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Bimini top brackets
The bimini top on my Key West uses a mounting like this"
http://tinyurl.com/9ozwsy This bracket allows the frame member mounted therein to rotate from front to back without placing undue stress on the mounting screws. Note, I said screws, not through bolts. However when underway, even slowly, or just at anchor with a small amount of ripple in the water, the bimini top sways from side to side. The side to side motion gets transmitted directly to the screws in the brackets, and causes them to loosen. I'm sure it's just a matter of time before they strip or worse. I'm wondering if there aren't some fittings made that would have a ball socket or some such to allow complete forward and back movement *and* some degree of lateral movement. Anyone know of such a thing? Help! |
Bimini top brackets
John H wrote:
The bimini top on my Key West uses a mounting like this" http://tinyurl.com/9ozwsy This bracket allows the frame member mounted therein to rotate from front to back without placing undue stress on the mounting screws. Note, I said screws, not through bolts. However when underway, even slowly, or just at anchor with a small amount of ripple in the water, the bimini top sways from side to side. The side to side motion gets transmitted directly to the screws in the brackets, and causes them to loosen. I'm sure it's just a matter of time before they strip or worse. I'm wondering if there aren't some fittings made that would have a ball socket or some such to allow complete forward and back movement *and* some degree of lateral movement. Anyone know of such a thing? Help! Is there a way to replace the screws with bolts and a backing plate? The current screw allows side to side motion, and some of the motion is absorbed by spring. If you had a bracket that did not allow side to side motion, the fiberglass and screw would be taking all the stress directly and would actually strip quicker. Or at least that is my story, and I am sticking to it. |
Bimini top brackets
John H wrote:
The bimini top on my Key West uses a mounting like this" http://tinyurl.com/9ozwsy This bracket allows the frame member mounted therein to rotate from front to back without placing undue stress on the mounting screws. Note, I said screws, not through bolts. However when underway, even slowly, or just at anchor with a small amount of ripple in the water, the bimini top sways from side to side. The side to side motion gets transmitted directly to the screws in the brackets, and causes them to loosen. I'm sure it's just a matter of time before they strip or worse. I'm wondering if there aren't some fittings made that would have a ball socket or some such to allow complete forward and back movement *and* some degree of lateral movement. Anyone know of such a thing? Help! We need to reduce or eliminate the sway. What is the frame made of? Show a picture of the frame, set up with the canvas on it. |
Bimini top brackets
On Sun, 04 Jan 2009 08:51:55 -0500, "Reginald P. Smithers III, Esq."
wrote: John H wrote: The bimini top on my Key West uses a mounting like this" http://tinyurl.com/9ozwsy This bracket allows the frame member mounted therein to rotate from front to back without placing undue stress on the mounting screws. Note, I said screws, not through bolts. However when underway, even slowly, or just at anchor with a small amount of ripple in the water, the bimini top sways from side to side. The side to side motion gets transmitted directly to the screws in the brackets, and causes them to loosen. I'm sure it's just a matter of time before they strip or worse. I'm wondering if there aren't some fittings made that would have a ball socket or some such to allow complete forward and back movement *and* some degree of lateral movement. Anyone know of such a thing? Help! Is there a way to replace the screws with bolts and a backing plate? The current screw allows side to side motion, and some of the motion is absorbed by spring. If you had a bracket that did not allow side to side motion, the fiberglass and screw would be taking all the stress directly and would actually strip quicker. Or at least that is my story, and I am sticking to it. What I'm looking for is some type of ball and socket bracket that would allow side to side motion without transmitting the stress to the screws. |
Bimini top brackets
On Sun, 04 Jan 2009 09:01:56 -0500, Jim wrote:
John H wrote: The bimini top on my Key West uses a mounting like this" http://tinyurl.com/9ozwsy This bracket allows the frame member mounted therein to rotate from front to back without placing undue stress on the mounting screws. Note, I said screws, not through bolts. However when underway, even slowly, or just at anchor with a small amount of ripple in the water, the bimini top sways from side to side. The side to side motion gets transmitted directly to the screws in the brackets, and causes them to loosen. I'm sure it's just a matter of time before they strip or worse. I'm wondering if there aren't some fittings made that would have a ball socket or some such to allow complete forward and back movement *and* some degree of lateral movement. Anyone know of such a thing? Help! We need to reduce or eliminate the sway. What is the frame made of? Show a picture of the frame, set up with the canvas on it. I don't have any pictures with the bimini up. I think it's ugly. The frame is stainless steel. I could reduce the sway by using some bungee cords or straps *across* the boat, or to the center console. I've thought of that, but the straps would be in the way of walking around. As a last resort, that's what I'll do. I'm thinking there must be some mounting brackets *made* to allow side to side motion. I've just got to find them! |
Bimini top brackets
On Jan 4, 9:31*am, John H wrote:
On Sun, 04 Jan 2009 09:01:56 -0500, Jim wrote: John H wrote: The bimini top on my Key West uses a mounting like this" http://tinyurl.com/9ozwsy This bracket allows the frame member mounted therein to rotate from front to back without placing undue stress on the mounting screws. Note, I said screws, not through bolts. However when underway, even slowly, or just at anchor with a small amount of ripple in the water, the bimini top sways from side to side. The side to side motion gets transmitted directly to the screws in the brackets, and causes them to loosen. I'm sure it's just a matter of time before they strip or worse. I'm wondering if there aren't some fittings made that would have a ball socket or some such to allow complete forward and back movement *and* some degree of lateral movement. Anyone know of such a thing? Help! We need to reduce or eliminate the sway. What is the frame made of? Show a picture of the frame, set up with the canvas on it. I don't have any pictures with the bimini up. I think it's ugly. The frame is stainless steel. I could reduce the sway by using some bungee cords or straps *across* the boat, or to the center console. I've thought of that, but the straps would be in the way of walking around. As a last resort, that's what I'll do. I'm thinking there must be some mounting brackets *made* to allow side to side motion. I've just got to find them!- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Not sure but I would look into Sailboat hardware... Lot's of moving joints there, one might suit your needs.. |
Bimini top brackets
You might find the side to side sway is reduced if you tighten the straps
more. I adjust them to be pretty tight and don't have much side to side sway. I run them about as tight as I can and still be able to pull them to the eyes. "John H" wrote in message ... The bimini top on my Key West uses a mounting like this" http://tinyurl.com/9ozwsy This bracket allows the frame member mounted therein to rotate from front to back without placing undue stress on the mounting screws. Note, I said screws, not through bolts. However when underway, even slowly, or just at anchor with a small amount of ripple in the water, the bimini top sways from side to side. The side to side motion gets transmitted directly to the screws in the brackets, and causes them to loosen. I'm sure it's just a matter of time before they strip or worse. I'm wondering if there aren't some fittings made that would have a ball socket or some such to allow complete forward and back movement *and* some degree of lateral movement. Anyone know of such a thing? Help! |
Bimini top brackets
On Sun, 4 Jan 2009 09:45:37 -0500, "jamesgangnc" wrote:
You might find the side to side sway is reduced if you tighten the straps more. I adjust them to be pretty tight and don't have much side to side sway. I run them about as tight as I can and still be able to pull them to the eyes. I keep them pretty tight. I may have found a solution or at least something along the lines of what I was thinking. http://tinyurl.com/9bpxs7 The ball and socket top caps and the deck hinge look like they'd do what I wanted. Now I've got to go look at them. |
Bimini top brackets
"John H" wrote in message ... What I'm looking for is some type of ball and socket bracket that would allow side to side motion without transmitting the stress to the screws. I think you'd end up with a very floppy bimini. The type of brackets you have allow the bimini to be lowered (folded up when underway). They are not supposed to hold it rigid. That's what the straps are for. Eisboch |
Bimini top brackets
On Sun, 4 Jan 2009 10:01:50 -0500, "Eisboch" wrote:
"John H" wrote in message .. . What I'm looking for is some type of ball and socket bracket that would allow side to side motion without transmitting the stress to the screws. I think you'd end up with a very floppy bimini. The type of brackets you have allow the bimini to be lowered (folded up when underway). They are not supposed to hold it rigid. That's what the straps are for. Eisboch Agree. But the straps prevent forward and backward motion. It's rock solid that way. If there were straps going from the top right to the bottom left and vice versa, then the swaying motion would be stopped also, or at least most of it. But, walking around would be a pain. It looks like a combination of this: http://tacomarine.com/ccp51/media/im...y/F11-0177.gif and this: http://tacomarine.com/ccp51/media/im...l/F13-0301.gif may do the job. |
Bimini top brackets
"John H" wrote in message ... On Sun, 4 Jan 2009 10:01:50 -0500, "Eisboch" wrote: "John H" wrote in message . .. What I'm looking for is some type of ball and socket bracket that would allow side to side motion without transmitting the stress to the screws. I think you'd end up with a very floppy bimini. The type of brackets you have allow the bimini to be lowered (folded up when underway). They are not supposed to hold it rigid. That's what the straps are for. Eisboch Agree. But the straps prevent forward and backward motion. It's rock solid that way. If there were straps going from the top right to the bottom left and vice versa, then the swaying motion would be stopped also, or at least most of it. But, walking around would be a pain. It looks like a combination of this: http://tacomarine.com/ccp51/media/im...y/F11-0177.gif and this: http://tacomarine.com/ccp51/media/im...l/F13-0301.gif may do the job. Maybe I don't understand your concept. What you have pictured is a ball and socket type of fitting that is *designed* to allow it to flop around. If your idea is to tighten up on the socket so it clamps down hard on the ball it might stiffen it up *however* all the forces due to wind, etc. will still be imparted on the bracket screws. You mentioned they are screws, not bolts with backing plates. IMO, you're going up with cracks in the gunnels. Too stiff is not always good. Wait, let me rephrase that. It's not always desirable to mount something like a wind catching bimini in a manner that it can't "give" a bit. All the forces will be transmitted to the brackets. The straps provide *additional* fore and aft support, taking much of the stress off the brackets. They are there with consideration that you may have the bimini up while underway. That's my opinion. Eisboch |
Bimini top brackets
On Jan 4, 9:20*am, John H wrote:
On Sun, 04 Jan 2009 08:51:55 -0500, "Reginald P. Smithers III, Esq." wrote: John H wrote: The bimini top on my Key West uses a mounting like this" http://tinyurl.com/9ozwsy This bracket allows the frame member mounted therein to rotate from front to back without placing undue stress on the mounting screws. Note, I said screws, not through bolts. However when underway, even slowly, or just at anchor with a small amount of ripple in the water, the bimini top sways from side to side. The side to side motion gets transmitted directly to the screws in the brackets, and causes them to loosen. I'm sure it's just a matter of time before they strip or worse. I'm wondering if there aren't some fittings made that would have a ball socket or some such to allow complete forward and back movement *and* some degree of lateral movement. Anyone know of such a thing? Help! Is there a way to replace the screws with bolts and a backing plate? The current screw allows side to side motion, and some of the motion is absorbed by spring. *If you had a bracket that did not allow side to side motion, the fiberglass and screw would be taking all the stress directly and would actually strip quicker. *Or at least that is my story, and I am sticking to it. What I'm looking for is some type of ball and socket bracket that would allow side to side motion without transmitting the stress to the screws.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Impossible. If it were a ball and socket type of connection, then it would be free to rotate all the way to the ground or water. If it were limited somehow, then it would still put the same amount of stress on the screws when it reached that limit. |
Bimini top brackets
John H wrote:
On Sun, 4 Jan 2009 10:01:50 -0500, "Eisboch" wrote: "John H" wrote in message ... What I'm looking for is some type of ball and socket bracket that would allow side to side motion without transmitting the stress to the screws. I think you'd end up with a very floppy bimini. The type of brackets you have allow the bimini to be lowered (folded up when underway). They are not supposed to hold it rigid. That's what the straps are for. Eisboch Agree. But the straps prevent forward and backward motion. It's rock solid that way. If there were straps going from the top right to the bottom left and vice versa, then the swaying motion would be stopped also, or at least most of it. But, walking around would be a pain. It looks like a combination of this: http://tacomarine.com/ccp51/media/im...y/F11-0177.gif and this: http://tacomarine.com/ccp51/media/im...l/F13-0301.gif may do the job. If I thought the bimini on a new boat would not hold up the stress while underway or even from waves, I would talk to my dealer about finding a better solution and/or providing backing plates and bolts. But as far as the brackets you showed, I don't think those would reduce the side to side movement, and would actually increase the movement. |
Bimini top brackets
John H wrote:
On Sun, 04 Jan 2009 09:01:56 -0500, Jim wrote: John H wrote: The bimini top on my Key West uses a mounting like this" http://tinyurl.com/9ozwsy This bracket allows the frame member mounted therein to rotate from front to back without placing undue stress on the mounting screws. Note, I said screws, not through bolts. However when underway, even slowly, or just at anchor with a small amount of ripple in the water, the bimini top sways from side to side. The side to side motion gets transmitted directly to the screws in the brackets, and causes them to loosen. I'm sure it's just a matter of time before they strip or worse. I'm wondering if there aren't some fittings made that would have a ball socket or some such to allow complete forward and back movement *and* some degree of lateral movement. Anyone know of such a thing? Help! We need to reduce or eliminate the sway. What is the frame made of? Show a picture of the frame, set up with the canvas on it. I don't have any pictures with the bimini up. I think it's ugly. The frame is stainless steel. I could reduce the sway by using some bungee cords or straps *across* the boat, or to the center console. I've thought of that, but the straps would be in the way of walking around. As a last resort, that's what I'll do. I'm thinking there must be some mounting brackets *made* to allow side to side motion. I've just got to find them! Doesn't that swaying drive you crazy? |
Bimini top brackets
On Sun, 4 Jan 2009 10:22:10 -0500, "Eisboch" wrote:
"John H" wrote in message .. . On Sun, 4 Jan 2009 10:01:50 -0500, "Eisboch" wrote: "John H" wrote in message ... What I'm looking for is some type of ball and socket bracket that would allow side to side motion without transmitting the stress to the screws. I think you'd end up with a very floppy bimini. The type of brackets you have allow the bimini to be lowered (folded up when underway). They are not supposed to hold it rigid. That's what the straps are for. Eisboch Agree. But the straps prevent forward and backward motion. It's rock solid that way. If there were straps going from the top right to the bottom left and vice versa, then the swaying motion would be stopped also, or at least most of it. But, walking around would be a pain. It looks like a combination of this: http://tacomarine.com/ccp51/media/im...y/F11-0177.gif and this: http://tacomarine.com/ccp51/media/im...l/F13-0301.gif may do the job. Maybe I don't understand your concept. What you have pictured is a ball and socket type of fitting that is *designed* to allow it to flop around. If your idea is to tighten up on the socket so it clamps down hard on the ball it might stiffen it up *however* all the forces due to wind, etc. will still be imparted on the bracket screws. You mentioned they are screws, not bolts with backing plates. IMO, you're going up with cracks in the gunnels. Too stiff is not always good. Wait, let me rephrase that. It's not always desirable to mount something like a wind catching bimini in a manner that it can't "give" a bit. All the forces will be transmitted to the brackets. The straps provide *additional* fore and aft support, taking much of the stress off the brackets. They are there with consideration that you may have the bimini up while underway. That's my opinion. Eisboch OK, my explanation probably sucked. I'm not worried about fore and aft motion, either while underway or at anchor. It's the side to side motion of the bimini that puts stress on the mounting bracket, because there is not enough play in the interface between the bimini frame and the deck bracket. The side to side motion gets transmitted through the bracket to the mounting screws. I don't want to stop the side to side motion. I want it to be free, so that stress will not be transmitted to the screws. I'm thinking the ball is loose in the socket, but I've not seen it yet. |
Bimini top brackets
"Jim" wrote in message ... wrote: On Jan 4, 9:31 am, John H wrote: On Sun, 04 Jan 2009 09:01:56 -0500, Jim wrote: John H wrote: The bimini top on my Key West uses a mounting like this" http://tinyurl.com/9ozwsy This bracket allows the frame member mounted therein to rotate from front to back without placing undue stress on the mounting screws. Note, I said screws, not through bolts. However when underway, even slowly, or just at anchor with a small amount of ripple in the water, the bimini top sways from side to side. The side to side motion gets transmitted directly to the screws in the brackets, and causes them to loosen. I'm sure it's just a matter of time before they strip or worse. I'm wondering if there aren't some fittings made that would have a ball socket or some such to allow complete forward and back movement *and* some degree of lateral movement. Anyone know of such a thing? Help! We need to reduce or eliminate the sway. What is the frame made of? Show a picture of the frame, set up with the canvas on it. I don't have any pictures with the bimini up. I think it's ugly. The frame is stainless steel. I could reduce the sway by using some bungee cords or straps *across* the boat, or to the center console. I've thought of that, but the straps would be in the way of walking around. As a last resort, that's what I'll do. I'm thinking there must be some mounting brackets *made* to allow side to side motion. I've just got to find them!- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Not sure but I would look into Sailboat hardware... Lot's of moving joints there, one might suit your needs.. Boom to mast hardware comes to mind. I don't think it's what he should be thinking about though. You talkin' about a 'gooseneck' fitting? fitting retracted for roller furling... http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v2...t=Hpim0167.jpg fitting inserted for normal sailing..... http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v2...t=Hpim0168.jpg |
Bimini top brackets
On Sun, 04 Jan 2009 10:35:46 -0500, John H
wrote: OK, my explanation probably sucked. I'm not worried about fore and aft motion, either while underway or at anchor. It's the side to side motion of the bimini that puts stress on the mounting bracket, because there is not enough play in the interface between the bimini frame and the deck bracket. The side to side motion gets transmitted through the bracket to the mounting screws. "Side to side" motion is the most difficult to prevent because there is typically no lateral bracing. The screws are working loose because of the high stress on them, and they will crack the deck eventually as others have pointed out. The answer is to through bolt the fittings with backing plates and/or oversize fender washers. That will solve the fitting problem and may reduce swaying some what. Ultimately the answer is more bracing, with at least three attachment points on each side. I'd get the recomendation of a good canvas shop that does a lot of biminis. |
Bimini top brackets
On Sun, 04 Jan 2009 08:43:17 -0500, John H
wrote: The bimini top on my Key West uses a mounting like this" http://tinyurl.com/9ozwsy This bracket allows the frame member mounted therein to rotate from front to back without placing undue stress on the mounting screws. Note, I said screws, not through bolts. However when underway, even slowly, or just at anchor with a small amount of ripple in the water, the bimini top sways from side to side. The side to side motion gets transmitted directly to the screws in the brackets, and causes them to loosen. I'm sure it's just a matter of time before they strip or worse. I'm wondering if there aren't some fittings made that would have a ball socket or some such to allow complete forward and back movement *and* some degree of lateral movement. Anyone know of such a thing? Help! The only way you are going to stop it is to make the stainless tubing fairly rigid - it's not so much the movement in the mount as it is the length of the tubing that is causing your problem. And the only way to stop that is to use heavier wall tubing - it's the wall flex that's the problem, not the mount. Cheap T-tops have the same problem - not enough wall strength in the tubes to make it rigid so they cross brace the hell out of them. Even in custom made, heavy T-tops like mine move without cross bracing. This T-top is very similar to mine - mine is a little taller, made from thicker tubing and is a slightly different design, but the point is that it's cross braced to keep the sway down. http://www.rangerboats.com/flash/gal...id=5511&gid=38 This is mine. http://www.swsports.org/images/Pictu...g%20Boat02.jpg With your current setup, the only way to make it stop is to cross brace the tubing with some sort of cording - maybe bungee cord or similar. What I would do is brace the cornors of the top where the tubing bends. You might be able to do it with bungee cord, but that defeats the purpose - it would cut down on the sway though. -- "An idealist is one who, on noticing that a rose smells better than a cabbage, concludes that it will also make better soup." H.L. Mencken |
Bimini top brackets
On Sun, 04 Jan 2009 12:03:49 -0500, wrote:
On Sun, 04 Jan 2009 08:43:17 -0500, John H wrote: The bimini top on my Key West uses a mounting like this" http://tinyurl.com/9ozwsy This bracket allows the frame member mounted therein to rotate from front to back without placing undue stress on the mounting screws. Note, I said screws, not through bolts. However when underway, even slowly, or just at anchor with a small amount of ripple in the water, the bimini top sways from side to side. The side to side motion gets transmitted directly to the screws in the brackets, and causes them to loosen. I'm sure it's just a matter of time before they strip or worse. I'm wondering if there aren't some fittings made that would have a ball socket or some such to allow complete forward and back movement *and* some degree of lateral movement. Anyone know of such a thing? Help! You need some diagonal bracing to stop the side to side. I see folks with straps from the top corner to the opposite gunnel. Yeah, that's one solution, but then walking around gets to be a big PITA. |
Bimini top brackets
On Sun, 04 Jan 2009 15:04:29 -0500, Tom Francis - SWSports
wrote: On Sun, 04 Jan 2009 08:43:17 -0500, John H wrote: The bimini top on my Key West uses a mounting like this" http://tinyurl.com/9ozwsy This bracket allows the frame member mounted therein to rotate from front to back without placing undue stress on the mounting screws. Note, I said screws, not through bolts. However when underway, even slowly, or just at anchor with a small amount of ripple in the water, the bimini top sways from side to side. The side to side motion gets transmitted directly to the screws in the brackets, and causes them to loosen. I'm sure it's just a matter of time before they strip or worse. I'm wondering if there aren't some fittings made that would have a ball socket or some such to allow complete forward and back movement *and* some degree of lateral movement. Anyone know of such a thing? Help! The only way you are going to stop it is to make the stainless tubing fairly rigid - it's not so much the movement in the mount as it is the length of the tubing that is causing your problem. And the only way to stop that is to use heavier wall tubing - it's the wall flex that's the problem, not the mount. Cheap T-tops have the same problem - not enough wall strength in the tubes to make it rigid so they cross brace the hell out of them. Even in custom made, heavy T-tops like mine move without cross bracing. This T-top is very similar to mine - mine is a little taller, made from thicker tubing and is a slightly different design, but the point is that it's cross braced to keep the sway down. http://www.rangerboats.com/flash/gal...id=5511&gid=38 This is mine. http://www.swsports.org/images/Pictu...g%20Boat02.jpg With your current setup, the only way to make it stop is to cross brace the tubing with some sort of cording - maybe bungee cord or similar. What I would do is brace the cornors of the top where the tubing bends. You might be able to do it with bungee cord, but that defeats the purpose - it would cut down on the sway though. What I'm hoping to find is a mounting bracket which allows the side to side motion without transmitting any stress. Actually, if the mounting bracket that is there ( http://tinyurl.com/9ozwsy ) were turned 90 degrees, the bimini could sway all it wanted with no stress on the screws. The only problem then is that I'd have to disconnect it whenever I wanted to stow it. |
Bimini top brackets
John H wrote:
On Sun, 04 Jan 2009 15:04:29 -0500, Tom Francis - SWSports wrote: On Sun, 04 Jan 2009 08:43:17 -0500, John H wrote: The bimini top on my Key West uses a mounting like this" http://tinyurl.com/9ozwsy This bracket allows the frame member mounted therein to rotate from front to back without placing undue stress on the mounting screws. Note, I said screws, not through bolts. However when underway, even slowly, or just at anchor with a small amount of ripple in the water, the bimini top sways from side to side. The side to side motion gets transmitted directly to the screws in the brackets, and causes them to loosen. I'm sure it's just a matter of time before they strip or worse. I'm wondering if there aren't some fittings made that would have a ball socket or some such to allow complete forward and back movement *and* some degree of lateral movement. Anyone know of such a thing? Help! The only way you are going to stop it is to make the stainless tubing fairly rigid - it's not so much the movement in the mount as it is the length of the tubing that is causing your problem. And the only way to stop that is to use heavier wall tubing - it's the wall flex that's the problem, not the mount. Cheap T-tops have the same problem - not enough wall strength in the tubes to make it rigid so they cross brace the hell out of them. Even in custom made, heavy T-tops like mine move without cross bracing. This T-top is very similar to mine - mine is a little taller, made from thicker tubing and is a slightly different design, but the point is that it's cross braced to keep the sway down. http://www.rangerboats.com/flash/gal...id=5511&gid=38 This is mine. http://www.swsports.org/images/Pictu...g%20Boat02.jpg With your current setup, the only way to make it stop is to cross brace the tubing with some sort of cording - maybe bungee cord or similar. What I would do is brace the cornors of the top where the tubing bends. You might be able to do it with bungee cord, but that defeats the purpose - it would cut down on the sway though. What I'm hoping to find is a mounting bracket which allows the side to side motion without transmitting any stress. Actually, if the mounting bracket that is there ( http://tinyurl.com/9ozwsy ) were turned 90 degrees, the bimini could sway all it wanted with no stress on the screws. The only problem then is that I'd have to disconnect it whenever I wanted to stow it. Tom has the right idea. We need to see your setup to determine how to place the braces. |
Bimini top brackets
Tom Francis - SWSports wrote:
On Sun, 04 Jan 2009 08:43:17 -0500, John H wrote: The bimini top on my Key West uses a mounting like this" http://tinyurl.com/9ozwsy This bracket allows the frame member mounted therein to rotate from front to back without placing undue stress on the mounting screws. Note, I said screws, not through bolts. However when underway, even slowly, or just at anchor with a small amount of ripple in the water, the bimini top sways from side to side. The side to side motion gets transmitted directly to the screws in the brackets, and causes them to loosen. I'm sure it's just a matter of time before they strip or worse. I'm wondering if there aren't some fittings made that would have a ball socket or some such to allow complete forward and back movement *and* some degree of lateral movement. Anyone know of such a thing? Help! The only way you are going to stop it is to make the stainless tubing fairly rigid - it's not so much the movement in the mount as it is the length of the tubing that is causing your problem. And the only way to stop that is to use heavier wall tubing - it's the wall flex that's the problem, not the mount. Cheap T-tops have the same problem - not enough wall strength in the tubes to make it rigid so they cross brace the hell out of them. Even in custom made, heavy T-tops like mine move without cross bracing. This T-top is very similar to mine - mine is a little taller, made from thicker tubing and is a slightly different design, but the point is that it's cross braced to keep the sway down. http://www.rangerboats.com/flash/gal...id=5511&gid=38 This is mine. http://www.swsports.org/images/Pictu...g%20Boat02.jpg With your current setup, the only way to make it stop is to cross brace the tubing with some sort of cording - maybe bungee cord or similar. What I would do is brace the cornors of the top where the tubing bends. You might be able to do it with bungee cord, but that defeats the purpose - it would cut down on the sway though. -- "An idealist is one who, on noticing that a rose smells better than a cabbage, concludes that it will also make better soup." H.L. Mencken Buy a better top with heavier tubes and connectors. |
Bimini top brackets
On Sun, 04 Jan 2009 16:49:15 -0500, Jim wrote:
John H wrote: On Sun, 04 Jan 2009 15:04:29 -0500, Tom Francis - SWSports wrote: On Sun, 04 Jan 2009 08:43:17 -0500, John H wrote: The bimini top on my Key West uses a mounting like this" http://tinyurl.com/9ozwsy This bracket allows the frame member mounted therein to rotate from front to back without placing undue stress on the mounting screws. Note, I said screws, not through bolts. However when underway, even slowly, or just at anchor with a small amount of ripple in the water, the bimini top sways from side to side. The side to side motion gets transmitted directly to the screws in the brackets, and causes them to loosen. I'm sure it's just a matter of time before they strip or worse. I'm wondering if there aren't some fittings made that would have a ball socket or some such to allow complete forward and back movement *and* some degree of lateral movement. Anyone know of such a thing? Help! The only way you are going to stop it is to make the stainless tubing fairly rigid - it's not so much the movement in the mount as it is the length of the tubing that is causing your problem. And the only way to stop that is to use heavier wall tubing - it's the wall flex that's the problem, not the mount. Cheap T-tops have the same problem - not enough wall strength in the tubes to make it rigid so they cross brace the hell out of them. Even in custom made, heavy T-tops like mine move without cross bracing. This T-top is very similar to mine - mine is a little taller, made from thicker tubing and is a slightly different design, but the point is that it's cross braced to keep the sway down. http://www.rangerboats.com/flash/gal...id=5511&gid=38 This is mine. http://www.swsports.org/images/Pictu...g%20Boat02.jpg With your current setup, the only way to make it stop is to cross brace the tubing with some sort of cording - maybe bungee cord or similar. What I would do is brace the cornors of the top where the tubing bends. You might be able to do it with bungee cord, but that defeats the purpose - it would cut down on the sway though. What I'm hoping to find is a mounting bracket which allows the side to side motion without transmitting any stress. Actually, if the mounting bracket that is there ( http://tinyurl.com/9ozwsy ) were turned 90 degrees, the bimini could sway all it wanted with no stress on the screws. The only problem then is that I'd have to disconnect it whenever I wanted to stow it. Tom has the right idea. We need to see your setup to determine how to place the braces. Yes, to *stop* or minimize the lateral swaying, I need to brace the bimini with straps, cords or what have you. Heavier uprights wouldn't help at all. It would just be more weight swaying back and forth. I want a way to allow the swaying of the bimini, but in a way that does not stress the screws holding the brackets to the gunwale. I'm thinking these may work. This piece would go into the bottom of the stainless steel upright: http://tacomarine.com/item--Top-Caps...set+screw.html And the ball would go into this piece, screwed or through-bolted to the gunwale. http://tacomarine.com/item--Deck-Hinge--F13-0301.html This *looks* like it would allow a good deal of lateral swaying before any stress would be placed on the mounting screws. That's *my* story. |
Bimini top brackets
On Sun, 04 Jan 2009 17:18:55 -0500, John H
wrote: I'm thinking these may work. This piece would go into the bottom of the stainless steel upright: http://tacomarine.com/item--Top-Caps...set+screw.html And the ball would go into this piece, screwed or through-bolted to the gunwale. http://tacomarine.com/item--Deck-Hinge--F13-0301.html This *looks* like it would allow a good deal of lateral swaying before any stress would be placed on the mounting screws. That's *my* story. Ah - my mistake - I didn't comprehend what you were talking about. My bad - I had the impression you wanted to dampen the lateral swaying rather than prevent stress from messing up the mounts. Yeah - those might work, but looking at the design you might get more sway than you want. That might put added stress on the assembly itself and cause it to distort or, possible, even collapse. Just a thought. -- "Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs even though checkered by failure, than to rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy nor suffer much because they live in the gray twilight that knows neither victory nor defeat." Theodore Roosevelt |
Bimini top brackets
"Tom Francis - SWSports" wrote in message ... On Sun, 04 Jan 2009 17:18:55 -0500, John H wrote: I'm thinking these may work. This piece would go into the bottom of the stainless steel upright: http://tacomarine.com/item--Top-Caps...set+screw.html And the ball would go into this piece, screwed or through-bolted to the gunwale. http://tacomarine.com/item--Deck-Hinge--F13-0301.html This *looks* like it would allow a good deal of lateral swaying before any stress would be placed on the mounting screws. That's *my* story. Ah - my mistake - I didn't comprehend what you were talking about. My bad - I had the impression you wanted to dampen the lateral swaying rather than prevent stress from messing up the mounts. Yeah - those might work, but looking at the design you might get more sway than you want. That might put added stress on the assembly itself and cause it to distort or, possible, even collapse. Just a thought. Yabut, Even with his "increased" lateral sway, at some point it stops and the same forces (or more, due to acceleration) are imposed on the mounting bracket screws. He's just introducing a time delay. Eisboch |
Bimini top brackets
On Sun, 04 Jan 2009 17:34:46 -0500, Tom Francis - SWSports
wrote: On Sun, 04 Jan 2009 17:18:55 -0500, John H wrote: I'm thinking these may work. This piece would go into the bottom of the stainless steel upright: http://tacomarine.com/item--Top-Caps...set+screw.html And the ball would go into this piece, screwed or through-bolted to the gunwale. http://tacomarine.com/item--Deck-Hinge--F13-0301.html This *looks* like it would allow a good deal of lateral swaying before any stress would be placed on the mounting screws. That's *my* story. Ah - my mistake - I didn't comprehend what you were talking about. My bad - I had the impression you wanted to dampen the lateral swaying rather than prevent stress from messing up the mounts. Yeah - those might work, but looking at the design you might get more sway than you want. That might put added stress on the assembly itself and cause it to distort or, possible, even collapse. Just a thought. And a good thought. I've got to find a place that stocks these and see what they look like. West Marine supposedly carries them, but I've not been yet. Maybe tomorrow. After golf. If the weather's decent. Priorities, you know. |
Bimini top brackets
Eisboch wrote:
"Tom Francis - SWSports" wrote in message ... On Sun, 04 Jan 2009 17:18:55 -0500, John H wrote: I'm thinking these may work. This piece would go into the bottom of the stainless steel upright: http://tacomarine.com/item--Top-Caps...set+screw.html And the ball would go into this piece, screwed or through-bolted to the gunwale. http://tacomarine.com/item--Deck-Hinge--F13-0301.html This *looks* like it would allow a good deal of lateral swaying before any stress would be placed on the mounting screws. That's *my* story. Ah - my mistake - I didn't comprehend what you were talking about. My bad - I had the impression you wanted to dampen the lateral swaying rather than prevent stress from messing up the mounts. Yeah - those might work, but looking at the design you might get more sway than you want. That might put added stress on the assembly itself and cause it to distort or, possible, even collapse. Just a thought. Yabut, Even with his "increased" lateral sway, at some point it stops and the same forces (or more, due to acceleration) are imposed on the mounting bracket screws. He's just introducing a time delay. Eisboch The answer is a higher quality bimini with heavier hardware and straps. |
Bimini top brackets
On Sun, 4 Jan 2009 17:57:03 -0500, "Eisboch" wrote:
"Tom Francis - SWSports" wrote in message ... On Sun, 04 Jan 2009 17:18:55 -0500, John H wrote: I'm thinking these may work. This piece would go into the bottom of the stainless steel upright: http://tacomarine.com/item--Top-Caps...set+screw.html And the ball would go into this piece, screwed or through-bolted to the gunwale. http://tacomarine.com/item--Deck-Hinge--F13-0301.html This *looks* like it would allow a good deal of lateral swaying before any stress would be placed on the mounting screws. That's *my* story. Ah - my mistake - I didn't comprehend what you were talking about. My bad - I had the impression you wanted to dampen the lateral swaying rather than prevent stress from messing up the mounts. Yeah - those might work, but looking at the design you might get more sway than you want. That might put added stress on the assembly itself and cause it to distort or, possible, even collapse. Just a thought. Yabut, Even with his "increased" lateral sway, at some point it stops and the same forces (or more, due to acceleration) are imposed on the mounting bracket screws. He's just introducing a time delay. Eisboch It's ok to talk directly to me! You're correct, if conditions were severe, the swaying could eventually cause the upper part of the socket to contact the sides of the base. Hopefully I'd have enough sense to take down the bimini before the swaying got that bad. (No comments about that last line, please!) As it is now, almost *any* swaying is stressing the bottom bracket and therefore the mounting screws. |
Bimini top brackets
"John H" wrote in message ... On Sun, 4 Jan 2009 17:57:03 -0500, "Eisboch" wrote: "Tom Francis - SWSports" wrote in message ... On Sun, 04 Jan 2009 17:18:55 -0500, John H wrote: I'm thinking these may work. This piece would go into the bottom of the stainless steel upright: http://tacomarine.com/item--Top-Caps...set+screw.html And the ball would go into this piece, screwed or through-bolted to the gunwale. http://tacomarine.com/item--Deck-Hinge--F13-0301.html This *looks* like it would allow a good deal of lateral swaying before any stress would be placed on the mounting screws. That's *my* story. Ah - my mistake - I didn't comprehend what you were talking about. My bad - I had the impression you wanted to dampen the lateral swaying rather than prevent stress from messing up the mounts. Yeah - those might work, but looking at the design you might get more sway than you want. That might put added stress on the assembly itself and cause it to distort or, possible, even collapse. Just a thought. Yabut, Even with his "increased" lateral sway, at some point it stops and the same forces (or more, due to acceleration) are imposed on the mounting bracket screws. He's just introducing a time delay. Eisboch It's ok to talk directly to me! You're correct, if conditions were severe, the swaying could eventually cause the upper part of the socket to contact the sides of the base. Hopefully I'd have enough sense to take down the bimini before the swaying got that bad. (No comments about that last line, please!) As it is now, almost *any* swaying is stressing the bottom bracket and therefore the mounting screws. John, I don't know how to make this more clear. *All* of your lateral "swaying" forces are transmitted to your gunnel brackets. I don't care if they are ball and socket, pinned or magnetically attached. Eisboch |
Bimini top brackets
On Sun, 4 Jan 2009 17:57:03 -0500, "Eisboch"
wrote: "Tom Francis - SWSports" wrote in message ... On Sun, 04 Jan 2009 17:18:55 -0500, John H wrote: I'm thinking these may work. This piece would go into the bottom of the stainless steel upright: http://tacomarine.com/item--Top-Caps...set+screw.html And the ball would go into this piece, screwed or through-bolted to the gunwale. http://tacomarine.com/item--Deck-Hinge--F13-0301.html This *looks* like it would allow a good deal of lateral swaying before any stress would be placed on the mounting screws. That's *my* story. Ah - my mistake - I didn't comprehend what you were talking about. My bad - I had the impression you wanted to dampen the lateral swaying rather than prevent stress from messing up the mounts. Yeah - those might work, but looking at the design you might get more sway than you want. That might put added stress on the assembly itself and cause it to distort or, possible, even collapse. Just a thought. Yabut, Even with his "increased" lateral sway, at some point it stops and the same forces (or more, due to acceleration) are imposed on the mounting bracket screws. He's just introducing a time delay. Good point. Which brings us back to square one - stop the sway. |
Bimini top brackets
On Sun, 04 Jan 2009 17:58:41 -0500, John H
wrote: On Sun, 04 Jan 2009 17:34:46 -0500, Tom Francis - SWSports wrote: On Sun, 04 Jan 2009 17:18:55 -0500, John H wrote: I'm thinking these may work. This piece would go into the bottom of the stainless steel upright: http://tacomarine.com/item--Top-Caps...set+screw.html And the ball would go into this piece, screwed or through-bolted to the gunwale. http://tacomarine.com/item--Deck-Hinge--F13-0301.html This *looks* like it would allow a good deal of lateral swaying before any stress would be placed on the mounting screws. That's *my* story. Ah - my mistake - I didn't comprehend what you were talking about. My bad - I had the impression you wanted to dampen the lateral swaying rather than prevent stress from messing up the mounts. Yeah - those might work, but looking at the design you might get more sway than you want. That might put added stress on the assembly itself and cause it to distort or, possible, even collapse. Just a thought. And a good thought. I've got to find a place that stocks these and see what they look like. West Marine supposedly carries them, but I've not been yet. Maybe tomorrow. After golf. If the weather's decent. Priorities, you know. 10-4. PS: I need to send those DVDs to you over the next week. -- "Do what you can, with what you have, where you are." Theodore Roosevelt. |
Bimini top brackets
On Sun, 4 Jan 2009 18:15:26 -0500, "Eisboch"
wrote: I don't care if they are ball and socket, pinned or magnetically attached. Magnets. KEWL!!! I got one of these for Christmas in my Santa Stocking. http://www.theneocube.com/ I can't stop playing with it when I'm bored. -- "Do what you can, with what you have, where you are." Theodore Roosevelt. |
Bimini top brackets
On Jan 4, 6:34*pm, Tom Francis - SWSports
wrote: On Sun, 4 Jan 2009 18:15:26 -0500, "Eisboch" wrote: I don't care if they are ball and socket, pinned or magnetically attached. Magnets. KEWL!!! I got one of these for Christmas in my Santa Stocking. http://www.theneocube.com/ I can't stop playing with it when I'm bored. -- "Do what you can, with what you have, where you are." Theodore Roosevelt. Holy ****, with my OCD just watching the video drove me nuts, having one would probably leave me in a rubber room...;) Kewl is right...;) |
Bimini top brackets
On Sun, 04 Jan 2009 18:34:32 -0500, Tom Francis - SWSports
wrote: On Sun, 4 Jan 2009 18:15:26 -0500, "Eisboch" wrote: I don't care if they are ball and socket, pinned or magnetically attached. Magnets. KEWL!!! I got one of these for Christmas in my Santa Stocking. http://www.theneocube.com/ I can't stop playing with it when I'm bored. But then don't you get mad about the missing strawberries? That's why I gave up fondling ball bearings. Made me think about the strawberries. --Vic |
Bimini top brackets
On Sun, 04 Jan 2009 17:54:32 -0600, Vic Smith wrote:
But then don't you get mad about the missing strawberries? That's why I gave up fondling ball bearings. Made me think about the strawberries. Ball bearings? Damn, all these years, I thought they were Ben Wa balls. ;-) |
Bimini top brackets
On Sun, 4 Jan 2009 18:15:26 -0500, "Eisboch" wrote:
"John H" wrote in message .. . On Sun, 4 Jan 2009 17:57:03 -0500, "Eisboch" wrote: "Tom Francis - SWSports" wrote in message ... On Sun, 04 Jan 2009 17:18:55 -0500, John H wrote: I'm thinking these may work. This piece would go into the bottom of the stainless steel upright: http://tacomarine.com/item--Top-Caps...set+screw.html And the ball would go into this piece, screwed or through-bolted to the gunwale. http://tacomarine.com/item--Deck-Hinge--F13-0301.html This *looks* like it would allow a good deal of lateral swaying before any stress would be placed on the mounting screws. That's *my* story. Ah - my mistake - I didn't comprehend what you were talking about. My bad - I had the impression you wanted to dampen the lateral swaying rather than prevent stress from messing up the mounts. Yeah - those might work, but looking at the design you might get more sway than you want. That might put added stress on the assembly itself and cause it to distort or, possible, even collapse. Just a thought. Yabut, Even with his "increased" lateral sway, at some point it stops and the same forces (or more, due to acceleration) are imposed on the mounting bracket screws. He's just introducing a time delay. Eisboch It's ok to talk directly to me! You're correct, if conditions were severe, the swaying could eventually cause the upper part of the socket to contact the sides of the base. Hopefully I'd have enough sense to take down the bimini before the swaying got that bad. (No comments about that last line, please!) As it is now, almost *any* swaying is stressing the bottom bracket and therefore the mounting screws. John, I don't know how to make this more clear. *All* of your lateral "swaying" forces are transmitted to your gunnel brackets. I don't care if they are ball and socket, pinned or magnetically attached. Eisboch Right. |
Bimini top brackets
On Sun, 04 Jan 2009 19:21:05 -0500, John H wrote:
On Sun, 4 Jan 2009 18:15:26 -0500, "Eisboch" wrote: "John H" wrote in message . .. On Sun, 4 Jan 2009 17:57:03 -0500, "Eisboch" wrote: "Tom Francis - SWSports" wrote in message ... On Sun, 04 Jan 2009 17:18:55 -0500, John H wrote: I'm thinking these may work. This piece would go into the bottom of the stainless steel upright: http://tacomarine.com/item--Top-Caps...set+screw.html And the ball would go into this piece, screwed or through-bolted to the gunwale. http://tacomarine.com/item--Deck-Hinge--F13-0301.html This *looks* like it would allow a good deal of lateral swaying before any stress would be placed on the mounting screws. That's *my* story. Ah - my mistake - I didn't comprehend what you were talking about. My bad - I had the impression you wanted to dampen the lateral swaying rather than prevent stress from messing up the mounts. Yeah - those might work, but looking at the design you might get more sway than you want. That might put added stress on the assembly itself and cause it to distort or, possible, even collapse. Just a thought. Yabut, Even with his "increased" lateral sway, at some point it stops and the same forces (or more, due to acceleration) are imposed on the mounting bracket screws. He's just introducing a time delay. Eisboch It's ok to talk directly to me! You're correct, if conditions were severe, the swaying could eventually cause the upper part of the socket to contact the sides of the base. Hopefully I'd have enough sense to take down the bimini before the swaying got that bad. (No comments about that last line, please!) As it is now, almost *any* swaying is stressing the bottom bracket and therefore the mounting screws. John, I don't know how to make this more clear. *All* of your lateral "swaying" forces are transmitted to your gunnel brackets. I don't care if they are ball and socket, pinned or magnetically attached. Eisboch Right. Whoops. Hit button too soon. Right, Looks like I'll invest in some bungee cords. One attached to the top sides of the CC frame and to the adjacent bimini sides should cut way down on the sway. Thanks. That probably saved a few bucks! |
Bimini top brackets
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Bimini top brackets
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