Speaking of tractors or lawnmowers
 

"Johnson" wrote in message
...

Ummm, I was responding to Eisboch who made a statement about commercial
mowers vs. residential mowers.

While I am inclined to agree with you that in HK's world, everything he
possesses is special, better, and more liberal than yours and mine, I
truly am interested in whether commercial mowers spin their blades faster
than residential ones.

Johnson

Despite your shade tree mechanics opinions, I can assure you that they do.
I have a friend who has a similar designed residential rated mower. (these
are the type
that you operate like a Bobcat. Your sit on it and drive it with two levers
that control hydraulic motors).

His doesn't come close to the Scag. You can tell just by the sound and by
how finely it chops up the clippings. Plus, I can go through foot high
grass and the mower doesn't miss a beat. His would stall.

Eisboch

Speaking of tractors or lawnmowers
 

Eisboch wrote:

"Johnson" wrote in message
...

Ummm, I was responding to Eisboch who made a statement about
commercial mowers vs. residential mowers.

While I am inclined to agree with you that in HK's world, everything
he possesses is special, better, and more liberal than yours and mine,
I truly am interested in whether commercial mowers spin their blades
faster than residential ones.

Johnson

Despite your shade tree mechanics opinions, I can assure you that they do.
I have a friend who has a similar designed residential rated mower.
(these are the type
that you operate like a Bobcat. Your sit on it and drive it with two
levers that control hydraulic motors).

His doesn't come close to the Scag. You can tell just by the sound and
by how finely it chops up the clippings. Plus, I can go through foot
high grass and the mower doesn't miss a beat. His would stall.

Eisboch


You're conversing with a sock puppet.


--
The modern GOP is little more than an army of moral absolutists led by a
gang of moral nihilists.

al-Qaeda terrorists kidnap Obama teleprompter
 

On Tue, 09 Jun 2009 19:52:04 -0400, Johnson
wrote:

jps wrote:
On Tue, 09 Jun 2009 19:18:22 -0400, Johnson
wrote:

jps wrote:

You're referring to me figuring out that you can't vote in the US?
Ah, still deluded as ever I see.

Johnson

Ah, still obfuscating I see. Can you vote in US elections?

If I said yes, you'd still chant the same mantra.

Carry on.

Johnson

Ah, still obfuscating I see. Can you vote in US elections?

Speaking of tractors or lawnmowers
 

Eisboch wrote:

Scag dealer and also confirmed by our landscaper who obviously only buys
commercial equipment. He's the one who recommended that I buy a
commercial mower for the purpose I needed (mowing large horse paddocks).

The residential tip speed limit is a federal regulation. I forget what
it is exactly, but something like 1750 feet/min rings a bell.

I couldn't find anything specifically regulating residential mower blade
tip speed, but did find that there is a federal regulation concerning
all mowers at 19000 fpm top blade tip speed. Most commercial mowers
appear to advertise at between 18000 and 19000.

Shamelessly cut and pasted:
---------------
American National Standards Institute (ANSI)
ANSI standard B71.1, Walk-Behind Mowers and Ride-On Machines With Mowers
- Safety Specifications, is the primary safety standard for homeowner
riding mowers and small tractors. This standard requires the use of an
operator presence control, a device that will stop the mower blades if
the operator leaves the seat without disengaging the blade drive (PTO).
This prevents an operator from being down on the ground around a mower
while it is running.

One of the most important features of this standard is a requirement
that the blades must stop turning within 5 seconds when the PTO is
disengaged or the operator leaves the seat. This requires an automatic
brake on the blade drive. ANSI also requires that mowers be tested to
strict performance standards for thrown objects.

A seatback height of at least 4½ inches is required to keep operators
from falling backward. There are requirements on dynamic turn and sudden
traction performance to improve machine stability. There are
requirements for braking performance. There are also requirements on
guarding and safety labeling. The blade tip speed is limited to 19,000
feet per minute.
----------------

That would seem to indicate that there is no specific lesser top blade
tip speed for a residential mower.

It still could be true, I suppose, that the manufacturers of residential
mowers spin the blades slower, but that may not be necessarily true in
all residential machines.

Johnson.

Speaking of tractors or lawnmowers
 

Eisboch wrote:

"Johnson" wrote in message
...

Ummm, I was responding to Eisboch who made a statement about
commercial mowers vs. residential mowers.

While I am inclined to agree with you that in HK's world, everything
he possesses is special, better, and more liberal than yours and mine,
I truly am interested in whether commercial mowers spin their blades
faster than residential ones.

Johnson

Despite your shade tree mechanics opinions, I can assure you that they do.
I have a friend who has a similar designed residential rated mower.
(these are the type
that you operate like a Bobcat. Your sit on it and drive it with two
levers that control hydraulic motors).

His doesn't come close to the Scag. You can tell just by the sound and
by how finely it chops up the clippings. Plus, I can go through foot
high grass and the mower doesn't miss a beat. His would stall.

Eisboch

Thanks. This sockpuppet appreciates the advice.

In my other post I noted that it would seem that residential mowers are
not constrained to a lower blade tip speed. Perhaps the manufacturers
build the residential ones with a lower tip speed.

Also, my sense is that the commercial mowers are probably designed to
cut better, and they do run near the maximum allowed tip speed.

Johnson

Speaking of tractors or lawnmowers
 

HK wrote:


You're conversing with a sock puppet.



Hey, it's got to be better than conversing with an empty suit.

Johnson

Speaking of tractors or lawnmowers
 

On Tue, 09 Jun 2009 20:22:40 -0400, Johnson
wrote:



It still could be true, I suppose, that the manufacturers of residential
mowers spin the blades slower, but that may not be necessarily true in
all residential machines.

I noticed the small Honda-powered Craftsman I have has one speed.
Long time since I had a gas-powered, having used an electric, then a
battery powered for my last 2 houses.
But I recall older mowers had a throttle and you could rev them up in
the high stuff.

--Vic

Speaking of tractors or lawnmowers
 

Vic Smith wrote:
On Tue, 09 Jun 2009 20:22:40 -0400, Johnson
wrote:


It still could be true, I suppose, that the manufacturers of residential
mowers spin the blades slower, but that may not be necessarily true in
all residential machines.

I noticed the small Honda-powered Craftsman I have has one speed.
Long time since I had a gas-powered, having used an electric, then a
battery powered for my last 2 houses.
But I recall older mowers had a throttle and you could rev them up in
the high stuff.

--Vic


My two gasoline powered grass eaters have throttle controls, but...both
owner manuals say to run them at wide open throttle when cutting grass.
Both are about six years old...


--
The modern GOP is little more than an army of moral absolutists led by a
gang of moral nihilists.

Speaking of tractors or lawnmowers
 

"Johnson" wrote in message
...
Eisboch wrote:

Scag dealer and also confirmed by our landscaper who obviously only buys
commercial equipment. He's the one who recommended that I buy a
commercial mower for the purpose I needed (mowing large horse paddocks).

The residential tip speed limit is a federal regulation. I forget what
it is exactly, but something like 1750 feet/min rings a bell.

I couldn't find anything specifically regulating residential mower blade
tip speed, but did find that there is a federal regulation concerning all
mowers at 19000 fpm top blade tip speed. Most commercial mowers appear to
advertise at between 18000 and 19000.

Shamelessly cut and pasted:
---------------
American National Standards Institute (ANSI)
ANSI standard B71.1, Walk-Behind Mowers and Ride-On Machines With Mowers -
Safety Specifications, is the primary safety standard for homeowner riding
mowers and small tractors. This standard requires the use of an operator
presence control, a device that will stop the mower blades if the operator
leaves the seat without disengaging the blade drive (PTO). This prevents
an operator from being down on the ground around a mower while it is
running.

One of the most important features of this standard is a requirement that
the blades must stop turning within 5 seconds when the PTO is disengaged
or the operator leaves the seat. This requires an automatic brake on the
blade drive. ANSI also requires that mowers be tested to strict
performance standards for thrown objects.

A seatback height of at least 4½ inches is required to keep operators from
falling backward. There are requirements on dynamic turn and sudden
traction performance to improve machine stability. There are requirements
for braking performance. There are also requirements on guarding and
safety labeling. The blade tip speed is limited to 19,000 feet per minute.
----------------

That would seem to indicate that there is no specific lesser top blade tip
speed for a residential mower.

It still could be true, I suppose, that the manufacturers of residential
mowers spin the blades slower, but that may not be necessarily true in all
residential machines.

Johnson.



When were those regulations written? My Scag is about 8 years old now, I
think. I know one thing. The blades don't have a brake on them. I have a
newer push mower that operates as described in your posted regulations, but
not the Scag.

Also, I believe that residential rider mowers have had a requirement to
automatically disengage the drive to the blades when the rider mower is put
into reverse to back up. The last two lawn tractors I had did this and one
was an old, 1990 vintage John Deere.

The commercial rated Scag doesn't do this either. Blades stay engaged both
forward and backward.

Leads me to believe the regs you cited are for residential rated equipment.

Eisboch

Speaking of tractors or lawnmowers
 

Eisboch wrote:

"Johnson" wrote in message
...
Eisboch wrote:

Scag dealer and also confirmed by our landscaper who obviously only
buys commercial equipment. He's the one who recommended that I buy a
commercial mower for the purpose I needed (mowing large horse paddocks).

The residential tip speed limit is a federal regulation. I forget
what it is exactly, but something like 1750 feet/min rings a bell.

I couldn't find anything specifically regulating residential mower
blade tip speed, but did find that there is a federal regulation
concerning all mowers at 19000 fpm top blade tip speed. Most
commercial mowers appear to advertise at between 18000 and 19000.

Shamelessly cut and pasted:
---------------
American National Standards Institute (ANSI)
ANSI standard B71.1, Walk-Behind Mowers and Ride-On Machines With
Mowers - Safety Specifications, is the primary safety standard for
homeowner riding mowers and small tractors. This standard requires the
use of an operator presence control, a device that will stop the mower
blades if the operator leaves the seat without disengaging the blade
drive (PTO). This prevents an operator from being down on the ground
around a mower while it is running.

One of the most important features of this standard is a requirement
that the blades must stop turning within 5 seconds when the PTO is
disengaged or the operator leaves the seat. This requires an automatic
brake on the blade drive. ANSI also requires that mowers be tested to
strict performance standards for thrown objects.

A seatback height of at least 4½ inches is required to keep operators
from falling backward. There are requirements on dynamic turn and
sudden traction performance to improve machine stability. There are
requirements for braking performance. There are also requirements on
guarding and safety labeling. The blade tip speed is limited to 19,000
feet per minute.
----------------

That would seem to indicate that there is no specific lesser top blade
tip speed for a residential mower.

It still could be true, I suppose, that the manufacturers of
residential mowers spin the blades slower, but that may not be
necessarily true in all residential machines.

Johnson.
I think. I know one thing. The blades don't have a brake on them. I
have a newer push mower that operates as described in your posted
regulations, but not the Scag.

Also, I believe that residential rider mowers have had a requirement to
automatically disengage the drive to the blades when the rider mower is
put into reverse to back up. The last two lawn tractors I had did this
and one was an old, 1990 vintage John Deere.

The commercial rated Scag doesn't do this either. Blades stay engaged
both forward and backward.

Leads me to believe the regs you cited are for residential rated equipment.

Eisboch




My Husqie (the one that was never manufactured) backs up with the blades
running.

Your comments about blade speed and commercial mowers is correct.



--
The modern GOP is little more than an army of moral absolutists led by a
gang of moral nihilists.