More ethanol problems
 

Wife and I went to Cedar Key for our anniversary and took the Tolman
to explore some of the islands. Got a nice but very expensive suite
($168/night, yes, I am cheap) and had an ok time, Cedar Key is a good
place but almost hostile to boaters. There is no place for a sailboat
to dock as we found on several previous trips and the city marina has
no fuel dock. The only place on the island to buy fuel is a Chevron
gas station so I filled the Tolman's tank thinking I'd use as much asd
I could and siphon the rest into my truck to burn it quickly.
Launched her and were on the way out when sputter, sputter, sputter so
I shut her down, She ran fine in neutral but when I put her in gear,
she died. Finally she died even in neutral. CRAP. Cranked up the
pull start 9.9 kicker but that would only run just above idle, WTF.
Finally noticed the kicker fuel line had a crack and it was sucking
air and spraying fuel into the water. A quick repair with Swiss Army
knife and it got us back to the marina. The Dockmaster saw us come in
and came over to see what was the problem. He immediately asked where
we had bought fuel and he just shook his head telling me that that gas
station had underground tanks that got water in the fuel. I asked
where to buy fuel and he said "somewhere else on the mainland, maybe
Georgia". Holy SH*&T.
We finally came home stopping at Manatee Springs State Park, very nice
and a great place to swim on a hot day. Stopped at a private marina
on the mainland where they told me to put lots of Stabil in the fuel,
replace the water separator, drain the carbs and try to buy fuel
without ethanol. They told me that Cedar Key could not get ethanol
free fuel, even at the marina if they ever put in a fuel dock.
All in all, Cedar Key is a nice place but their ambivalence to boaters
is legendary. They have a beautiful new municipal dock but it is
intended only for fishing with no way for boats to tie up.

More ethanol problems
 

Frogwatch wrote:
Wife and I went to Cedar Key for our anniversary and took the Tolman
to explore some of the islands. Got a nice but very expensive suite
($168/night, yes, I am cheap) and had an ok time, Cedar Key is a good
place but almost hostile to boaters. There is no place for a sailboat
to dock as we found on several previous trips and the city marina has
no fuel dock. The only place on the island to buy fuel is a Chevron
gas station so I filled the Tolman's tank thinking I'd use as much asd
I could and siphon the rest into my truck to burn it quickly.
Launched her and were on the way out when sputter, sputter, sputter so
I shut her down, She ran fine in neutral but when I put her in gear,
she died. Finally she died even in neutral. CRAP. Cranked up the
pull start 9.9 kicker but that would only run just above idle, WTF.
Finally noticed the kicker fuel line had a crack and it was sucking
air and spraying fuel into the water. A quick repair with Swiss Army
knife and it got us back to the marina. The Dockmaster saw us come in
and came over to see what was the problem. He immediately asked where
we had bought fuel and he just shook his head telling me that that gas
station had underground tanks that got water in the fuel. I asked
where to buy fuel and he said "somewhere else on the mainland, maybe
Georgia". Holy SH*&T.
We finally came home stopping at Manatee Springs State Park, very nice
and a great place to swim on a hot day. Stopped at a private marina
on the mainland where they told me to put lots of Stabil in the fuel,
replace the water separator, drain the carbs and try to buy fuel
without ethanol. They told me that Cedar Key could not get ethanol
free fuel, even at the marina if they ever put in a fuel dock.
All in all, Cedar Key is a nice place but their ambivalence to boaters
is legendary. They have a beautiful new municipal dock but it is
intended only for fishing with no way for boats to tie up.

Cedar Key is for the birds. I'd never go back there again.

More ethanol problems
 

On Sun, 02 Aug 2009 13:48:50 -0400, Gene
wrote:

This is the recommended replacement:
http://go2marine.wordpress.com/2009/...-at-go2marine/

No offense Gene, but I call bs - on the part of the manufacturer.

According to the MSDS PRI-G's primary ingredient is Shellsol which is
a Stoddard solvent - basically white spirit (not soluble in water)
also called dry cleaning fluid along with amines - basically organic
ammonia with organic dispersants - which could be anything.

http://www.berkeywater.com/Other_Pro...ces/MSDS-G.pdf

Shellsol is also considered an environmental hazard and hazardous
material.

http://www.enerquip.com.au/brochures...SOL%20A100.pdf

I'm not a chemist by any stretch of the imagination, but what I think
'cha got here is your basic marketing "switcherooni". Organic ammonia
plus organic dispersants = Wait for it, wait for it...

ammonia in alcohol.

Might as well pour a bottle of that solvent you use in your machine
shop, add a little ammonia and some wood alcohol into the tank.

All of which brings me around to the simple fact that if you use E-10
fuel, you're screwed no matter which product you use.

With respect to StarTron (the Starbrite product that everybody jumps
up and down about) - you can't find an MSDS on it online.

Wonder why? Petroleum products and enzymes - well, how about that.

Truth is nothing is going to stabilize E-10 fuels and most of the
products being promoted as "cures" for E-10 are actually adding to
environmental issues and engine problems instead of helping.

Use regular old Sta-bil - at least it's not going to hurt anything and
it will make you feel better.

More ethanol problems
 

On Sun, 02 Aug 2009 15:20:03 -0400, Gene
wrote:

On Sun, 02 Aug 2009 14:55:43 -0400, Wizard of Woodstock
wrote:

On Sun, 02 Aug 2009 13:48:50 -0400, Gene
wrote:

This is the recommended replacement:
http://go2marine.wordpress.com/2009/...-at-go2marine/

No offense Gene, but I call bs - on the part of the manufacturer.

Use regular old Sta-bil - at least it's not going to hurt anything and
it will make you feel better.

Oh, contraire..... I saw the goop that came out of those carbs and the
fuel wasn't *that* old and I had treated it with regular Sta-bil
myself.

Startron is:
.5% Proprietary Organic Compounds
95% Solvent Naptha (Petroleum), Heavy Aliphatic

I'm not sure we have a real answer for this....... yet!

Well, it could be, not that it is you understand, crap from the tank.
I had mine flushed last Fall in the Ranger (after five years from the
last time I did it) and the crap in the fuel must be amazing because
there was easily a good 3/4 pound of - well, no other word for it,
goop sitting on the bottom of the tank. And when I had the engine
winterized, the fuel filter was as heavy as an oil filter when you
remove it.

By the way, that's what Starbrite SAYS is in StarTron - nobody
actually knows for sure.

And I'll continue to use Sta-Bil thank you very much. :)

More ethanol problems
 

On Sun, 02 Aug 2009 15:55:43 -0400, Gene
wrote:

On Sun, 02 Aug 2009 15:20:03 -0400, Gene
wrote:

On Sun, 02 Aug 2009 14:55:43 -0400, Wizard of Woodstock
wrote:

On Sun, 02 Aug 2009 13:48:50 -0400, Gene
wrote:

This is the recommended replacement:
http://go2marine.wordpress.com/2009/...-at-go2marine/

No offense Gene, but I call bs - on the part of the manufacturer.

Use regular old Sta-bil - at least it's not going to hurt anything and
it will make you feel better.


Oh, contraire..... I saw the goop that came out of those carbs and the
fuel wasn't *that* old and I had treated it with regular Sta-bil
myself.

Startron is:
.5% Proprietary Organic Compounds
95% Solvent Naptha (Petroleum), Heavy Aliphatic

I'm not sure we have a real answer for this....... yet!

Oh, yeah.... Sta-bil is 95% Naptha, too..... I hope the "other stuff"
is the answer/active ingredient in these respective [admittedly] snake
oils.....

On a related subject, I wonder if this whole "phase separation" thing
is actually a problem or if it's just more BS.

More ethanol problems
 

On Aug 2, 2:59*pm, Yogi of Woodstock wrote:
On Sun, 02 Aug 2009 15:20:03 -0400, Gene



wrote:
On Sun, 02 Aug 2009 14:55:43 -0400, Wizard of Woodstock
wrote:

On Sun, 02 Aug 2009 13:48:50 -0400, Gene
wrote:

This is the recommended replacement:
http://go2marine.wordpress.com/2009/...tment-additive....

No offense Gene, but I call bs - on the part of the manufacturer.

Use regular old Sta-bil - at least it's not going to hurt anything and
it will make you feel better.

Oh, contraire..... I saw the goop that came out of those carbs and the
fuel wasn't *that* old and I had treated it with regular Sta-bil
myself.

Startron is:
.5% Proprietary Organic Compounds
95% Solvent Naptha (Petroleum), Heavy Aliphatic

I'm not sure we have a real answer for this....... yet!

Well, it could be, not that it is you understand, crap from the tank.
I had mine flushed last Fall in the Ranger (after five years from the
last time I did it) and the crap in the fuel must be amazing because
there was easily a good 3/4 pound of - well, no other word for it,
goop sitting on the bottom of the tank. *And when I had the engine
winterized, the fuel filter was as heavy as an oil filter when you
remove it.

By the way, that's what Starbrite SAYS is in StarTron - nobody
actually knows for sure.

And I'll continue to use Sta-Bil thank you very much. *:)

Active agent: WD-40?

More ethanol problems
 

On Sun, 02 Aug 2009 14:55:43 -0400, Wizard of Woodstock
wrote:

On Sun, 02 Aug 2009 13:48:50 -0400, Gene
wrote:

This is the recommended replacement:
http://go2marine.wordpress.com/2009/...-at-go2marine/

No offense Gene, but I call bs - on the part of the manufacturer.

According to the MSDS PRI-G's primary ingredient is Shellsol which is
a Stoddard solvent - basically white spirit (not soluble in water)
also called dry cleaning fluid along with amines - basically organic
ammonia with organic dispersants - which could be anything.

http://www.berkeywater.com/Other_Pro...ces/MSDS-G.pdf

Shellsol is also considered an environmental hazard and hazardous
material.

http://www.enerquip.com.au/brochures...SOL%20A100.pdf

I'm not a chemist by any stretch of the imagination, but what I think
'cha got here is your basic marketing "switcherooni". Organic ammonia
plus organic dispersants = Wait for it, wait for it...

ammonia in alcohol.

Might as well pour a bottle of that solvent you use in your machine
shop, add a little ammonia and some wood alcohol into the tank.

All of which brings me around to the simple fact that if you use E-10
fuel, you're screwed no matter which product you use.

With respect to StarTron (the Starbrite product that everybody jumps
up and down about) - you can't find an MSDS on it online.

Wonder why? Petroleum products and enzymes - well, how about that.

Truth is nothing is going to stabilize E-10 fuels and most of the
products being promoted as "cures" for E-10 are actually adding to
environmental issues and engine problems instead of helping.

Use regular old Sta-bil - at least it's not going to hurt anything and
it will make you feel better.

Thanks.
--

John H

More ethanol problems
 

On Sun, 2 Aug 2009 10:32:33 -0700 (PDT), Frogwatch
wrote:

try to buy fuel
without ethanol.

Here in SWFL I can get non-ethanol gas delivered to the house by one
of the local fuel dealers, 50 gallon minimum.

More ethanol problems
 

On Sun, 02 Aug 2009 18:25:59 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote:

On Sun, 2 Aug 2009 10:32:33 -0700 (PDT), Frogwatch
wrote:

try to buy fuel
without ethanol.

Here in SWFL I can get non-ethanol gas delivered to the house by one
of the local fuel dealers, 50 gallon minimum.

I've heard that you can get it up here too, but so far, no distributor
wil admit to selling it.

More ethanol problems
 

On Sun, 02 Aug 2009 19:07:10 -0400, Wizard of Woodstock
wrote:

Here in SWFL I can get non-ethanol gas delivered to the house by one
of the local fuel dealers, 50 gallon minimum.

I've heard that you can get it up here too, but so far, no distributor
wil admit to selling it.

It's perfectly legal for off road (marine) usage, at least it is here.