jps wrote in news:cl1dd59n32hnagfkbk55pjo07ukp48qiub@
4ax.com:

On Wed, 14 Oct 2009 18:40:23 -0600, Howard Brazee
wrote:

On Wed, 14 Oct 2009 17:44:58 -0500, "RD (The Sandman)"
wrote:

Why do you connect FOX News and the Republican party? FOX News is
conservative but it isn't Republican.

All Fox News does is advance Republican propaganda.

Do you know the difference between a conservative and a Republican?

He thinks Fox news is Republican more than conservative - you think it
is more conservative than Republican. That doesn't mean the two of
you disagree about which is which. But neither has backed up your
choice with evidence.

The Republican platform was created with lots of compromise and lots
of fighting (as is the nature of such platforms).

There isn't a conservative platform - instead there are many
conservative platforms - some which are contradictory. Obviously a
conservative Roman Catholic, a conservative Mormon, a conservative
millionaire businessman, and a conservative racist, and a conservative
Muslim have different platforms. (As do Liberal versions of all of
the above).

Well said. Roger Ailes and his assigns hew tightly to the Republican
agenda.


Notice that he said (As do liberal versions of all the above). Do you
think that CNN gets its talking points from the Democratic Party or is it
simply liberal biased like MSNBC?

--
Sleep well tonight,

RD (The Sandman)

On TV, they show how detergents take out bloodstains. A pretty
violent image. I think if you've got a Tshirt full of bloodstains,
maybe laundry isn't your biggest problem. Maybe you should get rid
of the body before you do the wash and get some different friends.

On Fri, 16 Oct 2009 14:02:06 -0500, "RD (The Sandman)"
wrote:

jps wrote in news:cl1dd59n32hnagfkbk55pjo07ukp48qiub@
4ax.com:

On Wed, 14 Oct 2009 18:40:23 -0600, Howard Brazee
wrote:

On Wed, 14 Oct 2009 17:44:58 -0500, "RD (The Sandman)"
wrote:

Why do you connect FOX News and the Republican party? FOX News is
conservative but it isn't Republican.

All Fox News does is advance Republican propaganda.

Do you know the difference between a conservative and a Republican?

He thinks Fox news is Republican more than conservative - you think it
is more conservative than Republican. That doesn't mean the two of
you disagree about which is which. But neither has backed up your
choice with evidence.

The Republican platform was created with lots of compromise and lots
of fighting (as is the nature of such platforms).

There isn't a conservative platform - instead there are many
conservative platforms - some which are contradictory. Obviously a
conservative Roman Catholic, a conservative Mormon, a conservative
millionaire businessman, and a conservative racist, and a conservative
Muslim have different platforms. (As do Liberal versions of all of
the above).

Well said. Roger Ailes and his assigns hew tightly to the Republican
agenda.


Notice that he said (As do liberal versions of all the above). Do you
think that CNN gets its talking points from the Democratic Party or is it
simply liberal biased like MSNBC?

CNN is a hodge podge of everyone's talking points. They're just as
likely to pick up something from the R's as they are from the D's.

MSNBC is certainly in the liberal camp but neither CNN nor MSNBC
fabricate stories like Fox.

Neither do they astroturf taxpayer gatherings like Fox does. Fox news
people not only promote these gatherings they "report" on but they're
in the crowd getting them riled up before the cameras are turned on.

Is that news or premeditated, produced propaganda?

jps wrote:
On Fri, 16 Oct 2009 14:02:06 -0500, "RD (The Sandman)"
wrote:

jps wrote in news:cl1dd59n32hnagfkbk55pjo07ukp48qiub@
4ax.com:

On Wed, 14 Oct 2009 18:40:23 -0600, Howard Brazee
wrote:

On Wed, 14 Oct 2009 17:44:58 -0500, "RD (The Sandman)"
wrote:

Why do you connect FOX News and the Republican party? FOX News is
conservative but it isn't Republican.
All Fox News does is advance Republican propaganda.
Do you know the difference between a conservative and a Republican?
He thinks Fox news is Republican more than conservative - you think it
is more conservative than Republican. That doesn't mean the two of
you disagree about which is which. But neither has backed up your
choice with evidence.

The Republican platform was created with lots of compromise and lots
of fighting (as is the nature of such platforms).

There isn't a conservative platform - instead there are many
conservative platforms - some which are contradictory. Obviously a
conservative Roman Catholic, a conservative Mormon, a conservative
millionaire businessman, and a conservative racist, and a conservative
Muslim have different platforms. (As do Liberal versions of all of
the above).
Well said. Roger Ailes and his assigns hew tightly to the Republican
agenda.

Notice that he said (As do liberal versions of all the above). Do you
think that CNN gets its talking points from the Democratic Party or is it
simply liberal biased like MSNBC?

CNN is a hodge podge of everyone's talking points. They're just as
likely to pick up something from the R's as they are from the D's.

Nope:


No they don't.

http://newsroom.ucla.edu/portal/ucla...px?RelNum=6664

Media Bias Is Real, Finds UCLA Political Scientist
By Meg Sullivan December 14, 2005
While the editorial page of The Wall Street Journal is conservative, the
newspaper's news pages are liberal, even more liberal than The New York
Times. The Drudge Report may have a right-wing reputation, but it leans
left. Coverage by public television and radio is conservative compared
to the rest of the mainstream media. Meanwhile, almost all major media
outlets tilt to the left.

These are just a few of the surprising findings from a UCLA-led study,
which is believed to be the first successful attempt at objectively
quantifying bias in a range of media outlets and ranking them accordingly.

"I suspected that many media outlets would tilt to the left because
surveys have shown that reporters tend to vote more Democrat than
Republican," said Tim Groseclose, a UCLA political scientist and the
study's lead author. "But I was surprised at just how pronounced the
distinctions are."

"Overall, the major media outlets are quite moderate compared to members
of Congress, but even so, there is a quantifiable and significant bias
in that nearly all of them lean to the left," said co-author Jeffrey
Milyo, University of Missouri economist and public policy scholar.

The results appear in the latest issue of the Quarterly Journal of
Economics, which will become available in mid-December.

Groseclose and Milyo based their research on a standard gauge of a
lawmaker's support for liberal causes. Americans for Democratic Action
(ADA) tracks the percentage of times that each lawmaker votes on the
liberal side of an issue. Based on these votes, the ADA assigns a
numerical score to each lawmaker, where "100" is the most liberal and
"0" is the most conservative. After adjustments to compensate for
disproportionate representation that the Senate gives to low-population
states and the lack of representation for the District of Columbia, the
average ADA score in Congress (50.1) was assumed to represent the
political position of the average U.S. voter.

Groseclose and Milyo then directed 21 research assistants — most of them
college students — to scour U.S. media coverage of the past 10 years.
They tallied the number of times each media outlet referred to think
tanks and policy groups, such as the left-leaning NAACP or the
right-leaning Heritage Foundation.

Next, they did the same exercise with speeches of U.S. lawmakers. If a
media outlet displayed a citation pattern similar to that of a lawmaker,
then Groseclose and Milyo's method assigned both a similar ADA score.

"A media person would have never done this study," said Groseclose, a
UCLA political science professor, whose research and teaching focuses on
the U.S. Congress. "It takes a Congress scholar even to think of using
ADA scores as a measure. And I don't think many media scholars would
have considered comparing news stories to congressional speeches."

Of the 20 major media outlets studied, 18 scored left of center, with
CBS' "Evening News," The New York Times and the Los Angeles Times
ranking second, third and fourth most liberal behind the news pages of
The Wall Street Journal.

Only Fox News' "Special Report With Brit Hume" and The Washington Times
scored right of the average U.S. voter.

The most centrist outlet proved to be the "NewsHour With Jim Lehrer."
CNN's "NewsNight With Aaron Brown" and ABC's "Good Morning America" were
a close second and third.

"Our estimates for these outlets, we feel, give particular credibility
to our efforts, as three of the four moderators for the 2004
presidential and vice-presidential debates came from these three news
outlets — Jim Lehrer, Charlie Gibson and Gwen Ifill," Groseclose said.
"If these newscasters weren't centrist, staffers for one of the campaign
teams would have objected and insisted on other moderators."

The fourth most centrist outlet was "Special Report With Brit Hume" on
Fox News, which often is cited by liberals as an egregious example of a
right-wing outlet. While this news program proved to be right of center,
the study found ABC's "World News Tonight" and NBC's "Nightly News" to
be left of center. All three outlets were approximately equidistant from
the center, the report found.

"If viewers spent an equal amount of time watching Fox's 'Special
Report' as ABC's 'World News' and NBC's 'Nightly News,' then they would
receive a nearly perfectly balanced version of the news," said Milyo, an
associate professor of economics and public affairs at the University of
Missouri at Columbia.

Five news outlets — "NewsHour With Jim Lehrer," ABC's "Good Morning
America," CNN's "NewsNight With Aaron Brown," Fox News' "Special Report
With Brit Hume" and the Drudge Report — were in a statistical dead heat
in the race for the most centrist news outlet. Of the print media, USA
Today was the most centrist.

An additional feature of the study shows how each outlet compares in
political orientation with actual lawmakers. The news pages of The Wall
Street Journal scored a little to the left of the average American
Democrat, as determined by the average ADA score of all Democrats in
Congress (85 versus 84). With scores in the mid-70s, CBS' "Evening News"
and The New York Times looked similar to Sen. Joe Lieberman, D-Conn.,
who has an ADA score of 74.

Most of the outlets were less liberal than Lieberman but more liberal
than former Sen. John Breaux, D-La. Those media outlets included the
Drudge Report, ABC's "World News Tonight," NBC's "Nightly News," USA
Today, NBC's "Today Show," Time magazine, U.S. News & World Report,
Newsweek, NPR's "Morning Edition," CBS' "Early Show" and The Washington
Post.

Since Groseclose and Milyo were more concerned with bias in news
reporting than opinion pieces, which are designed to stake a political
position, they omitted editorials and Op-Eds from their tallies. This is
one reason their study finds The Wall Street Journal more liberal than
conventional wisdom asserts.

Another finding that contradicted conventional wisdom was that the
Drudge Report was slightly left of center.

"One thing people should keep in mind is that our data for the Drudge
Report was based almost entirely on the articles that the Drudge Report
lists on other Web sites," said Groseclose. "Very little was based on
the stories that Matt Drudge himself wrote. The fact that the Drudge
Report appears left of center is merely a reflection of the overall bias
of the media."

Yet another finding that contradicted conventional wisdom relates to
National Public Radio, often cited by conservatives as an egregious
example of a liberal news outlet. But according to the UCLA-University
of Missouri study, it ranked eighth most liberal of the 20 that the
study examined.

"By our estimate, NPR hardly differs from the average mainstream news
outlet," Groseclose said. "Its score is approximately equal to those of
Time, Newsweek and U.S. News & World Report and its score is slightly
more conservative than The Washington Post's. If anything,
government-funded outlets in our sample have a slightly lower average
ADA score (61), than the private outlets in our sample (62.8)."

The researchers took numerous steps to safeguard against bias — or the
appearance of same — in the work, which took close to three years to
complete. They went to great lengths to ensure that as many research
assistants supported Democratic candidate Al Gore in the 2000 election
as supported President George Bush. They also sought no outside funding,
a rarity in scholarly research.

"No matter the results, we feared our findings would've been suspect if
we'd received support from any group that could be perceived as right-
or left-leaning, so we consciously decided to fund this project only
with our own salaries and research funds that our own universities
provided," Groseclose said.

The results break new ground.

"Past researchers have been able to say whether an outlet is
conservative or liberal, but no one has ever compared media outlets to
lawmakers," Groseclose said. "Our work gives a precise characterization
of the bias and relates it to known commodity — politicians."

-UCLA-

jps wrote in
:

On Fri, 16 Oct 2009 14:02:06 -0500, "RD (The Sandman)"
wrote:

jps wrote in
news:cl1dd59n32hnagfkbk55pjo07ukp48qiub@ 4ax.com:

On Wed, 14 Oct 2009 18:40:23 -0600, Howard Brazee
wrote:

On Wed, 14 Oct 2009 17:44:58 -0500, "RD (The Sandman)"
wrote:

Why do you connect FOX News and the Republican party? FOX News
is conservative but it isn't Republican.

All Fox News does is advance Republican propaganda.

Do you know the difference between a conservative and a Republican?

He thinks Fox news is Republican more than conservative - you think
it is more conservative than Republican. That doesn't mean the
two of you disagree about which is which. But neither has backed
up your choice with evidence.

The Republican platform was created with lots of compromise and lots
of fighting (as is the nature of such platforms).

There isn't a conservative platform - instead there are many
conservative platforms - some which are contradictory. Obviously
a conservative Roman Catholic, a conservative Mormon, a conservative
millionaire businessman, and a conservative racist, and a
conservative Muslim have different platforms. (As do Liberal
versions of all of the above).

Well said. Roger Ailes and his assigns hew tightly to the
Republican agenda.


Notice that he said (As do liberal versions of all the above). Do you
think that CNN gets its talking points from the Democratic Party or is
it simply liberal biased like MSNBC?

CNN is a hodge podge of everyone's talking points. They're just as
likely to pick up something from the R's as they are from the D's.

MSNBC is certainly in the liberal camp but neither CNN nor MSNBC
fabricate stories like Fox.

Not what I asked. You did answer about CNN.

Neither do they astroturf taxpayer gatherings like Fox does. Fox news
people not only promote these gatherings they "report" on but they're
in the crowd getting them riled up before the cameras are turned on.

Is that news or premeditated, produced propaganda?

Depends on who is reporting on it.



--
Sleep well tonight,

RD (The Sandman)

On TV, they show how detergents take out bloodstains. A pretty
violent image. I think if you've got a Tshirt full of bloodstains,
maybe laundry isn't your biggest problem. Maybe you should get rid
of the body before you do the wash and get some different friends.

On Fri, 16 Oct 2009 13:26:59 -0700, jps wrote:

On Fri, 16 Oct 2009 14:02:06 -0500, "RD (The Sandman)"
wrote:

jps wrote in news:cl1dd59n32hnagfkbk55pjo07ukp48qiub@
4ax.com:

On Wed, 14 Oct 2009 18:40:23 -0600, Howard Brazee
wrote:

On Wed, 14 Oct 2009 17:44:58 -0500, "RD (The Sandman)"
wrote:

Why do you connect FOX News and the Republican party? FOX News is
conservative but it isn't Republican.

All Fox News does is advance Republican propaganda.

Do you know the difference between a conservative and a Republican?

He thinks Fox news is Republican more than conservative - you think it
is more conservative than Republican. That doesn't mean the two of
you disagree about which is which. But neither has backed up your
choice with evidence.

The Republican platform was created with lots of compromise and lots
of fighting (as is the nature of such platforms).

There isn't a conservative platform - instead there are many
conservative platforms - some which are contradictory. Obviously a
conservative Roman Catholic, a conservative Mormon, a conservative
millionaire businessman, and a conservative racist, and a conservative
Muslim have different platforms. (As do Liberal versions of all of
the above).

Well said. Roger Ailes and his assigns hew tightly to the Republican
agenda.


Notice that he said (As do liberal versions of all the above). Do you
think that CNN gets its talking points from the Democratic Party or is it
simply liberal biased like MSNBC?

CNN is a hodge podge of everyone's talking points. They're just as
likely to pick up something from the R's as they are from the D's.

Delusional much?

MSNBC is certainly in the liberal camp but neither CNN nor MSNBC
fabricate stories like Fox.

MSNBC was caught in a God Damned lie just this week, fartwit. CBS had
to "fire" Dan Rather a few years back because they got caught
fabricating stories.

Neither do they astroturf taxpayer gatherings like Fox does. Fox news
people not only promote these gatherings they "report" on but they're
in the crowd getting them riled up before the cameras are turned on.

Is that news or premeditated, produced propaganda?

There is no hope of meaningful debate with someone as pre-programmed
as yourself. When your handlers slip up and forget to remind you to
breathe, we'll send a sympathy card to your folks.

On Fri, 16 Oct 2009 13:26:59 -0700, jps wrote:

Neither do they astroturf taxpayer gatherings like Fox does. Fox news
people not only promote these gatherings they "report" on but they're
in the crowd getting them riled up before the cameras are turned on.

Yet if there is a crown gathered for health care reform, Fox does not
cover it with the same zeal if the cover it at all.

Is that news or premeditated, produced propaganda?

Propaganda...pure and simple.

On Fri, 16 Oct 2009 16:39:09 -0400, wrote:

On Fri, 16 Oct 2009 13:26:59 -0700, jps wrote:

MSNBC is certainly in the liberal camp but neither CNN nor MSNBC
fabricate stories like Fox.


Unless you watch Olbernann. He is just a left wing Limbaugh who never
lets the truth get in the way of a good rant.

I'll admit to hyperbole but Rush is a serial fabricator.

I listen to him frequently and can tell when he's stretching the truth
unfairly and to the benefit of his point, but he doesn't just make
stuff up.

Rush turns events inside out to make them seem the complete opposite
of what they are.

I suggest you spend more time watching Rachael Maddow. She's the
goods. And yes, she does some positioning but she's honest about it.

On 10/16/09 4:50 PM, jps wrote:
On Fri, 16 Oct 2009 16:39:09 -0400, wrote:

On Fri, 16 Oct 2009 13:26:59 -0700, wrote:

MSNBC is certainly in the liberal camp but neither CNN nor MSNBC
fabricate stories like Fox.


Unless you watch Olbernann. He is just a left wing Limbaugh who never
lets the truth get in the way of a good rant.

I'll admit to hyperbole but Rush is a serial fabricator.

I listen to him frequently and can tell when he's stretching the truth
unfairly and to the benefit of his point, but he doesn't just make
stuff up.

Rush turns events inside out to make them seem the complete opposite
of what they are.

I suggest you spend more time watching Rachael Maddow. She's the
goods. And yes, she does some positioning but she's honest about it.

Rachel is *the best," no doubt about it. I wish she were moderating
"Meet the Press."




--
http://tinyurl.com/ykaa4k7