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I do not like Lifesling
On Thu, 8 Apr 2010 11:37:39 -0700, "Capt. JG" wrote:
"Don White" wrote in message . .. "Frogwatch" wrote in message ... On Apr 8, 1:27 pm, "Capt. JG" wrote: "Wayne.B" wrote in message ... On Thu, 8 Apr 2010 08:48:02 -0700 (PDT), Frogwatch wrote: I have one but when I consider how it is to be used, it makes no sense. In most cases, you will want to be able to throw something to the person and you simply cannot throw the Lifesling. After considering various throwables, I settled on a cheap JimBuoy with a poly (floating) rope attached via a ss clip. The 150' of light line goes into a canvas bag on the stern rail where it is protected from the sun. The ring buoy is detached and put below when I am not on the boat and the line is stuffed in its bag out of the sun. When I go aboard, I simply attach the line again. Of course, this is in addition to the tethers we use that attach via a carabiner to our inflatable life jackets. The tethers go to a ring bolt in the cockpit. At night, everybody wears a tether. The inflatables each have a strobe as well and mine has a new EPIRB. YES, I am paranoid. You misunderstand how a Lifesling is supposed to be used. The idea is to let all of the line out behind the boat and then circle the person in the water like you were bringing the tow rope to a water skiier. This is a maneuver that needs to be practiced. You should really try to find a "Safety at Sea" course in your area. They typically provide live demonstrations of all sorts of safety equipment and some very worthwhile discussions by experts. http://offshore.ussailing.org/SAS/Seminars.htm Yes, that's what I participated in... a couple of years ago. The other good point, which Wayne mentioned and I'll reinforce, is to get instruction and even more importantly get in lots of practice. It can be fun to do - if the water's warm and it's a nice day - with a volunteer. If it's not a nice day, practice one or more of the regular non-Lifesling techniques, such as the Quick Turn (aka Figure 8). You can't practice enough. -- "j" ganz I understand the circling bit until the Lifesling gets to the person but that just seems kinda slow when what you really want to do is get contact with the person ASAP. Yes, I do need more practice though. I believe, in a sailboat, the objective is to approach the victim while sailing upwind. You don't want to run him down & finish the job, eh? Yes. In fact, the object is not really to get to the person ASAP. Assuming they're wearing a PFD, they're not going to sink. The initial object of the process is to get yourself and your boat under control. Then, approach them in a sensible way... from downwind... typically a close reach, since a close haul give you no ability to point higher without stalling, and a beam reach is too fast and nearly impossible to let out the sails enough to stop. The object even after you've reached the COB is not to "get him out of the water," but rather to attach the COB to the boat, then retrieve. The Lifesling cuts the time to get back to the water vs. a more traditional approach (e.g., Figure 8) and gives the COB something to grab that's attached to the boat. Thus, in rough wind/sea state, you don't have a great of a potential to lose sight of the COB. Everyone needs more practice. I practice with my private students and even some charters if they're interested. It's really one of the essential lessons for sailing instruction. On the bay, we typically teach the Fig. 8, since we're interested in teaching sail trim and boat handling. It's too dangerous in these waters to put someone in the water. I've done that in the Carib., but not here, save the seminars previously mentioned. Damn. For a bit I thought you meant the Chesapeake. |
I do not like Lifesling
"Capt. JG" wrote in message easolutions... "Don White" wrote in message ... "Frogwatch" wrote in message ... On Apr 8, 1:27 pm, "Capt. JG" wrote: "Wayne.B" wrote in message ... On Thu, 8 Apr 2010 08:48:02 -0700 (PDT), Frogwatch wrote: I have one but when I consider how it is to be used, it makes no sense. In most cases, you will want to be able to throw something to the person and you simply cannot throw the Lifesling. After considering various throwables, I settled on a cheap JimBuoy with a poly (floating) rope attached via a ss clip. The 150' of light line goes into a canvas bag on the stern rail where it is protected from the sun. The ring buoy is detached and put below when I am not on the boat and the line is stuffed in its bag out of the sun. When I go aboard, I simply attach the line again. Of course, this is in addition to the tethers we use that attach via a carabiner to our inflatable life jackets. The tethers go to a ring bolt in the cockpit. At night, everybody wears a tether. The inflatables each have a strobe as well and mine has a new EPIRB. YES, I am paranoid. You misunderstand how a Lifesling is supposed to be used. The idea is to let all of the line out behind the boat and then circle the person in the water like you were bringing the tow rope to a water skiier. This is a maneuver that needs to be practiced. You should really try to find a "Safety at Sea" course in your area. They typically provide live demonstrations of all sorts of safety equipment and some very worthwhile discussions by experts. http://offshore.ussailing.org/SAS/Seminars.htm Yes, that's what I participated in... a couple of years ago. The other good point, which Wayne mentioned and I'll reinforce, is to get instruction and even more importantly get in lots of practice. It can be fun to do - if the water's warm and it's a nice day - with a volunteer. If it's not a nice day, practice one or more of the regular non-Lifesling techniques, such as the Quick Turn (aka Figure 8). You can't practice enough. -- "j" ganz I understand the circling bit until the Lifesling gets to the person but that just seems kinda slow when what you really want to do is get contact with the person ASAP. Yes, I do need more practice though. I believe, in a sailboat, the objective is to approach the victim while sailing upwind. You don't want to run him down & finish the job, eh? Yes. In fact, the object is not really to get to the person ASAP. Assuming they're wearing a PFD, they're not going to sink. The initial object of the process is to get yourself and your boat under control. Then, approach them in a sensible way... from downwind... typically a close reach, since a close haul give you no ability to point higher without stalling, and a beam reach is too fast and nearly impossible to let out the sails enough to stop. The object even after you've reached the COB is not to "get him out of the water," but rather to attach the COB to the boat, then retrieve. The Lifesling cuts the time to get back to the water vs. a more traditional approach (e.g., Figure 8) and gives the COB something to grab that's attached to the boat. Thus, in rough wind/sea state, you don't have a great of a potential to lose sight of the COB. Everyone needs more practice. I practice with my private students and even some charters if they're interested. It's really one of the essential lessons for sailing instruction. On the bay, we typically teach the Fig. 8, since we're interested in teaching sail trim and boat handling. It's too dangerous in these waters to put someone in the water. I've done that in the Carib., but not here, save the seminars previously mentioned. -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com Bad assumption. What if no PFD? You want to get a life ring or a floatation device to the person so they can stay above water. Especially in cold water. Only MOB situation I was in was about 40 years ago and they guy fell off the boat in to 50 degree water with a heavy coat on while salmon fishing. Threw him a life ring so he would have some floatation and kept eyes on him while I instructed the guy at the wheel where to go. And Lifeslings were recalled for some forgotten reason about 20 years ago. |
I do not like Lifesling
"Bill McKee" wrote in message
... "Capt. JG" wrote in message easolutions... "Don White" wrote in message ... "Frogwatch" wrote in message ... On Apr 8, 1:27 pm, "Capt. JG" wrote: "Wayne.B" wrote in message ... On Thu, 8 Apr 2010 08:48:02 -0700 (PDT), Frogwatch wrote: I have one but when I consider how it is to be used, it makes no sense. In most cases, you will want to be able to throw something to the person and you simply cannot throw the Lifesling. After considering various throwables, I settled on a cheap JimBuoy with a poly (floating) rope attached via a ss clip. The 150' of light line goes into a canvas bag on the stern rail where it is protected from the sun. The ring buoy is detached and put below when I am not on the boat and the line is stuffed in its bag out of the sun. When I go aboard, I simply attach the line again. Of course, this is in addition to the tethers we use that attach via a carabiner to our inflatable life jackets. The tethers go to a ring bolt in the cockpit. At night, everybody wears a tether. The inflatables each have a strobe as well and mine has a new EPIRB. YES, I am paranoid. You misunderstand how a Lifesling is supposed to be used. The idea is to let all of the line out behind the boat and then circle the person in the water like you were bringing the tow rope to a water skiier. This is a maneuver that needs to be practiced. You should really try to find a "Safety at Sea" course in your area. They typically provide live demonstrations of all sorts of safety equipment and some very worthwhile discussions by experts. http://offshore.ussailing.org/SAS/Seminars.htm Yes, that's what I participated in... a couple of years ago. The other good point, which Wayne mentioned and I'll reinforce, is to get instruction and even more importantly get in lots of practice. It can be fun to do - if the water's warm and it's a nice day - with a volunteer. If it's not a nice day, practice one or more of the regular non-Lifesling techniques, such as the Quick Turn (aka Figure 8). You can't practice enough. -- "j" ganz I understand the circling bit until the Lifesling gets to the person but that just seems kinda slow when what you really want to do is get contact with the person ASAP. Yes, I do need more practice though. I believe, in a sailboat, the objective is to approach the victim while sailing upwind. You don't want to run him down & finish the job, eh? Yes. In fact, the object is not really to get to the person ASAP. Assuming they're wearing a PFD, they're not going to sink. The initial object of the process is to get yourself and your boat under control. Then, approach them in a sensible way... from downwind... typically a close reach, since a close haul give you no ability to point higher without stalling, and a beam reach is too fast and nearly impossible to let out the sails enough to stop. The object even after you've reached the COB is not to "get him out of the water," but rather to attach the COB to the boat, then retrieve. The Lifesling cuts the time to get back to the water vs. a more traditional approach (e.g., Figure 8) and gives the COB something to grab that's attached to the boat. Thus, in rough wind/sea state, you don't have a great of a potential to lose sight of the COB. Everyone needs more practice. I practice with my private students and even some charters if they're interested. It's really one of the essential lessons for sailing instruction. On the bay, we typically teach the Fig. 8, since we're interested in teaching sail trim and boat handling. It's too dangerous in these waters to put someone in the water. I've done that in the Carib., but not here, save the seminars previously mentioned. -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com Bad assumption. What if no PFD? You want to get a life ring or a floatation device to the person so they can stay above water. Especially in cold water. Only MOB situation I was in was about 40 years ago and they guy fell off the boat in to 50 degree water with a heavy coat on while salmon fishing. Threw him a life ring so he would have some floatation and kept eyes on him while I instructed the guy at the wheel where to go. And Lifeslings were recalled for some forgotten reason about 20 years ago. It's not a bad assumption, given two factors. First, he pretty much implied everyone was wearing one. Second, on my boat I require everyone to wear a PFD. If you're wearing a PFD, you're going to be floating. The chances of an inflatable failing is minimal, as long as it's properly maintained, which is a trivial job. Of course, getting back sooner vs. later is better. But, you can't compromise the safety of the rest of the crew or the boat by acting prematurely. In the case of no PFD, then the options are much more limited. If the person is conscious, even in 50 deg water, they're going to have useful consciousness for 15 to 20 minutes (perhaps more). Throwing something, perhaps lots of things that float is always a good idea. It sounds like you did the right thing.. I take it the person survived. If the person is unconscious, the options dwindle further. Probably, they're going to die without a PFD. Not much can be done except try. The Lifesling has undergone extensive testing, and the CG approved models work as advertised. -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com |
I do not like Lifesling
On 09/04/2010 00:55, Capt. JG wrote:
"Bill wrote in message ... "Capt. wrote in message easolutions... "Don wrote in message ... wrote in message ... On Apr 8, 1:27 pm, "Capt. wrote: wrote in message ... On Thu, 8 Apr 2010 08:48:02 -0700 (PDT), Frogwatch wrote: I have one but when I consider how it is to be used, it makes no sense. In most cases, you will want to be able to throw something to the person and you simply cannot throw the Lifesling. After considering various throwables, I settled on a cheap JimBuoy with a poly (floating) rope attached via a ss clip. The 150' of light line goes into a canvas bag on the stern rail where it is protected from the sun. The ring buoy is detached and put below when I am not on the boat and the line is stuffed in its bag out of the sun. When I go aboard, I simply attach the line again. Of course, this is in addition to the tethers we use that attach via a carabiner to our inflatable life jackets. The tethers go to a ring bolt in the cockpit. At night, everybody wears a tether. The inflatables each have a strobe as well and mine has a new EPIRB. YES, I am paranoid. You misunderstand how a Lifesling is supposed to be used. The idea is to let all of the line out behind the boat and then circle the person in the water like you were bringing the tow rope to a water skiier. This is a maneuver that needs to be practiced. You should really try to find a "Safety at Sea" course in your area. They typically provide live demonstrations of all sorts of safety equipment and some very worthwhile discussions by experts. http://offshore.ussailing.org/SAS/Seminars.htm Yes, that's what I participated in... a couple of years ago. The other good point, which Wayne mentioned and I'll reinforce, is to get instruction and even more importantly get in lots of practice. It can be fun to do - if the water's warm and it's a nice day - with a volunteer. If it's not a nice day, practice one or more of the regular non-Lifesling techniques, such as the Quick Turn (aka Figure 8). You can't practice enough. -- "j" ganz I understand the circling bit until the Lifesling gets to the person but that just seems kinda slow when what you really want to do is get contact with the person ASAP. Yes, I do need more practice though. I believe, in a sailboat, the objective is to approach the victim while sailing upwind. You don't want to run him down& finish the job, eh? Yes. In fact, the object is not really to get to the person ASAP. Assuming they're wearing a PFD, they're not going to sink. The initial object of the process is to get yourself and your boat under control. Then, approach them in a sensible way... from downwind... typically a close reach, since a close haul give you no ability to point higher without stalling, and a beam reach is too fast and nearly impossible to let out the sails enough to stop. The object even after you've reached the COB is not to "get him out of the water," but rather to attach the COB to the boat, then retrieve. The Lifesling cuts the time to get back to the water vs. a more traditional approach (e.g., Figure 8) and gives the COB something to grab that's attached to the boat. Thus, in rough wind/sea state, you don't have a great of a potential to lose sight of the COB. Everyone needs more practice. I practice with my private students and even some charters if they're interested. It's really one of the essential lessons for sailing instruction. On the bay, we typically teach the Fig. 8, since we're interested in teaching sail trim and boat handling. It's too dangerous in these waters to put someone in the water. I've done that in the Carib., but not here, save the seminars previously mentioned. -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com Bad assumption. What if no PFD? You want to get a life ring or a floatation device to the person so they can stay above water. Especially in cold water. Only MOB situation I was in was about 40 years ago and they guy fell off the boat in to 50 degree water with a heavy coat on while salmon fishing. Threw him a life ring so he would have some floatation and kept eyes on him while I instructed the guy at the wheel where to go. And Lifeslings were recalled for some forgotten reason about 20 years ago. It's not a bad assumption, given two factors. First, he pretty much implied everyone was wearing one. Second, on my boat I require everyone to wear a PFD. If you're wearing a PFD, you're going to be floating. The chances of an inflatable failing is minimal, as long as it's properly maintained, which is a trivial job. Of course, getting back sooner vs. later is better. But, you can't compromise the safety of the rest of the crew or the boat by acting prematurely. In the case of no PFD, then the options are much more limited. If the person is conscious, even in 50 deg water, they're going to have useful consciousness for 15 to 20 minutes (perhaps more). Throwing something, perhaps lots of things that float is always a good idea. It sounds like you did the right thing.. I take it the person survived. If the person is unconscious, the options dwindle further. Probably, they're going to die without a PFD. Not much can be done except try. The Lifesling has undergone extensive testing, and the CG approved models work as advertised. I just tell people that if they fall out they are dead and I am not going to pick them up. |
I do not like Lifesling
"goofball_star_dot_etal" wrote in message
o.uk... On 09/04/2010 00:55, Capt. JG wrote: "Bill wrote in message ... "Capt. wrote in message easolutions... "Don wrote in message ... wrote in message ... On Apr 8, 1:27 pm, "Capt. wrote: wrote in message ... On Thu, 8 Apr 2010 08:48:02 -0700 (PDT), Frogwatch wrote: I have one but when I consider how it is to be used, it makes no sense. In most cases, you will want to be able to throw something to the person and you simply cannot throw the Lifesling. After considering various throwables, I settled on a cheap JimBuoy with a poly (floating) rope attached via a ss clip. The 150' of light line goes into a canvas bag on the stern rail where it is protected from the sun. The ring buoy is detached and put below when I am not on the boat and the line is stuffed in its bag out of the sun. When I go aboard, I simply attach the line again. Of course, this is in addition to the tethers we use that attach via a carabiner to our inflatable life jackets. The tethers go to a ring bolt in the cockpit. At night, everybody wears a tether. The inflatables each have a strobe as well and mine has a new EPIRB. YES, I am paranoid. You misunderstand how a Lifesling is supposed to be used. The idea is to let all of the line out behind the boat and then circle the person in the water like you were bringing the tow rope to a water skiier. This is a maneuver that needs to be practiced. You should really try to find a "Safety at Sea" course in your area. They typically provide live demonstrations of all sorts of safety equipment and some very worthwhile discussions by experts. http://offshore.ussailing.org/SAS/Seminars.htm Yes, that's what I participated in... a couple of years ago. The other good point, which Wayne mentioned and I'll reinforce, is to get instruction and even more importantly get in lots of practice. It can be fun to do - if the water's warm and it's a nice day - with a volunteer. If it's not a nice day, practice one or more of the regular non-Lifesling techniques, such as the Quick Turn (aka Figure 8). You can't practice enough. -- "j" ganz I understand the circling bit until the Lifesling gets to the person but that just seems kinda slow when what you really want to do is get contact with the person ASAP. Yes, I do need more practice though. I believe, in a sailboat, the objective is to approach the victim while sailing upwind. You don't want to run him down& finish the job, eh? Yes. In fact, the object is not really to get to the person ASAP. Assuming they're wearing a PFD, they're not going to sink. The initial object of the process is to get yourself and your boat under control. Then, approach them in a sensible way... from downwind... typically a close reach, since a close haul give you no ability to point higher without stalling, and a beam reach is too fast and nearly impossible to let out the sails enough to stop. The object even after you've reached the COB is not to "get him out of the water," but rather to attach the COB to the boat, then retrieve. The Lifesling cuts the time to get back to the water vs. a more traditional approach (e.g., Figure 8) and gives the COB something to grab that's attached to the boat. Thus, in rough wind/sea state, you don't have a great of a potential to lose sight of the COB. Everyone needs more practice. I practice with my private students and even some charters if they're interested. It's really one of the essential lessons for sailing instruction. On the bay, we typically teach the Fig. 8, since we're interested in teaching sail trim and boat handling. It's too dangerous in these waters to put someone in the water. I've done that in the Carib., but not here, save the seminars previously mentioned. -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com Bad assumption. What if no PFD? You want to get a life ring or a floatation device to the person so they can stay above water. Especially in cold water. Only MOB situation I was in was about 40 years ago and they guy fell off the boat in to 50 degree water with a heavy coat on while salmon fishing. Threw him a life ring so he would have some floatation and kept eyes on him while I instructed the guy at the wheel where to go. And Lifeslings were recalled for some forgotten reason about 20 years ago. It's not a bad assumption, given two factors. First, he pretty much implied everyone was wearing one. Second, on my boat I require everyone to wear a PFD. If you're wearing a PFD, you're going to be floating. The chances of an inflatable failing is minimal, as long as it's properly maintained, which is a trivial job. Of course, getting back sooner vs. later is better. But, you can't compromise the safety of the rest of the crew or the boat by acting prematurely. In the case of no PFD, then the options are much more limited. If the person is conscious, even in 50 deg water, they're going to have useful consciousness for 15 to 20 minutes (perhaps more). Throwing something, perhaps lots of things that float is always a good idea. It sounds like you did the right thing.. I take it the person survived. If the person is unconscious, the options dwindle further. Probably, they're going to die without a PFD. Not much can be done except try. The Lifesling has undergone extensive testing, and the CG approved models work as advertised. I just tell people that if they fall out they are dead and I am not going to pick them up. Don't get a lot of return visitors I imagine. I ask them if they know how to swim. No matter which way they answer, I tell them to wallets/purses in the cabin area. :-) -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com |
I do not like Lifesling
On 09/04/2010 19:02, Capt. JG wrote:
w wrote in message o.uk... On 09/04/2010 00:55, Capt. JG wrote: "Bill wrote in message ... "Capt. wrote in message easolutions... "Don wrote in message ... wrote in message ... On Apr 8, 1:27 pm, "Capt. wrote: wrote in message ... On Thu, 8 Apr 2010 08:48:02 -0700 (PDT), Frogwatch wrote: I have one but when I consider how it is to be used, it makes no sense. In most cases, you will want to be able to throw something to the person and you simply cannot throw the Lifesling. After considering various throwables, I settled on a cheap JimBuoy with a poly (floating) rope attached via a ss clip. The 150' of light line goes into a canvas bag on the stern rail where it is protected from the sun. The ring buoy is detached and put below when I am not on the boat and the line is stuffed in its bag out of the sun. When I go aboard, I simply attach the line again. Of course, this is in addition to the tethers we use that attach via a carabiner to our inflatable life jackets. The tethers go to a ring bolt in the cockpit. At night, everybody wears a tether. The inflatables each have a strobe as well and mine has a new EPIRB. YES, I am paranoid. You misunderstand how a Lifesling is supposed to be used. The idea is to let all of the line out behind the boat and then circle the person in the water like you were bringing the tow rope to a water skiier. This is a maneuver that needs to be practiced. You should really try to find a "Safety at Sea" course in your area. They typically provide live demonstrations of all sorts of safety equipment and some very worthwhile discussions by experts. http://offshore.ussailing.org/SAS/Seminars.htm Yes, that's what I participated in... a couple of years ago. The other good point, which Wayne mentioned and I'll reinforce, is to get instruction and even more importantly get in lots of practice. It can be fun to do - if the water's warm and it's a nice day - with a volunteer. If it's not a nice day, practice one or more of the regular non-Lifesling techniques, such as the Quick Turn (aka Figure 8). You can't practice enough. -- "j" ganz I understand the circling bit until the Lifesling gets to the person but that just seems kinda slow when what you really want to do is get contact with the person ASAP. Yes, I do need more practice though. I believe, in a sailboat, the objective is to approach the victim while sailing upwind. You don't want to run him down& finish the job, eh? Yes. In fact, the object is not really to get to the person ASAP. Assuming they're wearing a PFD, they're not going to sink. The initial object of the process is to get yourself and your boat under control. Then, approach them in a sensible way... from downwind... typically a close reach, since a close haul give you no ability to point higher without stalling, and a beam reach is too fast and nearly impossible to let out the sails enough to stop. The object even after you've reached the COB is not to "get him out of the water," but rather to attach the COB to the boat, then retrieve. The Lifesling cuts the time to get back to the water vs. a more traditional approach (e.g., Figure 8) and gives the COB something to grab that's attached to the boat. Thus, in rough wind/sea state, you don't have a great of a potential to lose sight of the COB. Everyone needs more practice. I practice with my private students and even some charters if they're interested. It's really one of the essential lessons for sailing instruction. On the bay, we typically teach the Fig. 8, since we're interested in teaching sail trim and boat handling. It's too dangerous in these waters to put someone in the water. I've done that in the Carib., but not here, save the seminars previously mentioned. -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com Bad assumption. What if no PFD? You want to get a life ring or a floatation device to the person so they can stay above water. Especially in cold water. Only MOB situation I was in was about 40 years ago and they guy fell off the boat in to 50 degree water with a heavy coat on while salmon fishing. Threw him a life ring so he would have some floatation and kept eyes on him while I instructed the guy at the wheel where to go. And Lifeslings were recalled for some forgotten reason about 20 years ago. It's not a bad assumption, given two factors. First, he pretty much implied everyone was wearing one. Second, on my boat I require everyone to wear a PFD. If you're wearing a PFD, you're going to be floating. The chances of an inflatable failing is minimal, as long as it's properly maintained, which is a trivial job. Of course, getting back sooner vs. later is better. But, you can't compromise the safety of the rest of the crew or the boat by acting prematurely. In the case of no PFD, then the options are much more limited. If the person is conscious, even in 50 deg water, they're going to have useful consciousness for 15 to 20 minutes (perhaps more). Throwing something, perhaps lots of things that float is always a good idea. It sounds like you did the right thing.. I take it the person survived. If the person is unconscious, the options dwindle further. Probably, they're going to die without a PFD. Not much can be done except try. The Lifesling has undergone extensive testing, and the CG approved models work as advertised. I just tell people that if they fall out they are dead and I am not going to pick them up. Don't get a lot of return visitors I imagine. You get what you pay for! I ask them if they know how to swim. No matter which way they answer, I tell them to wallets/purses in the cabin area. :-) |
I do not like Lifesling
On 09/04/2010 00:55, Capt. JG wrote:
"Bill wrote in message ... "Capt. wrote in message easolutions... "Don wrote in message ... wrote in message ... On Apr 8, 1:27 pm, "Capt. wrote: wrote in message ... On Thu, 8 Apr 2010 08:48:02 -0700 (PDT), Frogwatch wrote: I have one but when I consider how it is to be used, it makes no sense. In most cases, you will want to be able to throw something to the person and you simply cannot throw the Lifesling. After considering various throwables, I settled on a cheap JimBuoy with a poly (floating) rope attached via a ss clip. The 150' of light line goes into a canvas bag on the stern rail where it is protected from the sun. The ring buoy is detached and put below when I am not on the boat and the line is stuffed in its bag out of the sun. When I go aboard, I simply attach the line again. Of course, this is in addition to the tethers we use that attach via a carabiner to our inflatable life jackets. The tethers go to a ring bolt in the cockpit. At night, everybody wears a tether. The inflatables each have a strobe as well and mine has a new EPIRB. YES, I am paranoid. You misunderstand how a Lifesling is supposed to be used. The idea is to let all of the line out behind the boat and then circle the person in the water like you were bringing the tow rope to a water skiier. This is a maneuver that needs to be practiced. You should really try to find a "Safety at Sea" course in your area. They typically provide live demonstrations of all sorts of safety equipment and some very worthwhile discussions by experts. http://offshore.ussailing.org/SAS/Seminars.htm Yes, that's what I participated in... a couple of years ago. The other good point, which Wayne mentioned and I'll reinforce, is to get instruction and even more importantly get in lots of practice. It can be fun to do - if the water's warm and it's a nice day - with a volunteer. If it's not a nice day, practice one or more of the regular non-Lifesling techniques, such as the Quick Turn (aka Figure 8). You can't practice enough. -- "j" ganz I understand the circling bit until the Lifesling gets to the person but that just seems kinda slow when what you really want to do is get contact with the person ASAP. Yes, I do need more practice though. I believe, in a sailboat, the objective is to approach the victim while sailing upwind. You don't want to run him down& finish the job, eh? Yes. In fact, the object is not really to get to the person ASAP. Assuming they're wearing a PFD, they're not going to sink. The initial object of the process is to get yourself and your boat under control. Then, approach them in a sensible way... from downwind... typically a close reach, since a close haul give you no ability to point higher without stalling, and a beam reach is too fast and nearly impossible to let out the sails enough to stop. The object even after you've reached the COB is not to "get him out of the water," but rather to attach the COB to the boat, then retrieve. The Lifesling cuts the time to get back to the water vs. a more traditional approach (e.g., Figure 8) and gives the COB something to grab that's attached to the boat. Thus, in rough wind/sea state, you don't have a great of a potential to lose sight of the COB. Everyone needs more practice. I practice with my private students and even some charters if they're interested. It's really one of the essential lessons for sailing instruction. On the bay, we typically teach the Fig. 8, since we're interested in teaching sail trim and boat handling. It's too dangerous in these waters to put someone in the water. I've done that in the Carib., but not here, save the seminars previously mentioned. -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com Bad assumption. What if no PFD? You want to get a life ring or a floatation device to the person so they can stay above water. Especially in cold water. Only MOB situation I was in was about 40 years ago and they guy fell off the boat in to 50 degree water with a heavy coat on while salmon fishing. Threw him a life ring so he would have some floatation and kept eyes on him while I instructed the guy at the wheel where to go. And Lifeslings were recalled for some forgotten reason about 20 years ago. It's not a bad assumption, given two factors. First, he pretty much implied everyone was wearing one. Second, on my boat I require everyone to wear a PFD. If you're wearing a PFD, you're going to be floating. The chances of an inflatable failing is minimal, as long as it's properly maintained, which is a trivial job. Of course, getting back sooner vs. later is better. But, you can't compromise the safety of the rest of the crew or the boat by acting prematurely. In the case of no PFD, then the options are much more limited. If the person is conscious, even in 50 deg water, they're going to have useful consciousness for 15 to 20 minutes (perhaps more). Throwing something, perhaps lots of things that float is always a good idea. It sounds like you did the right thing.. I take it the person survived. If the person is unconscious, the options dwindle further. Probably, they're going to die without a PFD. Not much can be done except try. The Lifesling has undergone extensive testing, and the CG approved models work as advertised. I don't think they had H%S when I was a kid, but at least I had a duffle coat.. http://www.ceredigion.gov.uk/index.cfm?articleid=12585 |
I do not like Lifesling
"goofball_star_dot_etal" wrote in message
o.uk... On 09/04/2010 00:55, Capt. JG wrote: "Bill wrote in message ... "Capt. wrote in message easolutions... "Don wrote in message ... wrote in message ... On Apr 8, 1:27 pm, "Capt. wrote: wrote in message ... On Thu, 8 Apr 2010 08:48:02 -0700 (PDT), Frogwatch wrote: I have one but when I consider how it is to be used, it makes no sense. In most cases, you will want to be able to throw something to the person and you simply cannot throw the Lifesling. After considering various throwables, I settled on a cheap JimBuoy with a poly (floating) rope attached via a ss clip. The 150' of light line goes into a canvas bag on the stern rail where it is protected from the sun. The ring buoy is detached and put below when I am not on the boat and the line is stuffed in its bag out of the sun. When I go aboard, I simply attach the line again. Of course, this is in addition to the tethers we use that attach via a carabiner to our inflatable life jackets. The tethers go to a ring bolt in the cockpit. At night, everybody wears a tether. The inflatables each have a strobe as well and mine has a new EPIRB. YES, I am paranoid. You misunderstand how a Lifesling is supposed to be used. The idea is to let all of the line out behind the boat and then circle the person in the water like you were bringing the tow rope to a water skiier. This is a maneuver that needs to be practiced. You should really try to find a "Safety at Sea" course in your area. They typically provide live demonstrations of all sorts of safety equipment and some very worthwhile discussions by experts. http://offshore.ussailing.org/SAS/Seminars.htm Yes, that's what I participated in... a couple of years ago. The other good point, which Wayne mentioned and I'll reinforce, is to get instruction and even more importantly get in lots of practice. It can be fun to do - if the water's warm and it's a nice day - with a volunteer. If it's not a nice day, practice one or more of the regular non-Lifesling techniques, such as the Quick Turn (aka Figure 8). You can't practice enough. -- "j" ganz I understand the circling bit until the Lifesling gets to the person but that just seems kinda slow when what you really want to do is get contact with the person ASAP. Yes, I do need more practice though. I believe, in a sailboat, the objective is to approach the victim while sailing upwind. You don't want to run him down& finish the job, eh? Yes. In fact, the object is not really to get to the person ASAP. Assuming they're wearing a PFD, they're not going to sink. The initial object of the process is to get yourself and your boat under control. Then, approach them in a sensible way... from downwind... typically a close reach, since a close haul give you no ability to point higher without stalling, and a beam reach is too fast and nearly impossible to let out the sails enough to stop. The object even after you've reached the COB is not to "get him out of the water," but rather to attach the COB to the boat, then retrieve. The Lifesling cuts the time to get back to the water vs. a more traditional approach (e.g., Figure 8) and gives the COB something to grab that's attached to the boat. Thus, in rough wind/sea state, you don't have a great of a potential to lose sight of the COB. Everyone needs more practice. I practice with my private students and even some charters if they're interested. It's really one of the essential lessons for sailing instruction. On the bay, we typically teach the Fig. 8, since we're interested in teaching sail trim and boat handling. It's too dangerous in these waters to put someone in the water. I've done that in the Carib., but not here, save the seminars previously mentioned. -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com Bad assumption. What if no PFD? You want to get a life ring or a floatation device to the person so they can stay above water. Especially in cold water. Only MOB situation I was in was about 40 years ago and they guy fell off the boat in to 50 degree water with a heavy coat on while salmon fishing. Threw him a life ring so he would have some floatation and kept eyes on him while I instructed the guy at the wheel where to go. And Lifeslings were recalled for some forgotten reason about 20 years ago. It's not a bad assumption, given two factors. First, he pretty much implied everyone was wearing one. Second, on my boat I require everyone to wear a PFD. If you're wearing a PFD, you're going to be floating. The chances of an inflatable failing is minimal, as long as it's properly maintained, which is a trivial job. Of course, getting back sooner vs. later is better. But, you can't compromise the safety of the rest of the crew or the boat by acting prematurely. In the case of no PFD, then the options are much more limited. If the person is conscious, even in 50 deg water, they're going to have useful consciousness for 15 to 20 minutes (perhaps more). Throwing something, perhaps lots of things that float is always a good idea. It sounds like you did the right thing.. I take it the person survived. If the person is unconscious, the options dwindle further. Probably, they're going to die without a PFD. Not much can be done except try. The Lifesling has undergone extensive testing, and the CG approved models work as advertised. I don't think they had H%S when I was a kid, but at least I had a duffle coat.. http://www.ceredigion.gov.uk/index.cfm?articleid=12585 H%S? Don't know that acronym. -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com |
I do not like Lifesling
On Apr 8, 7:48*am, Frogwatch wrote:
I have one but when I consider how it is to be used, YES, I am paranoid. After reading all the advice I realized each advisor here neglected to consider a couple basic quesions before shooitn off their moth. Ya migh want to know: What type boat is Frogwatch using as in motor or sail WHat size is this unknow vessel and When does the bhoat operate. WHERE does this boat operate as in 80 degree F lake in Kansas or SF Bay or Strait of Juan de Fuca or 900 miles west of W 130 line Who are the passangers as in toddlers, or invalid 80 yo or Skip and Lydia. Does the operatrer have any training if so what kind and how aboutthepassangers? All will determine what type of emergency equipmnet and stratiges to use. But I guess its easier to just toss a bunch of jizz instead of inquiring first. Bob |
I do not like Lifesling
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