missiles in Cuba and in the end we pulled the missiles out
of Turkey.
We just had a dick measuring contest that almost destroyed the world
before we did it.
I never thought this was a success, on any level. All we proved was
that the Soviets were not as crazy as we thought they were. What we
didn't understand was that Castro had operational control of some of
those missiles and that they were capable of firing them. (a serious
CIA failure)

And Bush wanted to measure dicks with somebody who didn't have one.

We will have spent 5000 American lives, 50,000 wounded, 1 million
Iraqis dead or displaced.

All for a dick measurement against no one.

I agree Iraq was stupid but it wasn't toying with thermonuclear war.

Your point being?

His point being that Kennedy was "toying with thermonuclear war"... What
is so hard about that. Are you such an ideologue, you can't even read a
plainly put statement? Really...

And quite frankly, the one obvious reason we went into Iraq (if we
suggest there was an alternative for the sake of "this" argument), poke
holes in the suggestion that we went in to try and get some American
troops and supply lines closer to Iran, who is still working furiously
to get a nuke to Isreal, Saudi, USA, and Europe... Think about it, if
you can get the Bush Derangement Syndrome under control for a minute...

That's about the stupidest excuse for going there that I've ever heard!

So, you don't think Iran's nukes are a threat? You don't think Pakistan
is a threat? Wow, talk about stupid...

In article ,
says...

On 10/21/2011 2:53 PM, iBoaterer wrote:
In ,
says...

On 10/21/2011 2:20 PM, jps wrote:
On Fri, 21 Oct 2011 12:14:39 -0400, wrote:

On Thu, 20 Oct 2011 21:47:27 -0700, wrote:

On Fri, 21 Oct 2011 00:16:53 -0400, wrote:

On Thu, 20 Oct 2011 21:33:25 -0400, X `
wrote:

This whole Arab Spring thing can still blow up in our face if these
guys don't turn out to be the peace loving people we hope they will
be. I can remember people talking about what a great guy Castro was
because he defeated that evil dictator Batista and how he was going to
bring freedom to the island.. That lasted about 6 weeks until Castro
said, "Oh wait. Maybe I am really a communist" (after denying it for
years) and started nationalizing the whole island. Two years later we
damned near had WWIII over Cuba.

This time it might be WWIII over Israel.

Fortunately, we didn't have an absolute dummy in the white house during
the cuban missle crisis. We did have an absolute dummy in the white
house from 2001 to January 2009. You know, the guy who started two wars
with countries not at war with us. That dummy.

JFK was pretty stupid in that affair and was clearly thinking with his
dick not his brain.
He took this whole thing to the brink of WWIII for exactly the same
deal he could have had 10 months before without any drama.
The Soviets wanted our missiles out of Turkey, they pushed the issue
by putting missiles in Cuba and in the end we pulled the missiles out
of Turkey.
We just had a dick measuring contest that almost destroyed the world
before we did it.
I never thought this was a success, on any level. All we proved was
that the Soviets were not as crazy as we thought they were. What we
didn't understand was that Castro had operational control of some of
those missiles and that they were capable of firing them. (a serious
CIA failure)

And Bush wanted to measure dicks with somebody who didn't have one.

We will have spent 5000 American lives, 50,000 wounded, 1 million
Iraqis dead or displaced.

All for a dick measurement against no one.

I agree Iraq was stupid but it wasn't toying with thermonuclear war.

Your point being?

His point being that Kennedy was "toying with thermonuclear war"... What
is so hard about that. Are you such an ideologue, you can't even read a
plainly put statement? Really...

And quite frankly, the one obvious reason we went into Iraq (if we
suggest there was an alternative for the sake of "this" argument), poke
holes in the suggestion that we went in to try and get some American
troops and supply lines closer to Iran, who is still working furiously
to get a nuke to Isreal, Saudi, USA, and Europe... Think about it, if
you can get the Bush Derangement Syndrome under control for a minute...

That's about the stupidest excuse for going there that I've ever heard!

So, you don't think Iran's nukes are a threat? You don't think Pakistan
is a threat? Wow, talk about stupid...

Good god, man!!! I never said that Iran's nukes aren't a threat. And no,
Pakistan is not a threat, but alas, I never said that neither. What I
said was "That's about the stupidest excuse for going there that I've
ever heard." If Bush spent billions of dollars to go to Iraq and start a
war to have access to Iran, that's beyond stupid.

On 10/21/11 3:11 PM, JustWait wrote:
On 10/21/2011 2:53 PM, iBoaterer wrote:
In ,
says...

On 10/21/2011 2:20 PM, jps wrote:
On Fri, 21 Oct 2011 12:14:39 -0400, wrote:

On Thu, 20 Oct 2011 21:47:27 -0700, wrote:

On Fri, 21 Oct 2011 00:16:53 -0400, wrote:

On Thu, 20 Oct 2011 21:33:25 -0400, X `
wrote:

This whole Arab Spring thing can still blow up in our face if
these
guys don't turn out to be the peace loving people we hope they
will
be. I can remember people talking about what a great guy Castro
was
because he defeated that evil dictator Batista and how he was
going to
bring freedom to the island.. That lasted about 6 weeks until
Castro
said, "Oh wait. Maybe I am really a communist" (after denying
it for
years) and started nationalizing the whole island. Two years
later we
damned near had WWIII over Cuba.

This time it might be WWIII over Israel.

Fortunately, we didn't have an absolute dummy in the white house
during
the cuban missle crisis. We did have an absolute dummy in the white
house from 2001 to January 2009. You know, the guy who started
two wars
with countries not at war with us. That dummy.

JFK was pretty stupid in that affair and was clearly thinking
with his
dick not his brain.
He took this whole thing to the brink of WWIII for exactly the same
deal he could have had 10 months before without any drama.
The Soviets wanted our missiles out of Turkey, they pushed the issue
by putting missiles in Cuba and in the end we pulled the missiles
out
of Turkey.
We just had a dick measuring contest that almost destroyed the world
before we did it.
I never thought this was a success, on any level. All we proved was
that the Soviets were not as crazy as we thought they were. What we
didn't understand was that Castro had operational control of some of
those missiles and that they were capable of firing them. (a serious
CIA failure)

And Bush wanted to measure dicks with somebody who didn't have one.

We will have spent 5000 American lives, 50,000 wounded, 1 million
Iraqis dead or displaced.

All for a dick measurement against no one.

I agree Iraq was stupid but it wasn't toying with thermonuclear war.

Your point being?

His point being that Kennedy was "toying with thermonuclear war"... What
is so hard about that. Are you such an ideologue, you can't even read a
plainly put statement? Really...

And quite frankly, the one obvious reason we went into Iraq (if we
suggest there was an alternative for the sake of "this" argument), poke
holes in the suggestion that we went in to try and get some American
troops and supply lines closer to Iran, who is still working furiously
to get a nuke to Isreal, Saudi, USA, and Europe... Think about it, if
you can get the Bush Derangement Syndrome under control for a minute...

That's about the stupidest excuse for going there that I've ever heard!

So, you don't think Iran's nukes are a threat? You don't think Pakistan
is a threat? Wow, talk about stupid...


We're not going to invade Iran absent a powerful and significant act of
war on its part so long as someone mentally competent is in the White
House. Yet another reason not to vote for Republicans.