"riverman" wrote in message ...

Enjoy your new boat. I suggest taking a rubbing of the dings (lay a piece of
paper over them, and rub a pencil on it) to see exactly how large they are.
If it is indeed caused by a spot where the foam did not expand, its entirely
likely that a week in the open sun will exand them. It would be nice to
compare rubbings over a month or so, to see if that's happening.

Those sound like they might well be "bruises" on the Royalex rather
than voids in the ABS substrate.

Since Spartec/Uniroyal changed the composition of Royalex sheets back
in the early 90's the material has been much less hardy than the
pre-90 sheets.

I wonder in fact if there was yet another, more recent, change in the
composition of Royalex sheets. Our newest canoes all developed similar
depressions after just a few river runs, and many of those "bruises"
(which are noticable only on the exterior skin of the ABS) were along
the chines where the boat pressed up against some obstruction. Those
bruises or depressions have never popped back out after full
sun/warmth exposure.

More and more I appreciate pre-90 Royalex; our canoes from the 80's
are much tougher and take a licking without bruising. Our canoes from
the early and mid 90's are less hardy, and our newest Royalex boats
are wimps compared to the durability of the old Royalex.

Further cheapening of the Royalex "recipe"? They are going to
cheapen/ change themselves out of the market.

Hey, does anyone build a decent whtiewater boat in composites any
more? Remember the Wenonah Edge?

-Dan V.

On 25 May 2004 08:23:02 -0700, (Mike McCrea)
wrote:


I wonder in fact if there was yet another, more recent, change in the
composition of Royalex sheets. Our newest canoes all developed similar
depressions after just a few river runs, and many of those "bruises"
(which are noticable only on the exterior skin of the ABS) were along
the chines where the boat pressed up against some obstruction. Those
bruises or depressions have never popped back out after full
sun/warmth exposure.

More and more I appreciate pre-90 Royalex; our canoes from the 80's
are much tougher and take a licking without bruising. Our canoes from
the early and mid 90's are less hardy, and our newest Royalex boats
are wimps compared to the durability of the old Royalex.

I'll offer one more possibility to explain why our most recent Royalex
canoes seem to bruise so easily, even when compared with our mid-90's
boats (which are of the less hardy Royalex composition):

Our newest canoes are (were) in fact *very* new, as in popping outa
the mold fresh from the factory. We were paddling them only weeks
after they'd been made.

I sorta wonder if maybe Royalex continues to "cure" for some time
after manufacture?

A friend of our bought an canoe identical (same make and model) to one
of ours, but his had sat unsold in a dealer's store for nearly two
years. Both boats went on the same couple of initial trips, and he
without a doubt ran into and over more things than I, and his hull
isn't nearly as bruised.

Anyoen know - does Royalex continue to cure or harded for some time
after manufacturer?

Dan Valleskey valleskey at comcast dot net wrote in message . ..
Further cheapening of the Royalex "recipe"? They are going to
cheapen/ change themselves out of the market.

Hey, does anyone build a decent whtiewater boat in composites any
more? Remember the Wenonah Edge?

-Dan V.

On 25 May 2004 08:23:02 -0700, (Mike McCrea)
wrote:


I wonder in fact if there was yet another, more recent, change in the
composition of Royalex sheets. Our newest canoes all developed similar
depressions after just a few river runs, and many of those "bruises"
(which are noticable only on the exterior skin of the ABS) were along
the chines where the boat pressed up against some obstruction. Those
bruises or depressions have never popped back out after full
sun/warmth exposure.

More and more I appreciate pre-90 Royalex; our canoes from the 80's
are much tougher and take a licking without bruising. Our canoes from
the early and mid 90's are less hardy, and our newest Royalex boats
are wimps compared to the durability of the old Royalex.

"Mike McCrea" wrote in message
om...

Anyoen know - does Royalex continue to cure or harded for some time
after manufacturer?


My server is downloading at something like 3 bits per second, so I can't
wait around for the page to open, but I remember the specs for all different
layups of Royalex was on the Spartech site (they are the manufacturers;
www.spartech.com) If you search there, you'll probably find it.

However, knowing that Royalex stays thermoreactive for years, I can only
imagine that it must continue to 'cure' as it sits in the showroom. The real
question is: how long until it has hardened past it's elastic deformation
point? If it reaches that in a few hours, then it shouldn't be affected by
being on a stream in a few days or weeks.

Let us know what you find.

--riverman

"riverman" wrote in message
...

"Mike McCrea" wrote in message
om...

Anyoen know - does Royalex continue to cure or harded for some time
after manufacturer?


My server is downloading at something like 3 bits per second, so I can't
wait around for the page to open, but I remember the specs for all
different
layups of Royalex was on the Spartech site (they are the manufacturers;
www.spartech.com) If you search there, you'll probably find it.
The link to the PDF doesn't work at the moment. Wonder why?
http://www.spartech.com/royalite/pdf/royalex-low.pdf


However, knowing that Royalex stays thermoreactive for years, I can only
imagine that it must continue to 'cure' as it sits in the showroom. The
real
question is: how long until it has hardened past it's elastic deformation
point? If it reaches that in a few hours, then it shouldn't be affected by
being on a stream in a few days or weeks.

Let us know what you find.

--riverman

"MLL" wrote in message
m...

"riverman" wrote in message
...

"Mike McCrea" wrote in message
om...

Anyoen know - does Royalex continue to cure or harded for some time
after manufacturer?


My server is downloading at something like 3 bits per second, so I can't
wait around for the page to open, but I remember the specs for all
different
layups of Royalex was on the Spartech site (they are the manufacturers;
www.spartech.com) If you search there, you'll probably find it.

The link to the PDF doesn't work at the moment. Wonder why?
http://www.spartech.com/royalite/pdf/royalex-low.pdf



Dunno. but the stats aren't on the PDF file. Pan across the top to the
'products' dropdown, then to 'Royalite' and 'processing guidelines'. Looks
to me like it all cures in 8-24 hours.

--riverman

A couple :

www.millbrookboats.com
http://www.clippercanoes.com/categor...ame=Whitewater

And yes I do remember the Wenonah Edge, mine was in "toughweave" (aka
tupperweave) - that was one heavy boat!

Dan Valleskey valleskey at comcast dot net wrote in message . ..
Further cheapening of the Royalex "recipe"? They are going to
cheapen/ change themselves out of the market.

Hey, does anyone build a decent whtiewater boat in composites any
more? Remember the Wenonah Edge?

-Dan V.

On 25 May 2004 08:23:02 -0700, (Mike McCrea)
wrote:


I wonder in fact if there was yet another, more recent, change in the
composition of Royalex sheets. Our newest canoes all developed similar
depressions after just a few river runs, and many of those "bruises"
(which are noticable only on the exterior skin of the ABS) were along
the chines where the boat pressed up against some obstruction. Those
bruises or depressions have never popped back out after full
sun/warmth exposure.

More and more I appreciate pre-90 Royalex; our canoes from the 80's
are much tougher and take a licking without bruising. Our canoes from
the early and mid 90's are less hardy, and our newest Royalex boats
are wimps compared to the durability of the old Royalex.