Eisboch wrote:
"jps" wrote in message
...
Navigator, big plastic boat. Never liked the lines or the look and
they drop value pretty quick. Somebody was happy with you having paid
the depreciation.



You are entitled to your opinion.

Ever been in one in 8 foot confused seas? Ever seen how they are
constructed?
Ever been in the engine spaces and seen the size of the main stringers and
the general construction and design of the important elements of a boat?
Ever spent 10 hours a day at cruise speed, 30 miles offshore on one? Have
you owned one? Ever spent any serious time underway on one? Have you
piloted one in rough seas? Handled one in close quarter maneuvering? I
suspect not.

Something tells me you don't like them and made your unsolicited comments
simply because I owned one.

I agree they are not "pretty" in the eyes of all, but they are highly
regarded in marine surveyor's circles as being very well designed and built
from a marine engineering point of view. They are basically the same boat
as a Californian Yacht, the original Marshall design and boat line which he
sold and then purchased back a few years ago.

I could recite the main reason I decided to buy one, and the opinions of
seasoned, larger boat owners who were underway on the one I had but I doubt
they would be meaningful to you. I also don't think that the difference in
what I originally paid for it and what I sold it for almost 9 years later
represented an excessive "hit", depreciation-wise. Very few new boats hold
their value well.

Don't quit your day job to become a marine surveyor.

Eisboch



You are wasting your time trying to sell the merits of that boat to JPS.
He couldn't afford one even if he mortgaged his house and sold his girls
into slavery.

"anon-e-moose" wrote in message
...



You are wasting your time trying to sell the merits of that boat to JPS.
He couldn't afford one even if he mortgaged his house and sold his girls
into slavery.

Depending on what you are buying a boat for, you can have just as much
enjoyment in a less expensive, older and/or smaller boat. I did for
years. The old '82 Century I had was a POS, problems up the kazoo and it
handled like a brick. But I enjoyed it and I learned quite a bit about
boating on it, as I did on several more older boats I owned over the years.

Later when retirement was around the corner and my boating interests
changed I found myself in the market for a serious, safe, offshore boat that
could also be lived on for extended periods of time.
That's when I discovered the Navigator line, researched it's history and
builder's credentials and reputation and talked to experienced people who
were familiar with them, including highly qualified marine surveyors. I
became convinced after talking to a boat captain who makes his living
delivering larger boats up and down the east coast. I asked him of all the
boats he had delivered over the years in good weather, bad weather, rough
seas and calm, which one would he pick if he needed to pick only one to
make a trip from MA to Florida in. His answer (without hesitation) was
the Navigator and he then proceeded to tell me why.

Eisboch

On Wed, 24 Mar 2010 08:54:53 -0400, "Eisboch" wrote:


"anon-e-moose" wrote in message
.. .



You are wasting your time trying to sell the merits of that boat to JPS.
He couldn't afford one even if he mortgaged his house and sold his girls
into slavery.

Depending on what you are buying a boat for, you can have just as much
enjoyment in a less expensive, older and/or smaller boat. I did for
years. The old '82 Century I had was a POS, problems up the kazoo and it
handled like a brick. But I enjoyed it and I learned quite a bit about
boating on it, as I did on several more older boats I owned over the years.

Later when retirement was around the corner and my boating interests
changed I found myself in the market for a serious, safe, offshore boat that
could also be lived on for extended periods of time.
That's when I discovered the Navigator line, researched it's history and
builder's credentials and reputation and talked to experienced people who
were familiar with them, including highly qualified marine surveyors. I
became convinced after talking to a boat captain who makes his living
delivering larger boats up and down the east coast. I asked him of all the
boats he had delivered over the years in good weather, bad weather, rough
seas and calm, which one would he pick if he needed to pick only one to
make a trip from MA to Florida in. His answer (without hesitation) was
the Navigator and he then proceeded to tell me why.

Eisboch

Holy crap. Out of the thousands of boats designed, engineered and
manufactured, he could only site Navigator?

Was he a friend of the broker?

"jps" wrote in message
...

Holy crap. Out of the thousands of boats designed, engineered and
manufactured, he could only site Navigator?


I didn't say that. You did. I asked him what boat, (of that relative
size) based on his years of experience of running boats up and down the
east coast, in all kinds of conditions, would he choose to make the trip in
if he had the choice. And then he backed it up with reasons and examples.
They are not important here because you wouldn't be interested.

You really shouldn't try to spin a comment into something other than what it
was.

Eisboch

On Wed, 24 Mar 2010 12:09:40 -0400, "Eisboch"
wrote:


"jps" wrote in message
.. .

Holy crap. Out of the thousands of boats designed, engineered and
manufactured, he could only site Navigator?


I didn't say that. You did. I asked him what boat, (of that relative
size) based on his years of experience of running boats up and down the
east coast, in all kinds of conditions, would he choose to make the trip in
if he had the choice. And then he backed it up with reasons and examples.
They are not important here because you wouldn't be interested.

You really shouldn't try to spin a comment into something other than what it
was.

Eisboch

I didn't spin anything. I would have asked him what else he liked and
hoped that he'd mention something with some style and grace.

It is a boat after all, not a barge.

One of the greatest pleasures I have found in boat ownership is
admiring the lines and grace of the boat's design, as well as its
construction, layout and operation.

It helps make the maintenance go easier. I wouldn't want to wash and
wax something I considered ugly.

Make any sense?

"jps" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 24 Mar 2010 12:09:40 -0400, "Eisboch"
wrote:


"jps" wrote in message
. ..

Holy crap. Out of the thousands of boats designed, engineered and
manufactured, he could only site Navigator?


I didn't say that. You did. I asked him what boat, (of that relative
size) based on his years of experience of running boats up and down the
east coast, in all kinds of conditions, would he choose to make the trip
in
if he had the choice. And then he backed it up with reasons and examples.
They are not important here because you wouldn't be interested.

You really shouldn't try to spin a comment into something other than what
it
was.

Eisboch

I didn't spin anything. I would have asked him what else he liked and
hoped that he'd mention something with some style and grace.

It is a boat after all, not a barge.

One of the greatest pleasures I have found in boat ownership is
admiring the lines and grace of the boat's design, as well as its
construction, layout and operation.

It helps make the maintenance go easier. I wouldn't want to wash and
wax something I considered ugly.

Make any sense?


To a point.

When I was shopping for a larger, live-aboard type boat I was equally
interested in the engineering aspects of the boat, how well it was
constructed and how it handled and rode in various sea states. At the time
I had dreams of doing a lot of ocean going travel. Didn't exactly work out
as planned for other reasons, but that was the critera at the time for boat
selection.

The delivery captain told me the following story when I asked him what boat
he would pick for an offshore type trip:

He had been hired by many different people over the years ... dealers and
private owners ..... to run boats up and down the coast and had experience
in virtually all the name brands. He was bringing the Navigator up from
Florida for a local dealer. As you are probably aware, these guys typically
have a qualified person to run the boat with them on these runs and they run
24 hours a day, stopping only for refueling.

He was coming up the coast in the fall and was running a mile or so behind a
similarly sized Hatteras that was being delivered by another delivery
captain who he knew. The seas were becoming increasingly rough and, as the
saying goes, both boats were taking it "on the nose". They were
communicating by radio and the Hatteras captain indicated he was backing off
on the throttle more and more as the seas worsened.

The guy in the Navigator was not in any discomfort in the same seas and was
slowly gaining on the Hatteras. Finally, as he passed him, the captain of
the Hatteras fell in behind the Navigator, riding in it's wake.

That's why I decided to buy the Navigator after looking at many boats.

Eisboch

On Wed, 24 Mar 2010 14:14:04 -0400, "Eisboch"
wrote:


"jps" wrote in message
.. .
On Wed, 24 Mar 2010 12:09:40 -0400, "Eisboch"
wrote:


"jps" wrote in message
...

Holy crap. Out of the thousands of boats designed, engineered and
manufactured, he could only site Navigator?


I didn't say that. You did. I asked him what boat, (of that relative
size) based on his years of experience of running boats up and down the
east coast, in all kinds of conditions, would he choose to make the trip
in
if he had the choice. And then he backed it up with reasons and examples.
They are not important here because you wouldn't be interested.

You really shouldn't try to spin a comment into something other than what
it
was.

Eisboch

I didn't spin anything. I would have asked him what else he liked and
hoped that he'd mention something with some style and grace.

It is a boat after all, not a barge.

One of the greatest pleasures I have found in boat ownership is
admiring the lines and grace of the boat's design, as well as its
construction, layout and operation.

It helps make the maintenance go easier. I wouldn't want to wash and
wax something I considered ugly.

Make any sense?


To a point.

When I was shopping for a larger, live-aboard type boat I was equally
interested in the engineering aspects of the boat, how well it was
constructed and how it handled and rode in various sea states. At the time
I had dreams of doing a lot of ocean going travel. Didn't exactly work out
as planned for other reasons, but that was the critera at the time for boat
selection.

The delivery captain told me the following story when I asked him what boat
he would pick for an offshore type trip:

He had been hired by many different people over the years ... dealers and
private owners ..... to run boats up and down the coast and had experience
in virtually all the name brands. He was bringing the Navigator up from
Florida for a local dealer. As you are probably aware, these guys typically
have a qualified person to run the boat with them on these runs and they run
24 hours a day, stopping only for refueling.

He was coming up the coast in the fall and was running a mile or so behind a
similarly sized Hatteras that was being delivered by another delivery
captain who he knew. The seas were becoming increasingly rough and, as the
saying goes, both boats were taking it "on the nose". They were
communicating by radio and the Hatteras captain indicated he was backing off
on the throttle more and more as the seas worsened.

The guy in the Navigator was not in any discomfort in the same seas and was
slowly gaining on the Hatteras. Finally, as he passed him, the captain of
the Hatteras fell in behind the Navigator, riding in it's wake.

That's why I decided to buy the Navigator after looking at many boats.

Eisboch

It's a nice anecdote to support your purchase although you don't
mention model, size, year of Hatt. I suppose I'm too hung up on the
looks to consider that which I don't feel is attractive -- like
picking a wife with a great personality and body but a face like a
trucker. Shoot me, I have some vanity.

I'm sure the Navigator could be compared favorably to a number of
yachts capable of excellent seakeeping.

If you were having thoughts of motoring oceans, why not consider the
long range trawlers that are so popular? Too slow?

On Wed, 24 Mar 2010 08:24:33 -0400, anon-e-moose
wrote:

Eisboch wrote:
"jps" wrote in message
...
Navigator, big plastic boat. Never liked the lines or the look and
they drop value pretty quick. Somebody was happy with you having paid
the depreciation.



You are entitled to your opinion.

Ever been in one in 8 foot confused seas? Ever seen how they are
constructed?
Ever been in the engine spaces and seen the size of the main stringers and
the general construction and design of the important elements of a boat?
Ever spent 10 hours a day at cruise speed, 30 miles offshore on one? Have
you owned one? Ever spent any serious time underway on one? Have you
piloted one in rough seas? Handled one in close quarter maneuvering? I
suspect not.

Something tells me you don't like them and made your unsolicited comments
simply because I owned one.

I agree they are not "pretty" in the eyes of all, but they are highly
regarded in marine surveyor's circles as being very well designed and built
from a marine engineering point of view. They are basically the same boat
as a Californian Yacht, the original Marshall design and boat line which he
sold and then purchased back a few years ago.

I could recite the main reason I decided to buy one, and the opinions of
seasoned, larger boat owners who were underway on the one I had but I doubt
they would be meaningful to you. I also don't think that the difference in
what I originally paid for it and what I sold it for almost 9 years later
represented an excessive "hit", depreciation-wise. Very few new boats hold
their value well.

Don't quit your day job to become a marine surveyor.

Eisboch



You are wasting your time trying to sell the merits of that boat to JPS.
He couldn't afford one even if he mortgaged his house and sold his girls
into slavery.

Is that how you finance your boats? What boat have you?

The last boat I bought was with cash. Tolly 40 sundeck in pristine
condition.

"jps" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 24 Mar 2010 08:24:33 -0400, anon-e-moose
wrote:

Eisboch wrote:
"jps" wrote in message
...
Navigator, big plastic boat. Never liked the lines or the look and
they drop value pretty quick. Somebody was happy with you having paid
the depreciation.



You are entitled to your opinion.

Ever been in one in 8 foot confused seas? Ever seen how they are
constructed?
Ever been in the engine spaces and seen the size of the main stringers
and
the general construction and design of the important elements of a boat?
Ever spent 10 hours a day at cruise speed, 30 miles offshore on one?
Have
you owned one? Ever spent any serious time underway on one? Have you
piloted one in rough seas? Handled one in close quarter maneuvering?
I
suspect not.

Something tells me you don't like them and made your unsolicited
comments
simply because I owned one.

I agree they are not "pretty" in the eyes of all, but they are highly
regarded in marine surveyor's circles as being very well designed and
built
from a marine engineering point of view. They are basically the same
boat
as a Californian Yacht, the original Marshall design and boat line which
he
sold and then purchased back a few years ago.

I could recite the main reason I decided to buy one, and the opinions of
seasoned, larger boat owners who were underway on the one I had but I
doubt
they would be meaningful to you. I also don't think that the difference
in
what I originally paid for it and what I sold it for almost 9 years
later
represented an excessive "hit", depreciation-wise. Very few new boats
hold
their value well.

Don't quit your day job to become a marine surveyor.

Eisboch



You are wasting your time trying to sell the merits of that boat to JPS.
He couldn't afford one even if he mortgaged his house and sold his girls
into slavery.

Is that how you finance your boats? What boat have you?

The last boat I bought was with cash. Tolly 40 sundeck in pristine
condition.


Tollycraft built a nice boat. Not my style, but they are well built.

Eisboch